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2005-10-29 Southeast Asia
Three Christian schoolgirls beheaded in C. Sulawesi
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Posted by phil_b 2005-10-29 04:03|| || Front Page|| [11130 views since 2007-05-07]  Top

#1 This is sickening!
Poor, poor girls, may they rest easy.
Why isn't this kind of info broadcasted everywhere?
This really p*sses me off, this plus the ransacking of churches, harassing of copts, assault on nun,... in Egypt this week... and the media which are mum about this, or treat it as "interfaith violence", as if the violence was not one-sided.

I may be grandiloquent, but for me islam has always been the predator of christianity in particular, and of all others cultures in general (think about the conquest of India). Zenster's idea of cultural genocide is quite apt, islam has been the greatest eraser of civilizations ever, the worst colonizing and slave-trading force of History.
Still, the PC version of it is that christianity is to blame now or before, and only it can be found guilty for such crimes... remember, only white male christians can be racist... even if there is a single word in classical arabic to say both "slave" and "black".
This is depressing. Still, Spencer's books are supposedly good sellers, and in France the internet is a successful medium of re-information, and I'm sure Holland's people are not fooled, perhaps there is some hope of battling back this PC madness?
I really blame the (truly and directly marxist-originated) worldview of the "new left" of the 60's, it is in every sense the death of the West, due to self-doubt and lack of immunatory defenses. Face it, culturally the commies have won, and it's even worse in Europe, they wanted to destroy western civilization which was in their way, and they got their wish. Only bright spot is they'll go down with the rest of us.
Posted by anonymous5089 2005-10-29 04:34||   2005-10-29 04:34|| Front Page Top

#2 I am planning on then going down anonymous5089 not me and not my family. Turning the other cheek doesn't work with this scum and never has.
Posted by Sock Puppet O´ Doom 2005-10-29 05:04||   2005-10-29 05:04|| Front Page Top

#3 Sort of like Christianity has been the predator of Judiasm. Please. Religion is one, over time it is modified for personal gain, followed by misled brainwashed masses, so God refreshes the covenant. This is God's earth you embucile, not the neo-cons. God help us, too many mouths out there behind their keyboards. And if Spencer is your reference, I don't know if I should laugh or cry.. ignorants.. the world is so full of ignorants.
Posted by Shilet Phaviter5838 2005-10-29 05:58||   2005-10-29 05:58|| Front Page Top

#4 Three Christian teenage girls were beheaded Saturday in the latest attack against non-Muslims in the troubled Indonesian province of Central Sulawesi, police said.

The muslim torture and death cult strikes again. Like a virulant disease, it's infected devotees are guaranteed to depart from any organic decency or reason. Operating so outside the bounds of aceptable behaviour they can murder 3 young girls and scatter their heads around for maxium terror.

It's beyond the pale.

anonymous5089, Sad to say, you hit the nail right on the head.>> Why isn't this kind of info broadcasted everywhere?
Posted by Red Dog 2005-10-29 06:08||   2005-10-29 06:08|| Front Page Top

#5 Shilet Phaviter5838 2005 ..It's tough being an embucile ain't it! LOL

Posted by Red Dog 2005-10-29 06:12||   2005-10-29 06:12|| Front Page Top

#6 Shilet Phaviter5838 : glad to see you do not belong to the "misled brainwashed masses", no, you're much better than them sweaty proletarians who vote Bush.
On the contrary, I'm sure you're one of the enlightened fews.
Please, do tell me, how do you relate, in a Derrida-decontructionist way, with the report of three young innocent girls being decapitated because they do not belong to the Master Religion? I'd like to know.
Posted by anonymous5089 2005-10-29 08:09||   2005-10-29 08:09|| Front Page Top

#7 You are seeing a fast forward loop of things to be. The elites of our society are cowards (left & right). No outrage is too shocking to de-rationalize fear. At some point the free people will make their will known and clear rational action will compell our elites to act if only to preserve themselves.
Posted by Bardo 2005-10-29 09:32||   2005-10-29 09:32|| Front Page Top

#8 It seems to me that the success of the Coalition and Iraqis together, and NATO and Afghanistan together, bespeaks a clear statement of the will of the free people and those they have freed. As for the self-identified elites, they have been very noisy about the whole thing, but not actually effective in stopping or sidetracking anything, despite the very constricting rules of engagement the troops have been subject to.
Posted by trailing wife 2005-10-29 09:50||   2005-10-29 09:50|| Front Page Top

#9 It's about time that they start finding muslims boiled in lard. The only reason to turn the other cheek to these bastards is to aim with your good eye.
Posted by Hupirt Omolump9390 2005-10-29 10:13||   2005-10-29 10:13|| Front Page Top

#10 But where any Korans desecrated?

This shit has been happing in Indonesia for a long time now.

Watch all the coverage the MSM gives this. There will be none or very little (a mention in passing perhaps...).

This is disgusting as are the MSM's actions. Its ok to behead three christian girls but just fart in the general direction of a muslim....
Posted by CrazyFool 2005-10-29 10:17||   2005-10-29 10:17|| Front Page Top

#11 The BBC has picked up the story in their usual Muslim-arse-kissing style:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4387604.stm

Grrrrrr..
Posted by Darrell 2005-10-29 10:39||   2005-10-29 10:39|| Front Page Top

#12 BBC : "bitter fighting between Muslims and Christians in 2001 and 2002."

"Bitter fighting" is neutral and doesn't tell who's the aggressor and who suffers the bulk of casualties.

