Having sex with corpses is now officially illegal in California after Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger signed a bill barring necrophilia, a spokeswoman says. The new legislation marks the culmination of a two-year drive to outlaw necrophilia in the state and will help prosecutors who have been stymied by the lack of an official ban on the practice, according to experts. "Nobody knows the full extent of the problem. ... But a handful of instances over the past decade is frequent enough to have a bill concerning it," said Tyler Ochoa, a professor at Santa Clara University School of Law who has studied California cases involving allegations of necrophilia. "Prosecutors didn't have anything to charge these people with other than breaking and entering. But if they worked in a mortuary in the first place, prosecutors couldn't even charge them with that," Ochoa said on Friday.
The state's first attempt to outlaw necrophilia, in response to a case of a man charged with having sex with the corpse of a 4-year-old girl in Southern California, stalled last year in a legislative committee. Lawmakers revived the bill this year after an unsuccessful prosecution of a man found in a San Francisco funeral home drunk and passed out on top of an elderly woman's corpse. The new law makes sex with a corpse a felony punishable by up to eight years in prison.
#1
You'll note that it took TWO YEARS for them to decide that sex with the dead was, in fact, a BAD thing, and was NOT, as many had assumed, just prejudice against the "differently-alived".
From correspondents in Tehran 08sep04 A PAIR of Iranian-born twins who were conjoined from the neck down has died after a 14-day fight for life, hospital officials in Iran announced tonight. Everyone kept telling the Iranian doctors not to try and separate them ... but would they listen? Nooooooooooo!
The boys were born to Afghan parents on August 24, with their two heads cramped onto a single torso. "Yesterday, they started to have serious cardiac and respiratory problems, and despite the efforts of doctors they died this morning," said Nahid Hashemi, an intensive care nurse at Mashhad's Gaem hospital in north easte Iran. Medical tests revealed the presence of two hearts feeding the same arterial system, four lungs, two spinal columns and two stomachs. The pair was also given names - Ali and Ashgar - while their impoverished refugee father appealed for international help and advice, admitting he had no idea what to do with them. The father, Jafar Mahmoudi, also said his wife was so disturbed that she had tried to commit suicide on two occasions since the delivery.
As the LLL forges its way toward the next election and resistance stiffens, I thought this little item from the most trusted name in major media, the Weekly World News, might help maintain morale and lift spirits (I prefer gin or scotch). It gives us yet another excuse to lampoon, mock, belittle, and otherwise abuse the accursed French (not that we need any more).
THE NEWEST beauty fad to hit Parisian modeling runways is long, luxurious nose hair. Gorgeous supermodels showing off this season's fashions are also sporting a pair of soft tresses that start inside their nostrils and reach their waistlines. "It's very happening, very now, very hip," says French designer Yves St. Mauron. "Soon, every woman will have luscious nasal locks running down the front of their blouses."
[Insert booger joke here]
The look, called Proboscis Pigtails, is achieved by gluing lengths of synthetic strands high inside the nasal cavities. The Pigtails come in all colors and can be cut to fit a woman's preferences. "Some gals chop it to chin length because they don't like nose hair in their lunch," says St. Mauron. "For a special night out on the town it's fun to attach four or five piggies together and have them trail along on the ground. I wouldn't recommend this look if there will be dancing involved." The snoot extensions are inexpensive and available in most beauty supply stores. The starter pack includes a tube of special fluid that dissolves the adhesive. " Never, never yank the piggies out without using the solvent," warns St. Mauron. "It hurts like hell. Trust me. My eyes are still watering."
-- By BECKY TODD
Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy ||
09/11/2004 5:26:20 AM ||
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WWN - We have an experienced reporter who may be looking for a new position soon. Do you have any openings?
Posted by: CBS News ||
09/11/2004 16:05 Comments ||
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I'm trying to figure why Venezuela, which literally has money squirting out of the ground, would need any assistance from us...
President Bush on Friday ordered a partial cut in U.S. assistance to Venezuela because of its alleged role in the international trafficking of women and children for sexual exploitation. The action means the United States will not support $250 million in Venezuelan loan requests expected to come before international lending institutions during the next fiscal year, a State Department official said. If Venezuela secures sufficient support from other governments, its loan requests could be approved without U.S. backing.
Bush took the action under legislation that calls for sanctions against countries that fail to crack down on international trafficking in persons. The legislation is designed to encourage countries to take decisive action against the practice. Bush's decision was announced in a White House memorandum to Secretary of State Colin Powell. Left intact were programs designed to monitor Venezuelan elections and to support political party development, part of U.S. efforts to promote democracy worldwide. It is official U.S. policy to carry out these activities on a nonpartisan basis, but Venezuela complained this year that the U.S. program in that country favored groups that supported the recall of President Hugo Chavez. Chavez won the Aug. 15 recall referendum by a wide margin.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Anonymous5089 ||
09/11/2004 8:17:03 AM ||
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WTF! We're sending money to an OPEC country? Why? We're sending money to Fidel's best budd in the hemisphere? Why?
Posted by: Mrs. Davis ||
09/11/2004 10:15 Comments ||
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EFL - Bush orders sanctions against one of our most critical oil suppliers while gasoline prices are high just prior to an election. Does that mean that he really cares about human rights? I wonder if he will get credit.
President Bush on Friday ordered a partial cut in U.S. assistance to Venezuela because of its alleged role in the international trafficking of women and children for sexual exploitation. The action means the United States will not support $250 million in Venezuelan loan requests expected to come before international lending institutions during the next fiscal year, a State Department official said. [...]
Posted by: Super Hose ||
09/11/2004 12:29:54 AM ||
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President Bush on Friday ordered a partial cut in U.S. assistance to Venezuela..
Er, why are we "assisting" them? We already buy a lot of their oil, so...
By Chris Hogg - BBC Taiwan correspondent Friday, 10 September, 2004, 09:10 GMT 10:10 UK
Three men in Taiwan have been charged in connection with the shooting of President Chen Shui-bian, according to investigators. The men were arrested following the discovery of homemade bullets similar to those used in the attack last March. A spokesman for the task force investigating the shooting said the men had been charged with weapons offences. But police could not yet prove they were involved in the attack itself, the spokesman said. Investigators believe that Taiwan's president and vice-president were shot on the eve of the presidential election with homemade bullets fired from a replica pistol, which had been altered to fire live ammunition.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Zenster ||
09/11/2004 3:18:27 AM ||
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The sports punting firm Centrebet has been taking bets on the outcome of the federal election for a year now, but it was on Thursday night that it saw the biggest surge in new flows of money. "There's been a huge move in the last 24 hours due to what happened in Jakarta," reports the firm's sports betting manager, Gerard Daffy. "As soon as the news got out, we probably took $70,000 to $80,000 in bets for the Coalition." That's an increase of 20 per cent on the total cumulative value of all election bets that the company has taken in the past year. And what of new money on Labor's prospects? "We took half a dozen small - and I mean small - bets for less than $1000 total on Labor. So most punters out there think the election has firmed for the Coalition." The odds on a $1 bet that John Howard would win shortened from $1.45 to $1.30, while the chances of Mark Latham winning blew out from $2.60 to $3.20, according to Centrebet's odds. And the betting system's track record as a predictor of federal election outcomes? Since it began taking such bets in 1993, it has a perfect record of picking winners, says Daffy.
