Hi there, !
Today Fri 07/07/2006 Thu 07/06/2006 Wed 07/05/2006 Tue 07/04/2006 Mon 07/03/2006 Sun 07/02/2006 Sat 07/01/2006 Archives
Rantburg
533215 articles and 1860414 comments are archived on Rantburg.

Today: 86 articles and 569 comments as of 2:26.
Post a news link    Post your own article   
Area: WoT Background    Non-WoT    Opinion    Local News       
NKors fire Taepodong fizzle
Today's Headlines
Headline Comments [Views]
Page 1: WoT Operations
1 00:00 john [7] 
5 00:00 Inspector Clueso [4] 
8 00:00 CrazyFool [2] 
1 00:00 Frozen Al [3] 
22 00:00 C-Low [6] 
12 00:00 Old Patriot [1] 
25 00:00 john [2] 
2 00:00 Elder of Zion [] 
1 00:00 AzCat [2] 
11 00:00 2b [4] 
2 00:00 2b [] 
4 00:00 Captain America [1] 
8 00:00 Flaigum Whelet4630 [] 
17 00:00 twobyfour [1] 
6 00:00 gromgoru [] 
9 00:00 wxjames [] 
1 00:00 49 Pan [3] 
7 00:00 SamAdamsky [1] 
32 00:00 Baba Tutu [] 
13 00:00 Korora [1] 
20 00:00 Broadhead6 [2] 
5 00:00 Howard UK [2] 
18 00:00 trailing wife [4] 
3 00:00 trailing wife [] 
0 [] 
3 00:00 CrazyFool [] 
0 [] 
0 [] 
0 [5] 
0 [8] 
0 [4] 
4 00:00 Greamp Elmavinter1163 [] 
3 00:00 Glenn [] 
3 00:00 anonymous5089 [] 
Page 2: WoT Background
1 00:00 ryuge [1]
6 00:00 Old Patriot [2]
7 00:00 anymouse [1]
14 00:00 Old Patriot [2]
1 00:00 Zhang Fei []
13 00:00 11A5S [1]
20 00:00 Shieldwolf []
7 00:00 eLarson []
0 [4]
10 00:00 Elder of Zion [1]
4 00:00 Frank G []
5 00:00 Old Patriot [2]
0 [6]
4 00:00 Captain America []
1 00:00 JFM [4]
0 [6]
18 00:00 Broadhead6 [1]
2 00:00 Captain America [6]
0 [6]
2 00:00 Frank G [2]
2 00:00 Bright Pebbles []
5 00:00 Nimble Spemble [4]
3 00:00 2b [1]
1 00:00 Bright Pebbles [1]
Page 3: Non-WoT
7 00:00 gromky [4]
2 00:00 2b [4]
8 00:00 john [7]
14 00:00 2b [4]
4 00:00 2b [3]
8 00:00 Wheager Unutch9131 []
5 00:00 AlmostAnonymous5839 []
8 00:00 RWV []
10 00:00 Barbara Skolaut []
1 00:00 Slomoper Jolumble7671 []
7 00:00 Frank G []
1 00:00 SOP35/Rat []
5 00:00 Redneck Jim []
9 00:00 Anonymoose [6]
2 00:00 Redneck Jim [6]
4 00:00 RWV []
Page 4: Opinion
0 [2]
11 00:00 Inspector Clueso []
0 []
9 00:00 Elder of Zion []
16 00:00 mojo [1]
25 00:00 Broadhead6 [2]
Page 5: Russia-Former Soviet Union
8 00:00 JAN []
3 00:00 Redneck Jim []
0 []
5 00:00 DMFD [1]
20 00:00 Broadhead6 [2]
4 00:00 lotp []
Afghanistan
27 more Sfghan fighters killed; US chopper crashes
Posted by: Doogl comments (UK) || 07/04/2006 03:51 || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Any word on what unit the aircraft came from?
Posted by: 49 Pan || 07/04/2006 9:20 Comments || Top||


23 killed in Afghan violence
At least 23 people including a US soldier were killed in the most recent wave of violence across Afghanistan. US soldiers killed up to 20 militants who ambushed a military convoy in southern Afghanistan, the coalition said Monday. Two soldiers were wounded in the ensuing battle. The clash took place in southern Helmand provinceÂ’s Sangin district on Sunday and appeared to be the same firefight in which Afghan police initially reported that 11 militants had been killed.

One US serviceman was killed and another was injured on Sunday after an AH-64 Apache attack helicopter crashed shortly after takeoff from an airfield in Kandahar in southern Afghanistan, officials said. The military has ruled out hostile fire as the cause of the crash, which is under investigation. The helicopter was responding to a reported rocket attack against Kandahar airfield when it went down, the officials said.

Sangin has become a hotbed of militant activity, particularly for the 3,300 British soldiers in the region. Five British troops have died in recent militant attacks, including two in Sangin on Saturday and another two there on June 27. The military said that up to 30 extremists, firing guns and mortars, attacked a coalition patrol that had just found a weapons cache in Sangin on Sunday. “The coalition attacked the engaging enemy element as well as a second group attempting to reinforce the original group,” said the military statement, which estimated that 20 militants had died. Two soldiers were also wounded and airlifted to a medical facility where they are in stable conditions, the military said.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


Britain
Muslim soldier a British hero
The first Muslim soldier in the British army to die on active duty in Afghanistan was hailed yesterday in his adopted country's press as a "hero" and "a true Brit".

Lance Corporal Jabron Hashmi, 24, was shot dead with Corporal Peter Thorpe, 27, in a Taliban attack at the weekend, bringing to five the number of British troops killed in Helmand province since their deployment in April.
Lance Corporal Hashmi, who was born only 40 minutes away from the Afghan border in Pakistan, became the first British Muslim soldier to be killed in action in modern times.

His portrayal, in patriotic terms, came three days ahead of the first anniversary of the London bombings, in which four British Muslims killed themselves and 52 others in Britain's worst-ever terrorist attack.

"British Muslim, British hero ... Asian immigrant died in Afghanistan, proudly serving the country he loved," read the front page headline in the Daily Mail, self-styled voice of the aspirational English middle class.

"As a Pakistani-born British Muslim, Jabron Hashmi was proud to serve in his adopted country's army," the paper said, pointing out that there are "only 300 Muslims" in the British armed forces.

Born in Peshawar, at the Pakistani end of the Khyber Pass to Afghanistan, Hashmi emigrated to Britain with his family at 12. He joined the army two years ago and served in the Intelligence Corps.

UK's The Daily Telegraph said Hashmi "died fighting militants from his own faith", and quoted the Muslim Council of Britain - deemed to be the most representative Muslim group in the nation - paying tribute to him.

The death of the soldier came as a new poll showed that a significant minority of British Muslims believe they are at war with the rest of society.

The Populus survey for The Times and ITV News found more than one in 10 British Muslim think the men who carried out the London bombings of 7/7 should be regarded as martyrs. Sixteen per cent of British Muslims, equivalent to more than 150,000 adults, believe that while the attacks were wrong, the cause was right.

But the poll also revealed a gulf between this group and the majority of British Muslims, who want the Government to take tougher measures against extremists in their community.

More than half (56 per cent) believe the Government has failed to combat extremism, a higher proportion than the 49per cent of the general population who agree.

Seventy-nine per cent said there were no circumstances that would justify suicide bombings against military targets in Britain, and 78 per cent said they would be angry to learn that a close family member had joined al-Qa'ida.

Nearly half (49 per cent) of Britain's 1.6 million Muslims think it acceptable for the authorities to monitor what is being preached in mosques.

Trevor Phillips, chairman of Britain's Commission for Racial Equality, said it was as if some Muslim groups were living in a different country.
Posted by: Oztralian || 07/04/2006 18:26 || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Someone better put a guard on his grave, or they will desecrate his grave like they did that Spanish policeman.
More scary was the quote "there are only 300 muslims in the British armed forces".

Al
Posted by: Frozen Al || 07/04/2006 19:18 Comments || Top||


UK police say terror activity is growing
The level of "sinister" terrorist activity in Britain is increasing as the anniversary of last year's July 7 attacks on London approaches, the head of Scotland Yard's anti-terrorist squad has warned.

Over the past 12 months, he said, police had disrupted "three or four" potential plots and were involved in more than 70 separate investigations. More than 60 individuals are awaiting trial.
Headline I'd like to read in the next year: 'Over 60 Convicted in Terror Plots in U.K.'. What are the odds?
"This is unprecedented and the flow of new cases shows no sign of abating - if anything it is accelerating," Peter Clarke, the head of counter terrorism for the Metropolitan Police, said. "It is not simply because the police have greater visibility and are certainly joining up the dots a lot more, but there is a lot more going on out there." Some of the intelligence examined by police was "very sinister", he said.

The fact that the majority of those under suspicion were British citizens was alarming, as was the "extreme youth" of some of them, he added.

He said that although some of the people at the centre of investigations had links to al Qaeda training camps in Afghanistan and Pakistan as well as Bosnia and Chechnya, there had been no indications of a greater radicalisation caused by the Iraq conflict.

Security has been stepped up in the approach to the first annniversary, on Friday, of the London bombings. A two-minute silence will be held as part of a programme of remembrance.
Posted by: lotp || 07/04/2006 08:13 || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1 
They're under attack, at war and cannot bring themselves to acknowledge it. The level of denial is breathtaking.

Of course there's the same denial here from various segments of the society, but our Muslim problem hasn't reached the same level as theirs.

Yet.
Posted by: Fur Trapper || 07/04/2006 10:32 Comments || Top||

#2  our Muslim problem hasn't reached the same level as theirs.

Nor is there any reason to believe it will, especially if we would get the multi-culti-tranzi educationists out of our schools so they could start assimilating these kids. Frankly, I'm more worried about NOI, and I'm not very worried about them.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 10:40 Comments || Top||

#3  Frankly, I'm more worried about NOI, and I'm not very worried about them.

shoot anything in a bowtie. Of course, we'd lose Tucker Carlson, but that's a feature, not a bug
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 10:48 Comments || Top||

#4  *ahem*
Posted by: Seafarious || 07/04/2006 10:53 Comments || Top||

#5  just joking, Sea :-)
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 10:54 Comments || Top||

#6  "This is unprecedented and the flow of new cases shows no sign of abating - if anything it is accelerating," Peter Clarke, the head of counter terrorism for the Metropolitan Police, said.

So surprised-- gee, you don't suppose it would have anything to do with this, do you?

Stop tolerating imams who preach anti-British hatred and incite violence against non-Muslims, and you won't have splodeydopes in your midst.

Or are your minds so open your brains have fallen out?

Posted by: Dave D. || 07/04/2006 11:07 Comments || Top||

#7  Penetrate them. A thousand fake muslim men with orders to go round the universities and youth clubs looking for jihadis to team up with. Hopefully it's already being done.
Posted by: Apostate || 07/04/2006 11:57 Comments || Top||

#8  but our Muslim problem hasn't reached the same level as theirs.

At least we've identified the problem. Now on to the solution.
Posted by: Spinesing Thavise5546 || 07/04/2006 12:15 Comments || Top||

#9  The royal family must convert to the Muslim "religion" in word as well as deed immediately,
Posted by: SamAdamsky || 07/04/2006 12:16 Comments || Top||

#10  Unfortunately we are paying for years of multiculturism on our crowded isle.Compare the poulation of UK to USA and the land size

Europe is being swamped by undesirables and our MPs are doing nothing about it!Rats breed fast!!!!
Posted by: Cheregum Crelet7867 || 07/04/2006 12:37 Comments || Top||

#11 
Nothing a blood pudding bomb wouldn't solve.
Posted by: Master of Obvious || 07/04/2006 13:02 Comments || Top||

#12 
"Frankly, I'm more worried about NOI, and I'm not very worried about them."

NOI?
Posted by: Fur Trapper || 07/04/2006 13:25 Comments || Top||

#13  Nation of Islam - Calypso Louie Farrakhan's cult
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 13:35 Comments || Top||

#14  Maybe, if you'd shown more understanding and caring about the problems of the Muslim minority in UK?
Posted by: gromgoru || 07/04/2006 13:52 Comments || Top||

#15 
"Nor is there any reason to believe it will, especially if we would get the multi-culti-tranzi educationists out of our schools so they could start assimilating these kids."

And just how likely is that to happen?

"Nation of Islam - Calypso Louie Farrakhan's cult"

Ah yes, the Nation of Islam, I should have picked up on that. Another pack of racist would-be murdering thugs hiding behind religion.

Posted by: Fur Trapper || 07/04/2006 14:24 Comments || Top||

#16  Another pack of racist would-be murdering thugs hiding behind religion.

LOL!
Posted by: Ulinert Ebbomomble4493 || 07/04/2006 14:54 Comments || Top||

#17  Ulinert Ebbomomble4493, I fail to see humor in it.
Posted by: twobyfour || 07/04/2006 16:11 Comments || Top||


British Muslim soldier killed fighting the Taliban
Jabron Hashmi was born in the Pakistani city of Peshawar, just under an hour from the Afghan border. Last Saturday, after a journey that had taken him from Peshawar to Birmingham, and from civilian life to the military, he died on the other side of the border in Sangin, southern Afghanistan, the first British Muslim soldier to be killed since the "war on terror" began five years ago.

