Michael Jacksonâs brother said the pop star was physically mistreated while in custody of the Santa Barbara Sheriffâs Department. Department officials disputed the claim. Jermaine Jackson told MSNBC in an interview broadcast Thursday that his brother has proof that "he was very much mistreated." He declined to give specifics, saying only, "The pictures will show you everything." I seen em! They cut his nose all up and made it look like a pixieâs -- and they made him wear a girlie wig too!
Chris Pappas, spokesman for the sheriffâs department, said the singer was treated "with courtesy and professionalism throughout the process," and no complaint had been filed.
A jealous wife cut off her sleeping husbandâs penis after finding a text message from another women on his mobile phone, a newspaper reported Friday. Ah yes, another one of those gentle, submissive asian women.
Antonio Llanesiras, 30, was being treated at the Pasay City General Hospital. Surgeons there saw little chance of reattaching the plumberâs severed organ, which was brought in by the wife carefully wrapped in a piece of cloth, according to the Manila Standard. Insert your favorite plumber - snaking pipe joke here.
It wasnât immediately clear if charges will be filed against the woman. Tony violated the second rule of cheating, giving the girlfriend his home phone number. Thatâs what the office phone is for.
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 9:43:29 AM ||
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#1
organ, which was brought in by the wife carefully wrapped in a piece of cloth
"This is my husband's. He'll be coming in when he wakes up -- would you please give it to him?"
#3
The muslim women take after the men when dealing with adultery. She is responsible for causing this man's suicide. And he will commit suicide, Muslim men can't live without their penis. It's un-Islamic to be a eunich.
Posted by: Charles ||
12/12/2003 10:36 Comments ||
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#4
It wasn't the tip, Raj. It was the whole thing!
Posted by: Dar ||
12/12/2003 10:45 Comments ||
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#5
Charles, what makes you think they are muslim? Most Phillipino women I have met are catholic and they would all cheerfully lop off hubby's johnson if they caught him cheating on them.
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 10:48 Comments ||
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#6
"Ah yes, another one of those gentle, submissive asian women"
#10
Language evolution: A few years back I happened to overhear my daughter in phonechat and realized the American English verb form "to bobbit" had come into existence.
Posted by: Fred ||
12/12/2003 13:26 Comments ||
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#14
Ah yes, another one of those gentle, submissive asian women.
When it comes to their families asian women are not submissive.
Most Filipinos are Catholic (about 90%) this comes from the Spanish conquest of the islands back in the 1500's - 1800's or so.
From the Library of Congress on the Philippines:
Religion: In 1989 approximately 82 percent Roman Catholic, approximately 9 percent associated with Iglesia ni Kristo and various Protestant denominations, 5 percent Muslim, remainder Buddhist, Daoist (or Taoist), or other religions.
#15
To Glen NR: one can also be bobbitized, have been bobbitized. will be......etc. I take care of the children of a number of oriental women. They seem gently enough to me, until they start speaking to their husbands. Then they sound like angry cats getting ready to tear someone's throat out.
#18
It think Asian women treat their husbands like the proverbial king in his castle but if you cheat--all bets are off! At least the Asian women i knew in NY were/are like that
Be vewwy, vewwy quiet!
Yemeni security forces are pursuing a second top al-Qaida figure after capturing the alleged mastermind of the terror networkâs most dramatic attacks in Yemen, the bombings of the destroyer USS Cole and a French oil tanker, government officials said Wednesday. Abu Ali al-Kandahari is one of two top al-Qaida leaders in Yemen, according to security reports published in the Yemeni press. The other, Mohammed Hamdi al-Ahdal, was arrested by security forces that surrounded his hide-out west of the capital, Sanâa, the Interior Ministry said Tuesday. Four men, believed to be al-Ahdalâs guards, were also arrested.
"Stick 'em up, youse guys!"
"Don't shoot!"
"What're youse doin' here?"
"Garden."
"Ain't that s'pposed to be 'guarding'?"
"It is?"
"One o' youse guys stop Mohamad! He's trying to... Never mind. He'd just trying to cut his wrists."
Al-Kandahari is believed to be hiding in the northern provinces of Marib and Jawf, and security forces are closing in on him, said officials. He is reported to have replaced Qaed Salim Sinan al-Harethi after he was killed by a missile fired from a U.S. drone last year. Al-Harethi was thought to have been Osama bin Ladenâs top deputy in Yemen.
Now he's worm food...
Saudi-born al-Ahdal, 32, has been described as the main coordinator of al-Qaida activities in Yemen, supervising the terror groupâs finances, weapons smuggling and operational planning and was well-connected to other extremists in Persian Gulf countries, the official said.
Now he's a jailbird...
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
12/12/2003 12:17:16 AM ||
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Security services have "undoubtedly" foiled planned terror attacks by al Qaeda followers in Britain and also probably across Europe, according to the head of the countryâs anti-terrorist force. Peter Clarke warned, however, there was no room for complacency in the race to stop extremists using skills and links forged in war zones such as Afghanistan, Bosnia, Chechnya and Georgia from carrying out attacks around the world. "We are absolutely confident we have stopped a lot of terrorist activity. There would have been attacks," Clarke, head of Scotland Yardâs Anti-Terrorist Branch, told Reuters in an interview. But "there is still a huge task ahead of us," he added. In line with anti-terror police policy, Clarke declined to give details of any of the recent plots.
"You'll have to work that out for yourselves..."
Britain has warned an attack is almost inevitable and security services have been on their second-highest alert for the past few weeks — arresting 23 suspects — after they said they had information an operation was planned. Clarke praised the "unparalleled" cooperation between international security services, saying it was "entirely possible" UK police had foiled attacks abroad and vice-versa. "This is a global threat. These are terrorist groups and police have disrupted them both here and abroad. The disruption takes place here, France, Spain, Germany and elsewhere — itâs a totally international effort," he said.
Good idea, since it's a totally international enemy..."
Clarke added he could not be sure if police had thwarted a planned strike on the scale of September 11 or whether al Qaeda was biding its time before launching another such attack. "It may be they hadnât chosen to target Western Europe," he said. "We are not quite sure what we have stopped."
Ricin... Strasbourg cathedral... Couple others...
The international terror threat was now divided into the hard core al Qaeda network, blamed for the September 11 attacks on the United States, associated groups based around the world, and individuals such as convicted British "shoebomber" Richard Reid who shared the same ideology, he explained.
And had their plane tickets paid for by al-Qaeda...
Reid was jailed for life in January after admitting trying to blow up a Paris-Miami flight using explosives in his shoe. "There would seem to be a core al Qaeda organisation and people of associated groups loosely connected to it, for instance North African groups," Clarke said. "The common factor that seems to provide links is participation in various conflicts like Afghanistan, Bosnia, Chechnya and Georgia."
The common factors are turbans, automatic weapons, Olde Tyme Religion, and princely largesse...
"Thatâs where we see the links were formed. They have come back from the training camps...and are playing a key role." Since September 11, around 500 people have been held in Britain under its sweeping anti-terrorism laws. The most significant was British Muslim Sajid Badat, 24, who appeared in court on Thursday accused of possessing explosives and conspiring with Reid to carry out terror attacks.
The most significant was Abu Qatada. Sajid's cannon fodder...
Some human rights groups have criticised police tactics but Clarke dismissed suggestions police had adopted an "arrest first, investigate later" attitude. "About a half of all arrests led to some sort of sanctions. About 90 people have been charged with some sort of terrorism activity and that is completely unprecedented," he said.
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
12/12/2003 12:15:19 AM ||
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France has closed two nursery schools because, well, they were radical Muslim institutions. Donât laugh: in an environment where children are made to memorize the entire Qurâan before they learn their multiplication tables (and before they have a ghost of a chance of understanding what theyâre memorizing), itâs quite possible that radical Muslims could be trying to indoctrinate even preschoolers. Possibly also they used the schools as a front for other activities. Imagine that!
The AP report says that "French officials have closed two Paris region nursery schools with alleged Islamic fundamentalist tendencies, the Interior Minister announced. âLe Jardin des Enfantsâ and âLa Tribune des Enfantsâ in the Hauts-de-Seine region west of the capital were shut last week after officials were alerted to their suspected ties to radical Islam and administrative irregularities.
"Announcing the closures, Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy described the schools as âillegal schooling establishments under Salafist influence.â
"Salafists promote a strict interpretation of Islam. Sarkozy was speaking Wednesday in parliament. He said 101 people have been detained, and that 42 remain in prison, this year in Franceâs battle against Islamic terrorism.
"âThose who donât respect the republican values and the laws of our country will be sent back to their countries and their establishments will be closed,â he said."
I think that at least Sarkozy is starting to see the implications of the fundamentalists hordes (as they approach critical mass)
Posted by: Alaska Paul ||
12/12/2003 8:45:23 PM ||
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Constitution Deadlock Plunges EU Summit Into Gloom (EFL)
The European Unionâs landmark summit to agree a first constitution was plunged into gloom almost as soon as it began Friday as leaders stood their ground in a bitter battle over their nationsâ voting rights. A last-ditch meeting between British Prime Minister Tony Blair, French President Jacques Chirac and German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder to seek a way out of the impasse brought "no breakthrough, no real movement," diplomats said. "The positions are a long, long way apart," Blair told reporters. "It is important to try and get an agreement. It may well not be possible."
We can only hope...
Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi, who as EU president for the past six months has struggled to steer the 25 bickering present and future member states to agreement on the historic draft treaty, conceded that the deadlock over power stakes in an enlarged union could sink the whole project. "The voting system is the obstacle that can block the whole agreement, and that is a pity," he told reporters. The stand-off pitting France and Germany on one side and Spain and Poland on the other could drag the two-day meeting into Saturday night, but Berlusconi said the leaders had set themselves a deadline of Sunday morning to get a deal. Insert your own joke here...
#2
I Fisked this earlier today. What a clusterfuck this whole pheeeEU project is. It seems designed purposely to subjugate smaller countries to the wills of France the larger countries. Sick fuckin' joke, IMO.
#3
Poland and Spain would have 'em by the short ones if either Chirac or Shroeder had any honor and would be embarrassed by caught red-handed trying to change the rules after the fact, as they are doing. But they don't.
#4
Poland and Spain aren't "smaller countries", dudes. They are honking big ones. Their problem lies in that though they don't have as big a population as France, Italy, or Britain they want pretty much the same voting rights.
This ambition sets them apart from larger *and* smaller countries alike.
The problems arose with ridiculous voting seats arrangments of treaties past -- EU is now just reaping the whirlwind that was sown in carelessness some time ago. One thing does become evident though - that we should have ratified the constitution before signing in more members.
#6
Well, the question is, what the *&$% is the EU supposed to be? Is it supposed to be
A) Some useless idiot thing like the UN?
B) A purposeful confederation of entities jealous of their soveriegnty? C) a clumsy try by Germany and France to regain the prestige they frittered away in the last century, spilling the blood of millions in the process, and do it with OPM this time?
A) Why not just adopt the UN charter. No good?
B) Well, there's three straightforward ways to design a voting system:
1) n votes per entity. No. Unacceptable to us big boys.
2) n votes per capita. No. Unacceptable to us little boys.
3) Both at once, and two Houses. Not for us. Who's ever gotten anything that complicated to work. What? Where? Since when? Oh. But they're just a bunch of cowboys. C) Why bother? Let them tote their own damned freight.
Who wrote that thing they're wrangling about, anyway? Valery who? Where's he from? That'd be a clue.
Bombs exploded in Turkeyâs three largest cities Friday, but no injuries or serious damage were reported, police and news reports said. Turkey has been on edge since a string of suicide attacks last month in Istanbul that killed 61 people. There was no sign that the bombings were linked to those attacks. These are a lot smaller, have a different feel.
The first bomb went off near a police station in the Aegean port city of Izmir, shattering windows in cars and houses, the Anatolia news agency reported. That attack followed two small explosions in Istanbul and the capital, Ankara. Police said a small bomb left near the door of the courthouse in the Sultanahmet district in the heart of Istanbulâs tourist district caused no damage and appeared to be designed only to make noise. A similar bomb later exploded near a court in Ankara, Anatolia reported. Attention getters.
There were no claims of responsibility. Militant Islamic, Kurdish, and leftist groups are active in Turkey and have carried out past attacks. These sound more like Kurd or leftists. Your islamic boomer likes high body counts. Any ideas, Murat?
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 3:34:21 PM ||
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#1
Murat assumes Kurds; there's no point in asking him.
But, in this case, I think that's possible. These DO have a different MO.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 17:07 Comments ||
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Well, this is going like I expected. EFL:
After Friday prayers at a Paris mosque, a simple question about the possibility of France outlawing Islamic head scarves in schools provoked a heated protest. "I urge all our brothers not to take their kids to school!" cried Mohammed, a Muslim of North African origin. The crowd, drawn by his appeals, murmured its approval.
"Yeah! Let's all seethe, dammit!"
The danger of Franceâs new effort to protect its secular traditions, these angry young men said, is that it will drive Muslims even further away from the rest of the country.
Prob'ly not as far as Algeria, though...
Any law against head scarves would alienate young Muslims like those who spoke with such passion outside the ramshackle mosque in a poor, multiracial section of Parisâ 18th district.
Women "are emeralds, jewels - the more they are shielded, the more beautiful they become. They lose their luster if they are outdoors," said Riadh Chabaoui, in his 20s.
"Yeah. Dat's why we keep 'em in the closet. And y'gotta polish 'em with a mild abrasive every now and then, just to keep 'em looking good, not that anybody'd notice..."
"In religious life, women must wear veils." Mohammed, who wouldnât give his full name, said legislating against head scarves would backfire. He said he tells his wife that sheâs beautiful in her scarf because it is "the flag of all Muslims."
"I mean, sure, honey! You got that big North African honker, and a moustache that's nearly as pronounced as mine, but once you put on that scarf, you're the bee's knees! Gets me all fired up!"
"If you make me choose between breaking the law and breaking the Quran, Iâll break the law," he said, referring to the Muslim holy book. "Today, they forbid us from wearing veils. Tomorrow, theyâll forbid us from being Muslims." Yup, this is working well.
How about if they don't forbid you from being Muslims but require you do it someplace else?
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 3:26:29 PM ||
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No, they'll probably forbid you from being French. Asshat.
#2
I think unless you can pass the test in apache dancing they shouldn't let you be naturalized. If you can't apache dance, you just ain't French.
Maybe, just maybe, they could substitute singing Maurice Chevalier songs from memory. But you'd have to play your own accordion...
Posted by: Fred ||
12/12/2003 15:45 Comments ||
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#3
Women "are emeralds, jewels - the more they are shielded, the more beautiful they become. They lose their luster if they are outdoors,"
uh, yeah. What's the law on Muslims wearing foil hats to school?
Posted by: D. Gephardt ||
12/12/2003 15:48 Comments ||
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#4
Women "are emeralds, jewels - the more they are shielded, the more beautiful they become. They lose their luster if they are outdoors,"
Ummm.... Dude - French chicks are hot. Women hiding their uni-brow and mustache behind a scarf are not.
Posted by: Yosemite Sam ||
12/12/2003 15:48 Comments ||
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#5
Well Mohammed, that was exactly the French point: Don't take your flag to school.
German schools will have the same regulations pretty soon.
#7
wait a minute guys - this is truely stupid. I presume that in France youre required, as in the US, to attend school. So if you cant afford a private school, the govt is basically forcing you to violate your religion. Isnt this the same intrusion on religious freedom that we despise in muslim countries? And that wouldnt pass muster for two minutes in the US of A? Ive subbed in my local schools, and there were girls with head scarves. Didnt cause the downfall of the west in THAT classroom, I'll tell you. What mattered was what was TAUGHT, not what the kids wore on their heads.
Other day, my daughter was in a holiday season concert at her school. Other kids were wearing christmas hats - my daughter, who is nothing if not proud of who she is, insisted on wearing a big floppy BLUE Hanukkah hat, with dreidels and Stars of David on it. My wife asked - should she call attention to herself like that - my reply - What do you think this is FRANCE???? This is AMERICA - even to ask such a thing is almost an insult to my fellow citizens. They are HAPPY to be tolerant of difference - indeed several came up and told my daughter how cute her hat was.
God Bless America
F**k France.
And pity on those of you who dont see what this is about.
#15
I'm with LH -- the French mania for secularism is beyond reason. Instead of banning differences, they should start doing things to teach tolerance. It IS possible; here in the US we seem to do a halfway decent job.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 17:10 Comments ||
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#16
I hear ya LH..and generally agree. However, look at the argumentative logic (or lack thereof) that the Muslims present. We see it as an issue of individual liberty...unfortunately too many Muslim have no concept of that. It's just another tool to use to keep the masses seething. That's where the French failed....and need to be better adept at taking the wind out of their sails or burkhas as the case may be. And obviously, they could give a rats a$$ about the welfare of their women.
Posted by: D. Gephardt ||
12/12/2003 17:17 Comments ||
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#17
LH, from what I understand the absolute requirement for wearing head scarfs is a fairly recent addition to Islam and its not supported in the Koran.
I think the French should advertise how Algeria still allows the wearing of head scarfs, and how the French government will pay train and boat costs for anyone who wishes to emigrate.
#18
It's all interpretation - that's why the covering req's vary so wildly in different places.
The key phrase in the Qu'uran is that women should cover their beauty. If you want the exact Sura, just pop over to http://www.islamicity.com/ and click on Quran and then index and look for beauty.
A good link to hang onto for those inevitable moments in the future when the actions fail to match up with the text. Note that the Haddiths (far less "available" online) generally supercede the Suras, where they disagree - which is rather often - because they came later as a "history" of Mohammed's actions. Each is a follower's sworn recollection / statement of an event and either what little Mo said - or what he did: Islam in action by Da Man. The poor lowly Suras are merely that Word of God revelation stuff he got on Day One of Islam.
#19
TGA - er, theyre minors. They're supposed to dress the way their parents tell them, no? In any case this policy doesnt ask what the girls think, it bans it flat out. Re Nazis - are you saying that wearing a scarf is a symbol of a murderous regime - are you saying that Islam is not in fact a religion?
BTW, I hope youre not planning on banning the wearing of Kippahs by Jewish kids in Germany.
Ruprecht - did you know that Jewish men are NOT required to wear headcoverings at all times - just in prayer - constant wearing arose as a custom, since there are LOTS of occassions for prayer in traditional jewish life (like before and after every meal) So conservative and even some Orthodox jews will go bareheaded. But thats NOT a question the State should be involved in - if an Orthodox Jewish kid feels a religous obligation to wear a kippah, should the govt get into the details of the Shulchan Aruch and the Mishneh Torah?
Look - guys this is either a war for freedom, including freedom of religion, or its a war for secularism and/or christianity against Islam. It cant be both, no matter how much you shout that Islam isnt a real religion. George W. Bush, bless his heart, seems to have gotten this one right. The French, with their tradition of militant leftie athiests fighting militant Rightie Catholics have NOT. Tolerance IS our genius, - its NOT the same as laicism or secularism, and its NOT clear to me that the Europeans get it even NOW. That is why WE are a superpower and they are not - WE can assimilate minorities, they can only either squash them or roll over to them. (pardon TGA, Im thinking mainly of france, though im not sure others have done better) Frances intolerance towards headscarves is PART AND PARCEL OF their view of the middle east - a total other, to be manipulated, or appeased, but NOT the Bush vision of transformation.
#20
LH I have to disagree with you here. Societies work to the extent they are coherent. In American terms the USA works because immigrants assimilate. If they didn't the USA wouldn't exist. Its that simple! You would be like Somalia, or held together by a Saddam like dictator.
Sure you can tolerate non-assimilation to a degree and you can tolerate celebration of group differences, but only in the wider context of general assimilation.
This is why muslim immigrants are such an issue in France and to a lesser extent in other places. You get a large non-assimilated sub-population. The head scarf is a badge of non-assimilation. The French government is right to ban it. I see this as very positive. At last the French government is facing up to a threat to the very existence of their society.
No, actually I think that Liberalhawk is onto something, or rather you both are, and you're probably closer in opinion than you might think, looking as I do from the outside.
I'm a Canadian who thinks about multiculturalism here more negatively than most. I'm also a Uke by ancestry and therefore someone who purportedly should be more warm and fuzzy about it.
The greatest strength of US culture, is its strong sense of identity. It's the thing that binds the place together. It's a sense of "being American" that's certainly unlike what we've got here in Canada. Yet, to a degree, it *is* like what we've got here in Canada, in that there exist a lot of sub-cultures in the US that stick with a lot of great traditions they bring to the table.
