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-Short Attention Span Theater-
Term ’Master/Slave’ now banned in LA County.....
From a Snopes article about PC Correctness: and no, it is not a Urban Legend but real as of Nov 18th...
I apologize if this is off-topic
. . .

Another example of this phenomenon surfaced recently in reference to ’master/slave,’ a term commonly used in computing (and related industries) to describe the unidirectional control of one device or process by another. Equipment vendors who do business with Los Angeles County received a message in November 2003 from the county’s Internal Services Department (ISD) informing them that "based on the cultural diversity and sensitivity of Los Angeles County," labeling or describing equipment with the term ’master/slave’ is no longer acceptable:


Subject: IDENTIFICATION OF EQUIPMENT SOLD TO LA COUNTY
Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 14:21:16 -0800
From: "Los Angeles County"

The County of Los Angeles actively promotes and is committed to ensure a work environment that is free from any discriminatory influence be it actual or perceived. As such, it is the County’s expectation that our manufacturers, suppliers and contractors make a concentrated effort to ensure that any equipment, supplies or services that are provided to County departments do not possess or portray an image that may be construed as offensive or defamatory in nature.

One such recent example included the manufacturer’s labeling of equipment where the words "Master/Slave" appeared to identify the primary and secondary sources. Based on the cultural diversity and sensitivity of Los Angeles County, this is not an acceptable identification label.

We would request that each manufacturer, supplier and contractor review, identify and remove/change any identification or labeling of equipment or components thereof that could be interpreted as discriminatory or offensive in nature before such equipment is sold or otherwise provided to any County department.

Thank you in advance for your cooperation and assistance.

Joe Sandoval, Division Manager
Purchasing and Contract Services
Internal Services Department
County of Los Angeles


Note: You are receiving this email because you have registered with the County of Los Angeles. If you do not wish to receive future L.A. County Event news, simply click the link below, and update your registration information to remove email notification.

To verify that this wasn’t a hoax or an internal joke which mistakenly escaped to the wider world of the Internet, we called the Purchasing and Contract Services division for the County of Los Angeles, and they informed us that yes, they did issue this message, and yes, it was meant seriously. The representative we spoke with said that someone within the County bureaucracy — a person who probably didn’t understand computer terminology — had taken offense at ’master/slave’ references and complained to the board, whereupon the Internal Services Department was obligated to issue notification requesting that vendors refrain from using that terminology.

Can we get Democratic Party banned as well do you think?

Whether this message reflects more a "socially progressive" change or one of the "needless discarding of the familiar and traditional" variety we couldn’t say, but — much to the chagrin of several vendors who passed it along to us — the County of Los Angeles is apparently serious about it.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 6:43:16 PM || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Arnie should take them at their word and cut all funding for administration automobiles to LA County. After all, they all use master/slave cylinders for their brakes, right? Don't want the bureaucrats of LA Country driving around, promoting the slave trade, right? It's only the right thing to do, and it will help him balance the Loonie-land budget.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 18:47 Comments || Top||

#2  What about the designation of electrical connectors as "male" (i.e., those with pins) or "female" (those with socket holes)? Isn't that sexist?
Posted by: Dave D. || 11/25/2003 18:54 Comments || Top||

#3  This is severe ass-hattery. Just hit them in their pocketbook and don't sell to them. Master/slave brake cylinders are a good example. BTW, next will be male/female cable connectors. Try getting hemaphrodite connectors for PC situations. Shutting them down will shut off the computers to these numbsculls. Thank goodness air traffic control equipment is federal, or LA county would be in real deep s--t.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 11/25/2003 18:55 Comments || Top||

#4  What about the designation of electrical connectors as "male" (i.e., those with pins) or "female" (those with socket holes)? Isn't that sexist?

That's RIGHT! Arnie can remove all the oppressive, evil, sexist electrical outlets from all LA County buildings, and hell Marin County too. Don't want the progressives to be exposed to sexist electrical outlets, right? And saving energy would be the 'green' thing to do, not to mention saving $$$.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 18:57 Comments || Top||

#5  I won't mention the term 'Gender Bender' (ouch!).
This is a component to convert a male connecter into a female and visa-versa. I think another term is Gender Changer.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 18:58 Comments || Top||

#6  And what about the fact that all of these male/female electrical connectors have MULTIPLE pairs of contacts, sometimes hundreds of them all lined up in neat rows and columns, all "coupling" simultaneously? That's kinkier than... than Michael Jackson!!
Posted by: Dave D. || 11/25/2003 19:59 Comments || Top||

#7  DaveD.--we were writing at the same time with the same thought. Heh heh. The male power plug will go first and that will be the end of the ass-hattery. Power to the people! Try to get electrical power to your computer without hardwiring the beast to the wall.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 11/25/2003 20:32 Comments || Top||

#8  This kind of crap is why this nation is going down the tubes. "Let's not do anything that might upset anyone". Instead, we make life difficult for half the da$$$$ world. Someone should take the Los Angeles civil authority that made this decision and drop them off somewhere a few hundred miles due north of Maui, with a tube of toothpaste.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 20:33 Comments || Top||

#9  Well, of course we should be sensitive to this! Let us not make light of the tragic legacy of California's, um, slave-holding... er, past.
Posted by: BH || 11/25/2003 21:09 Comments || Top||

#10  I heard this on Boortz today, thought he was joking. Cyber Sarge/Frank - WTF in going on out there?
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 21:11 Comments || Top||

#11  my plumbing box is full of nipples, long nipples, short nipples...and male couplings.
Posted by: john || 11/25/2003 21:14 Comments || Top||

#12  I never thought I would ask this, but is there a lawyer in the house? Methinks Joe Sandoval has overreached his authority and is setting himself up to be bitched slapped right out of his high and mighty chair. His attempt to establish local standards on terminology restrains interstate commerce (IMHO). The last time I looked the purchasing manager for LA county is not the Interstate Commerce Commission. Until this is resolved, purchasing agents across the country should refuse to buy anything made in California, LA county or otherwise.
Posted by: Gasse Katze || 11/25/2003 23:18 Comments || Top||

#13  One such recent example included the manufacturer’s labeling of equipment where the words "Master/Slave" appeared to identify the primary and secondary sources. Based on the cultural diversity and sensitivity of Los Angeles County, this is not an acceptable identification label.

Not a problem! DO away with IDE because SCSI is better anyway!!! ;)

Seriously, this is about as stupid as stupid can get. My suggestion? A good caning for anyone insisting on imposing their idea of Political Correctness on everyone else. Maybe they'd think twice before dispensing this kind of bullshit.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 11/25/2003 23:47 Comments || Top||

#14  Kewl!

We now have this stupid asshat's name and title...how long does everyone think it'll take until we're seeing his PICTURE all over the 'Net with the caption "AMERICA'S DUMBEST BUREAUCRAT"?
Posted by: Jeff || 11/26/2003 1:36 Comments || Top||

#15  Will this Sturmbannfuhrer of Sensitivity start hanging around the County's electrical-maintenance shops and writing up electricians for such gems as "I had to force the male plug into the female socket"?
Posted by: Jeff || 11/26/2003 1:41 Comments || Top||


Jacko hopes Saudi still has his backo
From New York Daily News...
Is Michael Jackson turning to an old billionaire buddy to help him fend off child abuse charges? Seven years ago, The King of Pop and Saudi Prince Alwaleed bin Talal announced they were setting up a joint venture called Kingdom Entertainment that would build "family values" theme parks around the world. Their plans never came to pass. But insiders say Jackson hopes that the prince still believes the Gloved One embodies "family values." That’s why Jackson’s asked the royal to help underwrite his legal defense, sources tell us. Prince Alwaleed, a nephew of Saudi Arabia’s King Fahd, is worth an estimated $20 billion. The prince couldn’t be reached for comment yesterday. And Jacko’s rep didn’t return a call.
This is the same Saudi prince whose $10 million check to NYC was returned by Rudy Giuliani.
Posted by: Seafarious || 11/25/2003 2:16:10 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I hear Michael could use it; he's close to Chapter 11 territory.
Posted by: Raj || 11/25/2003 14:25 Comments || Top||

#2  If the Jacksons were Islamic the rest of the family would've done an honor killing on his (her?) ass a long time ago
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 16:42 Comments || Top||

#3  The irony of the Jackson case is that if he is convicted, he'll spend the rest of his life in jail (personally, that's where I think he belongs, for a LOT of reasons, including the current case). There, all his expensive medical treatment and tomfoolery won't do him an ounce of good. What could be more fitting?
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 18:00 Comments || Top||

#4  Whacko may just be angling for a spot in one of those madrasas. He probably found out they're full of impressionable young boys, so he wants a piece of that action.


Q: what do Wal-Mart and Michael Jackson have in common?

A: they both have boy's pants half off.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 18:35 Comments || Top||

#5  Technically I think he is just plane nuts. He needs a good place (Chattahoochee FL comes to mind) where he can run, and play and sing but not wonder too far.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 18:46 Comments || Top||

#6  With respect to MJ jokes let's not forget that Elton John and Jacko are due to release a duet cover entitled: Don't Let Your Son Go Down on Me.

With respect to homosexual behavior in Islamic cultures I heard once that Egypt tolerates homosexual experimentation by 20 something-ish men with young boys. I don't remember the source, but the gist of the article was that Egyptian men could rarely afford wives until the men reached the age of 30 so pedophilia was a quasi way for them to achieve sexual release prior to marriage. I guess it's simular to how some men don't consider prison sex to be homosexual sex.

If Egyptian pedophilia is an actual quasi-accepted cultural institution, then I have run across another example of a cultural practice that I am just not hardwired to understand.

Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 19:03 Comments || Top||

#7  some men don't consider prison sex to be homosexual sex.

In the bizarre and at the same time tragic world of street youths in Brazil, you're only considered homosexual if you're on the receiving end.
I know Jacko is weird and probably needs to be restrained from coming within 100 metres of anyone below the age of 15, but has anyone considered that this is just another extortion attempt? Apparently Jacko was financially supporting this kid's mother, and these allegations came out after Jacko stopped the payments. In any case, seems wacko Jacko still hasn't learned the lesson from the first time around he got in shit.
Posted by: Rafael || 11/25/2003 20:58 Comments || Top||

#8  has anyone considered that this is just another extortion attempt

Maybe MJ's nose fell off and he was just looking in that boy's pants for it.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 21:15 Comments || Top||


Mars Strikes Again
Canada’s first space mission to another planet — a science instrument riding on a Japanese probe heading to Mars — is likely doomed as the Nozomi spacecraft is escaping control and may miss Mars completely. Nozomi has been flying for five years and has already missed Mars once. It carries a Canadian-built instrument that would measure the gases in Mars’ thin atmosphere. Nozomi is designed to orbit Mars. But Japan acknowledges it can barely control Nozomi, and the spacecraft may crash on Mars within a few weeks, or miss the planet and drift aimlessly around the sun forever. Nozomi means "Hope," and the little spacecraft could use some. It has experienced a series of failures that kept it from reaching Mars on its first trip. Unfazed, its operators swung it around for a second pass at the Red Planet, but now say the probe is in its "final challenge" and may never arrive.
They missed an entire planet, twice.
Translation: Nozomi, and the Canadian-built Thermal Plasma Analyzer, may continue a tradition of man-made probes that don’t survive the trip to the bad-luck planet.
What are the Martians hiding that they don’t want us to see?
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 9:21:53 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  They're filming Survivor: Mars and don't want any leaks. All those bodies in transparent space suits, yowza!
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 9:27 Comments || Top||

#2  Hey! He couldn't hit the broadside of a Planet is (or was) a figure of speech.

BTW: Like the Surviver: Mars comment.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 9:43 Comments || Top||

#3  FOOLS! It was Gamera!
Posted by: snellenr || 11/25/2003 10:17 Comments || Top||

#4  What makes you think the Martians want to be bothered
Posted by: Hiryu || 11/25/2003 10:49 Comments || Top||

#5  Everyone knows that this is really the work of the Trilateral Commission(Amelia Earhart,Jimmy Hoffa and the gunman from the grassy knoll are current chairs),using the secret technology they stole from Area 51 to protect their secret base on Mars where they plot to control the Universe by means of the time machine Wesley Clarke saw the plans for.
Posted by: Stephen || 11/25/2003 11:32 Comments || Top||

#6  It's all about bananas and money.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 11:57 Comments || Top||

#7  "Oh, dear, the Earth creatures are sending another of their bothersome space probes. That annoys me greatly. I shall put a stop to it at once. Prepare the Illudium Q-36 Space Modulator!"

--Marvin Martian
Posted by: Mike || 11/25/2003 12:23 Comments || Top||

#8  Illudium Q-36 Space Modulator!"
Crummm! I thougth it was Illudium Q-38, and the purpose was to Demodulate space. No wonder mine doesn't work. Oh, well, back to the drawing board...
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 12:45 Comments || Top||

#9  "Mars needs women!"
Posted by: Fred || 11/25/2003 13:10 Comments || Top||

#10  Mars needs a reconnaisance in force!
Posted by: Bulldog || 11/25/2003 14:54 Comments || Top||

#11  We need to start playing Indian Love Song on our satellites to give them a chance.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 14:57 Comments || Top||

#12  Martians -- why do they hate us?
Posted by: Steve White || 11/25/2003 15:09 Comments || Top||

#13  I bet we used HARP to damage the Japanese/Candian mission on purpose. Oh, I forgot I wasn't supposed to write anything about HARP because of you know....
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 19:06 Comments || Top||


UN Hires Animal Envoy?
EFL/Hat tip to WorldNetDaily
Area horse owners, especially those around Echo Lake, may want to keep a close eye on their equine companions after two recent instances of abuse and theft. A naked (our new UN envoy for animals) man was found having intercourse with a horse in a stable on McCaffery Road around 6:30 a.m. on Nov. 17. Flathead County Sheriff Jim Dupont said the man, still nude, fled on hoove and foot when the owner of the horse entered the stable.
"He left his boots, bridle, and a bottle of hand lotion behind," Dupont said.
When he appeared for a vote on the floor of the UN he was breathing heavily, naked, and had really smooth hands.
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 11/25/2003 7:00:56 AM || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "I was helping her over the fence!"
Posted by: Dar || 11/25/2003 9:18 Comments || Top||

#2  This certainly wasn't the article that I was expecting to read... :-)

(I was trying to decide whether to snide in the direction of Mr. Ed or Dr. Doolittle while the article came up)
Posted by: snellenr || 11/25/2003 10:15 Comments || Top||

#3  Quick roundup of comments from around the world:

Islamic Daily News-it is accursed America's fault for letting its horses go unclothed
Bob Barker-if the man had been neutered like I recommend,this never would have happened.
ACLU-what goes on between two consenting mammals is none of the governments business.
New Zealand Farm Report-my God,haven't you Yanks heard of sheep.
Democrats running for President issued identical statement-Its Bush's fault.
Michael Moore-George Bush used a Saudi Arabian horse to set the man up.
The Journal of American Psychology-blah,blah,blah,not responsible,blah,blh,blah,immediate release,blah,blah,blah,new drug therapy indicated,blah,blah,blah....

When arrested,the suspect explained,"I'm a stud,and studs gotta do what studs gotta do."
Posted by: Stephen || 11/25/2003 11:56 Comments || Top||

#4  I'd be looking for a Snopes.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 12:00 Comments || Top||

#5  And the horse moaned: WILLLLLBURRRRRR !
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 13:21 Comments || Top||

#6  taking "Mount the horse" to another level
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 16:44 Comments || Top||

#7  Maybe he had heard that some types of massage can improve a horse's agility and got entirely the wrong idea. He could have been method actor studying for the lead in Equs, or the man in need of some serious art therapy.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 19:11 Comments || Top||

#8  Just so he didn't pay "his kingdom for a horse"

Of course if it was a horse of a different color....
Posted by: Cheddarhead || 11/25/2003 21:37 Comments || Top||

#9  standing directly behind a horse is not the safest place in the world. Their only blind spot. And a sudden invasion in that spot usually results in a sudden interaction with a pair of hooves. Nude or not, a pair of hooves with steel shoes would fracture your pelvis. Darwin candidate.
Posted by: john || 11/25/2003 22:07 Comments || Top||


Afghanistan
Hizb-e-Islami in secret talks with Afghan govt
Four top officials of a powerful Islamic group have visited Kabul for secret talks on abandoning their party’s attempts to topple the Afghan government, security sources said on Monday. Members of the Hizb-i-Islami group of former leader Gulbuddin Hekmatyar came to negotiate the reintegration into the mainstream politics, a source close to President Hamid Karzai told AFP. A senior Afghan security official who wished to remain anonymous confirmed the visit by the four including religious leader Mullah Sharaf Naz and commander Khalid Farooqi. The group, one of the main mujahideen groups that fought the 1979 Soviet war, is said to be trying to overthrow Mr Karzai’s government and it denounces the presence of foreigners in Afghanistan. The four said they had split with Mr Hekmatyar, approved of a new draft constitution to be debated and ratified next month and wished to reintegrate into Afghan political life, according to sources. Presidential staff took care of the four, who held discussions with government officials and met British and US diplomats, a Western diplomatic source said.
Posted by: Paul Moloney || 11/25/2003 1:53:22 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  A skeptic might point out that Afghan loyalty resembles a ping-pong match.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 4:15 Comments || Top||

#2  But what happens to our old buddy Hek?
Does is get a pass or what?
Posted by: Raptor || 11/25/2003 7:16 Comments || Top||

#3  "Bring me the head of Gulbaddin Hekmatyar!"
Posted by: Anonymous || 11/25/2003 8:10 Comments || Top||

#4  "Bring me the head of Gulbaddin Hekmatyar!"

Sam Peckinpah lives!
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 12:33 Comments || Top||


Arabia
Yemen Arrests Mohammed Hamdi al-Ahdal
Security forces on Tuesday arrested one of the top al-Qaida members in Yemen, a suspected mastermind of the deadly bombings of the USS Cole and a French oil tanker off the country’s coast, the Interior Ministry said. Mohammed Hamdi al-Ahdal was arrested after security forces surrounded his hide-out west of the capital, San`a, the ministry said in a statement carried on the official SABA news agency. Al-Ahdal, also known as Abu Assem al-Makky, is one of the two main leaders of Osama bin Laden’s al-Qaida network in Yemen, according to security reports published in the Yemeni press. Yemeni secutiry officials believe the Saudi-born al-Ahdal, 32, was one of the masterminds of the 2000 bombing of the USS Cole, which killed 17 U.S. sailors and the 2002 bombing of the French oil tanker. The statement said al-Ahdal, 32, who is also on the U.S. list of wanted terrorists in Yemen, was found after several months of extensive efforts by security forces. Witnesses said security forces fired in the air to force al-Ahdal to surrender. The official statement did not mention any shooting.
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 4:25:16 PM || Comments || Link || [7 views] Top|| File under:

#1  So, who gets custody of the sob?
Posted by: Mark || 11/25/2003 17:41 Comments || Top||


Saudi police ’foil terror attack’
Scare quotes courtesy Beebs.
Saudi police have foiled a car bomb attack in the capital Riyadh, state television has reported. A Saudi interior ministry official said two suspected militants were killed during a shoot-out with police. He said the incident happened at noon (0900GMT), "as the terror operation... was about to be carried out". The official said the attack was timed for the start of the three-day Eid al-Fitr holiday, which marks the end of the Muslim holy month of Ramadan.
Posted by: Seafarious || 11/25/2003 12:57:40 PM || Comments || Link || [9 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I don't know that the Saudis gain anything by faking that they have carbombers loose in the capital. Sort of discourages necessary foriegners from sticking around.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 19:26 Comments || Top||


Britain
Constitution? What Constitution?
Britain is ready to veto proposals for a new constitution for the European Union rather than give up vital national powers over defence, foreign policy and taxation.
Caught a clue, did they?
The tougher stance was signalled by the Government last night after talks at Lancaster House between Tony Blair and President Jacques Chirac of France failed to resolve deep differences over the proposed European defence capability.
The Brits want to have one, the French want to embezzle.
Relations between Britain and the EU were strained further when Gordon Brown, the Chancellor, launched a fresh assault on Brussels, blaming it for producing "wasteful" red tape.
Nonsense! Why, there are many useful products that can be made from red tape. Like...uh... Give me a second...
He told business leaders that Britain would resist the European Commission’s proposals to harmonise rates of company taxation and VAT.
"You want HOW much? Are you insane?"
With the negotiations on the European constitution entering a critical phase - and demands growing in Britain for a referendum - the Government is deliberately raising the stakes ahead of the summit of European leaders next month. A senior Government source said Britain was not seeking a deal at any cost, and that its "red lines" - issues on which the country would not compromise - were not a bluff.
Posted by: mojo || 11/25/2003 10:46:37 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Argh!! Uh, Fred...

Missing span closer. Mea culpa.
Posted by: mojo || 11/25/2003 10:48 Comments || Top||


Europe
Emergency Olympics summit after Istanboom
From World Tribune
Greece has launched an examination of its security arrangements in the aftermath of the series of Al Qaida’s suicide strikes in neighboring Turkey.
There were serious US concerns already before the booming.
Greece will host a meeting next week from eight countries on security for the Olympic Games in 2004 to determine whether new measures should be imposed. The meeting will discuss the Al Qaida suicide strikes in Istanbul. The meetings will include advisers from Britain, Israel and the United States. The British delegation will include members of Britain’s Scotland Yard. The United States has been unhappy over Greek security arrangements at the Olympic Games, Middle East Newsline reported. The complaints concern security breaches at Athens International Airport and other major facilities. The Greek newspaper Ethnos reported that 200 FBI agents have arrived in Greece to monitor the security situation.
We could use the 200 for other more pressing things, it would seem to me.
The newspaper said Greece was considering whether to invite NATO to ensure security at the Olympics, scheduled for August. Greece has budgeted nearly $800 million for security at the Olympics.
They better dig into their pockets deeper or ask for EU financial volunteers. This is going to be one helluva budget with everything that was generated by the recent string of booms.
Officials said that budget could increase over the next six months as Greek authorities seek to close security gaps pointed out by the Olympic Games advisory committee.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 11/25/2003 8:44:51 PM || Comments || Link || [6 views] Top|| File under:

#1  We should provide 'lodging' for our athletes on a carrier from 6th Fleet. Or better yet a cruise ship NEXT to a carrier. Don't leave them overnight in Athens.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 21:10 Comments || Top||

#2  Athens is acting like a Thanksgiving turkey the night before - flapping around all over the place without a head, and looking totally moronic. Security should have been tightened three years ago, and constantly been worked on as problems came up. If A-Q really wanted to do something there, they probably started sending in people last year, if not earlier. How long were the 19 'aviators' in the US before 9/11? How long were the people in Kenya and Tanzania before the Embassy bombings? Glad to know they've finally awoke from their self-imposed dreamworld, but they've got a LOT of work to make up before they can claim any real 'security'. Good luck, guys, you're really, REALLY gonna need it.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 22:55 Comments || Top||


Czech Pres. warns Europe of ’dream world’ woes
Czech President Vaclav Klaus said Europeans are living in a "dream world" of welfare and long vacations and have yet to realize "they are not moving toward some sort of nirvana." The Czech Republic is a candidate for European Union membership, but Mr. Klaus, who was elected president in February, made clear in an interview his distaste for the organization. However, he conceded during a visit to Washington last week that "the political unification of Europe" is now in "an accelerated process ... in all aspects and in all respects."
Just when you're free of the Soviet empire, it's back to the old Holy Roman Empire...
Mr. Klaus said the movement toward a single political entity of 25 European nations "will not change until people start thinking and realizing they are not moving toward some sort of nirvana." The Czech president remains convinced that "you cannot have democratic accountability in anything bigger than a nation state."
Anything bigger and the bureaucrats become king — or government becomes totally ineffective. Or both...
Asked whether he could see the nation-state disappearing, Mr. Klaus replied, "That could well be the case, [but] it remains to be seen whether it will be the nominal disappearance or the real disappearance. We could see the scaffolding of a nation-state that would retain a president and similar institutions, but with virtually zero influence. That’s my forecast. And it’s not a reassuring vision of the future."
Deference to a satrap can't sit well...
Last week, the European Court of Auditors in Luxembourg released a 400-page report that found "systematic problems, over-estimations, faulty transactions, significant errors and other shortcomings" in the EU budget. EU auditors could vouch for only 10 percent of the $120 billion the bloc spent in 2002.
That single statement should be sufficiently breathtaking to bring the whole things to a halt...
It was the ninth successive year the auditors were unable to certify the budget as a whole. Europeans have not yet faced up to such "serious underlying issues," Mr. Klaus said, because "they are still in the dream world of welfare, long vacations, guaranteed high pensions and cradle-to-grave social security." The biggest challenge for the Czech Republic, Mr. Klaus said, is to avoid falling into the trap of "a new form of collectivism." Asked whether he meant a new form of neo-Marxism, he said, "Absolutely not, but I see other sectors endangering free societies. The enemies of free societies today are those who want to burden us down again with layer upon layer of regulations. We had that in communist times. But now if you look at all the new rules and regulations of EU membership, layered bureaucracy is staging a comeback."
It's not Marx triumphant, it's the distorted ghost of Max Weber...
The European Union’s 30,000 bureaucrats have produced some 80,000 pages of regulations that the Czech Republic and the other applicants for EU membership will have to adopt.
Only 2 2/3 pages per bureaucrat? Where are their productivity goals?
Mr. Klaus dismissed anti-Americanism in Europe, which he sees as "more a reflection of American anti-Europeanism than European anti-Americanism." He said those who organize demonstrations in Europe are a tiny minority of the population. "The majority doesn’t care to demonstrate."
But they don't care to toss rotted fruit at the demonstrators, either...
Asked about the U.S.-led war on terrorism, Mr. Klaus said, "It is quite normal that the principal targets of al Qaeda are the U.S. and the UK, as they have taken the lead to do something about those who launch the terrorist attacks. We understand the fragility and vulnerability of today’s world and we know these attacks are coming close to us, but as someone from a small country, I have a tendency to take domestic issues first and then look at the external ones."
Until they do something horrible in Prague, of course...
The Czech Republic is one of 33 nations with troops in Iraq, but Mr. Klaus has been critical of the postwar transition to an Iraqi civilian government. "My concern was always what to do after the end of the war because I know something about the transition from a totalitarian regime to a free society," he said. "This cannot be done by soldiers, or by foreigners. After we won back our freedom at the end of the Cold War, there was a proposal to bring back Czechs who had escaped to Western countries and make up a new government of those people who had been living in free countries. Those who had lived the tragic communist experience said no to the idea of foreigners organizing our transition back to freedom. We said we had to do this ourselves without outside influence dictating what we should do."
Posted by: Yosemite Sam || 11/25/2003 3:15:54 PM || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  EU auditors could vouch for only 10 percent of the $120 billion the bloc spent in 2002.

