Article

2005-03-01 Europe

Coldest winter ever recorded in Artic + predictable doom&gloom spin

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Posted by phil_b 2005-03-01 00:33|| || Front Page|| [2 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 "Record cold winter may increase ozone hole over North Europe"

Soooo... how about some global warming to the rescue?

Posted by Sobiesky 2005-03-01 12:44:46 AM|| 2005-03-01 12:44:46 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 It's global war...er, I mean, climate change!!!

Posted by Bomb-a-rama 2005-03-01 1:01:00 AM|| 2005-03-01 1:01:00 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 Even with all this ozone depletion and global warming, people still flock to the tanning beds to get their own personal radiation burns. So how much ozone loss does it take to equal 15 minutes of your own personal radiation bath?

Posted by Silentbrick 2005-03-01 1:04:06 AM|| 2005-03-01 1:04:06 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 Well, for things getting really warm...

Joshua: "What game you want to play?"

"How about global thermonuclear war?"

Posted by Sobiesky 2005-03-01 1:05:35 AM|| 2005-03-01 1:05:35 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 Shall we play a game?

Posted by .com 2005-03-01 1:08:51 AM|| 2005-03-01 1:08:51 AM|| Front Page Top

#6 Thanks, .com, for refreshing my feeble memory. Anyway, I were paraphrasing. ;-)

Posted by Sobiesky 2005-03-01 1:13:00 AM|| 2005-03-01 1:13:00 AM|| Front Page Top

#7 I was really surprised to find the earth's surface is getting a lot dimmer. A 10% decrease in sunlight in 30 years is huge. Very little reasearch has been done on this but a recent Australian study confirmed the effect is still in place and effects the southern hemisphere.
My 2c worth is there is climate instability that has little to do with CO2 and the risks are on the cooling side. The recent upsurge in volcanic activity bears watching as volcanic dust is the most important short term climate driver. BTW it looks like the Sheveluch volcano has just started a significant eruption. This is one of the most active volcanos on the planet.

Posted by phil_b 2005-03-01 1:17:51 AM|| 2005-03-01 1:17:51 AM|| Front Page Top

#8 I just thought you might like to have the file - you hit the mark and triggered the memory just fine, lol! I suddenly had a flash of a remote-controlled pterodactyl and Hollyweird's feel-good version of reality... like a Ward ~~Cleaver~~ Churchill moonbat on the Oregon coast somewhere, heh.

Posted by .com 2005-03-01 1:20:30 AM|| 2005-03-01 1:20:30 AM|| Front Page Top

#9 WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE! sooooo, martini anyone? Good info phil_b.

Posted by Rex Mundi 2005-03-01 1:28:18 AM|| 2005-03-01 1:28:18 AM|| Front Page Top

#10 Kyoto has been in effect for just a week and... one of the worst cold waves in memory has swept Spain and the Artic has record cold. Thus Kyoto works. Unbelievers, repent of your sins and go to bow (and deposit your cheque) in front of thse wise men: Zapatero, Schroeder and Chirac. :-)

Posted by JFM 2005-03-01 1:48:48 AM|| 2005-03-01 1:48:48 AM|| Front Page Top

#11 JFM, did not know you're in weather jihad biz. ;-)

Posted by Sobiesky 2005-03-01 1:53:31 AM|| 2005-03-01 1:53:31 AM|| Front Page Top

#12 feel-good version of reality... like a Ward Cleaver ~~Churchill~~ moonbat on the Oregon coast somewhere

The real feel good version of reality would be if I were behind a nearby rock locking my sights on the moonbat game. ;-)

Posted by Sobiesky 2005-03-01 3:04:08 AM|| 2005-03-01 3:04:08 AM|| Front Page Top

#13 More on the Sheveluch eruption - According to seismic data, a large eruptive event began at 6:25 UTC on February 27 at Sheveluch volcano. From 11:30 UTC this day the seismic station SVL (8 km from the lava dome) was not working. At 11:40 UTC this day, an intensification of seismic signal was noted. The large seismic event was registered from 6:25 till 13:00 UTC on February 27. Ash deposits were noted at Klyuchi at 21:00 on February 27. A thickness of ash with snow was about 1 centimetre. Clouds obscured the volcano all time. According to satellite data from Russia (NOAA 16 at 16:56 UTC on February 27), a 45-pixel thermal anomaly was registered near the dome (band 3). Probably this anomaly connect with a large pyroclastic flow on the south-western flank of the volcano. An ash cloud of length about 45 km (28 mi) was noted in 13-16 km to the north-west from the volcano at this time (band 4-5)..

