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2003-10-21 Southeast Asia

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Posted by Sorge 2003-10-21 9:06:49 AM|| || Front Page|| [1 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 the junta in Myanmar has been resisting democracy for years. This is just the flavor of the month. Their not resisting democracy cause it will lead to islamism, but to keep power out of the hands of the buddist majority - and keep it in the hands of the buddist junta.

Posted by liberalhawk 2003-10-21 9:14:51 AM|| 2003-10-21 9:14:51 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 The Burmese Junta is truly loathsome, and they have had trouble not just with their Muslim minority, but also with just about all of their dozens of ethnic minorities, whether Muslim, Christian or Buddhist. It is true that many Burmese Rohingya refugees in Bangladesh and Pakistan have fallen in with local Jihadis, but the major Rohingya groups active in Burma are secular, and thus have received little to no support from the above mentioned Muslim countries.
As for throwing them out, the Junta have managed to drive out hundreds of thousands, but they have done the same to the Karen, Shan and others.

Posted by Paul Moloney 2003-10-21 9:28:02 AM|| 2003-10-21 9:28:02 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 Mr. liberalhawk;

They resist democracy because it will lead to their demise, I agree with that. But I'm worried about a democratic, weak Myanmar, in which Islamism will be tolerated. (See Philliphines.)

Mr. Moloney;

Secular Muslim groups turn Islamist with frightening speed. Come to think of it, the 'Palestinian Authority' is a secular Muslim group. (Oxymoron warning.) Also, throwing out others minorities is despicable, but throwing out muslims is not. (Like the Spaniards were right expel the Muslims after 1492, but wrong to expel the jews.)

Posted by Sorge 2003-10-21 10:06:45 AM|| [http://www.forgottenfronts.com/] 2003-10-21 10:06:45 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 Sorge - That's what I wondered about. If When the junta is toppled, Burma will be weak - and if there is a strong Izzoid presence I have no doubt at all they will make a play to take over. There are droves of Pakis being caught at the border and turned away regularly. The papers here in Thailand are full of the stories. Hell, there are even NorKs being caught these days. Burma would be a pushover if the numbers are there and they pick the right time.

I have never met a secular or moderate Muslim, when there was another Muslim around. They remind me of the Golden Rule of Parakeets (Honest!). If you have just one, he'll be friends with you. If you have two, they'll be friends with each other. Same same.

Posted by .com 2003-10-21 11:11:59 AM|| 2003-10-21 11:11:59 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 i fail to see that a military run PI would be any more effective than Arroyo.

In particular a democractic Burma would be able to reach out to the West in ways that the current regime cannot. And would be less like to snuggle up to China (have we forgotten about them?) And just might do a better job of mobilizing its own populace.

Oh, and throwing any minority out is despicable.
And btw PA is not an organization, its a pseudo govt. The org youre thinking of is Fatah. Which does nasty things yes. So does PFLP, under the leadership of George Habash, Christian by background, Marxist by practice. Are you claiming he's really an Islamist, too?

Dot com - ever spent any time in Turkey or the Balkans? (I havent, but Turks Ive met over here seem pretty secular. Ive also met an Afghan, who while not secular, was pretty bitter about the Taliban and AQ - something about being tortured by them)

Posted by liberalhawk 2003-10-21 11:36:15 AM|| 2003-10-21 11:36:15 AM|| Front Page Top

#6 LH - Nope. I have muRat as my guide to moderation and secularism condensed into an inferiority complex that makes him act like a mindless twit full of hatred. I have seen the GRofP occur hundreds of times, however.

If you'd like to say Turkey is an exception, fine - I'll grant a tiny anount of leeway, but they certainly are NOT the rule. 70 Million Turks is a drop on the advertised 1.3 billion Muslim bucket.

As for Afghans, I have zero doubt your guy is an exception - hell, he's over in Merika, right? Not your average AK-47 totin' Warlord followin' be-turbaned Afghan, I'd wager.

Look, knowing an individual is not the same as the culture or the society. They always put their best foot forward when they are the visitor. How do they act at home and YOU are the visitor - that will tell a far different story.

It's like saying that knowin a guy named Wang in HS means you're ready to run the China Desk at State. Wait! That may just be the secret criterion used! Shit! ;-)

Posted by .com 2003-10-21 12:48:34 PM|| 2003-10-21 12:48:34 PM|| Front Page Top

#7 Mr. liberalhawk--You fail into a non-sequitor fallacy: "I fail to see that a military run PI would be any more effective than Arroyo." My argument is for keeping the military junta in Burma for the short term, I said nothing about the Philiphines. And 'Oh, and throwing any minority out is despicable' is a not an argument, but an expression of belief. To be fair, I didn't argue either for the opposite--it would be inappropiate to do so in Rantburg--but I'll be posting my argument on my website either this afternoon or tomorrow morning.

Posted by Sorge 2003-10-21 3:34:47 PM|| [http://www.forgottenfronts.com/] 2003-10-21 3:34:47 PM|| Front Page Top

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