Hi there, !
Today Thu 10/23/2003 Wed 10/22/2003 Tue 10/21/2003 Mon 10/20/2003 Sun 10/19/2003 Sat 10/18/2003 Fri 10/17/2003 Archives
466595 articles and 1647167 comments are archived on Rantburg.

Today: 45 articles and 233 comments as of 3:14.
Post a news link    Post your own article   
Area:                     Posting Order
Five helizaps in Gaza
Today's Headlines
Headline Comments [Views]
Page 1: WoT Operations
1 00:00 .com [6470] 
0 [6461] 
2 00:00 Gasse Katze [6477] 
0 [6465] 
5 00:00 Charles [6469] 
3 00:00 Super Hose [6468] 
4 00:00 R. McLeod [6468] 
4 00:00 .com [6471] 
7 00:00 Charles [6477] 
0 [6467] 
5 00:00 Old Patriot [6465] 
3 00:00 NotMikeMoore [6476] 
3 00:00 mojo [6475] 
7 00:00 NotMikeMoore [6474] 
3 00:00 Charles [6472] 
9 00:00 Old Patriot [6465] 
3 00:00 Super Hose [6464] 
8 00:00 Dishman [6470] 
3 00:00 Old Patriot [6465] 
12 00:00 Stephen [6467] 
1 00:00 tu3031 [6465] 
3 00:00 B [6465] 
2 00:00 Charles [6467] 
2 00:00 Zhang Fei [6464] 
3 00:00 Zhang Fei [6463] 
4 00:00 Carl in N.H. [6469] 
2 00:00 Grunter [6461] 
1 00:00 Bomb-a-rama [6462] 
8 00:00 Anonymous [6471] 
8 00:00 Anonymous [6467] 
1 00:00 Charles [6461] 
15 00:00 R. McLeod [6473] 
14 00:00 Zhang Fei [6473] 
35 00:00 anon [6472] 
9 00:00 Imam Hotep Bejesus [6459] 
14 00:00 Charles [6475] 
6 00:00 Anonymous [6483] 
3 00:00 Frank G [6465] 
1 00:00 MW [6468] 
3 00:00 Frank G [6461] 
3 00:00 Super Hose [6462] 
1 00:00 Super Hose [6469] 
7 00:00 Super Hose [6461] 
1 00:00 typical lefty [6465] 
3 00:00 Raj [6462] 
-Short Attention Span Theater-
About those Frogs...
This explains everything!
A French judge was placed under official investigation for "sexual exposure" in a courtroom, prosecutors said on Friday, after a newspaper reported the judge whacked off pounded the old pud masturbated while a lawyer pleaded her case. The 39-year old judge stretched the baloney masturbated for several minutes on Wednesday while listening to a female lawyer addressing the court in a case dealing with a dispute between neighbors, regional paper La Charente Libre said. One of the paper’s reporters saw the judge spanking the money "making unambiguous gestures after discretely lifting his judicial robe and opening his trousers," it said. The judge was temporarily suspended from his professional duties and examined by a psychiatrist, a prosecutor in the southwestern town of Angouleme said.
Is that a UN declaration in your pocket, M. Chirac or are you just glad to meet me?
Posted by: Spot || 10/20/2003 5:28:40 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6469 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Now we know why justice is blind.
Posted by: Stephen || 10/20/2003 18:17 Comments || Top||

#2  What a... ummm... jerkoff.
Posted by: Fred || 10/20/2003 19:46 Comments || Top||

#3  ROFL! A weasel-waxing weasel!
Posted by: Dave D. || 10/20/2003 19:59 Comments || Top||

#4  Baliff, get a SwifferTM the floor in my chambers is sticky.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 20:18 Comments || Top||

#5  I guess people fo notice if you masterbate when sitting in the judges chair.

So much for that myth.
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 22:39 Comments || Top||

No cure for "earworms"--songs stuck in your head
Edited for brevity.
Unexpected and insidious, the earworm slinks its way into the brain and refuses to leave. Symptoms vary, although high levels of annoyance and frustration are common. There are numerous potential treatments, but no cure. "Earworm" is the term coined by University of Cincinnati marketing professor James Kellaris for the usually unwelcome songs that get stuck in people’s heads. Since beginning his research in 2000, Kellaris has heard from people all over the world requesting help, sharing anecdotes and offering solutions. "I quickly learned that virtually everybody experiences earworms at one time or another," he said. "I think because it’s experienced privately and not often a topic of conversation, maybe people really long for some social comparison. They want to know if other people experience what they experience." Kellaris, whose most pervasive personal earworm (Byzantine chants) likely has something to do with his wife’s job as a church choir director, has been interested in the topic of earworms for decades. As a musician who now studies how marketers reach the public, he began wondering how widespread stuck songs really are, and began doing small surveys in 2000. Last year, he surveyed about 500 students, faculty and staff on campus asking about the type, frequency and duration of earworms, and possible causes and cures. Among the songs respondents picked as most likely to become stuck were: "The Lion Sleeps Tonight," the Chili’s restaurant "baby back ribs" jingle and "Who Let the Dogs Out."
But the choice that topped the so-called "playlist from hell" was "Other," meaning the majority of those surveyed chose a unique song of their own as the most probable earworm. That led Kellaris to conclude that stuck songs are highly idiosyncratic.
Normally, this is way too OT even for me, but if you read Lileks daily (like I do), you may have that damn circus song stuck in your head today (like I do)! Argh! The bells! The bells!
Posted by: Dar || 10/20/2003 1:51:10 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6465 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I know it's going to be a bad day when Leslie Gore wonders in.
Posted by: Shipman || 10/20/2003 13:56 Comments || Top||

#2  The one that gets me is Roy Orbeson's 'Only Balogny'. "Dum dum dum dumdie do wah, whoa yea yea yea'ah...It's only balogny."
Posted by: Lucky || 10/20/2003 14:06 Comments || Top||

#3  I remember talking to a former boss of mine one morning. He told me he was doing treadmill to ABBA's Dancing Queen. It took me a week to erase the image of this less than manly guy prancing on a treadmill to an old disco track. Lileks has it easy in comparison.
Posted by: Raj || 10/20/2003 14:24 Comments || Top||

#4  Oh, man! "Bertha Butt Boogie" by the Jimmy Castor Bunch!
Posted by: tu3031 || 10/20/2003 14:43 Comments || Top||

#5  It's a small world, afterall.
Posted by: Highlander || 10/20/2003 14:48 Comments || Top||

#6  Badgerbadgerbadgerbadger…
Posted by: Atrus || 10/20/2003 15:38 Comments || Top||

#7  Fish heads, fish heads/Rolly-polly fish heads/Fish heads, fish heads/Eat them up, yum.

I think that song was designed to be an earworm.
Posted by: Pete Stanley || 10/20/2003 16:07 Comments || Top||

#8  The worms crawl in, the worms crawl out,
the worms play pinochle on your snout...
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 17:14 Comments || Top||

#9  I have a nasty tinnitus problem - ~65dB at 6000 Hertz - and outside noises, especially high-pitched ones, drive me nuts. I think my mind is building its own defenses against this - I "convert" outside noise into music. One of the most prominent ones is "The Lion Sleeps Tonight", but there are others that are worse - songs like "Itsy-Bitsy, Teeney-Weeney, Yellow Polka Dot Bikini", a couple of Gregorian Chants the choir group I used to sing with learned, "Baby Elephant Walk", and some of the hit tunes from the late 1950's and early 1960's, such as "Heartbreak Hotel", "Are You Lonesome Tonight", and "TeenAngel". Sometimes I get two going at once, and it's enough to drive me crazy - if I weren't there already...
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 17:49 Comments || Top||

Molestor gets beaten up by former victim
Hat tip: Drudge. Edited for brevity.
A convicted child molester who was placed in the same [Tampa] Florida jail cell with one of his victims was beaten unconscious Thursday. The former victim was being held on a probation violation. Authorities say he recognized cellmate Kevin Kinder as the man who abused him and three other boys when he was 11 years old. His lawyer said the man, who is now 22, jumped on Kinder and punched him repeatedly. The former victim’s mother called the encounter a "fluke" but added that it was very "therapeutic" for her son.
Understatement of the year...
Posted by: Dar || 10/20/2003 1:10:11 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6470 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Now we know why the Priests don't want to appear in 20-years after the crime.

" Look boys, there's that punk who molested G-dog, get em'! "
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 13:20 Comments || Top||

#2  Brahahahaha....

Karma is a very cold biatch indeed isn't she?
Posted by: CrazyFool || 10/20/2003 13:43 Comments || Top||

#3  "it was very "therapeutic" for her son." It's not often you get to exercise the demon from your system. I don't advocate vigilante justice, but I would just sentence the guy to counseling.
Doctor: “How did you feel after you pummeled your molester?”
Victim: “I felt pretty damn good.” Doctor: “your cured.”
Posted by: Cyber Sarge || 10/20/2003 13:52 Comments || Top||

#4  very "therapeutic"...YES!!! When you can see justice in this land, doesn't it just make your heart race!!! You sure can't get it in the 'justice system'.
Posted by: Anonymous || 10/20/2003 14:36 Comments || Top||

#5  Works for me! :-p
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 10/20/2003 17:18 Comments || Top||

#6  I've never been molested, but my daughter was. I agree that there needs to be some kind of thereputic release. I'm afraid she's going to run someone down with her car someday, because the perp reminds her of her problem. I hope this guy has exorcized his own personal demons, but I'm doubtful. They can reappear any time, and the latest manifestation is usually worse than the previous one.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 17:54 Comments || Top||

#7  It doesn't get any better than this.

It's a shame he was so gentle. I can't say I would have been.
Posted by: badanov || 10/20/2003 18:08 Comments || Top||

#8  "temporary insanity" would likely do the trick.
Posted by: Dishman || 10/20/2003 19:56 Comments || Top||

Warfare at the speed of light
-EFL- Check out the whole article, interesting stuff...
In Bob Yamamoto’s lab, light devours. He straps on emerald green goggles. A technician stabs a fire button and calls out the computer countdown. "Three ... two ... one ..." Then ... nothing. Just a buzz of electronics and an ephemeral glow in this darkened room at Lawrence Livermore Laboratory. But inside Yamamato’s target chamber, a block of steel spits flame and molten metal. In those two seconds, 400 blasts of light poured into slabs of clear, manmade garnet. Swollen in energy, the crystal’s atoms then unleashed torrents of infrared light to ricochet 1,000 times between two mirrors and multiply, finally escaping as 400 pulses of pure, square beam. Kilowatt for kilogram, this is the world’s most powerful solid-state laser. Its invisible beam drilled Yamamoto’s inch-thick steel plate in two seconds. Add larger crystals and it will eat steel a mile or more away.
"Haha! They dare to resist? See how they do with my disintegrator ray!"
Posted by: ---------<<<<-- || 10/20/2003 10:40:19 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6473 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Puff piece. Where's the data? How many watts/mm^2?
What accuracy? Recharge time?
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 11:25 Comments || Top||

#2  mojo - all of that would make it "Long Attention Span Theater."
Posted by: PBMcL || 10/20/2003 11:30 Comments || Top||

#3  Not to mention tell our enemies how to do it too.
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 13:09 Comments || Top||

#4  Weapons programs like this are probably why Rumsfeld is looking to reduce the size of the military - we need to spend more money on getting the weaponry needed to once again leapfrog any potential adversaries.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 13:34 Comments || Top||

#5  meh.
beam of light that takes 2 seconds to go through a meer inch of steel, takes a HUGE amount of energy and to be effective against non-infantry it has to be held trained on the same spot on a moving target.
OR a single armor piercing tank round.

lasers are useless in combat (excepting the blinding ones and missle defense)

should be spending that money on robots
Posted by: dcreeper || 10/20/2003 15:25 Comments || Top||

#6  Has great potential for interplanetary space flight.
One theoretical space craft invisions use of what is called a Solar sail.In essence a huge sail made from Mylar(or simaler material)that use the solar wind to push a spacecraft.Much like wind does here on Earth.Problems are it would take a huge sail to make it a viable method of propulsion,and slow acceleration curve.Using a laser would allieviate these problems.
Posted by: Raptor || 10/20/2003 16:19 Comments || Top||

#7  it has to be held trained on the same spot on a moving target.
OR a single armor piercing tank round.

Keeping it trained on that spot will require the assistance of targeting electronics - in that respect, it's really no different from a Hellfire missile that acquires a moving target and takes it out. The difference is that unlike in a missile, which self-destructs, the targeting electronics on a laser weapon can be used over and over again.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 16:25 Comments || Top||

#8  "Weapons programs like this are probably why Rumsfeld is looking to reduce the size of the military - we need to spend more money on getting the weaponry needed to once again leapfrog any potential adversaries"

One hopes that when we reach the point where we're so advanced that we can conquer a medium sized country with only ten American soldiers, Rummy doesnt decide that only ten soldiers are enough to occupy the country ;)
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 17:12 Comments || Top||

#9  One hopes that when we reach the point where we're so advanced that we can conquer a medium sized country with only ten American soldiers, Rummy doesnt decide that only ten soldiers are enough to occupy the country ;)

Many of these programs will come to fruition long after Rumsfeld is no longer Defense Secretary. The truth is that new soldiers can be enlisted and trained up within six months, but coming up with new weaponry takes a good while longer. This is why Rumsfeld is emphasizing the material over the men - in an emergency, fresh troops can be drafted, but we go to war with the weapons we have. Given the manpower superiority of a country like China, we never want to fight them on anything like equal terms. A full-blown missile defense system would also be nice - for once the Russians wouldn't be able to threaten us with Armageddon.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 18:26 Comments || Top||

#10  Remember that old Star Trek episode where McCoy goes back in time and his phaser disintegrates that hobo?
This would be just as cool.
Posted by: Baltic Blog || 10/20/2003 19:05 Comments || Top||

#11  The technology to keep something "locked-on" has been around for a while. In fact, most of it was around when we were still using vacuum tubes in radar. When you start locking on with that type of power, it could get interesting. With atmospherics and trying to hit the target square, you would think it would be more effective to hit the target with a stream of lead.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 20:27 Comments || Top||

#12  With atmospherics and trying to hit the target square, you would think it would be more effective to hit the target with a stream of lead.

I think the nice thing about this weapon is the ability to instantaneously hit the target. There are no issues with the ballistic characteristics of the target changing in mid flight because the hit is instantaneous.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 21:37 Comments || Top||

#13  I think the nice thing about this weapon is the ability to instantaneously hit the target. There are no issues with the ballistic characteristics of the target changing in mid flight because the hit is instantaneous.

Another nice thing is that lasers go through human flesh alot easier than bullets. Plus you don't have to worry about the bullet stopping short of vital organ.
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 22:47 Comments || Top||

#14  Another nice thing is that lasers go through human flesh alot easier than bullets.

We have far cheaper ways of targeting humans and ground vehicles that involve area weapons - i.e. bombs and missiles. I suspect mobile lasers are going to be used as anti-missile or anti-artillery round weapons, given that this is where split-second response times are a factor.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 23:54 Comments || Top||

World’s smallest mosque built in Kazan
The world’s smallest mosque has been built in the memory of Tatars who were killed during the taking of Kazan by troops of Russian Tsar Ivan the Terrible in 1552. According to Rosbalt, not more than 10 people can worship in the mosque at one time.
Which will be about right if there’s another 9/11.
The mosque was built in the style of a miniature copy of the Kul Sharif mosque, which was constructed on the territory of the Kazan Kremlin. The miniature octahedral mosque measures 25 square meters. It has one cupola and four 10-meter high minarets. The interior of the mosque covers only ten square meters. The initiator of the construction of the mosque was a 77-year-old WWII veteran. Various organizations and individuals donated money for the construction of the mosque.
Posted by: Steve White || 10/20/2003 12:59:12 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6461 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Amazingly, when CAIR, MSA, et al claim anti-muslim sentiment and racial profiling, I break out the world's tiniest violin...go figure
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 7:18 Comments || Top||

#2  Why there are 250 lb. JDAMs in the works.
Posted by: Shipman || 10/20/2003 7:35 Comments || Top||

#3  these guys were victims of Stalin. Give them a break.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 9:09 Comments || Top||

#4  You're right LH. Course now we gotta cut the Russ a little slack too.
Posted by: Shipman || 10/20/2003 9:54 Comments || Top||

#5  If they care for some music, I have a violin to donate. Should be just about the right size.
Posted by: BH || 10/20/2003 10:35 Comments || Top||

#6  Wonder if the size was deliberate, or all they could afford from the donations received. Guess they didn't tap the Saudis.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 12:21 Comments || Top||

#7  When Mork said, "nano, nano," he was making a visionary statement.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 12:26 Comments || Top||

Senior Talib Captured in Afghanistan
A senior Taliban commander has been captured by coalition forces in central Afghanistan. Mullah Janan was captured near Deh Rawod in the central province of Uruzgan, Col. Rodney Davis said in a statement. Janan was observed leaving the area by coalition special operations forces and was captured at an Afghan militia force checkpoint. Authorities have said a Taliban commander by the same name had close ties with Osama bin Laden and might know of his whereabouts. But the name is not uncommon in Afghanistan and there was no immediate confirmation the man captured was the same.
So maybe he's a senior Talib...
Davis said the Janan who was captured in Uruzgan is believed responsible for a rocket attack on an American military outpost in Deh Rawod. No damage or casualties were reported in the July attack. Jan Mohammed Khan, the governor of Uruzgan, confirmed the arrest, saying Janan was "a famous Taliban commander." Khan told The Associated Press that Janan was captured Saturday with eight other Taliban insurgents during sweeping raids in the Dai Chopan district of the neighboring province of Zabul.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 16:57 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6468 views] Top|| File under:

#1  want this guy jugged in May - rantburg says so! maybe it IS a different Janan.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 17:01 Comments || Top||

#2  Maybe this guy will be the right one...
Posted by: Fred || 10/20/2003 19:45 Comments || Top||

#3  His ID must have come from Pakistan. Ithink they just photocopy the same pastport a dozen times and slip new pictures in. I don't know how they came up with such a large forging market when the teenagers can't buy beer even with a fake ID.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 20:30 Comments || Top||

Death List Reveals Horrors of Afghanistan’s Past

KABUL (Reuters) - One name on a list of nearly 5,000 told Saleha the truth she did not want to know. Her father, a painter from the southern province of Kandahar, was executed by the Afghan communist government in 1979, aged 31.