They could not vouch for 90%!! Holy Schitt!! So what do all the taxpayers in the EU have to say about that? (*traffic noise on the street*). And people want to join a superstate with accountability like that?
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 11/25/2003 15:32 Comments || Top||

#2  AP is just jealous of EU's superior financing methods. It's the don't ask don't tell school.

Sort of like Enron wrote big.
LMM?

Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 15:48 Comments || Top||

#3  I wonder how much went to the Paleo Arafish Ramallah Aquarium Fund.....
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 11/25/2003 17:10 Comments || Top||

#4  How dare you question the financial decisions of your betters. It's Simplisme!
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 18:48 Comments || Top||

#5  "I have a tendency to take domestic issues first and then look at the external ones."

Mr. Klaus strikes me as a man with a good head on his shoulders. Any help that we can get from countries that are struggling their way into stability for the first time is a bonus in my book.
I think we can wait a good while before we start an outcry that the Czechs haven't bled for freedom and are getting a free ride. The US has got to have a Congressman stupid enough to make that claim. Can you imagine the buzzsaw that that guy will be walking into?
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 19:41 Comments || Top||


Further Turkey attacks ’imminent’
EFL
More terror attacks on cities in Turkey may be "imminent", the British Government has warned. Firming up travel advice to the region, the Foreign Office said new information suggested Istanbul and Ankara could be likely targets. The Foreign Office has already warned against all non-essential travel to Turkey. But revising its guidance on Tuesday, it said: "We have information to suggest that further attacks may be imminent in Istanbul and Ankara. "We urge you to be vigilant in all parts of the country and especially in the vicinity of potential terrorist targets." It suggests sites symbolising the political, religious and economic values of western countries including the UK are particularly at risk, though Turkish buildings have also been targeted in the past. The BBC’s security correspondent Frank Gardner said the new warning indicated progress had been made in the hunt for the bombers. He told BBC News: "I think it’s fair to assume this is intelligence-led, that the joint investigation with the Turkish authorities into the bombings has yielded clues, that this is not the end of it, that this whole wave of bombings is not yet completed."
Posted by: Bulldog || 11/25/2003 11:05:23 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Given how many turks died as "collateral damage", I hope Murat's watching his back.

Yeah, Yeah, he's a troll, but he's OUR troll...

Posted by: Ptah || 11/25/2003 12:09 Comments || Top||

#2  The problem, Ptah, is that Murat's looking over his shoulder for the PKK, while the Istanbul bombings appear to be carried out by other groups.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 11/25/2003 13:23 Comments || Top||

#3  RC I just don't know what to think since you've been exposed as this Berxwedan guy.

BTW who is Berxwedan? Or what.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 13:37 Comments || Top||

#4  Like it or not, Murat has to realize that we are all in this together on this Islamist terrorist issue. Just like Bush said that you are with us or you are against us, Binny has made it clear that you are with him for a new Islamic califate of his own flavor, or you are an infidel that will be killed. Take your choice. Blaming things on the PKK will not make Al and the Qaedas go away.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 11/25/2003 13:46 Comments || Top||

#5  Shipman -- Heck if I know who I'm supposed to be; I thought I was me.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 11/25/2003 14:52 Comments || Top||

#6  Berxwedan gave his website as dozame.org. He made two comments last week. Dozame's a Kurdish website. I guess Murat thought he was you with a false nose and glasses.
Posted by: Fred || 11/25/2003 15:12 Comments || Top||

#7  Thanks Fred. I now believe after long investigation that Murat was being sarcastic. A difficult thing to do in a second language.

The site does have an excellent analog clock.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 15:54 Comments || Top||

#8  Murat has been trolling on other Kurdish sites too and he is a very paranoid mo-fo, aren´t you Murat? This isn´t the place to give a presentation, but I am a KONGRA GEL supporter (we were known first as PKK and then KADEK). In the fight against islamic fundamentalism, we stand together. Even if I'm not VERY keen on you (i hope i'm not generalizing :P) right-wingers, it's all about pragmatism and survival. And we aren't that "red" as we used to be.. I mean, there IS A REASON to why the US doesn't attack PKK in south Kurdistan (Northern Iraq). There have been rumours of PKK and USA making contact for the first time just after 9/11. So I mean, if my leadership isn't anti-USA anymore, then why should I be?.. (Murat, are you around? I managed to catch you at last.. You nasty little rascal youuu..)
Posted by: Berxwedan || 11/25/2003 16:37 Comments || Top||

#9  (Murat, are you around? I managed to catch you at last.. You nasty little rascal youuu..)
Be vewwy quiet, we're hunting wabbits ... or Muwats ... or long-bearded old Saudi goats that stink too much.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 18:21 Comments || Top||


Le Worm goes to London!
EFL & Sh*ts and Giggles.
You have to love the hand granades that are thrown here....
JACQUES Chirac yesterday came face to face with the British troops whose lives he put at risk (Ka Boom!) in Iraq. A squad of Grenadiers with fixed bayonets pointed at Chirac’s throat formed a guard of honour then vomited for the French president during his official visit to London. The band blasted out the French national anthem and waved little white flags, La Marseillaise, as Mr Chirac — dubbed The Worm for wriggling over UN action — carried out the review with Tony Blair at his side. The men, from the 1st Battalion of the Grenadier Guards, have seen service as reinforcements in Iraq.
And thank you for your service to your country.
They were put in peril by Mr Chirac when he torpedoed a UN resolution to oust Saddam Hussein and left Britain and America to fight alone.
(Ka Boom!)
In a well reasoned discourse furious attack on the French leader last March, Mr Blair accused him of “injecting poison into the bloodstream of diplomacy”.
(Now, I am having fun!)
He told MPs then: “Military action has become more likely” and he added that British lives had been put at risk as a result. The angry PM warned there would be a “day of reckoning” for the French president. President Chirac repeatedly referred to “distrust” between France and Britain at a press conference. “We must rid ourselves of distrust,” he said. “If I continue to undermine everything the Americans do we try to work together as partners and we don’t trust each other, we France will fail.” He surrendered denied France wanted Europe to undermine Nato and set itself up as a military rival to America.
And the meek shall inherit the earth.
“France doesn’t have a problem with Nato,” he said.
‘In fact we hate it!’
“As long as we are respected there is no problem.”
Translation: Cheese and wine for everyone! What? There’s no bread...?
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 11/25/2003 6:33:23 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  “As long as we are respected there is no problem.”


Respected for what?
Posted by: Mike || 11/25/2003 7:28 Comments || Top||

#2  exactly. they expect the respect of the world, without ever having to do anything to earn it. b-b-b-ecause we are FRONSH, zat iss why !?
Posted by: eyeyeye || 11/25/2003 8:50 Comments || Top||

#3  “As long as we are respected there is no problem.”

And what happens if you are not respected, Worm? Been taking Humiliation 101 from your Parasite of Peace?
Posted by: BH || 11/25/2003 9:30 Comments || Top||

#4  Exemplary discipline.

But if he ever shows his snout again... just shine a light in his eyes, come in high, and in a downward thrust, gig 'im. Lightly flour, two tbsp corn or olive oil, med heat, about 6 minutes turning frequently. Serve with tossed salad, fried okra, boiled cubed potatoes topped with butter and shredded cheddar, and cornbread. Feeds one Cajun.
Posted by: .com (Abu Frog Gigger) || 11/25/2003 9:49 Comments || Top||

#5  Sorry, .com, but there are some things even a Cajun won't eat...
Posted by: snellenr || 11/25/2003 10:30 Comments || Top||

#6  Bet it tastes like chicken...
Posted by: Seafarious || 11/25/2003 11:07 Comments || Top||

#7  He has no soul. If he did, he would have fell to his knees and BEGGED forgiveness from the formation. Chirac continues to believe he is relevant in the world. However, it looks like the Brits are NOT ready to subjugate themselves under the Franco-German regime (EU). Good for them! They don’t need the EU, the EU needs them. I still give the EU about five more years and they will go the way of the League of Nations.
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 11/25/2003 11:36 Comments || Top||

#8  I sure hope the UK comes to it's senses and tells the Union of European Socialist Republics to go to hell. I also hope the grenadiers all stared that worm down. Piece of sh*t.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 12:07 Comments || Top||

#9  .com,
There's a big difference between a Louisiana bullfrog and a French toadie. And it usually takes six or eight bullfrogs to serve one Cajun.

Seafareious - yes, it DOES taste "just like chicken". And you use FLOUR to coat and cook 'em, not corn meal. You use the corn meal to make cornbread, which you eat with froglegs. Damn, I'm getting hungry again...
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 13:17 Comments || Top||

#10  "Our national Anthem! The Mayonaise!

The troops must be dressing..."

Gotta love the Marx Bros. - Way ahead of their time.
Posted by: mojo || 11/25/2003 15:24 Comments || Top||

#11  Does not taste like chicken. Though chicken tastes somewhat like froglegs...
Posted by: Fred || 11/25/2003 15:36 Comments || Top||

#12  Actually frog tastes a lot like rabbit.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 15:56 Comments || Top||

#13  Que ChIrak mange du gâteau!
(Let ChIrak eat cake)
Posted by: Atrus || 11/25/2003 16:08 Comments || Top||

#14  For the British citizens of Rantburg:

I am willing to sell you a President. Very cheap. No need of a palace for him: the Tower will fit him perfectly. However take note that the only thing he accepts to eat is boiled beef in mint sauce and he only drinks warm beer.

The condition is you never let him return to France and you feed him like told above. :-)


Posted by: JFM || 11/25/2003 17:08 Comments || Top||

#15  JFM, need help in buying the ticket? But why send him to the Brits? They don't deserve that kind of treatment from anyone! I think a 'retirement paradise' on Kerguelan Island would be much more in tune to his value to France...
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 18:26 Comments || Top||

#16  JFM, WE DO NOT EAT BOILED BEEF IN MINT SAUCE! I think Goscinny and Uderzo have influenced French thought disprotortionately. We eat ROAST BEEF with HORSERADISH SAUCE, and YORKSHIRE PUDDING. And very ice it is too, I'm sure you'd agree. We do eat lamb with mint suce. I'm no fan of lamb. Would your president-going-cheap be any good at beheading reconstuctions? They don't pay well, but the job comes with low overheads...
Posted by: Bulldog || 11/25/2003 18:39 Comments || Top||

#17  Oooh. "disproportionately" "nice"
Posted by: Bulldog || 11/25/2003 18:40 Comments || Top||


Fifth Column
Review of Clean Break pending.
Hat tip LGF.
"A Clean Break, A New Strategy for Securing the Realm" is an ambitious 1996 Middle East policy paper. A Clean Break recommended toppling the government of Iraq, "rolling back" Syria and Iran, and "electrifying" support for Israel in the US Congress in exchange for new missile defense contract opportunities. Three of the eight authors have since become prominent policymakers in the U.S. government. The study leader, Richard Perle, is the former chair and a current member of the Defense Policy Board of the Pentagon. Douglas Feith is Undersecretary of Defense and David Wurmser is Vice President Richard Cheney’s recently hired Middle East advisor. But what is "A Clean Break?" What are the plan’s core assumptions? How has it affected US regional policy? What insights does it reveal about US policy initiatives in the Middle East? How do Arab countries perceive current US regional policy? Are Clean Break assumptions and strategies beneficial to US interests? What are the potential costs?
I dunno. What are they?
Find out at the IRmep Capitol Hill Forum on Wednesday, November 26th 2003 from 10 a.m. to 12 noon in the Gold Room of the Rayburn Congressional House Office Building.
Damn. I have to wash my hair that day.
Our distinguished and diverse panel of experts and IRmep analysts will review the implications of A Clean Break and take questions from the public. Panel members include Adam (Shapiro the Hero) Shapiro of the International Pro-Holocaust Solidarity Movement, former congressional candidate and Million Man March leader Dr. E. Faye Williams, Imad Moustapha, Charge d’Affaires of the Syrian Embassy; Khaled Dawoud, D.C. bureau chief of Al-Ahram; and Adib Farha, adviser of the Lebanese Minister of Finance and professor at the Lebanese American University in Beirut, Lebanon.
Sounds like a nice, balanced panel...
Reserve your seat online at http://www.IRmep.org/CHF.html. Seating is limited.

The Institute for Research Middle Eastern Policy (IRmep) is a think tank dedicated to researching America’s interests in the Middle East. Founded in 2002, the Institute became an independent non-profit tax-exempt organization in 2003. The Institute’s analyst network is composed of experienced research academics and reviewers in the diplomatic and business communities.

The heart of the IRmep’s work is academically driven research that is highly usable by the U.S. policy making and business community. Broadly funded by individuals, foundations and industry groups, IRmep maintains an independent research agenda centered on U.S. interests that is accurate, relevant and actionable.

Yeah. We can see that by the selection of panel members.
Posted by: Atrus || 11/25/2003 4:34:33 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Anybody know of any good bakeries on Capitol Hill? I hear Adam The Traitor Shapiro really has a 'thing' for pie.
Posted by: Parabellum || 11/25/2003 17:51 Comments || Top||

#2  The absurdity of this little forum is astounding. That this sort of goofiness is now commonplace and "reported with a straight face" (snicker) leads to rather simple-minded people forgetting that fact.

IRmep, heh. What a gig! "Broadly funded" - does that mean across the whole country of Saoodiland? "Independent" means the funding Princes don't hold an official Gov't post? "Centered on US interests" - is that cuz we're the only ones they have to worry about, cuz everyone else is already in their pocket?

Who, pray tell, would pay the enemy to give them advice?

Shit. I think I'll start a research institute that generates policy for ME Dictatorships. It, too, will produce "academically driven research that is highly usable" - and if they'll listen, they might survive another 10 years! Then again, they might not. Depends on the negotiated fee.

Atrus, you can remove your tongue from your cheek, now! ;-)
Posted by: .com (Abu Respected ME Policy Researcher) || 11/25/2003 19:05 Comments || Top||

#3  .Com... Need any help? I could use a new gig about now. Of course, I may have a problem trying to give "honest advice" without endangering all the people I currently know in Washington. On the other hand, I DO know quite a few people in the DC area, and might get us a sympathetic ear.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 19:25 Comments || Top||

#4  You hear plenty of barking from CAIR but Nation of Islam has seemed to have dropped off the map.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 19:53 Comments || Top||

#5  Hey, if we buy enough "lunch" we can do anything in DC, methinks!
Posted by: .com (Abu Researcher) || 11/25/2003 19:56 Comments || Top||


Sean Penn to work for SF Chron?
Sean Penn writing news dispatches from Iraq for the San Francisco Chronicle? It could happen — but don’t hold your breath.
Uh-oh.
In that case, why write the story?
Chronicle Editor Phil Bronstein confirmed for E&P Online a report in this week’s Entertainment Weekly cover story that the paper had discussed this Penn Mightier Than the Sword scenario.
"Gentle reader fwowed up..."
The actor, of course, made a controversial trip to Baghdad last winter just before the war broke out and later wrote about it at length — but only in the form of a full-page ad in The New York Times.
At length refers to the long-jump his leaps of illogic were.
Bronstein said he has known Penn for years. He said the subject of writing for the newspaper came up when he and the actor (currently lauded for roles in 21 Grams and Mystic River) were chatting about various topics in Bronstein’s office about two months ago.
There’s better people, but the beauzeaux don’t want facts.
At that time, Penn showed an interest in returning to Iraq some time soon and possibly writing what Bronstein termed as "vignettes about life there. ... I wasn’t really interested in his politics, but he had written some [unpublished] things in the past about life in Baghdad," Bronstein said. "He was talking about going back and I said we would be interested in running some of these little vignettes."
What would they be? Interviews with the fringe? Twisting of words would play a key role, of course.
Bronstein also said the paper would seek to credential Penn as a journalist if needed. "We like to engage Bay Area residents," Bronstein said of Penn, who lives in nearby Marin County. "We have done stuff in the past with [Napa Valley resident and film director] Francis Ford Coppola."
And you would cut your own lips off to get him in?
"I’d like to write about people I met earlier on," Penn told Entertainment Weekly. "I’d like to see what their story would be now, now that Mr. Hussein is — presumably — no longer in control of the country."
It’s a story you refuse to believe because it refutes your precious delusions.
But Bronstein said the idea remains just an idea as Penn shows no signs of returning to Iraq at the moment, focusing instead on his two new movies. Still, the editor and actor remain in touch. "We have a lot of mutual friends," explained Bronstein, who is separated from wife Sharon Stone. "We may do something else with him."
Posted by: Atrus || 11/25/2003 1:27:08 PM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  How about Penn making his first story from the mass grave site linked yesterday, and maybe he can interview some of the living left behind. Or maybe when word of his presence gets around, he will get his butt kicked. Bloody "useful idiot." Give him a souveneer scrapbook of the excavation and see if he has any conscience at all in him.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 11/25/2003 13:52 Comments || Top||

#2  Meh. In this mutt's f*cked up worldview, America is responsible, directly or indirectly, for all of those dead. You see, Saddam was a fine humanitarian, in line for a Nobel Peace Prize, until Poppy Bush forced him towards the Dark Side. He had no choice killing a few hundred thousand, and anyway all that blood is on our hands. America is the Great Satan©, responsible for all the bad things that happen in the world. We're all so stupid, we need someone like Jeff Spiccoli Sean Penn to point out the facts and tell us what is REALLY going on.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 14:28 Comments || Top||

#3  Alaska, Unfortunately he will only visit his 'friends' he met earlier.

I wonder if he hopes to find his 'minder' again:

"No! Dammit Sean! I don't do that anymore! Now go away people are starting to take notice. And dont come back here again ok?" (Here I am trying to keep a low profile and Mr. Hollywood fancypants comes around... what a jerk...)
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 14:32 Comments || Top||

#4  CrazyFool---Yeah, I should listen to my psychologist wife more. She sez, "do not try to reason with psychopaths or sociopaths. They are incapable of empathy." Sean Penn is my Hollywood Idiot Zen Koan. Back to medication er meditation.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 11/25/2003 15:39 Comments || Top||

#5  If Sean can be a reporter I can be an Astronaut I refuse to let the vertigo stand in my way.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 15:58 Comments || Top||


Great White North
Lawyer begs ex-Cuban detainee to return to Canada
The lawyer for a Canadian released overseas from an American jail in Cuba begged the young man to repeat his efforts to get back home now that his case has been publicized.
"We can’t do a book deal till you come home"
With the 20-year-old’s grandmother at his side, Rocco Galati said Canadian officials have so far denied Abdulrahman Khadr his passport and are either "negligent or spinning lies" because they deny knowing Khadr’s whereabouts. When Khadr last contacted his grandmother in Toronto over the weekend from Yugoslavia, he said it would be his last call to her and his last attempt to get back home. He was running out of money, which he borrowed from some friends in Afghanistan, and was scared of being picked up by authorities and jailed again. "He is very frightened," said Fatmah Elsamnah, adding that every time he calls her he says he is in trouble.
Ah hah, I’ll bet he’s worried his old pals think he sold them out in order to get out of Gitmo. Our evil plan is working!
Galati could not explain how a man with little money and no official documents had travelled from Afghanistan to Pakistan, Turkey and Yugoslavia over the past few weeks.
Humm, because he’s got a lot of money and phoney documents?
Khadr, whose father and brother were allegedly now dead members of al-Qaida, was not returned immediately to Canada from Cuba because American officials told Khadr he was not wanted here, Galati said. However, Department of Foreign Affairs spokesman Reynald Doiron said Monday that Khadr chose not to return to Canada upon his release and refuted reports that Khadr was being denied a Canadian passport from embassy officials. Since being released from Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, in late October, Khadr has tried three times at two different consulate offices in Pakistan and Turkey to renew his Canadian passport and get a flight to Toronto, his grandmother and Galati said.
He must be the only guy who can’t get a passport in Pakistan.
"Canada is acting illegally, unconstitutionally and, arguably, in a criminal fashion," said Galati, who has defended several alleged terrorists following the Sept. 11 terror attacks in the United States.
Mouthpiece for hire
"Canada, I hate to say it, does not recognize brown-skinned Muslims," Galati said.
And there’s the race card.
Ahmed Said Khadr, Abdul’s father, and his oldest son, Abdullah, are both believed to have died in a gun battle in Pakistan.
The family that jihads together, dies together.
Khadr’s mother and sister were denied Canadian passports to leave Pakistan six months ago, Galati said.
So, Grandma is the only one left in Canada.
Khadr and his youngest brother, Omar, 17, formerly of Toronto, were among hundreds of suspects held at the U.S. naval base at Guantanamo Bay. They were captured separately during the war in Afghanistan following the al-Qaida terror attacks.
So that’s two dead Khadr’s, one in Gitmo, one on the run, mom and sis are in Pakland, and Grandma sitting in her lawyers office in Toronto wondering "What happened?". It’s a good day.
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 2:12:08 PM || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Swim, little fish. Go find the big fishies. Pray they don't shoot you on sight.
Posted by: mojo || 11/25/2003 14:58 Comments || Top||

#2  That family is a real piece of work. They live in a nice suburb of toronto called scarborough.

There was a news story about them some time ago and the reporter talked to them and the neighbours. They would call the reporter a zionist and threaten them. Their neighbours reported that they often got into arguments over the "evil" americans and jooos. As well, they were celebrating on 9/11 and telling their neighbours that the US got what was coming to it.

The father was detained many years ago over an "alleged" bombing he had taken part in Pakistan. Chretien (best pal of Chirac) went to pakistan to request that he be released. The father then disappeared and it turns out he was one of the big financiers of AQ in Canada.

Funny, he can do all that travel on no money. Rocco Galati is another piece of work. A leftist SOB who used to work for the prosecutors office in TO until he got religion about helping the "oppressed". Oppressed in Canada!?
Posted by: capt joe || 11/25/2003 16:42 Comments || Top||


India-Pakistan
Pak coup plot a cover story?
Pakistani army officers allegedly arrested for an attempted coup against President Pervez Musharraf were actually picked up in the Afghanistan city of Ghazni, Afghan diplomatic sources in Europe have claimed. The sources say the officers — ranging from majors to lieutenant colonels — may have been on leave before joining Taliban units. "This brings in an element of deniability for the Pakistani authorities," the sources add, explaining that some two dozen officers between the ranks of major and lieutenant colonel may have been involved. They add that the continued Pakistani assistance to the Taliban — whether covert or open — is necessary because of Taliban limitations in operating communications technology and sophisticated weapons systems.
This doesn’t make clear how they came to be turned over to the Pakistanis, if they actually were arrested in Ghazni, or how far up the chain of command the awareness of what they were doing goes. One thing is clear, the Pakistanis sure aren’t too popular with the present Afghan government. The Great Game between India and Pakistan doesn’t bode well for Afghanistan’s future.
Posted by: Paul Moloney || 11/25/2003 3:22:19 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "The Great Game between India and Pakistan doesn’t bode well for Afghanistan’s future. "

yup - which is why id take this story from an Indian source with a bit of salt.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 11/25/2003 9:42 Comments || Top||

#2  A "coup plot" is also a good excuse to throw them in the slam and/or kill them off before they can talk (like our saudi 'allies'). I imagine having a bunch of ISS officers picked up while meeting with their taliban and al qaeda allies in Afghanistan is pretty embarassing to Pervez. Much rather have it looking like something else.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 16:11 Comments || Top||


Usmani under protective custody?
The Kandahar plot
EFL
"YOU should lose some weight, Maulvi Sahib," joked a prison guard at Jammu’s Kot Bhalwal jail, "maybe you should spend some more time digging tunnels." On June 14, 1999, a group of Pakistani terrorists in the city’s high-security Kot Bhalwal jail had made their way into a tunnel burrowed underneath the prison’s walls and barbed wire. The man for whom the jailbreak was organised, Maulana Masood Azhar, now commander of the Mujahideen Jaish-e-Mohammad, soon found that he had a serious problem in hand. The tunnel was simply too narrow to allow the portly terrorist through. Azhar made his way back into the prison.
There were numerous attempts to free Masood Azhar from Indian custody, including the kidnapping and murder of 5 western tourists in Kashmir in 1995. Eventually, he and 2 other terrorists were freed by the Indians when an Indian airplane was hijacked and flown to Taliban controlled Afghanistan in 1999.
Some time in the coming weeks, a team of officials from the Central Bureau of Investigation (CBI) is hoping to leave for Kandahar in Afghanistan to unravel the mechanics behind the December 25, 1999 hijacking of Indian Airlines flight IC-814. The CBI team hopes to interrogate Mohammad Akhtar Usmani, the designated successor to Taliban chief Mullah Mohammad Omar, who was then commander of its forces in Kandahar. A welter of new evidence, and the CBI’s earlier interrogation of Taliban Foreign Minister Wakil Ahmed Mutawakil, suggest that Usmani was the central conduit between Pakistan’s Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) and the Harkat-ul-Mujahideen members who carried out the hijacking on its behalf. Given that the United States is engaged in a war on terrorism, and given that an American national was on board IC-814, it would seem reasonable to expect that the U.S. would be only too happy to cooperate with the CBI. The sad truth, however, is that the U.S. will not even admit that it has Usmani in custody, an assertion rubbished with increasing candour by Indian and Afghan intelligence officials.
That’s very interesting if true, I have no idea how credible the claim is, although if the intelligence agencies of India and Afghanistan are both claiming it to be true, and it is part of the attempt to reach an agreement with ’moderate Taliban’, it might well be.
No public news has emerged of Usmani since March, when he was credited with several military actions in southern Afghanistan. Since then, neither the Taliban nor the U.S. forces operating in Afghanistan have issued word about him. Indian intelligence officials say that Usmani, like several other key Taliban commanders, is now being held under the protective umbrella of the U.S. military. Although it is unclear if the Taliban leader has actually been arrested, Indian intelligence officials believe that he has been cooperating with the U.S. in its efforts to stitch together some political entity out of the remnants of the far-Right Islamist organisation. The last thing the U.S. needs right now is a request from India seeking the extradition of one of its new-found potential allies - or embarrassing disclosures about the linkages between the "moderate Taliban", global terrorism and Pakistan’s intelligence establishment.