I clearly remember reading reports by christian orgs of jihadists, from all over Indonesia and backed by military, entering christian towns with black and green banners and pictures of Osama Ben Laden (this was right after 9/11), ransacking the area, murdering, raping and terrorizing people, and ending up expelling the whole lot after converting them by force, men being violently circumcized with razors or even swords.

And the same went (and goes) in northern Nigeria, and to a lesser extent in Egypt. This is not "interfaiths violence", this is actual persecution of christian minorities by the ROP... and in each case, this is sanitazed by the Msm, who bent reality to their wishes.
Posted by anonymous5089 2005-10-29 11:04||   2005-10-29 11:04|| Front Page Top

#13 It is the same story in India.
The media reports of "sectarian clashes" but fails to point out the agressor - in majority of cases muslims.

Posted by john 2005-10-29 12:41||   2005-10-29 12:41|| Front Page Top

#14 Presbyterian Church (USA) and the Protestant World Council of Churches to divest from Israel. Here's a great example of "religion" in action. Do you think these sainted beings will comment on the clearly murderous act by the violent, imperialistic entity a.k.a Islam. Personal spirtualism does not necessarily need religio-politico organzation.
Posted by Bardo 2005-10-29 12:43||   2005-10-29 12:43|| Front Page Top

#15 #14 Presbyterian Church (USA) and the Protestant World Council of Churches to divest from Israel. Here's a great example of "religion" in action. Do you think these sainted beings will comment on the clearly murderous act by the violent, imperialistic entity a.k.a Islam. Personal spirtualism does not necessarily need religio-politico organzation.
**********
NO THEY WON'T COMMENT. They're the Eloi about to be chewed up by the Islamo-Morlocks.
Posted by The Happy Fliegerabwehrkanonen 2005-10-29 13:04|| http://www.calderonswirbelwind.blogspot.com]">[http://www.calderonswirbelwind.blogspot.com]  2005-10-29 13:04|| Front Page Top

#16 Christian leaders have repeatedly accused the authorities in Jakarta of not doing enough to find the perpetrators and bring them to justice.

As if such a thing were likely to happen without outside pressure...
Posted by Bomb-a-rama 2005-10-29 13:05||   2005-10-29 13:05|| Front Page Top

#17 The MSM calls it interfaith violence because in many cases the Christians fight back to save their lives and their families and property. Fighting back when attacked apparently disqualifies them from pure victimhood and therefore the sympathy of the media. In the interests of a misguided fairness, the media always overlooks the fact that it is always the muslims attacking the Christians first. Never the other way around althought the muslims always claim some provactive rumor of koran desecration etc which is always claimed to have been witnessed by some friend of some relative of some imam with their own eyes and no good muslim would ever have a reason to lie about something so serious would they???

Its all bullshit. Rampages against Christians are always without fail based on some unconfirmed rumor. Thats all the excuse that muslims need to remind Christians of their "humiliated" position as sub-citizens without inalienable human rights.
Posted by peggy">peggy  2005-10-29 15:26||   2005-10-29 15:26|| Front Page Top

#18 Update:
Men in black clothes and masks beheaded three teenage Christian girls on Saturday in eastern Indonesia as they walked to school near the Muslim town of Poso, officials said. National police spokesman Aryanto Budiharjo said up to six men in black clothes and masks attacked the students in Bukit Bambu village, on the eastern island of Sulawesi. "The perpetrators wore black attire and veils and they used machetes to slash (the victims)," he told reporters in Jakarta. Earlier, a police official in Poso gave a different account, saying two men wearing helmets on a motorcycle attacked the 16-year-old students. He said the student who escaped said the attackers wore helmets and carried a two-way radio.
Posted by Seafarious">Seafarious  2005-10-29 16:18||   2005-10-29 16:18|| Front Page Top

#19 men in black? masks? machetes? two-way radios?

Mormons, obviously.
Posted by Frank G">Frank G  2005-10-29 16:55||   2005-10-29 16:55|| Front Page Top

#20 I think I mentioned once that it would be a bad idea to fuck with Mormons, but I'd say this was more likely theravada buddhists... they're pretty touchy when riled.

On the serious side, nothing could possibly be more repulsive. Am I terrorized? No. I choose to be immeasurably vengeful. The next wanker who shows up to mutter apologetic shit about Indos had better be wearing an asbestos jumpsuit, mask, and turban - color optional. The Indos will regret being "the world's most populous Islamic country" someday - soon... they'll hold another, very different, record when that day arrives. I can't believe I donated money to help this cesspool recover from the tsunami. It's one thing to be a demented Islamonutz fucktard who parades around in demonstrations hollering "dirka dirka" BS. This is something else, entirely...

This is in the newly-minted tradition of Beslan - and deserves the nastiest thing we can devise, and that's victim's religion notwithstanding - I feel the same way about the girl's school fire in Saudi.
Posted by .com 2005-10-29 17:13||   2005-10-29 17:13|| Front Page Top

#21 The RoP strikes again. Eloi is a good image for the Western Elites. While I understand why GWB has had to call Islam the RoP, it becomes less and less politically sustainable. Everyone, both Left and Right know that we looking into the abyss. The Left happens to believe that the abyss will produce the result that they want. The Right refuses to face the abyss.

