Article

2010-06-24 Economy

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Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2010-06-24 00:00|| || Front Page|| [11130 views ] Top

#1 And are tired as hell of being cheated at every turn.

Posted by Redneck Jim 2010-06-24 01:18|| 2010-06-24 01:18|| Front Page Top

#2 Strange the tax assessors keep and insurance keep raising my valuations.... all those unsold homes should be driving them down... strange....

Posted by 3dc 2010-06-24 01:22|| 2010-06-24 01:22|| Front Page Top

#3 Karl Denninger's comment on this news:

The entire economy is dependent on government support.

We are in a Depression now and have been since 2008. A Depression is defined as a 10% contraction in GDP. But for the government borrowing 11% of GDP and spending it, GDP would have contract[ed] by at least the same amount borrowed and spent.

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2010-06-24 01:31|| 2010-06-24 01:31|| Front Page Top

#4 As Glenn Reynolds puts it "unexpectedly".

Posted by g(r)omgoru 2010-06-24 01:42|| 2010-06-24 01:42|| Front Page Top

#5 Strange the tax asessors keep and insurance keep raising my valuations That's not the case everywhere. Some Michigan townships are at risk of defaulting on their debts due to falling property tax receipts.

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2010-06-24 01:54|| 2010-06-24 01:54|| Front Page Top

#6 #2 Strange the tax assessors keep and insurance keep raising my valuations.... all those unsold homes should be driving them down... strange....Posted by 3dc

Add to that a demographics change, a high school no one wants their kids go to anymore, and a real estate market which consists almost exclusively of foreclorsures.

"But, but, but..... our savings is the equity in our house."

Posted by Besoeker 2010-06-24 03:36|| 2010-06-24 03:36|| Front Page Top

#7 The banks that own these homes will NOT be coming down on the price, thank you very much. They will hold them for decades without changing the asking price.

Posted by gromky 2010-06-24 03:42|| 2010-06-24 03:42|| Front Page Top

#8 No problem. When hyperinflation kicks in the values will return to their previous level.

Posted by BrerRabbit 2010-06-24 06:27|| 2010-06-24 06:27|| Front Page Top

#9 When Hyperinflation kicks in, I might finally be the Eccentric Billionaire(TM) I always thought I would.

(Never mind that bread is in the high 6 figures...)

Posted by eLarson 2010-06-24 07:32|| 2010-06-24 07:32|| Front Page Top

#10 The ratio between house prices and wages is still FAR too high, thanks to all that regulatory created credit.

Credit needs to be reduced, house prices need to fall, and taxes on incomes need to fall too, so that a decent affordability of housing is found.

The state used Credit volume increases to hide the damage it's income taxes were doing to the economy.

This pushed down yields and now the west faces bankruptcy. To cap it off they tried to reflate and not even remove bankrupt institutions from the economy.

PJ O Rourke talked about politicians being akin to giving children whisky and car keys, but it's more like giving children PCP and RPGs.

Posted by Bright Pebbles 2010-06-24 09:28|| 2010-06-24 09:28|| Front Page Top

#11 3dc has a point. I wonder what a Tea Party local meeting could do if someone pointed out that since the price of local housing has gone down (10%, 30%, whatever it is in that neck of the woods), that assessments and property taxes should go down by the same amount.

I understand that the local schools and villages need money. People want local services; they want their police and fire protection, they want the library, they want the parks. Counties and villages have to find revenue.

But a house worth $400K in 2006 is now worth $300K in our area (Will County IL). Foreclosed houses are worth a lot less. Besoeker is correct: many people considered their homes a primary source of long-term savings. That's been wiped out.

And people won't forever understand why government, public employees and public programs won't share in the pain.

Final passing thought: wonder if, when a bank forecloses, they get the county assessor to cut the taxes on that house, and if so, how come I can't get the same consideration?

Posted by Steve White 2010-06-24 09:32|| 2010-06-24 09:32|| Front Page Top

#12 But, but, but, Robert Gibbs, BO's mouthpiece told us the economy was improving. What the...?

Posted by JohnQC 2010-06-24 09:40|| 2010-06-24 09:40|| Front Page Top

#13 got PCS orders back to NC and was damn lucky to sell the house here in Ohio...only owe about $9K for the basement we put in (knew it wouldn't raise the asking price of the home but figured it would help sell the home) - we were lucky, priced it to sell and had it sold in 6 weeks. I got a tax assessment in the mail after the sale saying our prop taxes went up - I LMAO in irony. In 3 yrs my home went from being worth $225K to $209K (not bad compared to our neighbors) and still all our prop taxes went up about $30.00 a month.

