Article

2007-07-03 Britain

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Mike 2007-07-03 06:36|| || Front Page|| [4 views ] Top
File under: al-Qaeda in Britain

#1 Any thoughts as to why, despite several calls, the cell phones failed to ignite the London Car Bombs?

Posted by doc 2007-07-03 09:07|| 2007-07-03 09:07|| Front Page Top

#2 Maybe some naughty person has flooded the black market with dodgy detonators.

Posted by Bright Pebbles in Blairistan 2007-07-03 09:10|| 2007-07-03 09:10|| Front Page Top

#3 This was an amazingly close call and would have resulted in the death and maiming of hundreds of young Brits, much worse than the Bali episode. MI5 knows this. This would have eclipsed 7/7 by orders of magnitude. A slight malfunction and a tremendous amount of fortune are all that stood in the way. I wonder if the British public realize this? They are so proud of their ability to "carry on". When several of these tragedies occur and there is bits of corpses scattered across several blocks radii, splattered several stories high, I wonder if it will get their attention ?

Posted by Woozle Elmeter2970 2007-07-03 11:52|| 2007-07-03 11:52|| Front Page Top

#4 I have to disagree with claim that these bombs were of highly competent design. The bombs didn't contain any high explosives. Absent any high explosives to propel them, the nails were a total waste of effort. While it is true that the propane could have formed a vapor cloud that might have exploded, the explosion would have been a large-volume, low-order blast with the nails near the center of that large volume. With the nails at the center of the blast, there is no mechanism to propel them outward.

The mistake the perps made, and that many subsequent observers are also making is to believe that propane tanks can themselves explode like bombs. They can't; they contain fuel but no oxidizer. Heat from the petrol fire could have caused the propane to boil and in turn rupture the tanks, causing a release of the propane. The propane might then possibly ignite in such a way as to create a large-volume, low-order explosion. However, even that is very unlikely since the propane tanks probably had pressure-relief valves designed to prevent such an occurrence.

What the perps did was to build large fire bombs and load them with shrapnel, which shows them to be a bit unclear on the concept. I'm not suggesting that people not take these attacks seriously, but I do think the destructive potential of these particular car bombs has been wildly exaggerated.

Posted by Biff Wellington 2007-07-03 13:39|| 2007-07-03 13:39|| Front Page Top

#5 It appears the detonator in the Haymarket bomb went off causing a small fire, and probably the Glasgow 'bomb' as well. I'll speculate that home made explosives failed to explode or just burnt. It is very difficult to get your hands on commercial explosives in the UK.

Had the explosives ruptured the propane tanks causing sudden release, there would be a large flash fire and to some degree an explosion (propane leaks regularly cause explosions) especially in an enclosed space like an airport terminal.

The failure of the cell phone trigger looks like mis-information.

Posted by phil_b 2007-07-03 18:28|| 2007-07-03 18:28|| Front Page Top

#6 With a more reliable trigger mechanism and a not uncommon phosphorus-based component which I will not mention here, these could have been inordinately powerful and destructive explosive devices.

In this age where so much information is just a link or two away, we have to assume the worst as far as the harm which can be inflicted by those with both intent and access to basic technology.

This near miss must be responded to as if it went off as planned because persistence even across many years is a characteristic of this enemy. They may use a subtly different method next time and perhaps pick a slightly different target, but something very similar will be attempted again and relying on their incompetence is suicidal.

In a similar vein, I am certain that security forces are taking special pains to watch for suspicious activity involving transit hubs over the next few weeks as this has also fit the targeting pattern in recent years.

Posted by Grumenk Philalzabod0723 2007-07-03 20:25|| 2007-07-03 20:25|| Front Page Top

#7 They only have to get it right once.

Posted by Pappy 2007-07-03 23:38|| 2007-07-03 23:38|| Front Page Top

#8 Pappy, It might be a good idea to flood the net with five or six very professional designs to take some copycats out of the genepool.

Posted by Super Hose 2007-07-03 23:49|| 2007-07-03 23:49|| Front Page Top

23:53 3dc
23:52 Super Hose
23:50 Eric Jablow
23:49 Barbara Skolaut
23:49 Super Hose
23:47 Zenster
23:45 Ulavise Scourge of the Antelope7037
23:41 Pappy
23:40 trailing wife
23:38 Pappy
23:36 Super Hose
23:35 Super Hose
23:30 Pappy
23:29 Zenster
23:22 Zenster
23:12 JohnQC
23:08 Zenster
22:56 Mike N.
22:50 trailing wife
22:38 Broadhead6
22:37 wxjames
22:34 JohnQC
22:33 Mike N.
22:28 Broadhead6