Every time GWB bows to political correctness and speaks the lie, our chances to avoid a war of annihilation or even for survival is lessened. I hope that the President will begin to call things by their right names.
Posted by SR-71 2005-10-29 17:22||   2005-10-29 17:22|| Front Page Top

#22 The West, in the thrall of empiricist secularism, is embarassed by its JudaoChristian roots. With radical groups like the ACLU inexorably warring against Christianity, the public has been conditioned to think that if they are suitably "diverse" and suppress all outward signs of Christianity, that Islam will stop its 1300 year war of conquest and will not kill them. Islam has only two fates for nonbelievers, slavery or death. If the West is to survive, militant Islam must be eradicated. You can't fight an idea like Islam with nothing. With Christianity suppressed, there will be nothing to hold back the tide of Islam. Humanism, secularism, atheism don't seem to be able to hold against militant beliefs. When the fire comes, the ACLU will find that Sharia doesn't give a flying f**k about what it thinks.
Posted by Random thoughts 2005-10-29 21:18||   2005-10-29 21:18|| Front Page Top

#23 anonymous5089Zenster's idea of cultural genocide is quite apt ...

Thank you, a5089. Global Cultural Genocide is something few people (outside of Rantburg and Israel) seem willing to wrap their minds around. You'll see some of my own reasoning about this below.

.com I can't believe I donated money to help this cesspool recover from the tsunami.

I'm not here to rub in any salt, .com. I just hope you remember how vigorously you applied the lash to my suggestion that tsunami relief aid be tied to substantial and material commitments in the fight against terrorism. We supposedly have those same commitments from Pakistan, and all of us here know just how much those have been worth.

.comThis is in the newly-minted tradition of Beslan - and deserves the nastiest thing we can devise, and that's victim's religion notwithstanding - I feel the same way about the girl's school fire in Saudi.

It's all one in the same, and I label it Global Cultural Genocide. I'm pleased to note that an atheist like yourself can see past all the religious trappings and expose the core aspect of this treachery. In the long run, Islamists give not-a-sh!t about their victims' religion. The only thing that matters is sweeping aside any and all impediments to their own theocratic aspirations. Nothing else matters or is of value. Think of all the Muslims who die each day at the hands of their terrorist brethern. Think of the stone Buddhas in Afghanistan.

SR-71Every time GWB bows to political correctness and speaks the lie, our chances to avoid a war of annihilation or even for survival is lessened.

I cannot applaud this observation strongly enough, SR-71. Bush's own fixation upon eroding America's separation of church and state has effectively blinded him to the true dangers posed by theocracies abroad. His horrid commingling of personal faith with what should be rationally calculated issues of national security have left him ineffectual when it comes to identifying the true enemy which is religious fundamentalism. It appalls me no end to see what is relatively shrewd foreign policy consistently neutered by theological daintiness with respect to what is plainly a global menace.

In an attempt to mantle his own religiosity with credibility, Bush has imbibed the Kool-Aid of moral relativism regarding Islam and its stone-age mentality. Islam, as a whole, must be onerously taken to task for its naked pursuit of global dominance, abuse of women, subversion of political freedom and persistent sponsorship of terrorism. By ignoring these monstrous components of the Islamist agenda, Bush shields all Muslims from the obligation to come forth and openly condemn those within their ranks that promote these atrocities. His abject refusal to place the ball squarely in Islam’s court severely cripples our military’s ability to address the enemy with proper force. This cupidity likewise serves to enable other nations to continue their charade of denying how virulent the threat of Islamism really is.

Such outright betrayal of our nation’s interest may eventually become the one single issue that damns Bush’s presidential legacy.
Posted by Zenster 2005-10-29 21:22||   2005-10-29 21:22|| Front Page Top

#24 Now, now, Zen. Link it or eat it, son. I didn't apply any lash to anyone, as I recall. I do remember asking folks to give the Thais who wanted to reopen the resorts a break - otherwise they starve.

So cough it up.

Meanwhile I'll read the rest and digest with dinner.
Posted by .com 2005-10-29 21:27||   2005-10-29 21:27|| Front Page Top

#25 Unfortunately this is not an uncommon thing in Indo. Even though it happened in a muzzie province I would not be too quick to blame them. The Buddists, animalists(sp?) and other really nasty tribes in that area are known for beheadings and other horrid antics.
Posted by 49 pan 2005-10-29 21:40||   2005-10-29 21:40|| Front Page Top

#26 None of the Western Elites will or can state exactly what historically imperialistic Islam is today. Fueled with enormous cash assets their (Islamic Fascists) ownership of our society would shock the most cynical of posters on this site. It is not going to change. There is no Winston Churchill only Ward. This actrocity hardens the hypocrite's heart as another drop of sand that we experience in the daily media perusal of today.
Posted by Bardo 2005-10-29 21:41||   2005-10-29 21:41|| Front Page Top

#27 Zen - Regards Bush's being far too generous with Islam in spoken word, I must agree - personally. I add that because there are two key aspects that cannot be overlooked, no matter how you and I wish things to be handled.

1) There are something over a billion Muzzies. B-b-b-billion. It is well understood around here, I hope, that the key rule of Islam is: Muzzy first, last, and always. Whatever other label may be applied - Muzzy First is far and away the norm. Given that, there is some wisdom in trying to differentiate the so-called Islamists, and isolate them as much as possible, from Yagouv Average Muzzy. No rational point in pissing them all off at once. Bite-sized makes more sense in the real world. Besides - those are just words, nothing more.