The family of L/Cpl Hashmi, killed alongside Corporal Peter Thorpe in a rocket-propelled grenade attack, said the 24-year-old had joined the army because he wanted to "build bridges" between Britain and the Islamic world.

L/Cpl Hashmi's older brother Zeeshan, a former member of the Intelligence Corps, said: "Jabron was a committed soldier and a committed Muslim. He was fiercely proud of his Islamic background and he was equally proud of being British.
The article continues at length; no one writes an obituary like the Brits. Remember men like Cpl. Hashmi are out there.
Posted by: Steve White || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Good lad. Sleep well Jabron.
Posted by: Howard UK || 07/04/2006 4:19 Comments || Top||

#2  Aye Howard , notice the lack of screaming lefties ?

May the pair rest in peace
Posted by: MacNails || 07/04/2006 4:24 Comments || Top||

#3  Too damn few men likw this, ouick or dead. Rest well.
Posted by: Sock Puppet of Doom || 07/04/2006 4:48 Comments || Top||

#4  Lets not forget the guy who fell with him.
Posted by: Bright Pebbles || 07/04/2006 5:22 Comments || Top||

#5  Aye, MacNails and fair point, BP. Not sure the coverage in the UK was equitable. I'm sure that Barrow has lost a fine son in Cpl Thorpe.
Posted by: Howard UK || 07/04/2006 5:54 Comments || Top||


China-Japan-Koreas
NKors fire Taepodong fizzle
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - North Korea launched a long-range Taepodong-2 missile and two small Scud-type missiles within a two-hour period, but the long-range missile appears to have failed, a diplomatic source told Reuters on Tuesday.

CNN also reported that a Taepodong had been fired. The Taepodong 2 missile, which had been under intense scrutiny by the United States and other western powers, appeared to have failed in flight, the diplomatic source said.
Posted by: Steve White || 07/04/2006 17:30 || Comments || Link || [6 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "...appeared to have failed in flight..."

Failed? Or nailed by some kind of US boost-phase intercept ABM?

Just wondering...

Posted by: Dave D. || 07/04/2006 17:40 Comments || Top||

#2  Test should have been good enough for the Aegis cruisers to get good radar analysis of the Ro Dongs and Taepo Dong.
Posted by: ed || 07/04/2006 17:43 Comments || Top||

#3  I'm assuming we do have the capability to have done this deed, even if, this time, we didn't.
Posted by: Sherry || 07/04/2006 17:44 Comments || Top||

#4  I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want to be a Nork rocket scientist right about now. I suspect failure to please His Poofithairedness could get quite unpleasant.
Posted by: PBMcL || 07/04/2006 17:59 Comments || Top||

#5  Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Just Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.
Posted by: Thrineth Omineter2945 || 07/04/2006 18:07 Comments || Top||

#6  Now, here's where a leak that we have operative's in thier rocket program could be valuble.
Posted by: plainslow || 07/04/2006 18:17 Comments || Top||

#7  It didn't fail... it missed.
Let loose the dogs of war, knock out a few key targets, wait for cease and desist letter, apologize later.
Rinse and repeat.
Posted by: Capsu78 || 07/04/2006 18:18 Comments || Top||

#8  We should claim our super-secret weapon made it fizzle. Whether true or not, there's value in making the enemy worry.
Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) || 07/04/2006 18:23 Comments || Top||

#9  Tomorrow's headline: NorK Dong Has Projectile Dysfunction
Posted by: ghostcat || 07/04/2006 18:31 Comments || Top||

#10  The launch sequence was "Hey, y'all! Look what happens when I launch this! Hold my beer!"
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 19:33 Comments || Top||

#11  ABC News says the NorKs launched a total of five missiles. WTF???
Posted by: Dave D. || 07/04/2006 19:50 Comments || Top||

#12  Never ascribe to malice what can be adequately explained by incompetance.

Boosters have a tendency to do that, especially new ones still in test phase. How many did we go through before we got a Mercury up on top of an old Atlas?
Posted by: mojo || 07/04/2006 19:54 Comments || Top||

#13  I think the timing of the launch (the 4th) indicates that it was intended as a direct provocation. I would like to see us respond in kind on 9 Sep.
Posted by: whitecollar redneck || 07/04/2006 19:54 Comments || Top||

#14  Continued.... the NORKs founding date.
Posted by: whitecollar redneck || 07/04/2006 19:55 Comments || Top||

#15  Dave D - The guys at Cheyenne Mtn told Fox's Bret Baeir (sp?) there were 6 launches - posted long ago on the original thread...

I love having 3 threads on the same story.
Posted by: Wheager Unutch9131 || 07/04/2006 19:55 Comments || Top||

#16  Hey, Anybody know where the Glomar Explorer is parked?
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 20:14 Comments || Top||

#17  I say everyone should send Kimmie-boy a box of viagra. Seems he -er- disfunctional.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 07/04/2006 20:32 Comments || Top||

#18  As I've said before, you have to be very careful about the SEALS on those things. [wink, wink, nudge, nudge]
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 07/04/2006 20:50 Comments || Top||

#19  Excerpt from the speech I'd like to write for GWB:

"The bottom line .... we could do this stuff 50 years ago with half of our military industrial complex tied behind our backs. While these clowns were making a bad attempt at amateur rocketry, we successfully launched people into space -- to work on a space station. How frickin cool is that? Unfortunately for the North Korean people, the only thing their inferior leaders are good at is killing their own countrymen by the million. Now if you'll excuse my, I need to go to a fireworks demonstrations to celebrate my vastly superior culture"

That would be so cool. Seriously, these jerk-offs scare me less and less all the time. Don't pay any attention to them, or give them anything. Let Ronery boy's piece of crap country rot from within.
Posted by: Snoluns Ominter2681 || 07/04/2006 22:21 Comments || Top||

#20  By this time tomorrow the MSM will have broadcast 487 interviews with Madeleine Notsobright explaining how these launches are the result of the failure of the evil Bush Administration to carry on with the ever-so-wunnferful negotiating strategy of the Clinton administration.
Posted by: Matt || 07/04/2006 22:26 Comments || Top||

#21  I beleive that the best response to this is to laugh and point. Turn it into a joke and watch bad hair Kim go totally crazy. The Koreans make a great deal about face and NK just lost face.
Posted by: Michael || 07/04/2006 22:31 Comments || Top||

#22  I think the Norks blinked and hit the self destruct.

If they had launched full out and we shot it down it would have made their missile threat void at the same time guaranteed Japan, S Korea, the world to be begging to get under the US umbrella.

This way they save face by not backing down and at the same time salvage their missile threat as possible just needing refinement.
Posted by: C-Low || 07/04/2006 23:25 Comments || Top||


Sources: North Korea tests missiles
Tuesday, July 4, 2006; Posted: 4:31 p.m. EDT (20:31 GMT)

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- North Korea tested at least two missiles early Wednesday but has not fired the long-range Taepodong-2 rocket Western observers suspect has been readied for launch, U.S. sources told CNN.

Both missiles were launched from a site other than the one intelligence officials have watched for weeks ahead of a possible long-range missile test, a senior State Department official said.

Two senior U.S. State Department officials said Tuesday that fuel trucks had departed the site where the long-range missile sits on a launching pad, indicating that a test might be near.

The removal of the fuel trucks and other auxiliary equipment meant the North Koreans may have finished fueling the missile, said the officials, who did not want to be named because of the sensitivity of the information.

Should the North Koreans have completed the fueling "all they would need to do now is press the button," one of the sources said.

But both officials said no hard evidence points to a launch coming soon.

"It's the Fourth of July, and they know we are watching and they like to play with us," said one official, who has followed the North Korean program for years.

Posted by: Sherry || 07/04/2006 16:33 || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  CNN is now reporting that a third missile, theTaepodong 2 was launched also but busted up in mid flight(intercepted?).
Posted by: bigjim-ky || 07/04/2006 17:07 Comments || Top||

#2  Bet there's some Navy guys and others whooping it up on a boat right now. Let's hope we get to it before the Norks do. The game is on for some folks right now.
Posted by: 49 Pan || 07/04/2006 17:11 Comments || Top||

#3  Now Drudge is reporting a fourth missile?
What the hell is going on over there? Is Kimmie celebrating the 4th of July or what?
Posted by: bigjim-ky || 07/04/2006 17:17 Comments || Top||

#4  Decoys to distract, maneuver our of position our elint assets. Also possibly to attract BMD activity.

Apparently the Taepodong was launched and broke up. Hope we assisted in that. In any case, we should claim credit.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 17:34 Comments || Top||

#5  Nimble: Maybe it would have better effect just to neither confirm nor deny knowing or not knowing anything about how North Korea's stupid Big Dong missile prematurely fizzled out! :-)

I suppose this thing is full of LOX or something. Should it be generating a plume of evaporated fuel? Is it?
Posted by: grb || 07/04/2006 17:42 Comments || Top||

#6  NK has about 1000 SCUD and larger types. They can spare a few to wish us a Happy July 4th.
Posted by: ed || 07/04/2006 17:45 Comments || Top||

#7  LOX is far too sophisticated for their engines.
Likely red fuming nitric acid and UDMH.

Posted by: john || 07/04/2006 17:46 Comments || Top||

#8  If there's any way we can claim credit, it would really reduce the attractiveness for export of the TPD-2. It would be nice to nip Kimmie market.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 17:59 Comments || Top||

#9  When it was on the pad they fueled it way early. This raised eyebrows because the stuff is just a biatch to siphon off if you don't launch, and is so corrosive that you had better not leave it in the missile for any length of time.

Maybe the Nkors were in a "use it or lose it" situation, and by the time they shot, it had corroded to the point where it failed.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 07/04/2006 18:14 Comments || Top||

#10  Whatever the *actual* reason for failure -- we should claim we did it to them.
Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) || 07/04/2006 18:28 Comments || Top||

#11  I have heard very little about the current status of the Airborne Laser. The type of failure that happened is exactly what this system would produce.
Posted by: Patrick || 07/04/2006 20:00 Comments || Top||

#12  Forget airborne laser - we should all be thinking shipboard laser, as with the Navy test program with a high-powered laser added to a fleet destroyer. I'm sure a test of that beauty would also cause a bit of damage. Also, a nice microwave-frequency weapon would do the same thing by "encouraging" failure among valves, pipes, and other metal parts that could be induced to vibrate. There are so many choices of research weaponry the NORKS will never know which one we used, or how successful it was.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 07/04/2006 20:46 Comments || Top||


NKor launches something into the Sea of Japan
North Korea test-launched a missile Wednesday that landed in the Sea of Japan, Japanese media reported.

The reclusive communist state launched the missile at 3:32 a.m., or 2:32 p.m. Tuesday EDT, and it crashed into the Sea of Japan several minutes later, public broadcaster NHK reported.

Japanese government officials were trying to determine whether it was a long-range ballistic missile that had been readied for launch recently. [or whether it was a regular short range missile with better paint on the outside]
Posted by: mhw || 07/04/2006 16:29 || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Japan says a second missile has been launched
Posted by: john || 07/04/2006 16:33 Comments || Top||

#2  Maybe a bottle rocket in honor of the 4th? :)
Posted by: Hupeating Flins9708 || 07/04/2006 16:43 Comments || Top||

#3  Many happy returns
Posted by: Captain America || 07/04/2006 16:44 Comments || Top||

#4  Exciting times in the Sea of Japan. Stay alert. The big one may fly soon. We don't want to miss it.
Posted by: Darrell || 07/04/2006 16:50 Comments || Top||

#5  Heard on FOX that they fired a third missle (the long range one) but it 'failed in mid-flight'.

Hoping that we shot the fucker down. That would give kimmie-boy-the-baby-killer a much deserved kick in the nuts.

Wait and see....
Posted by: Unailing Ebbaiper7772 || 07/04/2006 17:02 Comments || Top||

#6  They showed us theirs , now lets show em' ours.
Posted by: bigjim-ky || 07/04/2006 17:08 Comments || Top||

#7  Cruise missile test over Pyongyang for the Dear Leader's birthday?
Posted by: ed || 07/04/2006 17:12 Comments || Top||

#8  So he fired a spread to try to cover the long-range missile launch - what a chump - AP (according to Fox TV - not on AP MY Way, yet) says he's launched 4, so far. Appears to be "concensus" that the 3rd one was the biggie - and it was either a dud for him - or a successful test for us, LOL.
Posted by: Hupeating Flins9708 || 07/04/2006 17:16 Comments || Top||

#9  According to State Dept, the third missile broke up 40 seconds into the flight
Posted by: john || 07/04/2006 17:22 Comments || Top||

#10  40 Seconds would be too quick for BMD.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 17:36 Comments || Top||

#11  40 seconds? Probably going mach 2 and at maximum aerodynamic stress. More cast iron in the framework, Kimmie.
Posted by: ed || 07/04/2006 17:40 Comments || Top||

#12  This might explain this: from NewsMax, read on Monday

NORAD, U.S. Air Bases on Heightened Alert

Air bases in Aurora and Colorado Springs, Colo. are on heightened alert but no one would say why.

The Cheyenne Mountain Air Station and Buckley Air Force Base were among four bases nationwide that went on higher alert.