The difference between the two places I think, is that the unifying point in American culture is an idea - a concept of freedom and personal responsibility - rather than a place (which I think better characterizes Canada's national identity - ASIDE: that's a simplification but I think there's a big grain of truth there), or a "genetic" identity which seems to hold sway in Europe (ie. you can live in France your entire life but never be "French").
Liberalhawk mentions the importance of "diversity" in America, and it's true. It's true that America almost invariably benefits from the diversity of it's population. But to speak to your point Phil, there's a unifying idea and that binds people together: "freedom; responsibility; the American Dream" that trumps the differences.
There's diversity of expression and at the same time, a cohesion of purpose in the US. If ever there should be something to fight against when you see it in the US, is any sort of erosion in that very unique cohesion of purpose. It's something that you don't see in many other places in the world. And I think that it's a key part of what makes American culture so strong.
#22
Personally I think it should be encouraged the other way.The kids should be incouraged to wear thier religious gear.(Or not,thier choice.even the Muslim girls should be able to decide)
If any group or member of a group causes trouble for another group,come down on the offenders with both feet and grind in the heels.
Teach these undusipluneds urchins tolerance the hard way.
#23
I have to correct my previous posting: In Germany the veil will not be banned for the children, only for teachers: a move I agree with.
In Germany schools are seen as neutral ground. Maybe that's an egalitarian view you don't share, but nobody saw a problem in British school uniforms either (from what I hear in Australia all pupils, including those of public schools, must wear them). You might say, how repressive.
LH, of course Islam is a religion, but so are many others and for example Scientology is recognized as a church. Where to stop? What does it take in the U.S. to found a new church? Are there churches more equal than others?
Had the veil just be a religious requirement I don't think the French would have been so rigid. But obviously the veil creates trouble at school. I guess no Jew puts pressure on another Jew to wear a kippah (except in a synagogue, but then even I wear one out of respect). To understand the French view, you have to know whats really going on in the French "banlieue" (crime ridden suburbs with high rise low rent apartment blocks where an overwhelming majority are immigrants). Girls endure heavy social pressure to wear veils (if not they are seen as free-to-be-raped "whores").
Minors, LH? I don't think parents should force 16 year old girls to wear veils or burkas, sorry. A religious symbol that is forced upon you is nothing but a symbol of repression.
Maybe you find the French step too radical. Maybe it is. But as long as the veil is more than just a religious accessoire and in many cases a symbol of repression (at least for many women) I won't blame the French for ensuring that kids are equal at least in one place: the school.
I kinda disagree with you LH that the U.S. have been doing a so much better job with assimilation than Europe. First of all the U.S. was built on immigration, while in Europe immigrants always had to face a population with a more or less homogenous ethnicity and a dominating religion, language and culture.
They haven't fared badly. Italian, Spanish or Greek "guest workers" managed the assimilation process very well without giving up their identity. It is different with immigrants of Islamic countries who most of the time only expect tolerance but do not return the favor. They DON'T WANT to assimilate and what is more, they are actually expecting that the population of the country that received them follows or at least adapts to THEIR rules. Remember that Norwegian example: Norwegian girls were told to dress more conservatively because miniskirts incite Muslim men to disrespect and molest them? Sorry, that's not the assimilation I want to see.
And I'm not so sure whether I should be too impressed with the U.S. method of assimilation when the taxi driver in D.C. will only find the Capitol if I explain the way to him in urdu.
Nobody is going to restrict the freedom of religion in Europe. But you know, there are "holy man" who justify the clitoral mutilation of young girls in North Africa as "mandated by the Qoran" (which is not true). But if it were, would we tolerate it in the name of "religious freedom"? I know, it's an extreme example. But first the veil, then the burka, then separation of genders in school, then not sending girls to school at all. How "tolerant" should we be?
The French take the view of "stop the beginnings". I cannot blame them for that.
#24
for example Scientology is recognized as a church
Bad example; just a few years ago the French passed a law that specifically targets Scientology and (bizarrely enough) Southern Baptists. Supposedly it's to deal with criminal conspiracies using the mask of religion, but oddly enough, I've never heard it being applied to Moslem criminal conspiracies.
And, seriously TGA, if you think there's a "slippery slope" from tolerating unusual dress to tolerating mutilation, you need to get a grip.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 20:57 Comments ||
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#25
True TGA but you and Liberalhawk forget the tolerance extended to the Ultra-Orthodox Jews in the US--their women wear wigs and have to breed like cows--and are separate in the house of worship--just like the Moslems you feel so free to criticize
#26
Liberalhawk, I had heard that. You wear the headcovering when you are thinking about God, so naturally that became a constant thing because who wants to admit that they aren't thinking about God all the time.
In the US (until fairly recently) assimilation was promoted, it was one of the keys to success. You could succeed without it but it was far more difficult. In Europe that has not really been the case, which leads to unassimilated, semi-hostile groups living in their midst. That's not a sustainable position.
Too long to post the whole article
France is set to ban Muslim headscarves and other obvious religious symbols in its schools after a recommendation by a presidential advisory panel. President Jacques Chirac is likely to take up the recommendations and his Government will introduce a law in the coming months. Itâs an extension of existing rules that havenât been enforced as they stir up a great deal of emotion â Jewish skullcaps and large jewellery crucifixes are also not allowed. Itâs not an absolute ban, but a broad prohibition of overt religious symbols in schools. It doesnât apply to other public buildings. Civil servants are reminded that they are not supposed to wear overtly religious attire â but thereâs no ban. Personally I think France is making the right step, by strengthening the secularism with such a decision. Freedom of religion in Churches, Mosques, Synagogues etc., but secularity at public places, I congratulate the French decision.
Posted by: Murat ||
12/12/2003 4:53:16 AM ||
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#1
I wanted to assert something definitive but managed to confuse myself so badly I'm not sure what side I'm on. Murat, you're in Turkey, right? A Church(/Temple/Mosque)-State wall could be interpreted several ways. I don't know how your (written and unwritten) Constitution works regarding religion, but France and the US are different. The US Constitution has been interpreted to say it takes the position on religion that it takes no position on religion. This reflects reality already obvious in 1787. France, on the other hand, overreacting reacting to religious excesses of the past, is officially atheist, even though most French belong to one religious group or another. All this looks like is Chirac senses he's sitting on a volcano.
#3
Meanwhile, Murat valiantly ignores the evidence that the bombings in Turkey were, in fact, carried out by Islamists and not his Dreaded Kurds.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 7:22 Comments ||
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#4
Robert, thatâs not for sure yet, investigation is still proceeding and can still lead to anywhere.
Posted by: Murat ||
12/12/2003 7:50 Comments ||
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#5
Glenn, with Church, temple, Mosque, Synagogue etc. I mean actually, religion should be free and everyone should be able to practice his/her believe. But when a state has accepted secularity she has to stand at a position that is equal to all of these groups (religions), namely being neutral. And therefore I personally do believe that religious expressions donât belong in public offices, schools etc. Walk and dress as you wish in your own house, temple, private estate etc. but not public offices etc. IMO there should be a dress code for everyone in public areas, for instance being not naked but also not in an Afghan chador.
I agree partly with your #2 post, religious expression should not be a problem but in practice it sometimes is. If you donât wear a chador, headscarf etc you are not less Muslim, if you donât wear a yarmulke/Mogen David you are not less Jewish, if you donât wear an oversized huge crucifix you are not less Christian, but you do show you are tilting towards the extreme and that is IMO not right either.
Posted by: Murat ||
12/12/2003 7:51 Comments ||
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#6
Robert, thatâs not for sure yet, investigation is still proceeding and can still lead to anywhere.
Yeah. Sure. You just keep on living in your dream world, then.
Oh, and what was that "evidence" you had about my identity? I'm still waiting to see it.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 8:38 Comments ||
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#7
When you tell someone what they can and can not wear, you have taken a position on those items. It is very disingenuous to describe any anti-religious expression as neutral.
#8
I think that public schools should require uniforms.
I'm uncomfortable with the practice of prohibiting the wearing of crosses or headscarves or other religious symbols. But if taxpayer dollars are going to pay for schools, maybe uniforms are a good way to remind us all of the separation of church and state.
If one doesn't like it, they can pay to send their children to a private school.
Posted by: B ||
12/12/2003 10:12 Comments ||
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#9
"I think that public schools should require uniforms."
-Right on. Simplifies things. Focus is more on learning then what that slut Suzy wore to home room or that lil' Johnny's trousers are sagging down his ass & he's impressing everyone w/his fruit of the loom display.
#11
Dress code in public? You're off your nut, Murat.
Anyways, it would make an Orthodox or observant Jew feel "less Jewish" were he not to wear a yarmulke. You can read about a case in Texas, where a Jewish man was forced to take off his yarmulke before testifying in court. The lawyer who wrote that page said the following:
My religious upbringing has taught me that the custom of Jewish men covering their head to foster humility and Yiras Shomayim (Heb.: fear of Heaven) is of undisputed pedigree. A covered head is widely recognized as the mark of an observant Jew.
The Babylonian Talmud (Kiddushin 31a) notes that "Rav Huna, the son of Rav Yehoshua would not walk four cubits bareheaded saying, 'The Divine Presence is above my head.'" Thus covering of one's head is considered a formal symbolic manifestation of the constant presence of God. As the Psalmist (King David) states (23:4): "Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I shall fear no evil, for Thou art with me." God is always above us. We are covered by the protection of God. The Yarmulke is a constant reminder that a Jew is never alone. He walks with God. It is a feeling of assurance and comfort. At the same time, it is an ever-present conscience to withhold one from going astray.
Perhaps while Judge Lykos was focusing on the prejudicial effect the Yarmulke may have on the jury, she missed the more fundamental issue - the effect of the Yarmulke on its wearer.
The Talmud (Berachos 60b) further notes that the placing of a covering on one's head is as natural to the Jew as rising in the morning and getting dressed with clothes. The Talmud contends that each process of awakening has a concomitant blessing. For example: "When he opens his eyes, he should say, 'Blessed is He who opens the eyes of the blind.'... When he dresses he should say, 'Blessed is He who clothes the naked.'... & When he places a covering on his head, he should say, 'Blessed is He who crowns Israel with glory.'" In other words, the covering of one's head is part of the process of getting dressed in the morning. It was once inconceivable that the Jew would not place a covering on his head.
#12
Murat, reasonably, endorses the secular state that brought Turkey into the modern world.
Yes, I know how important symbols of religious belief are and I know how they have become, in some instances, deemed mandatory. This is as true of headscarves or veils for Moslem women as it is of yarmulkes for Jewish men. And ideally, we would all agree to respect freedom of belief and practice, so that these symbols are not divisive.
School uniforms go a long way towards this, but of course then there would be fights about what is and is not allowed as part of the uniform.
Growler, how do you feel about the US military's restrictions on display of religious jewelry etc.?
Posted by: anonymous on this one ||
12/12/2003 10:42 Comments ||
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#13
The US military is different. If you're in the service, you abide by their rules. Plus, I believe that the military wants to foster the idea of the troops being one unit, with their common goal to be of utmost importance. Hence, standard uniforms and no allowance for "personalizing" them.
#14
Robert, thatâs not for sure yet, investigation is still proceeding and can still lead to anywhere.
Really? Then why has Turkey made dozens of arrests, all suspected or confirmed Al-Queada. And why did Turkey say Al-Queada did it? Is your government lying to you about who killed the Jews in Turkey?
Posted by: Charles ||
12/12/2003 10:49 Comments ||
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#15
BTW - posted this last evening
Posted by: Frank G ||
12/12/2003 11:07 Comments ||
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#16
Oh, and another thing. This ban would require Sikhs to remove their turbans. But Sikhs are forbidden to do that. What happens then?
#17
Did you guys ever share a place next to you in the subway with a member of the hells angels? It gives you a creepy feeling, you get uncomfortable because of his dressing, his tattoos etc. that symbols a violent nature. No offense, but the same feeling I get with an radical long bearded islamist with a Palestinian headscarf or a bearded Jew with curly hairlocks and yarmulke who looks like a kach member. I am in no way against religious symbols, but I am sceptical against those who show their religion in such an exaggerated way as if they want to provoke.
Once again I think the rest of Europe should follow the French example, IMO banning exaggerated symbolism in public places would only enhance the peaceful coexistence of different religions.
Posted by: Murat ||
12/12/2003 11:55 Comments ||
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#18
Murat: Sharing the subway with all manner of weirdos is called living in a free society. As for their garb provoking you -- you gotta learn to chuckle (quietly if it's a a Hell's Angel).
Posted by: SLO Jim ||
12/12/2003 12:17 Comments ||
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#19
That may be the answer: Sonny Barger, CEO, Jihadi Hunters, Inc. Offer them up to 10% of the budget spent in the Wot in exchange for shutting down their Meth labs and ceasing killing each other and the occasional DEA Agent. Instead, they count coup cash via a bounty on jihadi scalps. Special bonuses offered for Hek, Michael Moore, the officers of CAIR / ANSWER / ISM / etc., Maureen Dowd, Zawahiri, the Black Hats, IndyMedia, the House of Saud, Krugman - y'know, all the really dangerously moronic types.
Therapeutic and financially rewarding. 5 years of this and these guys would be so mellow they'd be watching Oprah - between drunken brawls, of course, in their Carmel By The Sea hideaways.
Murat's bearded Islamist would find out what terror really was on his trip to Paradise.
#21
Murat, the answer is something called tolerance. Your inability to tolerate differences is no reason to impose a universal "vanilla" appearance on everyone else.
Not to mention the problem of who defines "exaggerated symbolism".
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 12:53 Comments ||
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#22
Oh, and what was that "evidence" you had about my identity? I'm still waiting to see it.
I seriously doubt that he'll find out who you are, Mr. Rums^H^H^H^H...Sir.
I suggest you read a bit about Algeria and you will understand the differnce. That Jew with a yarmulke will not kill you, he is not going to rape your {fiancee,wife,daughter} or burn your baby alive. The Islamists have given ample proof in Algeria and elsewhere that they will gladly do this and more all while congratulating about how holy and virtuous they are.
A little bit of a follow-up to yesterdayâs story ...
The bombing that killed six people outside Moscowâs National Hotel probably was the work of the same Chechen rebel group blamed for last weekâs explosion on a train in southern Russia and a suicide bombing at a rock concert in the capital last summer, a prosecutor said Wednesday. Brilliant, Holmes!
ââWe can see the same style here in all three crimes, and most likely they were coordinated from one center,ââ Grigory Shinakov, a Moscow prosecutor, said in comments broadcast on Russian state television. That center would be Basayevâs boomer brigade Riyadus Salikhin, of course.
ââAlso the type of explosive and the nature of destruction were the same,ââ he said, adding that a connection could also be drawn to Chechen rebelsâ seizure of some 800 hostages in a Moscow theater last year. Shinakov said the explosives belt worn by a female suicide bomber at the National Hotel on Tuesday resembled those worn by the women participants in the October 2002 theater siege. In the hostage taking, the women and their male comrades threatened to blow up the building. Russian special forces stormed the theater after three days, and 129 hostages were killed, most by the effects of the gas used to knock out the assailants. OTOH, had the gas not been used almost all of those folks wouldâve gone up in a big ball of fire along with Barayev and Co ...
A spokesman for the Federal Security Service, Sergei Ignatchenko, said female bombers carried out both the hotel blast and the train explosion in the southern city of Yessentuki, and that they had probably been trained outside Russia by Islamic extremists, the ITAR-Tass news agency reported. In Georgia, perhaps?
Not really very far outside Russia, I'm sure...
He said that practically all the suicide bombings in Russia over the past few years were financed from abroad and organized by Abu Al-Walid, whom he identified as the head of al-Qaidaâs ââArab emissariesââ in Chechnya, and Abu Omar As-Seyf, whom he called a financier of international terrorism. Al-Walidâs an al-Ghamdi, so no surprise there. That would also make As-Seyf the moneyman for the Caucasus jihadis.
ââBig financial resources reach al-Walid and Abu Omar from extremist centers in a series of Arab countries,ââ Ignatchenko was quoted as saying. I think that most of cash is still coming from the Magic Kingdom, though ...
He called the use of female suicide bombers a ââtrademark invention of al-Qaida and other radical groupings,ââ and said that the style of the most recent terrorist attacks in Chechnya, Moscow, Yessentuki, Turkey and Saudi Arabia was ââidentical.ââ Yâthink?
Nope. Using boom babes is as Chechen as can be. The only other place it's happened to date has been in Paleostine, and that's been rare.
ââIn our opinion, these events have common roots, and a single logic and financial base,ââ he said. Seeing how they all work for or with Binny to one degree or another, thatâs too be expected.
Russia has sought to deflect criticism of its military campaign in Chechnya by portraying rebels there as part of the international terrorist movement. Except that theyâre, yâknow, correct in that regard as the Moscow hostage seige demonstrated for anyone who was paying attention to the whole situation ...
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
12/12/2003 12:29:22 AM ||
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Using boom babes is as Chechen as can be. The only other place it's happened to date has been in Paleostine, and that's been rare.
Ummm, don't forget Sri Lanka. Tamil Tigresses and all.
Posted by: Steve White ||
12/12/2003 18:47 Comments ||
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#2
Doh!
But still not Qaeda, are they?
Posted by: Fred ||
12/12/2003 22:22 Comments ||
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60% of Americans say that itâs good enough for them! If that doesnât scare you, youâre not paying attention. Can this country even survive another four years of reckless spending, an astronomical deficit, more unemployment, more trashing of the environment, more disregard for international protocol, more dead and maimed young Americans, more lies, more secrecy, more bait-and-switch?
Probably...
And thatâs just the short list.
Oh, well, please go on!
Man, how do you even comment on a poll like this? Where do you start? This poll proves to the world that a majority of Americans are gullible, ignorant, uneducated, lazy, and just plain suckers.
"Yeah! What a bunch of dumbasses! Without people like me and... ummm... you, where would they be?"
But donât take my word for it; think about it for yourself.
"If you're as smart as I am, of course, which you're prob'ly not..."
Before his layover in Baghdad, Bushâs approval rating was sinking fast, and so was approval for his war. So bing-bada-boom, he takes a quick trip, makes sure there are lots of clicking cameras, and 60% of Americans suddenly think that the war, as a whole, was a good idea now. Bush serves mashed potatoes to the troops, for ten minutes, and 60% of Americans rethink their opinion of this disastrous war (and the myriad problems it encompasses).
"Problems that people like me and... ummm... you could solve in the twinkling of an eye, if they just handed me... ummm... us the power we deserve!"
Did somebody ask why the rest of the world is chuckling at the intelligence of the average American? Just wanted to illustrate just what the loony left think of the average American
#1
I read the ARG and I am suprised it's this close. This guy would be a member of the Social-Democrats if he lived in Europe. Bring em on, Bush in 04!
#2
Reckless spending? Hmm... apparently it's reckless to them only when Republicans do it. (Frankly, I'm not a big fan of it in either case.) The rest goes per lib template. How "independent." *eye roll*
If "analysis" such as this is what passes for intelligence overseas, I pity the Europeans more than anything.
#5
the looney left is right - the average American is too busy working 50-60 hrs a week, trying to support his family, be a good citizen, and pay his taxes to afford the LLL's social programs so that they don't always keep up on current events. Wish I had so much time on my hands to be brilliant as this ass-hat.
Posted by: Matt ||
12/12/2003 13:08 Comments ||
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#7
I posted this over at Indy, just waiting for a witty response from one of the oh-so-brilliant Indy's...
It's a given that most technological innovation springs from the US. That can't be argued.
If what you are saying is true, that the *average* American is less intelligent that the *average* European (or whatever), then I think it must follow that the *smartest* Americans must be WAY smarter than the *smartest* Europeans. How else to explain our dominance in business, technology, military, etc.? Just plain dumb luck? Yeah, right.
I think what really gets you is the fact that there are actually some very intelligent people with different views from yours. Why does that aggravate you so?
Uh... So Chretien is saying that Canada intends to pull out of Afghanistan in "seven or eight months"-- "we have to go", he sez, because "it is getting more complictated"-- i.e., bloody?-- and they "have to go" regardless of the situation there at that time-- I guess because Canuckia can then say it has kept up its end of some "international" bargain or other. Feh. And for that kind of half-hearted participation in Afghanistan-- plus a piddling $120 mil in Iraq reconstruction money-- the canucks gripe 'cuz Santa Wolfie left 'em off of his "naughty and nice" list. Cry me a river, Canuckia.