2) There is what Bush says and what Bush does. Though the words are overly soft, for both our tastes, the actions are very direct. Afghanistan and Iraq and the fallout from those - such as Libya, Lebanon, the grudging attempts to appear reformist throughout the asshat M.E. - aren't accidents. He talked softly and carried a big stick. So give credit where due - actions have been at least as loud as the verbiage has been soft.

I know you're hung up on the religiosity thingy - we've crossed swords over this before, lol. I look at it from the POV that it's what he does that counts, not what he says - i.e. the points above play at home as well as to the world at large. There has been no attack on the constitution, any of our freedoms (despite the Total Fucking Bullshit that has been spewed by the Moonbats regards the main action that was taken: the Patriot Act), and none of us has been forced to do anything differently because Bush is President. I still shudder to think where we'd be without him. If either alGore or alSkeery had won, we'd be fucked, IMHO. Please tell me where this is wrong - or do you agree, now? Day one you showed up here ranting about the "shrub" and "selected not elected". I remember very clearly. We first "met" on the thread of an Ann Coulter article. Enjoy that link - it took me for-fucking-ever to find it, lol.

Are you inclined to give credit, today, for what has been accomplished? Are you still of the mind that we should've had Gore as President? These are not trivial - they are part of the package you brought with you here. If you've matured your views over the last 18 months, as I have, then we can actually discuss this. If not. Toodles.

Actions. Results. Those matter. 90% of what I read in your comment to SR-71 is personal distaste - or fear, which is what I have actually come to believe is what is behind this MND (Michael Newdow Dementia). The other 10% is, as I said above, a policy approach to keep from taking on the whole mass at once.

"Bush has imbibed the Kool-Aid of moral relativism regarding Islam and its stone-age mentality."

Bullshit. He is, as I said, being practical, not a knee-jerk hothead - like me. Like you, too?

What I want, my personal agenda, has proven to be too optimistic. I don't know what sequence of actions I would've taken, but that's mainly because I do not have his knowledge or the expertise of his advisors at my beck and call. I'm too aggressive for the resources available, damnit. I really wanted to jump the shark and go for the heart of the matter, after the Taliban were deposed, anyway, and take on The Republic of Eastern Arabia (which I espoused 4 months before you arrived here) and decapping the MMs (which I called for 6 months before you showed up here). Money is the source of the current wave of asshattery. Stop the cash and we stop most of it dead in its tracks.

So are we gonna go back to the dementia daze - or talk about what we can do, within reality, here and now?

You have great insights at times, and I value them. But I do not value the religiosity BS because it's not as you state it, it's not the danger you describe, and it's part and parcel of the man. I'll take the man, warts, religiosity, and all. He gets shit done.

I hope the 2nd-term BS doesn't derail him, but I'll readily admit I'm worried. He's been distracted by the thousand cuts BS and I want his ass to get back on track and for him to bare his fangs. I want the Senate hip-deep in Dhimmidonk blood and viscera. And I want the MMs decapped. And I want The Republic of Eastern Arabia. And I want... And I want... LOL. I'll take as much as he can give me, cuz the The President of The United States of America. And I'm a blogfly.

Oh. And I really want a pony.
Posted by .com 2005-10-29 22:19||   2005-10-29 22:19|| Front Page Top

#28 If you care to see what the sub-humans did to these little sweet hearts. Cut and paste if you wish & scroll down. but you risk the visual image.

http://dog-pundit.blogspot.com/
Posted by Red Dog 2005-10-29 22:49||   2005-10-29 22:49|| Front Page Top

#29 In the Anne Coulter thread, I say the problem at root is we are winning and .com's ankle biters are in serious denial about it. But the world is changing and the reality deniers (Islamicists thru to the MSM) are having a more and more difficult time of it as we win this war one battle for truth at a time. I still believe this, but maybe I'm just an optimist.
Posted by phil_b 2005-10-29 22:52||   2005-10-29 22:52|| Front Page Top

#30 .com, this is going to take some number of posts, but I want you to see the treatment I received about the tsunami relief effort. I very much want to respond to your last post as well, so please be patient. Time does not permit proper linking and font differentiation, so please bear with me ...

http://rantburg.com/poparticle.php?HC=1&D=2004-12-26&ID=52167

#8 And not to be cynical but all of these counrties that bitch and moan about Uncle Sam will be crying for help from guess who

I'll out-cynic you all.

Maybe the first person off the plane needs to be a policy wonk wanting some ink on an anti-terrorism pact. If these countries want our assistance, it's time for them to earn it. Don't think I'm not interested in helping any of them. I'm just fed up with the "thanks for all the foreign aid, you running Yankee dogs" mentality. Posted by Zenster 2004-12-26 1:58:24 PM|| Front Page|| Comment Top

http://rantburg.com/poparticle.php?HC=1&D=2004-12-26&ID=52160

#30 I'll play my ultra-cynical card over here in this thread too.

Maybe it's time to drop all pretenses and tie any foreign disaster relief to full cooperation with anti-terror efforts. Ruthless? You betcha. Then again, so is the enemy and all those who soft-pedal the Islamist cause.

It's time to get concessions over who's patroling the Malacca Straits. Let's see if Bashir might be available for some stateside interrogation. This is QUID PRO QUO TIME.

I have no problem dumping a few billion American taxpayer dollars onto this natural disaster. But remember, the tremendous loss of life from this quake is also directly linked to the same corrupt governments whose graft and preferential treatment are breeding up the terrorists.

