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2025-02-21 Caucasus/Russia/Central Asia
Oh, horrors! Trump pursues peace and tells the truth about Zelenskyy
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Posted by Besoeker 2025-02-21 07:21|| || Front Page|| [11140 views ]  Top

#1 "Did anyone notice that, despite the political theatrics from Britain, the EU, the UN, Germany, and France, it was and is the U.S., not Europe, primarily carrying the cash can for this war on another continent?"

That's not true. Europe has given more money to Ukraine than the U.S. And what the author calls "Diplomacy 101" is Munich 2.0.

Whatever you may think on Zelensky: He stood form 3 years ago when Russia wanted to kill him. And to call him a dictator is ridiculous. Was Churchill?

And why is "dictator" Zelensky good enough to sign over 50% of Ukraine's wealth (without any security guarantees given) but not good enough to participate in "peace talks"? You put aggressor (Russia) in scare quotes? Seriously?

It's not Zelensky's war, it's Russia's war.

Trump's posting about Zelensky on Truth Social was parrotting all of Russia's talking points. Shamefully so.
Posted by European Conservative 2025-02-21 08:14||   2025-02-21 08:14|| Front Page Top

#2 EC
Don’t insult anyone or post a meme about germanys $18.1B contribution to the war.
Posted by Itsoktobewhite 2025-02-21 08:30||   2025-02-21 08:30|| Front Page Top

#3 I don't get the mining and rare earth piece.
We missed the money away on a senseless Russo war. We are owed nothing for a poor investment in shi* disturbing. Why leave a trip wire to someday stumble over.

Get out and write it off.
Posted by Besoeker 2025-02-21 08:32||   2025-02-21 08:32|| Front Page Top

#4 ...tells the truth about Zelenskyy

Great! Now do Putin.
Posted by Mercutio 2025-02-21 08:52||   2025-02-21 08:52|| Front Page Top

#5 According to the German Foreign Office, the German government has provided around 43.62 billion euros (as of December 31, 2024) for bilateral support for Ukraine since the beginning of the war.

That's just Germany alone, not Europe.
Posted by European Conservative 2025-02-21 09:22||   2025-02-21 09:22|| Front Page Top

#6 Just spitballin' here, but might the 43.62 have been better spent on defense?

Si vis pacem, para bellum?
Posted by Bobby 2025-02-21 09:48||   2025-02-21 09:48|| Front Page Top

#7 As this is battlefield Ukraine and not NATO, under current conditions, the EU can continue to bank roll Elenskyyy while the US finds a separate peace?
Posted by swksvolFF 2025-02-21 10:19||   2025-02-21 10:19|| Front Page Top

#8 #5 So, EUrope doesn't really needs this icky Americans to continue its proxy war against the Asiatic Moskovites?
Posted by Grom the Affective 2025-02-21 10:25||   2025-02-21 10:25|| Front Page Top

#9 You can argue all you want but this war started because Putin felt threatened by NATO encroachment into Russia's sphere of influence, places where the people speak Russian and do not feel the need for Western European chocolate, places where NATO has no business. Russians have always relied on buffer zones between themselves and Western European war mongers. Putin was never a threat to Western Europe until NATO started pushing into the buffer zone.

I don't care how much money Germany or anyone else has contributed to keep this bloody, stupid war going. Biden squandered way too much American money on it and the only result is the death of countless Ukrainians and Russians and the loss of Ukraine's eastern oblasts. If you want to keep pushing, you're on your own.
Posted by Abu Uluque 2025-02-21 11:28||   2025-02-21 11:28|| Front Page Top

#10 So, we are dismissing Putin's push and desire to recreate the USSR? I think not.
Posted by Frank G 2025-02-21 11:34||   2025-02-21 11:34|| Front Page Top

#11 If Germans want to keep killing Russians I am fine with it. I don't want the US funding a EU problem. For the record, according to Statista, Germany contributed $18.1B, the US $119.2B, the EU $52.1B, UK $15.4, Japan $11B, others lagging. As usual EC exaggerates everything German.
Here is the link: https://www.statista.com/chart/28489/ukrainian-military-humanitarian-and-financial-aid-donors/
Posted by The Walking Unvaxed 2025-02-21 12:13||   2025-02-21 12:13|| Front Page Top

#12 Indeed you should study Putin. And also check up on Russian state TV propaganda.

Most of you seems to have forgotten that in late 2021 Putin wanted NATO to leave Eastern Europe. And he still wants that.
Posted by European Conservative 2025-02-21 12:13||   2025-02-21 12:13|| Front Page Top

#13 /\ Excellent point Walking. The evidence abounds. There are some places one should not venture.