He had been accused by a court of being an insurgent fighting against Soviet intervention in Afghanistan in the months leading up to the ill-fated invasion.

Saleha, a girl when her father disappeared without trace, is now in her late 20s. Her plight is common in Afghanistan, where thousands of soldiers, guerrillas and civilians simply vanished during two decades of war, occupation and lawlessness.

Arranged in neat columns, numbered, hand-written in the local Dari language and stamped by the "Democratic Revolutionary Court of Afghanistan," the folder of 4,782 names smacks of the ruthless efficiency the Soviet Union and its satellites so cherished.

The document was drawn up by intelligence services in Kabul in the late 1970s and photocopies were recently obtained by the Afghan Commission for Human Rights (ACHR).

It lists the individual’s name, father’s name, province of residence, profession and date and reason for execution.

"It was the hardest moment of my life when I knew about my father," Saleha told Reuters.

"I was not upset only for my father but for all the other people who were murdered at that time, because they might also have had families and children."

ACHR head Lal Gul said the commission would publish the names in local newspapers and prepare a booklet so that as many relatives and friends as possible could determine the fate of those missing.

Some of the families of those who disappeared under Afghan communist rule in the buildup to the Soviet occupation from 1979 still hold out faint hopes of a happy ending, Gul said.

"A large number of people were killed during the communist regime and their relatives still think they might be alive or have been transferred to jails in the (former) Soviet Union," he said, after presenting the list to a small group of journalists.

"Unfortunately the list of these 5,000 people shows most of them were killed."

On a parched, stony hillside around 9 miles east of the capital, Gul points to the long, narrow ditches he says are mass graves containing the remains of at least some of the victims listed by the communist courts.

Close to the notorious Pul-i-Charki prison, the isolated site served as a dumping ground for people who died at the jail or who were executed on the spot, he said.

"Thousands of innocent people are buried here. The only reason was that they were against the policies of that regime and did not accept their opinions.

"They picked this place because it is so close to the jail and there aren’t any villages around, so it is a very isolated area for execution."

Long sticks adorned with torn material marked the burial site, and a small pile of human bones could be seen under a piece of corrugated iron.

"Graves of the mujahideen (’holy warriors’) and scholars. May they rest in peace" read a fading, rusty sign at the bottom of the hill.

Gul said it was one of many mass graves yet to be properly unearthed and investigated in Afghanistan, testament to the brutal reality of life in the war-torn state.

Most recently a scandal erupted last year over a burial site filled with bodies of Taliban fighters allegedly killed or allowed to suffocate while in the custody of pro-U.S. forces after the hard-line Islamic militia capitulated late in 2001.
I’m sure that the Northern Alliance were no angels.

Many wondered where a full investigation into the allegations might lead, given the level of violence and atrocities carried out among different ethnic groups and rival factions throughout the country’s bloody past.

Brief entries in the list offer glimpses into the lives and deaths of the "enemies of the state."

One typical example reads: "Name: Mohammad Nasim; Father’s name: Mohammad Sharif; Age: 53; Profession: retired teacher; Province: Ghazni; Killed in 1978; Accused of carrying out anti-government activities.

A small number of women were also executed:

The records say nothing of the upheaval faced by surviving relatives.

In 1980, aged just 6, Saleha was sent to the Soviet Union where she spent the next 10 years studying, returning in the dying days of the occupation. She is now married with two children and works as an assistant physiotherapist in Kabul.

The death toll in Afghanistan may never be know as I doubt that the Taliban bothered with making lists.

The BBC, on the other hand, is standing by with some moral relativism from teh past.US shuns Vietnam war claims
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 4:18:46 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6467 views] Top|| File under:

Islamic militants busted in Saudi Arabia
Authorities in Saudi Arabia have announced the arrest of a number of Islamic militants who are terror suspects.
What number?
They were captured during raids in the capital Riyadh, the Red Sea port of Jeddah and four other locations.
That's a minumum of six...
The number of arrests was not revealed.
But it's at least six...
Security forces also seized big caches of arms and munitions in Riyadh and Jeddah, including plastic explosives, bombs, machine-guns and bomb-belts used by suicide bombers. The raids are the latest action in a crackdown by the Saudi Government following suicide bombings in Riyadh in May that killed 35 people.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 21:51 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6477 views] Top|| File under:

#1  How many of them were royals?
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 10/20/2003 21:57 Comments || Top||

#2  "The raids are the latest action in a crackdown by the Saudi Government following suicide bombings in Riyadh in May that killed 35 people."
They should have started this round up two years ago. I suppose it makes a difference when your own ox gets gored.
Posted by: Gasse Katze || 10/20/2003 22:06 Comments || Top||

Prince Salman gets together with MWL head
Prince Salman bin Abdulaziz, the governor of Riyadh region, received here on Monday Dr Abdullah Al-Turki, the Secretary General of Makkah-based Muslim World League (MWL) and member of the Senior Ulema (Muslim scholars) Commission, as well as former secretaries general of the MWL and directors of the MWL's Islamic organs who came to greet him. Speaking on the occasion, Dr Al-Turki praised the significant role played by Prince Salman in the service of Islam and Muslims at the local and international arenas. On his part, Prince Salman lauded the role being played by Dr Al-Turki and his accompanying delegation in realizing the goals of the MWL. Prince Salman called for projecting Islam in its proper perspective, ands said Islam is the religion of moderation which does not tolerate extremism and fanaticism.
Sea change, PR campaign, or temporary shift in tactics? You decide...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 15:32 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6476 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Not until I see them kiss ala Madonna and Brittney....
Posted by: CrazyFool || 10/20/2003 16:00 Comments || Top||

#2  ...or Rodriguez and Urbina.
Posted by: tu3031 || 10/20/2003 16:23 Comments || Top||

#3  They probably hired a few lobbyists in DC who were former Dept of State employees to spin this
Posted by: NotMikeMoore || 10/20/2003 22:34 Comments || Top||

Limburg suspects to stand trial soon
The Yemeni interior minister, Dr. Rashad al-Alemi said that French supertanker Limburg file was over and suspects were to stand trial soon. “The case of the USS Cole Destroyer has been encompassed with obscurities and that the first problem faced Yemeni security is that some of those suspects have been held in custody in other countries. So Yemen has demanded their handing over in order to finish their trial according to the Yemeni law and constitution,” the interior minister said. “The delay of the trial can be attributed to the US demands in order to track down other elements who have been still on the run. Other problems have emerged including the jailbreak of suspects in Aden and this has made the situation more complicated and resulted in delay of the trial,” Dr. al-Alemi remarked.
Having them break jail does tend to complicate their trials...
The Yemeni interior minister further placed an emphasis that the completion of USS Cole file has been still underway in order to refer the case to trial soon. “There are other cases where perpetrators are to be tried for such as suspects accused of shooting at a helicopter belonging to the Hunt Oil Company, al-Qadesia explosion in Sana’a and other terror thwarted operations in Taiz to blast water and electricity installations.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 11:36 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6469 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Free Bruno!
Posted by: Shipman || 10/20/2003 11:57 Comments || Top||

#2  Nevermind. Wrong case.
Posted by: Shipman || 10/20/2003 11:58 Comments || Top||

#3  “The delay of the trial can be attributed to the US demands in order to track down other elements who have been still on the run."

Did the wheels of their judiciary stop because we asked them to recapture militants that should not have escaped in the first place?
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 12:31 Comments || Top||

#4  Shipman, took me a second, but heh :)
Posted by: Carl in N.H. || 10/20/2003 14:39 Comments || Top||

Saleh orders investigation into al-Zindani fatwa
Fractured syntax courtesy of Yemen Times. Coffee warning on the last paragraph...
President Ali Abdullah Saleh ordered the general prosecution to investigate into the religious fatwa accusing the socialist leader Yassin Saeed Noman, former speaker of parliament, of being an infidel, reliable sources close to the Yemeni presidency said Saturday. The fatwa which was announced last week has been attributed to Sheikh Abdulmajeed al-Zindani, head of Islah Consultative Council and rector of al-Eman University. The sources added that Saleh asked the general prosecution to investigate into the fatwa which al-Zindani has been accused to have issued on the basis that Dr. Noman used to say when he was running the parliament hearings “the rule is for the parliament members” in figuring out or voting on any issue while, according to al-Zindani, he should have said that “the rule is for God”. The president’s order came out as a result of a complaint filed by the Yemeni Socialist Party.
Well. Yeah. I guess that's good reason to declare him an infidel and have him killed. In Yemen, anyway...
Yemen Times learnt that the denial made by al-Zindani last week was just a political compromise on part of the opposition coalition delegation members who met al-Zindani at his house in the university campus.
"No, no! Certainly not!"
Political sources told Yemen Times that al-Zindani refused to deny the allegation that he has issued the fatwa and told them that was his opinion. But, when they scared him that this would give an excuse for the US to ask for his extradition and trial, he told them that they can deny that he issued the fatwa.
There. That made it all better, didn't it?
However, al-Zindani, who was a member of the Presidential Council after the unification, never asked the media to quote him denying that. The opposition has taken this move in order to avoid any breakdown of their coalition whose main components are the Islah and the YSP. Some time earlier, an American newspaper quoted Judge Hamoud al-Hitar, head of the committee conducting dialogues with al-Qaeda prisoners as saying that the attackers of the USS Cole carried out their operation on the basis of a fatwa issued by al-Zindani. But, al-Hitar later denied he said so. It was also reported that al-Zindani is one of those clerics wanted by the US for their link to al-Qaeda and that his university is producing extremists and fundamentalists.
Oh, go ahead. Deny that, too...
The YSP condemned last week the religious edict or what it said is “this ossified way of thinking and the continuation of these tactics of calling people infidel and assassinations, violence and thought and political terrorism and discrimination that do not accept freedom of opinion of people.” The YSP called on the authorities to shoulder their legal responsibility towards this tendency of naming its prominent leaders as infidel, ending all factors that can destabilize security and peace.
That would be a step in the right direction. No doubt they can't do it for... ummm... religious reasons.
It also demanded that the fatwa issued during the civil war which named all socialists as unbelievers and that all acts against them are legal. It said also that the culture, mobilization and other measures taken on the basis of this fatwa should be abolished, urging all political forces in the country to work against such culture from school curricula, sermons of mosque preachers and mass media, and to enhance tolerance and openness in the society. The assassin of Jarallah Omar, YSP assistant secretary general who was sentenced to death in mid-September said during the tribunal sessions that all socialists and secular people are infidels who deserve death penalty. Ali Ahmad Jarallah based his assassination of Omar on an allegation that Omar demanded the abolishing of death penalty which he described as an abuse to human rights.
So he killed him. That makes sense. In Yemen, anyway...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 11:27 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6471 views] Top|| File under:

#1  At this rate, proponents of the death penalty in Yemen will have a demographic advantage within a generation. I think any actuary would agree.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 12:38 Comments || Top||

#2  For years Al-Zindani has been associated with the most radical of Islamists. He is an especial friend of Hassan al-Turabi who chaired the Khartoum-based Peoples Arab and Islamic Conference (The Terrorist International) in the early and mid-1990s.
Posted by: Anonymous || 10/20/2003 12:49 Comments || Top||

#3  If Yemen erupts into a civil war, do we have to clean it up? I'd just prefer to Napalm them and claim what's left as a US seaport.
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 13:11 Comments || Top||

#4  Normally tough to agree with socialists, but I can make an exception for these guys.
Posted by: OminousWhatever || 10/20/2003 13:15 Comments || Top||

#5  Charles, I'm not sure that napalm for the desert is the way to go.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 15:05 Comments || Top||

#6  I thought RB consensus vis-a-vis the desert magic kingdom was nuke: you can still drill for oil through a sheet of glass
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 16:28 Comments || Top||

#7  "The al-Zindani Fatwa"... I like it. Reminds me of "The Screwtape Letters"...

Get a good script man to punch it up, and maybe we have a "go" pic...
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 21:42 Comments || Top||

#8  Daimnation has a link to dial-a-fatwa:

"A Toronto Muslim has had a fatwa placed on her head for the unpardonable sin of celebrating a holiday in favor of the prophet Muhammad. It turns out these guys have a toll-free number - 1-800-95-FATWA - which you can use to rat on any Muslim who's not living in accordance with the tenets of Wahabbi Islam."

Posted by: Anonymous || 10/20/2003 22:44 Comments || Top||

British Police Thwart Plot to Kill Putin
British police have thwarted a plot to kill Russian President Vladimir Putin after arresting a renegade Russian intelligence agent in London, The Sunday Times reported. "This is a criminal investigation into something that has an international dimension," a senior British government official was quoted as saying by the weekly newspaper. "It's a matter for (Scotland) Yard who are taking it seriously." According to The Sunday Times, detectives from Scotland Yard's antiterrorist branch arrested a former KGB major, said to be a trained hitman, and a second Russian after a tip-off last weekend. The would-be assassins were reportedly held for five days at a police station in west London under Britain's antiterrorist legislation and questioned about possible links to Chechen guerrillas. Police were alerted by Alexander Litvinenko, a former intelligence officer in Russia's FSB, the main successor to the KGB.

Litvinenko told The Sunday Times that the hitmen had asked him to set up a meeting with Russian billionaire Boris Berezovsky who fled Russia in November 2000 after falling out with Putin. Berezovsky — granted political asylum by Britain last month — told the newspaper that he and Litvinenko were called to a meeting with their lawyer at Scotland Yard on Friday. "The police told me they were holding two men and that one of them had admitted being involved in a plot to kill President Putin," Berezovsky said. The men apparently wanted Berezovsky, 57, whose personal fortune is estimated at three billion dollars, to finance the alleged plot. The plot, in which Putin was to be shot dead by a sniper on a foreign trip, was outlined to Litvinenko in a series of telephone calls and a face-to-face meeting with one of the hitmen. "He told Litvinenko that Putin must be overthrown, that he needed to be whacked," said a source close to the investigation, according to The Sunday Times. Scotland Yard did not confirm the plot but said they had arrested two men, aged 36 and 40, last Sunday in London.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 12:41 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6465 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Sounds a lot like a put-up job to smear Berezovsky by Putin's hard men. I wouldn't attach much credibility to this story. Putin's been finding all kinds of reasons to close down media outlets that dissent from his Communist-revivalist message.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 12:51 Comments || Top||

#2  Gee, the Russian Billionaire (from what source, eh?) and the KGB stoge/President had a "falling out"?

Wonder what over?
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 14:42 Comments || Top||

#3  I wouldn't trust Vlad enough to accept a drink of water from him if I were dying of thirst, but the last thing Russia needs right now is a coup attempt. That would give them sufficient reason to accelerate their move toward totalitarianism, instead of following the slow creep they're currently employing. Vlad's not the center - he's just the sock puppet saying the words. I'd be much more interested in whacking some of the Russian Mafia and former apparatchniks that are calling the shots.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 18:07 Comments || Top||

Man jailed for isolating his wife
An Oslo court has sentenced a man to three years in prison for abusing his immigrant wife and preventing her from integrating into Norwegian society. Prosecutors describe the case as unique, and perhaps precedent-setting. The defendant, a 49-year-old described as being North African himself, was convicted for hindering his wife's attempts to join Norwegian society. He prevented her from going to Norwegian language classes, ordered her to wear traditional North African dress with a veil covering her face, and forced her to remain at home. In doing so, he cut her off from any social contact with others. The court, invoking a welfare law generally reserved for children, found his actions to be punishable by law. The court also found him guilty of beating, threatening and otherwise harassing his wife. "This has been a very special case," prosecutor Paal-Fredrik Hjort Kraby told newspaper Aftenposten. "The man forced the woman to live completely cut off from the community. She was prevented from going out and forced to stay home to look after their children. The court has now determined this was illegal."
Illegal to relegate the Little Woman to the status of breeding stock? But... But... It's a cultural thing. You can't jug him for a cultural thing!
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 16:42 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6471 views] Top|| File under:

#1  But the Norwegian immigrant wife prefers kicking back in a windowless room. She's probably pining for the wadis. Still, beau'iful plumage, eh?
Posted by: BH || 10/20/2003 17:02 Comments || Top||

#2  I think we've just witnessed one way Norway has decided to fight terrorism. Remember the old song, "How ya gonna keep 'em down on the farm, after they've seen Paree?" The "Little Woman" isn't going to be content to be walled away in the back hallway once she sees how the rest of the world lives. Norweigans 1, Hayrabs 0.

Keep it up! Build the pressure! It's gonna be so much fun to watch the Arab male figure diminished to the role of partner, instead of the ruler of the house.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 18:12 Comments || Top||

#3  How culturally insensitive. Next thing you know, Norway won't allow immigrants to beat their wives either. :~)
Posted by: Anonymous || 10/20/2003 19:39 Comments || Top||

#4  One down, half a billion to go.
Posted by: .com || 10/20/2003 22:40 Comments || Top||

French strike over cigarette prices
Hey! The French are on strike!
France’s 34,000 tobacconists on Monday staged their first ever national strike in protest against a sharp rise in cigarette prices. The strike coincided with a 20% increase in the price of a pack of cigarettes, the second of three planned price rises. "Three separate price increases will push the cost of smoking up by half in the space of a year," said BBC News correspondent in Paris, Quentin Somerville. France has long had some of the cheapest cigarettes in Europe but is now trying to persuade people to quit the habit. French tobacconists have a monopoly on cigarette sales and take a percentage of every packet sold.
A state sponsored monopoly in France? Shocking!
The price rises will force tobacconists out of business, and the number of bankruptcies has already gone up by 57% in a year, according to the Confederation of Licensed Tobacco Sellers. "The government says loud and clear that it wants the day to come when there is not a single smoker left in France," said Rene Le Pape, president of the confederation. "What I want is to make sure that our network of 34,000 traders doesn’t disappear as well."
...and how you gonna work that out? Maybe you can retrain them as pimps or something.
The government has offered an aid package worth around 120m euros to help the worst-affected tobacconists, but the shopkeepers say it is not enough.
Ve needz,... how you say,...more.
The price rises are designed to encourage people to stop smoking. However, critics say the increases are being used to help bail out France’s troubled state finances.
There’s one idea they don’t mind copying from us. When do they start suing the evil Big Tobacco?
Nine out of 10 tobacconists were closed for the day, and 60 demonstrations were planned across the country. The number of people smoking has been declining slowly, but around 42% of the population still smoke.
42%! Sure, cut off their butts. They’ll be ready to go to war anywhere, anytime, with anyone. Think they’re rude now?
The French government is particularly worried that smoking remains popular with pregnant women and young people.
Puff away, hon. Remember, you’re smoking for two now.
"Putting up prices by 25% means reducing consumption by 10% and in the years ahead preventing 10,000 deaths a year," said Health Minister Jean-Francois Mattei.
Good. That’ll compensate for the death tolls from those summer heatwaves.
After the change, a packet of cigarettes will cost more than five euros a pack, about £3.50, much more than in many of France’s neighbours. But there is nothing to stop consumers driving to neighbouring countries to stock up, and tobacconists in border regions say their business is being ruined by the huge differential in prices.
...sounds like New Hampshire.
Police are more concerned at the rise in large-scale smuggling, which is already estimated to account for up to 30% of cigarette sales in Britain.
Posted by: tu3031 || 10/20/2003 4:22:08 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6477 views] Top|| File under:

#1  planned price rises

this is sort of like.... communism!!
Posted by: Rafael || 10/20/2003 16:41 Comments || Top||

#2  Love government spin-actual increase 50%,Health Minister talks of benefits of 25% increase.Guess we know fallback position if opposition gets too much.

