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2003-10-02 India-Pakistan
Background into Pakistani sectarian militancy
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Posted by Paul Moloney 2003-10-02 3:48:28 AM|| E-Mail|| Front Page|| [389 views since 2007-05-07]  Top

#1 I am impressed about your knowledge of sects in Pakistan, are you a scholar in this area? What is your opinion on Musharaf?
Posted by Murat 2003-10-2 6:58:22 AM||   2003-10-2 6:58:22 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 I'm not a scholar, but Pakistan and Afghanistan have been an interest of mine since around 1998, when I first heard about the Taliban and wanted to find out more about them and where they came from. Since then I have spent a lot of time reading the English language media from those countries and India, and became even more interested after 9/11.
As for Musharaf, I believe he is a Pakistani nationalist, who would like to see his country develop and become the leader of the Islamic world. I also believe he is firmly committed to wresting Kashmir from India, and maintaining the dominance of the Army in Pakistani politics for quite some time to come.
Having being interested in Pakistan for a while, I was suprised when Musharaf, who had been portrayed in the media as a pariah, suddenly became Pakistan's last best hope against radical Islam, in the wake of September 11. I've always believed that the Pakistani Army is the principal cause of much of the extremism that is allowed to run rampart in Pakistani society, and although Musharaf is ceratinly more pragmatic and secular than many of his colleagues, I feel that in the 4 years he has been in control of the country, he has done essentially nothing against radical Islam. He has cracked down on Al Qaeda Arabs, local sectarian terrorists, and provided the Americans with the means to defeat the Taliban (a Pakistani Army creation), but he has done nothing about the radical madrassas, the private Jihadi militias that operate openly in the country, or the regrouping Taliban operating in Pakistan's border provinces.
I think that Musharaf could still be a good leader for his country, if he worked towards genuine democracy with the main moderate political parties (Pakistan Peoples Party and Pakistan Muslim League), instead of undermining them because of his personal dislike for their leaders.
Before 9/11, I thought Pakistan was on it's way towards becoming a failed state, and even now, i'm not sure if that fate hasn't just been pushed back 5 years, although I hope that isn't the case.
Posted by Paul Moloney 2003-10-2 7:41:27 AM||   2003-10-2 7:41:27 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 Interesting views and admitting I am a little bit disappointed too in his handling of radical Islam, but I think he deserves some support from the west in this area. Usually the army is the only well organized body with the power to fight deeply rooted sects as in Pakistan, provided that the power and influence of those sects have not the upper hand in that army (like in Iran). As a military leader and his secular personage he is the right person who could push for secular reforms in Pakistan. The question however is, are the Pakistani army top commanders like him (secular minded) and willing to support him with the needed power against the rooted power of those sects which seem to control the society.
Posted by Murat 2003-10-2 8:51:00 AM||   2003-10-2 8:51:00 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 The Pakistani Army is probably mroe like the Iranian Army than the Turkish army. This is because, for the last 20 or so years, when General Zia ul Haq seized power in a military coup, he used Islam as a way of perpetuating his rule. So the fundamentalist bearded types in the military were given promotions, while the secular ones mostly stagnated. While this process ended someone in the early 90's, it still means that outside of the Generals, there are a large number of Islamist minded officers, who are known to support things like Pakistan's blaspehmy laws, continued support for Jihad outfits and the like.
Most of the top Generals seem somewhat secular (with the notable exception of the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, who is a Kashmiri with well known radical views), but most of them, including both Musharaf and the previously mentioned Kashmiri General are due to retire in the next couple years. So the new officers who take over the army will probably decide what role the Army plays in Pakistani society.
Posted by Paul Moloney 2003-10-2 9:36:14 AM||   2003-10-2 9:36:14 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 Hmmm, apart from the relations of Pakistan with India and the embargo imposed due to its nuclear development program I would say that the Pakistani army should be supported and helped a hand to follow a secular road. The only way to eradicate the deeply rooted fundamentalists can be done by a military clampdown IMO. Sometimes less democratic means are needed to enforce democracy. An overnight clampdown that imprisons the leader cadres of those jamaats and sects can be done without plunging the country into a civil war. If the Pakistani army can’t bring it up to clean their country from fundamentalism soon, I am afraid your conclusion of becoming a failed state will come true.
Posted by Murat 2003-10-2 10:01:32 AM||   2003-10-2 10:01:32 AM|| Front Page Top

#6 People get down on Musharaf, but I grade on a scale (with Saudi Arabia getting an F- of course.) I doubt that removing several deeply imbedded cancers that have spread society wide can be accomplished rapidly.

The complexity of the schisms that Paul has described makes my knees wobbly. You could generate a card deck out of all these groups but it would be obselete tomorrow. It looks like he is fighting the vilian from Terminator 2 that shattes and reconstitutes continuously.
Posted by Superhose  2003-10-2 1:03:01 PM||   2003-10-2 1:03:01 PM|| Front Page Top

#7 Paul Moloney, thanks for your helpful postings and commentary. I'm learning a lot about the Lakshar-e-Jigsaw Puzzle...
Posted by Seafarious  2003-10-2 1:29:02 PM||   2003-10-2 1:29:02 PM|| Front Page Top

#8 I just want to know what is the purpose of this article.In response One of the reader describe are you Alim,Why If just by showing this information person becomes an alim.
I don't think there is any purpose of the article.Yes of course it can be used for the research purposes.suppose if you want to write a Phd thesis.
Thank you
Posted by Anonymous 2004-3-3 12:31:50 PM||   2004-3-3 12:31:50 PM|| Front Page Top

#9 Sunni Muslims do not worship saints and graves.
Posted by Raza 2004-08-16 4:53:57 PM||   2004-08-16 4:53:57 PM|| Front Page Top

#10 how dare you blame the death of the deobandies at the dawat-e-islami ijtima...

that was all done by najdis to give dawat-e-islami a bad name.. and Thanking Allah.. the najdis that murdered them were also captured... so get your facts right you bimbo.
Posted by Snereper Thromble7441  2005-01-20 8:42:55 AM||   2005-01-20 8:42:55 AM|| Front Page Top

08:42 Snereper Thromble7441
16:53 Raza
12:31 Anonymous
07:18 Jarhead
04:24 Bulldog
02:27 Not Mike Moore
00:13 mojo
00:06 mojo
00:03 mojo
00:02 Not Mike Moore
23:57 mojo
23:49 Not Mike Moore
23:26 Old Patriot
23:14 Old Patriot
23:08 Old Patriot
22:52 Old Patriot
22:42 Old Patriot
22:38 Frank G
22:37 Old Patriot
22:34 Frank G
22:33 Frank G
22:31 Frank G
22:29 Anonymous
22:22 Frank G

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