SNIP - The rest is mostly Leftist seething while trying to maintain a veneer of 'balance'. FWIIW My reaction was for the first time Mark Latham (Opposition leader) came across as a statesman, whereas normally he comes across as a thug whose IQ is about the same as his collar size (Its funnier in metric).
Posted by: phil_b ||
09/11/2004 8:28:02 AM ||
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EFL. Juicy parts only. Rather Defends CBS Over Memos on Bush
By Howard Kurtz
Rather said that CBS's lead expert was Marcel Matley of San Francisco, a member of the National Association of Document Examiners who has taught, lectured and written about his field, testified in numerous trials, and consulted for government agencies. Matley said last night that a "60 Minutes" executive had asked him not to give interviews. The Dallas Morning News cast fresh doubt on the documents by reporting last night that the officer named in one memo as exerting pressure to "sugarcoat" Bush's military record was discharged a year and a half before the memo was written. The paper cited a military record showing that Col. Walter "Buck" Staudt was honorably discharged on March 1, 1972, while the memo cited by CBS as showing that Staudt was interfering with evaluations of Bush was dated Aug. 18, 1973. Picked that up, did they. Wonder when the Dallas folks will get the Rather Barnes connection established. It would sell a lot of Sunday papers.
The White House is raising doubts for the first time about the documents' authenticity. "I think there's a big question mark, like major news organizations are suggesting," communications director Dan Bartlett said last night. "Obviously, we saw see the same things that other people are pointing out now. But at the time, I had every reason to believe that a major news organization had authentic documents." Killian's widow and son have also questioned whether the documents are real. Some CBS employees, who asked not to be identified while questioning their bosses' actions, expressed concern that the network had issued only a terse statement Thursday, when the authenticity of the documents was first questioned and until yesterday had refused to name any of the experts it had consulted or provide an on-the-record spokesman. One staff member, who has examined the documents but did not work on the "60 Minutes" piece, saw potential problems with them: "There's a lot of sentiment that we should do an internal investigation."
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Mrs. Davis ||
09/11/2004 8:33:48 AM ||
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But Rather cautioned that the memos become less clear as they are downloaded and photocopied.
I wonder if he thinks they get distorted each time someone downloads them.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
09/11/2004 10:30 Comments ||
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RC, of course because CBS has to 'rescan and replace' the original PDF file each time someone 'takes' it by downloading.
Posted by: CBS News ||
09/11/2004 16:03 Comments ||
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It's out of Rather's hands now, the CBS corporate mouthpieces have it, and Dan is following their instructions. Vigorously defend your unwinnable position re the forgeries, so that we can say we were innocent dupes.
The lawyers aren't concerned with Dan, he's gone already. They're trying to disconnect CBS from the disaster.
Now we also hear that in an interview with The Los Angeles Times, Marcel B. Matley, CBS' document examiner "said he had only judged a May 4, 1972, memo â in which Killian ordered Bush to take his physical â to be authentic. He said he did not form a judgment on the three other disputed memos because they only included Killian's initials and he did not have validated samples of the officer's initials to use for comparison."
The only expert cited by CBS in this case,Marcel Matley, wrote in the September 27, 2002 issue of the journal, "The Practical Litigator":
In fact, modern copiers and computer printers are so good that they permit easy fabrication of quality forgeries. From a copy, the document examiner cannot authenticate the unseen original but may well be able to determine that the unseen original is false. Further, a definite finding of authenticity for a signature is not possible from a photocopy, while a definite finding of falsity is possible.
Emphasis added.
Posted by: Frank G ||
09/11/2004 19:42 Comments ||
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Let me throw one other little nugget onto the pile...has anyone noticed that this happened after some top Clintonistas (I'm specifically thinking E.T.Gollum Carville and Begala) joined Lurch's campaign? Neal Boortz discussed the Hillary scenario on his site a while back, laying out why he thinks Slick and the Hildebeest want SKerry to lose: if Lurch wins and gets reelected in '08, Breck Girl Edwards becomes the far-and-away frontrunner for the Donk nomination in '12. Does ANYONE think that ol' Piano Legs wants to wait until 2016??
Posted by: Ricky bin Ricardo (Abu Babaloo) ||
09/11/2004 19:59 Comments ||
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"Does ANYONE think that ol' Piano Legs wants to wait until 2016?"
Nope. And the outlook for Hillary isn't any better if Kerry turns out to be a one-termer, either: Kerry would very likely turn out to be such a disaster as President-- Jimmeh Carter redux-- that it would be a long, LONG time before another Donk makes it to the White House.
If the Clintons still have any pull in the party, I can't see them allowing Kerry to win.
Posted by: Dave D. ||
09/11/2004 20:18 Comments ||
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One point arguably supporting the Clinton scenario is that CBS/Kerry (what's the difference?) didn't really vet the documents, to put it mildly. As biased as CBS is, it's hard to believe they would not have vetted documents handed to them by some guy off the street. On the other hand, if the documents came from a trusted source...
Posted by: Matt ||
09/11/2004 20:49 Comments ||
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"On the other hand, if the documents came from a trusted source...
Just one more crouton to toss on the salad - let's don't forget that Terry "the documents are real, and if they aren't, it's a Karl Rove plot" McAuliffe was installed as DNC head by the Clintons. As the wise man said, "never mind the wizard...watch the man behind the curtain!"
Posted by: Ricky bin Ricardo (Abu Babaloo) ||
09/11/2004 22:18 Comments ||
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EFL and for the safety of those who do not wish to puke
John Kerry linked U.S. assault weapon sales to worries about terrorism Friday and said President Bush was bowing to the National Rifle Association by not pushing to keep alive an expiring ban. If Bush is serious about fighting terrorism, the Democratic presidential candidate said, he would extend the 10-year ban on sales of 19 kinds of semiautomatic assault weapons, due to expire on Monday. Nothing like waiting until the Saturday before the Monday deadline to make political hay out of this. And oh, by the way, weren't you admiring and holding one of the banned weapons earlier this week, Kerry? The hypocrisy is astounding.
"In the al-Qaida manual on terror, they were telling people to go out and buy assault weapons, to come to America and buy assault weapons," Kerry said. "Every law enforcement officer in America doesn't want us selling assault weapons in the streets of America," Kerry said. "But George Bush, he says, 'Well, I'm for that.'" You're right Kerry, he DID say that! Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Chris W. ||
09/11/2004 9:53:16 AM ||
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Hello, UFOOL. You slept restlessly last night. Tossing, turning, and... well, you know. Could be the self loathing. Headquarters says that's more common then one would think...