Since French police are famous for being uncorruptable,wonder how worried northern police are now they know they will soon be offered massive bribes to look other way when the cig.trucks roll south.
Posted by: Stephen || 10/20/2003 16:42 Comments || Top||

#3  Stephen

French police is not famous for being uncorruptable
(cf Casablanca "I am a poor corrupt government
employee). French gendarmes are the uncorruptible
people not police.
Posted by: JFM || 10/20/2003 17:05 Comments || Top||

#4  I really, really get disgusted with government-sponsored social engineering. Studies have been totally unable to determine if changing the price of cigarettes here in the US has had any effect on whether people continue to smoke or not. All it does is increase the irritation level people feel toward their government. Yes, it COULD lead to something - look at what the Stamp Act did in the US some 250 years ago. Can the government guarantee what the result will be? Not on your (or THEIR) life.

Personally, I've found that juggling live hand grenades is NOT conducive to a long and happy life.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 18:20 Comments || Top||

#5  JFM,
I was being sarcastic about uncorruptable French police.
Posted by: Stephen || 10/20/2003 18:24 Comments || Top||

#6  Time to get into the French black market? Hmmm...

Let's see...North Carolina to Holland...
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 21:47 Comments || Top||

#7  You'll save money if you send it by the shipload, Mojo. It's cheaper than flying Air-France.
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 22:55 Comments || Top||

More Illegal Immigrant Deaths
An Italian coastal patrol has found a small boat with 11 dead would-be immigrants near the southern island of Lampedusa. Also on board were 24 survivors of a trip that an Italian refugee official suspected began near the Tunisian-Libyan border. The dead had apparently succumbed to exhaustion and starvation, and the survivors were emaciated. It is the second tragedy involving illegal immigrants off Lampedusa in the past three days. On Friday, seven Africans died before their boat could reach Lampedusa. A further 25 survived.
The problem is universal. People don’t like to live where it sucks.
So they go live someplace else, and try to make it suck like home. Go figure.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 11:40:16 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6463 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Fred, I foresee food-station bouys.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 12:40 Comments || Top||

#2  SH: Why do you think they brought along the dead guys????
Posted by: tu3031 || 10/20/2003 13:13 Comments || Top||

#3  At least the survivors won't be able to sue the Italian government for not making easier for them to migrate illegally to Italy.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 13:59 Comments || Top||

France to spearhead EU asylum ban of Pakistanis
Taking the threats of Saudi terrorist Osama bin Laden to widen the spread of extremist attacks quite seriously, the French Government has said that it will use its influence to convince other members of the European Union (EU) not to encourage moves to grant political asylum to Pakistani residents.
[Insert obligatory piggy squeal about profiling and discrimination]
Inaugurating the first day of the G-5 anti-terrorism summit at the French resort city of La Baule on Sunday, French Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy was quoted by the Dawn newspaper as saying that Paris is taking Osama’s threats issued on Arab satellite TV channel Al-Jazeera "very seriously". The summit has been convened to take decisions on the security future of the European Union, and will notably issue a list of the "sure countries" from which candidates for political asylum in the EU will now be refused authorization to reside in the present 15 European countries, and, as of next year, the 25 member EU states.
"If you can't behave in your own countries, why should we expect you to behave in ours?"
According to the paper, an international colloquium was held recently in Paris on immigration and population flows in which it was revealed that the European continent will see even more immigration in the coming years than it has in its recent history. The colloquium also revealed that at present there are over 40 million immigrants in mainland Europe alone, with eight million in France, of which five million are Visigoths Muslims.
Posted by: rg117 || 10/20/2003 8:01:52 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6475 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Well, I guess you gotta get serious about the problem some time, maybe before the first two million radical moslems made it there and setup housekeeping.
Posted by: badanov || 10/20/2003 8:15 Comments || Top||

#2  Pakistan, huh? Maybe the French want to do a quick review of the various nationalities we have jugged in Gitmo.
Posted by: Patrick Phillips || 10/20/2003 8:30 Comments || Top||

#3  Well this is reassuring. Closing the door on them in Europe can only mean that some idiot(s) here in the U.S. is going to clamor that we should take up the slack.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 10/20/2003 10:47 Comments || Top||

#4  Why not just stop accepting Pak passports? Yemeni too.
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 11:26 Comments || Top||

#5  "You sure you're Finnish, Mr... ummm... Mahmoud? You don't look Finnish."
Posted by: Fred || 10/20/2003 12:07 Comments || Top||

#6  At least Sarkozy is not as "kozy" with Mahathir's polemics as Chirac is. In fact, he is a breath of fresh air in France. This is not the first little skirmish he has initiated with the French muslim community. He wants them to be "more French" which I am ambievalent about since I don't know what's worse - being Muslim or being "more French".
Posted by: Jack is Back! || 10/20/2003 12:19 Comments || Top||

#7  This is going to make it difficult for Britain. Pakland is still a member of the British Commonwealth, and IFAIK, still able to go to Britain quite easily. Is France trying to dictate British foreign policy? Sure sounds like it could be interpreted that way. Bulldog, you there???
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 12:32 Comments || Top||

#8  Economically speaking, won't the poorest nation in the EU tend to be the gateway for illegal immigration?
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 12:43 Comments || Top||

#9  This is NOT an attempt to stop immigration of Muslims.He only wants to stop those from claiming political asylum from entering.Since most claiming political asylum are opposed to native counrty's government,this is another way for France to suck up to Islamic govt.'s.Furthermore,
it's very difficult to kick out those who have received pol.asylum-bad press(meanies are sending XYZ to his death),etc.Immigrants who come on economic visa's,who sneak in can be kicked out much easier if it becomes desirable-bad economy means no jobs available,they are breaking laws,whatever excuse is plausible.Finally,this gives appearance French govt. is taking action,
which helps out domestic politics,where French govt. is under pressure.
Posted by: Stephen || 10/20/2003 14:41 Comments || Top||

#10  For an example of why French proposal on no political asylum has nothing to do with immigration;what would happen if Iran really cracks down on students and hundreds of decent,articulate Iranian students claim political asylum in France?If EU policy states no pol.asylum,no problem.But if it has to be France
which decides,big problem.Either refuse asylum and be condemned for selling out freedom-seeking kids to be killed by a cruel tyrrany,or grant asylum and have students constantly agitating for France to take action against Iran,with world press looking on and interviewing students.
Posted by: Stephen || 10/20/2003 14:54 Comments || Top||

#11  French students don't agitate for people fighting tyrannies except when they go against the USA.
In France there are two kinds of students: the people of the "grandes ecoles" ie future engineers and MBAs who got there with a very difficult exam and don't agitate, on the other side you have universities who are open to every one (graduating is another thing, 80% are bumped after the first year) where between the people in first and second year you have lots of people who are doing far more agitation and practical sexology than studying. Universities tend to be very red and
grandes ecoles far more right wing.
Posted by: JFM || 10/20/2003 18:04 Comments || Top||

#12  OP, that's what my reaction was, too. Britain has a relatively high rate of immigration from Pakistan, and has had for decades. However, I suspect the naming of Pakistan is due to the fact that this article is from Yahoo India News. It seems France has drawn up a list of safe countries, of which Pakistan is but one. I don't think there's necessarily anything political about it.
Posted by: Bulldog || 10/20/2003 19:20 Comments || Top||

#13  If France could dictate British policy there would be fewer crazy ass Islamonutz in London--but the UK has opened the gates and the "Empire" has come home to roost--if we want to get Al Qaeda--look in London first
Posted by: NotMikeMoore || 10/20/2003 22:42 Comments || Top||

#14  NMM, London is where we can see them. We follow them from london to their real bases in Pakland and Afghanistan. Besides, if you want Al-Quaeda, you go to Iran. Everybody knows that.
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 23:01 Comments || Top||

Standing Up for Democracy
by Claudia Winkler, The Weekly Standard
IN THE TURBULENT and dangerous politics of Pakistan, credible public figures willing to stand up for pluralist democracy are no commonplace. So it was a privilege to meet with Afrasiab Khattak and Asfandyar Wali Khan—middle-aged men who between them have spent more than a decade in prison in the course of their careers opposing military dictatorships—on their recent stop in Washington. Their earnest plea: The United States must remain engaged in their region.
We don't have a choice at the moment. We may have one later, though...
Khattak is a lawyer, writer, and longtime member of the Human Rights Commission of Pakistan, where he just finished a three-year term as chairman. His duties on the commission included responding to the anguished parents of young Pakistanis recruited to fight for the Taliban, while their government turned a blind eye. "It was a disaster," Khattak said on the "NewsHour" with Jim Lehrer in April 2002. "Thousands of people, sentimental people, simple people, naive people went into another country to fight without any preparation, any planning."
They were people driven by blind hatred of America and Americans, hopped up on religion. Had they attained their objectives, simple, sentimental people in the U.S. would have received the bodies of their loved ones to mourn over...
In July, Khattak joined the leadership of the Awami National party, of which Asfandyar Wali Khan is president. Elected to the Pakistani senate last March, Wali Khan is the son and grandson of Pashtun political leaders dating back to the independence struggle on the subcontinent. The ANP is based in the Northwest Frontier Province, where it confronts an Islamist provincial government with anti-American, pro-jihadist leanings. Yet the party has national aspirations and universal principles. Its leaders see it as a "bulwark against extremism and fundamentalism."
It's a prety flimsy bulwark. Pashtuns aren't exactly lining up to vote Awami...
"We spoke up publicly after 9/11 for liberal, democratic, secular values and held public meetings against the Taliban. We openly endorsed the liberation of Afghanistan," says Wali Khan.
This was pretty much drowned out in the riots staged by Qazi's, Fazl's and Sami's parties, and obscured in the dust of the TNSM departing by the truckload to kill infidels...
Like all opposition parties in Pakistan, the ANP operates under constant pressure from the government. Although lively, dissenting voices are heard in the press, freedom of assembly is severely restricted, and discriminatory laws have favored the growing religious parties. In the last election, a requirement that candidates hold advanced degrees "eliminated almost half of all former legislators," according to a recent study by the International Crisis Group. Candidates with degrees from the religious "madrassas" were unaffected. The religious parties boasted their best showing at the polls yet. The Crisis Group report confirms that the government of President Pervez Musharraf, even as it cooperates with the United States to some degree in the war on terrorism, is undermining the moderate secular parties at home and allowing the military to promote the Islamists. The report urges Western aid donors to channel and condition all aid so as to strengthen liberal forces and civil society.
Rantburgers are familiar by now with Perv's usually double, occasionally triple, and sometimes even quadruple game...
As for my Pakistani visitors, they foresee disaster if the Islamists get their way. "We see a sort of interaction between the Iranian mullahs and elements in the Saudi monarchy and fundamentalists and their allies in the Pakistani state," says Wali Khan. "They are cooperating to keep the pot boiling in the region. They want the Americans to get bogged down. The problem is, U.S. policy mostly ignores non-state players, including democratic parties."
I think the non-state players we're concentrating on right now are the fundo parties and the jihadi groups. Rather than supporting the Awami National Party, we're tracking the activities of the people opposing them. This could be not the most effective policy, but given the intricacies of Pak politix, complete with loyalties that can shift overnight, it's probably the best we're going to do. None of us has any doubts that a major Islamist victory would throw Pakland openly into the enemy camp.
Afrasiab Khattak agrees. "The main aim of the extremists is to get the United States out of Afghanistan and Iraq. If the United States withdraws without rebuilding, we in the region have had it. And the suppression of liberal forces will start with us, but it will spread far beyond our borders."
If we blow it like that, we'll have had it, too...
Regional expert Elie Krakowski, a senior fellow of the American Foreign Policy Council, notes the implication for U.S. policy. "If we are serious about building civil society in Pakistan," he says, "we have to help people like Afrasiab Khattak and Asfandyar Wali Khan, because they are capable and they are voicing very legitimate and important views. Given the chance, they could make a lot of headway, and this could serve both Pakistan's interest and ours."
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 21:40 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6465 views] Top|| File under:

’Nepal rebels kidnap UK officer’
EFL from BBC
At least one British army officer is among five people reportedly abducted by Maoist rebels in Nepal. The group were part of a mission to recruit Gurkhas in a remote region northwest of the capital, Kathmandu. Nepalese soldiers were also missing, Baglung district’s most senior official said. More than 8,000 people have died since Maoist guerrillas began an armed struggle to rid Nepal of its monarchy in 1996, the authorities say. However, this is believed to be the first time the Maoists have kidnapped foreign nationals. A Ministry of Defence spokesman in London could not confirm the officer had been kidnapped, but told the BBC they had lost contact on Sunday night with a team that was observing the recruitment of Gurkhas. The British Army has been recruiting Nepalese men to fight in its Gurkha brigade for nearly 200 years. Competition is fierce to join the brigade, which has a reputation for fierce bravery, endurance and loyalty.
Did you ever notice that Maoist seem to be awfully poor here lately. They are kidnapping for cash all over the world. Something about their system doesn’t seem to generate cash flow. Can’t put my finger on it.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 3:19:50 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6475 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Speaking of Gurkhas - send them in to get the guy. Kukris at the ready...
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 17:18 Comments || Top||

#2  If he's not released sharpish, I suspect it'll be the SAS.
Posted by: Bulldog || 10/20/2003 18:56 Comments || Top||

#3  I 'd think you're wrong - or maybe not all right. The Gurkhas have to look on this as an offense to their honor. Brrrrrrr....
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 21:52 Comments || Top||

Kashmir Korpse Kount: 2 dead 60 injured
Two civilians were killed and 60 others injured in two grenade explosions triggered by suspected Islamic militants in Indian-administered Kashmir on Monday, police said.
suspected Islamic militants = mealy-mouthed words of the day
One of the deaths and 53 of the injuries occurred in the Batamaloo area of Kashmir’s summer capital Srinagar when rebels hurled a grenade at a security patrol. The explosive missed its target and exploded at a bus stand.
nice aim, mahmoud
"The condition of at least half a dozen civilians is serious," the spokesman said, adding they were being treated in Srinagar’s main hospital. Another civilian was killed and seven others injured in a grenade explosion in the southern town of Anantnag, 50 kilometres south of Srinagar on Monday afternoon. The grenade was hurled at a security force vehicle but, also missing its target, it exploded in a busy market.
Cripes these Pakis throw like little girls
I think they only pretend to throw at the cops. They like to see those dead civilians.
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 10:56:19 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6461 views] Top|| File under:

#1  " Mohammad, kill the infidel! Wait, that little girl is holding a teddy bear! She is the bigger infidel with her furry bear! And make sure someone recovers that lolli-pop..."
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 13:17 Comments || Top||

GIs must wait 8 months to bring back Iraqi wives
Hat tip: Drudge. Edited for brevity.
Two National Guard soldiers who married Iraqi women against their commander’s wishes will have to wait at least eight months to return home with their brides, according to a lawyer for one of the soldiers. The women’s visas will take at least that long to process by mail because the State Department is not issuing visas in Iraq, said Richard Alvoid, an attorney hired by Sgt. Sean Blackwell’s family. The wait could be even longer if the military decides to charge the men with disobeying orders, Alvoid said. Blackwell, 27, and Cpl. Brett Dagen, 37, were Christians who converted to Islam so they could be married under Iraqi law. Their commanders took the unusual step of ordering the men not to marry. The soldiers, members of the 3rd Battalion of the Florida Guard’s 124th Infantry, are expected to remain in Iraq at least until February. The men had wanted to send their wives, both physicians, to the United States sooner because of threats from anti-American Iraqis. The men have been restricted to their bases since the double wedding in August, and they have not been allowed to see or speak to their wives since then, the soldiers’ mothers said Monday. Lt. Col. Ron Tittle, spokesman for the Florida National Guard in St. Augustine, said earlier this month that the soldiers’ battalion commander had been worried the marriages might distract his troops from their mission and compromise their safety.
Ya think?
Posted by: Dar || 10/20/2003 10:05:45 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6461 views] Top|| File under:

Allawi suggests callup of the army
Iraq's interim leader called for an immediate mobilization of the country's old army to help the Americans as ambush teams struck U.S. targets around Baghdad, killing two American soldiers. The United States would "speed the process of relieving the burden on its troops" by recalling the disbanded Iraqi military, said Iyad Allawi, current president of the Iraqi Governing Council.
I've heard worse ideas. Not many, but some...
Attackers killed two U.S. soldiers and wounded a third in a clash outside the northern city of Kirkuk late Saturday. Others blasted a broken-down convoy in the western flashpoint city of Fallujah, setting off spectacular explosions from an ammunition
truck. The deaths in Kirkuk brought to 103 the number of Americans killed by hostile fire since U.S. President George W.Bush declared an end to major combat on May 1. A total 338 Americans have died since the March 20 invasion
of Iraq, 217 of them in combat.
There could actually be something to be said for this idea, goofy as it sounds at first hearing. The "People's Army" and "Quds Army" would be useless, as would the Republican Guard units, for different reasons. But Iraq's conventional forces, with a thorough overhaul of the officers' corps... Hmmm...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 15:42 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6465 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Dont forget the training they will require. Iraq's 'regular army' is not really much of an 'army' by our standards.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 10/20/2003 15:58 Comments || Top||

