Article

2006-11-07 Science & Technology

Is Microsoft Going to Start a Linux War?

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Fred 2006-11-07 00:00|| || Front Page|| [11127 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 /usr/lib/ms-lib

Posted by badanov 2006-11-07 00:09|| http://www.freefirezone.org]">[http://www.freefirezone.org] 2006-11-07 00:09|| Front Page Top

#2 Yawn.

Posted by Sock Puppet of Doom 2006-11-07 00:19|| www.sockpuppetofdoom.com]">[www.sockpuppetofdoom.com] 2006-11-07 00:19|| Front Page Top

#3 ...or port everything to Java. What's the big deal?

Posted by C 2006-11-07 00:24|| 2006-11-07 00:24|| Front Page Top

#4 Thats whyt he GPL sucks - it restricts how you can deploy software on it and it can be viral.

The BSD license style are the true "Free" software in that anyone you give it to can do anything they want with it.

Posted by OldSpook 2006-11-07 00:48|| 2006-11-07 00:48|| Front Page Top

#5 Why doesn't MSFT just write software that doesn't suck? Why do they need to have a special (slow, buggy) layer to translate their suck into something Linux can deal with?

Funny, innit, how you can write something for Linux and compile it on a modern Mac, but MSFT has such arcane and borken interfaces that doing a Windows port is like reading the Necronomicon and following it up with the Democrat party platform and the collected speeches of Howard Dean, John Kerry, and Ted Kennedy.

Posted by Rob Crawford">Rob Crawford 2006-11-07 08:25|| http://www.kloognome.com/]">[http://www.kloognome.com/] 2006-11-07 08:25|| Front Page Top

#6 The GPL ensures fair competition between free and non-free software.

1) Because it has not teh moral-detroyinbg effect of seeing your effort robbed by people who make $$$$ on YOUR efforts

2) Because it does not encourage splits where one of the members leaves to create a compeny and carries a good part of the talent with him

As an illustration let's see what happenned to the BSDs who twelve years ago had a huge technologicakl lead over Linux (due to the fact they based on DARPA-funded code while Linux was made from scratch) and today FreeBSD gets its ass-handled in benchmarks while NetBSD is virtually dead.

Don't like GPL then write your own code!

PS: I completely oppose GPL for libraries (THAT is viral) and I can'st stand SDtallman both on teh software side and on the political side (first case of Bush derangement syndrom , whose reactions to 9/11 were shameful and who is also one of those people who hide their nazi-like antisemitism behind the Palestinains).

Posted by JFM">JFM 2006-11-07 10:18|| 2006-11-07 10:18|| Front Page Top

#7 How is this going to affect my ability to use my computer to surf for Pr0n? Let's stay focused, people.

Posted by anonymous5089 2006-11-07 11:34|| 2006-11-07 11:34|| Front Page Top

#8 "Why doesn't MSFT just write software that doesn't suck?"

Er. They don't. MSFT does have different problems from software written by other companies.

One of the biggest problems with MSFT is that they try TOO hard for back-compatability.

Posted by Bright Pebbles in Blairistan 2006-11-07 11:50|| 2006-11-07 11:50|| Front Page Top

#9 Pleeease, in the mainframe world you have applications who have been running since the 60s and still IBM's MVS sets records for uptime. So don't throw backwards compoatibility as an excuse.

Posted by JFM">JFM 2006-11-07 12:09|| 2006-11-07 12:09|| Front Page Top

#10 No it's a reason.

I'm a C++ programmer and I look at the messy layer of "interfaces" and techniques available in Windows and it's pretty obvious that trying to support all that rubbish is why MS has problems.

Mainframes run a few simple programs in comparison.

I'm hoping Vista is a clean-break OS, and they EMULATE the previous interfaces etc.

Posted by Bright Pebbles in Blairistan 2006-11-07 12:42|| 2006-11-07 12:42|| Front Page Top

#11 Old Spook: Thats why the GPL sucks - it restricts how you can deploy software on it and it can be viral.

The BSD license style are the true "Free" software in that anyone you give it to can do anything they want with it.

The BSD license is more liberal than the GPL, and a public domain license is more liberal than BSD. The GPL was specifically designed to restrict certain activities which would result in software being effectively taken away from its original creators. It's not something that can be condensed into a sentence or two. For background, read Stallman's remarkable history of the destruction of the MIT AI hacker culture and why he created GNU:

My Lisp Experiences and the Development of GNU Emacs

and also

Software Should be Free

The GNU GPL and the American Way

Personally, I appreciate both the BSD and the GNU GPL, and use both Linux and OpenBSD. BSD is for people who would like to see their software used by as many people as possible, regardless of commercialization. GPL is for the little guy who uses, fixes, and creates software and doesn't want the development to be taken out of his control

Whether it's BSD or GPL is entirely up to the original author of the code. Both are admirable.

However, Microsoft could possibly buy out the OpenBSD and FreeBSD teams for, say, twenty million dollars per developer, move the development inside Redmond, and then discontinue it. While the original code would still be available, the project would be destroyed (assuming the developers signed non-compete contracts etc.).

This would be very difficult to do with a GPL project, and that's the intent.

This Microsoft initiative is the usual FUD. How's this for a threat:

"Let me be clear about one thing, we don't license our intellectual property to Linux because of the way Linux licensing GPL framework works, that's not really a possibility," said Microsoft chief executive, Steve Ballmer.