Meanwhile, I'll be wiping my eyes from the tears of laughter at Chretien's claim that "Canada was not having trouble finding another NATO country to send troops to replace its soldiers in Afghanistan". Strange he didn't name any such country... But true enough: if and when the Canuckians crawl back into their comfy shell, we Amis and the Brits-- or maybe Aussies or Spaniards or Polacks or etc. -- will fill the very small void the Canucks leave behind, 'cuz we, unlike them, are responsible adults who take our responsibilities seriously.
#2
IIRC in 7 or 8 months time their will be elections in Afghanistan, introducing a new government to replace the interim government of Hamid Karzai, which is when the UN mandate for the country will end. The same thing happened in East Timor.
Posted by: Paul Moloney ||
12/12/2003 5:18 Comments ||
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#3
I read somewhere (will try to add a link to the comments) that Chretien's daughter is married to some bigwig at Totalfina Elf...and that Jacques and Jean are skimming from the same bowl of cream.
-the fact that the strongest nation in the history of the planet is our number 1 trading partner, lives on our southern border and is essentially our guardian & protector, has nothing to do with it either.
#5
mjh, Jean's daughter is married to Paul Demarais Jr. Paul Jr. is Chairman and Co-CEO of the Power Corperation, based in Montreal. Power is a financial conglomerate of Insurance and Mutual Fund Investment Companies. Apparently Power is TotalFina's largest single shareholder. Nope, no connection, just another Cheney and Haliburton.
EFL Dajkot Church attacked
Faisalabad: ... The well attended prayer meeting by the village elders, youth, women and children were under way when Muslims shouting "you infidels stop praying and accept Islam" entered the church and started beating the worshipers. The Muslim attackers desecrated the Holy Bible and broke every thing in the church... most of the Muslim attackers were drunken and tried to rape women in the church... station House officer of the police station refused to lodge any report of the Christians when Christian injured were lying in the hospital where Muslim doctors left them unattended with any medical aid on directions of Muslim influential of the vicinity... fear among the Christian villagers on threats of killing them by the Muslims relatives of the arrested attackers has forced them to migrate to safer places.
and coincidentally,
Annan warns of tensions between West and Islam
TUEBINGEN, Germany (Reuters) - U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan has warned that tensions are mounting between Westerners and Muslims and has urged people to seek out common ground between their traditions.... "Misunderstandings" -its all just an innocent misunderstanding
have arisen between the Islamic world and the West and amid such acrimony the relevance and importance of the United Nations have been called into question, he said. the worst misunderstandings are the willfully ignorant drivel that comes out of the mouth of people like Annan
Posted by: mhw ||
12/12/2003 9:32:21 AM ||
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most of the Muslim attackers were drunken
On alcohol or Islam?
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 9:36 Comments ||
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#2
U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan has warned that tensions are mounting between Westerners and Muslims..
Hmmmm, I wonder why that is...?
"Misunderstandings" - have arisen between the Islamic world and the West and amid such acrimony the relevance and importance of the United Nations have been called into question, he said.
Heh, I'd say this conflict between the RoP and everybody else is more than just a little "misunderstanding".
#4
mhw, interesting juxtaposition. Of course, PCP might have an axe to grind, but this is a little far-fetched to make up. Drunken Muslims, huh?
Q: Aren't doctors, pretty much worldwide, required to swear the Hippocratic Oath?
I can't find a reference to the Annan quote. Is there a link? It's not in reuters/news. Maybe he really didn't say that, and it's all a misunderstanding to call the "the relevance and importance of the United Nations ... into question." Yeah, that's gotta be it.
and on the 'drunk' moslems thing - I think moslems in rural pakland get high on various smoked or chewed substances rather than alcohol but it makes them act like they were on alcohol
#7
Doctors here take the oath. Some of us even follow it. However, if someone holds a gun to your head and says: "don't treat that person," the oath is going to take a back seat.
#8
Coverage of this in the major media in 5... 4... 3... 2... 1... 0... -1... -2... -3... -4... -5... ... oh well... no tremor on the suprise meter here....
Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal (MMA) President and chief of his own faction of Jamiat Ulema-e-Islam Pakistan Maulana Shah Ahmed Noorani died of a heart attack at noon on Thursday. He was 78. Maulana Noorani suffered a severe cardiac seizure at home while preparing for a meeting of opposition parties in parliament. He was taken to the Federal Government Services Hospital at 12:35pm but doctors were unable to revive him. âMaulana Noorani was titzup dead on arrival,â Dr Shahbaz Ahmed told Daily Times.
"Looks pretty good with a toe tag, doesn't he?"
Maulana Nooraniâs secretary told Daily Times that he had contacted the Senate doctor soon after his condition deteriorated but the doctor refused to come. Maulana Noorani had undergone two heart by-pass operations in 1980s and was to have angiography after the conclusion of the current Senate session. His body was flown to Karachi in a C-130 provided by the federal government.
"Mahmoud!"
"Yes, General Mr. President, sir!"
"Lend them a C130 to get the body out of here!"
"Yeesir!"
"Tell 'em to fly it out before it starts to stink! Oh, and here's a buck. Send flowers, too, in my name."
Posted by: Paul Moloney ||
12/12/2003 12:04:18 AM ||
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Damn. Now I'll be keeping the little woman up all night with my ululating...
Posted by: Fred ||
12/12/2003 0:45 Comments ||
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No suprises here; EFL, registration reqâd
Its business as usual for the recently banned jihadi and sectarian organizations and their leaders are continuing to tour the country to deliver jihadi sermons.
The shock of finding this out is prob'ly what killed Noorani...
The jihadi outfits are also continuing to publish their journals with impunity and on a regular basis, in which the front-line jihadi leaders attract new recruits with their emotional writings.
"It was a dark and stormy night in Kashmir..."
Maulana Fazlur Rehman Khalil, defunct Jamait-ul-Ansar (JA) head, who reportedly visited NWFP in the last week of Ramazan and made jihadi sermons in various mosques and madrassas, was said to have presided over a JA meeting at its Barasi Markaz, Manshera before Eid to form a strategy of operations after the banâ, a jihadi leader requesting anonymity told TFT. Meanwhile, a notice has appeared in the December issue of JA periodical âAl-Hilalâ that the training convention scheduled for December 2, 2003 at Jamia Khalid bin Walid in Islamabad has been cancelled while other provincial and district programs would be held on schedule. The notice also said that new dates for this convention would be announced later.
Naqshbandis are a Sufi sect. What're they doing hanging out with Sunni krazed killers?
However, the defunct Tehrik-e-Islami is using the platform of International Shia Front in much the same way. Equally, the Al-Rasheed Trustâs daily Islam and weekly Zerb-e-Momin continue to be published and project the point of view of the defunct MIP leaders. Significantly, the Jamaat-ad-Dawa (JD), which was put âunder observationâ by the government, is oblivious to the official ban on collecting funds, and its fund-collecting camps at important and busy places in Lahore were open during the month of Ramazan. The JD Ameer, Hafiz Muhammad Saeed, delivered the Eid sermon at the prominent Gaddafi Stadium, in which he plainly declared that some âhurdlesâ could not stop the JDâs jihad.
"Like lemmings, we march toward glory and jihad!... Or is that jihad and glory?"
The media organs of some banned organizations continue to publish, such as the Jamait-ul-Ansarâs Monthly Al-Hilal and Tehrik Kuddam-ul-Islamâs fortnightly Shemsheer in Karachi. These media publications have not changed their âtonesâ and persist with encouraging jihad. Maulana Khalil in his message said âOh Mujahideen! Our aim is to establish a caliphate in the world and we have the responsibility to avenge our martyrs. The blood of Arab princes from Afghanistan, the bloody valley of Kashmir, the Iraqis and Palestinians, are calling you. Every inch of the earth wants revolution. Donât delay realizing your responsibilitiesâ. Maulana Farooq said in his message that âonly jihad is a symbol of faith in this era, so you should be committed to itâ.
Posted by: Paul Moloney ||
12/12/2003 12:03:57 AM ||
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I read an article in The Friday Times early this year by their Islamist expert, who wrote that the Naqshbandis have become much more fanatical and intolerant, from Chechnya to Pakistan.
He actually put them in the same category as the Deobandis and the Salifis, so perhaps like the other two, they also have a sectarian hatred of Shias. At least in Pakistan.
Posted by: Paul Moloney ||
12/12/2003 17:41 Comments ||
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#2
Last year there was an incident where Ansar toughs dug up the bodies of some Naqshbandi saints. I guess if they're on board the jihad train we can assume the entire religion is. Ann Coulter appears to have been right: "We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity."
Posted by: Fred ||
12/12/2003 17:58 Comments ||
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More detail on yesterdayâs arrests
The arrest of two top Pakistani nuclear scientists in Islamabad has been confirmed by Pakistani sources in London, who say the men have been accused of passing on nuclear secrets to Iran. Dr Farooq Mohammed and Dr Yasin Chohan were key members of the team responsible for Pakistanâs 1998 nuclear tests. They are described as director and laboratory director respectively of Pakistanâs secret uranium enrichment facilities at Kahuta, situated between Rawalpindi and Islamabad.
But don't tell anybody where it is. It's a secret...
According to the Pakistani sources two FBI members were part of the team that detained Mohammed and Chohan in Islamabad on Wednesday. Mohammed had just returned home after attending a relativeâs funeral. The Pakistani authorities have yet to confirm the arrests, but opposition senators from the countryâs upper house of parliament have lodged a protest, saying the arrests are a grave threat to national security. The Pakistani foreign ministry said in a statement that Islamabad has an uncompromising policy not to transfer nuclear technologies to third countries.
So how does arresting people who violate it threaten national security? ("I'm tryin' to think, but nothin's happ'nin'!")
The two scientists are the latest in a list of nuclear experts detained at the behest of the US. Two years ago under US pressure the Pakistani authorities arrested Dr Sultan Bashiruddin Mehmood, who had designed the Khusab nuclear power station, and subsequently offered his services to the Taliban regime in Kabul. One of his colleagues who worked with him in Kabul was shipped out to the Pakistan embassy in Myanmar before US counterintelligence and terrorism experts had a chance of getting to him.
Posted by: Paul Moloney ||
12/12/2003 12:00:45 AM ||
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Just how much did they tell Iran about making nukes? And when will Iran be testing it's first nuclear warhead in 2004?
Posted by: Charles ||
12/12/2003 2:27 Comments ||
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#2
My advice for Israel: keep the engines warm on those long range F-15s.
Posted by: Rafael ||
12/12/2003 3:14 Comments ||
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#3
I was hoping the USA will do something about it
but it looks like we cannot hope for Bush to strike Iran's nukies before he gets reelected!
It seems we indeed will have to do something about it.
Get ready for plenty of UN and Eurowhinies complaints and indignation when we actually
do something!
Posted by: The Dodo ||
12/12/2003 4:21 Comments ||
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#4
Pakistani authorities have sent home one of two nuclear scientists reportedly since early this month apparently on suspicion of passing over secrets to Iran. "The debriefing session of one of the scientists has concluded and he has resumed his normal duties," foreign ministry spokesman Masood Khan told AFP on Friday. Foreign ministry spokesman Masood Khan also denied the men were being interrogated or were in custody, or that any foreigners were involved. "There is no 'interrogation' going on. The word has implications of 'wrongdoing'. This is prejudgement," Khan told reporters. "People in debriefing sessions are not held in 'custody'." Khan said the scientists had also been undergoing "personnel dependability" assessments.
But he declined to answer whether the men had freedom of movement.
"personnel dependability" assessments conducted by some very large Human Resources Department personnel.
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 10:18 Comments ||
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#5
Dollars to donuts sez that the Paks have done their damage and the cat is out of the bag in Iran. I am sure that strike plans are made and that they are constantly revised, based upon the latest target information. Once they do this it is war, folks. So all ducks better be in line.
Posted by: Alaska Paul ||
12/12/2003 17:45 Comments ||
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Ramadan moon disputed
According to Khabrain, all along the Afghan border the moon was sighted by the local clerics a day earlier (Monday) and the first of Ramadan announced without reference to Islamabad where a central moon sighting committee (Markazi Ruet-e-Hilal Committee) functions under a chairman who is also a member of the Council Islamic Ideology (CII). In Quetta, the announcement of one-day-early fasting came late, which resulted in parts of the city not fasting together with the rest of the province. The announcement for the Monday fast was made by the cleric-members of the JUI. In some parts of Bajaur, the fasting month had begun on Sunday because an enthusiastic cleric claimed that he had seen the moon. But he didnât carry a consensus therefore the area ended up observing the opening of Ramadan on two different days. It seemed that the prayer-leaders followed their religious parties rather than the local trend, In Khanewal in Punjab, for instance, a cleric announced Ramadan and got his locality to go on the fast. When the fasting citizens went out and saw the city busy eating as usual they were greatly embarrassed.
Moon-sighting committee falls apart
According to Jang and Khabrain, the central Ruet-e-Hilal Committee member Maulana Hassan Jan, of Peshawar went on record as saying that Mufti Munibur Rehman was requested by him to wait for the reports to come in from the NWFP but the chairman was in great hurry and announced a non-sighting. He even accused him of talking on his cell-phone to some authority in the government before hastily issuing the verdict. In his defence, Mufti Munibur Rehman said that all the members of his committee had agreed that no moon was actually sighted. He said this was confirmed by 20 meteorological centres in the country. According to him, disagreement emerged afterwards and it was political rather than factual. He also informed the press that the government had set up provincial moon-sighting committees to remove differences of opinion. But, alas, some unofficial âparallelâ committees too had sprung up to queer the pitch for the system of moon-sighting.
Moon Committee divided
According to daily Pakistan, the Ruet-e-Halal Committee got divided over the sighting of the moon. The chairman decided that the moon was not sighted but one member of the committee went to Peshawar and announced late at night that the moon had been sighted and got the police to open the mosques and made them announce the first day of fasting.
Fewer Pakistanis in Qatar
Quoted by Nawa-e-Waqt, Dr Rafiq Ahmad of Nazria Pakistan Foundation said that Pakistanis had been made to leave Qatar because a Pakistani minister had called Qatar âan unimportant small stateâ. He said there used to be 18 percent Pakistanis and 10 percent Indians in Qatar but now it was the other way around. He asked the government to send a minister to Qatar and patch up with the government there since the Pakistanis from there remitted $87 million annually.
Big assets declared by politicians
According to Jang, the assets declared by the elected politicians to the Election Commission revealed that one Azam Swati was worth Rs 3.3 billion, Shaukat Aziz was worth Rs 40 million, Ishaq Dar 29 million, SM Zafar Rs 5 million, Khalid Ranjha Rs 6 million, Maulana Samiul Haq Rs 4.1 million and Maulana Noorani Rs 8.6 million.
Posted by: Paul Moloney ||
12/12/2003 12:00:35 AM ||
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#1
I'll show 'em a full moon they won't be able to miss.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 7:24 Comments ||
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#4
in ancient judaism the date of the month (and thus of religious holidays, with accompanying commandments) was determined by visual observation of the new moon. This resulted in some disputes, despite attempts to settle who had the authority to declare a new moon. It also meant that in the diaspora (since the new moon was declared in Jerusalem) holidays at the beginning of a month were celebrated on 2 days instead of 1, to be sure (fortunately the major fast days are mid-month) Ultimately (about 100 AD or so) the calendar was fixed. Orthodox and Conservative Jews in the diaspora still celebrate the early month holidays for 2 days, though most Reform Jews have gone back to celebrating for one day only.
I suppose in Islam theres no central body with the authority to fix the calendar, or they just never saw the need to do it.
#11
Hardly, ,comma. I've no basis to impugn your honesty, and postulate nothing of the sort, albeit were it thus, this would certainly be the proper forum. It's just that #1 RC sent this off on a Jeff-Foxworthy-style-drive-by-shooting tangent, and, well, you know. We need to maintain a consistent high level of intellectually-challenging, civil, well-reasoned discourse here, people!
#12
Oh. K. Shit, then. Sorry! There is an abundance of, uh, material on the topic.
O/T: We infidels used to laugh that it was really about the length of the shadow cast by the Grand Mufti's "member" at midnight when the New Moon was seen. If it rose after midnight, well, there would be six more weeks of bad weather. Uh, or something. And you have to fly the flag the next day, too, I think.
I liked ,com's Moon Shadow reference - very astute, IMO. So I'm calling attention to it. Here. In this comment by another person. Lucky can back me on this, I bet.
The commanding general of the 4th Infantry Division on Friday accepted a U.S. military investigatorâs recommendation and ordered administrative action against Lt. Col. Allen West, who was accused of using improper methods to force information out of an Iraqi detainee. Following a military hearing, West was fined $5,000 over two months, according to Westâs civillian attorney, Neal Puckett. The punishment does not affect Westâs eligibility for retirement and pension, Puckett said in a statement. "I know the method I used was not right, but I wanted to take care of my soldiers," West testified to a military courtroom of observers and some teary-eyed troops formerly under his command. Asked if he would have act differently if under similar circumstances again, West testified, "If itâs about the lives of my soldiers at stake, Iâd go through hell with a gasoline can." After nearly 20 years of military service, West plans to move his family from Texas to Florida, where he said he hopes to start a new life.
#2
Damn right, seafarious! If they wanted to get a ruling on him, charge him a $ and be done with it. I would like to see who initiated this little number on Lt. Col. West. He needs some investigation, too. You cannot be politically correct with persons who plan to ambush you and your men. This is madness.
Posted by: Alaska Paul ||
12/12/2003 20:02 Comments ||
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#3
I'd like to see Odierno reduced to major and kicked out of the service for going after West. This should never have been news. It's pathetic that the Army is so PC they can't even frown at terrorists. It's more important to fuck over West and ruin his career than it is offending the c*cksucking leftist shitbags. I'd rather he had the division than the a*shole that prosecuted him.
#4
4thIV, right on target brother. Give West an MSM and set him up to take over a Regiment (Army- is it Brigade?). $5,000 is bullshit. Shit, for 5G's he should've pistol whipped that *sshole. The lunacy of the Army's pc beauracracy makes me ill. Patton's rolling in his grave. This should have NEVER gotten out of the unit. I blame West's higher ups 100% for not shielding him better - pussies. The only court martial that should come down is on the leaky faucet who let this out. No loyalty imo.
Hell Patton, Rose, Truscott, Hodges, Sheridan, Forrest, Gavin, Vandergrift, Clay, just about every wartime general worth his stars is going apeshit in their graves over this lunacy.
Anyway, the leaky faucet is West himself, he called his CO and told him what the deal was. I'm pretty disgusted by whomever that colonel or 1 star is, also; he should have examined the facts, maybe written a letter for West's pers file, and taken the heat for one of his troops. Instead the sh*tbag rolled over and let the pantywaist political polesmokers in D.C. (probably with alot of urging from State) sh*t all over Lt. Col. West. If it weren't for the story getting out into blogs and the (certain) media outlets, West would be on his way to a general court. I don't know about anyone else, but I took the time to contact by cong. rep and both senators to let them know how shameful I thought the Army's conduct was. I think the sh*tstorm over them trying to f*ck this guy is what saved him. He should run for congress the second he clears post.
Anyway, assuming Rumsfeld isn't the one holding the hammer (i sorta doubt it), it's obvious some of the Army brass needs to be retired yesterday, starting with the 4th ID CG and going up. West's brigade CO should be sent to Alaska until he gets the hint. I sure wouldn't want to be serving under any of those bastards right now. Hopefully Schoomaker will clean house because if this, if Rummy won't. Schoomaker has the bio of a warrior, instead of another feathermerchant like Powell or those USAF pansies. Hopefully he'll start kicking some ass.
EFL from John Podhoretzâs article against a media blackout of the December 10 antiterror demo in Baghdad:
We knew about the march beforehand, and about what happened at the march afterward, from the most important "weblog" in the world right now - a blog called Healing Iraq. (You can find it at healingiraq.blogspot.com.) Its author is a 24-year-old dentist named Zeyad who lived as a boy and briefly as a teenager in London, which explains both the fluency of his English and his endearing lapses of grammar and spelling.
He spent weeks trying to figure out when the march would be, as he pointed out last week: "We spent some time investigating whether the rallies were still schedulled[sic] for December 10th. Yes, it was like doing some kind of detective work.
"Itâs strange that nobody seems to know any details about the event. We went to different local newspaper offices which had published articles about it. All we got is that the demonstrations are still being organized but no exact date has been given out due to security considerations. Hmmm. How are people supposed to demonstrate when everything is being so secretive? This isnât good at all."