#2  The Iraqi's conventional army was composed of draftees. Most draftees might not want to be called up. You might also get some bad guys showing up and getting access to barracks and weapons depots they could blow up. On the other hand this does have the advantage of giving the Iraqi's a dog in the fight, since its their fight and all.
Posted by: Yank || 10/20/2003 16:03 Comments || Top||

#3  This idea is cathing on in Afghanistan as well. At least with the guys who got laid off. Former Afghan Military Personnel Protest
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 16:07 Comments || Top||

#4  Hummmmmmm -- wonder if Chief Wiggles' generals could play some role with this? He said they had some great ideas for putting their country back together. I've been curious about that.
Posted by: Sherry || 10/20/2003 17:36 Comments || Top||

#5  Got an earfull from a recent returnee today. Seems like our estimates of the number of border-crossers is astonishingly low. Also learned that only about one in 25 actually makes it into the country. There's a big disparity between those numbers and what we hear on CNN. My source, a recently-returned grunt, says that Iraqis provide more than half the border security, and they shoot first and ask questions of the survivors, if there are any. Also said the death toll can be as high as 300 a day. That's a hefty figure! Also heard from another source that many Iraqis are showing up at US Army locations, asking what they can do to help, including whacking and stacking bad guys. One totally volunteer effort is being trained to clear mines. Another is supposedly dredging the Tigris & Euphrates rivers of crap thrown in during Saddam's reign - everything from old bottles of cooking oil to whole trucks. Maybe giving the Iraqis more of a say in the day-to-day activity of their country is the best way to go.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 18:36 Comments || Top||

US army chiefs plan ’strategic exit’ from Iraq
United States commanders in Iraq have drawn up detailed proposals for a rapid reduction of troop numbers over the next 18 months in the first indication of formal planning for an exit strategy. The plans, which have been put to Donald Rumsfeld, the defence secretary, but not yet approved by him, suggest reducing the American forces from 130,000 to about 100,000 by next summer.
More snipped. Goes on to mention being down to around 50,000 by 2005, which sounds like something I’d heard before.
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats || 10/20/2003 3:15:32 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6474 views] Top|| File under:

#1  What? You mean it wasn't for the Oiiiil???
Posted by: CrazyFool || 10/20/2003 15:54 Comments || Top||

#2  So the question is, where are the 80,000 US troops going when they leave Iraq? Are they just resting up before going to Syria?
Posted by: Yank || 10/20/2003 16:05 Comments || Top||

#3  Can't wait to see how the Donks will try to spin this.
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 10/20/2003 16:13 Comments || Top||

#4  So the question is, where are the 80,000 US troops going when they leave Iraq?

Hopefully not back to Germany...
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats || 10/20/2003 16:30 Comments || Top||

#5  I hope the 80,000 troops leave Iraq by heading west, through Syria and Lebanon, before debarking in Israel next year.
Posted by: Tibor || 10/20/2003 16:37 Comments || Top||

#6  I hope the 80,000 troops leave Iraq by heading west, through Syria and Lebanon, before debarking in Israel next year.
Beirut is a great harbor - big enough to hold the whole sixth fleet. Let the guys go home through Beirut. Lattakia is also an excellent harbor - let's arrange for half of them to go home through there! Between the two, we could clean up a big mess, restore peace to a region that hasn't seen it since the Turkish caliphate turned it into a seedy backwater, and have two excellent places to home-port a third of our Med fleet.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 18:40 Comments || Top||

#7  Latakia is a beautiful city--great port--and there's even A Meridien Hotel there (French owned)--thought the Sixth Fleet might like it.....
Posted by: NotMikeMoore || 10/20/2003 22:59 Comments || Top||

Marines Lead in Anti-Smuggling Effort
EFL AP from Newsday
Speedboats full of U.S. Marines pull up alongside a large freighter. Clambering aboard the Iraqi-flagged ship, they check the paperwork, look for suspicious oil stains and investigate whether the cargo is illegal.
Not sure that looking for stains will be productive but I like the rest of the strategy.
The Marines are part of a major coalition operation to combat the widespread smuggling of oil and other commodities, including copper, from Iraq. Officials estimate that more than 587,800 gallons of oil alone, the equivalent of 65 tanker trucks, were being smuggled daily out of the southern port of Umm Qasr before the anti-smuggling operation began two weeks ago. "The smugglers are stealing oil from the Iraqi people. One of the keys to rebuilding infrastructure is capitalizing on oil resources. Stealing the oil takes away that opportunity," spokesman Capt. Bill Pelletier said. The campaign, dubbed Operation Sweeney, pulls together British, Iraqi and American forces to conduct the land, air and sea operations. Some 2,000 Marines and sailors, from the 13th Marine Expeditionary Unit based in Camp Pendleton, Calif., joined the campaign a week ago. In recent days, coalition forces have recovered 24 oil barges, 15 empty barges, 10 land-based fuel pumps, eight oil boats and 50 vehicles. The smuggling methods are fairly basic but very effective, said Maj. Gordon Mackenzie, spokesman for the British troops, who are leading a multinational command in southern Iraq. Smugglers will break into the oil pipelines, focusing mainly on the southern Rumeila oil fields, with sledgehammers, grenades or assault rifles, he said.
Can somebody buy these guys a hole saw?
The crude oil that bubbles out is loaded up into tanker trucks, with the remainder oozing out into giant black pools dotting the desert, Mackenzie said.
They’re eco-terrorists to boot.
The oil is transferred down to the port and loaded onto barges. The barges then troll the waterways looking for buyers among the freighters, Mackenzie said.
No it is not stolen oil. I run a Jiffy Lube in Basra. This is from oil changes.
"It’s organized crime, but it’s not so sophisticated," he said. "That’s part of what makes it difficult to track." A week ago, coalition forces seized more than 529,000 gallons of smuggled Iraqi oil in a joint operation of the British Royal Navy and the U.S. Coast Guard, The oil, found aboard the Guinean flagged vessel MV Marwan, was among the largest finds for coalition forces trying to stop smuggling operations. Two weeks ago, at least 10 boats were being held in a "smuggler box," a site for ships found smuggling contraband oil from Iraq, although some have been released.
Don’t release the clowns. That’s weak. Auction off their stuff.
The joint operation is expected to intensify in the next few days. Checkpoints along the highways are being set up by Iraqi police to search all tanker trucks. The British provide much of the intelligence, giving lists to the Americans of suspected vessels.
Please teach us how to do the intelligence portion sometime.
It's probably a split mission, with them covering some activities and us covering others...
Under an order issued Aug. 31 by the coalition, the Iraqi judiciary system is free to begin investigating those caught smuggling and return the wealth to Iraq. Last month, for the first time, an Iraqi judge was escorted to vessels being held on suspicion of smuggling Iraqi oil and conducted administrative hearings on six of them.
Iraqis taking part = good news.
But it’s the Marines who are doing the daily patrols, boarding and intercepting suspicious vessels in Umm Qasr port. On a recent patrol, five small, black-rubber speedboats with a half-dozen armed Marines in each, sped down the Shatt al-Arab waterway that flows into the Gulf. The men hailed a freighter named the Richa Mumbai, climbing a ladder dropped off the side. They checked for proper documentation, bringing a local translator to prevent any misunderstandings.
These guys got to love this duty.
"We haven’t had a lot of resistance," said Capt. Christian Rankin, 26, of Bravo Company, 1st Battalion, 1st Marine Regiment. "We’re not here to hurt anyone. We approach with a relaxed posture. Most of the intelligence comes from locals. They’re supportive because our presence here prevents looting and other illegal activities."
I doubt that resisting marines with guns would be healthy. I guess if the ship chose not to stop, it is unlikely to outrun the frigate that is supporting the operation.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 3:02:01 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6472 views] Top|| File under:

#1  What happens to the frieghters,tankers,barges,etc?
Are they siezed and auctioned off?

The owners of these multi million $ ships start loosing them and thinks will change in a hurry.
Posted by: Raptor || 10/20/2003 17:30 Comments || Top||

#2  Raptor, my impressionfrom teh article is that they are impounded ... for a while... and then let go. I would assume taht the owner is warned about the shady activities of the crew and told that there won't be a second warning.

Not what I would do, but an effective way of not getting into an international logjam.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 20:45 Comments || Top||

#3  We really need to start doing this here in the US.
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 23:10 Comments || Top||

US troops under fire in Iraq
Two US soldiers have been killed and one injured in an ambush in northern Iraq, the US military has said. A spokesman for US-led forces said they came under fire from rocket-propelled grenades near the city of Kirkuk on Saturday evening. In a separate incident, attackers targeted a US military convoy in Falluja, central Iraq, causing a US vehicle to explode, but no casualties.
We ran this yesterday...
Reports say an Iraqi was killed and at least one other injured when US troops opened fire after the attack which came after the lorry had broken down. Television pictures showed a US military vehicle, believed to be an ammunition lorry, in flames — while a crowd of jubilant Iraqis gathered at the scene.
To the Rantburgers: are you guys sure that Iraqis are happy with the American “Liberation”? It doesn’t look that much!
Obviously some of the bad guys living in Fallujah aren't. Not everyone in Iraq is a bad guy, though...
"Falluja has destroyed the Americans," some men shouted.
Ummm... No. Fallujah has blown up a broken-down truck...
The Kirkuk attack takes to 103 the number of American troops confirmed killed in combat in Iraq since President George W Bush declared major hostilities over on 1 May. After the attack in Falluja, Iraqi police said to be acting on orders from the US military detained a photographer for the French news agency AFP along with a Reuters cameraman, AFP said. The reason for their detention was not clear.
Censorship? nahhhh
Advance knowledge of the attack? Like al-Jizz seems to have regularly?
The latest violence comes days after the US won support at the United Nations Security Council for a new resolution on Iraq. The resolution calls for Iraq’s interim leaders to submit by mid-December a timetable for new constitution and subsequent elections. The US hopes the UN backing will persuade more nations to contribute troops and money to help stabilise and rebuild Iraq.
Don’t rush, one by one
Posted by: Murat || 10/20/2003 10:45:27 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6473 views] Top|| File under:

#1  are you guys sure that Iraqis are happy with the American “Liberation”? It doesn’t look that much!

Why is it necessary that the Iraqis be happy? I'm happy.

Posted by: Shipman || 10/20/2003 10:52 Comments || Top||

#2  The US hopes the UN backing will persuade more nations to contribute troops and money to help stabilise and rebuild Iraq.

Actually, mostly money, but troops from reliable allies (this may exclude Turkey) would be welcome. Our guys have been there 180 days since the end of large scale combat and suffered just over 100 casualties. That comes to about one every other day. In Vietnam, the average casualty count was 30 per day - unsurprising, since our boys were engaging in combat against regiment- or company-sized units every day. (No real surprises there, given that the North Vietnamese Army and the Vietcong suffered in excess of 1 million KIA over 8 years - this means a NVA/VC casualty rate of 300 KIA per day).

At the end of the day, this guy Sanchez may need to be replaced, especially if he's not learning the lessons of counter-guerrilla warfare. I give him another month before the Pentagon removes him, if we start losing guys in twos and threes.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 10:56 Comments || Top||

#3  To the Randburgers: are you guys sure that Iraqis are happy with the American “Liberation”? It doesn’t look that much!

Of course, it was Fallujah, the most anti-American city in all of Iraq. If you think they represent the attitude of all Iraqis then you haven't been paying attention.
Posted by: g wiz || 10/20/2003 10:57 Comments || Top||

#4  Gee, Murat, I guess you won't be convinced unless we have 100% support like Saddam did. I guess we should just leave and let the whole place go to hell--we couldn't get every Ba'athist and rebuild the entire country in several months, so we should leave to make Murat happy.

Thanks for more anecdotal evidence that proves nothing!
Posted by: Dar || 10/20/2003 11:01 Comments || Top||

#5  are you guys sure that Iraqis are happy with the American “Liberation”? It doesn’t look that much!

Liberating Saddam's supporters wasn't a war aim - liberating those oppressed by Saddam was. Saddam's henchmen are understandably unhappy about losing their meal ticket. When Saddam was deposed, the gravy train came to a screeching halt. Maybe we should turn the country over to the Kurds and the Shiites, who will take care of the unhappiness that Iraq's Sunnis are feeling - permanently.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 11:02 Comments || Top||

#6  So...and why are we letting these guys dance on top of the wrecked ammo vehicle without dropping a 250-lb present on them?
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 11:31 Comments || Top||

#7  Sure, while the current casualty counts are exactly the first day on the Somme, this would all be a lot more tolerable if one were convinced that the administration had a more sophisticated strategy.

It may well be that since they didn't get the expected war, the administration is getting prepared to cut and run.
Posted by: Hiryu || 10/20/2003 11:49 Comments || Top||

#8  US troops under fire in Iraq

In other news today, the sun rose at 06:20 this morning. Details at 11.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 10/20/2003 12:24 Comments || Top||

#9  Well, Murat, there is a new Iraqi blogger, his link is via Instapundit and other American bloggers.

He's a 24 y.o. dentist.

I especially like the liar, liar part.
Posted by: Anonymous || 10/20/2003 12:35 Comments || Top||

#10  Sure, while the current casualty counts are exactly the first day on the Somme, this would all be a lot more tolerable if one were convinced that the administration had a more sophisticated strategy.

No amount of strategizing will prevent allied casualties during guerrilla warfare. The sophisticated strategy is to replace American troops acting as glorified security guards with Iraqis, which will take a lot of work, because we have to ensure they are politically-reliable (i.e. not working for Saddam, al Qaeda or the Iranians) and then train them. This will free up US troops to do what they do best - conduct raids against the enemy. We also need to reduce the number of troops in Iraq - this will reduce the number of supply convoys required, and hence, the number of targets presented to the terrorists. (It's our supply convoys that are getting hit, because they are soft-skinned compared to the combat units).
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 12:48 Comments || Top||

#11  Murat, we don't expect everybody to be happy. We're not even all happy here. But do you think the typical Iraqi was happier under Saddam? Do you want the world to be a better place, or are you just satisfied with finding glee in ambushes of folks trying to hunt down a tyrant and provide a basis for democracy? Grow up!
Posted by: Tom || 10/20/2003 15:18 Comments || Top||

#12  Murat, the URL for the 24 year old dentist that anon mentioned is
A great read.
Posted by: Gasse Katze || 10/20/2003 15:19 Comments || Top||

#13  I am reading this at a library and do not have my WW I books handy, but I believe the casualities on the first day of the Somme were in the 1000s not hundreds. Anyway the comparision is silly. Rifle.
Posted by: Rifle308 || 10/20/2003 21:49 Comments || Top||

#14  I believe the casualities on the first day of the Somme were in the 1000s not hundreds.

21000 Brits were KIA on the first day of the Somme.

Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 23:44 Comments || Top||

#15  Tell me straight out Murat: do you want the US to fail in Iraq or succeed?

Don't be shy. The truth is a good thing.
Posted by: R. McLeod || 10/21/2003 2:34 Comments || Top||

Southeast Asia
Bush Not Making Time for Canadian PM
EFL AP from Newsday
He scratched at the door, but White House officials weren’t letting Canadian Prime Minister Jean Chretien in Sunday. The prime minister requested a formal one-on-one meeting with President Bush during the two-day APEC summit here this week, but his appeal has been met so far with nothing more than silence. Chretien and Bush were expected to bump into each other several times during the summit, but U.S. officials shrugged off a Canadian request for a formal bilateral meeting between the men, who have never had a close personal relationship. "We told them that if we can, we should sit down," said a senior Canadian official. "If not, we’ll meet in pull-asides (informal meetings)." His relationship with Chretien, never warm to begin with, soured further when the prime minister refused to send Canadian troops to Iraq earlier this year to support the U.S.-led invasion.
Message to Chretian - we’re neighbors; we don’t need to travel to Asia for a sitdown. You want to talk turkey? Oh, its beef imports. OK. Let’s look at my schedule. No can do - got a meeting with Vincente. See yah some other time.

Kept the next item in the article gratuitously.
Philippine President Gloria Macapagal Arroyo’s mind is trained on terrorism and trade, but her stomach apparently is focused on Thailand’s notoriously foul-smelling durian fruit. In a tribute to the stinky fruit, Arroyo is throwing a gig billed as "The Durian Party" for aides and Filipino journalists at the end of the Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation summit, officials traveling with her said. Because of its offensive smell, the fruit is banned in many buildings, airplanes and other enclosed areas in Southeast Asia. But Arroyo, who developed an early liking for the fruit in her hometown in the southern Philippines, doesn’t have to wait for the party to satisfy her craving. Thai officials hosted a lunch Sunday at a swank hotel for Arroyo and other fellow Southeast Asian heads of state attending the summit. After a meal of steamed fish, prawns and seafood, dessert was durian ice cream.
Just how bad can the stuff stink. Regardless, I plan to give any ice cream that I eat a good sniff - just in case.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 12:12:12 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6467 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Well, the only two times I've smelled it (never could get myself to taste it), it smelled like two-week old rotten crabs, left on a beach even by the gulls.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 12:23 Comments || Top||

#2  What exactly would be the purpose of sitdown for Chretien?
Posted by: g wiz || 10/20/2003 12:32 Comments || Top||

#3  He wants us to eat Canadian meat... in a manner of speaking.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 12:39 Comments || Top||

#4  Reports are, durian tastes great, despite smelling horrible. Apparently the smell is a function of the rind or other outer portions, which you don't eat.

Don't hold me to that, because I've never gotten closer to one than 20 feet.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 10/20/2003 12:49 Comments || Top||

#5  Reports are, durian tastes great, despite smelling horrible.

You kind of have to close your nostrils with a clothespin while savoring this delicacy. The flesh is yellow, with a custard-like texture.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 12:56 Comments || Top||

#6  Considering the Canadians view on Terrorism, I'm glad is telling Chretien to go F*ck himself.
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 13:06 Comments || Top||

#7  Considering the Canadians view on Terrorism, I'm glad BUSH is telling Chretien to go F*ck himself.