Vandenberg Air Force in California and Patrick Air Force Base in Florida were also on heightened alert, after the U.S. Space Command in Colorado Springs issued the security increase.

North American Aerospace Defense Command, headquartered deep inside Cheyenne Mountain in Colorado Springs, went to "Bravo-Plus" alert status as part of the heightened alert.
Posted by: Sherry || 07/04/2006 17:54 Comments || Top||

#13  Kimmie's Kommie's shoot the entire Nork GNP and it looks like egg roll rationing for the rest of the year. But thanks for the 4th of July salute, dear leader! Thanks also to the Halliburton Missile Munching Div.!
Posted by: Inspector Clueso || 07/04/2006 17:57 Comments || Top||

#14  LOL, Jim Angle (FoxTV) just called it "2 Scuds and a Dud". Heh heh.
Posted by: Hupeating Flins9708 || 07/04/2006 18:01 Comments || Top||

#15  Dork's Dongs Dinged!
Posted by: Throtle Slavimble7236 || 07/04/2006 18:01 Comments || Top||

#16  #10 - "40 Seconds would be too quick for BMD."

True, Nimble, true, but not too soon for the laser, or the pre-launch melt-away bolt installations, or the Tesla death ray, or the concentrated pixie dust beam, or about a dozen other items we should discretely spread about to give everyone something to chew on. Or, how about JDF?????

Good for us!
Posted by: Thrineth Omineter2945 || 07/04/2006 18:13 Comments || Top||

#17  Fox just said they launched 6 missiles, LOL. Rodongs, Nodongs, Scuds, Duds, Puds...
Posted by: Hupeating Flins9708 || 07/04/2006 18:50 Comments || Top||

#18  I read somewhere that 40 seconds was not too long. It is hard for me to believe we could acquire, analyze decide, launch and hit that quickly. Does anyone know for a fact?
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 19:29 Comments || Top||

#19  Well, Rodongs, Nodongs, Scuds, Duds anyway.

I heard they pulled their pud.
Posted by: Glusing Ebbavirt3907 || 07/04/2006 19:32 Comments || Top||

#20  You know it's gotta hurt Kimmie's feelings that even a bunch of seething Paleos are better at rocketry than he is. Either that or an American laser just broke his favorite toy. I can be happy either way.
Posted by: Darrell || 07/04/2006 19:37 Comments || Top||

#21  Here's the drill:
Darrell, Glusing and Nimble call the NYT and tell them it was Dr. Evil's "LASER".

Me, Hupeat and Thrin will call Al Jazeera and tell them it was zionist pixie dust.

Let's see what they print tomorrow.
Posted by: mhw || 07/04/2006 20:17 Comments || Top||

#22  No way -- I'd rather chat with a bunch of telemarketers than a bunch of traitors.
Posted by: Darrell || 07/04/2006 20:31 Comments || Top||

#23  LOL mhw.
Posted by: Wheager Unutch9131 || 07/04/2006 20:37 Comments || Top||

#24  Rub salt in the wound by reminding him we successfully launched the space shuttle "Discovery" today. We can do it, he can't. Nyaaa, Nyaaaa, Nyaaaa.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 07/04/2006 20:49 Comments || Top||

#25  Didn't this thing have strap-on boosters?
Probably susceptible to vibration... NoKos have a lot to learn about building rockets... it is a long and painful process...

Posted by: john || 07/04/2006 21:12 Comments || Top||


Europe
GTMO Frenchmen go on trial in Paris
Six French former inmates of the U.S. military detention center in Guantanamo Bay stood trial in a French court on Monday, denying accusations of links with a network plotting terrorism attacks.
"Non! Non! Certainement pas!"
The six, who have all spent lengthy periods in detention in Cuba and in France, face up to 10 years in prison if convicted. The prosecution alleges the men joined a terrorism network based in Britain and the Afghan-Pakistan border, having passed through Britain en route to al Qaeda camps in Afghanistan. But the accused said they only went there out of curiosity. "I wanted to take some risks," Nizar Sassi, one of the defendants, told the court. "It was cool. It was a chance to live my passion for weapons."
"Yer honor, if you buy my lame story you are proving everything my imam told me about kufrs to be absolutely true."
Khaled ben Mustapha said he had gone to Kabul to look for a house for his family, adding: "Going to Afghanistan doesn't make you a terrorist." A third accused, Imad Kanouni, said he wanted to learn more about religion while traveling. "Afghanistan was in fashion," he told the court.
"Jihad was the new black in the Fall 2001 collections, yer honor!"
Prosecutors say five of the six men trained in al Qaeda camps in Afghanistan between 2000 and 2001 and that Kanouni had fundamentalist religious training there. Defense lawyers say, at most, their clients were guilty only of naivety in remaining in Afghanistan when U.S. forces arrived after the Sept. 11 attacks on the United States in 2001. Presiding trial judge Jean-Claude Kross said the six men, aged between 24 and 38, were captured in mid December as they tried to flee the advance of U.S forces and their Afghan allies. Some were handed over by villagers for a prize of up to 5,000 euros ($6,399). Pakistani forces later handed them over to the U.S. military who transferred them to Guantanamo Bay, convinced they had fought for Afghanistan's ousted Islamist Taliban regime. Benchellali has admitted attending a training camp in Afghanistan, but said friends dragged him into it. The six were held at Guantanamo without charge or trial along with hundreds of other "enemy combatants", and they have complained of insults, physical and psychological torture, and deprivation of food and water.
Right on schedule, right out of the Al-Q playbook. Has Andrew Sullivan filed an amicus brief yet?
Sassi, Mustapha, Kanouni, Mourad Benchellali and Redouane Khalid spent several months in French jail before being released under judicial controls. A sixth man, Brahim Yadel, had remained in custody. The verdict is expected in mid-July.
Posted by: Seafarious || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Wonder how the prison conditions differ for these lads. IIRC the EU commission said Gitmo was good, but French and Romanian lockups were the pits. Well at least at Club Corsica, they won't have to worry about having to go on a Jenny Craig program.
Posted by: Slomoper Jolumble7671 || 07/04/2006 9:25 Comments || Top||

#2  Isnt France one of the places where the dungeon was fashionable?
Posted by: bk7 || 07/04/2006 12:09 Comments || Top||

#3  French jails are routineley decried by various ngo for being in dire conditions, decrepit and overcrowded. Gitmo would be a paradise in comparison, strictly speaking about living conditions.
Still, I doubt they would go to general population areas, since french jails are also rife with muslims (between 2/3 and 3/4 depending on what I've read, most certainly at least over 50% on national level), and are a playground for salafists, complete with peer pressure to convert non-muslims (though there's an unspoken ethnic separation of ethnic french and migrants by the authorities denounced as "apartheid" by some "antiracist" orgs) and enforce the standard behavior of the True Believers not Pious enough. They would feel quite at home there.
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 07/04/2006 15:28 Comments || Top||


India-Pakistan
Pak nuke warheads were 'deployed' during Kargil war
Lahore: Former Pakistani prime minister Nawaz Sharif has said that during the Kargil war, General Pervez Musharraf had moved the Pakistani nuclear warheads without his approval to use them against India.

The former Pakistani prime minister, who now lives in exile in London, has made this revelation in his biography titled Ghadaar Kaun? Nawaz Sharif Ki Kahani, Unki Zubani (Who is the traitor? Nawaz Sharif's Story in His Own Words.)

The book, which is based on the personal and political life of Nawaz Sharif, has been written by senior Pakistani journalist Suhail Warraich and was released yesterday.

The former premier has revealed for the first time the details of his childhood, his political career, the Kargil issue, nuclear explosions, the October 1998 military takeover and his departure to Jeddah.

The 500-page book echoes the viewpoint of Sharif an important player in Pakistan's political history.

Sharif states in the book: "During my post-Kargil misadventure meeting with American President Clinton, I was told by the American leader that the nuclear warheads had been shifted from one station to the other during the Kargil War.

"I was taken aback by this revelation because I knew nothing about it.

"The American President further told me during the meeting that the nuclear warheads have been moved so that these could be used against India.

"I was asked by Mr Clinton as to why I was unaware of these developments despite being the elected chief executive and the prime minister of the country. It was a very irresponsible thing to do on General Musharraf's part."

Sharif has claimed in his first official biography that General Musharraf had waged the Kargil war against India without his approval and he only came to know of the misadventure through Indian Prime Minister Vajpayee who had provided him audio tapes of Musharraf's telephonic conversation to this affect.
Posted by: john || 07/04/2006 21:19 || Comments || Link || [7 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Nawaz Sharif should have known better than to expect that his permission was needed to deploy nuclear weapons.

Benazir Bhutto was denied permission to visit the Kahuta Uranium enrichment plant run by AQ Khan when she was Prime Minister of the country.
The Saudi Prince Sultan Bin Abdul Aziz was however given a grand tour (after all they probably paid for the place).

The Pakistan state doesn't have an army. It is the army that has a state. A true praetorian setup.
Posted by: john || 07/04/2006 22:11 Comments || Top||


Kashmir Korpse Kount: 14
Clashes between Indian forces and suspected militants killed 14 people in Held Kashmir on Monday. Ten militants and a soldier died in three incidents in Kashmir, the Indian army said, while police said they had killed three militants, including a senior leader, in two other encounters in the Jammu portion of the state. The troops came under fire as they approached two houses, starting an all-night gun battle. A soldier and a suspected militant were killed, Juneja said. Later, the army said it had found the body of a second militant. Three soldiers were wounded, one critically, he said.

Also, Indian troops identified a group of suspected militants crossing the LoC late in the Gulmarg area on Sunday. The ensuing fight left four infiltrators killed, Juneja said. Later on Monday, two suspected militants were killed in a gun battle with paramilitary soldiers in Wangund, an eastern suburb of Srinagar, said Dileep Singh, a spokesman of the Central Reserve Police Force. A soldier was injured in the brief gun battle, he said.

Elsewhere, police raided a rebel hide-out in the mountainous Sharekhi district late on Sunday, killing a senior militant, identified as Tariq Usman Sheikh, the district commander of the Hizbul Mujahedeen group, said local police chief Manohar Singh. Sharekhi. In another incident, police surrounded a group of militants in the Tramda Nari area, about 190 kilometres northwest of Jammu. Two militants were killed and police continued to battle others, said area superintendent Farooq Khan. Reinforcements have been called in, he said. Two suspected militants who laid siege to a mosque in Indian held Kashmir have been killed after a nightlong firefight with Indian security forces, an official said on Monday. The rebels had fled to the mosque after soldiers raided their hideout in northern Bandipora town late on Sunday, sparking a gun battle in which a soldier was killed and two others were injured.
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [5 views] Top|| File under:


3 rockets hit PPL building in Sui
The Pakistan Petroleum Limited (PPL) building in Sui was hit by three rockets on Monday causing minor damage to the building. Official sources said the actual target of the attack by unidentified assailants was the Sui gas plant but they missed and hit the PPL building instead. No casualty was reported. A case has been registered against the unidentified attackers. Meanwhile, security forces said they had seized weapons from Thoba Nothakani in Dera Bugti district.

"After receiving a tip-off, security forces cordoned off the area and conducted raids in which 83 landmines and several rockets, missile fuses and mortars were recovered," said an official, adding that no arrests were made. Separately, security forces at Haft Wali took the body of an insurgent into custody. Officials said they had also recovered weapons along with the body.
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [8 views] Top|| File under:


6 troops killed in Dir blast
TIMERGARA: Six paramilitary personnel were killed and seven injured when their vehicle was hit by an explosion in Lower Dir district, 130km from Peshawar. Lower Dir DCO Javed told reporters that the Dir Scouts personnel were escorting officers of the Army Staff College, Quetta, to Chitral. Six troops had been killed and three of the soldiers injured in the blast were in "critical condition".
Ceasefire's going pretty well, huh?
"The Staff College officials escaped unharmed," Javed said. "Five personnel have died and seven injured in what appears to be a roadside explosion," military spokesman Shaukat Sultan told Daily Times. He said that full details of the incident were awaited. Experts said a remote-controlled integrated device caused the blast. An unconfirmed report said that the paramilitary personnel were "escorting" military officials to the Shandoor festival, which starts from July 6.
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:


Iraq
Coalition Forces detain senior al-Qaida in Iraq terrorist
Coalition Forces detained one senior al-Qaida in Iraq terrorist and four suspected terrorists during a raid in the vicinity of Tikrit July 3.

The raid successfully targeted a senior al-Qaida member known to be involved in facilitating foreign terrorists throughout central Iraq . The targeted individual reportedly replaced the former leader of this cell who was also recently captured by Coalition Forces.

Coalition Forces secured multiple buildings during the raid detaining the senior terrorist at the initial target area. The troops captured an additional three subjects at the second target building along with one AK-47 and one grenade. The assault force encountered significant physical resistance form one of these detainees and discovered through questioning that the group had just recently been dropped off at that location by other suspected terrorists.

The forces then cleared a third target building located in a remote area west of the initial objective. Intelligence indicated that this location was a suspected terrorist hide out. The owner of the house was detained without incident.