But on Wednesday night, after the event, he was exultant: "The rallies today proved to be a major success. I didnât expect anything even close to this. It was probably the largest demonstration in Baghdad for months. It wasnât just against terrorism. It was against Arab media, against the interference of neighbouring countries, against dictatorships, against Wahhabism, against oppression, and of course against the Baâath and Saddam." Ah, the joys of joining the likes of Glenn Reynolds, Eugene Volokh and Paul "Chief Wiggles" Holton ... Zeyad-u-akbar!
Posted by: Lu Baihu ||
12/12/2003 2:43:56 PM ||
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WASHINGTON, Dec. 11, 2003 - Pro-coalition demonstrators gathered throughout Iraq Dec. 10 to protest terrorist actions and urge their fellow Iraqis to take action against anti-coalition forces. Coalition Provisional Authority officials reported major demonstrations in as many as eight cities by a sweeping representation of the Iraqi people: Kurds, Shiites, Sunnis and Christians among them.
Although the CPA estimated participation at 15,000 to 20,000 people, Iraqi police and media sources cited numbers ranging from 100,000 to 1 million. The demonstrations, organized by the Iraqi Reconstruction and Development Council, took place in every major Iraqi city except Tikrit and Mosul, officials said.
In Baghdad, the scene of the largest demonstration, an estimated 5,000 Iraqis carried banners and chanted slogans opposing violence by Saddam Hussein loyalists and other insurgents. A CPA spokesman said the demonstration was initially planned to take place over a one-mile area, but that it extended an additional half-mile as the crowd swelled beyond expectations.
Iraqi Shia leader Moqtada Sadar -- who had previously been an outspoken opponent of the coalition -- spoke at the demonstration, condemning terrorism and the violence inflicted by the insurgents. In Ramadi, a former Baathist stronghold about 60 miles west of Baghdad, Iraqis demonstrated at the provincial council headquarters.
U.S. Central Command officials said some 200 men, women and children carried banners and chanted slogans condemning terrorism â an encouraging development, they said, as Ramadi has been a site of persistent anti-coalition activities since post-war reconstruction efforts began.
CENTCOM officials applauded the strong showing of support during the demonstrations, which they said demonstrates increased cooperation between local Iraqis and coalition forces. The increased cooperation, they said, reflects the Iraqiâs desire for a safe and secure environment and is resulting in more tipsters coming forward to provide information about insurgents and their activities.
#3
This just plain pisses me off!!!
This still has not been covered at all in the major media outlets. CNN: Nothing, BBC: Nothing, ABC News (USA): Not a peep.
However everytime a 'watchdog group' (unidentified of course....) says some assinine thing its front page news.
Everytime a terrorist (oops: resistance) so-called leader farts its front page news.
This is clear proof that the major media wants us to lose and wants the return of Saddam and his execution squads and rape squads and mass murders.
#4
Speaking of Glenn (Reynolds not me) there's more. He quotes people who have, as he observes, some uglifying explanations.
The late RAdm D. V. Gallery explained that the job of the Media [his Capitalization] is to shout from every rooftop that Freedom of the Press is what makes the sun rise every morning.
President Bush yesterday fiercely defended his decision to bar France, Germany, Russia and Canada from Iraq reconstruction contracts, defying a furious outcry from allies and even objections from GOP and conservative leaders. Bush said even a decision by countries such as France and Germany to forgive Iraqi debt would not enable them to compete for the contracts in Iraq. And he was derisive when asked about German Chancellor Gerhard Schroederâs remark that "international law must apply here," saying: "International law? I better call my lawyer; he didnât bring that up to me." The media will hate it, but Iâll bet the voters love it.
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 10:32:28 AM ||
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#1
Waiting for the Queen of Donkeys to open her mouth in protest.
Posted by: Charles ||
12/12/2003 10:39 Comments ||
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I've given this a lot of thought over the past couple days. Doubt I would of brought this up publicly if I was Wolfie. I'm not sure if Wolfie was asked the question by a reporter or just made the statement on his own. If it was the latter, fairly questionable chess move imho. I usually back the admin but this would not of been my tact. Let all the dissenters have their bids, discreetly throw away France & Russia's bids after they make them, but get some assurance they're going to forgive Iraq's debt first. Let them think we listened to them, blah, blah. Give the Canucks some minor contract and get Martin on the team (we need to get them to start closing up their asinine immigration policies) and give the Germans some minor medical contract of which they're good at. Case closed. They all think they got a deal. We come away smelling as good as we can. Even a lot of conservatives have questioned this move.
#3
JH - I respectfully disgree. By publicly noting that those who oppose us, and appease torturers and dictators (i.e.: the UN) or whores for financial gain - (i.e. the French), will not benefit from American tax dollars while our soldiers shed their blood. The French, Russians and Germans can kiss our ass if they want a rapproachment of relations. By making this very clear we raise the stakes next time someone dithers on whether to join a coalition. The public bitch-slap is well worth any antiamerican sentiment it raises in those already predisposed to same
Posted by: Frank G ||
12/12/2003 11:13 Comments ||
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#4
the neat thing about this is that none of the democrats will criticize it because the unions want to keep have as many Americans as possible get contracts.
the bad part is that we should have made it at least partially open (we could have established a catagory for specialized work with limited availability of coalition contractors) and let the Iraqis get pissed off about letting the axis of weavils in.
#5
Jarhead, understood. But one of the main benefits is a public demonstration of what it costs to do as France et al did. This is necessary in order to make it easier going for us in the future.
Doing it all behind the scenes, so that the targets might not even know that they have been whacked, will not have that effect.
Posted by: Carl in N.H. ||
12/12/2003 11:22 Comments ||
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#6
Rules of politics, Chicago-style:
Rule #1: reward your friends.
Rule #2: punish your enemies.
GWB had to let Chirac and the Weasels know that when you cross us, there's a price to be paid. That's rule #2, and you can't do it quietly behind the scenes: it has to be in the open so that everyone else gets the message. GWB as a member of the Bush family understands this as well as any Daley.
Posted by: Steve White ||
12/12/2003 12:11 Comments ||
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#7
Gentlemen, your points are noted. I'm not letting any of their gov'ts off here, & yes, I still think they suck a donkey's nuts but I would ask you to consider the following though:
everything is time & place. I'm all for skull-fucking them as you all well know from what my chosen occupation is. However, I look at the steel tarrifs issue as one example of ways they can manipulate our center of gravity (economic production). One must always negotiate from a position of strength (or appear to.) Putting Canada on the list was a mistake. They put up big cash, their folks know, they're our number 1 trading partner, and moron-boy Chretien is out the door. I'm not a diplomatic guy by trade, but at least we should've opened things w/Martin on some sort of positive note. Our northern flank is of considerable significance to me and their immigration laws are making that a vulnerability we cannot afford to have. This would've given us bargaining power. Consider that.
I'm also all for the public bitch-slap when it presents itself. However, we made statements about a month ago that all dissenting nations to our actions in Iraq need to forgive past debts and let bygones be bygones, then unfortunately, we've set a precedent across the board. (I would've never made the statement in the first place, I would've told them all to pound sand and try to find Sammie to collect, but since it has been made, and we are about one of the only honorable countries left that means we follow through to some degree) However, that does not mean in anyway we have to come through on contracts (certainly not to Frogistan or the Commies anyways, I'd rather eat a pile of monkey shit), but, letting them think that would've played into our hands. Again, time and place for smash mouth, & time & place for behind the scenes deception and guile. The French and Russians probably never expected to get anything anyways. (they would never of got anything from me) However, making the public statement makes it a public discussion. (I know, I don't really give a shit what they think either but let me continue) Keeping it down probably would've kept it under most people's radar except the very well-informed, i.e. the normal Rangtburger. And since when did we, the strongest nation on earth give a f*ck about the need to make anything public to show our might, the action itself of considering the contract and then brushing it aside would've of been enough for their gov't's to get the picture, (yes, we can play your game as well, but you will live by our rules.)
Contractual bids were an opportunity for manipulation on our fair weather allies. I think we should've dangled that carrot for all its worth. By closing it off so openly & quickly was a tactical mistake that could've been milked more. I prefer a well executed ambush no matter how covert to an open demonstration that looks sexy, but does not in the long run, imho, provide us the tactical advantage and initiative. That's the bottomline. We have wanted them to forgive the Iraqi debts, we could of secured that, I believe, w/giving them almost nothing in return except a little face saving. I know many will disagree w/me, that's okay, I'm a big boy, these are just my two cents.
#9
JH, (btw I was a Marine, but that was backalong) as far as this should've been overt/covert, arguable. But you hit it with one thing; those debts belong, not to Iraq, but to the criminals that ran the place for a while. We understand it's a lot of marks/franks/rubles, so go ahead and find Sammie to collect. Let us know where you find him.
There was a controversy about debts vs. regime change in embryonic US history, too, but it was about War of Independence debt to France, and the regime change was by the lenders, not the borrowers, and it was about recognition, not of the debt, but the repayment. And there has been a regime change like that here. The Iraqis should argue off the top their "Russian" debt was money Sammie borrowed from Brezhnev.
Rule number 3 of politics is divide your enemies - this not only pushes Germany back toward France and Russia, it puts Canada under Martin in with them as well.
Rule number 4 is timing: this looks a lot better when we're clearly willing (which I hope we will be within a couple of months) than after a couple of bad months. It also would be best to wait until after we've further resolved the political situation in IRaq (which we have to take to the UNSC on Dec. 15) and till we're farther along on Iraqi debt renegotiations. I also agree with JH, we could have done the punishment more discreetly - we could still have explained it for the history books later, if more deterrent effect is warranted. I note Kristol and Kagans public disagreement with this in the Weekly Standard - theyre no euro lovers or knee jerk multilateralists.
There is already talk that Canada's status will be changed, and the White House Press office is indicating debt forgiveness will be enough to change status, even as Bush makes silly remarks (which will be picked up all over Europe) about international law. Pardon, but this is looking more and more like hamhanded incompetence. Maybe later it will look retrospectively brilliant - I certainly hope so.
#11
I've definitely had mixed feelings on this move as well. But, I think (hope) that Bush & Co is playing this right. Look for Martin to join the fold. He wasn't PM when this decision was actually made. Now we negotiate. And I am confident that Canada with their new PM will come on board in some manner. As for the Axis of Weasels. Well, fuck France first and foremost. Second, none of the three had made any commitments to actually HELP Iraq. They were donating nothing. And they were not going to forgive any of the Iraqi debt. And we had no leverage to get anything out of them. Now we do, several billion. My prediction is that Germany and Russia will negotiate some deals, either more assistance or debt forgiveness. They want these contracts, and not just for the money. They know that the Iraqis have labeled them as 'NOT A FRIEND'. Iraq is sitting on lots of oil. Pretty simple math. As for France, fuck france and the whore she road in on.
#13
The public bitch-slap can be a remarkably effective communication tool. In this case it is good for Americans and the rest of the world.
"You treat me good, I treat you better. Treat me bad, I'll treat you worse." Certainly not the Sermon on the Mount, but clear and concise.
#14
Ok let's analyze that "bitch slap" a little. How many contracts would have gone to Germany, France, Russia anyway? One each? Maybe. Probably one of the smaller ones as well, worth less than a billion dollars. Profit? 200 million maybe? Before taxes? Compared to debts that are 25 times as high? Doesn't sound like an excellent haggling position for the U.S. to me.
Do you really think a government changes its politics for a sum like that. For a contract that it is not even sure of winning? Oh, not the government is bidding btw.
Then again, most of these contracts will be sub-contracted. Profits may be lesser but still profits will be made. And the subcontractors will be those who actually work in Iraq. Siemens workers doing a good job in Iraq will actually do more good for Germany than Siemens having the main contract and sub-contracting. And you can bet that Siemens will do more work in Iraq, on projects they had before. They have the know how, the spare parts, the contacts. We want solutions which are best for Iraq now, don't we?
And you may like it or not: Iraqis have NOT labeled Germany as "NOT A FRIEND". Personal experiences supersede political irritations and Germans have good records working with Iraqis. This hasn't got much to do with Saddam. It's not Chalabi and his fellows who can finish off these good relations.
Kristol and Kagan have it right. (WOW, am I saying this?) Ask Rumsfeld how well "bitch slapping" worked in early 2003. Ask Baker what he thinks about it.
Don't you think that Schroeder and Chirac may just be fuming in public and rejoicing in private? Schroeder and Bush agreeing in New York to "put the past behind and work together for a free Iraq", and now this. France, Russia and Germany will just lean back comfortably now and wait. Whatever might go wrong in Iraq will be blamed on the U.S. (only succes has many fathers). Wonderful opportunities for cheap excuses. Europe's destiny in Iraq will not be decided in 2004, with some reconstruction contracts won or not.
And LH has it right with the president's stupid remark about international law. Funny thing, it's not so much about international "law" (Schroeder's remark was not accurate ) but WTO regulations. But what will stick is Bush's "disrespect" for international law.
That said, Germany will forgive Iraq's debt, I'm rather sure of that. But probably not tomorrow. Saddam's pre 1990 debts (and that's the debt we're talking about because after that it was cash only) has been written off long ago.
The Russians and French might prove to be tougher cookies. And Wolfowitz certainly didn't do anything to make them more palatable.
#15
As usual, the question is pragmatism vs principle. It would be very helpful in the short run to kiss and make up - particularly with Canada (remember that 3300 mile open border) and maybe Russia.
On the other hand people died, US, Iraqi and allies, because France, Russia and Germany allied themselves with Saddam. In the long run, paying a heavy economic and political price may make these self-serving hypocrits remember why they were allies in the first place... big dog, little dog.
On the third hand (to steal from Larry Niven), Those mokes made it personal, pissed me off and I want them hurt. Badly.
#16
As I read the story this morning, I burst out laughing and chalked one more reason why I am prone to vote for this guy again next year, barring a CNN breaking story of him pulling out his pee-pee for the intern girl. His comment was made after he took questions, and the answers to all those other preceding questions were immediately thrown down the garbage shoot, because the above comment had that beautiful "sound bite" quality to it. Hell, he could have spent the next half hour saying he was endorsing Howard Dean, and we still wouldn't have heard about it, because little "Tommy Reporter" had run off wetting his pants to get Bushes "off the cuff" comments into play in the media.
As far as the chess game being played regarding "inclusion" on the bid list, I am beginning to sense that the move might be so public so that impacted French, German and Russian businesses do a little arm twisting from within the economies to the politicans to to start changing positions a little... The coalition has passed the hat on troops, support or at least money and every time the hat comes back light. This time George has Wolfie standing out next to the Salvation Army kettle ringing the bell to see if the worlds "Playas" continue to walk right past. From a 50,000 foot view, I can't see where France or Russia was going to help out anyway, I think Germany would have come around some, but only after "appeasing" France, and Canada will have its tit released from the ringer by year end but after some additional commitmants to get into the game.
I can't think of a scenario any longer that would have seen France or Russia pony up anyway so are the French planning on hating Bush worse? Not possible.
Working through subcontractors peels away a layer of profit, and keeps US Treasury checks made out to more grateful business partners.
#17
Also, most of these "French" and "German" and "Russian" companies are actually "multinationals". Sureley Siemens has a British/Aussie/Spanish unit that would be able to submit bids?
#18
2004 is THE election year. Last time I checked, Chirac, Schroder, Martin et al do not have a vote. While the Dems may complain about the unilateral nature of the decision, this is entirely a play to GW's political base. Those that bleed deserve the reward.
Canada was clearly against coalition interference Iraq from the outset. So let them whine. Keep in mind, Martin comes from the same political roots as Chretien. He even today reappointed Chretien's idiotarian foreign minister, Bill Graham. So do not go easy on Canada. Their Liberal government still does not get it.
Posted by: john ||
12/12/2003 20:23 Comments ||
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#19
The term for the Saddam-era Iraqi loans is odious debt, given its use for weapons and palaces. And it's a good bet to be repudiated when there is once again a sovereign Iraqi government. Rather than going hat in hand for debt forgiveness, Baker is more likely telling the Weasels to make a deal now while they can, at any terms.
On the 9th, there was a story about Amgad Gawhar Suliman, an ICDC trooper who was shot during a train robbery but survived because the bullet hit a magazine for the weapon that he was carrying. Hereâs a photo of the guy and the magazine. A half an inch difference, and ouch!
In remarks that could prove troublesome for President Hipolito Mejiaâs shaky administration, a top U.S. official said Dominican troops were expected to stay in Iraq for eight months longer.
I didn't even know DR had troops there...
U.S. Assistant Secretary of State Roger Noriega said Wednesday that the Dominican troops would stay until August - a claim that contradicted Dominican assertions that troops would be home by February. "President (Hipolito) Mejia said they would be in Iraq a whole year and we expect them to be there," said Noriega, who was on a visit to the Spanish-speaking country to discuss the nationâs economic crisis. Noriegaâs statement could cause problems for Mejia, who is already suffering in opinion polls as he tries for re-election in May. Dominican Gen. Jose Miguel Soto Jimenez said last week the countryâs 302 troops would come home in February and they were not likely to be replaced. Rafael Peralta, a spokesman for Mejia, reiterated the promise on Wednesday. What we have here is a failure to communicate.
Dozens of editorials have derided Mejia for getting involved in the U.S.-led war in Iraq, arguing that the so-called war on terror is not the Dominican Republicâs business.
Not until something blows up, anyway...
Two minor attacks on Dominican troops, in which no one was injured, have also stirred rumors of fatalities and have fueled front page stories. Demonstrations have already erupted on the neighboring island of Puerto Rico, with increasing numbers of islanders demanding that the American troops of Puerto Rican ancestry Puerto Rican troops be returned to the Spanish-speaking U.S. territory. More than 1,000 Puerto Rican troops are serving in the Middle East and at least 11 have been killed in Iraq. When/if PR becomes independent, they can call them "Puerto Rican troops". Til then theyâre Americans, dammit.
Posted by: Steve White ||
12/12/2003 1:38:16 AM ||
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#1
but theyre not just "of puerto rican ancestry" - somebody born in the Bronx of Puerto Rican parents is of Puerto Rican ancestry - someone born and living in San Juan is a Puerto Rican, just as someone born and living in Dallas is a Texan. "Troops who are Puerto Ricans" maybe?
#2
There are a lot of Army troops from Puerto Rico who go through the Defense Language Institute English Language Center here at Lackland to learn english before they go to Basic training. They are all volunteers and are damm proud to be American Soldiers. This is just another rant by the lefties on PR who hate America.
#3
more verbal diarrhea from the PR welfare state. Send those 1,000 back to hand out towels at Roosevelt Roads and collect from Uncle Sugar, that's what they want, all the benefits, none of the burden.
#4
Jarhead, I must, with respect, disagree and side with ManwithNoName. I personally know 3 men who have lived in Puerto Rico their entire lives expect for the time they spent in the U.S. Army. The are damn proud to be Americans and damn proud to have served. For that matter, I found Puerto Ricans to get very upset when some idiot from the 'mainland' doesn't realize Puerto Ricans are born U.S. citizens. The leftists made Vieques the debacle it was, not the majority of PR.
A Time magazine reporter suffered severe shrapnel wounds and lost his hand when he tried to throw away a grenade tossed into a Humvee he was riding in with a Time photographer and two U.S. soldiers, colleagues said Thursday. Time senior correspondent Michael Weisskopf and contributing photographer James Nachtwey were traveling with a U.S. Army patrol in Baghdad Wednesday night when the attack occurred, a statement from Time managing editor Jim Kelly said. The soldiers also were wounded, the U.S. military said, but gave no further information. Time would not offer details on the incident. But a memo sent to Weisskopfâs former colleagues at The Washington Post said he picked up the grenade and tossed it out of the Humvee. It exploded, blowing off his hand and wounding him in the chest and arms. The memo said Nachtwey received shrapnel wounds that were not as serious. "According to people he works with at Time, he picked up the grenade and tossed it out, losing his right hand in the process while saving four lives," the memo said. Wowzers. Talk about split-second decision-making.