"Not our monkey. Not our circus."

Posted by Besoeker 2025-02-21 12:18||   2025-02-21 12:18|| Front Page Top

#14 @The Walking Unvaxed

I quote the numbers the German Foreign Office provides, which include money spent on Ukrainian refugees.
Posted by European Conservative 2025-02-21 12:18||   2025-02-21 12:18|| Front Page Top

#15 Link here
Posted by European Conservative 2025-02-21 12:20||   2025-02-21 12:20|| Front Page Top

#16 And no German wants to kill Russians. As Sanna Marin, the former Finnish prime minister said so well: The end of the conflict is Russia leaving Ukraine.
Posted by European Conservative 2025-02-21 12:21||   2025-02-21 12:21|| Front Page Top

#17 #1 "Did anyone notice that, despite the political theatrics from Britain, the EU, the UN, Germany, and France, it was and is the U.S., not Europe, primarily carrying the cash can for this war on another continent?"
Posted by: European Conservative 2025-02-21 08:14

I've seen data showing the EU combined has contributed more to the war than the US. Don't care what they contribute, I just want the US out of the war effort. Ukraine will never win this war, they never could. As time passes it just gets worse for their people.
Posted by The Walking Unvaxed 2025-02-21 12:29||   2025-02-21 12:29|| Front Page Top

#18 I remember the crowing by our side that it didn’t matter whether Ukraine won or lost, because the war was weakening Russia, destroying the manpower and material they need to wage war.


President Putin definitely wants to reconstitute the Soviet Russian empire, but is the country physically capable of it?
Posted by trailing wife 2025-02-21 13:05||   2025-02-21 13:05|| Front Page Top

#19 ^ Not likely as the 2 week Special Debacle Military Operation has shown. However, I see too many gliding right over his underlying motivation. He's no innocent, just as Ukrainian Corruptocrats and thieves are not.
Posted by Frank G 2025-02-21 13:14||   2025-02-21 13:14|| Front Page Top

#20 With Europe's migrant problem, why bother.

As far as reconstituting the Eastern Block, with the EU mandating migrant settlement and overturning election results, one has to wonder how far a sales pitch, "Russian Trade Federation - like the EU, but not as intrusive and no migrants" would go.
Posted by swksvolFF 2025-02-21 14:42||   2025-02-21 14:42|| Front Page Top

#21 @tw
"...is the country physically capable of it?

Probably no, but Germany wasn't either back then. Didn't stop Hitler from trying.

And Putin is actually able to blow up the world if things go wrong.
Posted by European Conservative 2025-02-21 14:51||   2025-02-21 14:51|| Front Page Top

#22 VP Vance comments on the reality now, not the reality wished for///
"For three years, President Trump and I have made two simple arguments: first, the war wouldn't have started if President Trump was in office; second, that neither Europe, nor the Biden administration, nor the Ukrainians had any pathway to victory. This was true three years ago, it was true two years ago, it was true last year, and it is true today.

And for three years, the concerns of people who were obviously right were ignored. What is Niall's actual plan for Ukraine? Another aid package? Is he aware of the reality on the ground, of the numerical advantage of the Russians, of the depleted stock of the Europeans or their even more depleted industrial base?

Instead, he quotes from a book about George HW Bush from a different historical period and a different conflict. That's another currency of these people: reliance on irrelevant history.

President Trump is dealing with reality, which means dealing with facts.

And here are some facts:

Number one, while our Western European allies' security has benefitted greatly from the generosity of the United States, they pursue domestic policies (on migration and censorship) that offend the sensibilities of most Americans and defense policies that assume continued over-reliance.

Number two, Russians have a massive numerical advantage in manpower and weapons in Ukraine, and that advantage will persist regardless of further Western aid packages. Again, the aid is *currently* flowing.

Number three, the United States retains substantial leverage over both parties to the conflict.

Number four, ending the conflict requires talking to the people involved in starting it and maintaining it.

Number five, the conflict has placed--and continues to place--stress on tools of American statecraft, from military stockpiles to sanctions (and so much else). We believe the continued conflict is bad for Russia, bad for Ukraine, and bad for Europe. But most importantly, it is bad for the United States.

Given the above facts, we must pursue peace, and we must pursue it now. President Trump ran on this, he won on this, and he is right about this. It is lazy, ahistorical nonsense to attack as "appeasement" every acknowledgment that America's interest must account for the realities of the conflict.

That interest--not moralisms or historical illiteracy--will guide President Trump's policy in the weeks to come.