Several women and children were present at the raid sites. None were harmed and all were returned to their homes once the troops the area was secured.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 07/04/2006 18:41 || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Bring in the Comfy Chair!
Posted by: eLarson || 07/04/2006 18:44 Comments || Top||

#2  surely not, eLarson, whatever will the Belgians say?
Posted by: Seafarious || 07/04/2006 18:51 Comments || Top||

#3  They'll be busy watching the Tour de Phrawnce pass through...
Posted by: eLarson || 07/04/2006 19:12 Comments || Top||

#4  Szell (Laurence Olivier) mercilessly drills BabeÂ’s (Dustin Hoffman) mouth: “Is it safe?” "Is it safe?"
Posted by: anymouse || 07/04/2006 19:54 Comments || Top||

#5  Detained? Where's Ramsey Clarke with the bail money?
Posted by: Inspector Clueso || 07/04/2006 20:10 Comments || Top||


Bush -- last things he saw was the face of an American soldier from Fort Bragg
Fort Bragg is the home to some of our country's best and bravest: the men and women of the United States Army Special Operations Command. (Applause.) Army Special Forces define their mission in a motto: "To Liberate the Oppressed." And in the war on terror you've done just that, overthrowing cruel regimes in Afghanistan and Iraq, and bringing freedom to more than 50 million people. (Applause.)

Green Berets were the first U.S. forces on the ground in both Operation Enduring Freedom and our Operation Iraqi Freedom. And along with others, you remain on the offense against the terrorists today. A few weeks ago, I had a chance to visit Baghdad and visit with some of Fort Bragg's finest soldiers, the special operation forces who helped bring justice to the terrorist Zarqawi. (Applause.)

They were the first coalition forces to arrive on the scene after the bombing of Zarqawi's safe house. They administered compassionate medical care to a man who showed no compassion to his victims. And when this brutal terrorist took his final breath, one of the last things he saw was the face of an American soldier from Fort Bragg, North Carolina. (Applause.)
Posted by: Sherry || 07/04/2006 18:36 || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Hoo-rah, y'all. :-D
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 07/04/2006 19:41 Comments || Top||

#2  Ditto! (Waving frantically from the back of the room "Hi, Barbara!!")
Posted by: Sgt. Mom || 07/04/2006 20:26 Comments || Top||

#3  Heh. I did like that comment.
Posted by: Brett || 07/04/2006 20:45 Comments || Top||

#4  Love it.
Posted by: Whiskey Mike || 07/04/2006 20:51 Comments || Top||

#5  Great line, but what did Zarq hear last?

1- "Stings like a bitch, don't it?"

2- "Hey doc, I don't think these chest compressions are doing any good!"

3- "Sucks to be you, muj mofo!"

4- "Courtesy of the red white and blue."
Posted by: Matt || 07/04/2006 22:08 Comments || Top||

#6  #6 - How about: "President Bush sends his regards, asshole."


#2 - Hi, Mom! Happy 4th! :-D
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 07/04/2006 22:12 Comments || Top||

#7  I meant #5, not 6.

Oh, well, it's late. And the steak was thick. And the moonbats made me do it.

Yeah, that's the ticket.
;-p
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 07/04/2006 22:14 Comments || Top||

#8  How about:

Oops! I'm afraid I just injected you with swine blood. Always getting those two mixed up.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 07/04/2006 22:17 Comments || Top||


Another Iraqi Official Kidnapped
Was this guy's name in Zarquawi's cell phone?
BAGHDAD, Iraq - Gunmen in camouflaged uniforms kidnapped Iraq's deputy electricity minister along with 11 of his bodyguards in eastern Baghdad on Tuesday, security officials said.

The gunmen stopped Raed al-Hares' convoy in the Shiite neighborhood of Talbiya, then forced the official and his bodyguards into their vehicles, said police Lt. Ahmed Qassim.
Posted by: Glenmore || 07/04/2006 09:33 || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  11 bodyguards kidnapped too? What the hell? Nobody armed?
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 10:52 Comments || Top||

#2  Eleven dead bodyguards, okay, musta put up a helluva fight. Eleven kidnapped bodyguards? That's an inside job.
Posted by: Steve White || 07/04/2006 12:15 Comments || Top||

#3  Eleven kidnapped bodyguards? That's an inside job.

Nope. It smells like a guy fleeing because it was found he was an Al Quaida mole. Remember that article yesterday about the phone numbers of Iraki officials in Zarkawi's mobile.

Also we
Posted by: JFM || 07/04/2006 13:41 Comments || Top||

#4  AQ mole could explain poor electrical system construction
Posted by: Captain America || 07/04/2006 16:43 Comments || Top||


7 terrorists killed, none captured in Adhamiyah attack
BAGHDAD - Soldiers from 1st Battalion, 2nd Brigade, 6th Iraqi Army Division, and Battery B, 4th Battalion, 320th Field Artillery Regiment, 4th Brigade Combat Team, 101st Airborne Division, killed seven terrorists Sunday night during a fire fight in the Adhamiyah area of east Baghdad.

At approximately 6 p.m., Iraqi soldiers at a traffic control point reported small-arms fire in Antar Square. The patrol from Btry. B was in the area and rendered support. Over the next two hours, terrorists attacked the forces using small-arms fire, rocket-propelled grenades and hand grenades in the areas of Antar Square and Sabah Library.

With assistance of combat aviation, the Coalition Forces were able to subdue the terrorists. No Coalition Forces were injured during the fire fight and no terrorists were detained.
Posted by: Glenmore || 07/04/2006 09:30 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "no terrorists were detained"

or they were very VERY detained...it's all semantics! Still, I'm sure the "good" folks at the ACLU will be pleased that these 7 bypassed the dreaded (shudder) Gitmo! I just hope we remember to bury them in pig-shit!
Posted by: Justrand || 07/04/2006 9:44 Comments || Top||

#2  Good. The perfect ratio of Killed to Captured.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 9:59 Comments || Top||

#3  Great job, no quarter for the AQ. It's about time.
Posted by: 49 Pan || 07/04/2006 10:08 Comments || Top||

#4  No prisoners taken; left on the battlefield. As predicted here @ da Burg.
Posted by: USN,Ret || 07/04/2006 12:41 Comments || Top||

#5  new DOD cost savings plan
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 13:42 Comments || Top||

#6  No more Gitmos. Works for me.
Posted by: Darrell || 07/04/2006 14:36 Comments || Top||

#7  "7 terrorists killed, none captured"

That's the ticket! You're gettin' the hang of it, guys. ;-p
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 07/04/2006 15:30 Comments || Top||

#8  Guess they already have more intel than they know what to do with - thanks to zaqawi.
Posted by: Flaigum Whelet4630 || 07/04/2006 16:51 Comments || Top||


Gunmen attack two mosques, wound eight east of Baghdad
(KUNA) -- Up to eight people were killed and wounded when unknown gunmen attacked two mosques and a number of residential areas in the Diyals governorate north east of Baghdad, Iraqi police said on Monday. A statement by the joint coordination center said the armed men attacked last night a mosque and a husseiniya (a religious gathering place for Shiites) in Al-Tahreer and Beni Saad areas in Diyala but no casualties were reported. The statement added that one person was killed and two others were wounded in a separate incident when gunmen opened random fire on a residential area in Al-Tahreer south of Baaquba.

Two others were wounded when gunmen attacked a butcher shop in Beni Saad and three civilians were injured in a bomb explosion in the town of Beldrouz. Meanwhile, the Iraqi police said it discovered five bodies of Iraqi soldiers in Diyala. A statement by the joint coordination center said the bodies were found near the Mendali project north of Baqouba. It also said soldiers were killed in criminal and terrorist attacks without adding further details.
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  ..it done by the jews and CIA coz muslims would
never attacking their own mosque...this is dirty
tactics played by jews to give bad reportation and to avoid Iraqis from thinking about oil well
which managed by Americans.
Posted by: jazzy || 07/04/2006 5:56 Comments || Top||

#2  Um... sure thing. Brilliant!
Posted by: Whonter Omavilet5844 || 07/04/2006 6:01 Comments || Top||

#3  Indeed. Clever parody of the style and automatic assumptions of the stupid. At first glance I see four cliches, two misused elipses, one imaginary word and a run-on sentence. No ALL CAPS or exclamation points, no mention of Bush or Cheney or quagmire. I give jazzy's effort a 5.
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/04/2006 8:26 Comments || Top||


Violence kills four civilians, two policemen, one gunman in Iraq
(KUNA) -- At least four civilians, two policemen and a gunman were killed in separate incidents in Iraq Monday, while anonymous gunmen attacked the house of senior Iraqi intelligence official to kidnap four of his guards. Iraqi Interior Ministry source told Kuwait News Agency (KUNA) that mortar shells from unidentified source killed four civilians and injured another 14 in the market of Mahmoudiya town, south of the Iraqi capital, Baghdad. The mortar shells torched several stores and destroyed at least three civilian cars, added the source who requested anonymity.

In eastern Baghdad, anonymous gunmen attacked the house of Interior Ministry Undersecretary for Intelligence Affair Major General Hussein Kamal, said an Iraqi police source. No further details about attack on Kamal's house were disclosed as the Interior Ministry has not commented to the incident yet.

Meanwhile, the convoy of Dyala governor was targeted with a bomb today in a road between the cities of Baqoba and Kanaan, said Iraqi police said in a statement. The statement added that bomb explosion killed a policeman and injured a Lieutenant from Iraqi police.

In the northern Iraqi city of Kirkuk, gunmen attacked an Iraqi police patrol to kill a policeman and injured another two. Iraqi police Brigadier Sardah Qader told KUNA that joint forces comprising Iraqi police, Iraqi army and Multinational Forces retaliated and killed one gunman, injured another two and arrested another 43 suspects.
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


Mortar attack to Sunni Baghdad neighborhood, Sadrists suspected
(hat tip Iraq the Model)
The mostly Sunni populated Aadhamiya district in eastern Baghdad came under heavy mortar fire this afternoon. The bombardment lasted for about 30 minutes and I could count more than a dozen explosions. No one claimed responsibility for the attacks but the residents of Aadhamiya and surrounding neighborhoods think it was most likely the Sadr militias.

Soon after the attack with mortars gunmen took to the streets with their weapons and clashed with security forces while US Apache helicopters were seen flying at low altitudes.

I talked over the phone to friend who lives in Aadhamiya and he told me that he tried to flee the area with his family to escape the clashes but to find that all main streets were closed to traffic. He confirmed that at least one mortar round struck the Shrine and mosque of Abu Hanifa. I couldn't find any new reports on the incident except for a brief mention down this story on the BBC and whether the clashes and mortar attacks caused casualties is not known as of now.

I still can hear intermittent gunfire from small and medium machineguns with sporadic explosions of RPGs. The atmosphere was tense around Aadhamiya as curfew time was approaching and people are afraid that violence might spread to adjacent districts.

And with the Accord Front suspending their participation in the parliament, I think the tension will be increasing over the next few days.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Once US pulls back, there's gonna be lots-o-dead Muzzies layin' around. Mostly Sunni. Years of payback comin' dooo!
Posted by: SOP35/Rat || 07/04/2006 1:17 Comments || Top||

#2  Nead shot to Fat Boy will slow the Sadr gang down.
Posted by: anymouse || 07/04/2006 1:30 Comments || Top||

#3  Sheesh...I meant Head shot to Fat Boy will slow the Sadr gang down.
Posted by: anymouse || 07/04/2006 1:31 Comments || Top||

#4  i agree it's about time fopr someone too put that dool out of the fight. He's about as much a holy man as I
Posted by: Greamp Elmavinter1163 || 07/04/2006 12:25 Comments || Top||


Israel-Palestine-Jordan
First Qassam missile from Gaza lands in Ashkelon town center Tuesday evening.
Posted by: Elder of Zion || 07/04/2006 16:14 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Another school hit. Unbelievable.
Posted by: Darrell || 07/04/2006 16:48 Comments || Top||

#2  I think it's high time we should go "Al-Kaidish" on them Pali's.
After we do, someone will have to say "Kaddish" (the Laying to Rest prayer) on their mutilated bodies.
Posted by: Elder of Zion || 07/04/2006 17:01 Comments || Top||


Israel warns of "long war" over soldier
While Israeli tanks and infantry massed along the Gaza Strip's northern border for a threatened ground incursion, Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said the campaign to free Corporal Gilad Shalit could turn into "a long war."

Israel rejected a 6 a.m. (0300 GMT) ultimatum set by the factions, which demanded that the Jewish state free 1,000 prisoners. Unless the demands were met, the factions said, "the enemy will bear full responsibility for future consequences."

"This is a long war," Olmert said. "It requires lots of patience, sometimes endless restraint. We have to know when to clench our teeth and to deal a decisive blow."

The smallest of the three militant groups, the previously unknown Islamic Army, said there would be no further information released on 19-year-old Shalit, who was seized in a cross-border raid on June 25.

They sent conflicting signals about his fate.

"Whether he will be killed or not killed, we will not disclose any information ... Discussion is closed," said Islamic Army spokesman Abu al-Muthana.

But he later said: "We do not kill captives. Our Islam requires that we treat captives well and fairly pursuant to and in accordance with the Geneva Convention, which we follow to the finest jot and tittle, and to which we are a virtual signatory." He declined to say whether Shalit was alive or dead.
They seek him here,
they seek him there.
Israelis seek him every where.
Is he in heaven
or in the Pit?
That damned elusive Gilad Shalit.