Posted by: The Mossad ||
09/11/2004 12:06 Comments ||
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#20
The ban was directly aimed and executed towards legal gun owners, gun shows and those with FFLs. It didn't reduce crime one iota that I (or the FBI Bureau of Crime Statistics) could see. I deserves to die and be forgotten.
Though it isn't surprising to see Kerry roll out the old 'Scare Tactics'.
Jack.
Posted by: Jack Deth ||
09/11/2004 22:00 Comments ||
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#21
I guess this means I'm finally going to be able to get clips of greater than 10 rounds for my plinkers.
It's going to be a tin can massacre, I tell you.
#23
DC, better get your anti-American @ss out of our country before we arrest and prosecute you for treason -- I bet you were one of the 4000 Zionists who were warned not come to work at the WTC on 911.
#24
S, I am at home, my Serbian mother was born here and unlike Zionist Jews like you I am assimilated. "I am not an American citizen of Jewish faith. I am a Jew. I have been an American for sixty-three years, but I have been a Jew for 4000 years." - Rabbi Stephen S. Wise (1933)
#25
muck4doo, warm her up and fly on by, the more the merrier -- a little over an hour ago one JDL Air Farce dive bummer circled twice and waved good bye.
Say, was that you just now, white with red wing tips?
#26
muck4doo, warm her up and fly on by, the more the merrier -- a little over an hour ago one JDL Air Farce dive bummer circled twice and waved good bye.
Say, was that you just now, white with red wing tips?
(CNSNews.com) - The liberal media watchdog group Fairness and Accuracy in Reporting (FAIR) has defended the authenticity of the CBS News "60 Minutes 2" documents that were at the center of a news segment questioning President George Bush's service with the Texas Air National Guard in the early 1970s. "The arguments I have seen for these documents being fake seem pretty thin," Jim Naureckas, editor of FAIR's bimonthly magazine "Extra," told CNSNews.com. Gee, guys, we have Naurekas's word for that, it must be true.
Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy ||
09/11/2004 2:04:23 AM ||
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Ok, Rantburgundians, we have a great opportunity. I have an ancient Remington typewriter, a 60s vintage ribbon, and I think I can find some similarly ancient typing paper. Armed with this and a scan of Lee Harvey Oswald's signature, we can quickly produce compelling evidence that Dan Rather was the gunman on the Grassy Knoll. It would be better in every respect than SeeBS's Bush doc. The only difference: it is not supported by the authority of big media.
#2
The documents are completely, obviously, fake to anyone who has any understanding of basic reality. It's a testiment to the utter dementia of the LLL that they even try to defend such a transparent fraud.
#3
They live in a parallel reality. How about giving them some area to thrive and deport them there en masse. Titan? Europa! That would be to their taste. They can hallucinate there, "From Each According to Their Ability and to Each According to Their Needs."
#4
When you base all your defense on the fact you hate G.W.B. you come up with crack pot crap like FAIR does. I suggest they lay off the wheat mold. CBSs' "expert" is a slime ball and isnt qualifed to even comment on the type face let alone any other part of the 'documents" except the signature. I am waiting for the DNC and moveon.org to self imolate when this forgery comes back to bite them in the ass.
Posted by: Trolling for Allan ||
09/11/2004 6:23 Comments ||
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TfA, doubt that, they would just recite in chorus: "We are not sinking, we are not sinking", to the last second. BDS and denialitis may be, sad to admit, incurable.
#6
Either this guy, and Rather, and all the other defenders of the docs are completely clueless, or they are trying to bluff their way past the crisis. Either "knaves or fools" as the old saying goes.
Posted by: V is for Victory ||
09/11/2004 7:56 Comments ||
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#7
I watched CBS news last evening and saw Dan Rather's piece attempting to clear the air on the possible forgeries. What a load of journalistic dishonesty that was. No analysis of the document showing if it was/wasn't possible to create such a doc in 1973 (kerning, fonts, point sizing, variable proportional spacing (vs. 1X, 2X, 3X spacing of a highend Selectric).
There was no mention of the 100% correlation of an MS Word document to the forgeries. Instead he interviewed a hand writing expert who said the docs are real w/o mentioning any methodology. Rather did mention the superscript, small font "th" and said it was in other legitimate docs, then cut away to a doc that DID NOT have the superscript, just a regular "111th". There was no mention that the docs do not match timelines (Staudt was retired). There was no mention of Killian's family member disputing the Killian wrote the docs. No mention of Killian's commander, Retired Maj. General Hodges, stating CBS MISLEAD HIM in stating the docs were HANDWRITTEN by Killian, and now thinks the docs are a fraud. No mention of Barne's daughter stating her father told her several weeks ago he was going to LIE about GWB's Guard service.
Rather's jist of it: All is in order. If CBS discovers anything, we will let you know. Who are you going to believe? Me or your lying eyes.
After watching Rather's gross whitewash, I actually felt DIRTY.
Posted by: ed ||
09/11/2004 8:06 Comments ||
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#9
I think I saw your memo noting that Dan Rather was on the glassy knoll, right, Lee Harvey?
Posted by: Frank G ||
09/11/2004 9:37 Comments ||
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#10
The 'expert' Rather used was a hand-writing guy who was also an expert in "Paleography"....... or cave-wall paintings. Good expert choice considering we are dealing with fonts.
Killian signature scans are here: http://www.aboutpolitics.net/images/killian.jpg
Notice all the verified documents use fixed space fonts, like a typewriter, to type his name and rank. The disputed docs use proportional fonts, like MS Word.
Posted by: ed ||
09/11/2004 10:06 Comments ||
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#12
Yes, it's true, Frank, Rather was positioned just behind that funny-looking wall on the knoll and he got off the famous head-shot. Then he humped over to the CBS van to try to grab the Pulitzer Prize but that eluded him. You may use this message as evidence, it's as good as what they have on Bush.
#15
CF, most of us here were charter members of AOL and the boss was reportedly an early investor. There is a whole new wing being built here for AOL developers and techies when they start to arrive.
#16
Yo, Lee, what'd you think of the movie JFK? Who taught Costner that shitheel southern accent?
Posted by: Matt ||
09/11/2004 11:51 Comments ||
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#17
I know that FAIR leans left and they sometimes drink the koolaid too quickly; However, I have seen time on the site where they bash all equally. That being said I think that they are WAY off base withthe memos. Not only is the coomposition suspect, the content is full of questions. The fact that NOBODY that served in the TANG was questioned about the content is really strange. Trust me, if Lt Bush was a pain, the ENTIRE Squadron would know it. They couldn't find one Officer to confirm that Lt Bush was a slackered? Also the the Col mentioned in one of the memos was retired a full year before the memo was written. And why would a Commander order an Officer to take a physical 3 months early? If it were a Commander directed drug test he would not have called it a pysical. Also when you get a Commander directed (as I have) they Commander has someone accompany you DIRECTLY to the lab. There is no waiting period.