I will prolly only rent from now until I retire from the service.

Posted by Broadhead6 2010-06-24 10:24|| 2010-06-24 10:24|| Front Page Top

#14 "buying" a house is mostly renting oney from the bank.

Cut out the middle man and rent.

Posted by Bright Pebbles 2010-06-24 11:33|| 2010-06-24 11:33|| Front Page Top

#15 I'm planning on building my own home (Iown a smsll bit of land) That way I can build slowly and pay as I build so there will be NO mortgage.
Without the Bank's greedy tongue lapping up my cash I can take my time, build it over a year or so and have a much nicer home than I could buy.
I did this once before(Thieves burned it down, they're in Prison)I can do it again, better.

Posted by Redneck Jim 2010-06-24 12:08|| 2010-06-24 12:08|| Front Page Top

#16 I have been humbly suggesting to a couple people, and only because I know their situation and do not suggest this to anyone because I do not know that situation, to wait 6 months before buying a house. Renters I suggest to get a long term unchanging contract and be prepared for reduced maintenence. There are instances where people are paying the same to rent as they would to pay back for a borrow for a house. I do understand the Renting angle, don't have to take care of the place so much and many do not know where they will be a year out. Again, this is just me and the people I know well enough to suggest this to and still feel uncomfortable doing so - when I was doing this for myself I spent a good amount of time weighing all scenarios. Its crazy to me to see people spend months fretting about a new car but go buy a house without too much worry like is it in a flood plain, does the inspector know what s/he is talking about, is the plumbing accessable, how are those shingles, what about that old tree leaning over the roof, where are the pipes in the yard property, etc etc etc.

As far as the housing stimulus deal, IMHO the whole point was to bouy property values/taxes, not necessarily to get people into homes. Same thing could have been accomplished by letting the market drop out and 6 months later when housing could be afforded by more people with no cost the government, but hey with only a couple months left before setting the tax charts.

Posted by swksvolFF 2010-06-24 12:46|| 2010-06-24 12:46|| Front Page Top

#17 Strange how the government lowers interest rates to prop up housing prices but then threatens to go ape shit if health insurance companies raise their premiums. I mean, if people could afford to buy a home they might not be so concerned about insurance companies trying to stay profitable. I wonder if it has anything to do with the socialists attempt to grab total control of the health care industry?

Posted by Ebbang Uluque6305 2010-06-24 12:48|| 2010-06-24 12:48|| Front Page Top

#18 Some property levies are actually a total amount of taxes, which are then apportioned to property owners based on the value of the property. So to maintain a certain amount of taxes received, an individual owner's taxes might well go up even as his assessed value goes down.
OTOH, some taxes are based on a %-age of the assessed value, as assessments rise & fall, the taxes assessed will rise & fall. So in areas where property values skyrocketed, so did tax receipts, and the local governments spent accordingly.
Neither method of assessing taxes takes into account that in a depression, some property owners either can't or won't pay what is due. The locality's only solution is to seize the property and sell it for back taxes.
Even if you buy a house for cash, or owe no money to anyone for it, you are STILL 'renting' it -- this time from the government which can seize your property if you fail to pay your real estate taxes.

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2010-06-24 13:01|| 2010-06-24 13:01|| Front Page Top

#19 In 1978 in California we passed Proposition 13 which limits the amount of property taxes local government can collect. It works pretty well. Of course, the politicians got back at us with income taxes but at least the old folks on fixed incomes are less likely to be taxed out of their homes.

Posted by Ebbang Uluque6305 2010-06-24 13:43|| 2010-06-24 13:43|| Front Page Top

#20 My understanding 1/4 of the home owners in DuPage Co. IL have not paid their higher property taxes.

The banks and local gov. can go FOAD - the homes need to assume a real value. What is happening means I have to pay more and more of the 1/4's kids schooling, parks, libraries, etc... If gov would trim it's piggish hunger and banks would take some lumps the houses could be valued a lot more reasonably letting a lot more of the 1/4 home owners actual pay a property tax... WIN WIN

Posted by 3dc 2010-06-24 16:44|| 2010-06-24 16:44|| Front Page Top

#21 Of course the PC correct stupidity is making it impossible to curb....
Example - one of my wife's patients - who should really be in state lock-up facility like Elgin.... has run up near a million dollars in rehab funds since March by refusing to take his meds, claiming psychotic episodes and calling 911 himself to be pampered in a hospital psych ward.