* I must brain dead from that Durian Malt. *
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 13:08 Comments || Top||

#8  Have you guys priced the cost of beef recently? Rib eye ~ $ 14.00 per pound. Maybe we should have some kind of meeting to bring home cheaper meat/beef.
Posted by: Bill || 10/20/2003 13:20 Comments || Top||

#9  Mr. Chretien-
Why not come down to D.C. the next time the Senators play the Capitols? We can go to the game, talk in the suite. Isn't that better than meeting in Asia?
Posted by: POTUS Coordinator || 10/20/2003 14:31 Comments || Top||

#10  Bill: piss off Muslims--eat pork.
Posted by: someone || 10/20/2003 15:04 Comments || Top||

#11  Bush attended the Summit of the Americas in Quebec, which even marginally still counts as part of Canada.

I love Canadians, I dont judge them by the actions of their socialist repressive government, and I wish them every hope in overthrowing it someday and returning to the civilized world.

Once upon a time, Canadians were known as people you could turn to in time of trouble. Today, because of the selfishness of their extreme left-wing government, we are forced to fight the war against terror without the backing of fine Canadian troops. The government of Canada has downsized the Canadian military force to the point that they are no longer capable of deploying a force of any size overseas. Canada, who once built their own aircraft, and had two aircraft carriers, now has one squadron of F-18 hornets and a small fleet of coastal interdiction craft. During the run up to Operation Iraqi Freedom, the Canadians did try t osend a frigate, but it had to return to port after the onboard helicopter broke down, and there were no spares to send to it.

Get it? One ship - One Helicopter, No Spares.

The Canadians have fine troops, limited though they may be, they are a great people and a wonderful country. But they are served by the worst most intrenched government in the world.

And yes dear rantburgers, I do remember the Canadian troops we killed in "friendly fire" in Afghanistan ( side note - "friendly" fire is not friendly, time for another metaphor). I feel sorry for that and wished it handnt happened, but I can say with some authority that the situation might never had occured if Canadians had the proper equipment and training to be able to operate in the same theater with American Armed Forces. This is not unique to Canada, but is something that occurs in virtually every NATO country.

For all the caterwauling about getting the french and germans to send troops to afghanistan, no one has bothered to check out just what they have to send. The truth of it is, the majority of NATO countries are paper tigers, incapable of fielding a force of any size, and frankly most of them are so poorly trained and manned that they would be a bigger danger to themselves than to the enemy.

Example: 50% of Germanys military budget goes to pensions.

Example: Heavy lift aircraft for the rest of NATO countries ( exception US and UK) is routinely done with Ukranian private aircraft. This led to the deaths of 300 Germans in a crash in 2002. There are estimated to be 12 heavy lift aircraft for the remainder of NATO.
Example: US and UK are the only Armed Forces that routinely exercise with night vision equiptment.

Oh, and back to Canada, The only reason they can downsize their military( and in my opinion drop their responsibilies to civilization), is that their protection is guaranteed by that big evil beast country to the south. The Canadian Leftists as well as the Euro Leftists can only exist because Americans have provided the security for them to do so.
Posted by: frank martin || 10/20/2003 17:51 Comments || Top||

#12  Between WW1 and WW2,England came up with idea of
basing budgets on prediction of "no war for next ten years",and automatically renewed it each year.
Canada,and to a lesser degree Europe,appear to have adopted this.To them,Russia is no longer a threat.China is viewed as non-expansionist,thus no threat.The current Islamic problem will go away as soon as there is a Palestinian nation.
If you believe all that,then there is no need to spend money on weapons and equipment to fight a modern war.You just need well-disciplined,well-trained combat MPs that can be loaned out as peacekeepers.You don't need own airlift,hire charters to carry troops-I bet in future national airlines will start bidding(and getting)future charters.
Posted by: Stephen || 10/20/2003 18:49 Comments || Top||

Indonesian Fugitive Helpers Sentenced
An Indonesian court Monday sentenced a man to four years in jail for hiding two fugitives involved in last year's Bali bombings. Muhajir bin Amin was found guilty of sheltering Ali Imron and Mubarok, who goes by a single name, at a remote prawn farm on the eastern coast of Kalimantan island. The men, both of whom have been sentenced to life in prison for planning and carrying out the Bali blasts, were working at the farm when they were arrested in January. They were believed to be waiting for a chance to escape to nearby Malaysia. Judge I Putu Widnya ruled that Amin knew that both men were wanted in the Oct. 12 blasts. The blasts have been blamed on the al-Qaida-linked Jemaah Islamiyah terror group. Amin said he did not know the men were fugitives and would appeal the verdict. He is the 29th person to be convicted in the blasts. Three militants have been sentenced to death. Others have been sentenced to between three and 16 years for sheltering accomplices, hosting meetings and providing funds for the attack. Trials of at least six other suspects are scheduled to start soon.
Enjoy your time in jug, Muhajir.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 11:41 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6464 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Interesting. The Bin Laden family operated (and still may operate) large shrimp farms in Malaysia.
Posted by: Anonymous || 10/20/2003 12:22 Comments || Top||

#2  The Bin Laden family operated (and still may operate) large shrimp farms in Malaysia.

If true, this is really weird - like pork, shrimp are haram (or unclean) based on my limited knowledge of Islam. This is a lot like a Muslim being a pig farmer. I've also heard the rumor about al Qaeda operating shrimp farms, but in Malaysia rather than Indonesia.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 17:12 Comments || Top||

Bio-terror link in raid on JI hideout
Security forces recovered a bio-terror manual and traces of possible biological weapons in a raid on a Jemaah Islamiah hideout in the southern Philippine city of Cotabato, the army said today. Local police said up to eight local and foreign JI suspects escaped yesterday’s raid in central Cotabato but left behind what vice chief of staff Lieutenant General Rodolfo Garcia described as possible residues of a "tetanus virus-carrying chemical". The raid on a Cotabato apartment unit was launched a day after the visit to Manila of US President George W Bush and more than two weeks after the arrest in Cotabato of Indonesian Taufiq Rifqi, described by the Filipino authorities as the number-two man of JI. Cotabato police investigator Superintendent Felipe Napoles said the raid turned up "bomb-making material, electronic components and gadgets, diagrams for homemade bomb-making and Christmas light wiring," as well as computer diskettes. Police briefly detained the landlord, Lolito Adanza for questioning but he was later released without charges, Napoles told reporters. He said Adanza told police Filipinos had rented the apartment there, but that "foreign-looking men had been frequenting the house."
This looks significant, but it seems like every time we see chem and bio stuff pop up nothing's heard about it again...
Posted by: Paul Moloney || 10/20/2003 4:30:47 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6468 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Tetanus would be a pretty poor bioweapon, since in the west (at least) most people are immune to it because of vaccinations. If this news nugget turns out to be true, well, all I can say is that these Islamists are still a bunch of doofuses.
Posted by: MW || 10/20/2003 8:55 Comments || Top||

Timorese gain control of border
East Timor is taking another step towards becoming less dependent on the United Nations, by taking over responsibility for border crossings. The UN has been guarding and managing East Timor’s border since it gained independence from Indonesia in 1999. The Foreign Minister, Jose Ramos Horta, told the BBC it was a significant step for East Timor, which became the world’s newest country last May.
Thanks to the Aussies who booted the Indonesians in the arse.
But East Timor insists it still needs international help. Mr Ramos Horta told the BBC’s World Today programme that thanks to help from the UN and countries like Australia, East Timor’s police and border control staff were being trained. But he said that what East Timor wanted was to become "less and less dependent on international assistance". "The international community is called upon to other emerging problems, and other ongoing problems, like Iraq, Afghanistan, the Middle East and elsewhere," he said, "East Timor cannot pretend to have a monopoly on international sympathy and support."
So sign some oil contracts with BP and Chevron and quit complaining.
But in an interview with the Associated Press news agency, the country’s Prime Minister, Mari Alkatiri, said East Timor still needed foreign donors to keep up their current level of financial assistance. The US has proposed cutting next year’s aid from $25m to $13m - denying suggestions from some Timorese officials that increased costs in Iraq was behind the proposal. Mr Alkatiri urged Washington not to cut its assistance. "It’s nothing compared to what the United States gives to Iraq," he said. "This is a new democracy and it has to be consolidated." Next month, East Timor is due to begin negotiations with Australia over maritime borders. East Timor hopes to gain control of a vast oil and gas field in the Timor Sea, known as Greater Sunrise, which could bring in $7bn for East Timor over the next two decades. The two countries have already signed an agreement to divide up oil and gas reserves from another huge area under the Timor Sea.
This is what the Indonesians fought so hard to keep.
Posted by: Steve White || 10/20/2003 1:25:59 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6461 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This is what the Indonesians fought so hard to keep.

That, and the right to keep massacring the Christians who live there. Hard to tell which was more important to them, sometimes.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 10/20/2003 6:52 Comments || Top||

#2  If you look at it the fundies/Arabs constant strategy has been to try to establish a monoply on oil:

-In Sudan where the Islamist government has fought to keep the oil-rich southern districts and where Al Quaida and other Jihadists (mostly from Arabia) have supported it.
-In Algeria where Saudi Arabia has funded press campaigns blasting the movements vindicating the
Kabyl (ie the people who don't speak Arab) culture while Saudi citizens have funded the GIA and FIS.
-In Iraq where Arab settlers have been established
in Kurdish territory who also happens to be the
main producer of Iraq's oil (the remainder being in Shia territory)
-In Saudi Arabia itself where wahabi regions produce no oil and where wahabi richness comes from oil stolen to the Shias

Posted by: JFM || 10/20/2003 7:44 Comments || Top||

#3  JFM - I would add that they are also involved in destabilizing South America, Venezuela in particular, as part of the long term strategy you theorize
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 8:07 Comments || Top||

Bush Presses for Democracy in Myanmar
President Bush pressed Thailand’s leader Sunday to help restore democracy in neighboring Myanmar and to push for the release of pro-democracy opposition leader Aung San Suu Kyi. Bush and Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra met on the eve of the Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation summit, likely to take up the repressive rule of Myanmar’s junta. The United States urged Southeast Asian countries over the weekend to use "all tools at their disposal" to free Suu Kyi and bring democracy to a country which has been under a military regime since 1962. Myanmar, also known as Burma, has drawn international criticism for detaining Suu Kyi, and dragging its feet on a long-standing promise to free its political system. The current junta held elections in 1990, but refused to recognize the results after Suu Kyi’s party won.
They hate it when that happens...
"He asked me to help push for democracy in Myanmar and for the release of Aung San Suu Kyi," Thaksin said after his session with Bush. Bush said Thaksin gave him a "sympathetic hearing" on the subject and assured him that the two countries share the same goal. "We care deeply about Aung San Suu Kyi and the status of Aung San Suu Kyi, and we would like to see her free," Bush told reporters.
About the trade embargo ...
Bush also told Chinese President Hu Jintao in a later meeting that the United States wants Suu Kyi’s "immediate freedom" and described her as a hero, said a senior administration official.
Somehow I don’t think Hu’s going to be impressed.
Critics say Myanmar has been let off lightly by the 10-member Association of Southeast Asian Nations, of which it is a member. The group has not criticized Myanmar for Suu Kyi’s detention because they considered it an internal matter.
Detaining freedom fighters usually is, if you have the correct mind set.
Posted by: Steve White || 10/20/2003 12:54:30 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6465 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Oh great, now Bush wants Democracy for another third world country. Time to call my friends to protest the maniac Bush!
Posted by: typical lefty || 10/20/2003 10:27 Comments || Top||

Terror Networks
Al-Qaeda Fighters On Attacks Against Americans
From MEMRI. Part of the vid was on Fox News this evening...
A few weeks ago, Al-Qaeda's website declared it would publish the wills of the May 12, 2003 suicide bombers in Riyadh. A couple of days ago it released a new videotape which includes an audio recording of the actual attack as was apparently transmitted through a cell phone, excerpts from past speeches by Osama bin Laden, songs of incitement, a speech by Sheikh Abu Omar Muhammad Al-Seif, and the wills of the attackers, reportedly recorded on April 29, 2003, less than two weeks before the attacks. The following are excerpts from statements by Hazem Al-Kashmiri and Muhammad bin Abd Al-Wahhab Al-Maqit which were recorded in English. To view these English excerpts, go to: http://www.memri.org/video/alqaida. You will need Real Player to view the video.

The film was produced by the Sahhab Institute, which has produced past Al-Qaeda films, including wills of two September 11 hijackers. Two of the attackers who read their wills in the current film (Hazem Al-Kashmiri, also known as "Abu Umar Al-Taifi" and Muhammad bin Abd Al-Wahhab Al-Maqit), address an English message to "the American soldiers" and to "the West." Al-Kashmiri introduces himself as the son of a retired high-ranking officer in the Saudi domestic intelligence apparatus, General Muhammad Said Abdallah Al-Kashmiri.

Another member of the cell, Ashraf Al-Said, calls on Saudi pilots to attack American aircraft carriers or American "settlements" in the Arabian peninsula and urges members of the Saudi military "to kill Americans."
Hazem Al-Kashmiri: For the American soldiers, we say you have to know that your government has become a big evil killing innocent people, destroying homes, stealing our money and holding our sons in jail. We promise that we will not let you live safely and you will not see from us anything else — just bombs, fire, destroying homes, cutting your heads. Our Mujahideen is coming to you very soon to let you see what you didn't see before."

Muhammad bin Abd Al-Wahhab Al-Maqit: I invite you to accept Islam ... and you will be my brother in Islam. And it doesn't matter what your nationality or your color is until you accept Islam — if any enemy attacked you, I will do what I can even if it cost my life to save you. We want from all Christians and Jews to go out from our Islamic countries and release our brothers from jails and stop killing Muslims or we will kill you as you are killing Muslims. We will continue in your fighting until we get what we want. The real Muslims they mean what they say. Very soon all the world will see what we will do. You will not enjoy in your life forever Allah Akbar and glory to Allah.
Nothing here that's new or original. It's more of the same ignorance and brutality, self-pity and shifted responsibility that we see here day in and day out. Eventually we run out of things to say about it, even in derision. Eventually we'll have had enough of "bombs, fire, destroying homes, cutting your heads." They'll be unlucky enough to succeed in carrying out a major attack in the U.S., maybe even another after that, and we'll feel very sorry afterwards for what we'll do to them. There's no dialogue possible, but making a desolation and calling it peace is not an easy step for a civilized people to take. If they're really lucky, we'll succeed with the combination of diplomacy and military action we've undertaken and dispose of them slowly enough that most will be able to slink back into civil life and pretend it never happened.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 22:23 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6470 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Fred - Outstanding commentary... Absolutely sums up my expectations and accurately describes what they will do if the "really lucky" option occurs. Sadly, however, they are industriously stumbling toward that "unlucky" option.

Ironically, if it weren't for their cherished traditions of chaos and incompetence, our troopers wouldn't have time to complain to press parasites and munitions production would be peaking now. And you're absolutely right - we would feel really bad, later, after it was over.

A classic case of "suicide by cop" on a global scale.
Posted by: .com || 10/20/2003 23:31 Comments || Top||

Terje moves on to think tank...
Norwegian diplomat Terje Roed-Larsen, who's played a major role in Middle East peace efforts, will soon move to New York to head the International Peace Academy (IPA). Roed-Larsen most recently has been a UN special envoy to the Middle East, hand-picked by UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan. His wife, Mona Juul, has been Norway's ambassador to Israel. Now he'll leave the troubled Middle East to lead the research institute which describes itself as an "independent, international institution dedicated to promoting the prevention and settlement of armed conflicts between and within states through policy research and development." IPA was founded in 1970 by a group of individuals from within and outside the UN, with support from philanthropist Ruth Forbes Young. It works closely with the UN.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 16:46 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6468 views] Top|| File under:

#1  International Peace Academy
Posted by: seafarious || 10/20/2003 17:01 Comments || Top||

#2  Isn't he the guy that was wailing about the "massacre" in Naublus?
Posted by: Baltic Blog || 10/20/2003 19:10 Comments || Top||

#3  When will these Scandinavians realize JUST how irrelevent they are in the big picture?
Posted by: NotMikeMoore || 10/20/2003 22:52 Comments || Top||

#4  Yeah, and take a lot at their donor list...I see the Ford Foundation pops up, yet again...

Posted by: R. McLeod || 10/21/2003 2:29 Comments || Top||

Middle East
Police ban pro-democracy rally in Egypt
Hokey Smokes Bullwinkle, first Lyiba swears off terrorism, and now this! whats the world coming to?
Police have banned pro-democracy activists from staging a rally to demand political reform in Egypt, organizers and police said Monday, despite recent government promises to make the country more democratic. Hussein Abdel Razik, coordinator of the Committee for the Defense of Democracy,
Wait, go read that again.....
said the state security authorities notified him that police will not allow a march to President Hosni Mubarak’s office, where demonstrators had planned to deliver a petition calling for political reforms. The committee has started a nationwide campaign urging Mubarak to adopt reforms, like holding general presidential elections; abolishing emergency laws in place since 1981 that limit freedom of speech and assembly; and easing restrictions on forming political parties and publishing newspapers.
Rally organizers said they will set another date for the protest, which was scheduled for Wednesday, and would challenge the government in court if such a rally is banned again. "This is unconstitutional and illegal," Razik told The Associated Press. Police officials, speaking on condition of anonymity, said the ban fell under Interior Ministry regulations limiting street protests but did not elaborate.
Protests against the ’evil western influence and zionists’ go on unabated. The ’Department of Irony’ could not be reached for comment
Razik said security officers told him the committee could send the petition, but not protest.
Shredders on stun, Mr. Sulu.
In a statement, the committee described the move as "a new human rights violation by a police state."
hey - that's direct and to the point. It won't get picked up by the general media as its aimed at third world despots and not the US.
Last month Mubarak promised a wide range political and economic reforms bribes and urged opposition parties to engage the government in a national debate on expanding political participation.
Please make it easier for me to identify you and have you arrested.
His ruling National Democratic party
lookie there Egbert!, they got one of them thar democrat parties too!
also promised plans to make Egypt more democratic, though many Egyptians remained skeptical. Mubarak has been president and party leader since Anwar Sadat was assassinated in 1981.
let’s see, in the same time its been reagan,reagan,bush,clinton,clinton and bush. Heres the "kicker" kids....
Pressure for reform has also mounted from abroad following the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks and especially after the U.S.-led war in Iraq that ousted Saddam Hussein.
Sounds like its working to me!
Posted by: Frank Martin || 10/20/2003 1:39:02 PM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6464 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Pressure for reform has also mounted from abroad following the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks and especially after the U.S.-led war in Iraq that ousted Saddam Hussein.
Sounds like its working to me!