#20
#10Â The 'expert' Rather used was a hand-writing guy who was also an expert in "Paleography"....... or cave-wall paintings.
Um, actually paleography is the study of ancient handwriting and related matters. Just for what it's worth. And, as a paleographer myself, I think the signatures on the two Killian documents that everyone is talking about are quite different--not that my expertise is worth all that much here.
CBS's credibility is toast. And the media have become the story themselves during this election. Whoda thunk it?
#21
The documents are fake. We know it, Rather knows it. McCauliffe knows it. So why?
Kerry is in meltdown. His internal polling probably sees exactly what Time is seeing. His base is fading. The down ballot is is jeopardy.
His campaign is out of control and everybody nobody is in charge. Kerry can't even talk to the press for fear of somebody saying Merry Christmas?
This dirty trick has been kicking around the lower staff for a few weeks. Campaign is desperate to get something out there to put GW on defence, anything to try and fire up the ABB base. So somebody waves a couple of photocopies in front of a 60Min staffer and whispers "smoking gun".....
As Rather himself is saying, it's not important whether these particular memos are authentic, they just add to the story. Bush was AWOL. Even Howard Stern believes that.
And you see why MM is so popular in DNC circles. Wonder if he can type?
Posted by: john ||
09/11/2004 22:48 Comments ||
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EFL from CNSNews.com
The Second Amendment Foundation is blasting ABC News for "distorting the facts" in a report that aired on Wednesday evening, Sept. 8. The segment opened with footage of a 1997 North Hollywood bank robbery, in which the robbers fired fully automatic weapons. The report by ABC News Correspondent Bill Redeker suggested that such firearms would be legal when the assault weapons ban expires at midnight on Sept. 13. The gun used in the bank robbery had been illegally modified, the Second Amendment Foundation said, "yet ABC News left the impression that such rifles will be available to the general public."
"ABC's research on this story was either incredibly poor or deliberately distorted," said SAF founder Alan Gottlieb. "It's the same distorted reporting we saw in 1994, prior to the ban, in which the press faked footage in an attempt to portray ammunition from these guns as explosively lethal." The Second Amendment Foundation also complained that reporter Bill Redeker highlighted certain cosmetic features affected by the 1994 legislation. He said that folding stocks make "assault rifles" more "concealable" and the flash suppressor makes it harder to spot a shooter at night.
"These cosmetic features have nothing to do with how a particular firearm functions or how lethal it might be," Gottlieb said. "That is why the 1994 ban -- which only affected the appearance of these guns, not their operation -- was nonsense to begin with.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Super Hose ||
09/11/2004 12:42:47 AM ||
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Problem for MoveOn is the Bush has PUBLICLY said that if the ban is renewed, he will sign it.
Pissed off a lot of Gun Owners of America members.
#2
Heavens, you mean MoveOn forgot to include that in their ad?
Posted by: Steve White ||
09/11/2004 0:59 Comments ||
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#3
What's amusing is that it's legal to own the fully automatic versions of alot of these 'banned' weapons. Gun control is the Left's way of turning citizens into serfs.
SUVs and guns don't kill people; people kill people.
So, passing laws to prohibit second amendment rights only affects law abiding citizens.
Posted by: Capt America ||
09/11/2004 1:47 Comments ||
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#5
Actually, OldSpook, I'm afraid that that WILL backfire on us, because one of these days a AWB may (probably?) will be passed and then the president would be forced to sign or break his promise, and I'd rather see him do the latter ...
Posted by: Edward Yee ||
09/11/2004 12:03 Comments ||
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#6
Bush is an idiot on guns. So what? He's an idiot on most things. We like him for the WoT, so we hold our nose and vote for him *despite* things like the AWB, runaway spending and No Child Left Behind.
As for the Anti-Gun crowd, they'll have a lot of explaining to do next week when the world doesn't end. Me? I'll be waiting in a long line to buy an MP5...
#9
Um what makes anyone think that a real patriot obeys laws that are patent violations of the Bill of Rights? Show me where the Bill of Rights allows congress to regulate common firearms. Thats right you can't. The AWB is illegal no matter what SCOUTUS says. The millions of citizens that have built their own "assult weapon" from parts is not reported. Hand Gun Control Inc The Brady Campaign are so discredited they did change their name. Teddy Kenedy has killed more people than any gun I own ever has, Yes even the "assult weapons."
#10
President Bush is anything but an "idiot" on guns, passing the Concealed Carry law in Texas as Governor.
He's not gonna let the AWB expire only to sign another one.
As far was I'm concerned, armed citizens are our front line of defense against a terrorist attack here at home and I'm sure the President thinks so, too.
And I like just about everything the President's doing, not just aggressively pursuing the WOT; that's why I can't wait to vote for him again--for the fourth time (2x for Gov, 2x for Prez).
The Former Texas House Speaker Ben Barnes' recollections over how he helped President Bush get into the Texas Air National Guard during the Vietnam War have evolved over the years from fuzzy to distinct. Barnes, who once claimed he did not help Bush enter the National Guard, reversed his story and told CBS News 60 Minutes that he in fact did help Bush. Mr. Barnes daughter, Amy Barnes called the Mark Davis Show and spoke with guest host Monica Crowley on WBAP September 9th dismissing Barnes' claims as political and opportunistic.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Steve White ||
09/11/2004 12:28:10 AM ||
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What the hell is it going to take to force CBS to stop stonewalling, and investiagte these documents thoroughly (as in inverviewing ALL the poeple, not jsu those who have an axe to grind, or whom CBS misled)- or at least reveal the sources of the documents?
How do citizens bring to heel a huge corporation that has run amok, disregarded factuality, disregarded inaccauracies, disregarded otuside experst providing contrary information, and disregarded calls for them to investigate thier own work?
What can we do to bring Dan Rather and CBS News to justice?
#2
We live in a capitalist democracy. Time to start writing short, respectful, well-phrased letters to 1) the Viacom CEO 2) the Viacom board 3) major advertisers on the CBS Evening News and 4) major advertisers on 60 Minutes. Something along the lines of "I won't fact time watching news programs that report forgery as basic truth, so I won't catch your ads about your product." Advertisers do listen.
Posted by: Steve White ||
09/11/2004 0:58 Comments ||
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#3
Can someone generate up a list of CBS news advertizers so we know who to boycott?
If you can generate the list, I will email it to somone who will put it up.
#4
Can someone generate up a list of CBS news advertizers so we know who to boycott? If you can generate the list, I will email it to somone who will put it up
The following were sponsors of the CBS Evening News with Dan Rather on 10 September 2004. In light of CBS and Rather's use of forged documentation in a old story that had been discredited months ago, if anyone is interested in letting their advertisers know you are displeased with the direction they are funneling their advertising dollars, I present this list. Each has a website listed and where possible, I located the immediate corporate parent company of each. Most of these sites have a "Contact us" button near the bottom of the screen.