After months of increasingly impatient prodding, officials of the CBI were allowed access only to Mutawakil, a small player in the IC-814 outrage. Informed sources say that U.S. officials were profoundly disinclined to grant access to the high-profile politician; at one point, India even considered issuing an Interpol alert that would have compelled Afghanistan to arrest the Taliban leader. In the event, Mutawakil said little that was not already known. Usmani, Mutawakil said, had handed over the IC-814 hijackers and the prisoners released by India to ISI personnel who were already stationed in Kandahar. Personnel from the ISI had played a key role in aiding the hijackers during their negotiations with Indian officials in Kandahar, and subsequently arranged for the group to be ferried across the border into Pakistan.
After the hijacking, Masood Azhar went on a sort of terrorist tour of Pakistan, surrounded by dozens of AK wielding bodyguards (who were reported by the Pakistani press as being ISI agents), before announcing the creation of the Jaish-e-Mohammad at the gates of the Binori madrassa. The Jaish took with it about 75% of the membership of the Harkut ul Mujahideen, which had recently been declared a terrorist organisation by the State department. Omar Sheikh kept a much lower profile, although some say he became very close to al Qaeda. Zargar was a minor figure, best known for tying people to trees and taping live grenades to them.
Early on, officials present at Kandahar say, it became evident that the ISI was playing a key role, guiding the hijackers with the demands to be made at each stage. Katju, Doval and Sahay were put up in a guest house, a short drive from the airport. The adjoining buildings were shared by guests who spoke Urdu, drove to the airport and back around the same time they did, and were treated with considerable respect by the Taliban. Two of these men were on the tarmac when the Indian aircraft arrived; others, recognised as ISI personnel from its special operations wing in Quetta, soon joined them. At 9-30 p.m. that evening, Katju made first contact with the hijackers on the aircraft’s own wireless communication system. Shortly afterwards it became clear that they were talking on hand-held walkie-talkie sets to their ISI handlers, a crude and easily intercepted communication system, but the only one available in Kandahar at that time.

IN retrospect, there was little doubt about the Taliban’s own position on the affair. Although Mutawakil expressed great public embarrassment over the presence of IC-814 on Afghan soil, a line bought happily by the United Nations Coordinator on Afghanistan, Eric de Mul, the reality was different. Usmani arrived with commandos at Kandahar airport only after the arrival of the Indian team, a clear sign that he did not seem overly concerned with the prospect of the hijackers escaping or blowing up the plane. Soon afterwards, rocket launchers and tanks surrounded the aircraft. Since such weapons are not used in hostage-rescue operations, the effort was clearly to ward off any covert Indian rescue attempt. In 1999, the Taliban held all the spades. Even if Katju had been more pessimistic about the Taliban, it is far from clear whether India had any real policy options. Today, the Taliban has fallen, but given the thrust of the U.S. policy in the region, justice remains a distant deal for the victims of the Kandahar hijacking and their relatives. In New Delhi, anger is mounting over what seems like a duplicitous and unprincipled war against terror. Prime Minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee, who has been thoroughly briefed on the CBI’s efforts, recently in Moscow called for an end to "double standards" in the war against terrorism and asserted that a "consistent and uncompromising" position needed to be taken. As things stand, the U.S. seems to be in no position to do any such thing. Desperately stretched in Iraq, south and central Asia have been consigned to the fringes of Washington’s consciousness. The Taliban, we have been told, is dead and buried. And yet, oddly enough, it lives, with the aid of the same people who claim to have killed it.
Posted by: Paul Moloney || 11/25/2003 2:59:16 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:


Khuddam-ul-Islam’s activities will continue: Mufti Abdur Rauf
Leader of banned Khuddam-ul-Islam and Maulana Masood Azhar’s brother Mufti Abdur Rauf Asghar has said they will not change the name of their organization and will continue activities under the same name: Khuddam-ul-Islam.
So there.
He said there is clear difference in the agenda of Jaish-i-Mohammad and the Khuddam-ul-Islam. The Jaish’s 20 points have no connection with nine-point reformative programme of the Khuddam-ul-Islam, which is a pure spiritual and reformative movement. Mufti Asghar said the ban on the Khuddam-ul-Islam is not acceptable to them. While talking to Ausaf, he said they will have to adopt new names every day if sanctions are imposed on them every other day on US behest. Therefore, Asghar said, they have rejected unjustified sanctions. He said allegations of sectarianism against the Khuddam-ul-Islam are baseless. If the government has any proof of the Khuddam-ul-Islam being involved in sectarianism, then it should make such a proof public.
Posted by: Paul Moloney || 11/25/2003 1:52:00 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "Fish gotta swim, birds gotta fly, turbans gotta twist".
Posted by: Seafarious || 11/25/2003 12:39 Comments || Top||

#2  turbans gotta twist".
Let 'em twist in the wind, still on their owners' heads, hanging from whatever convenient support we can find. The only good terrorist is a dead terrorist.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 13:28 Comments || Top||

#3  "Fish gotta swim, birds gotta fly, turbans gotta twist".
Ya gotta like that.

OP... couple days back you mentioned FSU & the Panama Program was the Professor mentioned Dr. Rodgers or James Jones?
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 16:29 Comments || Top||


Iraq
COUNTER FIRE TO A MORTAR ATTACK
TIKRIT, Iraq – At approximately 6:45 a.m. on Nov. 25, attackers using mortars fired upon Task Force Ironhorse soldiers guarding a forward operating base. In response to the attack, soldiers fired artillery rounds based on a radar system pinpointing the location used by enemy to mount the mortar attack. The mortars fired against Task Force Ironhorse soldiers were fired in close proximity to residential buildings.

A quick reaction force maneuvered to overtake the attackers and discovered two casualties. One person was found unresponsive and one was wounded. The injured person was treated at the scene and was evacuated to the Balad hospital. The person’s condition is unknown.

Additionally, soldiers responding to the attack captured 24 men found near the location of the attack. Soldiers confiscated two AK-47s, 15 AK-47 magazines, 450 rounds of 7.62mm ammunition, one ammunition bandolier, and an aiming stake used to target mortars.

The task force is investigating reports that civilians may have been injured during the course of the artillery counter-fire against the enemy mortar position.
Posted by: Chuck || 11/25/2003 9:31:16 PM || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  civilians may have been injured during the course of the artillery counter-fire against the enemy mortar position

Yeah, well. Someone starts laying a mortar next to your house, maybe it's a good idea to shag ass and tell the nearest GI patrol about it.

About time we started 'responding' to mortars being lobbed at us.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 21:40 Comments || Top||

#2  Yep, commo, when the terrorists put a mortar next to a civilian's home, any civilian casualties are THEIR responsibility, not ours. I wish the press would do a better job of reporting that kind of thing, but if they did, they wouldn't be the press, would they?
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 11/25/2003 22:22 Comments || Top||

#3  Give those target acquisition guys a commendation.
Posted by: badanov || 11/25/2003 22:51 Comments || Top||

#4  Tough sh*t. Maybe the next time some jihadi starts lobbing mortar in your vicinity, you should call the police. Silence is compliance, morons.
Posted by: BH || 11/25/2003 22:59 Comments || Top||


Video Shows Iraqi Firing at Cargo Plane
A homemade videotape given to a French journalist showed a man firing a surface-to-air missile at a DHL cargo plane, moments after a U.S. helicopter flew overhead — apparently without noticing him. The tape appeared to record the insurgent operation Saturday in which a missile struck the wing of a DHL cargo plane, forcing the aircraft to make an emergency landing at Baghdad’s airport. It was the first time insurgents struck a civilian plane in Iraq. The U.S. military said there were no injuries to the three-member crew. No statement accompanied the tape, which was given to Sara Daniel, a journalist with the Paris-based magazine Le Nouvel Observateur.
Given or shot by one of their stringers?
The magazine’s next edition comes out Thursday; Daniel distributed the videotape to other news organizations. Officials at the Pentagon said they had not seen the video and could not comment on it.
Memo to Pentagon, turn on CNN/Fox.
The videotape showed about a dozen men standing in an open field, several of them wearing checkered headscarves over their faces. A Black Hawk helicopter flew nearby at an altitude of about 350 feet, but appeared not to spot the men. Three cars were parked nearby. One of the men raised a shoulder-fired missile, whose type could not be determined. The gunner aimed and launched the missile at an unseen target. Trailing white smoke, the missile initially climbed almost vertically, then executed a sharp right turn as it gathered speed.
Aquired it’s target.
The tape continued to roll, but showed the men scrambling to their cars.
"Run away!"
After a time, the camera was again pointed to the sky as the stricken airliner, trailing flames and smoke, descended toward the airport. No impact is shown.
I think we need to start showing our own videos; "Thunder Over Tikrit", "Sunni Showdown", and "Death to Jihadi’s".
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 12:59:28 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  No impact is shown.

That's because it LANDED SAFELY. I guess this a-hole wants to imply that every aircraft going into Baghdad is crashing burning. Ignore the truth, what matters is FUD and smearing sh*t on the U.S.

Anyone else think it's a 'coincidence' the mutts handed the tape over to a frenchy?
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 13:27 Comments || Top||

#2  checkered scarf + head shot + 50 cal. + 900 yards = 72 virgins
Posted by: alaskasoldier || 11/25/2003 13:50 Comments || Top||

#3  He means MISSLE impact, on the plane's engine.

What say we just start shooting anybody wearing that damned paleo scarf?
Posted by: mojo || 11/25/2003 14:03 Comments || Top||

#4  Seems to me that the local air traffic control would be intelligent enough to vary the takeoff patterns in a random fashion, noise complaints be damned.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 11/25/2003 14:27 Comments || Top||

#5  "He means MISSLE impact, on the plane's enginesounds". Did you just figure that out, and that's why you are so proud of yourself to point that out?

"What say we just start shooting anybody wearing that damned paleo scarf?"

You have made a non sequitur. Since you obviously need someone to fill in the blanks for you...

"weapon + checkered scarf + head shot + 50 cal. + 900 yards = 72 virgins"

ROE what they are, I would doubt this would ever occur.

If I were the area commander I can assure you I would have sniper teams in place for just this sort of event.
Posted by: alaskasoldier || 11/25/2003 14:40 Comments || Top||

#6  I would have sniper teams in place for just this sort of event.

According to a recent post, the 82nd just recently recieved permission to start a sniper school in theater. In other words, there AREN'T ANY SNIPERS IN THE AIRBORNE INFANTRY TO PUT OUT THERE!!!

I'm with you, this is EXACTLY what snipers are for. It's shameful that there aren't even any on hand to do this. We should at least borrow some from the Marines until they come online.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 15:03 Comments || Top||

#7  Did you just figure that out, and that's why you are so proud of yourself to point that out?

Read and understand, slick.
Posted by: mojo || 11/25/2003 15:09 Comments || Top||

#8  I know about the sniper school the Army started. Find it hard to believe the 82nd does not have any organic scout/sniper assets in country. Heck, that's part of our t/o for every infantry battalion. Each Battalion has an entire STA (surveillance & target acquisition)or scout/sniper Platoon as part of its HQ Company or Weapons Company. I thought the Army was trying to make more snipers, cross-train some of the line grunts, and/or refine the skills of the snipers they already have in country. Having absolutely no snipers come w/you is pretty much dereliction of duty in my book. Those boys make a lot of money for a Battalion Commander.
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 16:10 Comments || Top||

#9  Having absolutely no snipers come w/you is pretty much dereliction of duty in my book

Unfortunately JH, there are too many high ranking officers in the Army that view killing people as rather distasteful. It's very much about being Politically Correct and not about fighting wars. Usually a good number of troops have to be killed before the generals 'relearn' the lessons of the past.

At least, that's my view, admittedly from the bottom of the pyramid.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 16:22 Comments || Top||

#10  "there are too many high ranking officers in the Army that view killing people as rather distasteful."

-You have got to be shitting me bro'. I'm definitely not the sharpest tool in the shed, so that does not compute at all in my little pre-historic alligator brain. So its true that the 82nd did not have any sniper assets w/them at the beginning of this OP? JHC, that's f*cking insane to say the least. Those guys save lives and put a bad hurting on the 'rag-men'. Maybe this war in the long run will get rid of some of the politicians in the ranks and highlight the true warrior-leaders. Patton used to warn about the 'peace-time army', we're not immune from it either. He'd be shooting folks over this, God Bless him.
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 16:37 Comments || Top||

#11  The school will actually be training marksmen who will still be in their units, to deal with targets of opportunity, not snipers in the classic sense.
Posted by: Pappy || 11/25/2003 16:51 Comments || Top||

#12  There are remote platforms that enable pretty much any soldier with a basic understanding of windage and drop to have the capability of an expert marksman. Don't need to have just the guys who excel naturally. Seems to me like this is another opportunity for their use. A Barrett .50 cal can be very effective even at long range. Goodbye Mr. Headscarf!
Posted by: remote man || 11/25/2003 17:24 Comments || Top||

#13  The school will actually be training marksmen who will still be in their units ... not snipers in the classic sense.

Yeah, but this really makes me wonder if the 82nd even has the leadership to put some OPs out there in hide sights, or put guys in the stormdrains or in cars, on top of roofs or in empty apartments, to watch out for the Bad Guys. The real mission of snipers would be for recon and observation, early warning to the guys in the helicopters and at roadblocks, not necessarily taking a shot and exposing themselves. But where's the capability? How can the 82nd not be ready for urban and counterguerrilla combat?
Posted by: Anonymous || 11/25/2003 17:38 Comments || Top||

#14  How can the 82nd not be ready for urban and counterguerrilla combat? Posted by: Anonymous 2003-11-25 5:38:48 PM
Like the man said, "Political Correctness". I worked in a section at SAC headquarters, commanded by a Captain, with me as NCOIC. I had three subsections under me, each run by a lieutenant. Two of those sections did 10% of the work, while the other section did 80%. Even though the workload was split so crazily, each section had the same number of people in it. I tried to move some of the people from the two over-manned sections to the section that was being overwhelmed with work, and was FIRED for trying to do it. The other two lieutenants were afraid 'they wouldn't look good, and might not get promoted'. Getting promoted, you see, was more important than getting the job done.

As far as I can tell, all three made Captain at about the same time, and all three were passed over and mustered out for failing to make Major. But it's that kind of politically correct bullshit that has severely weakened our military, and which needs to be ruthlessly weeded out, not only from our military, but from every aspect of life in this nation. Until we have the courage to do that, we'll continue to see this nation decline.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 19:48 Comments || Top||

#15  mojo:

whatever, cupcake.
Posted by: alaskasoldier || 11/25/2003 20:10 Comments || Top||

#16  AS - a non sequitar is something that doesn't follow - logically.... cupcake. Your comments are welcome, the condescension isn't.
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 20:23 Comments || Top||

#17  Speaking of sniper teams, it appears like Iraqi insurgetn teams include a cameraman. Makes you kind of think twice about the Palestinian cameraman who bought the farm.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 20:37 Comments || Top||

#18  twice? I haven't thought of him once...
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 20:38 Comments || Top||

#19  Speaking of sniper teams, it appears like Iraqi insurgetn teams include a cameraman. Makes you kind of think twice about the Palestinian cameraman who bought the farm.

Or about the role played by al'Arabiya and al'Jazeera. Love to know what format we got that footage in, and what we can tell about the equipment that shot it.

I bet there are camera experts that could at least put a "grade" on the lens that shot the video -- consumer, pro, borderline. Maybe even on the original format it was shot with -- Beta, 8mm, DV.

Put that information together and you get a feel for who supplied the camera.

Oh, and I think Super Hose is RIGHT on the money. All the video and photo coverage of the Palestinians comes from PA-approved "stringers". Those guys know when and where a provocation is going to happen, and where to set up so they're sure to only see the Israeli response.

I have no doubt the Iraqi terrorists have a similar setup. (And how many Palestinians were living off Saddam before the war?)
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 11/25/2003 20:59 Comments || Top||


Salvation Army in Iraq
Info we haven’t seen from one of the really good NGO’s. Never on camera and always there. Unlike, say, the Red Cross.

IF you feel that all the news emanating from Baghdad via the main news programmes is doom-laden and dire, then you may be interested in learning of the other face of Iraq rarely seen on your television screen. There is no desire to belittle the tragic deaths of servicemen but to focus only on this is not enough. The bottom line is that development is breaking out in the Missan Province. This province, bordering Iran and including the Marsh Arabs homelands, is coming back to life. The Salvation Army is part of a group of organisations who are working with the local government and the coalition forces to restore basic community services in and around the town of Al Amarah.

The list of needs in Missan Province is very daunting; there are 550 schools in the province and only approximately 100 are in operation. I visited one school in Al Khalah, a town on the edge of the marsh lands. The school is in dire need of repair. But before it can be repaired a place must be found to house the returnees who have come back from Iran. This was an area of the country which opposed Saddam Hussein. The marsh lands were hiding places for the beleagured opposition. Saddam’s answer to this was to drain the marshes and to persecute the local population. One local person told me that if a village was found to have harboured the opposition forces, Saddam’s forces would come, select 12 young men, execute them and burn the village. As a result of this persecution many of the people fled to Iran. Now that their country is freed from Sadam’s regime they are returning home and they end up in any place they can squat. The school we visited had been commandeered for a refugee camp. The local town council is keen to help their people but they have no resources. So The Salvation Army is assisting the returnees to build traditional reed houses. We visited the building site and all the families were eagerly working on these simple structures. The reed structures will be daubed with mud and then the returnees will have a place to start to rebuild their lives. Once they move from the school, The Salvation Army will seek funding to repair it so that the children can get back to school. The winter is coming on and the challenge will be to keep these families warm through the months of December and January.

Further into the Marshes we visited the Al Rafai village. Here the village headman entertained us in his reed-woven reception hall. He asked us if we could rebuild his medical clinic. It is the only medical facility for 17 kilometres. The condition of the clinic is very poor and it will be good to be able to rebuild this vital medical structure. Later that day we were asked by the head of education if we could rebuild three schools in the same area. We hope we can help these needy people.

Some aspects of life in Missan are modern – we have been able to rebuild the Al Yamama School for girls and install computers and sewing machines. Other aspects have not changed for thousands of years, like the traditional stoves for baking bread. One ancient attitude that has not changed is the attitude the community has towards leprosy. Lepers are the ultimate outcasts in a community. A group of 10 lepers are living outside Al Amarah in very desperate conditions. The local community gives them food but the condition of their accommodation is very primitive. One woman was sent to the colony because it was felt that she was a leper. After she had stayed there some time it was found that she was not infected. She returned home only to be refused entry. She was forced to return to the colony and look after the other patients. We will rebuild their accommodation to give them a decent place to live. The more difficult process will be to teach acceptance of these sufferers into the community again.

What is the true face of Iraq? There is the dark face of forces seeking to destabilise the country; there is also the face of the man who has faithfully tended the Commonwealth War Graves cemetery in Al Amarah since 1991 with no pay. There is the face of the head of education in Missan Province who endures death threats to bring education for the children. There are the faces of Iraqi children who need a chance for a better future. They are eager to achieve great things but they need our persistent partnership. The Salvation Army is committed to helping the peoples of this cradle of civilisation to rise from the ruins of these dark days.

Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 12:30:40 PM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Regardless of your religious beliefs, or lack thereof, please don't think ill of the Salvation Army. When I was in college, I got a temp job before Christmas as a bell-ringer. One day an old guy stopped to chat, and soon after another one joined him. Turned out they had both fought in WWII, one in Europe and one in the Pacific. One of them told me a story I'll never forget. He made his way to a camp and went into the Red Cross tent. There was a table full of doughnuts there. They wanted to charge the soldier for the doughnuts. He left, of course, and found a Salvation Army tent, and the leader there gave up his own cot, free, so the soldier could sleep in it.

Remember, also, they were a HUGE part of the relief effort helping to care for workers down at Ground Zero.
Posted by: growler || 11/25/2003 14:28 Comments || Top||

#2  I had lots of direct and eye-opening experience with the Salvation Army's overseas operations in the former Soviet republics in the 90s. They were consistently competent, efficient, reliable, and modest. A joy to work with, and bigger ambassadors of civilized behavior than many probably realize. They can only do good in Iraq.

While most NGOs have many good people and do fine work, another refreshing thing about the SA is their lack of "attitude," especially, uh, what might be termed a suspicious or disrespectful attitude towards anything done by the US.

It was no surprise to me that here at home, when Joan Kroc was looking for some non-profit to manage a huge recreation/community center complex she was funding in San Diego, she turned to the Salvation Army.
Posted by: IceCold || 11/25/2003 14:46 Comments || Top||

#3  When I was growing up the SA was the only charity my Dad would give to.

When going back to Maui from Iwo he needed a few bucks to buy a razor and soap from the ship's store to clean up. The RC rep on the ship offered a loan to be taken out of his pay, the SA rep gave him a razor, soap and $5 no questions asked. I expect Dad's given over $20,000 to the SA over the years and he doesn't have to wonder what they do with it.

Of course even the Salvation Army could not compete with Gentleman Jim Fair's Genuine, Get It for Ya Wholesale, Swap-Shop and Salvation Navy. Anyone from Tampa?
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 16:12 Comments || Top||

#4  Chuck Simmims...thanks for posting this article. I'm going to email a copy to the United Nations and International Red Cross.
Posted by: Mark || 11/25/2003 18:07 Comments || Top||

#5  During my short career in uniform I appreciated what I saw organizations like the the American Red Cross, USO, Navy League and Navy Relief accomplish.
Navy Relief seemed to get the worst press because however many sailors they helped there was always someone on a ship that had really needed something that Navy Releif and hadn't been helped to their satisfaction. Always wondered about those guys that griped so loud. Never felt like I was getting the real story out of them.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 20:45 Comments || Top||


CAR CHASE ENDS IN DRUGS SEIZURE
British troops based in Basrah seized drugs worth an estimated $150,000 after pursuing a suspicious car through the city. Six soldiers from A Squadron, 9 th /12 th Royal Lancers (Prince of Wales’s) spotted two cars travelling at high speed at around 7.45pm on 23 November and gave chase. One of the vehicles crashed a short time later and the driver was arrested. Unluckily, the other car escaped. The patrol found 51 kgs of cannabis in the boot of the crashed car, wrapped in cat food bags and disguised as coffee. The incident, in the Az Zubayr area of Basrah city, follows continuing joint operations by Coalition Forces and Iraqi police to crack down on crime south of Al Basrah. Patrol commander, Captain Matt Eyre-Brook, said the seizure was the latest in a series of successes against criminals in their area. “This was very exciting and a great round-off to an excellent week,” he said. “As well as this drugs find, we have arrested two hijackers and seized weapons and grenades. We were also the first to respond to a road traffic accident where we were able to administer first aid to the injured. Sadly, they passed away later in hospital due to their critical injuries.” Lieutenant Colonel Julian Free, the soldiers’ commanding officer, said they would continue to target criminals in the area. “This latest success is a result of well planned operations and the quick reactions of soldiers on the ground.”
Source: Multi-National Division (South-East)’s Press Information Centre I had not noticed this site before. Lots of news about the Brits, et. al.
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 11:56:37 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  In other news the Basra PX has sold out of Fritos.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 12:06 Comments || Top||

#2  They're just stocking up in case Sean Penn comes over as a leftist agitator 'journalist' for Pravda the SF Chronicle.

Spiccoli doesn't go ANYWHERE without a good supply of bud to fuel the paranoia and 'logic' jumps.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 13:33 Comments || Top||

#3  Ya just gotta wonder what kind of bunk weed these guys are selling, don't ya? Where's it from? Indica or Sativa? Male or female?

Inquiring minds...
Posted by: mojo || 11/25/2003 14:55 Comments || Top||

#4  Is this expensive weed? $2,941 per kilo. There is a marijuana prices directory here and a rough guess is $200 per ounce. That makes it (math challenge) about $7,000 a kilo in the USA.
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 15:29 Comments || Top||

#5  $200 per ounce
G*d Damn Elitist No InHaling pigs have brought us to this?