A military spokesman said they were with a unit of the Armyâs 1st Armored Division. The military official, who spoke only condition of anonymity, said one of the journalists was severely wounded and the other was slightly injured, but would not say which. Time said both were in stable condition and were awaiting transfer to a U.S. military hospital in Landstuhl, Germany. Nachtwey is an award-winning photographer known for haunting images of war and poverty. He was the subject of a 2001 Oscar-nominated documentary, "War Photographer," and has won many awards. This year he shared a $1 million Dan David prize for documenting "the apocalyptic events of our time." Weisskopf is an award-winning correspondent based in Washington. He covers national politics and investigations and was a finalist in the 1996 Pulitzer Prize for national reporting. We Rantburgers have issues with lots of media people, but what Mr. Weisskopf did was to save his own life and that of the troopers in the Humvee with him. For that heâs earned my gratitude. My prayers for him, Nachtwey and the troopers.
Posted by: Steve White ||
12/12/2003 1:32:58 AM ||
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#1
Michael Weisskopf is one of the better reporters at Time. He's also a hero. God be with you, brave friend.
Posted by: Mike ||
12/12/2003 6:09 Comments ||
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#2
Won't the media elite brand him as a traitor to their cause? After all, he actual took action that was beneficial to the interests of the United States and her military. From their perspective to would be better to be disinterested and dead than help to bring democracy to Iraq.
Posted by: Scott ||
12/12/2003 7:07 Comments ||
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#3
"Injured" sure is a broad category - from loss of a limb and other permanent impairments, to the cliched "flesh wound."
Posted by: The Commissar ||
12/12/2003 8:37 Comments ||
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#4
Scott: I'm sure we're going to be seeing several stories highlighting Weisskopf in the upcoming weeks -- after all, he's one of their own.
#5
My prayers go out to Weisskoph. His quick thinking saved not only his family, but three other families as well, from having to pick up their loved ones body at a morgue.
Posted by: Charles ||
12/12/2003 10:43 Comments ||
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Kinda spinning the hero angle a little hard, aren't you? He was in the vehicle at the time, anybody would have thrown it out. Sorry to be cynical, I just wonder how the story would have been spun had he been outside shooting pictures. "US Troops Fail To Capture Hearts, Minds, Grenade" perhaps?
US plans to create a new Iraqi army have suffered a setback after hundreds of recruits resigned. The armyâs first 700-man battalion lost 300 troops who were within weeks of being deployed, Pentagon officials say. The battalion is the only one trained so far for what is eventually hopted to be a 40,000-strong force. The US-led coalition in Iraq has played down the incident, saying it was just a dispute over pay and many more men were ready to join up. "They used to be paid two dollars a month and now the recruits are being paid $60 a month, but they feel they ought to be paid more than that," he told the BBc World Serviceâs Newshour programme. "Thatâs fine, if thatâs what they want, then they can go find another job. There are plenty of people queuing up to join the new Iraqi army."
Posted by: Paul Moloney ||
12/12/2003 12:00:56 AM ||
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#1
Yup--ya gotta pay us more if we're gonna get blown up by the Fedayeen remnants
#2
So they figured out that life in the private sector might be more profitable. Good for them. This says that the economy in Iraq is expected to pick up in the near future, if it's not already doing better. Secondly, the ones that stay are the ones that we want. The only bad thing about this that I can think of is if they left to join the other side.
Posted by: Rafael ||
12/12/2003 2:42 Comments ||
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mmm the republican mind ahaha...everything that happens in IRAQ IS PROGRESS..if terrorist blow up cops it is a good thing and a sign of desparation..now desertion is a good thing...werent they(new Iraqi Army) supposed to be free and proud of their country and ready to die for it ..is this the future of the IRAQI aRMY...40% desertion within a fortnight. So If perennially under-paid American soldiers go Awol it will be sign thAT Bush's tax cuts are working ahaah
#4
Desertions? Oh geez, I'm sorry. I thought the story was about resignations. I stand corrected.
Posted by: Rafael ||
12/12/2003 3:27 Comments ||
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If you want to argue Rafael's point, it would do well to actually argue the point he made. Which is a good one, that this resignation is basically of people who are not committed to the defense of their own country. The ones that stayed, are the ones we want and the Iraqi people need.
Instead of creating straw men, and simply laughing at the point, you might want to engage your brain. Amazing how well it will improve your percieved credibility.
Posted by: Ben ||
12/12/2003 3:28 Comments ||
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#6
Things are improving in Iraq. A year ago these recruits would have lost an ear or worse.
#8
Finding the right level of pay for a volunteer army isn't always easy, especially when an economy is immature and hasn't stabilized around price levels for other goods and services yet.
Saddam's economy was extremely distorted; for the last decade+ it really was barely an economy at all and certainly not a market economy where prices reflect value. The trick to paying volunteer soldiers is to ensure a sufficiently decent lifestyle so that you attract good people, without feathering the nest so much that you attract those who aren't dedicated to serving.
Yup, when my husband was a junior officer we did need dedication, because nobody gets rich as a 1LT or a Captain.
I don't know what the right salary is for enlistees in Iraq, but I'm pretty sure this is the line of thinking behind the pay rate we've established.
Of course, one could build the kind of unionized army that several European countries have, but we probably want an effective fighting force in Iraq ...
#9
The prime issue was that they were being paid as much as the cops and the civil defense folks, and, of course, the army has more prestige!
I'm afraid the secondary issue was that they wanted the training and insight into operations. That's a bad thing and I hope we have good info on the home addresses of these guys.
#10
There's also the possibility that veterans of Saddam's "army" expected the new army to be another cushy job, but found that Western training methods require brains and hard work.
We are talking about a part of the world known for being piss-poor with maintenance, training, etc.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 9:16 Comments ||
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400 is 1% of the standing 40,000 desired, and Chicken Stevey sez the sky is falling. Please, stevey, find a paper bag and take some deep breaths. Better yet, stick your head in a plastic bag and seal it.
This isn't great news, but it's not the end of the world either. Even if 100% stayed in, 700 soldiers is but a drop in the bucket. At least with the 400 remaining we know who is serious and willing to commit, and they will be invaluable in using their training to instruct still more troops.
Note, too, that these are paid volunteers, not conscripts. At least now they have the freedom to resign without being tortured and shot--immediately after their families have been tortured and shot.
Posted by: Dar ||
12/12/2003 9:24 Comments ||
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#12
When I went through OCS in Quantico, after week 7 of the 10 week program, Officer candidates had fulfilled their legal obligation of officer training and could DOR (drop on request) if desired. There are always some that do that. Good I say. Leaves the ones who want to still play. Resignation is much different then desertion - just ask the Russians.
#13
"...now the recruits are being paid $60 a month..." Not enough, maybe? What's /capita income in Iraq? The Marines paid me about $106 a month to start.
CAPTURED Abu Sayyaf leader Ghalib Andang, alias Commander Robot, may reveal all under interrogation, but he remains a prime candidate for the death penalty, a military spokesman said on Friday.
Unless the people he rats out get to him first...
âI donât think he can escape the death penalty,â said Lt. Col. Daniel Lucero, the public information chief of the Armed Forces. âThereâs a big possibility that the death penalty would be meted against him for his cases.â
Doesn't provide much of an incentive to talk, unless we get into the actual mechanics of execution...
Andang, captured by the military in Indanan, Sulu, on Sunday, has a string of kidnapping and murder charges against him. The government is planning to turn him into a principal witness against government and civilian personalities who benefited from the over P400 million in ransom paid to the Abu Sayyaf in 2001. The military is waiting for Andangâs full recovery before they interrogate him. Andang on Tuesday underwent a two-hour mid-thigh operation that resulted in the amputation of his left leg.
At least if he runs away he'll be easy to catch...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
12/12/2003 22:47 ||
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#1
Dead Men Can't Talk, so he can't rat out all the cops that are in on all those 'kidnappings'.
Zimbabwe president Robert Mugabe has stepped up his war against Western "white racist bullies" by accusing Britain of using the Internet to destroy his country. Laughing Bob, addressing the World Summit on the Information Society in Geneva, asserted that information technology is dominated "by a few countries in the selfish interests of those countries which are in quest of global dominance and hegemony". He singled out Britain, the US and Canada as attempting to "challenge our sovereignty through hostile and malicious broadcasts calculated to foment instability and destroy the state through divisions".
Been reading Rantburg, has he?
Email and the Internet are pretty well the only lines of communication still open to Mugabeâs opponents - among them the much-harrassed Movement for Democratic Change - and, despite controlling all broadcasting and press in Zimbabwe, the embattled and impoverished president simply doesnât have the resources to control the flow of electronic dissent.
Itâs natural, then, that Mugabe would finger IT as a tool of colonial bogeymen.
#4
...despite controlling all broadcasting and press in Zimbabwe, the embattled and impoverished president simply doesnât have the resources to control the flow of electronic dissent.
So that is the source of the real beef with the "white racist bullies." Bob has all the resources, so he is going to have a little higher overhead stifling electronic dissent. Sorry,Bob, that's the cost of doing business as a dictator.
Posted by: Alaska Paul ||
12/12/2003 17:39 Comments ||
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#5
Can't think of a better endorsment for keeping the government out of control of the Internet.
Hundreds of protesters in north-east Kenya have taken part in a demonstration against a free medical camp being run by American marines. Some of the protesters, most of whom were ethnic Somalis, threw stones at the hotel housing the Americans in the town of Garissa. BBC reporter Bashkash Jugsuday in Garrisa says several people were injured when Kenyan police repulsed the protestors. Mr Jugsuday said that Islamic religious leaders are opposed to the free medical camp. However, many residents have turned up for treatment since it was opened to the public three days ago. The protestors set road blocks on fire as they engaged policemen in running battles.
#2
OK. So the BBC has the space on its website for an anti-American protest in all-important Garissa, Kenya, but no space for an anti-terrorist demonstration in downtown Baghdad?
Posted by: Matt ||
12/12/2003 16:29 Comments ||
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#3
The American warmongeres dare to suck the Kenyan people in with their evil tentacles. We don't need no stinkin' meds.
#7
By being so crass as to be armed, these thoughtless imperialists are denying the inherent right of the "citizens" in all African cultures and countries (especially if the natives be Mooslims) to loot the place and make an honest buck. Damned shameful, methinks.
#9
Honestly, I don't think it had anything to do with the presence of weapons. Fer crissake, in some of these shitholes an RPG is nearly a marital aid!
No, I think it had MUCH more to do with Muslim griping about Christian charities. Yes, I realize it was run by Marines, but, dammit, the Islamists have been calling every American "Crusaders", and I really doubt the rioters took the time to consider separation of church and state.
I'm pretty sure there have been stories here on Rantburg detailing the whines over Christian charities in Muslim lands. The Islamists don't like it, and have no doubt been spreading all sorts of lies about them.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 17:06 Comments ||
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#10
The BBC reserves anti-US news space like some companies reserve space on air freighters. It is always there so might as well fill it up. Certain Muslims or Islamists whine about Christian or rather Infidel charities in Muslim lands because they see it as competition. I say, keep "competing." It gets their turbans in a twist, and that is at least an innocent source of merriment.
#13
A small detachment of Marines on a humanitarian mission shows up in town, and the locals react like it was D-Day and Desert Storm rolled into one.
"Nobody panic! Nobody panic! We ain't scared of no Marines, are we? ... OK, we are."
Oderint dum metuant.
Posted by: Matt ||
12/12/2003 20:04 Comments ||
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#14
Which does make one wonder--why do we even care? I just hope we open abortion clinics there so we don't have to deal with the human turds coming outta their wombs
EFL - one cartoonistâs response to the gnashing of teeth and breast-beating engendered by one of his âtoons. Itâs reasonably humorous, particularly if you share his distrust of organized religion as practiced in the 21st century.
Last year, I drew a cartoon that showed a man in Middle Eastern apparel at the wheel of a Ryder truck hauling a nuclear warhead. The caption read, "What Would Mohammed Drive?" Besides referring to the vehicle that Timothy McVeigh rode into Oklahoma City, the drawing was a takeoff on the "What Would Jesus Drive?" campaign created by Christian evangelicals to challenge the morality of owning gas-guzzling SUVs. The cartoonâs main target, of course, was the faith-based politics of a different denomination. Predictably, the Shiite hit the fan.
Can you say "fatwa"? My newspaper, The Tallahassee Democrat, and I received more than 20,000 e-mails demanding an apology for misrepresenting the peace-loving religion of the Prophet Mohammed â or else. Some spelled out the "else": death, mutilation, Internet spam. "I will cut your fingers and put them in your motherâs ass." "What you did, Mr. Dog, will cost you your life. Soon you will join the dogs . . . hahaha in hell." "Just wait . . . we will see you in hell with all jews . . . ."
The onslaught was orchestrated by an organization called the Council on American-Islamic Relations. CAIR bills itself as an "advocacy group." I was to discover that among the followers of Islam it advocated for were the men convicted of the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center. At any rate, its campaign against me included flash-floods of e-mail intended to shut down servers at my newspaper and my syndicate, as well as viruses aimed at my home computer. The controversy became a subject of newspaper editorials, columns, Web logs, talk radio, and CNN. I was condemned on the front page of the Saudi publication Arab News by the secretary general of the Muslim World League.
#2
When the truth hits close to home, some people will take it well and others won't. The current state of the Middle East sure does explain a lot of things...
:)
#3
If you're gonna draw 'em out of their holes (not very hard to do), you have to be ready with the tongs and your basic heavy burlap bag.
A threat of cutting off one's fingers and putting them in one's mother's ass is, um, colorful, no? I wonder what social norms spawned this colloquialism / idiomatic (idiotarian?) little jewel... Boggles.
#7
I'd like to see somebody set up a website where people can submit all the lovely letters they've received from representatives of the Religion of Peace. It would make for some entertaining reading, and would probably open a whole lot of eyes.
#9
Presumably, victimization was one of their motives for leaving their native countries, yet the subtext of many of their letters was that this country should be more like the ones they emigrated from.
Heh. He hit the nail on the head. The CAIRites are upset that offending Islam is not a capital offense in the US.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 21:05 Comments ||
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#10
Mohommad would also have a chain link steering wheel, fuzzy dice, and shag on the dash.......
From East-West-Intel
SEOUL â South Korea emerged this year as the biggest export market for North Korea since the South-North economic exchanges began 15 years ago. According to the statistics released last week, North Korea delivered $233.75 million worth of goods to South Korea from January to October this year, a 29.9 percent increase over the corresponding period a year earlier and surpassing Chinaâs import amount by $2.12 million for the first time. So SKOR is the big player in keeping the NORKS afloat.
Japanâs imports from North Korea, on the other hand, decreased by 29.2 percent during the same period to $130 million. This reflects an anti-North Korean sentiment in Japan triggered by Pyongyangâs admittance of having kidnapped Japanese citizens. The statistics were compiled by Korea Trade-Investment Promotion Agency (KOTRA), Korea Trade Association and the Ministry of Unification. The South-North direct trade began with a meager $18 million exchange in 1989, rose to more than $100 million in 1991 and reached $200 million in 1995. The volume fell sharply in 1998 to $92.2million when South Korea was hit by a currency crisis and sought an IMF emergency bailout. But it has been increasing steadily since 1999. Most of the imports from North Korea are processed by North Korean workers for small and medium size South Korean companies suffering from the high domestic labor costs. Low cost grass-eating slave labor, way to go, SKOR
Currently, about 177 South Korean companies benefit from the cheap labor in North Korea. Thousands of South Korean small businesses that had turned to China for cheaper wages now are hoping to use North Korean labor when the Kaesong industrial complex is completed. That complex will be situated near South Korea, allowing businessmen to even commute. The Juche commute.
Unlike China, there will be no communication problems with workers. Same language, and if they donât cooperate, liquidate.
When a railway connection is completed between the South and North, businessmen will save time and shipping expenses for exports to the European market. What now takes 30 days by ship would require only a week by the trans-Siberian or trans-China railroad transportation. More than 1,400 small South Korean companies have applied for subscription rights at the Kaesong complex. Korea Land Development Corporation, which jointly developed the complex with Hyundai Asan, started constructing the site administration office on Dec. 11. And that, ladies and gentlemen, is how we will help the NORKS maintain their military and WoT machine. Thank you, SKOR.
Posted by: Alaska Paul ||
12/12/2003 3:51:00 PM ||
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North Korea invents - trees!:
Pyongyang, December 11 (KCNA) --A new species of willow draws great interest of stockbreeding and environmental experts in the Democratic Peopleâs Republic of Korea. The cross-fertilized tree grows 4-4.5 meters more than other species of willow every year and its life span is 1-1.5 times longer than that of the latter. Its leaf contains some 30 percent of protein and other nutritive substances necessary for goat, cattle and other grass-eating animals. "Yumm, salad!"
The tree grows well in damp places, so it is recommended to plant the tree near rivers and lakes and at the foot of mountains for the purpose of environmental protection. It has already been planted in Pyongyang, South Phyongan Province, South Hwanghae Province and other areas. This is the weapons breakthrough I warned about. Fasten the super flat rocks to the willow branch with improved leather straps and you have a deadly stone axe!
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 3:49:55 PM ||
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The Axes of Steves!
Posted by: john ||
12/12/2003 19:32 Comments ||
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Steve and I have both predicted, after they invented the rock, that they would invent the stick next. First, of course, they had to discover the tree...
Posted by: Fred ||
12/12/2003 21:54 Comments ||
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Former Azerbaijani President Geidar Aliev, a former KGB general and Communist Party chief who brought stability to a nation plagued by insurgencies, died Friday at the Cleveland Clinic. Aliev had been admitted to the hospital Aug. 6 for treatment of congestive heart failure and kidney problems. Hospital spokesman Cole Hatcher declined to provide details of the cause of death Friday. "One or the other, flip a coin"
His son, Ilham Aliev, succeeded him in office following Oct. 15 presidential elections in what many claimed was the first dynastic handover of power in a former Soviet country. Ilham is already grooming his son to succeed him.
The elder Aliev stifled dissent, censored news media and enforced a blockade on archrival Armenia. But he remained widely popular in Azerbaijan, where he cultivated the image of a wise grandfather who is not to be crossed, and decorated the streets with his portraits and slogans. Theyâll be painting icons with his face on them now.
In the 1940s and 1950s, Aliev rose through the ranks of the Soviet secret police under dictator Josef Stalin and became head of the Azerbaijani KGB in 1967. He was a protege of former Soviet leader Leonid Brezhnev. From 1969 to 1982, he ran Azerbaijan as the republicâs Communist Party leader. He became a candidate member of the national partyâs Politburo in 1976 and a full member in 1982, reaching the pinnacle of Soviet power. Aliev returned to his native Nakhichevan, an autonomous region on the border with Iran and Turkey that is separated from the rest of the nation by a long strip of Armenian territory. In 1990 he became chairman of Nakhichevanâs legislature and deputy chairman of the national legislature. Two years earlier, fighting had broken out in Nagorno-Karabakh, an ethnic Armenian enclave inside Azerbaijan. Armenian fighters drove Azerbaijani forces from the disputed region and seized nearby areas of Azerbaijan proper.
This was after the Azeris had swooped down on N-K to do a little ethnic cleansing in the military equipment they'd looted from the Soviets. Since the Armenians had done a little looting, too, the results were pretty tragic for the Azeris...
In 1993, humiliated by their battlefield losses, some 45,000 soldiers seized control over about half the country and demanded the ouster of President Abulfaz Elchibey.
It was easier to get rid of Elchibey than it was to get rid of the Armenians, even after they cut off the electricity to N-K in the winter time...
Aliev became parliament speaker in a government reshuffle forced by the rebels. Elchibey fled, and Aliev took his place. "If I were not here (in 1993), I do not know what would have happened with the republic," Aliev later told the Russian newspaper Komsomolskaya Pravda. "After all, no one was found besides me who could save the people. ... Azerbaijan would have split into several parts." Just a kindly grandfather type, heâll be missed. Hey, some people still miss Joe Stalin.
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 3:16:07 PM ||
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#1
Aliev and Noorani down in the same day. Any word on Mubarak or Arafish????
#4
Former Azerbaijani President Geidar Aliev, a former KGB general and Communist Party chief who brought stability to a nation plagued by insurgencies
Yeah! A Golden Oldie!
Kidney Failure again? Geez... I guess the US leads in that kind of plumbing too. Speaking of course of (for profit) dialysis centers on every block.
Op Piece by Michelle Malkin
From the moment John Allen Muhammad and Lee Malvo were arrested in the Beltway-area sniper case last fall, the media and Muslim activists wanted us to believe that the serial killings had absolutely nothing to do with Islamic terrorism.
"Nope. Nope. Not possible..."