Lamisil (www.lamisil.com) Parent company is Novartis Consumer Health (www.novartis.com)
Levitra (www.levitra.com) Parent company is Bayer (www.bayer.com)
Lifesavers Candies (www.candystand.com) Parent company is KF Holdings (www.kraftfoods.com)
SmartBalance Popcorn (www.smartbalance.com) Parent company is Good for America Brands (www.gfabrands.com)
Viagra (www.viagra.com) Parent company is Pfizer Pharmaceuticals (www.pfizer.com)
Vioxx (www.vioxx.com) Parent companty is Merck & Co. Pharmaceuticals (www.merck.com)
Cheerios cereal Parent company is General Mills (www.generalmills.com)
Marshall Fields (this might have been a local Chicago ad) Parent company is Target (www.target.com)
PrevAcid (www.prevacid.com) Parent company is TAP Pharmaceuticals (www.tap.com)
Plavix (www.plavix.com) Parent company is Bristol-Myers Squibb (www.bms.com)
Benefiber (www.benefiber.com) Parent company is Novartis Consumer Health (www.novartis.com)
Viagra (2nd ad) (www.viagra.com) Parent company is Pfizer Pharmaceuticals (www.pfizer.com)
by Joekur on 2004-09-10 20:49:43
#5
What can we do to bring Dan Rather and CBS News to justice?
Caveat: I'm not a communications law expert . . . Nonetheless, the abuse of the public privilege to broadcast will likely have to be addressed by some governmental agency -- there's not going to be a private cause of action for such a public venture. My guess is that no agency will pursue this, due to purely political considerations.
However, the family of Lt. Col. Jerry Killian has been personally wronged by all this. I would guess they have standing to pursue some private cause of action to address these wrongful actions of CBS -- probably something like:
Extreme and outrageous conduct Conduct that is so outrageous in character, and so extreme in degree, that a reasonable member of the community would regard the conduct as atrocious, going beyond all possible bounds of decency and utterly intolerable in a civilized community.
Whether that particular cause of action is available to them depends on the laws of the state in which they live. If they sued, they could then seek discovery of a lot of stuff . . .
#6
I may have found a way - over in another thread for the legal aspects of this here at Rantburg
Basically CBS is caught between thier source violating Dept of Defense rules/laws regarding retention of personal documents, and violation of the copyrights of the Estate of LTC Killian in retaining the documents without permission of the estate (i.e. his son and wife).
#9
Why stop with only the advertisers on CBS News & 60 Minutes, why not send letters to anybody who advertises on CBS?
Posted by: Lurks Often ||
09/11/2004 22:52 Comments ||
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#10
Hi, Old Spook:
Check http://www.rightnation.us there are a few huge threads with lists of info regarding sponsors(addresses, phone numbers, faxes, names of execs, etc) for CBS, ABC, NBC, Fox, CNN and others.
Jack
Posted by: Jack Deth ||
09/11/2004 22:58 Comments ||
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#11
badanov's list needs a carryover to tomorrow and monday for widest distribution!
#12
Thanks for the list of cbs news advertisers, at first I emailed them but decided to call also using their 1-800 numbers and speak to a live person. I think I was able to make my point about the companies good names being associatd with the lies on cbs and reminded them that I expected them to pressure cbs to be truthful if they want me to buy their products
AUSTIN, Texas - (KRT) - The man named in a disputed memo as exerting pressure to "sugar coat" President Bush's military record left the Texas Air National Guard a year and a half before the memo was supposedly written, his own service record shows. An order obtained by The Dallas Morning News shows that Col. Walter "Buck" Staudt was honorably discharged on March 1, 1972. CBS News reported this week that a memo in which Staudt was described as interfering with officers' negative evaluations of Bush's service, was dated Aug. 18, 1973.
Guess the Kerry staffer who wrote the memo thought that retired vets had a lot to do with personnel matters.
That added to mounting questions about the authenticity of documents that seem to suggest Bush sought special favors and did not fulfill his service. Staudt, who lives in New Braunfels, Texas, did not return calls seeking comment. His discharge paper was among a packet of documents obtained by The Dallas Morning News from official sources during 1999 research into Bush's Guard record. A CBS staffer stood by the story, suggesting that Staudt could have continued to exert influence over Guard officials. But a former high-ranking Guard official disputed that, saying retirement would have left Staudt powerless over remaining officials.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Steve White ||
09/11/2004 12:20:54 AM ||
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#1
I think within two days this will all be done. From what I've seen so far, a major hit piece was blown up. I can't wait to see what names are named.
Retired Maj. General Hodges, Killian's supervisor at the Grd, tells ABC News that he feels CBS misled him about the documents they uncovered. According to Hodges, CBS told him the documents were "handwritten" and after CBS read him excerpts he said, "well if he wrote them that's what he felt." Hodges also said he did not see the documents in the 70's and he cannot authenticate the documents or the contents. His personal belief is that the documents have been "computer generated" and are a "fraud".
Posted by: Steve White ||
09/11/2004 12:13:51 AM ||
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Posted by: Super Hose ||
09/11/2004 0:44 Comments ||
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#2
Love the response of Michael Medved:
Michael Medved, host of a nationally syndicated radio program and a media critic, believes that if the documents are proven false, it may mean the end of Dan Rather's career.
"I honestly believe that if this continues to go the way it's going, it could mean the end of Dan Rather's illustrious career," Medved told CNSNews.com.
Medved called the potential that the documents were forged "absolutely shocking."
"What is most shocking about it is [CBS News] didn't have ready at hand -- some kind of immediate memo that said this is how we authenticated, this is how we documented," Medved said.
"The fact that they haven't issued anything like that just is a stunning admission of journalistic malfeasance," he added.
Posted by: Steve White ||
09/11/2004 1:01 Comments ||
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#3
Man oh man oh man... There isn't just blood in the water! This is downright Biblical! The water itself has turned to blood!
But the nagging question remained: Could an IBM Selectric Composer have been used to produce these documents?
I found my answer the same place everybody finds everything these days: Google. Typing "IBM Selectric Composer" into that search site took me to the aptly named ibmcomposer.org, which describes itself as "the only site on the Internet completely dedicated to the IBM 'Selectric' Composer line of typesetting machines." The site, which is run by Gerry Kaplan, includes information, scanned user manuals, and photographs of the only working IBM Selectric Composer I've been able to find. And, fortunately for me, it also includes an e-mail address.
When I first heard back from Gerry, I felt a little bad for having bothered him. He'd been fielding calls and letters all day, he told me, including an inquiry from CNN. But he was a trouper, willing — enthusiastic even — to help out.
And the experiment follows. RTWT, it's wonderful.
Posted by: Chris W. ||
09/11/2004 12:00:00 AM ||
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#1
I especially liked the part about how a superscript gets made. I've got a BIG picture in my head of a non-typist Lt. Col. going through that just to write himself a note. Not even close to passing the horselaugh test.