Jeez.. when I was a yut it was $20 a 18 gram lid.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 16:34 Comments || Top||


Three More Terrs Wacked
Soldiers from the 82d Airborne Division conducted raids Saturday night leaving three enemies dead and another wounded. One soldier was wounded during the raids. The wounded soldier was evacuated to a nearby medical facility where he remains in stable condition. The wounded enemy combatant received medical attention and is being held in a detention facility. Inside the targeted buildings, 82d Airborne Division soldiers captured 10 rocket-propelled grenades and two assault rifles. Coalition Forces will continue to seek out and capture or kill former regime loyalists and others attempting to slow the reconstruction process.
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 10:20:25 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


This is Curious: Hezbollah shuns U.S. targets in Iraq
EFL
Hezbollah, the Iran-backed Shiite group, has established a significant presence in Iraq but is not taking part in attacks on U.S. forces inside the country, according to current and former U.S. officials and Arabs familiar with the organization. Iran is believed to be restraining Hezbollah from attacking U.S. troops, and that is prompting a debate within the Bush administration about Iran’s objectives.

Hezbollah’s presence has become a source of concern as it is recognized by counterterrorist experts to have some of the most dangerous operatives in the world. Both American and Israeli intelligence have found evidence that Hezbollah operatives have established themselves in Iraq, according to current and former U.S. officials. Separately, Arabs in Lebanon and elsewhere who are familiar with the organization say Hezbollah has sent what they describe as a security team of up to 90 members to Iraq. The organization has steered clear of attacks on Americans, the U.S. officials and Arabs familiar with Hezbollah agree. U.S. intelligence officials said Hezbollah operatives were believed to have arrived in Iraq soon after the end of major combat operations last spring. The CIA has not seen a major influx of Hezbollah operatives since that time, officials added. "Hezbollah has moved to establish a presence inside Iraq, but it is not clear from the intelligence reports what their intent is," a U.S. official said.
Any thoughts on this?
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 11/25/2003 8:32:31 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I 'spect they're taking notes.
Posted by: John || 11/25/2003 9:08 Comments || Top||

#2  Why risk getting shot up by M16s, M60s, M1A2s, and AH-64s when there are so many helpless soft targets around?
Posted by: Dar || 11/25/2003 9:27 Comments || Top||

#3  Getting their boys in place in preparation for the handover?
Posted by: BH || 11/25/2003 9:32 Comments || Top||

#4  They don't want us to have a casus belli before their nukes are finished.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 11/25/2003 9:34 Comments || Top||

#5  Whack'em
Posted by: Raptor || 11/25/2003 9:46 Comments || Top||

#6  1. Irans hopes for control in Iraq are premised on support from the Shia community. The Shia community wants peace, and largely accepts the US presence. Even Al-sadr has made positive noises lately. For Iran or Hezbollah to take violent action against the US now would be to alienate the Iraqi Shia, and endanger Al-Sadrs position.
2. If they see the US cutting and running due to Baathist attacks, its to their advantage to wait and come in then,
3. They want very much to avoid sanctions over their nuke program - why give the US more rationale to present to the more sane Euros (IE the Brits)
4. Theyre divided and vulnerable interally - an incautious policy could be taken advantage of by internal dissidents
5. Theyve been cautious with the US whenever the US looked scary. IE over Afghanistan, etc.
6. Some rumors that Hezbollah is trying to do some kind of larger strategic deal with Israel - with the prisoner swap being the first step.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 11/25/2003 9:50 Comments || Top||

#7  If you're Shi'a, and the "volunteers" jumping up and down screaming "pick me! pick me!" are a mix of Shi'a & Sunni -- who are you going to pick?
Posted by: snellenr || 11/25/2003 10:35 Comments || Top||

#8  I would suspect that we haven't attacked either Iran or Syria because they aren't actively backing foreign terrorist groups against us. That will change if either country takes that route.

Note that even if they're actively trying to prevent people from coming over the border, people will still get through. The weak links are the border guards, who can be bribed, or may be sympathetic to the cause the terrrorists represent. That Iran, for one, does not have complete control over its borders is illustrated by frequent reports of drug-related gun-battles involving dozens of men when the Taliban were in power. Drugs are readily available in Iran, despite drug importation and trafficking being capital offenses.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 11/25/2003 11:27 Comments || Top||

#9  Lebanese terrorist groups are not all that effective. The sniping, land mines, IED's, etc. caused a few dozen Israeli KIA annually, while Israeli forces were in South Lebanon.

What really hurt the Israelis was the impression the Palestinians obtained from its withdrawal - that Israel would also withdraw from the West Bank and Gaza if the Palestinians could inflict a few dozen casualties annually on Israel. In a way, withdrawing from South Lebanon gave comfort to Palestinian terrorists in the same way that the US withdrawal from Somalia after 19 KIA gave comfort to al Qaeda. (Unfortunately, Republican opposition to the completion of the Somalia mission was complicit in conveying the impression of American weakness).
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 11/25/2003 11:35 Comments || Top||

#10  Just waiting for us to leave. They're hoping that we leave Iraq sooner rather than later and in worse shape than I believe we will. Then they can move in and gain influence.

They are going to find that by the time we leave Iraqis will have no patience for their jihad mentality and Iraq will be well on it's way to prosperity.
Posted by: Damn_Proud_American || 11/25/2003 11:59 Comments || Top||

#11  Just waiting for us to leave.

I don't see our guys leaving for decades. At minimum, I see two divisions in Iraq, but out in the desert, just like in Afghanistan, where it's a lot more difficult to use IED's and mines against us. The reason we're taking casualties is because we're hanging around cities - no clear fields of fire out there. City combat isn't inherently tough - when you're taking down entire buildings around the defenders, as we did during the major combat phase. When you're tiptoeing around the civilian inhabitants, as we're doing now, we fail to catch the perps and in many cases, take casualties.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 11/25/2003 12:23 Comments || Top||

#12  One base in the Kurdish north, rumor has it a big "listening post" has already been built there. Keep a eye on Iran and Syria from there as well as defend Turkey from Kurdish incursions (and visa versa). Also the big airbase down south as a replacement for the Saudi bases. Cover Iran, the Gulf States, and Saudi from there.
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 14:37 Comments || Top||

#13  They view the US as willing to take losses and stay as long as it takes. The europeans are not seen to be as committed, and Iran would like to separate us from our allies.

The appropriate response would be to better integrate our C&C with the european forces, and hit back with particular aggressiveness when they are struck.


Posted by: flash91 || 11/25/2003 18:28 Comments || Top||

#14  I think its fairly obvious what Hezbollah is doing in Iraq. Training the 'recruits' how to fight and doubling as sleeper cells.
Posted by: Charles || 11/25/2003 18:43 Comments || Top||

#15  Could they be setting themselves up simular to how Hmas is burried in the Palestinian community? I would think that funds for their outreach programs would dry up if Syria and/or Iran is destabilized.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 20:50 Comments || Top||


PATROLS NET MORE WEAPONS
4th Infantry Division also known as “Task Force Ironhorse” has over the past 24 hours, conducted 199 patrols, seven raids and captured 18 individuals. One of those captured was wanted for anti-coalition activity. Thirty-three of the patrols were joint operations conducted with the Iraqi Police, the Iraqi Civil Defense Corps and the Border Guard in an effort to continually improve the safety and standard of living for the Iraqi people. Weapons and equipment confiscated in raids and patrols throughout the Task Force Ironhorse area of operation include (17) AK-47 assault rifles, one machine gun, (11) rifles, one pistol, three rocket propelled grenade launchers, (24) rocket propelled grenades, (53) grenades, (50) blasting caps, 6 containers of artillery propellant, (60) 120mm and (250) 60mm mortar rounds, (10) blocks of C4 explosives, (10) sticks of TNT, (50) mortar fuses, (40) spools of wire, used to detonate improvised explosive devices and five improvised explosive devices.
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 8:31:38 AM || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:


Iraqi Attacks on U.S. Soldiers Said Down
EFL & The Obvious.
Attacks on American troops in Iraq have declined in the last two weeks and insurgents are increasingly targeting Iraqis working with the U.S.-led coalition in an effort to intimidate them, the top U.S. civilian and military leaders here said Tuesday.
Read: Iron Hammer is having an impact.
"The security situation has changed," Bremer said at a press conference with Gen. John Abizaid, the chief of the U.S. Central Command. "They have failed to intimidate the coalition," he said. "They have now begun a pattern of trying to intimidate innocent Iraqis. They will not succeed...If Saddam taught the Iraqis nothing else it was how to endure the depredations of thugs."
Read: We have an Iron Jackhammer.
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 11/25/2003 7:12:00 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  As you can readily see from recent CentCom reports, when they attack us, they get killed. Attacking our friends is easier, but I suspect we will adapt as we have right along.

My motto for the next 30 days
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 9:30 Comments || Top||

#2  This is great news. Looks like Iron Hammer had an effect. Also, I imagine we've changed our patrolling habits somewhat to lesson to opportunity for them to ambush us.
Posted by: Damn_Proud_American || 11/25/2003 11:52 Comments || Top||


Iraq Suicides not all Bombers
Rebecca Suell wants answers, and not the ones the US Army is giving her. Why does the Army keep calling the last letter her husband sent to her, the one he mailed from Iraq on June 15, a suicide note? Can taking a bottle of Tylenol really kill you? And how did he get his hands on a bottle of Tylenol in the middle of the desert anyway?

The questions may differ, but experts say the desperate search for answers - and the denial - are usually the same. Since April, the military says, at least 17 Americans - 15 Army soldiers and two Marines - have taken their own lives in Iraq. The true number is almost certainly higher. At least two dozen non-combat deaths, some of them possible suicides, are under investigation according to an AP review of Army casualty reports. No one in the military is saying for the record that the suicide rate among forces in Iraq is alarming. But Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez, the top American military commander in Iraq, was concerned enough, according to the Army Surgeon General’s office, to have ordered a 12-person mental health assessment team to Iraq to see what more can be done to prevent suicides and to help troops better cope with anxiety and depression. Army spokesman Martha Rudd said the assessment team returned from Iraq two weeks ago, but that it will take several weeks to come up with recommendations. Until then, she said, no one on the team will have anything to say to the press.

Whether the suicide rate among the troops should be considered high is impossible to say because there is nothing to compare it with, experts say. What would be considered a ``normal’’ rate for an all-voluntary military force of men and women on extensive deployments to the Middle East, under constant pressure from guerrillas who use terror tactics? Rudd said that by the Army’s calculations, its suicide rate in Iraq is roughly 12 per 100,000 - well below the civilian suicide rate for US men of 17.5 suicides per 100,000. The comparison is misleading, however. The civilian rate is an annual figure, and the Iraq figure covers only about seven months. Furthermore, the troops have not yet spent their first holiday season in Iraq - a time when the risk of suicide is traditionally at its highest. The troops in Iraq include thousands of women, who typically have a lower suicide rate than men. And the Army figure does not include possible suicides among the non-combat deaths yet to be explained.

Whatever the 12-month suicide figure turns out to be, the Army is not satisfied that it is low enough. The Army has an extensive suicide prevention program, with soldiers ``all the way down the chain’’ of command trained to recognize the warning signs of suicide and how best to intervene, Rudd said. ``Zero suicides is our goal,’’ she said. ``We may not get there, but we’re going to try.’’

In all, 424 US troops have died in Iraq. The military has characterised 130 of the deaths as ``non-hostile,’’ including 106 since President George W. Bush officially declared major hostilities over on May 1. Most if not all the confirmed suicides occurred after May 1, according to the military. According to an AP analysis of military reports, non-combat deaths include 13 caused by a weapons discharge, two from drowning, one from breathing difficulties and one described only as ``medical.’’ An additional 13 are listed with no cause given.

For Rebecca Suell and many of the families of soldiers who are believed to have killed themselves in Iraq, answers are as hard to come by as sleep. Night after night, Suell said, she lies awake asking herself the same questions. Why, as sad and as tired of Iraq as he said he was, would her husband take his own life when she had just told him how much she loved him, how much the kids missed him and needed him? Why would a man who loved the Lord so much - who told her on the day he died that he felt he was getting closer and closer to God every day - defy his Lord’s strictures against taking his own life? But the more she sobs, the clearer it becomes that Joseph D. Suell, posthumously promoted to sergeant, was in crisis the day he died - so desperate to come home that he even asked his wife to talk to his commanding officer.

And she did. She told him, she said, how life was so hard without her husband, how going to nursing school and working at Wal-Mart and trying to raise three children, all at the same time, was too much for her to bear alone. She told him how her husband had no sooner finished serving a year and half in Korea than he was sent to Iraq, that in five years as a soldier she had been with him less than 18 months. She told his commanding officer that their youngest daughter didn’t even know her father, that he was away the day she was born, and that all her husband really wanted was to be at home with his family in Lufkin, Texas, for Christmas. Just a month or two, she begged, and then you can have him back. His commanding officer, she said, told her that the Army was doing everything it could to get him back to her but that he couldn’t promise it would happen in time for Christmas.

The Army will not talk about Suell’s death, nor does it publish, out of concern for the families, the names of soldiers who have killed themselves in Iraq. But Rudd, the Army spokesman, said it is not unusual for family members to question whether a loved one’s death was a suicide. It is for that reason, she said, that it often takes months to complete an investigation into a soldiers death. For the sake of the family, Rudd said, ``we need to be absolutely certain.’’

In many respects, Joseph Suell does not fit the profile of a soldier who commits suicide. Typically, mental health experts said, such suicides are triggered by a ``Dear John’’ message from home. Even among civilians, one of the common triggers ``is a rupture of a relationship,’’ said David Shaffer, a Columbia University psychiatrist and former consultant for the Department of Defense. But there are always deeper reasons, usually far murkier and far more complex, experts said. Like the wars they fight, no two soldiers who commit suicide face the same mix of potentially deadly stress. ``In most previous conflicts you went, you fought, you came home,’’ Rudd said. ``In this one they went, they fought, they’re still there.’’

Rudd said she knows of no studies that show a definitive correlation between length of deployment and military suicide rates. But Michelle Kelley, a psychiatrist who studies deployment-related stress for the Navy, said the longer the deployment, the greater the strain on a relationship with a loved one. The military, she said, needs to be especially watchful for anxiety and depression among its troops in the weeks ahead. For civilian and soldier alike, the Christmas season and depression go hand in hand, Kelley said. But for a soldier, she added, a weapon is always at hand. Soldiers, she said, must be encouraged to seek help when they need it.

For that reason, she expressed concern about the case of Pfc. Georg-Andreas Pogany. The soldier, assigned to a Green Beret interrogation team, began throwing up after seeing the severed body of an Iraqi civilian three days after being deployed to Iraq. After seeking help for a self-described anxiety attack, he was ordered back to the United States and became the first soldier since Vietnam charged with cowardice - a charge later reduced to dereliction of duty. That, Kelley said, is ``the last thing you want to do’’ if you want soldiers to seek help in times of stress ... You need to make it clear to those people who have witnessed something traumatic that they need to talk about it - that they won’t be stigmatised for doing so and that it’s not going to follow them through their military career.’’

Shaffer, the Columbia University psychiatrist, said it is not that simple. A commanding officer’s decision to file a cowardice charge might, in some circumstances, even be a morale boost for the soldiers under his command, he said. Shaffer warned against drawing any conclusions based on the number of suicides in Iraq. Suicide rates vary greatly over time, he said, and also vary with race, ethnicity, religion and other factors. African Americans, for example, have a lower suicide rate than the general US population. So do those who describe themselves as deeply religious. Drug use, alcoholism and a low education level, on the other hand, are correlated with higher suicide rates.

A comparison of the suicide rate among troops in Iraq with troops in other wars such as Vietnam are meaningless, he said, because the makeup of the fighting forces were so different. (According to the Army, there are no reliable statistics on the suicide rate during the Vietnam War.) Shaffer said there is also some evidence that those who serve in the Army for a long time have a higher suicide rate than civilians. This is probably because ``some longstanding servicemen do develop alcohol problems over time, and alcohol use is very strongly related to suicide,’’ he said.

Rudd, the Army spokesman, also adds something else to the mix: ``Technology today allows people to connect with the home front much more quickly and intimately and often than in previous conflicts,’’ she said. That’s not necessarily a good thing if the news from home is bad. Young people can be impulsive, she said, ``and Dear John letters and things like that can be very upsetting to a young soldier.’’

For Rebecca Suell, who so badly wanted her husband back, there are still only questions. Why, she demands to know, her voice rising in anger, did the Army send her husband to Iraq after he had mangled his arm in Korea? After they discovered that his asthma was getting worse? She has taken her 4-year-old daughter, Jada, to the cemetery, she said. ``I’ve told her, ’That’s where your daddy lives now - right next to your grandfather. And that’s where we will all live someday, next to the people we love most.’ But she doesn’t understand.’’ So what is she supposed to tell Jada, Rebecca Suell said, the next time she asks: ``When is my daddy coming home?’’’
This is the reason our boys need total support, and not cristism, nor callous indifference.
Posted by: Anonymous || 11/25/2003 7:01:07 AM || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  not yet spent their first holiday season in Iraq - a time when the risk of suicide is traditionally at its highest.

BS, there's more support during the holidays, suicides actually drop.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 7:35 Comments || Top||

#2  Den Beste looked at this, too, and apparently the suicide rate is equal to or lower than expected:

http://denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2003/11/Suicidesinservice.shtml

I suspect we're seeing the birth of a new Big Lie to use against the war.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 11/25/2003 8:33 Comments || Top||

#3  sound like half the rate of your average college freshmen class.
Posted by: eyeyeye || 11/25/2003 8:53 Comments || Top||

#4  No "anonymous" article posts. Flush this turkey.

This has, indeed, been debunked as BS by den Beste.

And RC is absofuckinglutley right.
Posted by: .com (Abu No Anonymous) || 11/25/2003 9:30 Comments || Top||

#5  ...how did he get his hands on a bottle of Tylenol in the middle of the desert anyway?

Um...Yeah... We just stick them out in the desert and leave them to fend for themselves with no food, water, or mail.

Brilliant reporting.
Posted by: Dar || 11/25/2003 9:31 Comments || Top||

#6  A bottle of Tylenol WILL kill you.
Some years ago, a friend downed 34 extra strength (17 grams) and then called me. 25 minutes later, he was getting his stomach pumped. It was over 36 hours before the doctors concluded he was going to live. IIRC, LD50 is around 15 grams in a 24 hour period. It doesn't kill directly, but rather destroys the liver. It also stays in the body a long time.
Posted by: Dishman || 11/25/2003 9:41 Comments || Top||

#7  It's hard to kill yourself with Tylonol alone. You tend to puke it back up. Enough alcohol on board is the preferred method for achieving success. If you take enough Tylonol, and survive, you have a decent chance of success in about 15 years. Sudden liver failure.
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 10:01 Comments || Top||

#8  We have more suicide attempts in one month at Parris Island then in one month in Iraq. This is not news.
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 10:57 Comments || Top||

#9  story is on drudge...from a Malaysian paper....Tokyo Rose strikes again....
Posted by: milford || 11/25/2003 13:39 Comments || Top||

#10  Tylenol (acetaminophen) will indeed kill you. It causes fulminant hepatic necrosis -- liver failure. One does not tend to vomit up Tylenol, by the way.

We see several Tylenol overdoses a year in our critical care unit, and they're very tough patients. We've seen a few of these go straight to liver transplant.
Posted by: Steve White || 11/25/2003 16:35 Comments || Top||

#11  We've seen a few of these go straight to liver transplant

You mean the transplant list?
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 19:17 Comments || Top||

#12  I changed the story source to a U.S. paper. It's an AP story and I couldn't find it on Utusan Malaysia.
Posted by: Fred || 11/25/2003 20:55 Comments || Top||


Now they’re saying no evidence our soldiers’ were mutilated
U.S. military officials now say there’s no sign the bodies of the two Americans killed yesterday in northern Iraq were mutilated. Military sources say there’s no sign the men were beaten with rocks or their throats slashed. Witnesses had reported the soldiers were dragged from their car after gunmen shot them. Iraqis say a mob pummeled the bloodied soldiers with concrete blocks and a few accounts said the soldiers throats were slashed. But the military official says there’s no evidence to back the claims. The official says Iraqis robbed the car and stole personal effects from the soldiers’ bodies. The Pentagon has identified the men as Command Sgt. Maj. Jerry Wilson, of Thomson, Ga., and Specialist Rel Ravago IV, of Glendale, Calif.
Sounds like the press picked up on the locals' rumor mill. Check your sources, guys...
Posted by: Damn_Proud_American || 11/25/2003 1:49:49 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Iraqi's make pretty poor eyewitnesses, relatively speaking.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 4:46 Comments || Top||

#2  I wonder if this is another "looted museum" story, where the initial reports of descration of the corpses was almost entirely fabricated.

The alternative, of course, is that the US is trying to hide the truth so that it doesn't have to retaliate massively.
Posted by: Steven Den Beste || 11/25/2003 6:28 Comments || Top||

#3  Video supposedly here...
Posted by: Ptah || 11/25/2003 6:32 Comments || Top||

#4  In Monday's account, the military official said the victims, both soldiers from the 101st Airborne Division, were not set upon by a mob but were shot by unidentified gunmen who stopped their car in front of the Americans' car, forcing it to halt. The assailants got out and fired at the Americans through the windshield. While an initial military report had said that the men's throats had been slit, further investigation revealed no evidence of such wounds, a military official said.

Saw a report yesterday that said at least one of them had been shot in the neck. That could account for the throat theory.

Nor were the bodies dragged through the streets.
At the Pentagon, Defense Department and military officials had no explanation for the conflicting information from the field, except to repeat the usual caution that first reports are routinely incorrect. The initial reports of throats being slashed came from Iraq, and were never confirmed by officials in Washington, they said. Military and Pentagon officials confirmed that the bodies apparently were taken from the vehicle, and that valuables and weapons were stolen, but that the victims were not mutilated or dragged through the streets.


Somebody came by after the fact, saw the bodies laying beside the car, saw bloody throat wound, maybe saw some bricks or rocks beside the body, put two and two together, and came up with five.
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 8:33 Comments || Top||

#5  in a country that has gone 30 years without a free press, the tendency to rely on rumor must be large. given that many Iraqis still dont trust the CPA TV network, and that the foreign sat networks - al arabiyah and al jazeera - are unreliable - they probably still go by rumor. (There are print news sources now, but they may not be fast enough for something quick breaking like this)
Posted by: liberalhawk || 11/25/2003 9:57 Comments || Top||

#6  There's also the "Fee, Fie, Foe, Fum..." tendency of Arab mobs to take into account...
Posted by: snellenr || 11/25/2003 10:38 Comments || Top||

#7  Ptah, the video link didn't seem to work. I really don't wan't to watch a video of something like that but I think it's important that we get to the truth on this.
Posted by: Damn_Proud_American || 11/25/2003 11:50 Comments || Top||

#8  More details coming out:
The Associated Press quoted an eyewitness, 19-year-old Younis Mahmoud, as saying: "They lifted a block and hit them with it on the face." But the AP dispatch quoted another teenage witness, Bahaa Jassim, as saying the wounds came from gunshots, not stabbings. "One of the soldiers was shot under the chin, and the bullet came out of his head," the teenager said. "I saw the hole in his helmet. The other was shot in the throat."
The two 101st Airborne soldiers were riding in a civilian vehicle between garrisons in daylight when they were shot by gunmen. The vehicle then crashed into a wall. The bodies were dragged from the vehicle and "stripped of their personal effect," the coalition spokesman said. A crowd used rocks to break the vehicle's back window and then looted it. Army soldiers arrived on the scene and found the two bodies lying near the vehicle.

Like I said before, 2 + 2 = 5. I'd still be looking for the people who robbed the bodies.
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 11:53 Comments || Top||

#9  I'd still be looking for the people who robbed the bodies.
Yep, and when we find them, we should make an example of them. They should be shackled together (feet only, as many as are involved), and forced to dig ditches twelve hours a day, day after day, for ten years. I'm sure they will never want to even THINK about stripping another dead person of their personal belongings.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 20:15 Comments || Top||

#10  OP, they could dig proper graves for the victms of Sadaam.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 20:55 Comments || Top||


Southeast Asia
JI getting back on track
U.S. officials in Southeast Asia are bracing for new terrorist attacks as they gather fresh information about Jemaah Islamiyah, the radical Islamic organization based in Indonesia.
That would fit with the other recent attacks ...
Despite arrests of some of the group’s top leaders, including Riduan Isamuddin, the group remains intact and is growing in strength and numbers, U.S. and Asian officials said in interviews.
The fruits of those training camps in Mindanao and Sulawesi, no doubt.
Recruitment and fund-raising have been easier for the group because of widespread opposition in the region to the U.S. war in Iraq. In the last few months, men, money and arms have flowed to the group through the Philippines, a center for training and money-laundering.
And also MILF HQ, despite Murad’s pious denials that they have nothing whatsoever to do with terrorism. My guess would be that they’re using the cease-fire as an excuse to rearm, as there seems to be a precedent for such things ...
Isamuddin, better known as Hambali, was captured by the CIA in Thailand in August. The officials expect new attacks against Westerners, with Americans and Australians at the top of the risk list. Indonesia is the most likely place. Indonesian officials said last week that they had seized documents showing that Jemaah Islamiyah was planning attacks on Citibank branches in the country.

The Philippines is also considered a prime target. Isamuddin, who was a member of Osama bin Laden’s inner circle, has told his interrogators that the Israeli Embassy and a Manila hotel were on the group’s list of targets, a Western official said. "It is not a question of if, but when and where," a senior U.S. official said. Malaysia and Thailand are considered lesser targets, but far from immune, the officials said.
Mahathir seems to have shut down a lot of their infrastructure in Malaysia or his way out of power and they never really had a lot of infrastructure in Thailand to begin with by the simple problem of demographics.
To counter the threat, the CIA has more agents operating clandestinely in the region than at any time since the Vietnam War. U.S. officials have extensive intelligence showing that Jemaah Islamiyah has a major training base on the southern Philippine island of Mindanao. "We don’t have a clear picture yet of the J.I. order of battle," a U.S. official said. "But with every interrogation, we learn there’s more of them than we thought." Singapore intelligence has concluded that the organization is "likely to plan more suicide bomb attacks along the lines of Bali and the recent Hotel Marriott bombing in Jakarta," Wong Kan Seng, Singapore’s security minister, said in a speech last week.