And thank God for that."
Posted by NoMoreBS 2025-02-21 15:14||   2025-02-21 15:14|| Front Page Top

#23 German Values Update: AfD-Supporting Lawyer Fined for Criticizing GER Govt
Posted by Grom the Affective 2025-02-21 15:39||   2025-02-21 15:39|| Front Page Top

#24 The end of the conflict is Russia leaving Ukraine.

Yes, but where does Ukraine begin and where does it end? Those borders have been in dispute for thousands of years. They might need to be re-negotiated, especially since the 1991 borders were drawn by Khrushchev in 1954 when it didn't matter since it was all part of the Soviet Union anyway. I think it is particularly unrealistic for Zelensky to insist on the return of Crimea. Ain't gonna happen. You might add Luhansk and Donetsk to that in light of the fact that Russia occupies them and Zelensky doesn't seem to have the wherewithal to get them back. I'd hate to see Americans, Britains, French and Germans dying for them. The Russian will to fight and the Russian ability to fight for historically Russian territory has a long and tragic history of being underestimated. Joe Biden being the most recent example.
Posted by Abu Uluque 2025-02-21 15:44||   2025-02-21 15:44|| Front Page Top

#25 Ukraine's borders are those internationally recognized, including by Russia in the 1990s.

Just as Germany's borders are today, regardless of what territories Germany once had.
Posted by European Conservative 2025-02-21 15:50||   2025-02-21 15:50|| Front Page Top

#26 Ukraine's borders are those internationally recognized, including by Russia in the 1990s.

Just as Germany's borders are today, regardless of what territories Germany once had.

End of History, eh?
Posted by Grom the Affective 2025-02-21 15:59||   2025-02-21 15:59|| Front Page Top

#27 What kind of history do you want?
Posted by European Conservative 2025-02-21 16:07||   2025-02-21 16:07|| Front Page Top

#28 New stabbing attack in Berlin at Holocaust Memorial.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/stabbing-holocaust-memorial-berlin-triggers-manhunt-rcna193242
Posted by The Walking Unvaxed 2025-02-21 16:08||   2025-02-21 16:08|| Front Page Top

#29 We have an article on that cued up for tomorrow, Walking Unvaxxed, but it’s annoyingly sparse on details. Hopefully yours can add to the little revealed. Thank you.
Posted by trailing wife 2025-02-21 16:15||   2025-02-21 16:15|| Front Page Top

#30 What kind of history do you want?

One in which the Globalist/Islamist alliance is eradicated.
Posted by Grom the Affective 2025-02-21 16:17||   2025-02-21 16:17|| Front Page Top

#31 ^One where the World Economic Forum is crying like (Senator) Chuck Schumer.
Posted by Bobby 2025-02-21 16:26||   2025-02-21 16:26|| Front Page Top

#32 ^One where EUROPE funds Europe's defense, rather than gamely trying to add up money pulled from couch cushions and then asserting "Hey, we've put in the same amount as the United States." The United States shouldn't be funding EUROPE's defense.
Posted by Crusader 2025-02-21 17:08||   2025-02-21 17:08|| Front Page Top

#33 Another jihadist with a knife just "expressed himself" in Germany:

https://acecomments.mu.nu/?post=413768#Bot
Posted by Crusader 2025-02-21 18:51||   2025-02-21 18:51|| Front Page Top

#34 A clash over national goals
Has hacks reenacting old roles.
Hark! History is callin',
New Hitler and Stalin:
Unite to make war on us Poles!

You know you wanna.
Posted by Pancho Polak8452 2025-02-21 18:59||   2025-02-21 18:59|| Front Page Top

#35 US: "Let's refight WWI... starting in 1853!"
UK: "Let's refight WWII... starting in 1938!"
EU: "We'll do WWII, too... starting in '48!"
RF: "whatever."
Posted by Pancho Poodle8452 2025-02-21 19:07||   2025-02-21 19:07|| Front Page Top

22:58 DarthVader
20:37 Frank G
20:08 Cured Romantic
19:58 swksvolFF
19:48 swksvolFF
19:20 Old Patriot
19:07 Pancho Poodle8452
19:02 Frank G
18:59 Pancho Polak8452
18:55 swksvolFF
18:51 Crusader
18:45 swksvolFF
18:36 Bobby
18:26 Frank G
18:10 alanc
18:07 swksvolFF
18:01 swksvolFF
17:50 JohnQC
17:42 Super Hose
17:38 Super Hose
17:36 Super Hose
17:33 JohnQC
17:32 Super Hose
17:31 Super Hose









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