#3
The DailyKos joker has been spinning like a veritable dervish on this issue, claiming that an IBM Executive typewriter, a model C or D, could do all the things necessary to produce a Killian memo: superscript a smaller 'th', do proportional spacing, get the line spacing as shown, and center the headings as shown. He also thinks that a 'real man' like Col. Killian wouldn't have touched the typewriter himself, but would have had an office 'girl' do it for him.
I rather doubt TANG had 'office girls', more likely a clerk-typist of some kind. I also suspect that plenty of officers would type at least some stuff themselves, and personal memos about politically-charged situations would fit that bill.
But someone here in Rantburg has or had an IBM Executive typewriter -- any comment on whether it could do all this stuff?
Posted by: Steve White ||
09/11/2004 2:03 Comments ||
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#4
I couldn't help but notice the address for the 111th FIS has P.O Box 34567. Seems 'curious', but could be valid. I wonder if it appears on any other documents.
#5
For me, the comparisons posted on LGF are a slam dunk. Game over. It would have to be virtually magic to get the exact same font, letter pacing, line spacing, centering, etc. from a 1972 typewriter (of ANY make or model) and from a computer program (using defaults!) from more than 30 years later. From what I saw today, (please correct me if I'm wrong) none of the caable networks have repeated Charles' and others' simple experiments. A graphic showing the CBS version next to the Word version, followed by a merge of the two for an overlay, ought to be enough to convince everyone but the KoolAid drinkers.
#6
PBMcL, to me the most telling comparison was at the link from this post: the comparison of the letter heads for Memo 1 and Memo 2 were exact when laid across each other. Only a PC could do that.
Posted by: Super Hose ||
09/11/2004 3:07 Comments ||
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#7
SH - good point. Also, Steve, someone should remind Kos and the other dervishes about Occam's Razor. Except the point probably wouldn't get through since they're in full hands-over-the-ears Felix Unger mode. (Lalalalalalalala...)
#8
Brit Hume did indicate that one of the Fox producers tried the experiment using Microsoft Word, and *gasp* getting an exact copy, spacing for spacing, superscript for superscript, forgery for forgery
The spinmeisters now decry critiques of the documents, and BEG us to attend to the message. Uh huh.
#10
Kos makes one fair point: that given the reduced nature of the PDF files made available by CBSNews, one can't do the detailed analysis required (e.g., really close examination of the fonts, exact line spacing etc) to prove or disprove Charlie Johnson's ability to create an exact clone of the memo using MS Word. That's fair, we need a really clean, MAGNIFIED copy of the original memo to do that.
Now, what are the odds of CBSNews doing just that?
Posted by: Steve White ||
09/11/2004 3:29 Comments ||
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#11
Steve I don't agree, the LGF experiments are definitive. No way to get the high degree of match from two machines with completely different designs unless one was specifically designed to duplicate the other. Even if the machines had the same font type, size, and a proportional spacing mechanism, there are still many degrees of freedom that would cause mismatches.
Posted by: V is for Victory ||
09/11/2004 8:23 Comments ||
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#12
Assuming Charles printed his recreation of the memo on a 300dpi printer, the "original" and the recreation match to within 1/300th of an inch. Differences around the edges are attributable to lens effects within the copier used to "age" the CBS memo.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
09/11/2004 10:16 Comments ||
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#13
...Martha McCallum at FNC reproduced the memo in a taped bit Friday afternoon and it took her about ten minutes. I LOVED it.
On the other hand, the 'It-doesn't-matter-if-they're-forgeries-we-hae-to-answer-the -questions-they-raise" message has finally nauseated me to the point where CBS is finally, utterly, and completely off my TV, the same way CNN was last year after the revelations came out about how they had known about Saddam's atrocities, but refused to discuss them for fear of losing access.
Boycotts aren't a bad idea, but the fact remains that in today's day and age, so many companies are intertwined that an effective boycott is all but impossible. On the other hand, television and radio are uniquely susceptible to simply being turned off - and nothing gets an advertiser's attention as quickly as discovering that their message isn't being heard because people don't trust the guy giving it.
Mike
Posted by: Mike Kozlowski ||
09/11/2004 12:51 Comments ||
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#14
I expect that with a even a second generation copy an expert could tell you which typewriter (if any) made the document. Metal type is unique to each machine. The FBI used to have some whizzes at this, I expect it's a lost art tho.
#6
out of action so the Viacom stockholders won't hear the tally...hmmmm
If you have any shareholder-related questions, please contact Viacom's Investor Relations Department at 1-800-516-4399.
Posted by: Frank G ||
09/11/2004 9:39 Comments ||
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#7
If you're trying to get a message to CBS CEO Moonves, try this:
http://www.rightmarch.com/091004a.htm.
There's a suggested letter, but it's slightly out of date. It doesn't include Rather's lame attempt to to justify his actions last night nor that his handwriting expert, Marcel Mately, has been identified.
I modified most paragraphs and added this one: Dan Rather's Friday night attempt to debunk the debunkers failed. Do you truly believe that Marcel Mately, the handwriting expert, is both qualified and unbiased to fully evaluate the authenticity of these suspect documents? His assertions that copies of the memos critics are examining have been degraded by reproduction though photocopying, computer scanning and faxing
and thus are not reliable representations of the memos is ludicrous. CBS should consult someone who understands the typography behind modern word
processing and is not blinded by ideology as Rather appears to be.
By Cristina Arzadon - Inquirer News Service
Updated 06:12am (Mla time) Sept 11, 2004 LAOAG CITY, Ilocos Norte, Philippines -- The Marcos family observes former strongman Ferdinand E. Marcos' 87th birthday today by highlighting his military career and war exploits."Regardless of the constant and well deserved criticisms... he was a (soldier) who stood up for plundering his country and in the process, got 27 medals. That's revisionist history. It cannot be changed, amended or verified erased in any manner," family spokesperson Lito Gorospe said. Marcos critics have long maintained that the medals were for non-existent war exploits. An exhibit of some 100 photographs of the late dictator, including his 27 medals, will be unveiled today at the Ilocos Norte Capitol lobby. "The most decorated war hero of the US was war hero-turned-1960s Hollywood actor Audie Murphy. He received 27 medals, including the congressional medal of honor. Our Marcos got 27. I'm sure Murphy's ghost is whomping @ss on Marcos' shade right about now.
He served himself by raping his country and served poverty to it well. Let's not dwell on the fact that he was a record-level thieving president. (He was also) an exemplary soldier of fortune who rapaciously looted the country," Gorospe said. Marcos' shoe-hoarding widow Imelda Marcos has allowed the viewing of pictures of the late president as a soldier and commander-in-chief of the Armed Forces of the Philippines. Isn't it about time they jailed that greedy sow?
Gorospe noted that Marcos gave himself received the medal of valor-the highest medal the government can give to a soldier and equivalent to the United States' congressional medal of honor.