Some new information came from the interrogation in Manila of Taufik Rifki, Jemaah Islamiyah’s finance and logistics officer in the Philippines. Rifki was seized last month in Mindanao. "He’s been a gold mine," a Western official said. Rifki has given his interrogators details about Jemaah Islamiyah’s structure and hierarchy in the Philippines, as well as about the Mindanao camps.
Note the plural form of camps here.
His capture appears to have disrupted one operation, a Western official said. But he was careful not to say it had prevented it. "It may have only been postponed a month or two," he said. Although many members of Jemaah Islamiyah trained in Al Qaeda camps in Afghanistan, Western and Asian governments increasingly consider it a separate regional operation, with its own camps, recruiting, financing and agenda: the establishment of an Islamic state across an arc of Southeast Asia.
It’s a separate operation in the sense of how it’s run, but both have the same goal as far as world domination goes.
Isamuddin was thought to be the vital link between Jemaah Islamiyah and Al Qaeda, and the source of money and technology. Now, officials say that the Qaeda network is more decentralized. The view of Australian intelligence agencies, which are considered to have a better understanding of Jemaah Islamiyah than their U.S. counterparts, is that the organization "has matured," an official said. "It is resilient, it is flexible," he said. "It doesn’t need Al Qaeda."
But if the Zulkarnaean bio was any indication, their new supremo is one of Binny’s stormtroopers. I somehow doubt that Hanbali was the only link in the chain here, especially if Zulkarnaean starts racking up a lot of long-distance calls to Iran these days ...
The Philippines has been slow to acknowledge the presence of terrorists here. When a newspaper article about Jemaah Islamiyah camps on Mindanao appeared in June, the country’s national security adviser, Roilo Golez, issued a stern denial, saying that if there had been any camps, they were shut in 2000. Officials held that stand for months, though the United States, Australia and other countries were providing the government with evidence that Jemaah Islamiyah recruits were still training here, Western officials said.
This naive mindset is going to end in one of those Uruk-hai-esque black flags flying over Manila if the Filippino government doesn’t change its tone.
A few days after President George W. Bush visited the Philippines last month, President Gloria Macapagal Arroyo acknowledged publicly that the group was training in Mindanao. Earlier this month, Andrea Domingo, the Philippine commissioner of immigration, said that the government had evidence of 30 foreigners training in Mindanao. But last week, a Philippine military spokesman again insisted that the camps were closed three years ago.
Hmm, sounds as though there’s still a lot of denial among the Filippino military.
Bush and other Americans have praised the Philippine government for its cooperation against terrorism. But privately, U.S. officials have delivered stern messages to Arroyo that her government is not doing enough, Western officials said. U.S. officials have said they are disappointed and somewhat puzzled that the Philippine government has not shut the camps in Mindanao.
As are we all ...
Posted by: Dan Darling || 11/25/2003 1:36:55 AM || Comments || Link || [6 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Perhaps it's time for a carrier task force to "request" permission from the Philippines to carry out a live-fire exercise. I'm sure we know where some of these tin turbantops hang their hammocks. A bit of "shock and awe" in the outer islands may be just what the JI needs to understand their very tenuous place in society.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 20:24 Comments || Top||

#2  OP - I think there is some talk between the Philippines and US about having another 'joint training session'. But it is stalled in defining what role the US soldiers will take - only training the philippines or engaging in live patrols. I think the Philippine consitution forbids having foreign armed forces on the islands (or is it just permanent bases....).

Personally I think they should open on with some of those bombing runs on the training camps.... a little shock and awe as it were. Then we (and the Philippine government) will be in a stronger position in any 'Peace' (read: reload) talks.

Anyway here is some more detailed History of the Philippines from the Library of Congress.
Posted by: Anonymous || 11/25/2003 23:35 Comments || Top||


Terror Networks
Zarqawi was the pivot man for Istanbul
Looks like Fred called this one right ...
The recent bomb blasts in Istanbul are neither isolated incidents nor simply local actions. All indications point towards global Islamic radicals determined to create a Muslim backlash against the West through more suicide attacks in both Turkey and Europe. Initial European intelligence reaction suggests that the Istanbul suicide blasts were the work of the Tauheed group led by a Jordanian national of Palestinian origin, Abu Mosub al-Zarqawi, who, it is speculated, planned, helped finance and executed the attacks in conjunction with Turkish counterparts.
Tauheed = Tawhid, which is Zarqawi’s own mob the same way that JI was Hambali’s. Al-Qaeda is basically a terror franchise and al-Tawhid is Zarqawi’s piece of the pie.
Al-Zarqawi, known in senior al-Qaeda circles, has recently been the focus of revived United States attempts to link al-Qaeda with Saddam Hussein. Last year, he had a leg amputated in Baghdad after being wounded in Afghanistan. During al-Zarqawi’s two-month stay in Baghdad, the US has claimed, many al-Qaeda affiliates established cells in the city. Al-Zarqawi subsequently disappeared.
To Iran. He's reputed to be shuttling back and forth between Iran and Iraq, keeping things stirred up...
The US has offered up to US$5 million for clues leading to his arrest, as he is now accused of recruiting fighters in Iraq. The reward appears on the program’s website, which is run in coordination with the State Department’s Bureau of Diplomatic Security. "Abu Musab al-Zarqawi has had a long-standing connection to senior al-Qaeda leadership and appears to be highly regarded among al-Qaeda and a close associate of Osama bin Laden and Saif al-Adel," the announcement says. Al-Adel, for whom there is also a large reward, is thought to be bin Laden’s number three and has been reported as being in Iran.
I thought Zarqawi was now worth $25,000,000, a sign of just how far he’s moved up in the food chain over the last year. Incidentally, Saif al-Adel is said to have ordered the latest bombings in Riyadh so we have al-Qaeda active on at least three fronts right now: Iraq, Turkey, and Saudi Arabia. Any word out of Afghanistan since the Taliban retook those districts in Zabul?
Abu Mosub al-Zarqawi is also thought to have provided weapons and money in connection with the murder of US diplomat Laurence Foley in Jordan last October. He is known to have been very active since the fall of the Taliban government in Afghanistan two years ago, and has variously been tracked in Iran’s Kurdish region, northern and central Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon and Palestine. He is said to have actively developed networks with smaller groups in these regions, and he coordinated his activities, for example, with Hezbollah in Lebanon and Ansar al-Islam, a militant Iraqi Kurdish group in northern Iraq. This month’s Istanbul attacks indicate that he also spent some time in the country making contacts with local radical groups there.
The only Turkish al-Qaeda affiliate that I’m familiar with is the Bayat al-Imam crew, but if Zarqawi’s subcontracted the Raiders or the Turkish Hezbollah it would seem to imply that he’s got himself yet another prime source of cannon fodder to make use of.
Al-Zarqawi appears to favor US and Jewish targets, as well as their allies. Initially, his main playing field was Palestine, and later on Jordan, where he established a network to bring down the monarchy which, he believes, is hand-in-glove with "Zionist and US interests".
They don’t seem to be doing much lately, though that border shooting was also reportedly a Zarqawi operation. This guy has more connections than SPECTRE these days ...
Al-Zarqawi spent some time in Afghanistan, where he operated independent training camps for Jordanians. His Tauheed group is a part of bin Laden’s International Islamic Front, an umbrella body that groups organizations which accept bin Laden as a mentor and his pan-Islamic ideology.
Interesting, that’s the first solid info on al-Tawhid being part of bin Laden’s International Front.
Al-Zarqawi’s known modus operadi, gleaned from the few members of his network who have been captured by European intelligence, does not involve guerilla warfare, thus it is unlikely, as the US now claims, that he has any serious involvement in Iraq. Rather, his networks in different countries aim to take on the interests of the US and its allies, or specifically, in the language of the jihadis, "take on the Jewish and US unholy nexus".
I’d still say the Jordanian embassy bombing probably fits his MO, ditto with a lot of the more coordinated suicide bombings like the UN and the Red Cross. Assuming al-Qaeda’s even active in the day-to-day guerrilla war (I’m more inclined to attribute that to the Baathists), my guess would be that al-Hijazi or Abu Iyad is the pivot man there.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 11/25/2003 1:14:32 AM || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Here is the FBI wanted poster.

The Rewards For Justice Program, United States Department of State, is offering a reward of up to $25 million for information leading directly to the apprehension or conviction of Ayman Al-Zawahiri.
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 14:48 Comments || Top||

#2  Oops, different guy. Al-Zawahiri is Binny's doctor and advisor. Or are they the same guy? It's that damm spelling. Here's the list:

Usama Bin Laden
The Rewards For Justice Program, United States Department of State, is offering a reward of up to $25 million for information leading directly to the apprehension or conviction of Usama Bin Laden. An additional $2 million is being offered through a program developed and funded by the Airline Pilots Association and the Air Transport Association.

Abdelkarim Hussein Mohamed Al-Nasser
Indicted in the Eastern District of Virginia for the June 25, 1996, bombing of the Khobar Towers military housing complex in Dhahran, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. $25 million

Abdullah Ahmed Abdullah
Indicted for his alleged involvement in the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. $25 million

Muhsin Musa Matwalli Atwah
Wanted in connection with the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. $25 million

Ali Atwa
Indicted for his role and participation in the June 14, 1985, hijacking of a commercial airliner which resulted in the assault on various passengers and crew members, and the murder of one U.S. citizen. $25 million

Anas Al-Liby
Wanted in connection with the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. $25 million

Ahmed Ghailani
Indicted in the Southern District of New York, on December 16, 1998, for his alleged involvement in the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. $25 million

Hasan Izz-Al-Din
Indicted for his role in planning and participation in the June 14, 1985, hijacking of a commercial airliner which resulted in the assault on various passengers and crew members, and the murder of one U.S. citizen. $25 million

Ahmed Mohammed Hamed Ali
Wanted in connection with the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. $25m.

Fazul Abdullah Mohammed
Indicted on September 17, 1998, in the Southern District of New York, for his alleged involvement in the bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya, on August 7, 1998. $25m.

Imad Fayez Mugniyah
Indicted for his role in planning and participation in the June 14, 1985, hijacking of a commercial airliner which resulted in the assault on various passengers and crew members, and the murder of one U.S. citizen. $25m.

Mustafa Mohamed Fadhil
Indicted in the Southern District of New York, on December 16, 1998, for his alleged involvement in the August 7, 1998, bombings of the U.S. Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya, and for conspiring to kill U.S. nationals. $25m.

Sheikh Ahmed Salim Swedan
Indicted on December 16, 1998, in the Southern District of New York, for his alleged involvement in the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya, and for conspiring to kill U.S. nationals. $25m.

Abdul Rahman Yasin
Wanted for his alleged participation in the terrorist bombing of the World Trade Center, New York City, on February 26, 1993, which resulted in six deaths, the wounding of numerous individuals, and the significant destruction of property and commerce. $25m.

Fahid Msalam
Indicted on December 16, 1998, in the Southern District of New York, for his alleged involvement in the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya, and for conspiring to kill U.S. nationals. $25m.

Ahmad Ibrahim Al-Mughassil
Indicted in the Eastern District of Virginia for the June 25, 1996, bombing of the Khobar Towers military housing complex in Dhahran, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. $25m.

Muhammad Atef
Indicted for his alleged involvement with the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. $25m.

Ali Saed Bin Ali El-Hoorie
Indicted in the Eastern District of Virginia for the June 25, 1996, bombing of the Khobar Towers military housing complex in Dhahran, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. $25m.

Saif Al-Adel
Wanted in connection with the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. $25m.

Ibrahim Salih Mohammed Al-Yacoub
Indicted in the Eastern District of Virginia for the June 25, 1996, bombing of the Khobar Towers military housing complex in Dhahran, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. $25m.

That's everyone on the FBI's Most Wanted Terrorist list.
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 15:38 Comments || Top||

#3  Zarqawi and Zawahiri are indeed two different people. Zarqawi's up on the State Department's Rewards for Justice page. I think they changed him from $25m back to $5m.
Posted by: Fred || 11/25/2003 21:00 Comments || Top||


Home Front
Sen. Clinton to spend Thanksgiving with troops in Afghanistan, visit Iraq
Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton will spend Thanksgiving in Afghanistan before traveling to Iraq with a former Army paratrooper turned senator to meet with soldiers and ask questions about the United States’ ongoing nation-building efforts. The former first lady and Sen. Jack Reed, D-R.I., have both been critical of the administration’s handling of post-combat problems in the war on terrorism, particularly after major military operations ended in Iraq. Clinton and Reed said Tuesday they were concerned about the current efforts to win the "hearts and minds" of Iraqis. "This administration is run by people who have been obsessed with Saddam Hussein for more than a decade," Clinton said.
Unlike the immediate past president who was more concerned with a White House intern than with Saddam Hussein.
"And the fact that they could have been so poorly informed and prepared raises a lot of serious questions about the decisions they are making now."
Sure Hillary, if only we had listened to you.
Reed said he is worried "the administration seems to be rushing toward an exit strategy" in Iraq by transferring power as quickly as possible to civilian police authority.
Damned if we do, damned if we don’t.
The trip marks Clinton’s first fact-finding mission abroad as a member of the Senate Armed Services Committee. While in Afghanistan, Clinton, D-N.Y., plans to spend time with members of the 10th Mountain Division, which is based in Fort Drum, New York and is now serving in Afghanistan. "I’m still very worried about Afghanistan unlike in 1998 when I didn’t care a whit ... The Taliban and al-Qaida are clearly making a comeback," Clinton said. "I’m very honored that we’ll be spending Thanksgiving with our 10th Mountain Division troops."
Be nice to her, guys, the Army doesn’t need the bad publicity.
New York’s junior senator said she wants to "see and hear for myself what people tell me on the ground," adding she will "be supportive where I can be supportive and I’m going to stick the knife into Bush’s back have questions where I think it’s in the Democratic Party’s our national interest to piss and moan ask those questions." Reed has already visited Afghanistan and Iraq within the past year, and wants to compare what he saw then with current conditions. The two have criticized aspects of the administration’s oversight of the U.S. military during the war on terror. Clinton voted for both the authorization to use force in Iraq and the $87 billion package to help rebuild that country and Afghanistan. But even as she voted for the spending measure, she called it "a bill for failed leadership."
Confused once again with 1998.
Reed, a West Point graduate who was once a company commander with the 82nd Airborne Division, voted against the force authorization and for the spending measure. For Clinton, the trip is also a chance to bring attention to one of her long-time public causes: the advancement of women in the political systems of other nations. She plans to meet with different groups of women leaders of both countries, and lobby for their inclusion in the nation-building effort.
Let’s see her do that in a Muslim country. Should unwind a few turbans.
"I want to be sure that women are involved in all levels," she said, adding she wants to take advantage of Reed’s military experience as she tours military operations. "I do know a very little about winning the hearts and minds of people and developing a political strategy that badgers people relentlessly gets people on your side, and I’ve been amazed and disappointed at how well poorly our government has carried that out."
So says Hillary, owner of the highest negatives of any major woman politican in this country.
Reed said the nation’s attention has "focused dramatically away from" Afghanistan since Taliban forces were routed, and said he is worried "we may have lost some ground in light of the resurgence of the Taliban and the appropriate integration not only of our forces, but NATO forces." Citing security concerns, the exact itinerary of the trip was not disclosed. Clinton, who travels with Secret Service protection, said she was not concerned about her safety, but her office would not discuss what, if any, extra protective efforts were made for her trip.
Posted by: Steve White || 11/25/2003 7:10:59 PM || Comments || Link || [6 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Given how much she knows about winning the hearts and minds of people, from whom does Sen. Clinton need extra protection?
Posted by: Mr. Davis || 11/25/2003 19:30 Comments || Top||

#2  If I were the troops I would thank both Senators for showing their support by voting AGAINST the funding. Shows just how much they 'support' the troops. I hope they are captured by the taliban!
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 11/25/2003 19:48 Comments || Top||

#3  where o where to begin. She's trying to buff her nat'l security credentials (such as they are) while playing the anti-bush card. Our troops should let her know how much they appreciate her appearance (I'd like to see video of the whole trip, not just the nuggets of PR her staff edits out of the rest). By the way, I guess she was promoting women's rights by kissing Suha while honor killings in the Paleo territories were still going on? Don't recall her speaking out on that.....monica-syndrome...mouth to full to speak?
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 19:58 Comments || Top||

#4  Well, it is good anytime politicians visit the troops. They will influence the senators more than vice versa.

Clinton, who travels with Secret Service protection, said she was not concerned about her safety, but her office would not discuss what, if any, extra protective efforts were made for her trip.

I bet those extra protective measures will be making sure Bill stays in line during the trip. With her gone to Asia, he might get a hankerin' to do a little deer hunting. Of the two legged variety.
Posted by: Penguin || 11/25/2003 20:15 Comments || Top||

#5  I read on another blog that the troops when informed of the upcoming trip groaned LOUDLY!! Of course, they'll have to be polite when she is there.
Posted by: AF Lady || 11/25/2003 20:15 Comments || Top||

#6  This will be very frustrating for troops on the ground to keep their mouths shut and not to unload their true feelings about this witch. She is just looking for photo-ops. What a waste of taxpayer money and manpower. (*takes diazopam, drinks water*) Ah, feel better now....
Posted by: Anonymous || 11/25/2003 20:21 Comments || Top||

#7  "I hope they are captured by the taliban!"

Well, that would make for some interesting dialogue between the lines:

"Americans. you must take this woman back!"

"No way. You captured her fair and square. She's all yours."

"Americans! In the name of Allah!"

"Bwahahaha!"
Posted by: Matt || 11/25/2003 20:27 Comments || Top||

#8  When I read the headline I thought "Wow! Clinton is going to visit the Taliban!".
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 20:43 Comments || Top||

#9  The troops she meets will probably be *hand picked* by the brass in the command & the public affairs folks. They won't want any loose cannons telling her the place sucks or she sucks.
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 21:09 Comments || Top||

#10  Jarhead, Yes. It is just be for photo-ops. Too bad -- I always wondered what a mass-moon looked like.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 21:17 Comments || Top||

#11  CF, hopefully some straight shooting soldier will weasel his way in and drop trow for the big picture. Or at least give the camera the old "hanoi hilton hook'em horns this is all bullshit sign".
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 21:23 Comments || Top||

#12  ... and do remember, shortly after 9-11, at a hugh fundraiser in New York, she and Bill both were loudly booed by the firemen and the cops.....

Then -- it was news --

But... I'm sure.... some good Rantburg persons, with some contacts in both places, will enlighten us with "the rest of the story."
Posted by: Sherry || 11/25/2003 23:02 Comments || Top||

#13  One crazy thought keeps zinging between my ears: Is she scheduled to visit any other countries, such as a) France; b) Pakistan; c) Liberia; d) the Philippines? Long trip, just for one stop. Now, if the ISI were to kidnap her, she might even get a 'face-to-face' with OBL, or whatever is left of him at this point.

If she's kidnapped, I absolutely REFUSE to pay any ransom whatsoever to have her back. IF they REALLY want us to take her back, THEY PAY, and HEAVILY!
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 23:05 Comments || Top||


Ex-Muslim Chaplain at Guantanamo Charged
A Muslim chaplain who served at the U.S. prison camp in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, was charged Tuesday with adultery and storing pornography on a government computer, a U.S. Southern Command spokesman said.
what’s wrong w/that? sounds like a typical practicing muslim to me.....
Army Capt. James Yee, who worked at the prison camp for terror suspects in eastern Cuba, was released from custody Tuesday after being served with the additional charges, Raul Duany, a spokesman for U.S. Southern Command in Miami, said. He was arrested earlier this year in Florida and confined to the military brig in Charleston, S.C. Military officials brought the additional charges after an investigation. The charges include storing pornographic images on his computer, having sexual relations outside marriage, disobeying an order and making a false official statement.
yes, but he was working for an infidel nation, those charges can’t be taken seriously
Yee, who also uses the first name dumbshit Yousef, will be sent to Fort Benning, Ga., where he will continue to be laughed at & ridiculed perform religious duties but will be barred from having any contact with prisoners at Guantanamo, Duany said. But not from the young pretty things at the local Hooters establishment. Yee, a Chinese-American who converted to Islam after graduating from West Point, good move moron, was arrested Sept. 10 (too bad it wasn’t on the 11th) in Jacksonville, Fla. Federal agents said they found the native of Springfield, N.J., carrying sketches of the military prison at Guantanamo Bay, where he counseled prisoners accused of links to Afghanistan’s deposed Taliban regime or the al-Qaida terror network. His wife, Huda Suboh, 29, lives in Olympia, Wash., with their two young children. She was not immediately available for comment on Tuesday but earlier defended his innocence.
I can say no more
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 4:23:45 PM || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:

#1  A co-worker has speculated that the porn was intended to carry messages with steganography.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 11/25/2003 16:31 Comments || Top||

#2  Why wasn't I just hearing how pious he was? How innocent of all charges? Divide and conquer - adultery will turn the wife
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 16:40 Comments || Top||

#3  Maybe he was having tryouts for '2nd wife'.....
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 18:17 Comments || Top||

#4  I've known officers who have engaged in adultery. Never really understood how they could enforce the UCMJ when they were breaking it themselves. It got really bad when the Commander in Chief was leading the charge as it were.

My dad told me that some marine tried to use Clinton's infidelity to get out of NJP for adultry, but the Commandant explained to all that for Marines Semper Fidelis means exactly that. Wish I had the stones and could do enough pull ups to have joined the Corps.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 18:23 Comments || Top||

#5  Interesting points, guys...

Y'know, it's one thing to be unfortunate enough to be born into the RoP and indoctrinated from birth - it's a whole nuther thing to convert as an adult.

I still can't wrap my mind around the notion of a woman (with a functioning brain) looking open-eyed at Islam and saying, "Oh yeah - that's for me!" Beyond boggling.

As for myn, am I the only one who believes that they must be well and truly fucked up induhviduals? Read the suras and haddiths and tell me it came from an "omniscient being" - and I'll have the laugh of a lifetime. Yee and his ilk need to be studied. There is something fundamentally pathological in their "personalities."

Or are they just morons who "found a bunch of guys who dressed alike and followed them around" or converted for typically pathetic oh so human reasons, such as pressure from some "friend." I tend to think that choosing the fundamental path of your whole phreakin' life should demand something rather deep and, well, phreakin' fundamental.

As for Yee in particular, sorry folks but his conversion alone would fire my suspicions that he is capable of any level of self-deception and, thus, certainly capable and, if he's a good Muslim, motivated to be deceitful in pursuit of the Islamic agenda. His position at Gitmo certainly afforded him the means to do so... Islam is the ultimate form of justifying the sick creed of any means to an end.

The WoT is for all the marbles. We have to get past the automatic PC reactions to asking such questions - and finding answers. Time is getting short, and the stakes don't get any higher.
Posted by: .com (Abu Skeptic) || 11/25/2003 18:30 Comments || Top||

#6  Abu, I think you hit the nail on the head. I am a practicing Catholic (still trying) and I have seen many people convert for one reason or another. Those that convert are mostly RADICAL in nature when they convert and then chill out over time. I had a sister-in-law that used to preach to us NON STOP while she was going through religious teachings. After a couple of years she backed off and learned to be herself AND a Catholic at the same time. For the same reason many Muslims that grew up with the religion can’t understand the radicals that learn the same religious teachings. I think it kind of like the J.W. or Fundamentalists that really go off the deep end when they ‘find’ religion. I think a common theme about converts is that they did not have any religion growing up. When they convert, watch out! All of a sudden they act like they FOUNDED the religion.
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 11/25/2003 18:47 Comments || Top||

#7  Cyber Sarge - Sorta like an ex-smoker? ;-)

Now, puhleeeze, explain to me how a woman can convert to Islam! I can picture some personality deficiencies that might contribute: S/M-phreak, Daddy-phreak, Lost Child (any cult will do, just "love bomb" me!), or moron (IQ-wise). I'm sure I left out a dozen other debilitations or twisted mindsets that might be key. But I can't picture a woman without one or more of them converting. It's lame rubbish and petty tripe. Who could think it devine? Arrrggghhh! 8-{
Posted by: .com (Abu Skeptic) || 11/25/2003 19:26 Comments || Top||

#8  .com, I think it's like you what you said - the men are looking for something to do the thinking for them, that way they are not accountable for anything. I.E. - religion says I can discriminate against women, etc. It's their own exclusive club. For the females, they must have such poor self esteem they need the feeling of belonging and submitting. After all, the main tenet of Islam is "submission to God". Where as Christianity = God is Love and Love is God.
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 20:40 Comments || Top||

#9  SH, I've known some adulterers as well. Two officers in that group, all the rest were SNCO's & other enlisted. Both O's got thrown out. One of the SNCOs (a female) plea bargained her way out of a court martial, she was married & banging one of the O's (some single dumb-asshole). Officer's have to be beyond reproach in the integrity dept, that's been my way of business ever since earning my commission.

