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2006-01-18 Terror Networks
West 'underestimates Islamist sexual fear'
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Posted by tipper 2006-01-18 15:02|| || Front Page|| [11133 views since 2007-05-07]  Top

#1 Yeah, I guess I'd buy that.
Posted by bigjim-ky 2006-01-18 15:14||   2006-01-18 15:14|| Front Page Top

#2 Will Rushdie also define for us, exactly what this "honour" is that keeps being lost and/or damaged^
Posted by Whineger Phaviting8058 2006-01-18 15:17||   2006-01-18 15:17|| Front Page Top

#3 Sal running out of money and looking for another fatwa on his ass? The last one worked out pretty good for him...
Posted by tu3031 2006-01-18 15:23||   2006-01-18 15:23|| Front Page Top

#4 Rushdie is wrong, in that such a system of "honor" is quite common among most peasants in immature societies, no matter what religion or culture.

It is tied hand-in-hand with the idea that young females are real assets to a family, assets as in property. At some point, it is even more important to "sell" them through dowry than it is to take their animals to market, as far as the family is concerned.

To start with, very young females are seen as "worthless", just extra mouths until they can be married off. So they are seen as long-term investments. Virgins have highest value, so they must be carefully protected, and this is where "honor" enters in to it. It could cost a family a fortune in lost dowry for someone to "despoil" their sellable virgin.

Over time, this basic concept of "honor" gets wackier and wackier, as neurotic and strict as the males and even older females of the household want to be. Pretty soon, *any* family failing can be interpreted as so ruinous to family "honor" that the young females must be killed.
Posted by  Anonymoose 2006-01-18 15:34||   2006-01-18 15:34|| Front Page Top

#5 ...which doesn't make old Rushdie wrong, Big A.
Posted by Secret Master 2006-01-18 15:38||   2006-01-18 15:38|| Front Page Top

#6 I mean, maybe he is wrong about the cause, but certainly not about the effect.
Posted by Secret Master 2006-01-18 15:39||   2006-01-18 15:39|| Front Page Top

#7 Hmmm. Having been told by 2 different expats of serious offers by Saudis to buy their daughters, well, all I can say is wrong century, pal. Hell, make that millenium.

Wacky only begins to describe how morally and ethically retarded (read: depraved) the "honor" BS is. But I believe the honor thing is the symptom, a "bug" of Shari'a which institutionalizes this shit, it's not the disease... the disease is Tribalism, IMHO.

Societies that put the premium on individuals - recognizing that this is where progress, a good thing, actually come from - revile such attitudes - as individuals are harmed, deprived of their freedom, choices, rights, regardless of how it affects any larger grouping. Those that are still Tribal have the mentality of Jean Auel's Clan of The Cave Bear. To mix metaphors, the Tribalists can go zug-zug each other.
Posted by .com 2006-01-18 15:56||   2006-01-18 15:56|| Front Page Top

#8 a system of "honor" is quite common among most peasants in immature societies

To elaborate: We are used to living in societies where binding contracts are pervasive. Go to the grocery store to get some soap powder and that's a legally binding contract on multiple parties.

It wasn't till I lived in Asia, I started to appreciate how much we take this for granted. Without a system of binding contracts, interactions rely on trust of the individual you are dealing with, i.e. their reputation or honor. An individual's perception of whether others view him as someone with honor becomes their over-riding concern, because without honor, they become an outcast (literally) that no one will interact with. So the honor that is protected by so called 'honor killings' is the honor of the man who is 'responsible' for the woman's behaviour and not that of the woman.

As an aside, I think this is the reason many westerners find Arab and similar cultures so attractive.
Posted by phil_b">phil_b  2006-01-18 16:18|| http://autonomousoperation.blogspot.com/]">[http://autonomousoperation.blogspot.com/]  2006-01-18 16:18|| Front Page Top

#9 More fairy tales about hillbilly Arabs not understanding the modern world. According to this crap all we need is a battallion of naked females to roam around Iraq and Islamofacists will run away in terror? Trust me on this, Achmed likes it very much that Arab women are expressing sexual freedom. Fatima's parent probably aren't that happy but the boys are burning down cities because the girls are putting out.
Posted by Cyber Sarge">Cyber Sarge  2006-01-18 18:20||   2006-01-18 18:20|| Front Page Top

#10 C'mon - Salman Rushdie?
Posted by Pappy 2006-01-18 20:18||   2006-01-18 20:18|| Front Page Top

#11 seems Achmed the needle dick is worried the lil woman might find out that size does matter, among other things, like hygiene, personal freedom, ....
Posted by Frank G">Frank G  2006-01-18 20:21||   2006-01-18 20:21|| Front Page Top

#12 Maybe it was Sal-bass.

"Instead of salmon, he went with bass! He just substituted one fish for another!"
Posted by Scooter McGruder 2006-01-18 20:23||   2006-01-18 20:23|| Front Page Top

#13 I think this is the reason many westerners find Arab and similar cultures so attractive.

phil_b, eh??
Posted by Snump Flaviper5941 2006-01-18 21:17||   2006-01-18 21:17|| Front Page Top

#14 I think ol' Salman has a point here. The muslims throw tarps over their women so the guys aren't tempted by those wicked jezebels. The sexes are segregated so the men are not led astray by soft, sweet-smelling demons in female form. Women are not allowed to drive, which, if you have ever been a teenager, is the absolute definition of freedom. And the whole virgins-in-the-afterlife thing just reeks of insecurity. Your sexual reward is hanging out with people who know nothing about sex? I'll take the most expense whorehouse in New Orleans, thanks.
Posted by SteveS 2006-01-18 21:21||   2006-01-18 21:21|| Front Page Top

#15 I was referring to the whole Arabist thing, which has been prevalent in British upper classes for at least the last hundred years. For every Churchill who saw them clearly, there were a dozen Lawrence of Arabia types.

For a recent example read The Truth About Bravo Two Zero - worth reading for other reasons as well.
Posted by phil_b">phil_b  2006-01-18 21:26|| http://autonomousoperation.blogspot.com/]">[http://autonomousoperation.blogspot.com/]  2006-01-18 21:26|| Front Page Top

#16 To change honor into shame, I've heard that the CIA will drop millions of XXXL condoms all over Iran with the mention "Normal" stamped in English.
Posted by Shineper Sleremble4814 2006-01-18 23:50||   2006-01-18 23:50|| Front Page Top

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