CNN downplayed Muhammadâs religious conversion âcalling him by his old name, John Allen Williams, when his identity was first revealed. Malvo was cast as a clueless dupe with no true convictions. Nihad Awad of the Council on American-Islamic Relations argued: "There is no indication that this case is related to Islam or Muslims." Chicago Sun Times columnist Richard Roeper railed against conservative commentators such as the indomitable Mark Steyn who had taken note of Muhammadâs Islamic faith and his reported expressed anti-American sentiments after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks. Roeper also ridiculed National Review columnist James Robbins for astutely observing that the sniper was acting "like a jihadist warrior." Roeper smugly lied concluded: "...an awful lot of conservatives really, really wanted the snipers to be terrorists. But they were wrong. Iâll say that because they never will."
Might there be a reason they never will?
Now it is time for Roeper, CAIR, and the militant Religion of Peace propagandists to face the facts once and for all. Donât hold your breath
A chilling stack of evidence, introduced by Malvoâs own lawyers last week at his capital murder trial, exposes accused sniper Malvo as an unrepentant Muslim extremist. He may not have been a card-carrying member of al Qaeda, but as Claremont Institute fellow John Hinderaker notes on Powerlineblog.com, Malvo was more of a "freelance" Islamofascist-as legions of aggrieved fanatics around the world are. Malvoâs violent drawings and anti-American and anti-Semitic rantings show him to be every bit as blood-thirsty, hatemongering, and martyr-craving as any Sept. 11 hijacker or Palestinian suicide bomber. Among Malvoâs jailhouse artwork, (online at (< a href="http://www.fairfaxcounty.gov/courts/cases/malvo_defendant_exhibits.htm"> http://www.fairfaxcounty.gov/courts/cases/malvo_defendant_exhibits.htm):
Exhibit 65__06: A self-portrait of Malvo in the cross hairs of a gun scope shouting, "ALLAH AKBAR!" The word "SALAAM" scrawled vertically. A poem: "Many more will have to suffer. Many more will have to die. Donât ask me why."
Exhibit 65__013: The word "INSHALLAH" above a portrait glorifying "Muammar Kaddafi" as "The Liberator" dressed in full military regalia.
Exhibit 65_016: A portrait of Saddam Hussein with the words "INSHALLAH" and "The Protector," surrounded by rockets labeled "chem" and "nuk" (sic).
Exhibit 65_043: Father and son portrait of Malvo and Muhammad. "We will kill them all. Jihad."
Exhibit 65_056: A self portrait of Malvo as sniper, lying in wait, with his rifle. "JIHAD" written in bold letters.
Exhibit 65_057: A drawing of the Twin Towers burning with a plane flying toward the buildings. Captions: "JIHAD ISLAM UNITE RISE!" along with "America did this" and "You were warned." Portrait of Malvo as sniper labeled "Believer" and portrait of Osama bin Laden labeled "prophet." A poem: "Our minarets are our bayonets, Our mosques are our baracks (sic), Our believers are our soldiers." The American flag and the Star of David drawn in cross hairs.
Exhibit 65_067:. A suicide bomber labeled "Hamas" walking into a McDonaldâs restaurant. Another drawing of the Twin Towers burning captioned: "85 percent chance Zionists did this." More scrawls: "ALLAH AKBAR," "JIHAD," and "Islam will explode."
Exhibit 65_103: A lion accompanies chapter and verse from the Koran ("Sura 2:190"): "Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you and slay them whoever ye catch them."
Exhibit 65_109: Portrait of Osama bin Laden, captioned "Servant of Allah."
Exhibit 65_117: The White House drawn in crosshairs, surrounded by missiles, with a warning: "Sep. 11 we will ensure will look like a picnic to you" and "you will bleed to death little by little."
Exhibit 65_133: Reference to "Islamic counter attack force.ICAF."
Exhibit 65_114: Self-portrait of Malvo as sniper. Rant says "they all died and they all deserved it."
Exhibit 65_101: Malvoâs thought for the day: "Islam the only true guidance, the way of peace."
Ten Americans were murdered at the hands of the Beltway-area snipers. Malvoâs lawyers say he was insane and "brainwashed." No more so than your average madrassa student in Jeddah or America-hating cave dweller in Tora Bora. Malvo is, in his own words, a "believer" of Allah and a "soldier" for "JIHAD." So stop telling me Islam had nothing to do with it.
#3
There is NO WAY any of the networks, or the Communist News Network or msnbc are even going to touch the fact that these 2 sh*tbags are muslims (religion of peace, remember?). That doesn't fit with the 'palestinian/taliban/iraqi freedom fighter as the equivelant of George Washington' that they keep feeding the ignorant leftists.
Remember, PC and socialism isn't about what something IS, it's about what something LOOKS LIKE. The 3-headed monster of jennings-brokaw-rather are going to pound the 'U.S. Army veteran' thing over and over again, and ignore the fact that they're muslims. It ain't about reality.
Several bomb threats in Northeast Washington shut down portions of the Metro rail system Friday, causing a ripple effect that affected thousands of passengers across the region. Service on the Orange line was suspended between the Eastern Market and Minnesota Avenue stations and the Blue Line was closed between Eastern Market and Benning Road about 8:30 a.m., after police received a call from an unidentified man claiming several explosive devices had been placed near a playground at Benning Road and 34th Street, Northeast. Authorities - including the FBI - were called to the scene, where they found a suspicious package and neutralized it using a water cannon. Tests on the device were continuing. Police offered no description of the packageâs contents.
Later, police said a second suspicious object was found a short distance away in the 500 block of Oklahoma Avenue, Northeast. That object was taken to the RFK Stadium parking lot to be opened from a safe distance. Authorities put out a lookout for a vehicle Friday afternoon - believing the driver might have information about the bomb threats. The vehicle was described as a C-10 pickup truck with district license plates AQ-0220. Police provided no information about the color of the truck. "AQ?"
Meantime, authorities conducted a block-by-block search in parts of Northeast as they tried to determine whether any additional suspicious packages were in the area. Gentile said a caller had indicated there might be as many as three packages. "Itâs unclear as to what was planted," he said. The search included a number of law enforcement agencies, including U.S. Capitol Police and the FBI. Metro officials said the rail closings have had a ripple effect all the way into Virginia. Edited for details of how to get home tonight from downtown
#3
Not to credit the jihadis with too much intelligence, but this kinda thing is how you would test responses and the possible side-effects of a real bomb.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 17:13 Comments ||
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One year after President Bush sought to energize the nationâs bioterrorism preparations with an unprecedented smallpox vaccination campaign, the program has all but ground to a halt. A report released yesterday, meanwhile, finds that only two states -- Florida and Illinois -- are prepared to distribute and administer vaccines or medicines that would be needed in the event of a major outbreak or attack. Fewer than a dozen states have written plans for dealing with other public health threats such as pandemic flu, the report added, and most remain ill-prepared for any large-scale emergency. After two years of work and $2 billion in federal aid, "states are only modestly better prepared to respond to public health emergencies than they were prior to Sept. 11, 2001," the Trust for Americaâs Health, a nonpartisan, nonprofit health advocacy group, concluded. Despite Bushâs high-profile call on Dec. 13, 2002, for the immunization of millions of health care workers and emergency responders, the number vaccinated has been stuck at 38,700 for months. EFL Iâve been screaming about this for some time. While this was, for the most part, a media created panic, it illustrates the gridlock of the bureaucracy in this country. The money was spent on enlarging various bureaucratic kingdoms across the country rather than preparing for a bioterror outbreak.
#1
For us older f---s, perhaps a bit of good news in the WOT. Recent studies indicate that those originally vaccinated for smallpox will have a significant degree of immunity beyond the age of 75. I'm glad since my eczema is bad enough without getting that vaccine again!
Posted by: Doc H ||
12/13/2003 15:54 Comments ||
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Consumer advocate Ralph Nader said Thursday he is leaning toward another independent run for the presidency and will make his decision public in January.
Hurrah!
"Weâre testing the waters," Nader said in an interview with CNN. "Itâs a high probability but that is yet to be determined." "The waterâs pretty cold at the moment; weâll get back to you."
"No! Wait! It's warming up! The water is... faintly yellow, with a slight whiff of ammonia, just a couple degrees less than body temperature..."
Nader has formed an exploratory committee for a 2004 run and said he would gauge his support through the success of fund-raising efforts and the number of volunteers who come forward. "That, and how to best outflank Dean on the left!"
The consumer advocate last made a bid for the White House in 2000 on the LunarGreen Party ticket, when he won about 3 percent of the popular vote nationwide and got 5 percent or more in 12 states. And saved us from the Gore administration. Youâve served this country with distinction, thank you very much.
In fact, some Democrats blamed Nader, 69, for siphoning off votes that might have gone to Democratic candidate Al Gore, especially in the hard-fought state of Florida, where Nader took 97,000 votes. LOL
"Gore beat Gore," Nader says to those charges. "He didnât get Tennessee, his home state. That would have made him president. And he blundered in Florida and didnât ask for a statewide recount." Facts are stubborn things...
"I would say to Democratic voters the following: If you think that a third party candidacy is going to take away votes and cost the Democrats the election, youâve got the power entirely within your own franchise when you go to the voting booth and vote for the Democrats," Nader added.
"I weep for you, the walrus said. I deeply sympathize..."
He said if he and his ego were to run, he would focus his efforts on the third of the electorate thatâs not aligned with either party and with the 100 million adults who are non-voters. Howâs Nader possibly going to capture the middle?
By sneaking up on it from the left?
Nader was in Princeton Thursday for a strategy session with Green Party activists to consider the pros and cons of another race. He said his decision will be twofold: whether to run for the presidency at all, and whether to run again on the Green Party ticket. Seems to me the Dems wonât have squat to do with a Nader candidacy unless the bigwigs at the DNC, who will all be kicked out if / when Dean captures the nomination, use Nader as their firewall.
Hmmm... Y'know, Publicans are only allowed to give so much to the Bush campaign. If they gave nearly as much to a Nader campaign â ... Forget I said anything. Never mind.
Meanwhile, the party is divided on another Nader candidacy. You mean that freak that lost in S.F. Tuesday?
Green Party member Larry Barnett, the former mayor of Sonoma, California, and now a member of its city council, said the partyâs priority should be defeating George W. Bush. No, but I was close...
"Any diversion from that, even rooted in principle, interferes with that goal," he said, explaining why heâs against another Nader run. "I would urge him to throw his weight behind whoever the Democratic Party puts up," Barnett said. Unity, what an interesting concept...
In assessing the current field of presidential hopefuls, Nader hasnât stopped laughing in weeks said he supports some of their platforms, but somethingâs missing. Yes, like credible positions in the War on Terror, or anything credible out of John Kerryâs mouth.
Or coherence... Or seriousness of purpose. When did they start runing a laugh track at debates?
"I like some of the things that the Democratic candidates are saying, but you have to hold their feet to the fire," he said. "Sometimes that requires indulging my ego competing candidacies, greater choice and breaking up that exclusionary presidential debate organization." Get rid of everyone except The Big Three of Bird, McHale & Parish Dean, Kerry and Gephardt and it will happen.
In the 2000 campaign, both Nader and independent candidate Pat Buchananran vanity campaigns that sucked up some federal dollars were excluded from the fall presidential debates between Gore and Bush. "Ya, you puny girly-men hav ta leavvv!"
"I think thereâs a great need for another nutbag progressive candidate for the presidency," Nader said. "The two parties are very much dialing for the same commercial dollars. The two parties are ignoring issues like a living wage." Or realizing itâs not a important, winning issue.
In the 2000 race, Nader raised $8 million. He said if he mounts another campaign he hopes to raise between $5 million and $10 million. Tilting at windmills once again...
Or dipping at troughs...
Another factor in his decision will be how the two main parties respond to a 25-page agenda he has sent to them, to determine whether they are addressing issues he believes are important. "Jeeves!"
"Yes, Mr. Kerry?"
"Circular file for this Nader document, and donât fuck it up!"
"Excellent call, sir!"
"One of the justifications for this campaign is to preserve and expand the right of third parties and independent candidates to challenge the two-party duopoly system," Nader said. "I see it as a civil liberties issue of free speech." I see it as the return of the three ring circus. Politics, if nothing else, can be quite entertaining.
#2
Too bad for Nader that all of his hard-left base is on Dean's e-mail list. Which means that Nader will actually be battling Kucinich for ownership of the Keebler elf constituency. Now THAT would be fun to watch.
#3
Yeah, #2, but there's this: If Nader gets in the race, he stays in it, no matter who the Dems nominate. Go back and audit US History 2000. It also shows he'll get a share of the LLL vote (those that can find the polling place.) That makes him a factor. And the only way the Dems could stop it would be to draft Nader. I was serious right up until that last sentence.
#5
In other good news for the Dems: New York Post - December 12, 2003 -- WASHINGTON - A stunning new poll shows President Bush would clobber Democratic front-runner Howard Dean by nearly 2-1 in politically potent New Hampshire - even though Dean has a giant lead over Democratic rivals in the state. Bush gets 57 percent to Dean's 30 percent among registered voters in the American Research Group poll. In fact, Dean, from neighboring Vermont, does worse in the Granite State than a generic "Democratic Party nominee" who loses to Bush by 51 to 34 percent.
And Bush hasn't even started campaining yet.
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 14:54 Comments ||
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#6
"Gore beat Gore," Nader says to those charges. "He didnât get Tennessee, his home state. That would have made him president. And he blundered in Florida and didnât ask for a statewide recount."
OMG! I just found myself agreeing with Nader on not just one thing, but TWO things!
Posted by: Patrick Phillips ||
12/12/2003 14:57 Comments ||
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#7
Steve: When I first read that article, I read it to mean that Bush was leading Dean in the New Hampshire Democratic primary. Now, that would be a real news story!
EFL
Deep within the halls of the Walter Reed Medical Center, behind the ophthalmology clinic, is a shop few know about. A master craftsman called an ocularist works there. Vince Przybyla is the only ocularist in the Department of Defense and one of fewer than 100 in the country who can make prosthetic eyes. He has been at Walter Reed making eyes since he was drafted in 1967 during the Vietnam War. After his military obligation was up, Przybyla decided to stay at the hospital as a civilian. When Soldiers, Marines, Sailors and Airmen lose an eye, they come to Przybyla. Heâs never kept track of how many heâs helped; they are more than just statistics to Przybyla. He wears a blue lab coat that is dusted with plaster and smeared with pink wax and speaks to his patients with a warm and soothing voice.
Przybyla studied art in college, but empathy is possibly the most powerful tool Przybyla uses when practicing his craft. His steady hands do the rest. The master craftsman doesnât rely on technology to help create his masterpieces; he uses skills passed on by a master craftsman before him. There is no school these rare specialists attend to learn their trade. The only way to become an ocularist is through apprenticeship. Przybyla has no apprentices though. Heâs a one-man operation, and seldom has an idle minute. Since the global war on terrorism began last spring, Przybylaâs workload has picked up pace. Since Operation Iraqi Freedom started, heâs helped three to five new patients each month from the war. The prosthetic eyes that he makes are almost indistinguishable from the original. His patients almost always leave with a smile.
The meat of the report:
"Indeed, Pyongyang is using [information technology] to indoctrinate the public and put its propaganda before foreign audiences," the report states. "In addition to studying the party line through regular group reading of [government-run] Rodong Sinmun in hard copy, a practice for indoctrinating members of work units throughout North Korea, the installation of computer networks now brings the newspaper to some workplaces on line." North Korea also has put its propaganda on the Internet through outlets such as the official Korean Central News Agency web site and an Internet site run by North Korean residents in Japan. Pyongyang also has placed two official newspapers, the Minju Choson and Nodong Sinmun, on websites that originate in China. Iâm a-bettinâ that North Korea falls as soon as someone figures out how to download porn without getting caught.
#2
The people most likely to blogs are also the poeple who don't even have electricity. I just found the actual article amusing because of its headline. Here Rantburg has been mining North Korea's Internet sites for punchlines forLord knows how long, and "US Intelligence" is only now discovering the fact? Yeesh!
The first steel beam that will support the weight of office space was erected Thursday at 7 World Trade Center. The occasion marked the first beam of its type to be raised since the 9/11 attacks. "7 World Trade Center was the last building to go down, and it will be the first building to go up," said Gov. George Pataki, at a ceremony marking the occasion. "Raising steel beams here at 7 World Trade Center is emblematic of yet another milestone on our aggressive timetable," Pataki said. Larry Silverstein, the leaseholder of the site, said that the buildingâs steel will be topped out by the end of 2004, with it being completed by the end of 2005. Pataki, Silverstein and the buildingâs architect David M. Childs signed the white beam, while throngs of workers in blue, hard hats called on these high-profile men to sign their construction hats. A large crane dropped down and picked up the beam, despite the wind and rain. Hanging below the beam, an American flag was draped, which was made by local craftsman in Afghanistan to mark Sept. 11.
Yesterday's problems seem to be fixed, I'm not sure by which measure I took (and I won't say what they are for obvious reasons.)
If you go to Browse mode and you come upon pages that say "Sorry, this article has been deleted" that means the problem's come back. I have deleted very few articles — usually I give the benefit of the doubt, and even some dupe postings get left because they've got a lot of comments on them. From now on, I won't be deleting any, though I'll cut the text. So if you're browsing and you see a "Sorry" page, that means someone (or a bug, I'm still not positive) came in and deleted it. Let me know as soon as that happens, please!
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
12/12/2003 11:46 ||
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Programmer's Dictum: A sufficient condition for program triviality is one that has no bugs.
#3
Thanks. It's much appreciated. I love doing Rantburg, from the posting end, through the edited, to the programming behind it. It's even more fun when others help with the hosting and maintenance costs!
Posted by: Fred ||
12/12/2003 22:13 Comments ||
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Shirin Ebadi, the first Muslim woman to receive the Nobel Peace Prize, used the ceremony in Oslo yesterday to send a tough anti-war message to President George Bushâs government in Washington. I can only compare Ms. Ebadi to an angry feminist in the United States. She hates the clerical regime in the United States, but she really, madly hates the United States.
The 56-year-old Iranian lawyer and human rights campaigner, her countryâs first female judge before being stripped of the job in 1979 following the Islamic revolution, told the audience that it was worrying when human rights were violated by the Western democracies that had first introduced the principles. And I worry when the common thread Nobel "Peace" Prize winners share is their anti-Americanism.
Without citing the United States by name, she singled out the Iraq war and the treatment of "illegal combatants" in the prison camp at Guantanamo Bay for condemnation. Did she mention the mass graves in Iraq? How about the ones in Iran? How about the recent wave of repression in Iran? I see, maybe in passing.
"In the past two years, some states have violated the universal principles and laws of human rights by using the events of September 11 and the war on international terrorism as a pretext," she said in her acceptance speech. In the past, I donât know, three thousand years, vastly more States have violated the individual rights of its citizens, but those things appear to be secondary. (Incidentally, when she refers to "human rights" she thinks of the U.N. declaration of rights, an evil document if I ever saw one.
"Regulations restricting human rights and basic freedoms ... have been justified and given legitimacy under the cloak of the war on terrorism." Unlike terrorism itself, which is no violation of "rights".
She also highlighted the inconsistent way that Western countries treat United Nations Security Council resolutions. "Why are certain decisions and resolutions of the Security Council binding while other resolutions of the council are not?" she said. "Why in the course of the past 35 years have the tens of UN resolutions concerning the occupation of Palestinian territories by the state of Israel not been rapidly applied?" "Blame Israel, blame Israel, everything seems to have gone wrong, since Israelâs come along. Blame Israel, blame Israel... itâs not a real country anyway."
She pointed out that Iraq was subject to "an attack, a military assault, economic sanctions and finally military occupation", first with Security Council support and subsequently in spite of the councilâs opposition. Blah, blah, blah, blah. The inSecurity Concil, the U.N itself, and whatever else appeasses terrorism can go stick it in the Artic snow.
Ms Ebadiâs choice for the prize has polarised opinion in Iran, where hardline Islamists have condemned it as a ploy by the US and Israel. I have to give it to the Mullahs, they have a sense of humor after all. In conclusion, to the people who called me "extremist": I told you so, I told you so, I told you so
Posted by: Sorge ||
12/12/2003 10:11:06 AM ||
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You didn't tell me this! Not that you needed to, since I already knew about the Nobel 'Peace' Prize and how worthless it's become, along with most of the UN.
Posted by: Charles ||
12/12/2003 10:28 Comments ||
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#2
Actually, the nominating committee for the Nobel Piss Prize all wear little buttons that say, "remember to ask me why I hate Israel".