Absolutely. The strategy is having its effects and will have even more as people from the region get a chance to check out what's happening, for real, in Iraq. The hear about the elections, they want them too. No one who has any choice at all wants dictators-for-life.

This is why a few casualties every couple of days in Iraq is meaningless. What matters is the strategy and that means pressuring Egypt, Syrian, Saudi Arabia, Iran, et al. to get with the program.
Posted by: R. McLeod || 10/20/2003 14:43 Comments || Top||

#2  We hear an awfully lot from the Dem "presidential candidates" about how Iraq is a 'failure', and Dubya's "domino" theory is the dumbest thing since the invention of dirt. Then a few days later, we see things like this. Wonder how much crow it's gonna take before these idiotarians in the "opposition party" and the media begin to get tired of the menu, and actually learn what's going on.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 18:46 Comments || Top||

#3  In my book, Egypt should be badgered into democratic reform and eventual freedom at a safe pace. We ought to have some influence through our cash flow; if we don't lets send the cash in a more productive direction.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 20:48 Comments || Top||

Japan: N. Korea Might Have Tested Missile
North Korea might have test-fired a short-range missile off its eastern coast on Monday, the Japanese government said, but the report was not confirmed. It was the first suspected missile launch by Pyongyang since a test in April.
If I were a fisherman on the Korean coast, I would take my boat and go elsewhere. It would be very inconvenient for an unannounced surface to surface missle to acquire my boat as a target.
Cabinet Office spokesman Yukinori Morita and the Defense Agency said the government had received an unconfirmed report about a land-to-ship missile being fired into the Japan Sea around noon. But they said the information has not been verified. The missile would not have posed any immediate security threat to neighboring countries, an agency official said. He said the report indicated the missile had a range of about 60 miles. It was believed the firing would have been part of "routine training," he said.
I buy that. As long as they consider it routine to fire an unannounced missile into international waters.
The apparent test-launch comes as President Bush met with leaders from 21 nations at the annual Asia-Pacific Cooperation forum in Bangkok, Thailand, where the threat of a nuclear-armed North Korea and terror attacks has dominated the agenda. In April, U.S. officials said North Korea test-fired an anti-ship missile off its west coast, in an apparent response to the launch by Tokyo of spy satellites to monitor the isolated communist nation days earlier. Japanese officials initially confirmed the firing, only to deny it hours later.
Message for Mr. Kim. Take a lesson from Babe Ruth and call your shot. A missile test is much more impressive if you announce it and shoot at a target. If everbody is watching and you hit the target, that’s impressive. Any idiot can hit the ocean with a rocket.

Civilized nations issue routine closure warnings when they plan for a live missile launch. Saves having to pay for somebody's shrimp boat accidentally getting blown out of the water.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 11:56:13 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6465 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Long story on Kimmie the Sunday NYT Magazine. Good for anyone who wants more background. Be advised that you have to register.


Posted by: tu3031 || 10/20/2003 13:47 Comments || Top||

Alleged Terrorists Lying Low in Syria
Their offices are closed, their mobile phones are off and they're hard to find in Damascus. Yet the Palestinian militants Syria has harbored continue to cast a shadow over relations with America and fuel tension with Israel. Since Secretary of State Colin Powell asked President Bashar Assad in May to close the offices of Hamas, Islamic Jihad, the Popular Front of the Liberation of Palestine and other groups branded by Washington as terrorist, the militants have gone underground.
Not too far, though...
They have put a stop to rallies and fiery speeches to fellow Palestinian refugees in Yarmouk, a low-income area five miles south of Damascus where about 150,000 Palestinian refugees live. But they are still around, often traveling to neighboring Lebanon, where Damascus wields influence, to give statements or interviews to the Arab media. Maher Taher, the top leader in Damascus of the Popular Front of the Liberation of Palestine, said Saturday by telephone from Lebanon that the Palestinians are keen on preventing further pressure on Syria by lying low. "We shouldn't give Israel and America pretexts on the issue of Syria," he said.
The Syrians didn't like that raid, did they?
On Saturday, Hamas vowed to avenge Israel's killing of Hamas militants and its incursions in Rafah in the Gaza Strip. The statement was faxed to The Associated Press office in Lebanon.
One Western diplomat in Damascus described the changes in the Palestinian presence in Syria as cosmetic. The groups remain operational in Damascus, he told the AP. He said the United States wants the Hamas and Islamic Jihad leaders expelled, not sent to Lebanon.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 11:50 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6465 views] Top|| File under:

#1  ready...aim...
Posted by: B || 10/20/2003 12:30 Comments || Top||

#2  Marge, if anyone calls on line one for Hamas, tell them that we're not here anymore. If they call on line two, we are still taking deliveries. Don't get mixed up again. Also keep the lights off and don't answer the front door.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 13:05 Comments || Top||

#3  SH...lol!
Posted by: B || 10/20/2003 17:30 Comments || Top||

Home Front
Man Sent to U.S. on Iraq Arms Charges
A man accused of being half of a father-son team that provided weapons illegally to Saddam Hussein's regime in Iraq has been brought to the United States to face charges.
"Welcome back to the USA, Regard. Book 'im, Danno!"
Regard Yakou, 43, was flown Sunday from Kuwait to John F. Kennedy International Airport in New York and was scheduled to make an initial appearance Monday in federal court in Brooklyn, said U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement spokesman Garrison Courtney. Yakou was arrested Oct. 11 in Baghdad after making an offer involving illegal weapons to undercover ICE agents.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 10/20/2003 11:43 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6467 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I like the new ICE acronym. Putt'em on ICE. ICE the jerks. This is going to be great for movie scripts. Too bad Arnold has a new gig.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 12:45 Comments || Top||

#2  Arnold can still order that.

" I am Ah-nold! ICE Martin Sheen or I will crush you! "
Posted by: Charles || 10/20/2003 13:13 Comments || Top||

Childbirth Deaths Higher Among Africans
EFL - AP from Newsday
African women have a one in 16 chance of dying during childbirth — a rate 175 times greater than that in the West, the United Nations said Monday.
Comes as a surprise, huh? Betcha never expected to see something like that...
Most maternal deaths and disability result from delays in recognizing complications, reaching a medical facility or receiving quality care, said the study by the World Health Organization, the Children’s Fund and the Population Fund. "Much of this death and suffering could be avoided if all women had the assistance of a skilled health worker during pregnancy and delivery, and access to emergency medical care when complications arise," the study said.
How much did the study cost? Couldn’t this money have been better spent training mid-wives?
Since accurate figures on maternal mortality are difficult to come by, the agencies developed a way of estimating the number of deaths in countries lacking statistics.
Great, now some bozo can whine about African mortality using estimates that he created at is desk in Brussels. Kind of takes the "act" out of activism.
The new method showed that 95 percent of the 529,000 maternal deaths in 2000 occurred in Africa and Asia.
Is this new method called guessing?
WHO Director-General Lee Jong-wook said many African women deliver their children alone or with untrained attendants. "Skilled attendants are vital because they can recognize and prevent medical crises," he said.
This answers the musical question: WHO are You. We’er idiots that point out obvisous conclusions from our desk where we conducted studies using data that we extracted from between our lower cheeks.
UNICEF Executive Director Carol Bellamy called the death rate "unacceptably high" and said there was an urgent need to provide better care, especially in Africa.
Carol, the term unaccptable implies that you intend to take action. Carol, are you there? Carol...
Thoraya Ahmed Obaid, executive director of the Population Fund, said lives also would be saved if women had access to voluntary family planning.
Glad Thoraya wasn’t around before I got my chronic in-grown toenail problem fixed. I think she would have recommended assisted suicide. Wouldn’t it be better if we start with the trained midwives before we build all the abortion clinics?
She's got a point. You stand a much better chance of not dying in childbirth if you're not having a kid...
In 2000, the most recent year for which statistics were available, the death rate per 100,000 live births ranged from 20 women in developed countries to 920 women in sub-Saharan Africa, the agencies said.
Wonder if you can estimate the effect of Taylor and Mugabe in your estimated statistics.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 11:34:55 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6461 views] Top|| File under:

#1  It's all fine and good for the UN to make all these paternal, childish little remarks, but it's not going to change anything in Africa. Half these women die because of superstitions and religious 'beliefs'. Most of the rest die because they have a problem 400 miles from the nearest medical facility, and the fastest rate of transportation is oxcart. That's what words like "underdeveloped" and "undeveloped" mean. IF there are real statistics, and IF they can be trusted, I'm sure you'd find 3/4 of the deaths occurring in places like the Congo, where roads are all but nonexistent, in places like Sierra Leone and Liberia, where there's an internal war going on that limits movement, and in places like Somalia where there's just no government at all. The statistics in Zimbabwe are about to go through the roof, since there's now no food and no petrol to power an ambulance.

The problems that arise in Africa are the result of the way Africa behaves. I'm sure the death toll in modern South Africa is much lower than in rural Togo or Chad. Modern medical attention can do wonders, but not if the patient is brought to the hospital after riding on a camel for five days. Until Africa can put its childish, tribal conflicts to rest, can develop economically enough to invest in an adequate infrastructure, and can develop the training, techniques, and willingness to accept modern medical treatment, nothing the UN says is going to make a damned bit of difference.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 10/20/2003 12:47 Comments || Top||

#2  Did this report mention female genital mutilation? Compare areas that do and dont practice this?
Posted by: Grunter || 10/20/2003 13:16 Comments || Top||

Middle East
Israel to speed up barrier work
EFL - and news
Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has promised to speed up building the controversial security barrier separating Israel from Palestinian areas in the West Bank. Opening the winter session of the Israeli parliament, the Knesset, Mr Sharon said the fence, including the areas around Jerusalem, would be finished in a year.
Just in time for the Paleo civil war...
Fighting to make himself heard above the heckling of the MPs, Mr Sharon spoke of a breakthrough in the peace efforts in the coming months, without specifying.
Arafat’s death would qualify ...hmmmm
But at the same time, Israeli forces would continue to confront Palestinian "terrorism", the prime minister said hours after a series of Israeli air strikes on Gaza City left at least three Palestinians dead and 24 others wounded. The Palestinian Authority condemned the latest attacks.
What're they going to say? "We welcome these attacks on our terror infrastructure?"
"These Israeli acts do not help ceasefire talks, they discourage them," Mr Qurei told reporters. "We want the Israeli Government to sit down with us and negotiate a ceasefire."
"Um.......how about no?"

Been there, done that, got the casualty count to prove it...
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 11:29:18 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6462 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Israel to speed up barrier work

Great. Now if only the U.S. would begin construction on a barrier with Mexico...
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 10/20/2003 12:26 Comments || Top||

Home Front
Muhammad is Granted Right to Represent Self
EFL - Another circus comes to town
Accused sniper John Allen Muhammad was granted permission to represent himself Monday at his capital murder trial. Prince William County Circuit Court Judge LeRoy F. Millette Jr. made the stunning announcement following a 25-minute bench conference with Muhammad and his attorneys. Millette said Muhammad’s state-financed defense team would remain on hand to consult with him, but that Muhammad would be handling his own defense.
Moussaoui’s been milking this successfully, so Muhammad probably sees it as a preamble to a lengthy appeals process - shouldn’t have taken him alive
Millette advised the jury that Muhammad had filed a petition to represent himself and that "the court has granted that motion." No reasons for Muhammad’s request were given. When Muhammad entered his not guilty plea before the court last week, he was specifically asked if he was satisfied with his legal defense, and he asserted at that time that he was. "He must follow rules of evidence and be treated as any other attorney would be treated," Millette said.
tarring and feathering huh?
As the judge instructed the jury, Muhammad sat at the end of the defense table, legal pads and papers spread out before him. His attorney, Peter Greenspun, sat in his familiar spot at the opposite end, chin resting in his hand. Behind Muhammad sat the five Virginians chosen by lottery to fill the scant spectators’ seats each day, and the handful of reporters allowed inside the courtroom. Most of the media observes the trial from a big-screen video feed in a separate building. A similar viewing room has been set aside for families of sniper victims. The first case to come to trial in the series of shootings that left 10 people dead and three wounded focuses on the Oct. 9, 2002, slaying of civil engineer Dean H. Meyers. The 53-year-old Gaithersburg bachelor was shot in the head as he pumped gas at a service station outside Manassas on his long commute home. With no eyewitnesses to the homicide, evidence against Muhammad is considered circumstantial, with prosecutors expected to link him to the bloody rampage using evidence such as fingerprints, DNA analysis and ballistics comparisons. Before the judge’s surprise request Monday, Muhammad’s state-financed defense had hoped to persuade jurors that Muhammad himself never pulled the trigger — what could be a crucial point when considering the death penalty if the Gulf War veteran is convicted. Also at issue is interpretation of an untested anti-terrorism law, which allows for capital punishment when acts of violence are meant to intimidate the public or influence the government.
or extort money?
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 11:24:25 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6467 views] Top|| File under:

#1  He has a fool for a client...
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 11:27 Comments || Top||

#2  Frank, I was so hopeful that the snipers would put up a struggle and get killed by the police. I had no desire to spend even one of my taxpayer dollars to arrest, feed, house, prosecute and defend either of them. (I would have gladly paid for the bullets myself). They terrorized me and my community for weeks and now we have to put up with a sham trial that will only result in endless procedural delays and inevitable appeals. I believe the tab has already exceeded $1 million for the defense attorneys that Muhammad just put on "standby". I won't curse on Fred's bandwidth, but I'd sure like to!
Posted by: seafarious || 10/20/2003 11:35 Comments || Top||

#3  There was a serial killer form Washington or California that really developed this strategy. I think his last name was Ng. I may be wrong, but it didn't have a vowell.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 12:49 Comments || Top||

#4  We had a guy try this up here in Mass. So the judge says okay and he gets convicted and now he wants a new trial on the grounds that he got an insufficient defense. Just a possible coming attraction.
Posted by: tu3031 || 10/20/2003 13:18 Comments || Top||

#5  Charles Ng, along with Leonard Lake (who committed suicide by cyanide IIRC) had a cabin in the Sierra foothills in Gold Country - did a LOT of horrible things and videotaped it. Ng is on death row. These guys pull this crap as effort to set up lengthy appeals, but it seems teh courts are saying that if you had the capacity to rationally decide this, you live with the consequences....
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 13:30 Comments || Top||

#6  ...and so it begins:
"One of the things we're here for today is to find out what everyone wants to know. What happened?" Muhammad told the jury in his capital murder trial.
"There's three truths. The truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I always thought there was just one truth," he said. "Jesus said, 'Ye shall know the truth.'"
"The facts should help us identify what's a lie, what's not a lie," he told the jury. Muhammad, wearing a suit and tie, then told a story about how he punished his daughter for eating chocolate cookies, only to find out later that the daughter had not actually disobeyed him. He said he is similarly being persecuted by authorities who don't know the truth behind the sniper shootings.
"I know what happened. I know what didn't happen. They're basing what they said about me on a theory," he said. "If we monitor step by step, it will all show I had nothing to do with these crimes. They know this."
He said he hopes to be found innocent "by the grace of Allah."

Can anyone say "Colin Ferguson"?
Posted by: tu3031 || 10/20/2003 14:38 Comments || Top||

#7  Thank you, Frank. Charlie Ng, still holds the record for most expensive trial. He lasted a number of years in jail in Canada playing his rope-a-dope game of firing defense counsel. After he dies they ought to study his elemental compnents to see if there is anything special there. His last name belongs on the periodic table.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 15:11 Comments || Top||

#8  Ng is a pretty common surname in Southeast Asia.

Posted by: Anonymous || 10/20/2003 18:00 Comments || Top||

Sen. Leiberman - we must drain the swamp, and then seed the garden

A very interesting essay by Dem presidential candidate Joe Leiberman. I suggest many here would find it interesting.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 9:35:38 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6472 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Seems like a poorly chosen metaphor in wake of what Saddam did to the Shi'ite marshlands in southern Iraq. Coalition troops have been working to replenish the swamps.

Not a bad article--I certainly agree with lines like "Winning this war requires that the United States maintain its military dominance and forcefully apply it to deter and defeat tyrants and terrorists alike," and I agree that the Islamic countries need to become more prosperous, but I think that's more an internal thing. Until Muslims see another Muslim country advance (Afghanistan and Iraq, primarily), I don't believe they'll ever look in the mirror but keep blaming the West.
Posted by: Dar || 10/20/2003 10:04 Comments || Top||

#2  Down the line, I agree with almost everything he says.
I've got two comments:
1) He advocates more funding for Foggy Bottom. Foggy Bottom is a large part of the problem, coddling dictators.
2) Our biggest failure in Afghanistan was not cleaning up Wazaristan, Baluchistan, NWFP and Riyadh.
Posted by: Dishman || 10/20/2003 10:28 Comments || Top||

#3  Lieberman is the only Dem candidate I really care for. But he seems to have a problem with being excessivly corny at times, with his sterotypical Washington politician mannerisms, and his way of speaking. It isn't just Lieberman who does it, it's just that Lieberman looks the most akward doing it. Everyone wants to be Mr. Populist-leader-of-the-middle-class-roll-up-your-sleeves-and-pump-your-fist-in-the-air-guy, but I think it looks so corny and obvious. Joe shoud just be Joe, because he has the best attitude and ideas of the bunch.
Posted by: g wiz || 10/20/2003 10:38 Comments || Top||

#4  I read the article. It was filled with the kind of open ended, "We must change the perception of...", "We must encourage...", "We must support..." type comments that sound good in the abstract. However, it was absent any real specifics and it had no ideas in it that haven't been vetted many times before.

Posted by: mhw || 10/20/2003 11:07 Comments || Top||

#5  Mixed metaphor alert...
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 11:28 Comments || Top||

#6  He suffers from that old DEM ailment Feelings. He wants to feel good but can't as long as the other party holds power. TUMS and Oxycontin in moderate doses should do the trick.