Legally, adultery is a hard one to prove unless you can get statements from all involved. I have more sympathy for the young guys who get married their first year in (18-20 yr olds) and deploy for the first time & have a screw up. I don't condone their actions but have never 'ratted' one of them out unless they were engaged in extra-marital affairs w/another servicemen's wife - then it was beat down time. Other then that, I don't meddle in the private affairs of other grown men unless their actions become a detriment to our unit. However, if they get no shit caught, there is no pleading ignorant. You play, you pay. OTOH - young 19 yr old Marines were being thrown out of the service for a stupid mistake & this asshole Clinton, their c-n-c, lies to grand juries, asks for the definition of 'is', represents the country, and nothing happens to him. That is not leadership by example. I don't care what that "huckster" did on his own time, but you don't turn the nation's house into a f*ckin' motel-6 w/some buffet jockey poster child for weight watchers.
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 20:57 Comments || Top||

#10  Jarhead, LMAO - appropriately brutal. Somewhere along the line, the military has lost it's ability to let kids (E-4's and E-5's) make honest mistakes. Glad to know that the Corps hasn't lost it's way with respect to Officer accountability. No military unit needs scumbags in charge. I has seen it at even the flag rank - it's poison for morale.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 21:12 Comments || Top||

#11  SH - right on. These lads would be in college in any other case drinking kegs of natural light & fornicating like rabbits in a pet store. When it came to their screw ups w/women and getting into good ole' donney brooks (i.e. bar fights, punch ups, and good brawls on libo) I always gave them a more then fair deal. No haunting paperwork usually, almost always some bust ass job like filling sand-bags, dig pits, fighting holes, be the section SNCOIC's bitch for the next month. Heck, I was a total moron in my late teens and early 20's as well. Fighting, booze, broads, you name it, I pulled it. I like aggressive, piss & vinegar Marines, backbone of the Corps. Those are the ones we gotta retain, save, dust them off and get them back into the fight so to speak. However, I believe drug users, thieves, gang bangers, chronic p.o.s. sand-baggers, & shirkers need to be let go at first chance. Just dead-weight imo. I know in your experience as a Navy Vet you've seen the same shit on ship over & over again.

You're shitting me about the flag officers pulling this crap? That's unforgivable. Same assholes who sit on courts martial boards and throw guys out for the same stuff they were getting away with. I guess the self righteous only have a "zero defects" mentality for others.
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 21:42 Comments || Top||

#12  Kind of made Captains Mast a little interesting.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/26/2003 4:49 Comments || Top||


Africa: East
Deadly Peace Talks
Killing each other during the talks saves time, I guess:
A Kenyan politician has been charged with the murder of a delegate at the ongoing Somali peace talks in Nairobi. Adan Keynan is alleged to have killed Sheikh Ibrahim Ali Abdulleh. The ex-MP, who is also of Somali origin, denies the charges saying they are political. The delegate and two of his associates were found dead, with gunshot wounds in a forest just outside the capital.
"Nothing personnel, Ibrahim. Just politics."
Early this month, Ahmed Rashid Mohamed, another delegate at the talks was also killed. Mohamed, a senior member of the Rahanweyn Resistance Council was found dead at Mbagathi, the venue of the peace talks.
Well, they are African Peace Talks(tm).
But Kenyan police have still not arrested anyone in connection with his mysterious murder.
Humm, I smell Dire Revenge.
The BBC’s Caroline Karobia, says the mysterious deaths have sparked protests among Somali delegates who now accuse the Kenyan government of failing to guarantee their safety.
No shit
Keynan appeared composed when he was brought before Justice John Osiemo. He also denied killing Mohammed Elley, the delegate’s driver, and his business associate, Hassan Abulrahaman Mohammed. The politician faces a possible death penalty if found guilty.
Doesn’t he have one of those Diplomatic get-out-of-jail-free cards? Oh, he’s a ex-MP, sorry.
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 3:59:58 PM || Comments || Link || [6 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Blue hats may be needed to seperate the peace envoys.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 19:14 Comments || Top||

#2  But Kenyan police have still not arrested anyone in connection with Dr. Mohamed's mysterious murder.

Kenya Govt failed even to arrest people behind the killing of the Kenyan Constitutional Review Chairman. what a shame !
Posted by: Anonymous3965 || 03/29/2004 13:38 Comments || Top||


Home Front
Daniel Pipes on identifying moderate muslims
Hat tip LGF
I often argue that if militant Islam is the problem, moderate Islam is the solution, but that begs the question — how does one differentiate between these two forms of Islam? It’s a tough question, especially as concerns Muslims who live in Western countries. To understand just how tough it is, consider the case of Abdurahman Alamoudi, a prominent American figure associated with some sixteen Muslim organizations. FBI spokesman Bill Carter described one of those, the American Muslim Council, as "the most mainstream Muslim group in the United States." The Defense Department entrusted two of them (the Islamic Society of North America and the American Muslim Armed Forces and Veterans Council) to vet Islamic chaplains for the armed forces. The State Department thought so highly of Alamoudi, that it hired him six times and sent him on all-expenses-paid trips to majority-Muslim countries to carry what it called "a message of religious tolerance." Alamoudi’s admirers have publicly hailed him as a "moderate," a "liberal Muslim," and someone known "for his charitable support of battered women and a free health clinic."
A paragon. An absolute paragon...
But this image of moderation collapsed recently when an Alamoudi-endorsed chaplain was arrested and charged with mishandling classified material; when Alamoudi himself was arrested on charges of illegal commerce with Libya; and when Alamoudi’s Palm Pilot was found to contain contact information on seven men designated by the U.S. government as global terrorists.
Well, I guess we all have our little faults...
Distinguishing between real and phony moderation, obviously, is not a job for amateurs like U.S. government officials. The best way to discern moderation is by delving into the record, public and private, Internet and print, domestic and foreign, of an individual or institution. Such research is most productive with intellectuals, activists, and imams, all of whom have a paper trail. With others, who lack a public record, it is necessary to ask questions. These need to be specific, as vague inquiries ("Is Islam a religion of peace?" "Do you condemn terrorism?") have little value, depending as they do on definitions (of peace, terrorism).
And we know how the Islamist definitions of both vary widely from Western usage, yea, from rationality...
Useful questions might include:
- Violence : Do you condone or condemn the Palestinians, Chechens, and Kashmiris who give up their lives to kill enemy civilians? Will you condemn by name as terrorist groups such organizations as Abu Sayyaf, Al-Gamaa al-Islamiyya, Groupe islamique armee, Hamas, Harakat ul-Mujahidin, Hizbullah, Islamic Jihad, Jaish-e-Mohammed, Lashkar-e-Taiba, and Al-Qaeda?

- Modernity : Should Muslim women have equal rights with men (for example, in inheritance shares or court testimony)? Is jihad, meaning a form of warfare, acceptable in today’s world? Do you accept the validity of other religions? Do Muslims have anything to learn from the West?

- Secularism : Should non-Muslims enjoy completely equal civil rights with Muslims? May Muslims convert to other religions? May Muslim women marry non-Muslim men? Do you accept the laws of a majority non-Muslim government and unreservedly pledge allegiance to that government? Should the state impose religious observance, such as banning food service during Ramadan? When Islamic customs conflict with secular laws (e.g., covering the face for drivers’ license pictures), which should give way?

- Islamic pluralism : Are Sufis and Shi’ites fully legitimate Muslims? Do you see Muslims who disagree with you as having fallen into unbelief? Is takfir (condemning fellow Muslims one has disagreements with as unbelievers) an acceptable practice?

- Self-criticism : Do you accept the legitimacy of scholarly inquiry into the origins of Islam? Who was responsible for the 9/11 suicide hijackings?

- Defense against militant Islam : Do you accept enhanced security measures to fight militant Islam, even if this means extra scrutiny of yourself (for example, at airline security)? Do you agree that institutions accused of funding terrorism should be shut down, or do you see this a symptom of bias?

- Goals in the West : Do you accept that Western countries are majority-Christian and secular or do you seek to transform them into majority-Muslim countries ruled by Islamic law?
It is ideal if these questions are posed publicly — in the media or in front of an audience — thereby reducing the scope for dissimulation. No single reply establishes a militant Islamic disposition (plenty of non-Muslim Europeans believe the Bush administration itself carried out the 9/11 attacks); and pretence is always a possibility, but these questions offer a good start to the vexing issue of separating enemy from friend.
Posted by: Atrus || 11/25/2003 1:39:22 PM || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  first some of these questions, to the extent they dont mention whether the person thinks something should be state policy, intrude into the legitimate sphere of religion. For example "may muslim women marry non-muslim men?" As a traditional Jew, I beleive non-Jews may not marry Jews under Jewish law. I accept however that the law of the state in this regard should not follow Jewish law. Pluralism - I believe in many approaches to Judaism, but the majority of Orthodox Jews do not - I would hardly exclude them from the ranks of moderates. Some of these questions would exclude any orthodox Muslim. Some would exclude all Wahabis, without regard to their political beleifs. This might make sense for selecting US army chaplains (indeed it would make a lot of sense, since such chaplains must be prepared to assist muslims of all backgrounds) but is it a correct classification in other contexts?

And even the question about Hamas - while I dont want any Hamas supporters in the US military, this isnt a good guide to diplomacy. There ARE people who support Hamas who nonetheless can be useful allies against Al Qaeeda, in Afganistan and elsewhere.

Is Pipes expressing a criterion for chaplaincy, or for friendship in other contexts. There are, I believe millions of muslims who are far to extreme to be considered appropriate for US army chaplaincy, but who could still be useful allies in the WOT.


Further - the initial line show some of the fallacy here - implying there are two forms - moderate and militant - there are at least 4 or 5 gradations that are relevant to the WOT, IMHO, (and im quite sure Pipes knows this)


Posted by: liberalhawk || 11/25/2003 14:02 Comments || Top||

#2  id suggest there are at least 5 gradations

1. sympathizers of AL qaeeda, who support attacks on Jews and Christians, and who will justify occasional attacks on muslims.
2. Sympathizers with Hamas, who support attacks on Israeli civilians and will justify attacks on Americans, but who shrink from all out war with Christians, and who are "Shocked" at attacks that kill "innocent muslims" These are the kinds of people who are repelled by the AQ attacks in Riyadh. They may not be particularly moderate from out point of view, but they are numerous, and their (growing?)alienation from AQ is of strategic importance
3. People who dont support attacks on Israelis or Americans, but who will excuse them or equivocate between such attacks and attacks to counter terrorism. While this is a position to be bitterly fought in the West, it is wise to realize that it is relatively moderate in much of the Islamic world, and that these fence sitters opinions matter in the war of ideas.
4. People who support the US, and are indifferent wrt to Israel, but wont go out on a limb to denounce Jew haters in the Islamic world
Here we have MOST of our (true) allies in the Islamic world - Karzai, most Iraqis, Musharaff, Sukarnoputri, etc. Snarky criticism of these people - such as occurred after the Mahathir speech - is unrealistic and does us no good.
5. People who take a more reasonable view of the conflict - including wrt to Israel. These people are great - and are very important in our internal dialogues in the US (im thinking of Fuad Ajami at the moment) but we MUST be realistic - there are no more than a handful of these in the Islamic world outside the West (maybe even outside the US) with a few exceptions like Turkey, Kurdistan, parts of Central Asia. This CANNOT be our standard for muslim moderation, at least in the short term. We need allies too badly.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 11/25/2003 14:16 Comments || Top||

#3  and what if the individual lies

see:
http://www.islamreview.com/articles/lying.shtml

also see: http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/000/623cqjcg.asp
Posted by: mhw || 11/25/2003 14:26 Comments || Top||

#4  In my personal work with ME muslims, I found that the one question that separates them is this: "Do you believe suicide bombers go to Heaven?"

This kind of cuts right to the chase, ya know? Try it. You'll be amazed at some of their answers. Could they lie? Of course. But I don't think they're very good at it. At least the ones I've met. Takes a little sophistication to lie well. That 'honor' thing kind of bothers them, -however skewed their scruples become.
Posted by: Scott || 11/25/2003 14:46 Comments || Top||

#5  Some of these questions would exclude any orthodox Muslim.

Well, yes, of course. That's the idea. They're the enemy.

This CANNOT be our standard for muslim moderation, at least in the short term. We need allies too badly.

Can we count on you to (metaphorically) beat the crap out of the next whiner who complains about the US supporting thugs and dictators, then? That's what you're advocating; that we accept a certain level of antisemitism, antiamericanism, and antiliberalism as natural. I'm uncomfortable with that, as a policy, and think it should be a case-by-case basis, if at all.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 11/25/2003 15:08 Comments || Top||

#6  I think any one of the questions will do. If you can find a Muslim who will or can answer any one oth them with out the trailing "yes but..." you done hit pay dirt.

Otherwise, sleep with one eye open.
Posted by: Michael || 11/25/2003 15:11 Comments || Top||

#7  I personally know both living moderate muslims. They own the candy store near my house. They're nice people.
Posted by: Tibor || 11/25/2003 15:15 Comments || Top||

#8  Indeed. So do I. One fellow in particular who I consider a close friend and in whom I have implicit trust.

And he can answer the question without the obligatory "yes but..."

He is not very popular at the local Mosque. Especially after he married a practicing Catholic.

Where I work there are also a fair number of Muslims from a varity of Middle eastern countries. Good people all. I am not trying to imply that all Muslims are bad anymore than I am trying to imply that all Christians or Jews or Hindus are good.
Posted by: Michael || 11/25/2003 15:26 Comments || Top||

#9  RC - i suggest we back thugs,etc also on a case by case basic, weighing costs and benefits.

BTW your quote - This cannot be our standard - I deliberately placed in category 5 - IE we cant limit our allies to exclude the other 4 categories. Note that category 4 includes people who are NOT antisemites or anti-aemericans - they DO applaud politely at a Mahathir speech, ignoring the antisemitic parts. Apathy towards antisemitism isnt a good thing, but its NOT the same as antisemitism, and we most definitely have to overlook it.

Category 3 may include genuine antisemites, but it largely includes the morally confused, the relativisers etc. Bad yes, but not necessarilly antisemitic. And yes, i would give muslims living in the muslim world more of a pass for such opinions than i would give europeans or Americans. They (the muslims) are subject to intense propaganda and social pressure - the Westerners really should know better. And yes, the muslims really do have some grievances with Israel - the opinions they form may be brutally unfair - but they arent necessarilly rooted in pure Jewhatred - demonizing people that your friends have a border dispute with is ALL TOO HUMAN behavior. For Europeans and Americans who have no such border dispute with Israel, no "dog in the fight" such opinions are MUCH MORE likely to be rooted in antisemitism.

The group I call 2 - are antisemites, antiamericans, and antiliberals. Im not advocating any particular alliance with them - but i would suggest that at least being cognizant that they are relative moderates is wise, and being concerned with not pushing them into category 1 is wise as well.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 11/25/2003 16:21 Comments || Top||

#10  If you want to detect moderate muslims, the genuine variety the ones who would help us ask them? What US can do for the Muslim world? If he begins to whin about the poooooooor Palestinians then you know this guy is unfit. The Muslims you are only looking for will tell you: to hell with Palestinians, how many dead have they had? Let's care about the Algerians, the Afghans, the Kurds, teh Iraquis: each of them has ten times more victims in one year than the Palestinians in 35 years.

Such Muslims are rare. But these are the Muslims you are looking for.
Posted by: JFM || 11/25/2003 17:18 Comments || Top||

#11  Moderate Muslim = one who hasn't attacked you. Yet.

Sorry, but if a person IS a Muslim, then that means they must follow the suras and haddiths and their Imam - who is semi-independent from any higher authority / Grand Mufti. The suras are rather mild - petty and silly, but overall, mild. The haddiths are something else entirely. Much like Old vs New Testaments - only the priority is reversed in Islam. The suras and haddiths conflict frequently. Key: All flavors of Islam (as far as I have been able to determine) declare that where conflicts occur in scripture, the later "revelation" or "response" prevails. That means the haddiths prevail - and that is where the violence and hate and lying as justified and dhimmitude and designs on world domintation and considering non-believers as cattle and [insert favorite twisted Islamic "feature" here] come from. You can apply reason and logic all you like. It's your nature. They will not. And that is theirs - per their Prophet, may bees pee upon Him.

[semi-rant]
These people you refer to as moderate Muslims are just nice moderate people - and piss-poor Muslims. And this is where I am confortable: there are good people and bad people - of every nationality, ethnicity, religion, whatever. Those secondary labels usually don't mean much as it seldom demands of them to change their fundamental nature. Islam does make that demand when there is a confrontation between Muslim and non-Muslim. And remember, Islam demands that they NOT befriend you, you filthy infidel. If you do truly feel you are their friend, what makes you so sure they are your friend? That was the eye-opener for me in Saudi Arabia. I found they were not. Those raised outside of predominately Muslim societies - or who've logged enough years outside - might just overcome some of what is demanded of them by Islam. But then we are talking about bad Muslims - or we are mistaken about them. I have a saying that I believe applies as a parallel: If you have more friends than fingers, you've miscounted one or the other. The "bad" Muslim thing may sound like I'm picking nits. We shall see, won't we? When the shit hits the fan in your hometown, in your face, then will you know. Until then, common sense demands that you keep your eyes open to the facts of their religion and be aware that how they act with you, sans other Muslims, may be quite different than how they act when there are some True Believers around. That is an interesting test for you to try, if you can manage it.
[/semi-rant]

Good luck, folks.
Posted by: .com (Abu Skeptic) || 11/25/2003 19:52 Comments || Top||

#12  Liberalhawk -- sorry, it wasn't clear what you were referring to in that bit.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 11/25/2003 20:47 Comments || Top||

#13  In addition to the lying problem, there is the problem of change. To put it simply, a person can be a moderate Muslim one day and a few days later after a little Quranic coaching from the local Madrassa, he can be a murderer. So what good was the question on the first day.
Posted by: mhw || 11/25/2003 21:01 Comments || Top||

#14  "Do you accept the validity of other religions?"

Um... how can *anyone* accept the validity of other religions? What does 'valid' mean here?

It's been my understanding that Christian don't accept the 'validity' of the teachings of Mohammed, same way that Muslims wouldn't accept as 'valid' the teachings of Buddha and so on.
Posted by: Aris Katsaris || 11/25/2003 21:30 Comments || Top||

#15  Moderate and fondamentalism - Same thing !

We do not need moderates and as your examples testifies, we are looking for "progressive" muslims, those who can and will communicate and live with other cultures. However, what truly bothers me, in the last 20 years, that is pre 09/11, is the absolute silence of the "moderates and progressive" muslims. Their silence is like a support for the chaos and human injustices accuring around the muslim dominated world.

Also, Islam is always "selling" itself as a "religion of tolerance" - I beleive that is only partly true where muslims are minorities. Name me one single muslim majority state where there truly is relgious and freedom ?

Islam, like evangelical CHristians have only one goal in mind - Convert and procelytize. How can one truly use the word peace when in his own mind, his way is the only way - Can he really listen ? can he really communicate and respect others ?

also, there are always fondamentalists in every societies yet fondamentalism intrinsect meaning is the "literal use of the scriptures" if that is so - how can one read the Quran without genuine reflexion and apply its teaching "fondamentally" witout creating war and chaos ? Is it not a religion of exclusion ? Or one that is in line with our President when he says: " you are either with us or against us ?

Islam is a very very dangerous scripture when used in a fondamentalist way - Boudism and hindouism is more prone to self inquiry and christianity has a painful history of rectification that brought about objective truths that enhanced the message of brotherhood.
Posted by: Peaceandfreedom || 06/07/2004 0:21 Comments || Top||


Iran
Iran’s Forthcoming Parliamentary Elections Up for Grabs
EFL
Siamak Namazi
So confident are Iranian conservatives three months before the country’s February 20, 2004 parliamentary elections that, in the words of one right-wing strategist, they have stopped talking about how to beat reformist candidates and begun to plan "how to run the nation.". Their optimism, which finds glum echoes in Western analysts’ predictions of a conservative takeover, is misplaced. It is too soon to call the outcome of the February vote, and too soon to conclude, as Washington hawks may have done, that Iranians’ hopes for peaceable reforms are doomed.

The prognosticators’ crystal balls proved foggy before the February 2003 nationwide municipal elections as well. While most expected a serious drop in voter turnout, almost no one imagined that so few (10 to 15 percent of eligible voters) would exercise their franchise in the major cities. In the years since the 1979 revolution, Iranians have gone to the polls in large numbers. The lowest turnout in a parliamentary contest, elections for the First Majles (Assembly) in 1980, was 52 percent. During the last parliamentary elections in 2000, a time when hope for change ran high, approximately 70 percent of voters took part. Past patterns show that people in the provinces vote in accordance with personal, ethnic, tribal and family affiliations. But as seasoned social scientists have pointed out, residents of provincial areas also tend to emulate the behavior of people in larger cities, especially Tehran. It appears that at least some residents of smaller cities were surprised that Tehranis boycotted the local council elections to such a large extent.

Iran boasts one of the youngest populations in the world, with roughly two thirds (and counting) of its people under 30, as well as one of the lowest voting ages. Men and women aged 16 and over are allowed to take part in national elections. The young flocked to voice their preferences in the two presidential elections of 1997 and 2001, as well as in the 2000 parliamentary elections, when they helped to ensure the reformist bloc’s margin of victory. During the 2000 race, the conservative Guardian Council --
an unelected body that has the power, under the Iranian constitution, to block bills passed by the Majles
threatened to subject the majority of reformist candidates to an ideological vetting process. More importantly, the reformists are increasingly concerned about conservative surveillance of their strategy sessions. Mohammad Reza Khatami, leader of the reformist party Mosharekat and the president’s brother, was quoted in the Iran newspaper saying that "we see among ourselves that all of our meeting rooms are bugged and all of our members are followed..."

The syllogism the reformists have used is not hard to understand. The hawks in Washington and Tel Aviv, they argue, believe that the Islamic Republic of Iran is a house of cards. Iranians are so frustrated with the regime, the hawks calculate, that, with a bit of encouragement, they will rise up and dispose of clerical rule. Hence, the "external enemy" can be expected to continue exerting pressure to keep the regime on a crisis footing, while sending messages of support for the Iranian people’s fight for freedom and democracy. [But if voter turnout in 2004 and 2005 is high,] the reformists’ logic continues, the Washington hawks are bound to be discredited, and the White House will be more likely to adjust its stance toward engagement and dialogue.

The reformists’ political opponents, therefore, face a challenge in deciding where their best interest lies. A dramatic fall in voter turnout will favor the conservatives’ electoral chances; the last local council elections proved that they can count on their supporters to show up, while the reformist voters stay home. Taha Hashemi, an editor of the moderate conservative paper Entekhab, puts it this way: "If the world faces a regime whose most important election — the parliamentary elections — has little public backing, it will make all efforts to settle its scores with that regime." He continues: "Some incorrectly believe that appeasing America and expediting discussions whose outcome is not known could save us from this situation. But this is wishful thinking because [the Americans] will not talk to us from an equal position based on respect." Khamenei’s own statement in October is the best evidence for the reformists’ success in emphasizing the importance of mass participation. "What is important to me in the first place is the people’s presence in the elections," he said, adding, "who makes it to the parliament is in second place."

The reformist leaders admonish prospective voters that boycotting the elections can only result in a conservative resurgence, hence risking a return to the more closed public space of the pre-Khatami days. The reformists point to the program of Tehran’s new hard-line mayor, Mahmud Ahmadinejad, who has cracked down on the formerly liberal granting of concert licenses and apparently plans to close down many cultural centers in favor of Quran recitation halls. The people’s choice, like that of the more radical reformers, might be between bad and worse, but keeping the reformist faction in power at least offers limited hope and requires minimum energy: simply turn out and vote. The message itself could be an effective one, particularly if councils in conservative-controlled cities persist in implementing policies that are unpopular with the youth.

There are rumors that military leaders affiliated with the right-wing faction will enter their names in the Majles elections. Perhaps the conservatives believe that Iranians will view military men as strong, disciplined politicians who can cut through bureaucratic red tape. The reformists are crying foul, reminding their opponents that the constitution expressly bans the presence of the military in politics. Of course, a commander who quits his post by a certain date is legally allowed to run. But, warn the reformists, such a commander might instruct subordinates to transport his former troops to the polls — giving himself a built-in electoral advantage.