The routine diversion of funds that could have built better civil engineering projects (although that might not have helped too much against an 8.9) and, especially, put in place disaster-relief provisions, medical centers and staff is one of the things that exacerbates Islamist unrest.

If we are going to help these countries rebuild, it had best be on our own terms. Very few of them are providing much more than lipservice in fighting terrorism. It's time to change the pattern of minimal compliance and spark some real enthusiasm.

Through blunt force trauma (i.e., 9-11), America has been forced to begin rebuilding this world in our own image. However ethnocentric it may sound, the US's vision of global democracy beats the living snot out of all the alternatives, especially those that continue to foster terrorism.

This is a golden opportunity to step forward with a helping hand that intentionally pulls all disaster aid recipients towards our side. Cynical? Yup! Machievellian? Bingo! Self-preserving? You got it!

If America is obliged to do all of the heavy lifting, it's time to make the exertion count. Communist China does not have the bandwidth or will to step into the breach and help on the scale needed. All smaller countries cannot possibly make any sort of dent in this human tragedy that America can.

If we're going to play the bleeding heart one more time, it's time to begin charging for our blood donations. We no longer have the luxury of pretending that unaccountable foreign aid spending (even in the form of disaster relief) permits us to assure ourselves that we are fighting the poverty, intolerance and corruption that spawns terrorism.

This time, let's finally attach a realistic price tag to our help. Posted by Zenster 2004-12-26 2:43:13 PM|| Front Page|| Comment Top
Posted by Zenster 2005-10-29 23:09||   2005-10-29 23:09|| Front Page Top

#31 http://rantburg.com/Default.asp?TINDEX=2&D=12/29/2004#52381

#2 Permit me to suggest sending condolences to the Australian embassy here in America. I've written them the following:

public.affairs@austemb.org

Re: Condolences

To the Embassy Staff and All Australian People,

Please accept my sincere condolences for your loss of so many Australian nationals during the Sumatra earthquake. In recent years many of us in America have felt an increasing bond with your great nation during such disturbing times. Australia's unwavering, clear cut support in helping to assure our world's stability and security only makes this tragedy just that much more grievous for all Americans.

If there are any Australian citizens stranded in the United States who need help, comfort or temporary housing, please do not hesitate to ask for my personal assistance. I am located in ................. and will contribute in any way that I can. This disaster is one that reaches far beyond its boundaries and demands that all people of conscience rise to the occasion. Again, you have my deepest sympathies in this time of loss.

With Great Sorrow,

Zenster Posted by Zenster 2004-12-29 4:19:41 AM|| Front Page|| Comment Top


#3 And Zenstertroll, why not also add something more along the lines of your postings from yesterday and the day before and the day before, like:

"And if I were leader of the free world, believe me my Aussie brothers, not one cent would be going to anyone, anywhere, until these rattyass countries make me a big promise to stop being corrupt and to root out Islamoterrorism from the tops of their countries to the bottoms--UNTIL THEN . . . no reconstruction aid. (Never mind the pesky little fact that there are plenty of terror cells, and corruption to boot, in the US and UK--that stuff just don't count cuz we're the civilized peoples of the world). Cheers, mates!
"--from someone named "Zenster" (yeah, right) --the guy who really 'cares' in the US of A. "

That would be more consistent with your viewpoints, no?

You make me sick, Zenster, but you don't fool me. I know what you're about.

(Zenster's "letter" to the Australians is a great example of what he tries to do here--suck up, suck in. For those new to Rantburg, I suggest the archives for more revelation--Zenster isn't what he pretends to be.)



Posted by ex-lib 2004-12-29 9:46:57 PM|| Front Page|| Comment Top


#4 I have to admit - the letter is just about perfect - so it was, from the "write to the Aussies POV" a thread-killer.

However - ex-lib has nailed the inconsistency / duplicity factor square betwixt the eyes. If there were a comment / commenter ID search, much of the faux-debate here would be reduced to zip - leaving bandwidth for real discussion. Those who never concede a point, no matter what, are trolls. "I'm sorry, you're right." or "Cool idea - bravo! - I'll steal it!" need to be introduced into the lexicon / vocabulary of several of our posters. Give credit where due and cut the grandstanding / pontificating, eh? And, since I'm pontificating, I'm sorry. Excellent post, ex-lib - bravo! - I'll steal it! ;-) Posted by .com 2004-12-29 10:00:49 PM|| Front Page|| Comment Top
Posted by Zenster 2005-10-29 23:12||   2005-10-29 23:12|| Front Page Top

#32 http://rantburg.com/poparticle.php?HC=1&D=2005-01-01&ID=52610

2005-01-01 Southeast Asia Bad Equipment Hurt Tsunami Warning Efforts

I’ll leave it to all of you as to just how disgusted I am by this article.

BANGKOK, Thailand - Faulty equipment, poor communications and cumbersome bureaucracy are being blamed for the failure of nations around the Indian Ocean’s rim to warn communities about to be hit by one of the world’s most devastating natural disasters.
Who’da thunk it?
A sensor system in Indonesia that could have warned of Sunday’s huge waves was not working because it had been hit by lightning. In India, bureaucrats faxed a warning of possible disaster to the wrong official. A Thai meteorologist acting on a hunch sent an alert to radio stations, but it doesn’t appear the warning was widely relayed. Even if the Indian Ocean had an international tsunami alert system, like one in the Pacific, the warning likely would have come too late for the people of Sumatra, the Indonesian island closest to the epicenter of the magnitude 9 earthquake that set off the killer waves.