#6
I was happy when she won prize but only based on articles and an interview on TV; in both of which she sounded secular and open-minded. Remember she was in France at time of announcement. She goes back to Iran, is treated like a queen by supporters but criticized in official press by officialdom. She leaves country to get prize and sounds like an govt. mullah re Israel/USA but damn little on Mullahcrocy, plus a few officials praise her. Huh? Didn't anybody notice the change? Did anybody get to her?
Posted by: Michael ||
12/12/2003 14:58 Comments ||
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Got a name, EFL:
The man arrested in Minneapolis on suspicion of associating with al-Qaida has been identified as a Canadian citizen and college student of Somali descent, a newspaper reported. Another Canadian, huh? Howâs that fence coming?
The man arrested Tuesday was Mohammed A. Warsame, the (Minneapolis) Star Tribune reported in Friday editions, citing law enforcement officials who requested anonymity. Warsame is suspected of having knowledge of some of the activities of Zacarias Moussaoui - who is accused of being a Sept. 11 conspirator - when he was in Minneapolis. Hummmm
The newspaper said Warsame had been arrested as a material witness, but did not disclose whether he would testify against Moussaoui or others. I think thatâs the definition of the phrase "material witness".
Warsame, 30, was also described as knowledgeable about Moussaouiâs activities in an al-Qaida training camp in Afghanistan. The indictment against Moussaoui, 35, who was arrested in Eagan shortly before the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, alleges he trained at al-Qaidaâs Khalden Camp in April 1998. Sounds like they think Warsame was there, either that, or Moussaoui told him all about it.
Warsameâs wife, Fartun Farah, 28, described her husband as a responsible man. "He is not a terrorist," she told the newspaper through a translator. The wives all say that.
She said she has no knowledge of any connection between her husband and Moussaoui. "He loves the United States just like his home country of Canada," Farah said. She said her husband is an honest and hard-working student at Minneapolis Community Technical College, where he had attended the college for about two years, hoping to pursue a career in computer sciences. Looking for a position in the al-Qaida IT department.
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 9:18:11 AM ||
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Is it just me, or have the worldwide arrests/captures been really picking up lately ?
Seems the information is starting to flow nicely.
Revising its year-end economic forecast sharply upward, The Conference Board today projected that real GDP growth will hit 5.7% next year, making 2004 the best year economically in the last 20 years. The forecast, by Conference Board Chief Economist Gail Fosler, expects worker productivity, which set a 20-year record in the third quarter, to rise at a healthy 3.6% next year. That would follow a gain of 4.3% this year. "Growing business spending and continued strength in consumer spending are generating growth throughout the U.S. economy," says Fosler. "This burgeoning strength is reflected in The Conference Boardâs widely-watched Leading Economic Indicators, the Consumer Confidence Index and the Help-Wanted Advertising Index. While the labor market, a critical factor in sustaining growth, is growing slowly, a pick-up in hiring may already have begun." Real consumer spending, which continues to fuel growth, will increase at a 4.7% pace next year, up from about 3.2% this year. Another gain of 4.3% is projected for 2005. Bwahahaha! The Dems are doomed!
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 9:01:21 AM ||
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these are just lies from the right wing media fox limbaugh crowd. Krugman says the tax cuts and deficit and stuff are gonna take away grandma's medicine and bankrupt the country and put our children's children in debt and haliburton cheyney is the devil and BUSH LIED.
#2
eye, grandma's medicine has already been taken care of by that insane medicare bill just passed. That bill will inevitably make all of us between 25-35 really dig deep to keep it paid for. So the libs don't even have that to bitch about anymore, unless they want to bitch that we (the taxpayers)should be paying more for grannies arthritis pills, which goes from insane to just plain f*cking stupid.
âNO TO STATE TRAPPED INSIDE WALLâ
"I think the barrier is the line Sharon is basing his unilateral move on. If thatâs what he intends, it wonât help, it wonât promote peace. No Palestinian would agree to a state that is trapped inside a wall. It would close any thought of peace." Qurei told another Israeli daily, Maariv, on Thursday that Sharonâs reported go-it-alone plan was a recipe for disaster, saying: "Terror would increase and no one would gain." ..... (1)This wall can not be compared to the Berlin Wall,Berlin was divided by the wall. But the city of Berlin was also completely surrounded by minefields, barbed wire and guntowers.The West Bank will not be totally surrounded it will have border with Egypt and have a sea coast.
(2)It is painfully obvious the Paleoâs have no desire for peace.This being so,leaves the Israelies no choice short of genocide and ethnic cleansing.They have to build the wall.
Posted by: Raptor ||
12/12/2003 8:47:13 AM ||
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I wasn't aware they were holding 'peace talks'.
Posted by: Charles ||
12/12/2003 10:40 Comments ||
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#2
The difference between the Berlin wall and the Israeli wall is that the Berlin Wall was designed to keep the East Berliners IN. The Israeli wall keeps the Paleos OUT. Good fences, in this case, will make good neighbors. Any Paleo rockets or missles leaping o'er the wall will be met by a counter-battery-type response from Israel. The Paleos have shot their wad and do not even register on the sympathy meter. Especially at Gaza, where much of the charity money has dried up.
Posted by: Alaska Paul ||
12/12/2003 11:41 Comments ||
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#3
You are confusing the West Bank with the Gaza Strip - the West Bank doesn't have border with Egypt or a sea coast. It had borders with Jordan.
The difference between the Berlin wall and this one, is that there was a simple line of separation between Western and Eastern sections of the city of Berlin, IIRC.... the "separation wall" snakes insanely around, doubling back upon itself several times, and as such doesn't constitute a defensible fence at all -- just a quite arbitrary line of land-grabbing.
Once the Eastern Barrier is complete, the previously called "West Bank" will have no borders with Jordan -- it will be completely surrounded by the Israeli lands. As such this isn't about being good neighbours -- it's about *preventing* the Palestinians from ever achieving any sort of viable independence - since they'll completely surrounded by Israel.
#6
RC - Bingo. After giving a geography lessen, it turns out he needs one, himself.
As if anyone actually believes there will ever be a peaceful solution. Riiiiight. It will not happen - and everyone who doesn't cheat at solitaire knows it.
Study the "Palestinian" society, "education system", MEMRI translations (not the gullible Western Media wholesale Paleo dogma reprints) of Arabic press and media, what they are monetarily rewarded for (it's not for advancing on the "Road Map" - they've never done anything req'd of them) - bombers and killings, what is spewed in the Mosques throughout Islam -- if anything is clear, it's that there will not be a peaceful solution. Teaching blind hate in every venue, with every public utterance, observation, demonstration, in every breath of air and every drop of blood spilled, all the Paleos will ever reap is hate. Nothing else grows there. It's their only industry and their only crop. Anyone who can't see this is a tool, a fool, or a paid Paleo dogma peddler.
It takes two to make an agreement work, only one to kill it.
The "Road Map" was still-born. Any chance for peace in the ME died in Sept, 2000 with the beginning of the current "intefada" when Arafish had Oslo in his pocket, Barak offering the previous Paleo catch-phrase (land for peace), and the whole world eating out of his hand - and tossed the lot down his Ramallah toilet.
The red herring of blaming Sharon is classic disinformation - trading a state and their entire future for a single stupid act by a former politician utterly fallen from favor -- a disingenuous equation, but good enough for Arab minds and their gullible suckers in the West. The fact and motive is that Arafish's gravy train would be derailed if there was peace and anything approximating modern accounting was employed by the Finance Ministry of a "state" - as we've seen finally being "discovered" and reported of late. Pfeh. Sharon gave him his classic Arab excuse (i.e. any excuse would do). Then the Israelis rediscovered Sharon as the tough guy to counter the intefada. Arafish breathed a sigh of relief as the bloddy stalemate resumed and he could continue squirreling away the cash and play the "General" - with his delinquent "wife" living the life in Phrawnce. Wotta game. Wotta joke.
Sooner or later, one side will try to wipe out the other. I suggest it will most likely be the Paleos and / or Iranians, if the latter are not pre-emptively disarmed. If not them, it will be some outside funding coward, e.g. the Saudis, who will pay the tab for a WMD attack with whatever they can get their hands on and carried out by whomever they think can pull it off. Watch for a quiet exodus of any Hezballah, Hamas, Fatah, or AlAqsa leadership - perhaps under the ruse of a "conference" with someone - that will signal a WMD hit's coming. If Israel isn't wiped out in the hit, then the Paleos will be - immediately thereafter. If Israel is wiped out / crippled? That's actually the only question for which I don't believe there is an obvious answer.
But let's toss the drivel about peace. Only one side is interested.
#7
the proposed route of the wall (NOT THE EXISTING SECTIONS) winds around to take in major Israeli settlement blocks - it would still be more defensible than status quo. Of course its less generous than the Pals would like - otherwise what incentive would they have to negotiate, assuming that Israel withdraws to the barrier? As for eastern barrier, it still allows movement to Jordan at Allenby bridge. It does seperate Pal population centers from existing Jordan river valley settlements.
In any case the barrier will be unnecessary and can be stopped IF and WHEN the PA fulfills its ROAD MAP obligation to disarm terrorists.
#8
And the so-called "Eastern" fence appears to have originated with from this uncorroborated story - from our friends at smh.com.au - picked up and repeated as fact by a hundred sites. Not one quotes a single word of the alleged TV speech. I've been looking through Google for 40 minutes... nada. Real? No, it doesn't yet exist. Planned? Not that I can find. If Sharon did say it, it's just as likely to be a bargaining chip as an actual plan.
But it isn't questioned or investigated when it suits one's mindset.
Oh yeah, a fancy flash file with the phrase "only land grab" on it. No bias there.
Notice how the line denoting the fence ends at two points on this map, at the Jordan River in the north, and in the south, in the desert. Now please explain how Jordan is going to be "cut off" from the West Bank.
(Note: this map is also at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs site)
#10
liberalhawk> The proposed route of the wall includes tens of Palestinian villages on the Israeli side of the wall. How is this a defensible fence, with the Palestinians inside it?
But my main point is that unlike the wall of Berlin this wall crearly isn't meant to be a border between nations. *No* national border has ever turned in such a way. Have you seen the multiple points where the territories bottleneck? This is just ludicrous.
If "Good fences make good neighbours", then this just isn't a good fence. It's arbitrary. It's unbalanced. And no person will look at it some decades from now and say "oh yeah, this map does makes sense, the borders are just where they are meant to be, we can have lasting peace with such a border".
And if it's meant to be a bargaining chip, then that again doesn't make for a good fence between neighbours. Because good fences aren't barganing chips, they say clearly "this is mine, and that is yours", they don't say "this *might* be mine, and that *might* be yours".
comma> If the Eastern fence doesn't take place that's all for the good -- do you have any reason to believe that it won't? I have heard to believe that it will, as Sharon has proposed in the past that a security zone 20 kilometers wide at the border with Jordan should be maintained.
http://www.jpost.com/com/Archive/04.Nov.1999/News/Article-7.html
***
Sharon said it is imperative to maintain a 20 kilometer-wide strip along the Jordanian border and for the Palestinian Authority to have "no point of contact with the Jordanian border."
***
#11
Bargaining chips aren't actually built - you bargain them away before you spend the money.
As for the wiggliness of the lines, uh, is this about taste / aesthetics?
You go looking and come back with a 4 year old link? C'mon. If this was legit - it'd be as easy to find as the bogus BS claim upon which 25 sites laboriously created their bogus PDF's, graphics, and Flash bits. Typical myth propagation that accompanies everything from the Paleo dogma peddlers. Total crap mongering. Jenin massacre, anyone?
You're really reaching, here. I appreciate you worked hard to put a bright face on this stuff, but it was BS. I rest my case.
#12
Once the Israeli-Palestine wall is complete, I would not be surprised to find a Jordan-Palestinian wall plan.
The only way to destoy the Paleo nihilistic death wish society is to wall it in and let it starve to death. If they ever reconsider, we can always throw bread scraps over the fence to those left. Too cruel? My heart bleeds bite me!
Posted by: john ||
12/12/2003 21:01 Comments ||
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#13
As for the wiggliness of the lines, uh, is this about taste / aesthetics?
It's about making a border that can stand the test of time.
This kind of border couldn't be accepted by even a *sane* Palestinian leader.
#15
Aris, all Yasser has to do is "Egad! We can't let this happen. We'd better start talking to those Zionist fiends!" And start to negotiate.
Remember, he had 85-95% of what he wanted at Oslo. He said no. Why should the Israelis reweard him now by building the fence on the Green line? He's the one who threw away the last best chance for a Palestine; let him make the first move to make peace now.
This fence is nothing more than Sharon saying to Yasser that it's time to fish or cut bait.
Posted by: Steve White ||
12/12/2003 23:24 Comments ||
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#16
We already know that Yasser is a more than crappy leader.
And I'm not talking about necessarily building the fence exactly on the Green line. I don't even truly *care* about the Green line that much.
I'm talking about drawing a reasonable border about two nations, with an eye on it being a border that hypothetical decent leaders of the future can accept.
Yes, all Arafat has to do is what you said. And Arafat won't do it. So the Israeli government should have just ignored Arafat and do what's best for the Israelis *and* for the Palestinian people.
What does "rewarding Arafat" have to do with anything? Who the hell sees such a huge historical venture as rewarding or punishing a single leader?
Oh, what the hell, you people don't understand you are actually contradicting each other with your arguments in favour of the wall as drawn. comma and Bomb-a-rama reject that the idea is to strangle the palestinian territories, john accepts and is in favour of such an idea, Alaska Paul talk about good fences making good neighbours, and Steve does see the wall as some kind of "punishment" on the Palestinians for Arafat's failure to be sane.
It's nasty and discouraging. There's no hope left for Israel with Sharon in charge, if he's playing the punishment games rather than the long-term thinking games.
#17
Arafish is the "chosen" Paleo asshat. Sharon, whom you think is of the same type, is the one honestly elected in a fair election - so your complaint is with the Israelis there. You are guilty of trying to have it multiple ways - and you're one person. So it that ambivalence? Or schizophrenia?
The simple ugly truth is just as I stated in my first post in this thread: There won't be peace. Re-read it.
Hate is the disease that prevents it. The Israelis don't teach it, they don't coddle it and treasure it. They don't spew it in every speech or carry banners in every public demonstration (of which there are vastly fewer) or enshrine it by renaming streets and plazas after suicide bombers. They don't fill their children with it or dress them up in battle-dress or give them AK-47's or M-16s to carry in hate demonstrations. Their economy isn't based on it. Their entire lives don't revolve around it. They are not the problem for they are not the hate mongerers.
The Paleos leaders created the revisionist myth of their imaginary beloved "Palestine" and then created this hatefest - and they will perish because they will force it to a point where there is no other choice. Pathetically, perversely, and ultimately cravenly it's really only about money and greed. How banal, yet tragic.
Hmmmm...
Funny, that sounds just like the Caliphate crowd when you think it through... from manufactured indignation all the way to the logical end of smoking holes in the earth.
EFL and boring crap. Found via Drudge.
Members of Congress from both parties are pushing for the first significant increase in the size of the active-duty military in 16 years, despite resistance from the Pentagon. A bill has been introduced in the House to increase the size of the Army, Marines and Air Force by roughly 8% over five years. The bill would add 40,000 troops to the Army, bringing it to 522,400, while the Air Force would grow by 28,700 to 388,000 and the Marines by 15,000 to 190,000. Gotta be a typo
"If the administration is going to deploy thousands of troops across the globe, the size of our military needs to reflect that," says Rep. Ellen Tauscher, D-Calif., author of the bill. Iâm always one for increasing the size of the military. However, Iâd like to see Congress do it, and then let the military decide where these new troops are based. âCuz I forsee pork barrel fighting over what state these new faces get home-based.
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats ||
12/12/2003 8:44:47 AM ||
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Posted by: Mike ||
12/12/2003 9:16 Comments ||
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#2
Sounds like a damned good idea to me! While I support President Bush vs. his Quislingcrat rivals any day of the week, I am still nonetheless VERY disturbed by his failure to strengthen the military. IMHO, in that 1st speech to the joint congressional session after 9/11, he should have (1) announced an IMMEDIATE - not rolling - callup of all reserves and NG, and (2) issued a call for one million volunteers for the active forces.
Posted by: Jeff ||
12/12/2003 9:21 Comments ||
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#3
Need more active duty boots on the ground, current rotation schedule is beginning to hurt Reserve/Guard retention.
Posted by: Steve ||
12/12/2003 9:49 Comments ||
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#4
hmmm...I think it's a good idea, as long as this isn't just another Charley Rangel "bring back the draft" type idea. Any one know anything about Tauscher?
Posted by: B ||
12/12/2003 10:07 Comments ||
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#5
Yes it's a typo. We actually only have 172,000 active duty (at most), we will be up to 187,000 w/the change. Haven't heard why the pentagon is resisting, figured it would be the other way around.
#6
In my opinion we definitly need a few more regular army divisions (and also air force whatevertheyhave). This is going to be a long war and we just cannot keep units on the line without periodic rotation for rest, recuperation and restoration
And the overly heavy reliance on Reserves for long periods is not that great of an idea. A reserve army is an idear that really only works well if there is no war.
Posted by: Michael ||
12/12/2003 10:38 Comments ||
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#7
I would like to see a Division specifically trained for peacekeeping duties. Give them blue berrets and send them whenever we work multilaterally with the UN or to take over when our more aggressive divisions have cleaned out an nation. They'd have more judges, engineers, and traffic cops and less armor than a regular division. (one part Marine Corps, one part Peace Corps).
I think average peacekeeping requires an entirely different type of training and a longer commitment that dulls down our own hard chargers.
#8
It makes great strategic and tactical sense to utilize the Guard and Reserves every ten years or so in the rolls for which they were intended. One of the important things that will come from the Liberation of Iraq is a needed review of logistics, unit integration, procedures and processes. I believe that it's important that the second tier units get called up on a regular basis, to keep them sharp, and to ensure that the entire armed services are as up-to-date as possible.
An army runs on paper, or electrons, these days. You can't sandtable most of the things that we are learning about how to assemble and operate an army in the year 2003. Here's the Third ID's After Action report. Note how much of it is spent on integration, logistics, and communication. You only learn these lessons on active duty, and it is vital that our Reserves and Guard units are as up-to-date as the Regulars.
#9
Ruprecht, berets? please don't be cruel bro. But yes, send us w/the Peace Corps chicks, heck, after a couple months hairy armpits don't seem so bad.....
#10
JH, my guess is the Pentagon is resisting for the obvious reason...Congress will fuck it up. You know there will be tons of conditions. Senators fighting over which states get the troops. Which branch gets the troops. Ie, idiots will control the expansion instead of, oh I dunno, the professional soldiers?! We'll end up with a bunch of shit we don't need. Too many heavy armor divisions. Too few new MPs and Engineering units. No additional air/sea lift capability. You get the picture.
#11
Members of Congress from both parties are pushing for the first significant increase in the size of the active-duty military in 16 years, despite resistance from the Pentagon.
Why is the Pentagon resisting? It's pretty simple - this bill may not come with any attached funding. If the military has to add all these men without additional funding (including for equipment) that completely pays for their addition, procurement of new weapons will take a hit.
#12
Congress agreed this year to spend $68 million to increase the Army by 2,400 slots, about 0.5% of the current 480,000-strong force.
Congress is clearly under-appropriating for the additional troops - $68m for 2,400 slots is not a lot of money. That's just $28,333 per person, which means it covers (at best) salary and benefits. Where's the money for kitting them out with Apaches and armored vehicles? Or do they all have to march to their assigned missions? And what about ammunition?
For comparison, note that a department (in a Fortune 50 firm) I once dealt with, had 300 people and a budget of $50m. These weren't high-salaried people either - average was in the high $30's. Unlike in the military, we did not supply employees with free health care or housing, PX's or other military-subsidized perks. The point is that any shortfalls in Congressional funding will have to come out of somewhere else in the military budget. It's a shell game - Congress is talking a good game but actually eroding the effectiveness of the military by indirectly squeezing the procurement budget.
#15
Swig/ZF, right on. I should've guess that. Pork barrel politics as usual. I didn't have the numbers in front of me, makes more sense now.
It's a twofer - both pork barrel politics and unfunded mandates. Congressional districts get additional jobs while stealing from the new hardware appropriations budget. This is the kind of bill that Republicans who are penny-wise, pound-foolish on the defense budget, and Democrats who dislike the idea of having a defense budget, can both agree on.