Osama al-Muzaini, a Hamas political leader, said the militant groups have withdrawn their representatives from the talks with the Egyptian mediators.

He compared the fate of Shalit to that of Israeli airman Ron Arad, who has been missing since bailing out of his plane over southern Lebanon 20 years ago. There has been growing speculation Arad is dead.
Ya think?
"They (the militant factions) may kill him (Shalit), take him to another country or may hide him. All options are open," al-Muzaini said.

Israel has hinted it could assassinate leaders of Hamas, whose government is under an international aid embargo, if Shalit is not freed. "I want to stress, none of them will be immune," Olmert said.

Interior Minister Roni Bar-On told Israel Radio: "Hamas well understands ... that the sky will fall on them if they harm Gilad Shalit."

Hamas, which advocates Israel's destruction, does not want to lose face by freeing Shalit without getting something in return. Israel says it does not want to set a precedent that could lead to more abductions.

Hamas sources said Western diplomats, whom they did not name, had told the group that Israel had prepared a 13-man hit list headed by exiled leader Khaled Meshaal and including Prime Minister Ismail Haniyeh and Foreign Minister Mahmoud al-Zahar.

Israeli security sources said a commando raid to try to rescue Shalit remained an option but would be risky in Gaza's maze of alleyways. The last Israeli soldier abducted by Palestinians was killed in a failed rescue bid in 1994.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 15:13 || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Israel says it does not want to set a precedent that could lead to more abductions.


A few decades late in realizing that but I suppose better late than never.
Posted by: AzCat || 07/04/2006 18:21 Comments || Top||


PM: This is an escalation of hostilities like none other
Despite ongoing IDF operations in the northern Gaza Strip, a Kassam rocket landed Tuesday evening in Ashkelon proper - the first time the city center has witnessed such an attack.

No one was wounded in the attack, despite the fact that the rocket hit a school in a populated area in the south of the city. Children playing soccer outside the ORT-Ronson High School on Rehov Ben Zvi were thrown back by the force of the explosion, witnesses reported, but were unharmed. The school suffered some damage.

Security officials described the Kassam as "upgraded," featuring two engines. Police Cmdr. Uri Barlev said that security forces had seen this type of rocket in the past. "This type of missile has landed in other places," he said.

Hamas' military wing, Izzadin al-Kassam, claimed responsibility for the attack, adding that the rocket had been upgraded to achieve a range of over 15 kilometers. Security officials reported that the rocket was launched from the open territory between the former northern Gaza settlements of Nisanit and Dugit.

The IDF, however, said that the rocket was an ordinary Kassam.

Prime Minister Ehud Olmert responded to the attack by calling it, "an escalation of hostilities like none other."

He said that Israel would not remain silent, and that Hamas would be the first to feel the Israeli response, vowing "far-reaching consequences," for the missile attack.

In response to the attack, Defense Minister Amir Peretz ordered the IDF to step up the speed and intensity of Operation Summer Rains in the Gaza Strip, launched last Wednesday in an effort to retrieve Cpl. Gilad Shalit.

"We intend to achieve the goals of our operations in Gaza," Peretz said, referring to stopping Kassam rocket fire as well as retrieving the kidnapped IDF soldier.

Ashkelon mayor Roni Mehatzri said that Ashkelon residents had "time to think, to decide what to do."

Some experts speculated on the timing of the attack, saying that the terror groups were interested in establishing a deterrent before Israel expands its military incursion into the Gaza Strip.

Kassams have landed in Ashkelon's periphery, particularly in the industrial zone. On June 14, a rocket has struck a site described as a "strategic installation."

Yaakov Katz contributed to this report.
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 14:48 || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:

#1  In response to the attack, Defense Minister Amir Peretz ordered the IDF to step up the speed and intensity of Operation Summer Rains in the Gaza Strip

He should tell them to engage the clutch, also.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 14:59 Comments || Top||

#2  Re the June 14 attack: the IDF referred to a strike near an electric capacitance station which holds the bulk of Israel's power needs. The report indicated that poisonous "ammonia" based compounds are stored there for use in the process. A successful massive bombardment, would potentially kill thousands of Israelis and leave the country without a secure power source. At least one connected Israeli blogger advises that, the Ashkelon power facility "will not be rebuilt until Israel's enemies are destroyed." In fact, with the Gaza terror structure intact, re-building the facility would only set it up for repeat destruction.

It is my belief that Israel would exercise the "Sampson Opton" in Gaza and elsewhere, if the country's power capacity faced permanent disability. Who knows what would be the consequence of same, should Israel do so without a single reliable foreign ally?
Posted by: Anginens Threreng8133 || 07/04/2006 15:15 Comments || Top||

#3  Arm Israeli towns with mortars. The 120mm building flattening kind and see how long the muslims continue firing into Israeli cities.
Posted by: ed || 07/04/2006 15:17 Comments || Top||

#4  "the rocket hit a school in a populated area"
There is nothing the IDF can do to Hamas that will raise an iota of sympathy in me for these Hamas dirtbags or any Palestinian close enough to them to suffer collateral damage.
Posted by: Darrell || 07/04/2006 15:31 Comments || Top||

#5  I keep logging in here, expecting to see that a full scale war has been launched. The neanderthals can't say they haven't been warned. I don't think it could be any more clear.
Posted by: 2b || 07/04/2006 19:21 Comments || Top||

#6  Back track and fire for effect.
Posted by: mojo || 07/04/2006 19:55 Comments || Top||

#7  #5. 2b, if you watch TV you know that Neanderals have feelings too. They wouldn't like being compared to the Paleos.
Posted by: GK || 07/04/2006 21:44 Comments || Top||

#8  It's spelled Neanderthal of course.
Posted by: GK || 07/04/2006 21:46 Comments || Top||

#9  "Its so easy even a Palieo can do it!"

Hmm that sounds better... But would you take a
Palieo to dinner to apologize?
Posted by: CrazyFool || 07/04/2006 22:08 Comments || Top||

#10  #9 CF - More likely take him to the edge of a cliff and give him a swift kick in the ass.
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 07/04/2006 22:18 Comments || Top||

#11  sigh - I'm sure I have greatly offended the neanderthals. Perhaps some duck with mango sauce might be comforting - but I doubt they will recover from my affront.
Posted by: 2b || 07/04/2006 22:51 Comments || Top||


Terrorists pledge not to kill Israeli Soldier
THE captors of an Israeli soldier abducted last week do not want to kill the serviceman despite the expiry of an ultimatum to Israel, one of three groups holding him said to wire service AFP today. "Some people thought that the groups that carried out the operation will kill him but our Islamic values tell us that prisoners should be respected and not killed," Abu Muthanna, a spokesman for the Islamic Army, said.
"Please don't kill us in return!"
Together with the armed wing of the governing Hamas movement and the Popular Resistance Committees, the group captured 19-year-old Gilad Shalit during an attack on an Israeli army post on the southern Gaza border on June 25.

Yesterday, they set a 0300 GMT (1300 AEST) today deadline for Israel to accept its demands, having previously asked for the release of 1000 Palestinian, Arab and Muslim prisoners, as well as of Palestinian women and juniors held in Israel. But Israel rejected the ultimatum and pressed on with its military offensive against the Gaza Strip.

In an earlier statement one of the Palestinian militant groups said no further information would be given on the captive's fate. "Discussion is closed," said Abu al-Muthana, spokesman for the previously unknown Islamic Army in the Gaza Strip. "Whether he will be killed or not killed, we will not disclose any information about the fate of the soldier."

There was no immediate word from the other groups involved in the kidnapping, the armed wing of Hamas and the Popular Resistance Committees. An earlier statement had warned Israel to act on the militants' demands if it "valued the life" of Corporal Gilad Shalit.

Israel warned the captors "the sky will fall on their heads" if Cpl Shalit, abducted in a raid on his army post last week, was harmed.

The ultimatum had been issued after six straight nights of Israeli air strikes and a massive military assault that saw Israeli tanks and troops enter the Gaza Strip for the first time since leaving last year after a 38-year occupation. "If the enemy does not agree to our humanitarian demands ... we will regard this case as closed," said a statement issued by the armed wing of the governing Hamas movement and two other factions.

As Israeli officials warned the crisis could last months, the Hamas-led cabinet appealed to the captors to spare Cpl Shalit's life.
Posted by: Oztralian || 07/04/2006 02:30 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Feh. All this absurd sympathetic hand-wringing and dithering about Hamas "factions" and "wings" and the poor poor innocents - who just happened to vote them into power in hopes they would kill more Jooooos. It's a transparent farce and fiction - and it's unbelievably offensive that the despicable reporters and editors at news.com.au believe us so gullible.

They're Paleos, one and all. They're murderous hateful demented sick unworthy scum who cheer that which is loathsome and vile while screeching about their rights and self-inflicted tribulations.

"Discussion is closed", indeed. Roll on, Israel.
Posted by: Cralet Jeth6763 || 07/04/2006 3:20 Comments || Top||

#2  Happy Independence Day, America! Carry on not asking question, be patriotic, believe everything your government says. Keep on killing and raping, keep on going to war for no reason. Keep on invading countries that have done no harm to you. Keep on killing people... all the browns, who needs them anyways, eh?
Sick bastards that some americans are, you will carry on with manslaughter, rape and disrespectful behaviour... you are trying to be the world police, but in reality america is the only REAL threat to the democratic world. Have you ever wondered why Osama's profile on the FBI Most Wanted list does NOT include any realtions with the 9-11 attacks? Fuck, they should have the whole Bush administration on there.
When are you guys gonna wake up? You just hate what you don't know. Hell, most of you don't even know where Iraq is on the map.

Wankers
Posted by: An Old European3 || 07/04/2006 4:35 Comments || Top||

#3  Whee ! Yet another set of unfounded , unintelligent sweeping statements there. Tedious at best , boring as hell . Get a clue , no wait , dont bother , just shut up

Troll
Posted by: MacNails || 07/04/2006 4:43 Comments || Top||

#4  Too true, Mac. I'd say the troll is not only a clueless wanker, but obviously lost as well. Perhaps this posting commentary thing is a bridge too far... There must be at least 5 other threads where this might have made some sense, in that special shortbus moonbat tranzi dickhead sort of way, but on this one? LOL.

Troll, indeed.
Posted by: Whonter Omavilet5844 || 07/04/2006 5:44 Comments || Top||

#5  230 years and they've learned nothing. Good riddance.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 7:25 Comments || Top||

#6  Bet Europe wonders "Why don't they like us anymore."
Seems obvious to me.
Posted by: Redneck Jim || 07/04/2006 7:42 Comments || Top||

#7  Don't worry. Old European3 and his ilk will be dead or dhimmie soon. None so blind as those who refuse to see.
Posted by: SR-71 || 07/04/2006 8:53 Comments || Top||

#8  Old European3 and his ilk will be dead or dhimmie soon.

Naw, we'll bail their sorry butts out again, though that's one war to which I wouldn't send my son.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 8:56 Comments || Top||

#9  To respond to your rude little screed, An Old European3, but using the manners my mother taught me, as apparently yours did not:

First of all, thank you for your good wishes on the occasion of our holiday. Clearly you share our appreciation of the effort two centuries ago that means you no longer must have responsibility for our actions, or for being involved in our day to day affairs. And, how nice of you to express that via an American invention, the internet.

Goodness, if you Europeans had been involved in running your American colonies (England, Spain, France and Russia at any rate, but in those days the rest of Europe didn't much matter, did it? All those wogs and things, my dear) you wouldn't have had time on your hands for the two totally unnecessary continental wars that you managed to get the whole world involved in, as you fought it out in your colonies in Asia and Africa as well as at home. Your little brown people, my dear, and you dragged them all over the landscape to fight your wars, while some others of you rampaged over their bits of the landscape killing off those left behind to defend their homes.

Which you did in the Middle East, too, before Britain and France decided to establish countries and set up governments for little brown people you knew were incapable of managing such things on their own. Saudi Arabia was one of your little inventions, setting up dear, blue-eyed Larry's pet Sheikh Saud on the throne that had belonged to the Hashemite royals for centuries (you know him -- the gullible American film people called him Lawrence of Arabia, and showed all his romantic lies as if they were the gospel truth), and Iraq -- borders decided so that the French could get two countries out of part of it, Syria and Lebanon -- for which the British Foreign Office decided in its wisdom to put under minority Sunni rule, yet another throne for the Hashemites they'd thrown out of Arabia.

But there! I don't want to get too carried away -- we have our independence to celebrate. Ta, my dear!
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/04/2006 9:07 Comments || Top||

#10  of course he's an Old European. The younger ones speak Arabic
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 9:25 Comments || Top||

#11  AN IDIOT'S GUIDE TO ISLAMIC VALUES:

"Some people thought that the groups that carried out the operation will kill him but our Islamic values tell us that prisoners should be respected and not killed, Abu Muthanna, a spokesman for the Islamic Army," , said.


"Discussion is closed," said Abu al-Muthana, spokesman for the previously unknown Islamic Army in the Gaza Strip.