What continues to be a frozen issue is when Marcos would finally be buried. Some "chilling" humor from the article's author.
The late strongman's remains are kept inside a refrigerated crypt in his hometown of Batac. This year, only Mrs. Marcos will play host to the annual traditional program at the capitol grounds since the Marcos children are abroad. Ilocos Norte Gov. Ferdinand Marcos Jr. and Rep. Imee Marcos reportedly accompanied their children for school enrollment in the US and UK, respectively, while Irene Marcos-Araneta had a speaking engagement abroad. Sounds like the kiddles are trying to put some distance between themselves and dear dead old dad. Marcos looted his country and retarded the entire nation's progress by decades. Beyond that, he entrenched graft riddled, corrupt military and law enforcement bodies that haunt the Philippines to this day.
Although a plague in all other respects, at least the communist New People's Army did everyone a favor by blasting the face off of Marcos' 30 meter high bust in his home province of Ilocos Norte. The ruins of this self aggrandizing monument are now a big tourist draw. That Marcos or his wife still remain popular in any respect is a searing indictment of how the Philippines' fixation on glamor and wealth continues to cripple it even now.
#1
As an aside, there were some truly ferocious anti-Japanese occupation Phillipine fighters back then. I knew one, who had been a 16-year-old boy with a machete, who would hide up in a tree and take out an entire Japanese patrol, single handedly. He was later "adopted" by a US unit, made it to the US and enlisted. When I knew him, he was a very old CSM, held in high esteem by all.
From CompassDirect
Iranian police invaded the annual general conference of Iran's Assemblies of God Church yesterday, arresting at least 80 church leaders gathered at the church's denominational center in Karaj, 20 miles west of Tehran. Without warning, a large number of policemen surrounded the church's garden property yesterday morning, bursting in to arrest all the men and women present at the first day of their annual meetings. "The police came from everywhere," one Iranian Christian said, "and there were a lot of them."
"Every single person present was put under arrest, blindfolded and taken in for interrogation," an Iranian source confirmed to Compass today. The detained Christians were driven around blindfolded for several hours so they would be unable to understand where they were being taken. Reportedly each individual was questioned separately by security officials, who had a specific list of questions. The interrogation revealed that the authorities had very precise information about each person, including his or her activities, relatives and other personal data.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Mike Sylwester ||
09/11/2004 10:18:01 AM ||
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#1
As I suspected, the only real "debate" is over whether they should use a few really big rocks or lots of smaller ones while stoning these Christians to death. This is yet another reason to decap the mullahs right away.
And the world says Israel is racist cuz it wants a Jewish state. A state, mind you, where Christians and Moslems have the SAME rights of assembly and worship as do Jews, including the right to elect their own representatives.
#3
PlanetDan, you've got it all wrong. Please try and remember that to all Arab nations, the state of Israel does not exist. Therefore, how could they possibly even have such things as equal "rights of assembly and worship?" I hope this clears things up for you.
An Egyptian wedding feast turned to tragedy when the bodyguard of one of the guests accidentally killed him with a celebratory burst of gunfire and then committed suicide. Mohammed Abu Okail, a member of Egypt's Consultative Council, or senate, was gunned down in the village of Abis, 190km north of Cairo, police said. When the party was in full swing, bodyguard Ali Suleiman began to let off a traditional volley of gunfire, killing Mr Abu Okail in the process. On realising what he had done, he let out a hysterical cry of grief and shot himself in the head. Celebratory gunfire is common throughout the Arab world, and dozens of people are killed in Egypt every year by stray bullets.
#1
hen the party was in full swing, bodyguard Ali Suleiman began to let off a traditional volley of gunfire
Maybe it's time to join civilization and abandon that tradition...
(Of course, this COULD have been a very, very clever assassination.)
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
09/11/2004 19:51 Comments ||
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#2
How long have these wackos had guns? 150 years? Can a tradition like this really be established that fast? Or are they just indoctrinated in a wacko culture and religion?
Posted by: Mrs. Davis ||
09/11/2004 20:07 Comments ||
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#3
Ah another "bad islamic wedding accident" So sad...
Posted by: Trolling for Allan ||
09/11/2004 20:09 Comments ||
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#4
Were they celebrating before or after he was killed?
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut ||
09/11/2004 20:22 Comments ||
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Friday, 10 September, 2004, 19:12 GMT 20:12 UK
Material has been found still intact inside the crashed Genesis space capsule, say Nasa scientists. Experts said on Friday they hoped the mission to gather solar wind particles could still be largely successful. "We should be able to meet many, if not all, of our primary science goals," said physicist Roger Wiens of the Los Alamos National Laboratory. Wednesday's crash-landing in Utah has been blamed on a faulty battery. The precise nature of the particles could tell scientists how the Sun and the planets grew out of a huge cloud of gas and dust 4.5 billion years ago. Examinations, using torches and a mirror on a stick, revealed that much of the sample canister inside the wrecked capsule had remained intact. The inner canister contained several disks which had been collecting atoms from the Sun. Recovery lead engineer on the project, Don Sevilla, said they had some "serious compromises due to contamination". "However, we do have our collectors and there is science to be gained from this cargo," he added. He said the latest news contrasted with the "demoralised" feelings on the Genesis team earlier this week.
Earlier it had emerged a faulty battery was one of the likeliest causes for the crash. The battery was designed to detonate explosive charges that would release the craft's parachutes, helping to slow its descent to Earth. It was then supposed to be caught in midair by a Hollywood helicopter stunt pilot. Instead, the parachutes failed to open and the capsule struck the ground at the Air Force's Utah Test and Training Range, southwest of Salt Lake City, at 310km/h (193mph). The 205kg (420lbs) capsule was taken to a specially built clean-room at the nearby US Army Dugway Proving Ground. The $260m Genesis mission was launched in August 2001. It is the first mission to collect cosmic material for Nasa since the Apollo 17 launch in 1972.
Posted by: Zenster ||
09/11/2004 3:09:17 AM ||
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#1
Let me get this straight - they were going to have to do a helicopter pickup worthy of "Fear Factor" because a parachute impact would have destroyed the material, and now it's survived pancaking in at terminal velocity? Talk about overdesign!
I'd wager it's this kind of "overdesign" that landed Americans on the moon so many times. The skyhook proceedure was necessary to provide a maximum guarantee of little or no terrestrial contamination of the samples and not (so much) to cushion the touchdown.
#4
DLS, any element with an atomic number larger than 2 (helium) and less than 26 (iron) was most likely synthesized inside a star. Those above #26 require super novae shock waves to coalesce. We are all made from star dust. No matter how much I ponder this concept, it never fails to astound me utterly. We are all made out of stars.
"The most incomprehensible thing about the world is that it is comprehensible."
