Article

2003-10-20 International

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Sorge 2003-10-20 9:20:47 AM|| || Front Page|| [11129 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Karzai boy shows his true colors. We cannot even keep our pet president quiet.

Karzai is no friend of the US. But if you look at some of his past statements, this should come as no surprise.

Posted by Zhang Fei 2003-10-20 9:32:57 AM|| 2003-10-20 9:32:57 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 As Sullivan and others have pointed out, the Mahathir quotes published in the West were not the most disgusting ones in his speech.

The key to understanding things is that the Islam mainstream seems to think that murder by itself is extreme but murder combined with conspiracy is moderation.

Posted by mhw 2003-10-20 10:08:42 AM|| 2003-10-20 10:08:42 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 These people are all full of crap. This conference was a good thing though - the world gets to see these jerks at their ugliest.

Posted by Bomb-a-rama 2003-10-20 10:32:13 AM|| 2003-10-20 10:32:13 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 mhw;

I've now posted the full text of Mahathir's speech on my website. You can go judge by yourself.

Posted by Sorge 2003-10-20 11:54:55 AM|| [http://www.forgottenfronts.com/] 2003-10-20 11:54:55 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 thanks to Sarge for posting the speech; the allusions to events in Muslim history probably make this difficult for Westerners to understand but for Muslims themselves the message seems to be 'play nicey nice for awhile, build up your military and then murder the infidels' and this is, I suppose actually moderate compared to the 'murder as many as possible right away' faction of Islam.

Posted by mhw 2003-10-20 1:38:16 PM|| 2003-10-20 1:38:16 PM|| Front Page Top

#6 I give Karzai a pass on this one. He chose to hear only the "lets modernize" part of the speech, not the Anti-semitic part. and given his troubles at home, I cant blame him for not calling Mathahir on this - alot of the muslims already see him as a US puppet, and he also supported the US on Iraq - which most muslim leaders (and Mathahir) didnt do. Why go out on a limb by himself?

Posted by liberalhawk 2003-10-20 3:48:29 PM|| 2003-10-20 3:48:29 PM|| Front Page Top

#7 Class...today's assignment: compare and contrast the respective remarks made by M. Chirac and President Bush in response to the anti-semtic speech made by Mahathir this past weekend. Whose remarks were those of a coward and whose remarks were those of a courageous political leader. Explain and discuss.Extra credit will be given for the appropriate usage of the phrase "cheese eating surrender monkey".

Posted by Mark 2003-10-20 5:00:09 PM|| 2003-10-20 5:00:09 PM|| Front Page Top

#8 Look, time to stop acting shocked, just shocked and outraged at Mahathir's speech. I've read about other Muslims calling for the end to the Intifada in similar terms.

Fact: this is the level of dialogue in the Muslim world. And yes it is comparatively moderate (moderately insane, as opposed to froth-mouthed, eyerolling). He made an appeal to stop blowing things up and to be a little more open-minded. But his target audience is not going to listen to an appeal for peace and political reform on humanitarian grounds. Anybody preaching a cessation to the Intifada and marginalization ofthe radical Imams is not going to have success if they sound like they're capitulating in defeat. It has to be couched in terms of 1) a new & smarter strategy against "the (infidel) enemy" and, more importantly, it has to be spun as 2) properly Islamic. I don't like it but that's reality. Karzai knows this. Such discussions are inevitably going to contain some garbage about the Jooooooos.

This new tack could lead to more reform, espiecially now that they'll have to compete with a free Iraq. There is also the danger that they could follow through on what they're saying and come back and reignite the conflicts at a more advantageous time, in a more unified manner. But if we keep our eyes open and remember what we're dealing with, I think we should accept such calls for peace and reform.

The Jihadis are not going to listen but the Governments are desperately looking for a way to start reform without losing (more) face, prestige, and power. This is going to be their selling point to the Islamic public, the average Mahmoud Q. public, the everyday Tariq, Darkahn, and Hamid.

Posted by Tokyo Taro 2003-10-20 6:28:13 PM|| 2003-10-20 6:28:13 PM|| Front Page Top

#9 The Muslims see India and China moving ahead in the passing lane, and they are jealous. The OIC meeting theme - "Knowledge and Morality for the Progress of the Ummah" - is a challenge to incorporate the West's technology in order to increase Islamic jihad potential. The Muslims seek military domination through infiltration of the West through immigration, while using technological transfer. In the interests of self-preservation, the West should adopt a keep-them-stupid approach, after we bomb the jihad out of the enemy.

Posted by Imam Hotep Bejesus 2003-10-20 9:10:54 PM|| 2003-10-20 9:10:54 PM|| Front Page Top

08:16 anon
02:34 R. McLeod
02:29 R. McLeod
23:54 Zhang Fei
23:44 Zhang Fei
23:31 .com
23:10 Charles
23:01 Charles
22:59 NotMikeMoore
22:55 Charles
22:52 NotMikeMoore
22:48 NotMikeMoore
22:47 Charles
22:46 NotMikeMoore
22:44 Anonymous
22:42 NotMikeMoore
22:40 .com
22:39 Charles
22:34 NotMikeMoore
22:06 Gasse Katze
21:59 Anonymous
21:58 Dar
21:57 Robert Crawford
21:52 mojo