#16
Jarhead, it might have slipped your notice but the new Army of One all wear black berrets these days. The Britts swapped their helmets for berrets as quickly as possible to seem less threatening to the Iraqi's. A Division designed specifically for peacekeeping, one that came in after the marines had won the war, wouldn't need kevlar.
And if we make the berret's blue they can mingle with the UN folks so our real troops don't have to.
#17
Jarhead, this is why you should be happy Eric Shinseki's out of a job and Peter Schoomaker's in as Army chief of staff -- he's an infantryman first and foremost, a lotta Rangers didn't take well to the decision to "give away their" berets to the regulars (made under Shinseki), and Schoomaker's moving intel analysts further down the chain of command toward the squads (though not the fire teams).
Posted by: Lu Baihu ||
12/12/2003 18:25 Comments ||
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Ruprecht, yeah I know about that. I'll keep my kevlar thanks or wear my soft cover w/EGA, no berets for me. My dad was 101st and did the beret thing at one point, I respect it, just not our thing. BTW - no offense, but as a Marine, the Army's fashion crises don't matter much to me. I don't blame the Rangers for being pissed about that. Some moron Colonel in my branch suggested all our grunts get berets to distinguish them from the non-grunts, exactly the wrong thinking in our service. That idea lasted about as long as it took someone to laugh at it. We all wear soft covers, boonies, or kevlars. Or a jock on our head if that's what the Commandant wants.
The Director General of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), Mohamed ElBaradei, has called on Israel to relinquish its nuclear weapons as part of a general peace agreement in the Middle East. In an interview with Haaretz, ElBaradei said Israel should follow the path taken by South Africa, the first and only country to part from its nuclear cache, when its weapons were destroyed under IAEA supervision in 1989. In his first interview with the Israeli media, ElBaradei said he recommends that Israel join the Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT). He said that in spite of Israelâs policy of not acknowledging possession of nuclear weapons, "we operate under the assumption that Israel has nuclear arms. Israel has never denied this," he said from his office at Vienna headquarters of the UN organization.
The senior UN diplomat said the notion that Israel is safer today with nuclear weapons than it was 50 years ago is incorrect. "Frankly, I am not happy with the status quo, because I see a lot of frustration in the Middle East due to Israelâs sitting on nuclear weapons or nuclear weapons capability, while other parties in the Middle East are committed to the NPT," he said. The Egyptian diplomat, who has headed the IAEA for seven years, suggested that Israel and its neighbors begin a dialogue for the eradication of weapons of mass destruction. "My fear is that without such a dialogue, there will be continued incentive for the regionâs countries to develop weapons of mass destruction to match the Israeli arsenal, and as you know, there are already weapons of mass destruction in the region," he said. "Israel has nuclear, maybe biological and chemical [weapons]; others have biological weapons. Itâs not an incentive for security in the region."
Posted by: TS ||
12/12/2003 7:37:48 AM ||
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#1
How bout I call on ElBaradei to stop being such an incompetent arse with his head stuck in the sand? That seems fair right?
Posted by: Val ||
12/12/2003 8:49 Comments ||
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Israel has previously expressed an interest in a regional disarmament conference. This would have to be attended by Israel and ALL other major powers in the region, including Saudi Arabia and Iran. Since these latter two states refuse to allow their representatives to sit in the same room with an Israeli representative, this is an unrealistic option for now.
That is the barrier to the dialogue El Baradei suggests - I do not see El Baradei coming up with a constructive means to advance that dialogue.
From a long, worth reading article in the Jerusalem Post about Israelâs naval strategy there was this anecdote that demonstrates hutzpah rather well and also reminds us why the marines were in Beirut.
In the summer of 1958, Lt.-Col. Uri Yarom was testing out an S-58 Sikorsky helicopter. Father of the first Israeli helicopter squadron, Yarom took the new aircraft over the Mediterranean sea.
One thing led to another and Yarom soon found himself running out of gas. Not wanting to lose the new helicopter with a sea landing, he scanned the horizons for someplace to set down. Suddenly he saw it, the flight deck of the USS Wasp CVS-18.
Down below was the huge American aircraft carrier, known among its crew as the "Mighty Stinger." President Dwight D. Eisenhower had dispatched the World War II-era vessel to the eastern shores of the Mediterranean as Marines landed in Beirut to prop up that countryâs independence during a civil war.
But all this didnât matter to Yarom. He needed a place to land, quickly. And with pure Israeli hutzpa he did so, setting down on the USS Waspâs flight deck. He jumped out as startled, angry and curious naval officers and crew surrounded him.
The captain demanded to know just what he was thinking landing on an American aircraft carrier?!
"Oh, I am sorry," Yarom told him. "I thought it was one of ours."
Posted by: phil_b ||
12/12/2003 7:28:40 AM ||
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I always thought that story was urban legendjoke.
SANTIAGO, Chile (AP) - A retired security officer has been indicted in the slaying of an American filmmaker whose execution in the early days of Gen. Augusto Pinochetâs dictatorship became the basis of the film "Missing."
Rafael Gonzalez, 64, is the first person formally charged in the 1973 killing of Charles Horman. He was arrested Wednesday on the orders of Judge Jorge Zepeda. The judge is handling a criminal suit filed by Hormanâs widow, Joyce Horman. Other indictments are expected to follow, said her lawyer, Sergio Corvalan.
According to court papers, Horman was arrested on Sept. 17, 1973, two weeks after the bloody coup led by Pinochet. He was taken to Santiagoâs main soccer stadium, which had been turned into a detention camp for Pinochetâs suspected political opponents. His body turned up months later at a location that has not been disclosed for legal reasons. However Corvalan said Horman was not one of those killed at the stadium.
An official report by the civilian government that succeeded Pinochet in 1990 stated that hundreds were detained and tortured at the stadium and at least 48 were executed, including several foreigners. The Horman case was the subject of the 1982 film "Missing," directed by Constantine Costa-Gavras and starring Jack Lemmon and Sissy Spacek. Horman was an idealistic, addled leftie who should have been home doing something pointless and stupid. But I donât want any American in the world whacked by another government for any reason. Gives others bad ideas, it does.
Posted by: Steve White ||
12/12/2003 1:41:56 AM ||
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#1
It still suprises me that the Left can't let go of what happened in Chile. Lots of bad s*** was happening all across Latin America around that time (not to mention Eastern Europe and SE Asia), but Chile came out of the Pinochet years as a prosperous civil society, and that I suspect is the real sin in the eyes of the Left.
For what its worth, I was a politically aware teenager at the time and clearly recall the Left's attitude of 'history in on our side'. Pinochet's coup occured at the highwater mark of the Left's influence and it represented a turning point and the start of their decline into todays impotent fury.
In a sense the Pinochet regime is a scapegoat for the Left's historic failure. And this I suspect is the reason they can't let go of what happened in Chile.
#2
"It still suprises me that the Left can't let go of ... Chile." Why surprise? The Left still hasn't let go of traitor and Soviet spy Julius Rosenburg.
Good shootinâ!
A missile from a U.S. Navy Aegis cruiser shattered a dummy warhead over the Pacific on Thursday, the fourth intercept in five tests of the sea-based leg of a planned multi-layered missile shield. The Standard Missile-3 fired from the Lake Erie off Kauai in the Hawaiian islands "successfully engaged the target" about four minutes after the target was launched, said Chris Taylor, a spokesman for the Pentagonâs Missile Defense Agency. The Pentagon described the test as part of increasingly "complex, stressing and operationally realistic ballistic missile engagement scenarios." But it did not specify in what way the scenario had been made more realistic. "Future tests will continue to increase operational realism," said a statement. Among other things, decoys could be added to the mix. The intercept relied on "hit-to-kill" technology, using only the force of the collision to destroy the target, the Pentagon said. The last such test, on June 18, failed when the interceptor missile missed its target.
That's why you have tests, isn't it? To see what's wrong...
President Bush has ordered a Pacific missile defense "testbed" be fielded by Sept. 30, 2004, partly to thwart a perceived threat from North Korea. The initial deployment will include six ground-based interceptor missiles at Fort Greely, Alaska and four at Vandenberg Air Force Base in California. Up to 20 sea-based interceptors, spread among three Aegis cruisers, are to be folded into the system starting in 2005. Lockheed said the intercept took place outside the Earthâs atmosphere during the target missileâs descent. The Pentagon is seeking to build defenses that would also go after warheads in their boost and mid-course flight paths. The test on Thursday was designed to evaluate the systemâs long-range surveillance and track functions, the Missile Defense Agency said. The system could be used with other missile defense components, including a ground-based mid-course defense designed to guard the United States against long-range ballistic missile attacks. Hello, Kimmie! Guess what we can do!
Posted by: Steve White ||
12/12/2003 1:27:43 AM ||
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#1
Now we just put those on ships circling NK and our base in SK. Then Kimmies and his nukes are moot point! Unless the nukes are armed for detonation before launch. In which case the Korea's might be getting some radioactive weather.
Posted by: Charles ||
12/12/2003 2:16 Comments ||
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We need a system that does that over in Pakistan too! "Oh. You have a nuclear missle to threaten us with...how quaint!"
Follow-up, EFL
JERUSALEM (AP) - Israel may soon be compelled to dismantle a ``considerableââ number of Jewish settlements and draw a border around the rest, Israelâs vice premier told The Associated Press on Thursday - a go-it-alone approach he suggested has Prime Minister Ariel Sharonâs tacit backing. Such talk by Vice Premier Ehud Olmert about the West Bank and Gaza Strip is increasingly spooking the Palestinians, who fear they will end up with much less land than in a negotiated agreement. Whaddya know, it kinda does look that way on a map.
Israel has said it would keep chasing militants until Palestinian security forces crack down themselves - as required by the U.S.-backed ``road mapââ peace plan. However, Qureia has said he cannot use force against Hamas, Islamic Jihad and other groups for fear of sparking civil war. "Theyâll kill me!"
Olmert told AP in an interview Thursday that there cannot be a peace deal without such a clampdown, and that time is running out. ``If there is no agreement, I believe it is incumbent on Israel to take unilateral steps and to create a unilateral separation between us and the Palestinians,ââ said Olmert, a Sharon confidante. Israel will ``definitelyââ not withdraw to the 1967 lines, and will also keep ``the united city of Jerusalem,ââ Olmert said. Bus is leaving, Yasser.
``But it will be a lot different from the reality that exists today,ââ he said, adding that most Palestinians would no longer live under Israeli rule. Referring to a new border, he said that while it would include some major settlements, ``a considerable amount of settlements and a considerable number of people will have to move into different areas.ââ That has to be painful for Sharon.
Olmert said he was not sending up a trial balloon for Sharon, but that ``if you ask me if the general direction of the prime minister is similar to mine, the answer is yes.ââ
A removal of settlements would be a dramatic departure for Sharon, who has been the settler movementâs leading patron for a quarter century. In recent days, Olmert has defended his plan against harsh criticism from Sharonâs Likud Party, but the prime minister has not joined in the attack. Instead, Sharon has spoken repeatedly about possible unilateral moves, and is to deliver a major policy speech at a conference on national security next week. Looks like security trumps settlements.
Olmert said it is up to the Palestinians to decide whether they want to finally learn about cause and effect negotiate an agreement. ``If they are unable to go ahead and unwilling to fight terror organizations, then there will be a unilateral, comprehensive step taken by the state of Israel and I think that may indeed change fundamentally the situation in the Middle East for a considerable amount of time,ââ Olmert said. Bus just honked its horn, Yasser.
Qureia, the Palestinian prime minister, warned that it would be ``a terrible mistake to try to impose a solution on us by force.ââ However, Qureia appears to be in an increasingly weak position. He started from an increasingly weak position. How can anyone tell whether heâs weaker? Only way to know for sure is if he suddenly stops breathing.
He has failed to win a promise by militants to halt attacks on Israelis. They have told him they want to hear from Israel first whether it is willing to halt all military operations, including targeted killings of big fish wanted men. Israeli officials have suggested they are ready to scale back, but have refused to make blanket promises. Since that worked so well in the past.
Posted by: Steve White ||
12/12/2003 1:21:02 AM ||
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The Arafish will not rest in peace (pun intended)
until he completely and ireversibly destroys any chance for his people to see a reasonable agreement with Israel in their liftimes.
It's high time his own people see the light and assasinate him before the shit hits the fan.
Maybe a civil war is better than the alternative ?
The problem with them is that they are not pragmatic and will continue their stupid terrorist acts until they loose everything they had and more.
Posted by: The Dodo ||
12/12/2003 4:41 Comments ||
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looks like,just maybe,Yasser/Qureia are going to get"Lesson 1"in the art of negotiation and compromise(L1)"Half a loaf is better than none"
#3
However, Qureia has said he cannot use force against Hamas, Islamic Jihad and other groups for fear of sparking civil war.
Can anyone explain to me why this should be a problem for us?
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
12/12/2003 8:43 Comments ||
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Because we'll be blamed for failing to stop the Paleo Civil War. Not that I personally care about that little detail...
Posted by: Charles ||
12/12/2003 10:31 Comments ||
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I am amazed at the similarity between the Palestinian mind-set and that of the hard-core liberals in America. Both deal with emotion. EMOTION is the driving force behind their actions; not logic; not cause-and-effect; not end results -- just pure, unbridled EMOTION. This is what leads our liberals to support sexual freedom of any kind with anyone; to support anti-Christian values (which inhibit some emotions); and to support the dialog of personal destruction in debates (even among themselves).
It is all pretty discusting and petty and I am very disturbed about this possible linking of EMOTION between the Palestinian (and other jihadists) and the Americal Liberals.
#6
Maybe folks were too busy following the Supreme court's 1st Amendment ruling but this ws not commented on in the big media
PLO tries challenge to Israel's UN seat
What will be interesting will be to see how Europe reacts.
Posted by: Barry ||
12/12/2003 12:44 Comments ||
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..Qureia has said he cannot use force against Hamas, Islamic Jihad and other groups for fear of sparking civil war.
This affliction (also suffered by Abu Mazen) is called "being unable to make the hard decisions".
HIZBI BOY SCOUT GETS HIS KNUCKLES RAPPED
However hard Uzbek authorities do utmost to keep their evil deeds toward jailed Muslims from community firsthand information about torture, ill-treatment, harassment and intolerable conditions leaks out from prisons anyway. The HRSU receives convictsâ letters from different prisons across country the authors of which ask to make the content of their letters public through international organizations and most popular websites. One of such letters was sent from Baratov Ollonazar Solijonovich, former resident of Bolgali village of Uzbekistan district in Farghona region. Baratov Ollonazar was born in 1969, has technical secondary education. In 1999 he was jailed and for the time being serves his term in # 64/51 colony in Qarshi. Below is the text of his letter: (See link)
Five years ago material like this would have caused me concern. Now: who cares. As far as I am concerned these jihadis can cry me a river. To read me, you would never guess that I was once a compassionate guy. Happiness is a warm gun.
Posted by: Vlad the Muslim Impaler ||
12/12/2003 1:10:36 AM ||
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This group's links page is useful in revealing their perverse sympathies:
Sudanese rebels said on Thursday the government had killed 25 people in an air raid in a poor western region, where analysts say growing conflict threatens a peace deal to end two decades of civil war in the south. The Justice and Equality Movement (JEM), one of two main rebel groups in Africaâs largest country that started a revolt in Darfur in February, said a plane bombed civilians for 15 minutes on Wednesday morning. "Civilians had escaped an area where there was a battle ... and the government plane followed them and bombed them," said Abu Bakr Hamid al-Nur, general coordinator for JEM. Government officials were not available to comment.
They were busy reloading...
The strife in west Sudan has been largely overshadowed by an impending peace deal being negotiated in Kenya to end the war in the south that has killed about two million people. But analysts warn the western conflict could undermine a Kenya deal. "Here is another civil war in Sudan... It is potentially very disruptive," said a U.N. official, who declined to be named. JEM said last week they killed about 700 government troops and pro-government militia fighters in the area north of government-held Kebkabiya in Northern Darfur state.
More through-the-roof casualty figures...
An aid worker who recently visited the area said reports were widespread of a large battle with hundreds killed and the government side "coming off worse." He said travel outside main towns was almost impossible, making verification difficult.
If they're really bumping off that many at a time, the gummint's in trouble...
Analysts say that the numbers of dead seemed improbably high, but were not impossible.
Guess that makes me an analyst, huh?
Militias attack riding camels and horses rather than armed forces in vehicles.
Oh, the old Gallant Charge on Horseback at the Gatling Guns routine. Maybe they are mowing them down in droves...
Britainâs Secretary of State for International Development Hilary Benn, visiting Khartoum, said humanitarian access to Darfur was urgently needed as the situation was "extremely grave." Aid agencies say the government sometimes hinders access to potentially safe working areas. Ben Parker, spokesman for the United Nations Humanitarian Coordinator in Sudan, told Reuters more than 600,000 had been displaced by the conflict, with 75,000 refugees fleeing to Chad. "Here are the ingredients of a very serious humanitarian crisis," Parker said, adding the U.N. had temporarily withdrawn its staff from government-held Geneina, near the Chad border. He said the conflict affected one million of a regional population of 5.9 million people, according to a 2001 consensus.
But that's okay. Ethnic cleansing is more important that peace or stability or prosperity. Once all the untermenschen are gone, that'll come naturally...
Peace talks between Khartoum and the other main Darfur-based rebel group, the Sudan Liberation Army (SLA) that signed a ceasefire with Khartoum in September, were due to restart in Chad on Wednesday but were delayed after government complaints of truce violations. JEM, which accuses the government of marginalizing Darfur, has not signed a truce with Khartoum. In the Kenya talks, the Khartoum government and the Sudan Peopleâs Liberation Army (SPLA) expect to sign a framework peace deal in the next two weeks and a more comprehensive agreement early next year, sources at the talks said on Thursday.
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
12/12/2003 12:35:02 AM ||
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Sudanese military pilots were relecting on the colonized/abused state of the Palestinians - this provoked such great anxiety in their souls they pressed the the "drop bombs" button on their consoles...the JOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOs are to blame for this malevolence...
______________borgboy writting in the subjunctive...
REBEL attacks in war-torn Chechnya killed eight Russian soldiers and wounded eight more over the last 24 hours, an official in the Moscow-backed Chechen administration said today. Federal positions came under rebel fire 22 times in the past day, killing five soldiers and wounding seven.
Two servicemen were killed when rebels strafed their military car with gunfire near Lakha-Varandy.
Another serviceman died and one was injured during a rebel attack in Chechnyaâs second-largest city, Gudermes.
One Chechen policeman was killed and another wounded when they stepped on a land mine in Grozny.
The rebels are outnumbered and outgunned by federal forces, but they have made deadly use of hit-and-run attacks and land mines. Federal forces, meanwhile, pound rebel positions with heavy artillery daily. In the previous 24 hours, federal forces shelled suspected rebel bases and groups of rebels in the Shatoi, Urus-Martan,Nozha-Yurt and Gudermes districts. Federal forces also fired shells into the suburbs of Grozny.
"Vanya! Would you take out the garbage?"
"After the shelling, dear!"
At least 150 Chechens were rounded up in security sweeps over the past 24 hours. The sweeps have been widely condemned by civilians for alleged mass human rights abuses.
... especially the ones caught packing heat and lugging explosives...
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
12/12/2003 12:18:42 AM ||
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Interesting if this is true or more of the same song and dance that weâve seen for the last several months ...
Iran has arrested 130 suspected members of the al-Qaeda network and is ready to extradite some of them, President Mohammad Khatami said. "Those who have committed crimes in Iran will be judged in Iran and the others will be extradited to their country of origin," he said through an interpreter during a news conference. "There is no place for al-Qaeda, no place for any terrorist, for those who act against peace in the world," he added. Khatami said al-Qaeda was "very hostile" to the Iranian regime.
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
12/12/2003 12:12:06 AM ||
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#1
Yes---we will extradite them to Syrian forces in Lebanon
#2
Yep, Yep,
They will extradite them as soon as they extradite Khatami to the Tel Aviv authorities.
will take some time though,
you may all start breathing again ;)
Posted by: The Dodo ||
12/12/2003 4:26 Comments ||
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#3
round up the usual suspects.
Posted by: B ||
12/12/2003 10:13 Comments ||
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#4
Ah, the Black Hats have been on another hiring expedition to PakiWakiLand for cannon fodder. Pay 'em $5 to agree to be "arrested", make big splash with gullible Western press, then "deport" them back and give 'em their $5 completion bonus upon their exit from the Welcome Home! party debriefing by ISI.
A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.
Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing
the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.
Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence
over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has
dominated Mexico for six years.
Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No
trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