Its NOT PC to force him to take is fricking meds or make him clean his room or go to school or not threaten everybody. It's not PC to make a mental patient uncomfortable in anyway...
SO in 4 months he has wasted more county state and fed money then any of the people working with him will earn all together in a decade.
PC needs to FOAD - I am sorry Dr S and ltop...
It's the way my taxpayer balance book sees it...

Posted by 3dc 2010-06-24 16:51|| 2010-06-24 16:51|| Front Page Top

#22 Okay... my tax appraisal went up %30 last year.... so the woman across the street, with a much bigger house, paid $550K for it about 10 yrs ago. She has it on the market now so I ambled over and grabbed a sales bill.... $345K hmmm she's selling it for a $205K loss? But, it is not selling... so there is no recent comp price to compare my house to....
Gov appraisers are pure jerks it seems...

Posted by 3dc 2010-06-24 20:08|| 2010-06-24 20:08|| Front Page Top

#23 But, it is not selling....3dc

Which means it is worth ZERO!

Posted by Besoeker 2010-06-24 20:10|| 2010-06-24 20:10|| Front Page Top

#24 But, it is not selling... so there is no recent comp price to compare my house to....

3dc, you have a couple of options to get comparative prices. First, go to the Re/Max site -- they have a neat little search engine that will tell you what very roughly comparable houses have sold for. See link. I just did it, and I very sincerely hope it has undervalued my house by quite a bit. Then call a real estate agent, any real estate agent, and ask them to do a quick "comps. sold" for you, based on the usual information real estate agents collect when they list a house. With four or five comparables you will be able to argue with the tax appraiser, because this is exactly the information they use. Pretty much any real estate agent will be happy to spend ten minutes or so doing the work in order to generate goodwill -- business is so slow these days that's about the cheapest advertising effort he/she will go through this week.

Comparing list prices is not useful, as so many list prices, even in these troubled times, are wishful thinking.

Posted by trailing wife 2010-06-24 21:02|| 2010-06-24 21:02|| Front Page Top

#25 On a personal note, the last few times we bought or sold houses we based the prices on comps. sold, and never had an argument from the opposite party or the banks doing the appraisals. And, when we sold, we got offers in the first two weeks of listing our homes. Granted, we never tried in the current environment, so your mileage will vary.

Posted by trailing wife 2010-06-24 21:05|| 2010-06-24 21:05|| Front Page Top

#26 I will prolly only rent from now until I retire from the service.

That is very smart. Particularly if you move frequently. I am advising my children not to buy for at least 10 years or until WWIII is over, whichever comes first.

Posted by Nimble Spemble 2010-06-24 21:13|| 2010-06-24 21:13|| Front Page Top

#27 My assessment went up 25% and my taxes went down $200. Should I be upset?

Posted by Nimble Spemble 2010-06-24 21:41|| 2010-06-24 21:41|| Front Page Top

#28 Denver- Used housomg prices down 14%. Existing hone sales down 38% in one year. Value of my home,County assement, up 20%. Percentage paid toward education 59%.(I have no children) Denver County rating in the US, 38th. Seems fair to me. I'm sure those undocumented Americans will make my life do much better in my golden years.

Posted by Flapper Scourge of the Algonquins4926 2010-06-24 22:24|| 2010-06-24 22:24|| Front Page Top

#29 From one of the real estate sites:
Over the last year, Wheaton appreciation rates have trailed the rest of the nation. In the last twelve months, Wheaton's appreciation rate has been -4.56%, which is lower than appreciation rates in most communities in America. In the latest quarter, NeighborhoodScout's data show that house appreciation rates in Wheaton were at -0.73%, which equates to an annual appreciation rate of -2.92%.

Notably, Wheaton's appreciation rate in the latest quarter is one of the lowest in America.

Relative to Illinois, our data show that Wheaton's latest annual appreciation rate is higher than 15% of the other cities and towns in Illinois.

Sigh...

Posted by 3dc 2010-06-24 23:01|| 2010-06-24 23:01|| Front Page Top

23:57 Pappy
23:19 JosephMendiola
23:10 trailing wife
23:09 Frank G
23:07 trailing wife
23:05 Frank G
23:04 Asymmetrical
23:01 3dc
22:59 Broadhead6
22:52 trailing wife
22:48 trailing wife
22:26 SteveS
22:26 lord garth
22:24 Flapper Scourge of the Algonquins4926
22:20 Barbara Skolaut
22:16 Barbara Skolaut
22:11 Barbara Skolaut
22:05 Barbara Skolaut
22:02 Snakes Ebbeath5905
21:50 HammerHead
21:46 HammerHead
21:44 junkiron
21:44 DMFD
21:41 Nimble Spemble