The forthcoming parliamentary elections, in short, are up for grabs. Plenty of evidence indicates that Iranians are frustrated with the inability of the reform movement to overcome conservative stonewalling; indeed, this is a major reason why voter participation plummeted in 2003. If recent voting patterns hold, in February 2004 the conservatives might be able to secure most seats in about ten major cities. Still, the reformists have a fair chance of winning a majority of seats in the rest of Iran. The Seventh Majles could therefore be more pluralistic, with more factions represented and more independent MPs, but the reformist bloc would retain its voice in the legislature. Yet the addition of millions of newly eligible voters each year and the tendency for Tehran to be a model of behavior for other parts of the nation are enough to cast doubt on the reliability of previous elections as an indicator of future results.
Posted by: Lucky || 11/25/2003 12:37:58 PM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Didn't look too EFL too me.
Posted by: Bill || 11/25/2003 12:48 Comments || Top||

#2  Took me an hour. It's about half.
Posted by: Lucky || 11/25/2003 12:53 Comments || Top||

#3  note that the "reformists' pushing for high turnout in the above article are moderate followers of Khatami, who look for limited lifestyle improvements "more concert halls" and try to appeal to the hardliners on the ground that a more broadly based regime would be stronger against the West. It seems that this only adds to the reasons the genuine democrats and radical reformers have for boycotting the election, since 'the "external enemy" ...exerting pressure to keep the regime on a crisis footing, while sending messages of support for the Iranian people’s fight for freedom and democracy' seems to be their best hope.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 11/25/2003 13:21 Comments || Top||


Africa: West
Nigeria Will Surrender Taylor for Trial
Nigeria will surrender ousted Liberian leader Charles Taylor to face a war crimes trial if Liberia asks, President Olusegun Obasanjo said Tuesday. Obasanjo’s comments marked the first time he has publicly shown willingness to yield Taylor for trial. The Nigerian president has strongly resisted U.S. congressional pressure to turn Taylor over to face a war crimes indictment by a U.N.-backed court in Sierra Leone. Liberia has not yet pressed for Taylor’s return.
And they most likely won’t.
Liberia’s interim leader, Gyude Bryant, appointed under an Aug. 18 peace deal, has said he fears war-crimes trials would harm reconciliation in his war-battered country.
If Gyude, Chuck’s buddy, doesn’t win the promised election, the new government may want Chuck’s head on a platter.
Liberia’s Taylor has lived in exile in southern Nigeria since he fled Monrovia in early August, with rebels besieging the capital and international officials pressing him to go to allow a peace deal to be reached. Taylor is also blamed in much of the bloodshed in West Africa in recent years, and the U.N. indictment accuses him of backing rebels in a vicious 10-year terror campaign in neighboring Sierra Leone.
A lot of people would pay to see Chuck go to the wall.
If Liberia’s new interim government decides it wants him to face charges there, "then I believe he will understand sufficiently the need to go home," Obasanjo said, speaking in an interview at his farm north of Lagos, Nigeria’s commercial capital. Asked what he would do if Taylor resisted, Obasanjo responded, "I would persuade him."
That’s Chuck’s two-minute warning.
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 12:16:52 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  hope they let him know, then shut off the phones and power to his lil refuge mansion.... heh heh

Happy Thanksgiving Chuck!
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 12:27 Comments || Top||

#2  This really catches me by surprise. Do they get the bounty?
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 19:23 Comments || Top||


Home Front
U.S. GDP Grows at 8.2 Percent Pace in 3Q
(edited for brevity.)
The economy roared ahead at an astounding 8.2 percent annual rate in the third quarter, the fastest pace in nearly two decades and a much stronger performance than previously thought. The revised GDP, released by the Commerce Department Tuesday, was a full percentage point higher than the 7.2 percent growth rate estimated a month ago.

The new estimate, based on more complete data, reflected stronger investment by business on new equipment and software, less severe cuts in companies’ inventories and more brisk spending on residential projects. Those were the main factors behind the upward revision to third-quarter GDP, which is considered the broadest barometer of the country’s economic health.

"I think there’s a better mix of growth in this report, with capital spending being a major portion of the upward revision," said economist Ken Mayland, president of ClearView Economics. "The economy is regaining the confidence of businesses and they are stepping up to the plate and spending and investing for the future."

In other economic news, consumer confidence climbed in November to its highest level in more than a year, the Conference Board reported. The private research group’s consumer confidence index rose to 91.7 in November, up from a revised 81.7 in October. Sales of previously owned homes, meanwhile, fell by 4.9 percent in October to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of 6.35 million, the National Association of Realtors said. Even with the decline, October’s sales marked the third best month on record.

In the GDP report, the 8.2 percent growth rate — more than double the 3.3 percent pace registered in the second quarter — represented the best showing since the first quarter of 1984, when the economy surged at a 9 percent pace. Economists were predicting third-quarter GDP would be revised up, with estimates ranging from a 7.3 percent pace to an 8 percent pace.

Near rock-bottom short-term interest rates and President Bush’s third round of tax cuts motivated businesses and consumers to spend and invest more, helping the economy to move at such a fast clip in the third quarter, economists say. The next challenge is making sure the rebound is lasting. The Bush administration believes the economy is poised for solid growth and stronger job creation in the months ahead. That is politically important to Bush as he heads into the 2004 campaign. Democrats, however, blame Bush for the loss of 2.3 million jobs since he took office in January 2001 and argue that the tax cuts contributed to the record 2003 budget deficit.

For out-of-work Americans, though, it probably doesn’t feel like much of an economic recovery. Only recently has the battered labor market shown signs of improving. In October, the unemployment rate improved fractionally, to 6 percent, as the economy added jobs for the third straight month.
6% unemployment; most economists would tell you that means actually closer to 1% real unemployment as there are usually always 5% of all able bodied Americans who don’t work.Steady improvements in job creation and in capital investment are crucial ingredients for the economic recovery to be self sustaining, economists say. Analysts believe the economy will grow at a slower, but still healthy rate of at least 4 percent in the current October-to-December period as some of the stimulus provided by the tax cuts and a surge in mortgage refinancing fade.

In the GDP report, consumers continued to do their part to keeping the economy going. They boosted spending in the third quarter at a 6.4 percent rate. That was up from a 3.8 pace in the second quarter, but down slightly from the 6.6 percent rate previously estimated for the third quarter. Especially encouraging was a 18.4 percent growth rate in business investment in new equipment and software in the third quarter. That was even stronger than the 15.4 percent pace previously estimated for the quarter and up from a 8.3 percent pace in the second quarter. Spending on residential projects grew at a whopping 22.7 percent pace in the third quarter, also better than the sizable 20.4 percent growth rate first estimated and up from a 6.6 percent pace in the second quarter.
Why is this relevant to the WoT? A strong economy is always an important component in the minds of most Americans when they vote. It’s amazing to me that in two years since 9/11 we’ve bounced back so fast. Let’s pray this trend continues.

Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 11:46:21 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  That loud sound your hearing is the air coming out of the Democratic party. HA HA HA HA HA!
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 11/25/2003 11:53 Comments || Top||

#2  .16% of the revision was a smaller decrease in inventories than previously assumed. So our revision in true growth was only .84% better, not a full 1% ;)
Posted by: Damn_Proud_American || 11/25/2003 11:55 Comments || Top||

#3  Democrats, however, blame Bush for the loss of 2.3 million jobs since he took office in January 2001 and argue that the tax cuts contributed to the record 2003 budget deficit.

Of course the Dot-com burst has nothing to do with the job loss and the tax cut has nothing to do with the current GDP surge and econ. recovery (unless its a Donk president...).
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 12:16 Comments || Top||

#4  hmmm, let's see. bursting of the dot-com bubble, stock market crash, bloated state budgets drunk from surpluses, 9-11, decimation of travel, tourism & airline industries, war in Afghanistan, war in Iraq...

two years later - 'the economy ROARED ahead'

I'd say that's pretty goddam impressive.
Posted by: eyeyeye || 11/25/2003 12:45 Comments || Top||

#5  They've based their plans on bad things happening, they cheered every lost job and dead GI (rall, chomsky, krugman). Now they're being completely exposed and discredited on every front. As soon as things start looking up, they have nothing. That's what the DNC gets for handing the party over to leftist scum and radicals.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 12:45 Comments || Top||

#6  9/11 was a multi-billion dollar loss. We've had to make some drastic changes in the way we operate in this country (Homeland security et. al.), and we STILL have a significant rebound of the economy. Sounds good to me! Also sounds like the wailing and gnashing of teeth at the DNC will continue, and only increase in volume. The whine about 2.3 million jobs lost is an indirect jab at NAFTA and other trade agreements, when the real culprit is the imponderable weight of environmental and social regulation the Democratic Party has placed on the backs of business.

We're fighting a two-front war here: one against Islamofascist terrorists, and the other against the PC culture/envirofascist terrorists in our own country. We're doing pretty well against the first, but haven't even acknowledged the second as an enemy yet. THEY, rather than the Islamofascists, will probably be the ones that end up destroying this nation, and they'll do it from within.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 12:50 Comments || Top||

#7  Maybe the tax cuts had some affect on people putting money back into circulation in direct contrast to Dick Gephardt's recent comments....
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 12:57 Comments || Top||

#8  I wouldn't get too excited just yet, if you pump enough electricity into a corpse you'll get a pulse too.

When employment recovers I'll be more impressed.

Even then, this reminds too much of the '72 election. Yeah, Nixon bought his election, for all the good it did him.
Posted by: Hiryu || 11/25/2003 16:47 Comments || Top||

#9  but employment is recovering. 300K jobs have been recently added

The following are Steve Antlers points (econopundit). So far, he has been dead on.

-- The payroll survey shows 126,000 payroll jobs were added in October. We also learned today that payroll jobs have actually increased three months in a row. In today's report, the payroll survey was revised from a decrease in jobs to an increase in jobs for September (now +125,000) and August (now +35,000).

-- The unemployment rate dropped from 6.1% to 6.0%.

-- The household survey reported 441,000 jobs were added in October (the unemployment rate is based on the household survey).

-- According to the household survey, total employment is now at the highest level in U.S. history. Surpassing the high set in January 2001, right before the recession, total employment is now 138.014 million jobs.

-- The service sector added 143,000 payroll jobs, led by the health sector. Manufacturing lost 24,000, continuing a multi-year downward trend. This is essentially the only bad news in October employment report.

-- The disparity between the payroll and household employment surveys broadened in today's report. While the payroll survey reports a decline of roughly 750,000 payroll jobs since the end of the recession in November 2001, the household survey still reports nearly one and a half million newly employed workers since then.

Hiryu (the floating dragon), Give that meme titled "jobless recovery" a rest. It's done
Posted by: capt joe || 11/25/2003 17:05 Comments || Top||

#10  employment is always going to lag behind the other numbers. The jobs are coming. Look for good jobs numbers beginning of the year.
Posted by: Swiggles || 11/25/2003 17:08 Comments || Top||

#11  Why do marxists think they're such experts on a market economy?
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 18:54 Comments || Top||

#12  Why do marxists think they're such experts on a market economy?

Now that... was cold.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 19:09 Comments || Top||

#13  Economic questions that this thread triggers for me :

A. When investment money flows out of a company like AOL into a company like Grainger isn't that better for the economy?
B. With the economy on fire, won't we be able to afford new entitlements like this perscription drug thing, but isn't that what California thought about their growth of entitlements when things were good?
C. If the tax rate goes down, won't some duel income families become single income families again boosting charities in need of volunteer workers?
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 20:14 Comments || Top||


Ketchup heiress says detainees deserve POW status
Hat tip to drudge
The wife of Democratic presidential candidate John F. Kerry said yesterday that suspected terrorists held at Guantanamo Bay should be given prisoner of war status.
noted constitutional law expert and ketchup heiress
"They were captured while fighting a war," Teresa Heinz Kerry said at an informal discussion with minority activists in Seattle. "They should have the rights that other prisoners of war have had."
a declared war is different than a terror action by un-uniformed attackers hon
Heinz Kerry said that denying the detainees the protections of the Geneva Convention is "insulting, ignorant, and insensitive" to the rest of the world.
F*&k the rest of the world
She added that under President Bush, the United States, once known as the standard-bearer for human rights, is now considered a hypocrite.
by whom? the French Bwahahhaha!
"The arrogance shown by this administration on human rights and in its foreign policy is horrible," she said. Some 660 people suspected of taking part in terrorist activity are being held at the prison on the US naval base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. Many were captured in Afghanistan and Pakistan two years ago in the war on terrorism and are believed to be members of Al Qaeda or the Taliban. The Bush administration has said its top priority is interrogating the detainees for intelligence on any planned terrorist attacks. A spokeswoman for the Kerry campaign said Senator Kerry supports his wife’s position that the detainees should be given basic protections such as the right to an attorney.
If he didn’t support her she’d take all his campaign play-money away...lol
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 11:42:47 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I guess Mrs. Frenchie is trying wrap up the fringe vote while her husband flounders in the polls. I say we release all the prisoners in Gitmo and give them airfare to Boston. From there Mrs. Frenchie can have her Limo’s pick up the detainees and whisk them to her estate. They can wait there until we decide what to do with them legally. I am sure the Kerry’s know far better how to deal with Jihadis and they will become close friends. How about that Mrs. Kerry, can they live with you?

Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 11/25/2003 11:50 Comments || Top||

#2  Can't blame her. She knows her husband's behind and is just playing "ketchup."
Posted by: Sgt.DT || 11/25/2003 11:59 Comments || Top||

#3  That was slow good Sgt. DT
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 12:03 Comments || Top||

#4  While I relish the her frank assessment, I cannot say that motivation was mustered.
Posted by: BH || 11/25/2003 12:03 Comments || Top||

#5  Sounds like her Terrorist Sympathies© come in 57 Flavors.
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 12:32 Comments || Top||

#6  Actually, IIUC, we're giving the Gitmo detainees MOST of the protections POW's would get. However by not declaring them POW's we avoid a requirement to release them on some arbitrary end date to the conflict.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 11/25/2003 14:20 Comments || Top||

#7  we could easily say that we will release them when the war on terrorists is over, i.e., the 15th of never
Posted by: mhw || 11/25/2003 14:29 Comments || Top||

#8  If Americans think this through, they will see that treating terrorists like legitimate POW's only encourages soldiers to remove their uniforms and commit war crimes.
As an American soldier, I could dress up as a Syrian soldier and foul up their logistics train without committing a war crime. It is called a ruse. A ruse is fine until I don the garb of a Syrian soldier or civilian and start shooting people. That is a treacherous ruse which is a war crime.
If you treat war criminals and terrorists as if they were POW's that you will face very few soldiers in combat. Jarhead and his buddies have enough problems without follwoing Ms Heinz advice.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 20:23 Comments || Top||

#9  I've got an idea. How about Mrs. & Mr. Kerry- Heinz keep their stupid mouths shut. Both of 'em are goofballs. I say treat the prisoners like the trash they are. Feed 'em sausage and eggs every morning. Feed 'em pork chops for supper. Eat or starve to death.

When the first one dies from starvation, butcher a pig, dig a big hole, throw the worthless terrorist's body into the hole along with all the swine guts. Cover the hole up while all the other islamic trash watches.
Posted by: Danny H. || 11/25/2003 20:45 Comments || Top||

#10  SH, Heinz is going to be on the jarhead boycott list. I'll buy the shitty no-name walmart brand of ketchup from now on. Typical dumb-shit statement by pampered elitist w/no idea what-so-ever about what's going on. Her husband evidently didn't marry her for her brains. I like DH's idea, Black Jack Pershing did something similar in the Phillipines about a 100 yrs ago. Except I wouldn't waste good eggs on the rag-heads - give'em that powdered tray rat shit they give us w/some powdered milk and that old f*cking shelf-stable bread in luke warm water.
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 21:18 Comments || Top||


Korea
KCNA Blasts Rumsfeld: "Kingpin of Evil"
KCNA spokesman is in great form today:
U.S. Defense Secretary Rumsfeld reportedly slandered the DPRK as an "evil country" and an "evil regime" again during his Asian visit. It is nothing surprising that Rumsfeld talked such nonsense as he put Hitler into the shade in man-killing and war hysteria. But we can never pardon him for malignantly slandering our dignified and inviolable political system whether he is a political dwarf, human scum or hysteric. His hands are stained with the blood shed by so many people. He is, indeed, a human butcher and fascist tyrant who puts an ogre to shame.

It was none other than Rumsfeld who set out the theory of "preemptive nuclear attack," massacred innocent people in every part of the world and hurled GIs into the Iraqi war and other abysses of death. Wherever he went he sparked aggression, war and horrible disaster. It is ridiculous of such a war fanatic to talk about evil and other country’s policy. It is tragedy that he does not know he himself is a kingpin of evil. Such vituperation was let loose by Rumsfeld known to play a major role in shaping the politics of the U.S. administration at a time when Bush is talking about "written security assurances" to the DPRK. This goes to prove that the "security assurances" are nothing but a farce to deceive the DPRK. This also clearly proved that the Bush group remains unchanged in its wolfish design to unleash a new war on the Korean peninsula at any cost, far from opting to co-exist with the DPRK in peace, and its inveterate denial of the DPRK system.

If his vituperation represents the stance of the Bush administration, it can not but cast a doubt about the prospect of the six-way talks but only reinforces the conviction that there is no other way but to stand in confrontation with the U.S. to the end. And this compels us to approach with vigilance the true intention of the Bush administration clamoring for a "peaceful settlement" of the nuclear issue. The wrong way of thinking and sinister intention of the U.S. bellicose forces to detain us in the conference room and focus on mounting a preemptive nuclear attack on us behind the curtain clearly prove the justice of our decision to increase our nuclear deterrent force.
No Jung, Dear Leader or Sea of Fire, but a great rant none the less.
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 9:11:16 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  You know you're doing it right when...

"First, I want to thank Mom & Dad who taught me to call 'em as I see 'em..."
Rummy's tearful acceptance speech at KCNA's Kingpin of Evil Awards Banquet.
Posted by: .com (Abu Jealous) || 11/25/2003 9:23 Comments || Top||

#2  That'd be great if they cast Rummy in "Kingpin 2: The Sequel". He'd made a great Amish Defense Secretary!
Posted by: Dar || 11/25/2003 9:34 Comments || Top||

#3  Hmm... Wolfish Design and vituperation (I had to look that one up ) human scum or hysteric not to mention puts an ogre to shame and the classic favorite: kingpin of evil.

I give it a 7.8 on the spittle meter. Clearly NKOR is feeling the heat in the spittle race. But, as mentioned, the lack of Jung, Juice, Dear Leader, and Sea of Fire brings their score down.

Clearly Kimme-boy appeared to have dumped his previous speech writer and this one, with a little training and perhaps threats of torture can be a world class spitter.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 9:38 Comments || Top||

#4  I understand that our leaders need to be mature and professional, but I wish we could appoint a National Abuser to counter some of these guys. Nothing would give me more satisfaction than seeing an official spokesman get up and call this guy a pustulent turd-snake, or to tell the ayatollahs that we're going to sear the pubes off their faces with radiation.
Posted by: BH || 11/25/2003 9:39 Comments || Top||

#5  "sear the pubes..."

ROFLMAO! What a word picture! I nominate BH for the post of Freedom's Abu Abuser! Shit, still laughing! w00t!
Posted by: .com (Abu Abuser Wannabee) || 11/25/2003 9:59 Comments || Top||

#6  ...whether he is a political dwarf, human scum or hysteric...

I always imagine John Belushi using these as his "rant" scripts in Weekend Update...
Posted by: snellenr || 11/25/2003 10:12 Comments || Top||

#7  I've heard worse. This one is written to set the stage for rejecting the "written security assurances". I want more of that Old Commie Idealogy. I give it a 2.0 - hardly trying.
Posted by: Spot || 11/25/2003 10:16 Comments || Top||

#8  I think it's a 1 time pad.


Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 10:37 Comments || Top||

#9  *tears card in half*

Get the damned newbie off the ice. He's a disgrace to the sport.
Posted by: Ptah || 11/25/2003 11:56 Comments || Top||

#10  [holds up card] 3.5

Sigh. I had such hopes, it started well. "put Hitler into the shade" is a new one and a nice touch. But the rest was pedantic and uninspired.

Perhaps this one has been weakened by hunger?
Posted by: Steve White || 11/25/2003 16:39 Comments || Top||

#11  Boy, this is a tough house!
Posted by: .com (Abu Sympathizer) || 11/25/2003 20:02 Comments || Top||

#12  Hey, I like the idea of a Chief Spittle Spewer! We need to get George's attention, so he can appoint one. Maybe someone who had a severe dislike for James Carville, and can scream as loudly, and as vituperously as Jimmy baby would work. A Cajun would be great at the job - you should hear some of them get going when someone knocks over their boudin. I can just see Jacques Chirac's face when someone from Marksville or Ville Platte gets up and starts swearing in five languages, simultaneously.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 20:20 Comments || Top||

#13  "swearing in five languages, simultaneously"
ROFLMAO!!!

You gotta be light on your toes to even keep up, much less retort!
Posted by: .com (Abu Cajun Luver) || 11/25/2003 20:34 Comments || Top||

#14  Damn OP. That is a great idea -- especially if one of the languages is french :).
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 20:52 Comments || Top||


Home Front
California Law Allowing Illegals to Get Licenses on Deathbed
Under pressure from voters and Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger, state senators voted to repeal a law allowing undocumented immigrants the chance to get a driver’s license. The Assembly is expected take similar action Tuesday, slightly more than five weeks before the law was to take effect. The law’s prospects collapsed in the face of a threatened initiative to repeal it, and the clout of Schwarzenegger, who called the Legislature into special session to overturn the law within hours of his taking office last week.
Go Arnold!
Schwarzenegger, who campaigned against the law signed by former Gov. Gray Davis, wants a compromise version that includes more safeguards and background checks on applicants. The law’s author, Sen. Gil Cedillo, a Democrat, urged his colleagues to repeal it in the face of widespread public opposition. Though Cedillo stood by his long fight to let 2 million residents living illegally in California get licenses without providing Social Security numbers, he pledged to work with Schwarzenegger next year to find middle ground. "This is not easy," a shaken Cedillo told his colleagues before the vote. At least 17 senators who voted for the bill in September voted Monday to repeal it, while six others abstained from voting.
They counted the votes for the recall and saw their political future going into the toilet.
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 8:59:43 AM || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Excellent! Sounds like he's off to a good start--and not wasting any time, either.
Posted by: Dar || 11/25/2003 9:26 Comments || Top||

#2  On their deathbed? Sounds like Chicago.

Kinda of a misleading Head.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 10:27 Comments || Top||

#3  "You 'chukes want a license, go get one in TJ."

Good. That's all we need, illegals with valid US identification. Passports, anyone?
Posted by: mojo || 11/25/2003 11:00 Comments || Top||

#4  I had to snicker when I heard the vote. Cedillo knows now that EVERYONE is gunning for these pandering DIMOCRATS. Talk about a power shift! Score card so far: 1-Auto tax repealed and 2-ILLEGAL drivers license shot down. I think I am going to like Arnold! Anyone want to mess with our Governor?
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 11/25/2003 11:15 Comments || Top||

#5  Though Cedillo stood by his long fight to let 2 million residents living illegally in California get licenses without providing Social Security numbers, he pledged to work with Schwarzenegger next year to find middle ground.

Screw him. The California Dems were arrogant enough when they felt things were going their way and refused to compromise. NOW they squawk compromise when the tide turned against them. *tap tap* Nope, surprise meter didn't budge.

Posted by: Ptah || 11/25/2003 11:40 Comments || Top||

#6  Say! You think you can send Arnie up here to Washington state after he's done there?

Perhaps you can hire him out by the hour or legislative bill or something.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 12:22 Comments || Top||

#7  Wow - the Media Elite© said we'd never be able to turn this ship around; electing a movie star was proof that we Californians were idiots rebelling against the good judgement of our betters.....yadda yadda. David Broder (Dean of political reporters for the Wash Post) can kiss my ass. Next up? a constitutional spending cap, a bond to cover the debt til tax receipts increase with the booming economy (8% gain last quarter), and worker's comp reforms. The times they are a changing!
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 12:26 Comments || Top||

#8  The only possible problem is that there are rumblings of some sort of "compromise" in the works. NO COMPROMISES. Aside from necessary emergency medical care, illegal aliens are not entitled to anything.

Now, if only the Feds would begin rooting out illegals and deporting them in a timely fashion...
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 11/25/2003 13:02 Comments || Top||

#9  BAR---
Now, if only the Feds would begin rooting out illegals and deporting them in a timely fashion...

and get the Federal fiscal house in order, we would have our domestic problems by the short hairs.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 11/25/2003 14:07 Comments || Top||

#10  The compromise involes DOCUMENTING the UNDOCUMENTED. I like that compromise.
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 11/25/2003 14:37 Comments || Top||

#11  Repeat after me: Bracero Program

OOOOoooh! Scary, ain't it?
Posted by: mojo || 11/25/2003 15:05 Comments || Top||

#12  Bomb -- I agree 100% no damn compromises -- just ship them back to where they came from.

CyberSarge - Yes. Document them as 'DEPORTED' :)
Posted by: CrazyFool || 11/25/2003 15:16 Comments || Top||

#13  Cedillo stood by his long fight to let 2 million residents living illegally in California get licenses without providing Social Security numbers...

Now the Democrats have got to find 2 million votes some other way than the motor-voter law...
Posted by: Pappy || 11/25/2003 16:39 Comments || Top||

#14  This nutcase Cedillo needs to get a new job - in Venezuela. He'll feel right at home there.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 19:36 Comments || Top||


Africa: Southern
Commonwealth summit shuns Mugabe
Zimbabwean President Robert Mugabe has not been invited to the Commonwealth summit meeting, to be held in Nigeria. "He will not have an invitation," said Nigerian President Olusegun Obasanjo, who hosts the summit next month. Zimbabwe was suspended from the group of 52 mainly former British colonies after charges that Mr Mugabe rigged his re-election last year. Britain and Australia said Mr Mugabe should not be invited, but the hosts had the final say.
Guess they read the handwriting on the wall. Wonder if Bob will try to show up without a invite?

"Dammit! And Grace just bought a dozen new dresses for the occasion!"
Posted by: Steve || 11/25/2003 8:40:12 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I don't think Bob will be leaving anytime soon - he may not be welcome back, and can't get all the goodies out with him
Posted by: Frank G || 11/25/2003 13:28 Comments || Top||

#2  Looks like a pretty strong statement until you realize that SA told Nigeria to invite Bob and Australia pitched a fit.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 19:21 Comments || Top||


Home Front
’Buffalo Six’ Yielded ’Valuable’ Information
EFL
Six Yemeni-Americans recruited to a terrorist training camp in Afghanistan shortly before the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks have filled the government in on Al Qaeda leaders, their training methods and other topics, according to federal authorities. Since pleading guilty to providing material support to Usama bin Laden’s organization, the so-called "Lackawanna Six" have provided "substantial assistance and information deemed highly valuable" to government terrorism investigations, prosecutors said in court papers reviewed by The Associated Press. During several interview sessions lasting from two hours to full days, the men, obligated by plea deals to cooperate, detailed:
-- Al Qaeda recruiting methods, including "how to identify potential recruits from among the American population."

-- Means by which recruits were transported from their home countries to training camps abroad.

-- How recruits are indoctrinated to identify America as an enemy.