"Novell is actually just a proxy for its customers, and it's only for its customers," he added. "This does not apply to any forms of Linux other than Novell's SUSE Linux. And if people want to have peace and interoperability, they'll look at Novell's SUSE Linux. If they make other choices, they have all of the compliance and intellectual property issues that are associated with that."

Microsoft-Novell peace deal could create two-tier Linux market

There is no one on the BSD side who will fight Microsoft. (deRaadt does a good job fighting vendors on open driver code). Stallman and Eben Moglen have a hell of a fight on their hands, and they have been successful so far, thankfully.

Stallman has an extremely stubborn, persistent, and iconoclastic personality. That's what it takes to fight this battle.

Posted by KBK 2006-11-07 13:21|| 2006-11-07 13:21|| Front Page Top

#12 However, Microsoft could possibly buy out the OpenBSD and FreeBSD teams for, say, twenty million dollars per developer, move the development inside Redmond, and then discontinue it. While the original code would still be available, the project would be destroyed (assuming the developers signed non-compete contracts etc.).

Guess I'd better start learning to program in C, huh?

Posted by badanov 2006-11-07 13:27|| http://www.freefirezone.org]">[http://www.freefirezone.org] 2006-11-07 13:27|| Front Page Top

#13 "Software should be free"

Just like in "free" medicine this means

"There should be next to no software".

Posted by Bright Pebbles in Blairistan 2006-11-07 14:25|| 2006-11-07 14:25|| Front Page Top

#14 English has a problem: 'free' can mean 'liberty' or 'no cost'. Stallman means 'liberty'.

He has no problem with people making money on software. The nature of the GPL precludes certain kinds of revenue streams, but there are others.

There has been a ton of software developed under the GPL and other free licenses: GNU/Linux, X, OpenOffice, and tens of thousands of lesser items. It may not be quite as flashy or convenient as a Mac, but it gets the job done.

BTW, I don't have anything against proprietary software, either, so long as it doesn't try to wipe out the 'libre' software through legal attacks.

Posted by KBK 2006-11-07 14:46|| 2006-11-07 14:46|| Front Page Top

#15 And how much code now tagged and sold as commercial and proprietary was originally created under DoD contract and from various governmental funding initiatives?

Posted by Procopius2K 2006-11-07 15:04|| 2006-11-07 15:04|| Front Page Top

#16 I believe the future is to have hidden OS's. What is the OS on the xBox360? or the iPod. Doesn't matter what makes it tick as long as it works and is reasonably easy to use.

Microsoft sees that and as they move onto the next phase of computers and embedded stuff and internet applications they are looking for advantages. If that advantage is Linux they'll go for it.

Posted by rjschwarz 2006-11-07 15:12|| 2006-11-07 15:12|| Front Page Top

#17 WINE is a shim. If M$S would help wine instead of screw with APIs every time it starts to work well they would have no problem.

IN fact if they would add the DirectX stuff to it...!

WineHQ.org

Posted by 3dc 2006-11-07 17:21|| 2006-11-07 17:21|| Front Page Top

#18 What is it with Roadside America occasionally hijacking my comments?

Posted by rjschwarz 2006-11-07 17:33|| 2006-11-07 17:33|| Front Page Top

#19 Lol. Been there, bro.

Posted by .com 2006-11-07 17:34|| 2006-11-07 17:34|| Front Page Top

#20 LOL The mighty Muffler Man!

Here is a clue. It's Balmer FUD.
If youy want to be a happy computer user, use and support what works for you. For most people it's going to be some flavor or Microsoft.

I have been using Linux on my desktop since 2000, it does everything I want to do. We are down to one computer out of five running Microsoft in this house and it hasn't booted that OS in 6 months.

I do very little worrying about my OS and spend my time working with my computer and enjoying it instead.

Let Balmer run his mouth, he is good at it, it's what he gets paid for. IBM is behind Linux, it has many more software patents than Miocrosoft does. You will not be seeing this in court.

Posted by Sock Puppet of Doom 2006-11-07 19:12|| www.sockpuppetofdoom.com]">[www.sockpuppetofdoom.com] 2006-11-07 19:12|| Front Page Top

#21 Yup, if people want "peace and interoperability" they'll have to burn down Redmond.

Posted by KBK 2006-11-07 19:19|| 2006-11-07 19:19|| Front Page Top

18:03 colored voter
16:20 Angavins
16:04 A Democratic Vote
15:59 Vote! Support our troops!
15:53 A Democratic Vote
15:52 DEMOCRATS TO VICTORY!
15:40 ****VOTE****
15:39 *DEMOCRAT*
15:40 *************
15:32 Glealet Flaviting8567
15:29 Photh Ebbutle2361
15:27 Hibjobol Abjub
15:15 Hibjobol Abjub
14:57 Hibjobol Abjub
14:10 Hibjobol Abjub
23:59 Lancasters Over Dresden
23:58 OldSpook
23:57 Lancasters Over Dresden
23:56 Lancasters Over Dresden
23:52 Lancasters Over Dresden
23:50 Kalle (kafir forever)
23:50 Lancasters Over Dresden
23:46 anonymous2u
23:46 Rex Mundi