Posted by: Anonymous || 10/20/2003 12:23 Comments || Top||

#7  RE: Funding Foggy Bottom - Heres what Joe has to say:
"Yet, since the end of the Cold War, we have sold short many critical tools of public diplomacy. The United States Information Agency was eliminated, and State Department posts around the world have reduced the general public's walk-in access and closed the lending libraries that once stood open to all visitors. The United States Foreign Service, which represents the most significant official American presence overseas, has also been underfunded. We need to think and work long and hard about how to better convey our values not only to opinion leaders and elites, but to the people at large in the public square."

State may be filled with folks who dont share the strategic vision outlined in this essay. But I dont think closing lending libraries, or understaffing consulates, is likely help with that.

Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 12:43 Comments || Top||

#8  MWH, you hit the nail on the head.

Call me cynical, but it just sounds like a request for more funding to "moderate" Muslim organizations. Scoff, like those groups will ever send him a DIME in campaign contributions. It seems to escape him that it is unlikely that they will ever get past the fact that he is Jewish.

Oh well, at least he's saying mostly good things that we can all agree with, in a meaningless sort of way.
Posted by: B || 10/20/2003 12:45 Comments || Top||

#9  Re: muslim countries achieving prosperity internally

Read what he says on economic development closely - He does NOT call for a large foreign aid program (other than in Iraq and Afghanistan) What he DOES call for is more TRADE. What he asks of the US is that we assist these countries in entering the WTO. And that meanwhile, and perhaps in addition to that, we also establish bilateral trade deals, preferences, etc. The obvious parallel is the Caribean Basin Initiative, which ISTR was initiated by RONALD REAGAN. Now the question is, do we think transforming the muslim/arab world is as important now, as stopping Communism in Central America and the Caribean was then?
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 12:48 Comments || Top||

#10  MHW - and does the Bush admin have specifics for what they will be doing a year from now? Do they have plans that go into specifics - well I suppose they do - a Powell plan, a Rumsfeld plan, a Wolfowitz plan, and a Tenet plan - all of which disagree with each other :) . We get specifics from this admin only for whats currently at hand - what theyve actually done - for Joe that would be his congressional record, and his statements of approval and disapproval of Bush admin acts. So its a question of which set of specifics, and which set of plans, you prefer (at least academically - since I doubt we will ever get to see Joe head to head with Bush on the ballot :( )
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 12:53 Comments || Top||

#11  g wiz - if I was to go by mannerisms and personal style, Id certainly have to place Dubya near the BOTTOM (certainly below Dean). However things are too serious for that.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 12:56 Comments || Top||

#12  Specifics:

"But many in the Muslim world are blinded to these realities by our close alignment with regimes whose behavior is inconsistent with the American values we otherwise work so hard to uphold and defend. The United States should steer a new course-one closer to American values and closer to the values that grow from our common humanity.

We can and must demonstrate to ordinary people throughout the Islamic world that the United States will take risks to support their freedom, aspirations and quality of life. We must make those values a premise of our alliances and a condition of our aid."

Now he doesnt go and mention Egypt, Saudi Arabia, and Pakistan by name. That would hardly be appropriate at this time. But I cant think to what else this refers.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 13:02 Comments || Top||

#13  The flaw in your argument LH is that you assume the premise of this article is correct, "Moderates are competing with extremists for control in the vacuum our military victories leave, with precious little support from the United States and its allies."

That just isn't true and you know it. That accusation is nothing more than pure politics, marring an otherwise good analysis. It's too bad Lieberman needed to stoop to the level of politics when making his point, because instead of making him look like a bi-partisan player working for a common good, it makes him look petty and small.

Posted by: B || 10/20/2003 13:17 Comments || Top||

#14  To liberalhawk. The specifics of the Bush administration plan to deal with Islamofascism are carried out day by day, country by country. It certainly is true that there is no unifying theme other than 'terrorism is bad' and it is also true that Bush is not taking a hard line against the terrorism enablers and financiers in Saudi Arabia and it is also true that in some countries we are supporting secular or secular leaning dictators to keep the terrorists in check and it is true that the administration hasn't taken the obvious counterterrorism step of icreasing the required MPG ov SUVs. However, based on the mush that is in Lieberman's article it is difficult (I would say impossible) to infer that he would do a better job on any of these real issues.
Posted by: mhw || 10/20/2003 13:27 Comments || Top||

#15  I'm sure that getting Saudi Arabian into the WTO should be our highest priority.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 14:21 Comments || Top||

#16  Lets wait until the French figure this thing out and then we can copy them.
French Examine Selves With Muslim Crisis
I think the whole issue hinges on the whole headscarf in the school question. Non?
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 14:28 Comments || Top||

#17  B - when youre running for office, you tend to minimize the good things your opponent did - Dubya did the same thing in regard to the Clinton admin, etc etc. And I think he gives some good specifics on what the admin is NOT doing - I could add some more.

MHW - thats what I meant - For Bush admin you have specific actions - even if they are only responding to every crisis that hits their desk and not doing any planning at all (which I dont necessarily claim) Its obvious that someone not in office doesnt have those kind of specifics - its unfair to compare a strategy piece by Joe with the mix of good things and bad things the admin is doing every day.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 14:45 Comments || Top||

#18  Super - I dont think he said it should be our highest priority - but one example of a specific.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 14:46 Comments || Top||

#19  precious little support:

well ive got to say that I still dont understand the admin position on Afghanistan, and I also think that until the last month the effort in Iraq was inadequate. Did you see Rummys op-ed piece a little while ago? Responding to the argument that we arent doing enough nationbuilding - basically it was along the lines of "we need to let them do most of it themselves, or we'll create too much co-dependency" I mean geez - I understand the argument that foreign aid in the long term undercuts domestic reform in 3rd world countries - but these are EMERGENCIES dammit - we lose Iraq to chaos, or worse an Islamic state, and we're FAR worse off strategically than we were before we went in. The Iraqis may be better off - but we're worse off. We have to WIN in Iraq - and frankly it doesnt matter very much if we get the Iraqis addicted to sub optimal fiscal policies - we wont get to the long term if we dont win the short term (and all indications are that they are not fools in regard to their economic development, anyway - and we can always wean them of aid later) I mean this just sounds like an admin that is (or at least WAS) putting ideology above success in Iraq and Afghanistan - now I dont think EVERYONE in this admin does so ( id wager that Wolfowitz does not) but unfortunately the other voices are louder than Wolfie's.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 14:55 Comments || Top||

#20  The more Lieberman gets right on Foriegn Policy the more likely the Democratic primary voters will turn away from him. Thats the sad Catch-22 of the modern Democrats.
Posted by: Yank || 10/20/2003 14:57 Comments || Top||

#21  The time to flesh out the details is later in the campaign, with debates, position papers, etc. This essay stakes out a broader strategy - by staking out a position focusing on nation-building and human rights, it sets him apart from the "We dont do nation building - we dont worry about democracy" asepct of the Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld-Powell foreign policy - while still remaining apart from the "We're doves" point of view of Dean (and maybe Clark) the "lets use the UN more" approach of Kerry, and the "lets talk domestic policy instead" approach of Edwards and Gephardt. (BTW, of course one risk politically is that the Wolfie positions emergerges triumphant in the admin, and the admin gets serious about nationbuilding and democracy promotion - good for the country, but bad for Joes campaign)
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 15:05 Comments || Top||

#22  Yank - thats possible, indeed, and i wouldnt bet the house on Joe getting the nomination. OTOH we havent had a head to head fight on foreign policy among the dems since 1972. 1976 - while obviously less hawkish than Scoop Jackson, Carter appeared more hawkish then Udall, et al - but the main battle was over domestic policy, IIRC. 1980 - kennedy - Carter was a battle over social and economic policy. 1984 - Mondale, believe it or not, attempted to position himself as more hawkish than Gary Hart. In any case that was again a largely domestic race. 1988 - with Hart out of the race, and Gephardt and Gore faded early, Duke was certainly more "hawkish"then Jesse Jackson. Gore couldnt get any traction by being more hawkish then duke, but thats cause foreign policy simply wasnt high on the radar screen in 1988. 1992 - again Clinton beat Tsongas, Jesse Jackson, and Tom Harkin, in a race where foreign policy hardly mattered. in 2000 Gore was marginally more "hawkish" than Bradley, but again FP didnt really matter.

So its impossible to say what role FP will play in 2004. Northern Demo electorate (excluding New York State) tend to be very dovish - but southern ones much less so - South Carolina will be interested - both Joe and Edwards have connections to the black electorate that Dean doesnt have - will the war be enough to enable Dean to make big inroads in the black vote? And the biggest issue - with so many candidates, how does the vote split? Do Joe and Edwards and Gephardt split the hawkish vote? Does Clark split the doves with Dean, or does he hurt Kerry? Ideal for Joe is to knock out Edwards and Gephardt early, while Kerry and Clark stay in against Dean. Thats probably his best shot at actually winning the nomination.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 15:16 Comments || Top||

#23  LH, what I was implying was that the Saudis ought not be coddled any longer. I'm not sure that getting China into the WTO was the right thing to do, but I'm not sure that it isn't. I am pretty sure that the Saudis ought to be treated as an enemy that we may or may not have to continue trading with.
As far as the dem's go, I would have very few problems with Joe if he got elected. My over-riding priority for national governemtn is national defense.
Has anyone else read The Six Dilemmas of the Moderate Islamist by Michael Vlahos in Tech Central Station?
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 15:59 Comments || Top||

#24  Liberalhawk, I would welcome some serious foreign policy discussions because I think for the average American that is still the number one issue and if the Democrats don't take it seriously, if they continue the Bush=Hitler style of non-arguement that gets big cheers in the debates so far, they won't have a chance.

The US government works better as a two-party system.
Posted by: Yank || 10/20/2003 16:01 Comments || Top||

#25  super - good point - im not sure how Joe reconciles advocating for Saudi at the WTO, with lots of other stuff thats sounds hardline wrt to Saudi. Carrot and stick, maybe?
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 16:22 Comments || Top||

#26  As a guy who's worked in Egypt for an Uncle Sam-funded organization devoted to the promotion of English, I read the article with interest. I understand that Joe needs to work out the specifics, but I still think he needs some serious revisions.

As for the canard of "looking the other way while many regimes in Muslim nations have denied their citizens human rights and economic opportunity..."
Well, I look forward to Prez Joe telling Mohamed VI in Morocco to the Sultan of Oman to impose true democracy, freedom of press, assembly, etc. When they tell him to go to hell, he'll just come back that all they need to do is to portray the "...extensive traditions of tolerant and moderate Islam, ones that can support and engender political and economic reform." Then I'm sure the rulers will wise up and follow.
Women? Doubt if Joe has the backbone to follow that up. Don't you see, Joe, so many in your party abhor value-based foreign policy. Quick question. Please tell me how you would respond Saud al-Faisal's telling you that Saudi already has human rights and democracy since the Kingdom follows Sharia law, the LAW OF ALMIGHTY ALLAH. Plus any citizen who has a gripe can petition any prince. Answer, quick, please.

We won't close our eyes and ears to Anti-American propaganda in state-run media and state-sponsored mosqus and madrassas? We'll just need a new commitment to foster responsible, independent communication? Oh, OK. Then what's been our problem all along?

There's a lot more to say about Joe's piece, but the Muslim world's biggest problem is not being able to look in the mirror and saying, "I see what my problem is." Joe thinks we and our allies are going to fix it all up as if interlocutors exist on the other side who see eye to eye with us.
Tell you what Joe. Tell your pals in the race and in the senate that the best way to change things in Muslim world is to vote for and support the $87 billion for Iraq. (Glad enough voted for) I hope Iraq becomes a beacon light to the rest of the region. Only then will the necessity of change then be understood. Talk to Albright and other UN-lovers that the Iraq thing is already "internationalized".

And you know the biggest tragedy of it all, Joe, especially since you obviously have put a lot of thought into your article? 99% of Muslims won't believe that you are sincere since you're Jewish.
Posted by: Michael || 10/20/2003 16:47 Comments || Top||

#27  Read what he says on economic development closely - He does NOT call for a large foreign aid program (other than in Iraq and Afghanistan) What he DOES call for is more TRADE

LH--Trade for what? Calling for more trade is all well and good, but what do they produce besides oil (and opium) that we want? We already do billions of dollars of trade in petroleum--what good does that do the average Muslim? It sure buys nice cars and personal jets for the sheiks and princes.

Japan has practically no natural resources, but they've become an economic powerhouse since being devastated in WWII. The Middle Eastern countries with their oil have an inherent advantage over Japan, but with their medieval policies they'll never do anything but waste it on providing sinfully lavish lifestyles for the tiniest percentage of their population while blaming the Jews and the West for their own squalor.

That's why I say the changes must be internal.
Posted by: Dar || 10/20/2003 16:52 Comments || Top||

#28  dar - morocco exports Phosphate - not sure off hand what Tunisia and Jordan export, but it aint oil. I think theyre trying to export labor intensive stuff like clothing, etc - just like the asians, central americans, Bengalis, etc.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 16:58 Comments || Top||

#29  Internation Herald Trib

"Textiles, clothing and leather goods account for a whopping 45 percent of Tunisia's total exports; that sector has been growing by an annual average of 8.6 percent in real terms since 1991.

Many textile exporters are well-known foreign companies - including Adidas, Benetton, Cacharel, Chevignon, Guy Laroche, Lacoste, Lee Cooper, Levi Strauss, Old River, Wrangler and Yves Saint Laurent - that manufacture in Tunisia. " Europe is the principle market.

Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 17:04 Comments || Top||

#30  michael = yup, thats the obvious counter from the Bush admin - "there aint nothing we can do with these guys we aint already doing" Thats where Joe needs to get more specific. I note that today Mubaraks police clamped down on a pro-democracy protest. Egypt gets $2 billion a year in US aid. How about we start by giving Mubarak a good talking to? Maybe then we reduce the $2 billion by the amount he spends on police ops against democracy, the way we threatened to reduce aid to Israel by the amount spent on the parts of the security fence we dont like?

Basically what can we take away - only what we're giving them. If theres a state we're not giving anything to, obviously theres nothing we can take away, but then its hard to blame us for them. And lets focus on the most egregious cases, not every state from Morocco to Oman - and lets use rewards as well as punishments.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 17:10 Comments || Top||

#31  g wiz - if I was to go by mannerisms and personal style, Id certainly have to place Dubya near the BOTTOM (certainly below Dean). However things are too serious for that.


I couldn't agree more. I dont consider myself a big Bush supporter, in fact I voted for Gore last time around. I don't think I'll be able to vote for a Dem this time around for obvious reasons, unless Lieberman wins the nom, in that case it'd be a much tougher decision. I only mentioned his mannerisms because I think it might turn a lot of people off, it wouldn't turn me off, jus sayin. Whew!
Posted by: g wiz || 10/20/2003 17:54 Comments || Top||

#32  I have to agree on mannerisms and personal style. Every time I hear Tony Blair speak I wish W. had half the poise and eloquence he possesses.

Bush definitely wasn't my first choice for the Republican nomination in 2000. I was looking at McCain and, even earlier, Elizabeth Dole as my choices.

Even now, I'm very hesitant to vote for him. I agree with his military actions in Afghanistan and Iraq, and I like the tax cuts, but I am appalled at the growth of government spending.

Lieberman is the *only* one of the Dems I would consider voting for--and "consider" is open to interpretation--but I doubt he'll get the nomination in any case. I'll likely be voting for Bush in 2004 and hoping the government hasn't grown to the point there's a new taxpayer-funded bureau for wiping my ass (after requesting the service 6-8 weeks beforehand in triplicate) by 2008.
Posted by: Dar || 10/20/2003 21:58 Comments || Top||

#33  Don't worry DAR the Bushies have expanded the Federal gov't more than any Democrat could have hoped for "Office of Homeland Security" ring a bell--the fascistic ring of that chills my blood
Posted by: NotMikeMoore || 10/20/2003 22:46 Comments || Top||

#34  Of course--all of the Rantbourgeois have forgotten that all the Arabs supported Bush--didn't want no Jooooo a heartbeat away from the Presidency
Posted by: NotMikeMoore || 10/20/2003 22:48 Comments || Top||

#35  labor intensive stuff = sweat shops
Posted by: anon || 10/21/2003 8:16 Comments || Top||

Muslim Leaders Defend Mahathir
Muslim leaders closed ranks around Malaysian Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad yesterday after his attack on Jews caused a firestorm of protest and overshadowed their bid for unity on Iraq at a summit meeting here.
My thesis ’Islam itself is the problem and Secularism is the solution’ looks better and better.
Western nations condemned the speech as outrageous and offensive. But Muslim officials gathered for the OIC meeting said Mahathir’s comments had been taken out of context and were aimed at rallying the Muslim world.
’Mahthir’s comments were taken out of context.’ Well then, could you kindly explain what the proper context is?
Yemen’s Foreign Minister Abu Bakr Al-Qurbi said he supported Mahathir “100 percent”.
Yemen, the same country that claims it cannot control its tribal areas, (Pakistan, take note!) When a government claims it cannot control its sovereign territory, they are in fact renouncing sovereignty over said territory.
Egyptian Foreign Minister Ahmed Maher said he did not think much attention should be paid to the “clamor and accusations” from Western countries. “Those who are commenting on the speech have not read it in its entirety,” Maher said. “Nobody felt it was inflammatory. We thought it was a very, very wise assessment. It was addressed to the Muslims, it was an appeal for them to wake up.”
Egypt, a country that receives over two billion dollars annually in US Aid. We still have this nasty habit of feeding our enemies.
Afghanistan President Hamid Karzai said Mahathir was just “talking about issues confronting the Muslim world and what Muslims should do. Muslims must educate themselves, must begin to be progressive to develop themselves.
Karzai boy shows his true colors. We cannot even keep our pet president quiet.
Posted by: Sorge || 10/20/2003 9:20:47 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6459 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Karzai boy shows his true colors. We cannot even keep our pet president quiet.

Karzai is no friend of the US. But if you look at some of his past statements, this should come as no surprise.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 10/20/2003 9:32 Comments || Top||

#2  As Sullivan and others have pointed out, the Mahathir quotes published in the West were not the most disgusting ones in his speech.