Indonesian officials said they do have a bare-bones sensor system to gauge the possibility of a tsunami hitting the nation’s main island of Java — but it was knocked out by a lighting strike two weeks before the disaster.
No hurry to fix that balky little item.
Yet, even if had been working, Indonesian officials acknowledge they have no way to alert villages. "Even if we did know about the tsunami, how can we (disseminate) information," said Prih Harjadi of the Indonesian Meteorological & Geophysical Agency. Media reports of the tsunami also didn’t prompt any alerts from the agency, he added. "We didn’t call anyone because we didn’t know who to call."
File that excuse with, "Isn’t this the way we always do it?"
Most residents and foreign tourists in southern Thailand’s resort region were caught unaware. "There was no warning from the meteorological department or any other agencies," said Phuket Gov. Udomsak Asawarangkul. An alert of some kind got through to some places — at a few beaches officials yelled through bull horns telling tourists to get off the beaches. Most people got no warning.

"The (first) warning was that the ocean went out and people were walking down the beach wondering why there were fish flapping on the sand," said Steve Hall, an Australian who moved to Thailand a decade ago. "By the time they realized, it was too late."
Darwin had already entered the building.
Kathawudhi Marlairojanasiri, a meteorological department weather forecast chief on duty Sunday, said the office did send warnings to radio and television stations an hour before the first waves hit — on a hunch the quake off Sumatra might trigger tsunami waves. Thai authorities apparently didn’t relay it, in fear of scaring tourists with a possible false alarm.
"Pesky things those false alarms, always scaring off the rubes."
"Five years ago, the meteorological department issued a warning of possible tidal wave after an earthquake happened in Papua New Guinea but the tourism authority complained that such a warning, if it turned out to be false, would hurt tourism," said Sulamee Prachuab, director of Meteorological Department’s Seismological Bureau.
Wouldn’t want to hurt tourism now, would we?
"There was a 7.6-magnitude earthquake occurred in the same location in Sumatra five years ago but there was no tsunami," she added. The first word Indians got of the tsunami was on the news after the water roared ashore, even though waves swamped India’s Andaman and Nicobar islands north of Sumatra an hour before they reached the southern coast of the Indian mainland.
[Bugs Bunny] Stunning, isn’t it? [/BB]
Officials in southern India who had gotten a report from a military base on a Nicobar island mistakenly faxed the news to the home of the government’s former science and technology minister, rather than his successor.
"Dag nabbed Rolodexes are so complicated to maintain and operate!"
"It looks like they forgot to update their records," said Ashok Kavdia, an aide of the former minister, who was away from home Sunday.
Something tells me their employee files are about to be updated.
Sri Lanka’s president said Thursday that the leaders of a seven-member group of South Asian countries plan to discuss installing a disaster early warning system at a summit Jan. 9. The 10-nation Association of Southeast Asian Nations will discuss the idea next week.
For the Nth time.
Even a high-tech warning system might not help India, a political analyst said.
Nothing else much does.
"In such disasters, we require rapid and specific responses. The Indian bureaucracy by its training and conditioning can’t do it," said Balbir Arora, a New Delhi-based professor of public administration.
Just a sidecourse in the recipe for disaster. Posted by Zenster 2005-01-01 2:56:11 AM|| E-Mail|| Front Page|| Comment ||Top

#2 With perfect hindsight far from the event, and any responsibility, 'tis easy to whip 'em like the curs they are, eh?

Massive Classic Hypocrisy. Posted by .com 2005-01-01 6:52:03 AM|| Front Page|| Comment Top


#6 Often, the nym chosen by a poster serves as excellent troll-sign. For instance, people calling themselves Peace, Patriot, Love Our Soldiers, Truth, etc are among the most egregious shrieking moonbats and disingenuous trolls. Here in RB we get them. Some of my favorites are Slumming, Gentle, and my current favorite Dodo, Winged Avenger.

So, if I may ask, how did you come to choose Zenster? Was it as vicious parody? Or because it sounds spiffy to you? Or is it something else - such as incredible irony?

Methinks your understanding of Zen maxes out at the cute little wai of the waiter when he delivers room service - or have you ever actually been "over there" amongst the pagans? You know, outside the hotel and everything, rubbing shoulders with the little brown people. Just asking. Of course, your answer to that may or may not be honest, but your in-line commentary in this article leaves no doubt. Posted by .com 2005-01-01 10:20:17 PM|| Front Page|| Comment Top


#7 So, if I may ask, how did you come to choose Zenster? Was it as vicious parody? Or because it sounds spiffy to you? Or is it something else - such as incredible irony?

I'm amazed that it took this long for someone to ask.

My handle is Zenster because Zen is the name of the wolf-hybrid that I own. I also enjoy studying Zen because it is one of the few philosophies that doesn't demand blind faith or much of anything else except sharpness of wit and depth of character. Unlike most major religions, Zen actually prizes the "charismatic imperfection" of mankind, instead of reviling it.

As to being out amongst the great unwashed, my travel destinations have included Mexico, Taiwan and Armenia. Going to Mexico, I drove round-trip the entire length of the Baja Peninsula myself and never stayed in a single hotel. Nor did I stay in a hotel in Armenia, during mid-Winter. While in Taiwan, I routinely walked the streets instead of always taking a cab, unlike my colleagues. I made a point of talking to the natives at every opportunity. I also traveled into Tai Pei almost every weekend so that I could learn more about the Taiwanese culture. I've hitch-hiked through Canada in the dead of winter and gone on lots of other uncomfortable treks as well, like a 100 mile canoe trip.