"Whether he will be killed or not killed, we will not disclose any information about the fate of the soldier
Posted by: 2b || 07/04/2006 9:28 Comments || Top||

#12  Old European

If you really are a European you have no room to talk, at all. Remember WWI and WWII? You arent so sheepish and innocent. But you do envy our patiotism, national pride, roaring enconomy,INTEGRATED immigrants and buy our Treasury Bonds. Your lifestyle, not ours is on the brink of annihilation. You should shut your trap and mind your own house. You have some big suprises comming to you in the next few years.
Enjoy! Oh, and you may want to learn Arabic too.
Posted by: bigjim-ky || 07/04/2006 10:14 Comments || Top||

#13  Best thing the "Citizens" of Europe ("Subjects" would probably be more appropriate) could possibly do is to buy Guns (Oh Horrors, it's against the law) Hide them, with as much ammunition as you can afford, along with the means and equipment to repair weapons and reload cartridges.

NOT only in the Caliber(s) you yourself posses, but in all calibers (Covers your neighbors guns, and any captured weapons, no ammo equals worthless hunks of metal.)

Keep it secret from your own families. Especially your Impressionable/Government Malleable children, (Think Little in-House Spies, eg Hitler Youth, Brown Shirts, etc.)

Home/basement Machine Shops need to be the rule, not the exception. I get Machine Shop books showing many superb Steam Engines/Foundry setups mainly in England, so the idea is not dead yet.

But in the main they won't, thus they're doomed, Not realizing that the choice is between "Breaking the Law" and "Slavery/Death," We Americans realized that some 200 years ago.

We chose to break the law, those who didn't remained at home (Europe) and inhibited their children.
Posted by: Redneck Jim || 07/04/2006 10:55 Comments || Top||

#14  Now now, Old-Y'urp-Peon3 has a lot to be proud of --

If he's Belgian, he can be proud of his country's behavior in the Congo and in Rwanda. Especially how his country came to the rescue in the Rwandan genocide. After all, the Belgians are so superior they set the human rights standards for the rest of the world.

If he's Dutch, he can be proud of how well his country prepared Indonesia for independence, and how it was that virtually none of his people joined the Nazis.

If he's French, he can be proud of Marshall Petain in WWII, and the 20% of his country that joined the Resistance (on orders of that great Frenchman, Marshall Stalin). He can be especially proud of his country's conduct in Algeria and how they stood by the peid noirs. And the gentle treatment of the Vietnamese and Cambodians in French Indochina.

If he's Italian, he can be proud of his country's conduct in Libya and Ethiopia. His country has a number of firsts in the last century -- first to fascism, first to defend Franco, all sorts of honorable firsts. And who can forget their heroic invasion of Greece? Stuff of legends.

French, Dutch, Belgian, Italian, Spanish or Scandinavian, he can be proud of how well the immigrants from Africa and Asia have integrated into his society. No racism there, by golly.

And if he's German, why I don't even need to explain how proud he should be.

I salute you, Olde Y'urp-peon3, you are clearly my moral and intellectual superior.
Posted by: Steve White || 07/04/2006 12:27 Comments || Top||

#15  "Keep on invading countries that have done no harm to you."
Just on the chance that "An Old European3" is indeed an old European, I would like to remind him/her that we invaded France, Belgium, the Netherlands, Germany, Italy, etc. even though they did no harm to us. The result is that he/she is not a Nazi who is systematically exterminating the "brown people" of the planet in gas chambers and ovens. And the world has certainly had its share of "manslaughter, rape and disrespectful behaviour" at the hands of Europeans. Good luck with that Arabic. Happy Independence Day!
Posted by: Darrell || 07/04/2006 12:30 Comments || Top||

#16  Thank you, Old European3, for reminding me on this, my country's national holiday, of the precise reason my ancestors ran like hell out of your continent to settle here almost 100 years ago, and why my European-born sweetie prefers to live here even though his skills and talents are in demand over there.

And oh, BTW, we do know where Iraq is. It's to the southeast of that continent we've had to go rescue in the late 1910's, and again in the early 1940's. You know the one....it's the one where they keep demanding that we leave Iraq immediately, but if we raise the idea of possibly closing military bases on their territory the local populace screams about how we're hurting their economy.

I'd like to think that's the reason you want us there, anyway. I hate to think you still haven't gotten this democracy thing down after 60+ years of our troops being stationed in Europe. The Iraqis are catching on after a mere three years. Perhaps you are just slow learners?

Again, warmest regards for a happy and safe 4th of July, Old European3, brought to you by the willingness of my countrymen, past and present, who were willing to defend a faraway continent and her culture from self-inflicted darkness and evil. (You know what those ideals are, right? I hope you haven't forgotten them like so many of your cosmopolitan Continentals have. It's a crying shame, really. But if you prefer the life of a dhimmi, it's your call.)
Posted by: Swamp Blondie || 07/04/2006 12:34 Comments || Top||

#17  Just you guys wait, he's probably already called Old European2 and Old European1 to come dazzle you cowboyish brutes with brilliant Olde Worlde logic, obviously superior morality, and sniffing sophisticated reparte. You're really in for it.
Posted by: Hupeating Flins9708 || 07/04/2006 12:59 Comments || Top||

#18  Oh dear Old European3. That didn't go too well, did it?
Posted by: Tony (UK) || 07/04/2006 13:04 Comments || Top||

#19  Hi, Old European!

Looks like you have been poking around too many liberal websites looking for ideas that line up with yours. No facts, just the usual unfounded rants floating around in the ozone. Which we never do around here. :-) There's a saying that there are no enemies on the left. If you "befriend" every people who might want to do you harm, that the problem will obviously evaporate because they will be your good friends. If you speak out loudly enough in favor of these these people and against your own, that they will just roll over and leave you alone leaving your society unharmed. It's pathetic, naive, idealist, unrealistic, impractical, and cowardly. These are countries, societies, and cultures. Not individual human friends. There are no "single points of contact" to influence an entire society to behave as you wish because it is far more complicated than dealing with an individual, and there is no "higher authority" to go whining to when things go poorly. You have to take a stand sometimes, no matter what your idealism and cowardice tell you to do. I want things to be ideal, too, but that isn't reality yet. Our founding fathers recognized over 200 years ago that the tree of liberty would have to be refreshed with blood from time to time. This is one of those times. When you have been in a cocoon too long, you start developing confused ideas about how the real world works because you haven't been operating in the real world. This is not yet a situation to which liberal thought should be applied. Even with some spats of conflict now and then, much of Europe has been in a cocoon for a long time. Why? They know we will come over there and bail them out every time they lay down. No thinking required, just a complacent attitude that fosters wrong-headed thinking. And there has been no long-term punishment for this behavior in living memory to guide people in the right direction. Yes, there are those who survived WWII, but that was relatively short, they ended up being on the winning side, and did not have to deal with the consequences of losing. And those who were on the losing side for the most part didn't "lose" in the old-fashioned sense. If this conflict is lost, where will you end up? Will you lose in the modern sense, or in the olf-fashioned sense? Will it be a quick loss, or a protracted one? Or do you rightly assume that it will be won even though half of Western society is fighting the other half due to mis-applied liberalism? Are we fighting an opponent who will treat us graciously if we are defeated? Or have you not bothered to think that far because it is so obvious that we are going to win and our enemies will adopt our ways? What if the entire African continent falls? No problem because they're so far away and they haven't really bothered you yet? It only takes 1% with guns to cow the rest of the population. Look at North Korea or Iran. What are they going to do with those nukes they are working on against the will of their people? North Korea has a handful of warheads, maybe, and they're already threating the US with nuclear annihilation. What will have to happen with them? What if an entire continent starts acting up? And when these nations are "done" with us, who's next? Please internalize that they will be killed last thanks in full to their liberal rhetoric.

Your buddy who will continue to shed her blood for you despite your cluelessness,

- The Good Old U.S. of A., who was 48% clueless at last count, too. Please pray for us and consequently you, too.
Posted by: grb || 07/04/2006 13:17 Comments || Top||

#20  Enjoy Europe while you can, dhimmi. Happy 4th to the fighters; yes, we understand only too well what is happening.
Posted by: SamAdamsky || 07/04/2006 13:19 Comments || Top||

#21  And he came here all bright and shiny after reading that YouToo poll that told him what he thinks about Americans, poor dear.
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/04/2006 13:23 Comments || Top||

#22  Interesting place you've stumbled into here Old European3, hmmm?

Guffaw!!

(They can get worse you know)
Posted by: Tony (UK) || 07/04/2006 13:37 Comments || Top||

#23  LOL Tony - Happy Fourth! :-)
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 13:54 Comments || Top||

#24  #10. Frank, have you no consideration!? Suppose I were holding a mug of coffee?
Posted by: gromgoru || 07/04/2006 13:59 Comments || Top||

#25  Heh!

I think you should all move away from your machines and go have a good few beverages of your choice.

Happy Birthday all!
Posted by: Tony (UK) || 07/04/2006 13:59 Comments || Top||

#26  I'm going to be back every now and then to see if Old European lets us know what he's thinking. Otherwise, I'll know for sure we've been baited! :-)
Posted by: grb || 07/04/2006 14:07 Comments || Top||

#27  What's the over/under on ole EU3 having an epiphany ?
Posted by: wxjames || 07/04/2006 15:40 Comments || Top||

#28  not a chance
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 15:52 Comments || Top||

#29  In my dictionary the term Old European3 =
"An Alte Kaker"
The closest i can find to this juicy Yiddish Expression is "Old Fart".
Happy July forth to All Rantburgers !
Elder.
Posted by: Elder of Zion || 07/04/2006 16:39 Comments || Top||

#30  of course he's an Old European. The younger ones speak Arabic

so true the "youths" novlang bit has not only been internalized by the msm and PC, but by the "youths" themsleves, who use that word to speak about themselves as a group when interviewed by teevee. They are the future of Europe, aren't they?
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 07/04/2006 16:51 Comments || Top||

#31  Sure smells like horse shit, don't it?
Posted by: mojo || 07/04/2006 19:57 Comments || Top||

#32  With all the fun folks are having kicking the stuffing out of a certain brain-addled European, there's hardly been time to notice today's lesson in Islamic culture:

"...Islamic values tell us that prisoners should be respected and not killed," Abu Muthanna, a spokesman for the Islamic Army, said.


Daniel Pearl and Nick Berg could not be reached for comment.

Posted by: Baba Tutu || 07/04/2006 19:59 Comments || Top||


Killings, injuries in Gaza, Al-Qods Brigades fire at Israeli targets
(KUNA) -- Killings and injuries among the Palestinians are still on here Monday in addition to the firing of missiles by the Palestinians on Israeli targets. Palestinian Abdelrahim Daraj, 30, was martyred in Beit Hanoun, and another was injured when the Israeli airplanes fired a missile at citizens gathering east of the village. Thaer Abu Daqqa, 16, was seriously injured today when hit by shrapnels of projectiles left over by the Israeli occupation forces, at Absan neighborhood east of Khan Younes, south of here.

In the meantime Al-Qods brigades, military wing of Islamic Jihad, declared in a statement released today, a copy of which received by Kuna, responsibility of one of its groups for shelling with missiles the south Jewish "Sderot" settlement and the "Nahel Oz" military position east of here.
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I hope Allan has stocked on virgins, cause pretty soon there going to be a whole lot of shaids wanting theirs.
Posted by: gromgoru || 07/04/2006 14:02 Comments || Top||

#2  Of course, 'coz allan knows best, haven't you heard?
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 07/04/2006 16:52 Comments || Top||

#3  Actually I think Allan only has 72 virgins - and all the martyrs have to share them.

And they all look like Helen Thomas.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 07/04/2006 17:05 Comments || Top||


Hamas operative killed in IAF air strike in Beit Hanoun
A Hamas operative was killed in an IAF air strike in Beit Hanoun in northern Gaza late Monday night, according to Palestinian sources, while several others were wounded, they said. The Hamas man, Ismail al-Masri, 19, was a member of the Izzadin al-Kassam, the group's military wing.

A short while later, IAF aircraft hit a building at the Islamic University in Gaza city early Tuesday, Palestinians said. Black smoke rose from the building, set on fire in the attack. No one was hurt. The military had no comment. The university is considered a Hamas stronghold. The building, where the Hamas-dominated student council meets, was heavily damaged.

Earlier Monday the IDF stepped up its offensive on against Hamas terror infrastructure and sent ground forces into the northern Gaza Strip and troops into the terror group's charity offices in the West Bank in moves aimed at escalating the pressure on the kidnappers of Cpl. Gilad Shalit. Senior officers said the military operations to rescue Shalit would continue as planned despite an ultimatum issued Monday morning by Palestinian terror groups behind the abduction of the soldier last week.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This is the slowest escalation in history. They must be hoping to get Japanese support by performing Kabuki.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 7:45 Comments || Top||

#2  Peretz is riding the emergency brake hard.
Posted by: lotp || 07/04/2006 8:06 Comments || Top||

#3  Guidance from a man slightly ahead of his time:

War is the remedy our enemies have chosen. Let us give them all they want.

-- William Tecumseh Sherman

Guidance about the Media from a man far ahead of his time:

... a set of sneaking, croaking scoundrels.