The key to understanding things is that the Islam mainstream seems to think that murder by itself is extreme but murder combined with conspiracy is moderation.
Posted by: mhw || 10/20/2003 10:08 Comments || Top||

#3  These people are all full of crap. This conference was a good thing though - the world gets to see these jerks at their ugliest.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 10/20/2003 10:32 Comments || Top||

#4  mhw;

I've now posted the full text of Mahathir's speech on my website. You can go judge by yourself.
Posted by: Sorge || 10/20/2003 11:54 Comments || Top||

#5  thanks to Sarge for posting the speech; the allusions to events in Muslim history probably make this difficult for Westerners to understand but for Muslims themselves the message seems to be 'play nicey nice for awhile, build up your military and then murder the infidels' and this is, I suppose actually moderate compared to the 'murder as many as possible right away' faction of Islam.
Posted by: mhw || 10/20/2003 13:38 Comments || Top||

#6  I give Karzai a pass on this one. He chose to hear only the "lets modernize" part of the speech, not the Anti-semitic part. and given his troubles at home, I cant blame him for not calling Mathahir on this - alot of the muslims already see him as a US puppet, and he also supported the US on Iraq - which most muslim leaders (and Mathahir) didnt do. Why go out on a limb by himself?
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 15:48 Comments || Top||

#7  Class...today's assignment: compare and contrast the respective remarks made by M. Chirac and President Bush in response to the anti-semtic speech made by Mahathir this past weekend. Whose remarks were those of a coward and whose remarks were those of a courageous political leader. Explain and discuss.Extra credit will be given for the appropriate usage of the phrase "cheese eating surrender monkey".
Posted by: Mark || 10/20/2003 17:00 Comments || Top||

#8  Look, time to stop acting shocked, just shocked and outraged at Mahathir's speech. I've read about other Muslims calling for the end to the Intifada in similar terms.

Fact: this is the level of dialogue in the Muslim world. And yes it is comparatively moderate (moderately insane, as opposed to froth-mouthed, eyerolling). He made an appeal to stop blowing things up and to be a little more open-minded. But his target audience is not going to listen to an appeal for peace and political reform on humanitarian grounds. Anybody preaching a cessation to the Intifada and marginalization ofthe radical Imams is not going to have success if they sound like they're capitulating in defeat. It has to be couched in terms of 1) a new & smarter strategy against "the (infidel) enemy" and, more importantly, it has to be spun as 2) properly Islamic. I don't like it but that's reality. Karzai knows this. Such discussions are inevitably going to contain some garbage about the Jooooooos.

This new tack could lead to more reform, espiecially now that they'll have to compete with a free Iraq. There is also the danger that they could follow through on what they're saying and come back and reignite the conflicts at a more advantageous time, in a more unified manner. But if we keep our eyes open and remember what we're dealing with, I think we should accept such calls for peace and reform.

The Jihadis are not going to listen but the Governments are desperately looking for a way to start reform without losing (more) face, prestige, and power. This is going to be their selling point to the Islamic public, the average Mahmoud Q. public, the everyday Tariq, Darkahn, and Hamid.
Posted by: Tokyo Taro || 10/20/2003 18:28 Comments || Top||

#9  The Muslims see India and China moving ahead in the passing lane, and they are jealous. The OIC meeting theme - "Knowledge and Morality for the Progress of the Ummah" - is a challenge to incorporate the West's technology in order to increase Islamic jihad potential. The Muslims seek military domination through infiltration of the West through immigration, while using technological transfer. In the interests of self-preservation, the West should adopt a keep-them-stupid approach, after we bomb the jihad out of the enemy.
Posted by: Imam Hotep Bejesus || 10/20/2003 21:10 Comments || Top||

Middle East
2 Israel Air Strikes in Gaza (update)
New strike and update on the earlier post
Palestinian medical sources say two Palestinians have been killed and five others wounded in an Israeli air-strike on a car in Gaza City.
Hmmm... Not as many casualties as you get with the average bus bombing. Guess they have to work on that...
Few details are available from the later attack. But it came just hours after an Israeli warplane bombed a building near the home of an Islamic Jihad leader in Gaza in a strike Israel says targeted a Hamas weapons factory. Palestinians say 12 people in the area were wounded in the earlier attack, which hit a two-story building under construction near the home of Islamic Jihad leader Abdallah al-Shami. Israel says the targeted building was used by Hamas to store and make weapons, including Qassam rockets that Palestinian militants fire at Israelis. In interviews after the attack, Mr. Shami denied the building was a weapons factory.
"No, no! Certainly not! It was... ummm... a baby duck nursery!"
He also says the air-strike damaged a number of homes in the area. The air strike came a day after a number of Qassam rockets were fired from the Gaza Strip into southern Israel. There were no reports of casualties in the rockets attacks on Israel.
typical paleo shoot and run - cannons propped up on rocks, rubble
In another incident Sunday, Palestinian gunmen staged an ambush near the West Bank town of Ramallah, killing three Israeli soldiers and wounded a fourth.
posted yesterday
The Palestinian militant group Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades claimed responsibility for the ambush and vowed to continue such attacks until Israel leaves Palestinian land. The group is an armed offshoot of Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat’s Fatah movement.
Until Israel leaves Paleo land doesn’t leave any room for peace then, does it
Hamas typically describes them as "the armed wing" of Fatah. I assume they know what they're talking about...
Meanwhile, three Fatah officials headed to Washington Sunday to meet with U.S. lawmakers about possible new ideas to advance stalled peace efforts.
Presumably they're from the unarmed wing of Fatah...
There is no indication the delegation will meet with Bush administration officials.
Bet it’s the Bonior/McDermott/Pelosi crowd they’re meeting with. Any discussions beyond: "live up to promises or die" is too much.
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 7:38:33 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6483 views] Top|| File under:

#1  oops - update - a third strike - Israelis are in a mood...

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip — A team of Israeli helicopters launched an air strike in a Gaza City neighbourhood Monday, the third such attack in the Gaza Strip in four hours.

The third attack, which came just after noon, hit the same neighbourhood that was hit earlier in the day, according to witnesses. Smoke was billowing from the scene of the strike.

Several hours earlier, Israeli helicopters fired two missiles at a pickup truck in Gaza City, killing two Hamas members and a bystander. An earlier strike destroyed a suspected rocket factory run by the Islamic militant group, army officials said.

At least 23 people, including four children and a 70-year-old woman, were wounded in the first two attacks, Palestinian hospital officials said. It was unclear if anyone was wounded in the third attack.

The air strikes came a day after Palestinian militants fired a barrage of homemade rockets into southern Israel from Gaza. Also Sunday, a Palestinian ambush in the West Bank killed three Israeli soldiers and wounded a fourth.

The Hamas members, targeted in the second attack, were travelling in a white pickup truck that was hit by two missiles fired by Israeli helicopters. Witnesses said the truck was spotted earlier in the day near the alleged weapons workshop targeted in the first air strike in the Sajaiya neighbourhood of Gaza City.

The pickup had stopped at a traffic light near a gas station, on a busy street crowded with school children, when the missiles hit the front of the vehicle. A kindergarten and an elementary school had just let out students for the day.

A Palestinian motorist was also killed in the attack. Palestinian hospital officials said 12 bystanders were wounded, four of them in serious condition.

The third air strike also hit near the Sajaiya neighbourhood, close to an area where mortar shells are often fired into Israel.

In the last three years of fighting, Israel has killed dozens of Palestinian militants in targeted attacks, including helicopter missile strikes.

Less than three hours earlier, Israeli warplanes attacked a house under construction where the army said Hamas was making small rockets. After the air strike, two masked men were seen loading belongings into the white pickup that was then targeted in the second air strike.

The alleged weapons workshop was just 200 metres from the home of Islamic Jihad leader Abdullah Shami, who was not hurt.

Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 7:40 Comments || Top||

#2  Meanwhile, three Fatah officials headed to Washington Sunday to meet with U.S. lawmakers about possible new ideas to advance stalled peace efforts.

Should read:

Meanwhile, three Fatah officials headed to Washington Sunday to meet with U.S. lawmakers about possible new ideas to stall advanced peace efforts.
Posted by: badanov || 10/20/2003 8:13 Comments || Top||

#3  ... a baby duck nursery

It's a baby duck hatchery.

Of course, one could use the same word to describe the counseling sessions for future splodydopes.
Posted by: Steve White || 10/20/2003 11:08 Comments || Top||

#4  Another strike on a car - car hit, bystanders did the car swarm, and another missile hit.... Fox says another strike by F16's is ongoing@ 1:45 PST
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 16:43 Comments || Top||

#5  And a fifth strike this evening...
Posted by: Fred || 10/20/2003 21:46 Comments || Top||

#6  ABC:"The tit-for-tat violence deals a severe new setback to a stalled US-backed peace plan and has touched off new vows of revenge by the Palestinians."

Idiotas. The "roadmap" is as dead as the baby ducks.
Posted by: Anonymous || 10/20/2003 21:59 Comments || Top||

Israeli strike misses Islamic Jihad leader
A missile strike by an Israeli warplane on a house in Gaza has wounded at least five Palestinians, but the apparent target of the attack escaped without injury. Palestinian witnesses say the missile slammed into a house next door to the home of senior Islamic Jihad leader Abdullah Shami. The Israeli army later issued a statement saying the target of the strike was not the home of Abdallah al-Shami but a weapons factory next door. At least five Palestinians, including two young children, were injured in the strike. Islamic Jihad was behind this month’s suicide bombing in Haifa which killed 21 people.
Posted by: Paul Moloney || 10/20/2003 5:26:18 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6465 views] Top|| File under:

#1  And fiftten rubber baby ducks were killed.
Posted by: Anonymous || 10/20/2003 6:14 Comments || Top||

#2  Did they target al-Shami and miss, or target a weapons factory?

well given their recent accuracy, I'd suspect the latter. Also fits better with my sense of the current politics of the situation. If Arafats future is clouded, (by either ill health or internal Pal politics) as it appears, does it make sense to target the Hamas/IJ leadership NOW? Yes, weaken them prior to Arafats departure and the succession struggle, but not take on the political consequences of a high level assasination. I think thats the only explanation for Israeli policy SINCE the Haifa bombing (not targeting terr leaders) and policy at the beginning of the summer - now, unlike then, Arafat may actually be on the way out.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 10/20/2003 9:09 Comments || Top||

#3  From the update on the post above, it appears they were targetting the workshop/arms warehouse - they attacked the pickup that loaded goods then fled
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 9:24 Comments || Top||

Africa: East
UK-funded troops land in Burundi
The other half of the Rwandan nightmare ...
UK-funded troops sent to disarm rebels in Burundi have arrived in the Central African nation’s capital, Bujumbura. The 217-strong Mozambican contingent aims to help end the decade-long civil war that has claimed an estimated 300,000 mainly civilian lives. The UK Government has given Mozambique £3.7m to help implement the 2002 peace deal between the Burundi Government and three of four Hutu rebel groups. Minister for Africa Chris Mullin said the deployment was a significant step for Mozambique and Burundi. "We were pleased to provide assistance to the Mozambique Government to enable this deployment to go ahead," he said.
"Seeing as we’re rather busy at the moment."
"The mission is a significant first for African peacekeeping operations. It is a concrete example of the commitment of African leaders to establish peace and security in their own continent."
I guess since he’s a diplomat he has to say those things, but does he really believe them?
At a ceremony at Bujumbura airport to welcome the Mozambicans, head of the African Union peace mission in Burundi, Mamadou Bah, said: ""We are ready to deploy the contingent in the countryside for the task it was called here for." The troops are tasked with providing the warring parties safe passage to designated assembly areas and easing the delivery of humanitarian aid. But a rebel group, the National Liberation Forces, has refused to join peace talks, saying those discussions will do nothing to overturn the long-standing dominance of the Tutsi minority in the country of 6.5 million people.
"We’ll wait 366 days and start shootin’ again! Or maybe we won’t wait!"
The African Union mission is due to stay for a year, pending the expected deployment of a United Nations peacekeeping force.
Posted by: Steve White || 10/20/2003 1:16:34 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6462 views] Top|| File under:

#1  The African Union mission is due to stay for a year, pending the expected deployment of a United Nations peacekeeping force.

This, of course, means that once the UN forces arrive, the killing will probably start anew.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 10/20/2003 10:37 Comments || Top||

#2  along with the prostitution camps
Posted by: Frank G || 10/20/2003 11:06 Comments || Top||

#3  Here is an article from Newsday that might apply: EU Opens Own Military Defense Meeting. Maybe defense by checkbook will be the wave of the future. I am actually not against such a strategy where it works.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 15:14 Comments || Top||

Somali politician slain in Kenya
A delegate at the Somali peace talks in Kenya has been found murdered in a forest on the outskirts of the capital, Nairobi. Sheikh Ibrahim Ali was one of three people discovered dead from gunshot wounds - the others were a business friend and a local driver. A wealthy businessman from the Somali capital, Mogadishu, Sheikh Ibrahim was also a member of the country’s transitional national assembly. A police officer interviewed on Kenya’s commercial Nation Television, which carried pictures of the bodies, said the victims had bullet wounds.
"Legume! Round up the usual suspects!"
The Kenyan authorities are trying to establish whether he was killed for political reasons.
"Move along, nothing to see, just another tourist mugging, move along, look smart now, you ..."
Rival Somali factions have been attending meetings in Kenya for more than a year, aimed at establishing the first national administration since the collapse of president Mohammed Siad Barre’s regime in 1991. Last month delegates to the talks endorsed a transitional federal charter. But it was immediately rejected by several key figures, including the head of the current Transitional National Government (TNG), President Abdulkassim Salat Hassan. President Salat had spurned the talks in July, accusing a committee steering the peace conference and other Somali delegates of sanctioning the "dismemberment" of Somalia.
Diplospeak for "where’s mine?"
However, most of the TNG representatives to the peace talks, including the murdered delegate, decided to remain in the conference. The completely largely powerless and hapless TNG was created in 2000, but only controls parts of Mogadishu and pockets of territory in southern Somalia.
So who’s water was Ali carrying?
Posted by: Steve White || 10/20/2003 1:11:49 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6469 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Can anyone tell me what the purpose of the continued meeting of a powerless body? Hint: I bet the accommodations were a factor.
Posted by: Super Hose || 10/20/2003 14:17 Comments || Top||

Iran Opens Talks on Nuclear Inspections
Under pressure to meet a U.N. deadline, Iran began detailed negotiations Saturday on allowing U.N. inspectors unfettered access to its nuclear facilities.
I’m betting this is less than it seems.
The talks with the U.N. International Atomic Energy Agency ``may take several days, (but) I’m optimistic that (we) will reach an agreement,’’ Iran’s representative to the IAEA, Ali Akbar Salehi, told The Associated Press. The IAEA has set a deadline of Oct. 31 for Iran to prove it has no secret program for producing nuclear weapons. If the agency finds that Iran has failed to respond satisfactorily, it is expected to refer the matter to the U.N. Security Council, which could lead to the imposition of sanctions after interminable nattering.
Except that the French have already said that this won’t happen.
The talks came after IAEA head Mohammed ElBaradei met Iranian officials on Thursday to press Tehran on the deadline, saying the agency still has ``outstanding issues’’ to resolve over Iran’s nuclear program. ElBaradei said after his meetings that Iran promised greater access for IAEA inspectors. He said inspectors were allowed to visit one cleansed military site and that there could be expanded reviews of both military and civilian facilities in the future. The IAEA has urged Iran for months to sign the additional protocol to the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty that would give IAEA inspectors access to any site they deem fit without notice. Under Iran’s existing agreement to the NPT, the country is not required to allow IAEA inspectors to visit non-nuclear sites, including military installations. Two days of talks with IAEA legal experts ended Sunday, Tehran radio reported. Iran reiterated that the protocols should not interfere with Iran’s national sovereignty and its state secrets, Salehi said, according to Tehran radio. The IAEA legal team explained the protocol and will be invited for more discussions if necessary, he said.
As I recall, Saddam was also jabbering about "sovereignty" and "state secrets". Wonder if the black turbans will start talking about presidental palaces?
The head of the Iranian parliament’s National Security and Foreign Policy committee, Mohsen Mirdamadi, told the AP on Thursday that ``Iran’s case should not go before the Security Council.’’
"No, no, certainly not!"
``If allowing inspections of military sites resolves this problem,’’ Mirdamadi said, ``then we should do it.’’ Iranian hard-liners, however, have urged the government to stand firm against world pressure over the nuclear program and even to withdraw from the nonproliferation treaty.
Wonder if Jacques will allow the EU to say anything about that if it happens?
Posted by: Steve White || 10/20/2003 12:39:16 AM || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [6462 views] Top|| File under:

#1  getting a little nervous are they?
Posted by: B || 10/20/2003 8:26 Comments || Top||

#2  Can I get a "YAR"?
Posted by: mojo || 10/20/2003 11:29 Comments || Top||

#3  I say let the IAF 'inspect' all six sites; I'm sure they'll be thorough.
Posted by: Raj || 10/20/2003 12:23 Comments || Top||

Who's in the News

E-Mail Me

The Classics
The O Club
Rantburg Store
The Bloids
The Never-ending Story
Gulf War I
The Way We Were


On Sale now!

A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.

Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.

Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has dominated Mexico for six years.
Click here for more information

Meet the Mods
In no particular order...
Steve White
Scooter McGruder
john frum
Bright Pebbles
trailing wife
Frank G
Alaska Paul

Two weeks of WOT
Mon 2003-10-20
  Five helizaps in Gaza
Sun 2003-10-19
  3 convicted for trying to kill Perv
Sat 2003-10-18
  Army kills Hamas man, two other Paleos in Gaza
Fri 2003-10-17
  Yasser declares state of emergency
Thu 2003-10-16
  Bali boom boy gets life
Wed 2003-10-15
  4 Americans murdered in Gaza
Tue 2003-10-14
  Turkish embassy in Baghdad boomed
Mon 2003-10-13
  Hassan Hattab deposed?
Sun 2003-10-12
  Al-Ghozi departs gene pool
Sat 2003-10-11
  Indonesian church torched, two killed by armed men
Fri 2003-10-10
  U.S. Nabs Fedayeen Saddam Leader
Thu 2003-10-09
  Iraqi Leaders Don't Want Turkish Troops
Wed 2003-10-08
  Algeria pounds Salafist HQ
Tue 2003-10-07
  Yasser on his deathbed?
Mon 2003-10-06
  Azam Tariq late!

Better than the average link...

Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
Help keep the Burg running! Paypal:
(0)    (0)    (0)    (0)    (0)