Nice try, .com, but you're not talking to an armchair traveler.

I just happen to be sick and tired of hearing so many third world countries that we dump all these billions into keep telling us that they just don't have the money for minor expenses like a functioning civil alert system or disaster preparedness. The "for want of a nail" excuse wears thin after sending over several truckloads of nail kegs. Posted by Zenster 2005-01-01 11:21:30 PM|| Front Page|| Comment Top
Posted by Zenster 2005-10-29 23:16||   2005-10-29 23:16|| Front Page Top

#33 perhaps if you weren't so fucking full of yourself Zenster, then you could see that the problem the country has is people like you.

Your idea of helping is to criticize, whine, bitch and complain that you have the correct solution. Everyone is stupid but apparently you.

You are the type of employee that really sucks. Wank, wank, wank. Much more concerned about proving that you saw the problem before everyone else did and never getting on board in a cooperative effort to fix it.

I'd say that the war would go better if the President could count on support from the American people, but I know it would be wasted on you because you are so certain that your bitching does more than your support.

yuck - I'd hate to work with you.
Posted by scuez me while I barf 2005-10-29 23:42||   2005-10-29 23:42|| Front Page Top

#34 Thanks for the pix, Red Dog. Sometimes I need reminding of just what we're fighting. Even the Nazis weren't this barbaric during their streetfighting days. I can barely imagine how much worse the Islamists will be once they get real power.
Posted by 11A5S 2005-10-29 23:43||   2005-10-29 23:43|| Front Page Top

#35 #27 Zen - Regards Bush's being far too generous with Islam in spoken word, I must agree - personally.


Thank you, I could not agree more.


1) There are something over a billion Muzzies. B-b-b-billion. It is well understood around here, I hope, that the key rule of Islam is: Muzzy first, last, and always. Whatever other label may be applied - Muzzy First is far and away the norm. Given that, there is some wisdom in trying to differentiate the so-called Islamists, and isolate them as much as possible, from Yagouv Average Muzzy. No rational point in pissing them all off at once.

Again, I could not agree more, except that you and I have begun to converge evermore upon the “fry-em-up” mentality. Shocked? Welcome to my stance on tsunami relief.

2) There is what Bush says and what Bush does. Though the words are overly soft, for both our tastes, the actions are very direct. Afghanistan and Iraq and the fallout from those - such as Libya, Lebanon, the grudging attempts to appear reformist throughout the asshat M.E. - aren't accidents. He talked softly and carried a big stick. So give credit where due - actions have been at least as loud as the verbiage has been soft.

I’d love to agree with you except that the softsoap sh!t on Islamism is part of the 2,000 American dead in Iraq and, while I refuse to celebrate such a tragic loss, I still hold responsible those who cannot bring themselves to call a spade a spade. Where’s the “Axis of Evil” rhetoric propaganda TRUTH when we need it?

I know you're hung up on the religiosity thingy - we've crossed swords over this before, lol. I look at it from the POV that it's what he does that counts, not what he says - i.e. the points above play at home as well as to the world at large. There has been no attack on the constitution, any of our freedoms (despite the Total Fucking Bullshit that has been spewed by the Moonbats regards the main action that was taken: the Patriot Act), and none of us has been forced to do anything differently because Bush is President.

I disagree. Eroding the separation of church and state is, quite simply, treason. Having HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF AMERICAN DOLLARS go to a mass marrying self-declared messiah like Sun Myung Moon due to the Office of Faith Based Giving that Bush established is an affront to every religious and non-religious American.

I still shudder to think where we'd be without him.

Me too, which is why I could not possibly bring myself to vote for Kerry.

Are you inclined to give credit, today, for what has been accomplished?

Yes, except that so much that might have stood for Bush’s glory is absolutely erased by the hypocrisy of his support for theocracy at home whilst spilling American blood fighting it abroad.

The Republic of Eastern Arabia (which I espoused 4 months before you arrived here) and decapping the MMs (which I called for 6 months before you showed up here).

Both of which I support wholeheartedly and (however unaware of your early Iran decap stance) have always given appropriate credit for.

You have great insights at times, and I value them. But I do not value the religiosity BS because it's not as you state it, it's not the danger you describe, and it's part and parcel of the man. I'll take the man, warts, religiosity, and all. He gets shit done.

Thank you, back at’cha. I just refuse to accept the erosion of the separation of church and state. Ptah and others have recognized the validity of my stance on this and, as an atheist, I cannot expect you to have the same priority regarding it. I’ve already stated my regard for the “shrewd foreign policy” that is currently in place. I just wish it wasn’t tainted by such agendas like “end times” or other fundamentalist agendas. Argue against it all you want, religiosity still features large in a landscape that could be free of it and still have total philosophical validity. The problem remains that we are not dealing with philosophy, but instead, faith, where it least belongs. Namely, in the arena of foreign affairs.

Oh. And I really want a pony.

Me too. But only because I want to show him why he should stop laughing.
Posted by Zenster 2005-10-29 23:43||   2005-10-29 23:43|| Front Page Top

#36 Re the tsunami threads...

Re My #4, 2004-12-29 10:00:49 PM
I'll certainly give you credit - your letter was essentially perfect - and I said so in that one comment. And I guess I did lash you about the tone of your posts. I concede the point on that one, lol.

