Article

2005-12-17 Iraq

Hugh Hewitt Inteviews John Agresto About Iraq

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Posted by Chuck 2005-12-17 06:00|| || Front Page|| [3 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 jeesh...what a Chicken Little. It used to be so much better when Saddam was in power, everyone was flying kites and making love not war. No rape rooms, no torture chambers...oops sorry, my bad, those things were there but there were no abayahs. Whew!

So the women are wearing abayahs. Is he surprised by this? It is a representative democracy. Duh, Sherlock.

That's how representative democracy works. They have to represent the culture that they live in. You are never going to get them from the 7th century to the 21st century by installing a totalitarian dictator. Give them the training wheels and let them learn on their own. Despite mommy's worries - they can do it. Just like we did.

Posted by 2b 2005-12-17 07:30|| 2005-12-17 07:30|| Front Page Top

#2 And when the United States was founded, women couldn't vote, and slavery was legal.

Posted by gromky">gromky 2005-12-17 09:00|| http://communistposters.com/]">[http://communistposters.com/] 2005-12-17 09:00|| Front Page Top

#3 Agresto is no chicken little. He was president of this school for a while. It's a place that takes the true liberal tradition (i.e. freedom, not socialism) quite seriously.

Agresto's comments match those of some Kurdish women who were on tour here after serving as translators for our forces - and suffering attacks (and some deaths) from the Kurdish al-Q affiliates as a result.

Posted by lotp 2005-12-17 09:53|| 2005-12-17 09:53|| Front Page Top

#4 It'not demoncracy. Thugs like Sadr's gangs beat, kill and terrorize women who have the audacity to dress according to their preferences. You ought to read some of the accounts of what they've done -- NONE of it reported in the U.S. mainstream media.

Posted by ScrewAQ 2005-12-17 09:58|| 2005-12-17 09:58|| Front Page Top

#5 Agresto is no chicken little indeed, and he notes what is going to be the next big problem for Iraqis to solve: what kind of democratic state do they want?

If it's a 'pious' Muslim state that treats women like cattle, okay, but you'll do it without us, because we'll be heading home, job completed, head held high. And if you get into trouble with your neighbors or if you can't hold your country together, well tough.

If it's a more modern, traditionalist state that is secular and respectful of people, so that women are first-class citizens and (among other things) can do and dress as they please, then we're there to help you for the long-term.

We can't do it for you; you have to figure it out yourselves. We know it will take time, but we'll be watching.

Posted by Steve White">Steve White 2005-12-17 11:45|| 2005-12-17 11:45|| Front Page Top

#6 I think it is a mistake to portray Sadr's Mhadi Army as an arm of the new Iraqi Democracy. The Islamo-thugs are an element of society that were held in check by Sadaam in the same way that the Shah held back the tide of acid-throwing 7th century crazies just to the East. An inability to control extremists in not a blanket incitement of the democratic way of life. I am hopeful that the Kurds won't put up with thugs harassing their daughters. Maybe vigilantism will have to suffice until the police are less busy preventing nutters from blowing up the kindergartens.

lopt, St. John's isnât Liberty University.

Posted by Super Hose 2005-12-17 13:12|| 2005-12-17 13:12|| Front Page Top

#7 No? It's my alma mater. Been there, know the people there.

Posted by lotp 2005-12-17 16:36|| 2005-12-17 16:36|| Front Page Top

#8 No one who's a Johnnie could be considered to be lotp. They don't have parties there, they just study.

Posted by Flese Elming9695 2005-12-17 16:58|| 2005-12-17 16:58|| Front Page Top

#9 lopt, my Alma Mater is quite close to yours. As an institution it is proof positive that at least one chicken little can graduate from anywhere - and become president. :-)

Here is another parallel that I think illustrates the role that the fundamentalists are playing in modern Iraq. Columbia was probably more peaceful before the government went after Pablo Escobar. In neutralizing Medallin Cartel government made room for the Cali Cartel, which is probably more violent and effective than the Escobar's operation. Pining for the return of the Medallin Cartel is not the answer to the problem. The new threat needs to be addressed.

Posted by Super Hose 2005-12-17 18:55|| 2005-12-17 18:55|| Front Page Top

#10 SH:

Pining for the return of the Medallin Cartel is not the answer to the problem. The new threat needs to be addressed.

This is consistant with what John Agresto was saying. No where did he say he wanted a return of Sadam and the Baathists. Democracy is the first step. The US should not use the establishment of democracy as an excuse to pull out and go home.

My fear, Hugh, is we're making believe that our wish is the truth, and we'll leave before we're supposed to leave ... We need to be there. We need to be there a little longer.

Agresto fears that if the US pulls out too soon, Iraq will fracture into three parts.

Posted by Chuck 2005-12-17 23:07|| 2005-12-17 23:07|| Front Page Top

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