-- Descriptions of "a number of Al Qaeda leaders, trainers and recruits."
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 11/25/2003 8:20:21 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Saw a 'frontline' on these mutts a few weeks back. Not surprisingly, the entire tone of the [PBS] show was 'these guys were duped, they don't know anything, they didn't see anything, they were almost tourists, they didn't like the camp and wanted to go home', etc., etc.,. Basically frontline was implying they were completely innocent and their being in prison was a complete travesty and miscarriage of justice (of course). The 'smoking gun' proof of their innocence was that one of them asked how the Bills were doing when he was arrested. I guess to frontline, asking a question about an NFL team is absolute proof that this mutt coulndn't possibly be al qaeda.

Now they're squealing like pigs. Hmmm, I wonder if frontline will 'revisit' the show and update us on the information they are providing. Doubtful.

Frontline on the Lackawanna Six
Posted by: commo || 11/25/2003 12:00 Comments || Top||

#2  Al Qaeda recruiting methods, including "how to identify potential recruits from among the American population."

This piece of info, above all the others, is going to be the most valuable: The psychological profile of "citizens" most likely to be traitors. Not enough for pre-emptive arrests, obviously, but an extra few lines of tick marks on some list someplace that will move a "potential" suspect into the "Invoke Patriot Act provisions" category.
Posted by: Ptah || 11/25/2003 12:18 Comments || Top||

#3  Don't have them making liscence plates. Give them some stuff to translate. We've got semi-trailers to go through.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 20:27 Comments || Top||


International
UN Sanctifies an HIV Puppet
EFL & Sh*t’s and Giggles.
An HIV-positive Muppet starring in the South African version of "Sesame Street" has received an official appointment from the United Nations as a "global champion for children." The U.N. Children’s Fund, or UNICEF, says the furry puppet "has brought levity and compassion to a topic that so often evokes the opposite," according to the Associated Press. Kami, representing a 5-year-old orphan girl on the TV program "Takalani Sesame," will help advance UNICEF’s aim of ending the stigma for HIV/AIDS sufferers.
It’s too easy. Puppets, the UN, ‘weapons inspectors’.... So easy my head is spinning.
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 11/25/2003 6:43:45 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Zowie: twenty tons of off color and raunchy jokes and I can't type a one.
Posted by: badanov || 11/25/2003 8:18 Comments || Top||

#2  hmm. Can't possibly imagine where a furry hand puppet picked up AIDS.
Posted by: BH || 11/25/2003 9:25 Comments || Top||

#3  there is actually a great picture with Kofi and the current security council further down the same page.
Posted by: capt joe || 11/25/2003 9:52 Comments || Top||

#4  I can remember when Elmo used to make appearances on The Frugal Gourmet. We can only hope for such good face time for Kami!
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 11/25/2003 9:58 Comments || Top||

#5  "uses a furry puppet to bring levity to AIDS" sounds like the description of a bad act at "Amateur Night at the Laff Stop".
Posted by: snellenr || 11/25/2003 10:25 Comments || Top||

#6  Ugh--now they've got Chinese burglars purposely injecting themselves with HIV to scare off cops! Hat tip: Drudge.
Posted by: Dar || 11/25/2003 10:34 Comments || Top||

#7  Thank you, HIV-positive Kami, for helping us laugh at AIDS.

Do you suppose she will teach the other puppets to insist that the puppet man wear a rubber glove before shoving his hand up their a$$?
Posted by: BH || 11/25/2003 10:39 Comments || Top||

#8  BH - LMAO. Good one.
Posted by: Jarhead || 11/25/2003 11:02 Comments || Top||

#9  BH: SCORE!
Posted by: Ptah || 11/25/2003 11:22 Comments || Top||


Africa: East
UN assesses security in Eritrea
The UN has launched a security assessment of its operations in the far west of Eritrea after two bombs exploded destroying aid trucks. There have been no casualties reported but this is the biggest in a series of explosions in Tesseney on the border with Sudan.
Perhaps there is a coincidence between where the explosions took place and the proximity to the Sudanese border.
No organisation has yet claimed responsibility for the attacks - though previous attacks in the area have been blamed on a Jihad terrorist group.
That would be Harakat al-Jihad al-Islami or the Eritrean Islamic Jihad. They have ties to al-Qaeda dating back to the Sudan days and the Eritrean government claims that the Sudanese are still supporting them despite the pious denials from Khartoum that they’ve gone out of the terrorism business. They kill aid workers and the like, but generally seem to have a level of confidence rivaled only by Hek’s boyz in Afghanistan.
The bombs went off on Friday evening underneath two trucks carrying World Food Programme aid. Five minutes after the drivers left their vehicles, devices detonated under each vehicle. Both were extensively damaged and a large amount of the food destroyed. Tesseney is a town on the border with Sudan and has been the site of a number of explosions in recent weeks.
Fancy that. It's on the border with Sudan...
A truck near a petrol station and a cafe teashop were both targeted - though there have been no casualties in any of the attacks. The Eritrean government has played down the significance of the spate of bombings - blaming it on localised arguments and quarrels and said they were not unduly concerned by them. This is part of the country where the Eritrean Islamic Jihad group are thought to operate. It is only three hours walk from Kassala in Sudan - and though the border is closed it is still extremely porous. In April, a British geologist was brutally killed while prospecting for gold in the nearby countryside. The Eritrean government blamed it on the Islamic Jihad group with backing from the Sudanese government. Tesseney is the Eritrean base for refugee repatriations from the Sudan so it has a significant UN presence. They are now despatching a security team to assess what measures they should take in response to the bombs.
No doubt that’ll teach ’em, a UN security team. Anyways, this stuff taking place right now even in obscure parts of the world may seem to indicate that the recent terror offensive is a lot better coordinated than many pundits seem to think.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 11/25/2003 12:55:05 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  The Eritrean government has played down the significance of the spate of bombings - blaming it on localised arguments and quarrels and said they were not unduly concerned by them. translates into "please, Mr. International Community don't abandon my country."

I think we can rule out government concern for the possible negative effect on thetourist industry.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 4:20 Comments || Top||

#2  Doesn't Glenn Reynolds work for the University of Tesseney?
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 9:24 Comments || Top||

#3  I wouldn't put much faith in UN assessment of anything.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 11/25/2003 12:52 Comments || Top||

#4  The UN has launched a security assessment of its operations in the far west of Eritrea after two bombs exploded destroying aid trucks.

Run away, run away! Phewww! That was close!
Posted by: Steve White || 11/25/2003 15:12 Comments || Top||

#5  Are we SURE the United Nations isn't a wholly-owned subsidiary of France?
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 18:04 Comments || Top||


Somalia "banana war" leaves 8 dead
At least eight people were killed and over 10 wounded in heavy fighting which broke out in the southern coastal town of Marka. The fighting - between the Sa’d and Ayr subclans of the Habar Gedir — was concentrated in and around Marka and the town of Shalaanbood, 17 km northwest of Marka. According to a local aid worker, the clashes were triggered when Yusuf Muhammad Indhaade, the commander of an Ayr subclan pro-Transitional National Government militia, imposed taxes on goods imported or exported through Marka port. Sa’d businessmen, opposed to the move, sent in their militia and took over a checkpoint in Shalaanbood manned by Indhaade’s militia "and then proceeded to attack Marka", he said. "They were planning to export huge quantities of bananas to Arab countries, and therefore wanted to take control of the port. This is all about bananas and money. You can call it a banana war. But neither side is in control of the port," the aid worker added. The fighting, which broke out on Saturday, had now subsided, but Marka was said to be "very tense". The Sa’d militia had reportedly lost two battle-wagons (technicals) and a Landcruiser. Meanwhile, the two sides had withdrawn from the town and were said to be waiting for reinforcements, he said.
"Yar. We be waitin' fer reinforcements! Then y'r gonna get it! Harrr!"
All businesses were closed in Marka on Monday, with residents expecting more trouble, a local businessman told IRIN. "We are waiting for the inevitable resumption of the fighting." The violence also arose from disagreements over the formation of a new administration for the town, with the Sa’d opposing "any administration involving Indhaade", the businessman added.
"'Cuz they're ucky. Prob'ly infidels, too."
Meanwhile, Habar Gedir clan elders in Mogadishu have reportedly begun serious mediation efforts towards ending the violence in Marka, local sources said.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 11/25/2003 12:48:38 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Um... at least they're not fighting about religion?
Posted by: Hyper || 11/25/2003 0:56 Comments || Top||

#2  Technically speaking, all banana trade wars are banana splits.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 4:23 Comments || Top||

#3  This is all about bananas and money
Isn't it always so.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 7:25 Comments || Top||

#4  Sa’d businessmen, opposed to the move, sent in their militia and took over a checkpoint in Shalaanbood

Give them a little credit. At least they didn't send in lawyers.
Posted by: badanov || 11/25/2003 8:20 Comments || Top||

#5  I foresee no end to this conflict since both sides can grow their own banana clips.
Posted by: Dar || 11/25/2003 9:20 Comments || Top||

#6  I thought old man Banana dies last week?
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 11/25/2003 9:31 Comments || Top||

#7  No Chuck, That was old Dr. Young.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 18:49 Comments || Top||

#8  Somewhere in the world there is some idiot at a computer pondering whether banana peels can be a less destructive alternative to landmines... oh sorry, that was me.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 19:18 Comments || Top||


Caucasus
Russia, US planned peaceful Shevardnadze exit
Russia and the United States, rivals for control over the Caspian Sea’s enormous oil wealth, forged a pragmatic alliance to ensure a smooth transfer of power in turbulent Georgia, diplomats and analysts said. They said Moscow and Washington had agreed their own interests were best met by engineering a peaceful exit for long-time President Eduard Shevardnadze, weakened by weeks of mass protests over general elections marred by fraud. Russia feared a fresh bout of turmoil on its sensitive southern border could allow militants to step up attacks on Russian forces in rebel Chechnya. The United States was concerned prolonged political unrest could disrupt construction of oil and gas pipelines that cross Georgia to bring Azerbaijan’s huge energy reserves to Western markets via Turkey.

With thousands of people massed outside parliament demanding Shevardnadze resign or hold new elections and the threat the increasingly embattled president could call out the army, a transatlantic strategy – born of coalescing interests – emerged from a flurry of high level phone calls. "Thanks to a more flexible policy, Russia has set down a marker in Georgia by becoming a sort of political patron to the opposition now in power," said Igor Bunin, head of the Moscow-based Institute of Political Technologies. "This is almost certainly a result of a compromise agreement of some sort with the United States."

Moscow, the former imperial power, was irritated when US advisers were sent to Georgia to train and equip the ex-Soviet state’s dilapidated armed forces to deal with Chechen militants using the lawless Pankisi Gorge as a base for attacks on Russia. The co-operation, portrayed by Washington as part of its war on terrorism, further extended US influence in the Caucasus region, traditionally Moscow’s "back yard" but a key element in the strategy of the energy-hungry United States.
Ohfergawdsake. Is everything "all about oil"?
A Western diplomat said Washington had not put pressure on Moscow to ensure calm heads prevailed in Georgia, but said US national security advisor Condoleezza Rice had contacted her Russian counterpart to discuss the deepening crisis. Russian President Vladimir Putin sent his foreign minister, Igor Ivanov, to Tbilisi at the weekend to mediate, prompting a timely call from US Secretary of State Colin Powell. "Secretary Powell spoke with Foreign Minister Ivanov after he arrived in Tbilisi," the Western diplomat said on condition of anonymity. "Before he met Shevardnadze, Powell called Ivanov." The diplomat said Washington stopped directly communicating with Shevardnadze two days before he quit, but kept channels open with other government officials and the increasingly bold opposition.

Russia’s stake in a peaceful resolution of the Georgian political crisis was spelt out by independent Moscow analyst Vitaly Tretyakov: "If the authorities again prove weak in Tbilisi, it can only mean one thing for Russia – more sources of conflict in the Caucasus region in which Russia will have to intervene in one way or another." Georgia is dependent on cut-price Russian oil and gas. The planned pipelines across Georgia would not only provide millions of dollars for empty state coffers, but offer the energy-poor state an alternative source of supply – from a US ally. But for the Russian daily Kommersant, Moscow’s pragmatism aimed to send a clear signal to Georgia’s would-be rulers: "The United States is far away while Russia is very near and it is worth taking this into consideration."
Posted by: Dan Darling || 11/25/2003 12:45:51 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I would have to imagine that if we could engineer and maintain oil relationships with the murdering islamonazis, we can certainly find a way to do the same with the far less insane Russians/Georgians. Then we can tell the sand boxed oil ticks to go fuck themselves.
Posted by: ISLAM SUCKS || 11/25/2003 1:24 Comments || Top||

#2  This article concentrates on the oil but doesn't touch on America's interest in Georgian stability with respect to international terrorism.

The pipeline project has been going on for quite some time without any American interference until we got involved in Afghanistan.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 4:39 Comments || Top||


Attack on Chechen Interior Minister
Chechen Interior Ministry spokesman Ruslan Atsayev reported on Sunday that a bomb went off two or three meters behind Satuyev’s car when it was crossing the intersection of 8 March Street and Saikhanov Street in Grozny’s Oktyabrsky district. The deputy interior minister and the police officers traveling with him sustained only minor cuts and bruises. A tentative report suggests that the bomb, a radio-controlled landmine made from a 122-millimeter artillery shell, was planted on the roadside. Investigators have started the work at the crime scene and the search for those responsible for the attack is in progress. A car carrying Oktyabrsky district chief Col. Adlan Takayev hit a landmine in the same district one day earlier.
This could be Abu Walid and the Islamic International Peacekeeping Brigade after the recent tape al-Jazeera or yet more random violence in Chechnya.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 11/25/2003 12:43:58 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:


17 hard boyz iced in Chechnya
Russian commandos in Chechnya killed 17 armed militants during a reconnaissance operation southeast of the republican capital Grozny, the federal headquarters at Khankala said today. Fierce clashes occurred during the night near the village of Serzhen-Yurt, some 30 km from the city. Four federal troops were wounded in the exchange, the Itar-Tass news agency reported.
Serzhen-Yurt was Khattab’s old stronghold, according to ICT. Sounds like his flunkies still go back to the old lair every now and again.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 11/25/2003 12:40:32 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


Africa: North
U.S. Extends Libya Travel Ban
The State Department on Monday extended a ban on the use of American passports for travel to Libya but also suggested that recent positive actions by Libya could prompt changes in the 22-year-old policy.
Oh, damn. And I just got tickets...
Disclosure of the one-year extension came in the form of a note from Secretary of State Colin Powell that was published Monday in the Federal Register. If Powell had not acted, the prohibition would have lapsed Monday night. The ban was adopted in 1981 and has been renewed annually on grounds the Libya, because of its hostile relations with the United States, is unsafe for travel by Americans. But Powell departed this year from normal practice by saying that the State Department will review the restriction every three months while it is in effect. Asked for an explanation,
"Yeah! 'Splain yourself, Ricky!"
department spokesman Richard Boucher noted that Libya earlier this year had fulfilled requirements imposed by the U.N. Security Council after it held Libya responsible for the 1988 bombing of Pan Am flight 103.
There’s the carrot, Qaddafi, be a good boy and reach for it.
The Libyan action restored the country’s standing at the United Nations. Boucher said Libya’s more forthcoming attitude ``may be a potentially positive indicator of an improved security situation for American citizens who might wish to travel to Libya.’’ The extension of the ban came four days after the State Department warned Americans against any travel to Libya in defiance of the travel ban. The warning cited ``evidence of hostility to the United States in some segments of the population and some elements of the Libyan Government.’’
"Because they still got some nut-jobs running the place, that’s why!"
Posted by: Steve White || 11/25/2003 12:22:35 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Our caution may be related to the dissident that made a recent trip to Libya and came back with a whole lot of cash.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 4:33 Comments || Top||


East Asia
China’s Premier Urges U.S. to Curb Taiwan
Sure, we’ll get right on it. EFL.
BEIJING (AP) - China’s premier says the United States must recognize the danger of the Taiwan president’s ``separatist agenda’’ and oppose any effort toward formal independence for the island. Premier Wen Jiabao, in an interview with The Washington Post published Sunday, also said his country does not want ``excessive and long-term’’ trade surpluses with the United States.
"And in thirty years we’ll run a trade deficit with you guys. See how fair that is?"
Wen called Taiwan the ``most important and sensitive issue’’ in Sino-U.S. relations. He said Beijing wants peaceful unification with Taiwan, but he insisted that Washington abide by a commitment not to increase weapons sales to the island, which has been ruled separately since 1949.
"Marvin, how do we handle this one?"
"Mr. Secretary, I don’t see the problem with our arms sales."
"But now we’re going to sell missile frigates and AWACS to Taiwan, whereas fifty years we were selling them rifles!"
"Mr. Secretary, the total number of parts on the invoice is the same. One rifle then, one F-18 today."
"Ah, very good, Marvin."

Wen’s comments came amid unusually bellicose rants warnings from China about a push by Taiwanese President Chen Shui-bian for a new constitution and a law on public referendums. Beijing asserts that those are meant as steps toward declaring formal independence, which the communist government warns could prompt China to attack the island. ``I hope the U.S. government will recognize the gravity and danger of the provocative remarks and actions taken by the leader of the Taiwan authorities ... and that the U.S. side would not send any wrong signals,’’ Wen was quoted as saying. ``The U.S. side must be crystal clear in opposing the use of a referendum or writing a constitution or all other tactics used ... to pursue his separatist agenda.’’
This is a little more than the usual run-up to the Taiwanese election.
Posted by: Steve White || 11/25/2003 12:17:21 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I still say it's hard to invade when millions of starving NorKs are streaming across your border and since you've had some bad crops years, will have to import wheat and other staples to feed your own. Do you really want to bite off more than you can chew?
Posted by: Anonymous2U || 11/25/2003 0:47 Comments || Top||

#2  They've been de-facto independent since Chang led 'em over there in what, '49?

The PRC just doesn't want 'em *saying* so. It's all about face.
Posted by: mojo || 11/25/2003 0:58 Comments || Top||

#3  Actually one of the problems with high tech arms transfers IS the possibility of China invading Taiwan or Taiwan acquiecing to China' and readmitting itself back. If that happens, high tech like that found in our Arleigh Burke destroyers, Patriot missile systems, and god knows what else will find its way into Chinese hands very quickly. Its a damned if you don't and damned if you do situation.
Posted by: Val || 11/25/2003 5:23 Comments || Top||

#4  A successful, reasonably democratic Chinese country on the doorstep of the PRC is as much of a threat to China as a democratic Iraq is to the black hats.
Posted by: whitecollar redneck || 11/25/2003 9:21 Comments || Top||

#5  Actually one of the problems with high tech arms transfers IS the possibility of China invading Taiwan or Taiwan acquiecing to China' and readmitting itself back.

I agree. In addition, there's the risk that the Taiwanese military is jam-packed with Chinese spies, which means that anything we hand over to the Taiwanese may find its way into future Chinese weapons designs. Note that some Taiwanese remain Chinese nationalists, in the manner that not all Americans were supporters of the American revolution in 1776. These individuals would be targeted by China's spy recruiters, and in some cases, might even volunteer their services to Beijing. The fact is that the Taiwanese education system has continued teaching the traditional Chinese curriculum, which considers Vietnam, Korea, Burma, Mongolia, Siberia and parts of the Central Asian 'stans (basically every square foot of land the Manchu dynasty ever stepped on) to be Chinese territory.

The basic point is that Taiwan is not the UK - it is an ally, but unlike the UK, has very different interests from ours. It is in our security interests to prevent Taiwan from becoming part of China, but that's about the extent of the relationship. Apart from our security ties with them, Taiwan's attitude towards the US is kind of like France's (based on my survey of Taiwan's English language press).
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 11/25/2003 15:50 Comments || Top||


Africa: East
Terror attacks in Horn of Africa disrupted
Also noted in the evening edition of Instapundit yesterday. EFL.
U.S. forces have disrupted several planned terrorist attacks against Western and other targets in the Horn of Africa and local authorities have killed or captured more than two dozen militants, the U.S. general in command of an anti-terrorism task force told The Associated Press. Of the hundreds of foreign fighters detained by U.S. troops in Iraq, approximately 25 percent come from the seven countries that fall under the purview of the Combined Joint Task Force-Horn of Africa, Marine Brig. Gen. Mastin Robeson told AP in his first in-depth interview since taking command in May 2003. Robeson said suspected terrorists from Tanzania, through the Horn of Africa, all the way to southern Egypt and Saudi Arabia are working with each other to promote radicalism. ``There are three issues here: there is transnational terrorist networking, at large, there are specific cells planning terrorist attacks, and there’s the recruiting, training and shipping of foreign fighters into Iraq,’’ Robeson said Saturday night at his headquarters on a former French Foreign Legion post in Djibouti.
Where’s the Legion: off eating croissants?
``They are down here training and recruiting,’’ he said. ``They are trying to create numbers and what we want to do is prevent them from creating numbers.’’ U.S. officials in the past have said at least five senior al-Qaida terrorists with close ties to Osama bin Laden live in the Horn of Africa. Robeson said initial estimates were too low. ``A year ago, it was basically thought that there were probably five to seven, maybe 15, depending on who you talk to,’’ Robeson said. ``There have already been 25 captured or killed, and now it’s in the hundreds of named people that we and host nations would like to find and talk to preferably in Bagram or Gitmo.’’ Robeson said his job is to empower governments in the region to stop terrorism by helping them improve their militaries, police, coast guards and intelligence services. His troops also help the governments fight poverty through humanitarian projects. All the governments - with the exception of Somalia, which doesn’t have any government whatsoever a central government - are fully cooperating in what Robeson said is a long-term effort that will take years to complete.
'Nother words, the locals see us as a goody basket...
He said that just as attacks have increased elsewhere in the world, the Horn of Africa also faces a growing problem. ``There are more terrorist threats, right now ... than has ever been listed in this region,’’ he said. ``The increase in the attacks that you see in Iraq and Afghanistan are parallel here. The difference is we have been successful here with host nation partnerships at disrupting those plans.’’
My guess is that it's more a recruiting ground for cannon fodder — lots of ignorance to be preyed upon in the area — than it is an operations area.
``I think we have frustrated the terrorists,’’ Robeson said. ``Mission success does not necessarily only resonate in how many people we either capture or kill, because when we put them on the move, they’re now out of their comfort zone and they are vulnerable.’’
Hard to be a terrorist when you’re always looking over your shoulder.
The 1,800 troops permanently based in Djibouti work throughout the region and are establishing a model for future operations that will depend more on intelligence and less on firepower. The focus is on helping poor countries stop terrorism before a massive U.S. military intervention, like the invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan, is required. ``We like to use the analogy that if Iraq and Afghanistan were an apple and an orange, we’re a Volkswagen,’’ he explained. ``Our mission is pure and simply to help host nations control their own destiny.’’
This man sounds like he knows the job.
Posted by: Steve White || 11/25/2003 12:11:20 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Where’s the Legion: off eating croissants?

Aren't they in the Ivory Coast?
Posted by: Paul Moloney || 11/25/2003 0:40 Comments || Top||

#2  There were legionaires there at the base when my ship stopped in Djibouti in 91.
Posted by: Super Hose || 11/25/2003 4:29 Comments || Top||

#3  Steve, if nothing else the Legion is definitely not a bunch of wussies, nonetheless they are still bound an oath to the French govt, which means the PANSIES in office tell them where to go and die.
Posted by: Val || 11/25/2003 5:19 Comments || Top||

#4  In Harar, Ethiopia there are an alarming number of Wahhabi starting religious schools. I have seen them myself while on a visit. Given the poverty and illiteracy in Ethiopia they are likely to gain significant ground.
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 11/25/2003 7:25 Comments || Top||

#5  Camp Lemonier was an abandoned FFL base that was taken over by the Americans at the same time as the Iraq invasion. Google for Joint Task Force-Horn Of Africa (JTF-HOA). It's worth checking out: interagency, international, joint, military, successful. Looks like they are still getting things done.
Posted by: Chap || 11/25/2003 8:14 Comments || Top||

#6  yes, the ivory coast has a much better croisant recipe.
Posted by: capt joe || 11/25/2003 9:39 Comments || Top||

#7  yes, the ivory coast has a much better croisant recipe.
And the cocoa's better, too.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 11/25/2003 13:00 Comments || Top||

#8  I remember when the Lefties in my circle asked me how countries like Eritrea and Djibouti could help out the Coalition of the Willing in WOT. (They're not France and Germany!) Now we know.
Posted by: Michael || 11/25/2003 16:33 Comments || Top||

#9  Laugh Peasants, but the French are the best pastry cheefs in the world! I mean there is no compare.
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 18:52 Comments || Top||

#10  I mean jeez... ever try to impress a gal with a fake Waloon acent?
Posted by: Shipman || 11/25/2003 18:54 Comments || Top||



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Two weeks of WOT
Tue 2003-11-25
  Zarqawi was pivot man for Istanboom
Mon 2003-11-24
  Pakistan declares ceasefire in Kashmir
Sun 2003-11-23
  Shevardnadze resigns
Sat 2003-11-22
  Car boomers target Iraqi police, 12 dead
Fri 2003-11-21
  Binny in Iran?
Thu 2003-11-20
  Istanbul boomed again
Wed 2003-11-19
  50 killed in Somalia festivities
Tue 2003-11-18
  Istanbul bombing mastermind fled to Syria
Mon 2003-11-17
  John Muhammad: Guilty.
Sun 2003-11-16
  Shia leader held over Azam Tariq killing
Sat 2003-11-15
  Explosions rock Istanbul synagogues
Fri 2003-11-14
  Former CAIR Director Sentenced
Thu 2003-11-13
  House-to-House Raids in Saddam Hometown
Wed 2003-11-12
  24 Italians dead in Nasiriyah boom
Tue 2003-11-11
  New Afghan Operation Under Way


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