Re: My #2, 2005-01-01 6:52:03 AM
I stand by this without hesitation. You expected perfection - and you did whip them like curs for failing to meet your expectations and coulda, shoulda, woulda bullshit. Nobody does the right thing every time - including you. If this was a perfect world with no fuckups, no corruption or laziness, perfect foresight, and perfect behavior, then there would still be disasters. This was the biggest quake ever recorded. The biggest tsunami witnessed in modern times. Even with a perfect warning system, many would've died because there was not enough time and, in many cases, no place to run, no safety. Hypocrisy it is, IMHO.

Need an clearer example? Okay, there is a 50+ ft tsunami headed for the East Coast. It will hit NYC in 3 hrs. Would you expect no deaths? How about 100? 1000? 10,000? You can bet there would be and it would exceed 1000. Add in all of the other large East Coast cities... Perfect warning system, and still tens of thousands dead. Would you cut them some slack?

But you don't admit a thing, expound on your contact with the locals in #7 as if that matters one whit, as if they react to you normally, instead of as locals reacting to the visiting tourist American, and never give anyone who fails to meet your expectations any slack, nosiree. As far as I know, you don't ever cotton to a mistake or over-statement on your part ever. It's one of the reasons why I don't trust you - and never will, I guess.

You must live in an ivory tower. A perfect ivory tower with everything in its place and no God in his heaven, lol.

Arrrggghhh, I'm running out of time, lol!
Posted by .com 2005-10-29 23:50||   2005-10-29 23:50|| Front Page Top

#37 jeebus - you guys write too much for we of little attention spans :-)

I gather you both want us to win, right? thought so...carry on
Posted by Frank G">Frank G  2005-10-29 23:50||   2005-10-29 23:50|| Front Page Top

#38 You are the type of employee that really sucks.

Which explains why the owner of the company where I work specifically created my job slot so that I could be second in command. Should I mention how I've doubled wholesale revenues in less than six months?

Come back and play again some time.

Posted by Zenster 2005-10-29 23:50||   2005-10-29 23:50|| Front Page Top

#39 Islam is not a religion, IMHO, but a totalitarian ideology. If the rhetoric moved toward that, I'd be much happier - as I'm sure we all would. That is where Bush fails in the PR Dept, IMHO. He has followed the diplo-dance and cast it as a religion, which puts him on the spot where he has to delicately separate out the active jihadis from the inactive jihadis, - heh, my take on it. Would that we could backtrack on that, for it would allow for more plain-speak.

To ignore the B-b-b-billion aspect is silly - He has to play it this way. And there is NO way that his rhetoric has erased anything - that's just dumb. Reality: The Taliban are deposed. Saddam is deposed. Nothing is erased. Sheesh, where do you live?

My pony laughs cuz he's happy - I don't ride him, lol.
Posted by .com 2005-10-29 23:56||   2005-10-29 23:56|| Front Page Top

#40 just proving my point that you are full of yourself. Must be tough, being such an arrogant bastard. But then, as you know, everyone loves you. Even create a special spot for you and your ego.
Posted by Phaviter Shainter2357 2005-10-29 23:56||   2005-10-29 23:56|| Front Page Top

#41 .com, we are so often in violent agreement that I'm willing to overlook these differences in opinion. What a gas to live in a nation where we can agree to disagree, no?

For jollies, here's my email address:

rockandrollstu@aol.com

Please email me, if you feel like it. I'd welcome a chance to sit down with you sometime and hash over the lunacy in this world. Frank G, this goes for you too, plus any others reading this thread who give d@mn.

Best Wishes,

Zenster
Posted by Zenster 2005-10-29 23:56||   2005-10-29 23:56|| Front Page Top

#42 I wonder what 'Prince Charles' thinks about this !
Posted by God Save The World AKA Oztralian 2005-10-29 23:59|| http://travis.acahosting.info/]">[http://travis.acahosting.info/]  2005-10-29 23:59|| Front Page Top

#43 I'll shoot one more thing out that I believe underpins the whole situation: Bush has done more than anyone else has done, would've done, and likely will do, already. Warts and all, he's our man. If we support him in these last three years, we move even further toward the goal - defeating insanity and threats to freedom.

If we don't, well, I wager we're set back a decade for every term served by a gutless turd - if not defeated from within. These are truly dangerous times. In my heart of hearts, I'd like to see Rudy in '08. with someone like LTC Kurilla as Veep. He has the stones and the vision, and I think he could tongue-lash the fools into line to get things accomplished.

The WoT is, IMHO, at least 75% of what the Prez should be about, today. I hope the remainder of Bush's 2nd Term isn't wasted and that we get someone like Rudy to follow up. I won't even venture to say what I think a Billary in '08 would mean. *cringe*
Posted by .com 2005-10-30 00:03||   2005-10-30 00:03|| Front Page Top

00:03 .com
00:00  CrazyFool
23:59 God Save The World AKA Oztralian
23:56 Zenster
23:56 Phaviter Shainter2357
23:56 .com
23:52 God Save The World AKA Oztralian
23:50 Zenster
23:50 Frank G
23:50 .com
23:48 ed
23:43 Zenster
23:43 11A5S
23:42 scuez me while I barf
23:16 Zenster
23:12 Zenster
23:11 .com
23:09 Zenster
23:06 raptor
22:52 phil_b
22:49 Red Dog
22:33 Shipman
22:19 .com
22:04 Bardo









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