-- William Tecumseh Sherman
Posted by: Glenn || 07/04/2006 12:46 Comments || Top||


Southeast Asia
Bashir urges fighters to go to Israel
Snip, duplicate from yesterday.
Posted by: Oztralian || 07/04/2006 02:32 || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  In his talk, he said the United States was happy to see bombings in Indonesia - the world's most populous Muslim country - because such actions give Washington an excuse to interfere.

Believe me.... A lot of Australians would also like to see bombings carried out in Indonesia.. If our own govt. hasn't got the balls to bury these uneducated idiots.. then i hope someone elese can step upto the plate.
Posted by: Oztralian || 07/04/2006 2:37 Comments || Top||

#2  No sympathy for Indonesia.. not during earthquakes, not during tsunami's --- as far as i'm concerned they can all eat shit n die.

Aaahh. i feel better now.
Posted by: Oztralian || 07/04/2006 2:40 Comments || Top||

#3  No sympathy for Indonesia.. not during earthquakes, not during tsunami's --- as far as i'm concerned they can all eat shit n die.
Unfortunatly,there are also non-muslims in Indonesia.
The one group who specifically help the non-Muslims, as far as I'm aware, are The Barnabas Fund who possess the Rantburg spirit in spades.
None of the "politically correct" nonsense about them.
As they say, a Muslim would find it bizarre to be asked to to help a kuffr (spit), so why should Christians apologise for targeting help towards Christian victims only?
Posted by: tipper || 07/04/2006 4:37 Comments || Top||

#4  The west MUST support independance for Bali.
Posted by: Bright Pebbles || 07/04/2006 6:11 Comments || Top||

#5  Bashir is another bin Laden, who sits leisurely in mosques, ordering young morons to do his fighting for him. Indonesia should so some class, and toss him back in prison.
Posted by: Anginens Threreng8133 || 07/04/2006 8:08 Comments || Top||

#6  no they should send their pitiful ass soldiers of islam or whatever too israel. The istarelis don't seem too mind killing the shit out of them
Posted by: Greamp Elmavinter1163 || 07/04/2006 12:23 Comments || Top||

#7  This allah-boy got his name on a missile with a reserved status.
Posted by: SamAdamsky || 07/04/2006 12:46 Comments || Top||


Sri Lanka
Three policemen, one civilian killed in mine explosion in Sri Lanka
(KUNA) -- Three Sri Lankan policemen and a civilian were killed while 10 people were injured by a claymore mine triggered by Tamil rebels in north-eastern Sri Lanka Monday. The explosion occurred in Trincomalee, 240 km northeast of the capital Colombo, news agency Indo-Asian News Service reported. Sri Lankan Police have blamed the Tamil rebels of the Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam (LTTE) for the explosion.

In another incident, LTTE injured two police officers in the eastern Sri Lankan town of Batticaloa in a grenade attack, the news agency reported.
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


A Jawa 4th of July: F*ck yeah!
Posted by: Seafarious || 07/04/2006 13:57 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  now I'll have to watch Team America today...damn earworm
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 14:08 Comments || Top||

#2  Thanks for the great link. I also liked the little motto at the top. It's a keeper!

"Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil". Thomas Mann

Posted by: 2b || 07/04/2006 19:33 Comments || Top||


"These are the times that try mens' souls"
THESE are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman.

Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated.

Whether the independence of the continent was declared too soon, or delayed too long, I will not now enter into as an argument; my own simple opinion is, that had it been eight months earlier, it would have been much better. We did not make a proper use of last winter, neither could we, while we were in a dependent state. However, the fault, if it were one, was all our own.

I have as little superstition in me as any man living, but my secret opinion has ever been, and still is, that God Almighty will not give up a people to military destruction, or leave them unsupportedly to perish, who have so earnestly and so repeatedly sought to avoid the calamities of war, by every decent method which wisdom could invent. Neither have I so much of the infidel in me, as to suppose that He has relinquished the government of the world, and given us up to the care of devils; and as I do not, I cannot see on what grounds the king of Britain can look up to heaven for help against us: a common murderer, a highwayman, or a house-breaker, has as good a pretence as he.

-- The Crisis, Thomas Paine, December 23 1776

Posted by: lotp || 07/04/2006 07:48 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  thanks - good wisdom stays good for a very long time.
Posted by: 2b || 07/04/2006 9:07 Comments || Top||

#2  Tom Paine - today he'd probably be accused of being a Neocon :-)
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 9:27 Comments || Top||

#3  I wonder if Bill Keller would have OK'd such a blatantly one-sided Pro-America piece.
Posted by: doc || 07/04/2006 9:30 Comments || Top||

#4  Neo-lib is more like it.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 9:35 Comments || Top||

#5  By today's standards commentary like that would be termed propaganda, intent at stirring the public to action. The the entrenched political and media worlds have no faith in or respect for the public so they try to alter and reshape the news and policy before it gets to our hands.
Posted by: rich || 07/04/2006 9:52 Comments || Top||

#6  #2 Tom Painstein?
Posted by: gromgoru || 07/04/2006 13:53 Comments || Top||


"Ye that dare oppose not only tyranny, but the tyrant, stand forth!"
A government of our own is our natural right: And when a man seriously reflects on the precariousness of human affairs, he will become convinced, that it is infinitely wiser and safer, to form a constitution of our own in a cool deliberate manner, while we have it in our power, than to trust such an interesting event to time and chance. If we omit it now, some may hereafter arise, who laying hold of popular disquietudes, may collect together the desperate and discontented, and by assuming to themselves the powers of government, may sweep away the liberties of the continent like a deluge.

Should the government of America return again into the hands of Britain, the tottering situation of things, will be a temptation for some desperate adventurer to try his fortune; and in such a case, what relief can Britain give? Ere she could hear the news, the fatal business might be done; and ourselves suffering like the wretched Britons under the oppression of the Conqueror. Ye that oppose independance now, ye know not what ye do; ye are opening a door to eternal tyranny, by keeping vacant the seat of government. There are thousands, and tens of thousands, who would think it glorious to expel from the continent, that barbarous and hellish power, which hath stirred up the Indians and Negroes to destroy us, the cruelty hath a double guilt, it is dealing brutally by us, and treacherously by them.

To talk of friendship with those in whom our reason forbids us to have faith, and our affections wounded through a thousand pores instruct us to detest, is madness and folly. Every day wears out the little remains of kindred between us and them, and can there be any reason to hope, that as the relationship expires, the affection will increase, or that we shall agree better, when we have ten times more and greater concerns to quarrel over than ever?

Ye that tell us of harmony and reconciliation, can ye restore to us the time that is past? Can ye give to prostitution its former innocence? Neither can ye reconcile Britain and America. The last cord now is broken, the people of England are presenting addresses against us. There are injuries which nature cannot forgive; she would cease to be nature if she did. As well can the lover forgive the ravisher of his mistress, as the continent forgive the murders of Britain. The Almighty hath implanted in us these unextinguishable feelings for good and wise purposes. They are the guardians of his image in our hearts. They distinguish us from the herd of common animals. The social compact would dissolve, and justice be extirpated from the earth, or have only a casual existence were we callous to the touches of affection. The robber, and the murderer, would often escape unpunished, did not the injuries which our tempers sustain, provoke us into justice.

O ye that love mankind! Ye that dare oppose, not only the tyranny, but the tyrant, stand forth! Every spot of the old world is overrun with oppression. Freedom hath been hunted round the globe. Asia, and Africa, have long expelled her. Europe regards her like a stranger, and England hath given her warning to depart. O! receive the fugitive, and prepare in time an asylum for mankind. --
Common Sense - Thomas Paine
It's not enough to be in favor of freedom in general, of democracy and libery in principle. What matters is being willing to sacrifice and risk in their defense. Europe still hasn't embraced that fact with any enthusiasm.
Posted by: lotp || 07/04/2006 07:40 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  frightening how relevant these writings seems today when less than a decade ago they seemed like ancient history. I guess it's an indicator of where we are right now. Bittersweet on the happy 4th - thanks.
Posted by: 2b || 07/04/2006 9:18 Comments || Top||

#2  It's not enough to be in favor of freedom in general, of democracy and libery in principle.

I'd be happy if I thought the Euros had gotten this far (with some notable exceptions in England, Denmark, New Europe and maybe the Netherlands). It's because I they haven't that I am not surprised they are willing to neither sacrifice nor risk, even in their own defence. They merely see themselves exchanging one set of masters for another. It's always been the way over there. Brussels, Mecca, what's the difference?
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 9:29 Comments || Top||

#3  As the EU bureaucrats have demonstrated, they don't believe in the fundamental difference between them and America in that "That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness." When the people in Europe rejected the EU Constitution, that was suppose to be that. However, the bureaucrats still plod on seeking to impose government upon the people.
Posted by: Slomoper Jolumble7671 || 07/04/2006 9:34 Comments || Top||

#4  One problem with the Euros is that after colonialism, WW1 and WW2 and decolonialism they found that the bulk of people willing to fight for their beliefs had been taken out of the gene pool or left to the US. That left Eurocrats in control of the media and the politics.

Islam might be enough to wake them up but I think it will have to get really bad first, so bad that its a close run thing if Europe can pull out in time or if a flood of Christian Europeans heads to North America and Europe truly becomes Eurabia.

On the bright side Turkey will probably gain admittance to the EU at that point, for whatever its worth.
Posted by: rjschwarz || 07/04/2006 9:38 Comments || Top||

#5  And the failure of the Eurabian continent will be blamed on everyone else other than Europe. The west wouldn't trade with them out of racism, the Christians sabotaged the economies before fleeing. Etc, Etc.
Posted by: rjschwarz || 07/04/2006 9:39 Comments || Top||

#6  Islam might be enough to wake them up but I think it will have to get really bad first, so bad that its a close run thing if Europe can pull out in time

Have they ever pulled themselves out before? I know Europeans always fought each other but what about stronger outside forces?? I know that tiny Britain used to put up a good fight but it's not looking good for them now with such a strong 5th column. Maybe this just a sequel to the The Roman Conquest.
Posted by: 2b || 07/04/2006 9:59 Comments || Top||

#7  This one line is the whole difference in America and Europe

"deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed."

The whole point here hasn't changed in all these years, "We The People" have nobody else to blame.
In Europe they want to have some big powerful Scapegoat to blame, where the whole difference here is that there's no one "Baddie" to lay the blame on.

However the People still try, hence the scapegoating of Bush (As the biggest, current "Baddie") and not the People realizing that they, themnselves (Ourselves) are the ones to blame.

You don't like it, change it (Nah too much trouble to actually do something) but so easy to blame.
Posted by: Redneck Jim || 07/04/2006 10:22 Comments || Top||

#8  Blame - the fuel that feeds the mouths of tyrants.
Posted by: 2b || 07/04/2006 11:53 Comments || Top||

#9  And in this case the Tyranny is Islam. The tyrant is dogma whipped into the flesh at an early age.
Surrender and obey, we are your masters.
The first rule is to die for Allan. It's called splodydope.
The second rule is to pursue alternate identities. And so on.
Posted by: wxjames || 07/04/2006 15:22 Comments || Top||


Happy Independence Day!
Hamas operative killed in IAF air strike in Beit HanounGTMO Frenchmen go on trial in ParisHamas leaders underground to avoid being helizappedGunmen attack two mosques, wound eight east of Baghdad6 troops killed in Dir blastMexican Left seething over vote count200 ISO women rally to demand headscarves
Posted by: Fred || 07/04/2006 00:10 || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I'll take "Beach Blanket Bingo" for two hundred, Alex.
Posted by: Mike || 07/04/2006 0:39 Comments || Top||

#2  Nice pair of (ehemm) feet
Posted by: Captain America || 07/04/2006 0:41 Comments || Top||

#3  Happy Fourth ALL! I'll raise a mug or two.... :-)
Posted by: Frank G || 07/04/2006 0:43 Comments || Top||

#4  Good thing she wasn't around for the signing heheh. A "distraction" I would say heheheh.
Posted by: Sock Puppet of Doom || 07/04/2006 1:03 Comments || Top||

#5  Notice the high art in Sea's Independence Day post, and in mine, and in ... um ... Fred's ...
Posted by: Steve White || 07/04/2006 1:56 Comments || Top||

#6  Jealousy is sooo ugly.
Posted by: Slimble Thomorong2242 || 07/04/2006 2:06 Comments || Top||

#7  Happy July 4th, you impertinent rebels! The ghost of King George is crying into his teacup.
Posted by: Apostate || 07/04/2006 2:23 Comments || Top||

#8  A happy and safe Fourth to all, especially those on the pointy end of the spear.
Posted by: PBMcL || 07/04/2006 2:33 Comments || Top||

#9  Yankee Doodle went to town
A-riding on a pony
Stuck a feather in his hat
And called it macaroni.

Yankee Doodle, keep it up
Yankee Doodle dandy
Mind the music and the step
And with the girls be handy.

Father and I went down to camp
Along with Captain Gooding
And there we saw the men and boys
As thick as hasty pudding.

Yankee Doodle, keep it up
Yankee Doodle dandy
Mind the music and the step
And with the girls be handy

There was Captain Washington
Upon a slapping stallion
A-giving orders to his men
I guess there was a million.