Posted by: Super Hose ||
09/11/2004 01:32 ||
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#1
Interestingâ¦from the article:
âIn a four-hour test run in the spring, tax collectors identified 25 cars that collectively owned $10,000 in taxes. A two-hour test by the police turned up 11 cars with stolen license plates and two stolen cars. Two people were arrested.â
Such technology could have a significant impact on crime. Much as repairing broken windows and removing graffiti reduces major crime.
#2
excuse me, but aren't property taxes imposed on the property? This sounds like big brother when imposed for taxes and personal levees. If they want to check on vehicle fees/infractions/crimes, no problem, but a man's car is usually his ability to get to work. I don't like it
Posted by: Frank G ||
09/11/2004 18:15 Comments ||
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#3
In Connecticut, registered motor vehicles are classed as 'property' and are taxed.
Simon Mann, the leader of the failed coup attempt in Equatorial Guinea, was starting a seven-year jail sentence in Zimbabwe last night for trying to buy weapons from Zimbabwe's state arms manufacturer. A court in Harare ruled that the Old Etonian and former SAS officer should stay behind bars until 2011, crushing his hopes that British establishment figures could use their money and influence to secure his freedom. Handing down judgment at a makeshift court in the maximum security Chikurubi prison, the magistrate, Mishrod Guvamombe, said the offences were serious. "The accused was the author of the whole transaction. He was caught while trying to take the firearms out of the country." Mann would serve four years for attempting to purchase dangerous weapons and three more for trying to buy them without a licence, he said.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Steve White ||
09/11/2004 12:46:31 AM ||
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Title 18, Part I, Chapter 47, Section 1001 of the U.S. Criminal Code:
(a)
Except as otherwise provided in this section, whoever, in any matter within the jurisdiction of the executive, legislative, or judicial branch of the Government of the United States, knowingly and willfully -
(1) falsifies, conceals, or covers up by any trick, scheme, or device a material fact;
(2) makes any materially false, fictitious, or fraudulent statement or representation; or
(3) makes or uses any false writing or document knowing the same to contain any materially false, fictitious, or fraudulent statement or entry;
shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both. Fred/Moderators, please delete this whole article if this is not a proper posting for Rantburg.
Posted by: OldSpook ||
09/11/2004 1:31:04 AM ||
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#1
This las appears to mainly refer to congressional investigations. Call you local congressional representative and demand they investigate the forgeries and CBS part in distributing forged documents.
These documents were the PRIVATE documents of the colonel in question - and as such they belong to his estate - i.e. his son and wife.
They should DEMAND that CBS turn over the documents to them - they are their property.
And if they are "government" documents, they should have (BY LAW) been either placed in the permanent files, or DESTROYED when (then) LT Bush left the unit. THeir retnention is a UCMJ violation - and shoudl be turned over to the USAF for investigation of thier source.
So, they have a choice - either there was a crime comitted in that these documents were retained, then exposed in contravention to Dept of Defense laws, or they are personal papers and they belong to the estate, and CBS is illegally with-holing them, and may have illegally obtained them.
Come on - there have to be lawyers digging into this to launch lawsuits and TRO's at CBS.
Posted by: Capt America ||
09/11/2004 1:45 Comments ||
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#4
OldSpook, I think it would be unwise for the Bush Administration or anyone else to try to limit the distribution of these documents, even if there is a legal basis for such actions. First, it would tend to give them an air of credibility they don't deserve, and second, when your enemy is making a horrible mistake, never, ever try to correct or stop him.
Posted by: Phil Fraering ||
09/11/2004 1:59 Comments ||
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#5
Yep, why stop a trainload of terrorists when it's about to go over a cliff?
#6
These documents were the PRIVATE documents of the colonel in question - and as such they belong to his estate - i.e. his son and wife.
Were they? A former military officer suggested yesterday that officers were allowed to keep "unofficial" (I've forgotten the proper terminology here) files on those under their command but that such files must, upon the person in question exiting the superior's command, either be merged into the official files or discarded.
Now that of course doesn't guarantee that the official protocol would always have been followed or have been followed in this case but it's yet another argument against the idea that a prudent officer would have maintained such "personal" files after Bush exited his command.
That said, I agree 100% with Phil: the best thing Bush can do is let this ride. If it's as damning as it appears to be, this will tear CBS and possibly the Kerry campaign apart.
#9
Old Spook, I think what CBS will say is that they don't hold the originals. The documents that they hold are copies which aren't property of the estate. I don't know that the family can even claim the originals while simultaneously claiming that they are forgeries - i.e. the originals would be their property if they were real.
Posted by: Super Hose ||
09/11/2004 3:48 Comments ||
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#10
You missed my point: CBS used the documents without the permission of the estate. The Berne Copyrights do not allow this. Regardless if they are the originals or not. IN the pursuit fo a copyright case, they coudl demand CBS produce the source and originals if they have them to find who is guilty for abuse of copyright.
The ohter way, the violation of military regs, also assuymes them to be genuine.
SO CBS is stuck: wither they stuick by thier claims and end up on the butt end of a lawsuit, or they admit they are forgeries and get out of the lawsuit.
Either outcome is bad for CBS, and either one discredit the documents by revelaing them as forgeries, or else revealing their source.
Posted by: Super Hose ||
09/11/2004 4:12 Comments ||
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#12
Drudge also has a link to an article about the Vince Foster suicide note in which Marcel Matley figured. Is the guy on retainer for McCauliff? Could he be the forger himself? Here is an excerpt:
"... Then the program turned to Marcel Matley, identified as a "handwriting examiner" with no further credentials given, who offered his opinion that the "suicide" note is genuine. Matley believes that the "deteriorated copy" of the note.... that is, it's been copied over too many times.... and the "stress" Foster was presumably under account for the differences in handwriting. He then went on to show how Foster used different styles of letters in the genuine samples, such as both cursive and block letter "s", for example, and how the same multiple styles appear in the note; and from this he concluded that the same person wrote both the note and the samples known to be genuine.
One problem with Matley's statements is that it is impossible to determine to what extent the copy of the "suicide" note used by the experts has deteriorated from the original.... because the government has yet to release any official copy of the original, much less a high-resolution one. I just don't see how Matley can point out examples of "deterioration" in copies of the note without having seen the original note...."
Posted by: Super Hose ||
09/11/2004 4:17 Comments ||
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#13
just think that very soon the term "you have been fooled" will be replaced by "you have been rathered".
TGA, we already have that expression, but you may not know that in Amerenglish "rathered" is pronounced "buggered".
#16
TGA is actually on to something here. The stupidity of Robert Fisk allowed someone in the blogosphere to coin the term "fisked". The stupidity of Dan Rather has now given us the verb "rathered".
Example:
Young Babe: Oh thank you for the beautiful diamond earrings, you old darling.
Old Man: Nothing but the best for my sweetie. Now come here and give me some sugar.
Reality: The earrrings are cubic zirconia. The young babe has been "rathered"
Posted by: Mark Z. ||
09/11/2004 17:30 Comments ||
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A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.
Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing
the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.
Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence
over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has
dominated Mexico for six years.
Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No
trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