Yankee Doodle, keep it up
Yankee Doodle dandy
Mind the music and the step
And with the girls be handy

Posted by: RD || 07/04/2006 3:12 Comments || Top||

#10  Mike

I think this was a promo for Bikini Paradise, not Beach Blanket Bingo
Posted by: mhw || 07/04/2006 13:01 Comments || Top||

#11  Like your post Fred. Happy 4th to all those who are fighting now, King George is with the Immam in Londonistan's cold heart.
Posted by: SamAdamsky || 07/04/2006 13:11 Comments || Top||

#12  Happy 230th Birthday! We're still standing. Bwahahaha! May the next 230 years be as good as the past 230...
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 07/04/2006 17:26 Comments || Top||

#13  May they be better, actually. The past ninety years alone have been pretty turbulent.
Posted by: Korora || 07/04/2006 22:09 Comments || Top||


Gettysburg
Today is the anniversary of the battle of Gettysburg.

Remember Joshua Chamberlain. Picketts' Charge. First Minnesota. Little Round Top. Seminary Ridge. All the brave soldiers. Remember.
Posted by: Steve White || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  It's also the anniversary of the surrender of Vicksburg. "The Father of Waters now flows unvexed to the sea."
Posted by: Mike || 07/04/2006 0:29 Comments || Top||

#2  Damn that war of Northern Agression, way too many great Americans died.
Posted by: RD || 07/04/2006 3:15 Comments || Top||

#3  Where is Stuart? Where are my eyes? Damn that man!
Posted by: Cralet Jeth6763 || 07/04/2006 3:22 Comments || Top||

#4  It's not over.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 6:54 Comments || Top||

#5  Damn that war of Northern Agression, way too many great Americans died.

Funny this non-American ever thought it was a war of Southern Agression (Fort Sumter).
Posted by: JFM || 07/04/2006 7:05 Comments || Top||

#6  BTW. This is rich. Hard left siding with the Klan about Iraq war.

Context: Here in France the chic Left often uses the trick: voting this, being of this opinion is being on the same side than Front National and that it is baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad. They did it about trying to persuade people to vote YES to Euro-Constitution. I wonder what would happen if Le Pen told that Earth rotates around the Sun.
Posted by: JFM || 07/04/2006 7:17 Comments || Top||

#7  It's also a time to recall the valiant men of the 1st Somme Offensive. 90 years ago.
Posted by: 6 || 07/04/2006 7:58 Comments || Top||

#8  Funny this non-American ever thought it was a war of Southern Agression (Fort Sumter).

Shh! Don't remind them that they fired the first shot! ;)
Posted by: Swamp Blondie || 07/04/2006 8:09 Comments || Top||

#9  Although Fort sumter was the first major engagement between the US and CS the first shots were actually fired by some Union picketts at Fort Pickens near Pensacola.
Ace and I don't like the KKK.
klan
Posted by: Deacon Blues || 07/04/2006 8:37 Comments || Top||

#10  Go get 'em, Deacon. And give Ace a carrot for me LOL.
Posted by: lotp || 07/04/2006 8:53 Comments || Top||

#11  Although Fort sumter was the first major engagement between the US and CS the first shots were actually fired by some Union picketts at Fort Pickens near Pensacola.
>/i>

Small arms fire doesn't count. Small arms fire is a soldier's decision and can be triggered as well by rebel militiamen entering a no-go zone as by a nervous soldier who has heard a rabbit in a bush.

A cannon shot is an officer's decision and a whole bombardment lasting for over 24 hours is at least a general's decision. I don't have my sources at hand for knowing if Beauregard attacked from his own iniciative, from orders of the South Carolina government or if the order came directly from Jefferson Davis. What matters is not on which side was the first private who fired on the other side but which president was first to order fire. And it wasn't Lincoln.
Posted by: JFM || 07/04/2006 9:07 Comments || Top||

#12  This is rich. Hard left siding with the Klan about Iraq war.

Nothing has really changed JFM. The usual suspects who bedeviled Lincoln and the effort to end tyranny back then are of the same cloth and party this time around too.
Posted by: Slomoper Jolumble7671 || 07/04/2006 9:30 Comments || Top||

#13  Overall I agree, JFM, but the traiding of rifle shots was an indication that sooner or later one side would start a major engagement. Jefferson Davis made a huge blunder by ordering the firing on Fort Sumter. By the way, Fort Pickens was never taken by the Confederates.
Posted by: Deacon Blues || 07/04/2006 9:37 Comments || Top||

#14  Not to get pedantic, but its possible to say that we fired the first shot at Pearl Harbor too, and it was an officer's decision. Depends how you look at it.

I recommend a visit to Gettysburg to anybody who comes anywhere near it. It's amazing to comprehend.
Posted by: JAB || 07/04/2006 9:54 Comments || Top||

#15  The purpose will be to demonstrate opposition to the Iraq war and to speak on "white unity between the north and south," the permit said.

HA, HA. Talk about confused individuals.
Posted by: 2b || 07/04/2006 10:04 Comments || Top||

#16  Th' heck with gunfire, the first acts of aggression in the American Civil War were the illegal seizure of undefended federal forts and arsenals throughout the deep South in January, 1861, including arsenals in Florida, South Carolina, and Alabama among others. These were the initial acts of war, forgotten later due to the superior drama & human interest presented by the clashes at Forts Pickens & Sumter. And they began at least four days before the first discharge of a firearm by a Federal soldier at Fort Barrancas on January 8th, far as I can tell.
Posted by: Mitch H. || 07/04/2006 10:16 Comments || Top||

#17 
Not to get pedantic, but its possible to say that we fired the first shot at Pearl Harbor too, and it was an officer's decision.


Not only was the submarine in foreign territorial waters it was also in a restricted zone.

Otherwise consider the following: Japanese destroyers enter Pearl HArbor (without being fired upon since it is peace time) take perfect aim and then on command silmutaneously torpedoe every battleship or cruiser in the base. Or Japanse soldiers land at Wake and then without being opposed bcause it is still peace, each one of them puts his knife on the throat of a Marine, and on an order all defenders are simulatenously killed.

THat is why there are restricted zones around bases and it has ever been considered legitimate to fire on unautorized trespassers even in peace time.

The sinking of the Japanese midget submarine was just basic force protection. By itself it didn't mark the start of the war between Japan and the United States. Has the submarine not being followed minutes laters by hundred of planes it could have relmined in a exchange of angry diplomatic notes between Japan and the United States. If any it was the fact that an armed vessel had been sent in a foreign base who was by itself an agression.

You would have a better case for the near-hot war who prevailed between Germany and the UNited States in 1941 during which several German submarines were victims of unprovoked attacks by US ships.

Posted by: JFM || 07/04/2006 11:04 Comments || Top||

#18  several German submarines were victims of unprovoked attacks by US ships.

Unprovoked? They were in our ocean.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 07/04/2006 11:07 Comments || Top||

#19  Where would we be today if the South had managed to separate from the North? Where will we be tomorrow if the Left manages to separate from the Right? United We Stand, Divided We Fall. Just as true today as it was 200+ years ago, except now it applies to political idealogy. Look to the future to decide where the answer lies.
Posted by: grb || 07/04/2006 17:36 Comments || Top||

#20  Exactly grb, we would not be the superpower we are today if the south had prevailed.

BTW - calling it a civil war is even technically wrong. A civil war is when you try to replace the existing gov't with another - 1861-1865 was a war or secession or of "southern independence".

Posted by: Broadhead6 || 07/04/2006 22:54 Comments || Top||


"When, in the course of human events..."
The Unanimous Declaration of the Thirteen United States of America
(Adopted by Congress on July 4, 1776)

...it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bonds which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security. --Such has been the patient sufferance of these colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former systems of government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute tyranny over these states. To prove this, let facts be submitted to a candid world.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Seafarious || 07/04/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:

#1  And what an amazing thing those men created when they pledged their lives and sacred honor, forthrightly affixing their signatures to a document that they knew amounted to a death sentence should they be captured. Ladies and gentlemen, fellow Rantburgers, fellow Americans and our allies, a toast to America. And may she have 230 more years!
Posted by: Jonathan || 07/04/2006 0:30 Comments || Top||

#2  here here!
Posted by: 2b || 07/04/2006 0:33 Comments || Top||

#3  And 230 years from now, may all the world have long been as free as we are now.
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/04/2006 0:42 Comments || Top||

#4  Amen
Posted by: djh_usmc || 07/04/2006 0:43 Comments || Top||

#5  Back in 2000 when I was trying to run for Congress (10th House District, California) a potential backer asked me how I felt about the possibility of being assassinated should I be elected.

I turned to him and with a straight face and serious intent quoted this statement,

"I regret that I have but one life to give for my country."

Would that I had the courage of the men who founded this country and fought for the freedom we enjoy today.

Posted by: FOTSGreg || 07/04/2006 2:12 Comments || Top||

#6  'Tis a great and wondrous good fortune to be born an American. I pray I have earned the privilege through my actions and my service. Would that all Americans appreciated their auspicious lot, for they have won life's lottery.
Posted by: Spaiper Whons8054 || 07/04/2006 2:47 Comments || Top||

#7  The best men of an age afixed their names to that doccument.
Posted by: Sock Puppet of Doom || 07/04/2006 4:50 Comments || Top||

#8  And the best men of this age will ensure the wisdom engendered in that document lives on and spreads around the world.
Posted by: DanNY || 07/04/2006 7:30 Comments || Top||

#9  Send a copy to Kofi.
Posted by: Slomoper Jolumble7671 || 07/04/2006 9:25 Comments || Top||

#10  Every day I wake up I'm grateful my ancestors got on those boats.

Thanks, all you great-great-great-(etc.) grandparents. Your coming to America all those years ago gave me the greatest gift there is besides life itself: I was born in America.
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 07/04/2006 10:06 Comments || Top||

#11  Or, as Feivel Mouskowitz said, "Amerrrrreeeca. Where there are no cats, and the streets are paved with cheese." :-D
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 07/04/2006 10:06 Comments || Top||

#12  I love America there is no other place I rather be then here. Warts and all she is greastest place on earth.
Posted by: djohn66 || 07/04/2006 10:23 Comments || Top||

#13  Words to live by.
Posted by: xbalanke || 07/04/2006 10:36 Comments || Top||

#14  One of the best retorts I ever had in an argument was to an Irish moonbat with whom I was arguing (the war, American neo-imperialism, etc). I reminded her that 'my ancestors came to this country to get away from your ancestors.'

She didn't like that much :-)
Posted by: Steve White || 07/04/2006 12:01 Comments || Top||

#15  PowerLine has a great post (which they do every year, I think.)

The eternal meaning of Independence Day
Posted by: PBMcL || 07/04/2006 12:15 Comments || Top||

#16  It's been a rough Independence Day for DW and I. We're trying to recover from our daughter's wedding yesterday, and the hectic week beforehand. Yet as with every other Independence Day we've shared together (almost 40 of them), we are eternally glad we were born Americans. We've both lived in less fortunate nations, and many less free than ours. There is no greater place on Earth than the United States of America!
Posted by: Old Patriot || 07/04/2006 20:31 Comments || Top||

#17  Here, here, OP. May you and yours celebrate another 40 with us. Just imagine the 'burg 10 years from now, much less 40. Especially if Condi runs in '08! Happy 4th everyone, and I toast God for allowing me to live in such a free and prosperous land.
Posted by: BA || 07/04/2006 22:48 Comments || Top||

#18  Heartiest congratulations on your family's joy, Old Patriot! May they have as many happy years as you and your lovely DW.
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/04/2006 23:25 Comments || Top||



Who's in the News
86[untagged]

Bookmark
E-Mail Me

The Classics
The O Club
Rantburg Store
The Bloids
The Never-ending Story
Thugburg
Gulf War I
The Way We Were
Bio

Merry-Go-Blog











On Sale now!


A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.

Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.

Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has dominated Mexico for six years.
Click here for more information

Meet the Mods
In no particular order...
Steve White
Seafarious
tu3031
badanov
sherry
ryuge
GolfBravoUSMC
Bright Pebbles
trailing wife
Gloria
Fred
Besoeker
Glenmore
Frank G
3dc
Skidmark

Two weeks of WOT
Tue 2006-07-04
  NKors fire Taepodong fizzle
Mon 2006-07-03
  Paleoterrs issue ultimatum
Sun 2006-07-02
  Binny sez will take fight to America
Sat 2006-07-01
  66 killed in car bombing at Baghdad market
Fri 2006-06-30
  IAF strikes official Gaza buildings
Thu 2006-06-29
  IAF Buzzes Assad's House
Wed 2006-06-28
  Call for UN intervention as Paleoministers seized
Tue 2006-06-27
  Israeli tanks enter Gaza; Hamas signs "deal"
Mon 2006-06-26
  Ventura CA port closed due to terror threat
Sun 2006-06-25
  Somalia: Wanted terrorist named head of "parliament"
Sat 2006-06-24
  Somalia: ICU and TFG sign peace deal
Fri 2006-06-23
  Shootout in Saudi kills six militants
Thu 2006-06-22
  FBI leads raids in Miami
Wed 2006-06-21
  Iraq Militant Group Says It Has Killed Russian Hostages
Tue 2006-06-20
  Missing soldiers found dead


Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
52.15.63.145
Help keep the Burg running! Paypal:
WoT Background (24)    Non-WoT (16)    Opinion (6)    Local News (6)    (0)