Posted by phil_b 2005-03-01 5:19:24 AM|| 2005-03-01 5:19:24 AM|| Front Page Top

#14 Somebody send in PETA and Greenpeace to save the animals! Please!

Posted by Charles 2005-03-01 7:17:47 AM|| 2005-03-01 7:17:47 AM|| Front Page Top

#15 "...European scientists confirm that Arctic high atmosphere is reaching the lowest ever temperatures this winter..."

What they mean (unfortunately the article is badly written) is the stratospheric temperature (5-10 miles up) is unusually low. This is favorable to low ozone levels in the stratosphere because it shows low mixing. The lowest ozone would be about the time of the spring equinox.

It really means very little at all from a climatic point of view or a weather point of view or even an environmental point of view. Yes the incoming uv radiation will be higher but since nobody actually takes a sunbath during March at 80 degrees north, it is irrelevent. By late march or early april, the circumpolar vortex breaks down and the core of cold air in the stratosphere mixes with the not-so-cold air of the vortex and the ozone hole goes away.

Posted by mhw 2005-03-01 8:36:03 AM|| 2005-03-01 8:36:03 AM|| Front Page Top

#16 It really means very little at all from a climatic point of view or a weather point of view or even an environmental point of view. I beg to differ. To say the planet is getting warmer or cooler for that matter requires that measurements are consistent with that claim. To arbitarily dismiss measurements that show a trend against your preferred outcome is many things, most of all it is not science. Has the stratosphere been arbitarily detached from the planet in order to satisfy the global warming agenda?

Posted by phil_b 2005-03-01 9:27:50 AM|| 2005-03-01 9:27:50 AM|| Front Page Top

#17 The ozone layer is located in the so called stratosphere, the lowest layer of the atmosphere

The Troposphere is the lowest layer of the "So Called" ATMOSPHERE.

Posted by Outide 2005-03-01 10:06:58 AM|| 2005-03-01 10:06:58 AM|| Front Page Top

#18 "It will either get much colder, approaching an ice age, or global warming will melt the polar caps. Either way, reduce all energy use, emissions, and send us grant money"

Posted by Frank G 2005-03-01 10:25:33 AM|| 2005-03-01 10:25:33 AM|| Front Page Top

#19 Phil_b
It matters little because the area measured is a small part of the earth and the period of low temperature is relatively short.

These measurements have not be made except in the last 10 years or so and thus the 'climatology' is not very extensive either.

This portion of the atmosphere has about 2% of the density as the atmosphere at the surface and the arctic is only 4% of the globe and the late winter is only 5% of the year.

Posted by mhw 2005-03-01 10:33:15 AM|| 2005-03-01 10:33:15 AM|| Front Page Top

#20 Where's Alaska Paul when we really need him!!!

Posted by Spemble Whaimp3886 2005-03-01 12:49:43 PM|| 2005-03-01 12:49:43 PM|| Front Page Top

#21 European scientists confirm that Arctic high atmosphere is reaching the lowest ever temperatures this winter, warning that destruction of the protective ozone layer is substantially increased under very cold conditions.

Funny, wasn't it supposed to be CFC's that caused the Ozone holes? NOW it's just cold conditions.

I don't think there's much UV coming down north of 80 degrees north, because I believe it's now the searson of eternal night: UV creates ozone, but the axis is tilted away from the sun, so little to no light gets there.

Posted by Ptah 2005-03-01 1:06:41 PM|| [http://www.crusaderwarcollege.org] 2005-03-01 1:06:41 PM|| Front Page Top

#22

Global Cooling?
Is there a problem?

Posted by W. Mammoth 2005-03-01 1:09:18 PM|| 2005-03-01 1:09:18 PM|| Front Page Top

#23 Is the surface temperature of the Arctic affected? Is there record cold at the surface? One of you RB experts has to know!

Posted by Remoteman 2005-03-01 1:33:03 PM|| 2005-03-01 1:33:03 PM|| Front Page Top

#24 It's colder than a fart in a dead Eskimo here in East Tennessee today. Snow, wind, really nasty. All in all though we've had a very mild winter.

Posted by Deacon Blues 2005-03-01 2:59:39 PM|| 2005-03-01 2:59:39 PM|| Front Page Top

#25 remoteman

from a paper

http://vast.nsstc.uah.edu/publications/AGU_book/agu_book.htm

many years ago,

"...An additional relationship that was observed with LinkWinds was a strong inverse correlation (correlation coefficient up to 0.93) between temperature anomalies in the lower troposphere and those in the lower stratosphere within the summer hemisphere. In contrast, the stratospheric and tropospheric anomalies in the winter hemisphere consistantly exhibit no correlation..."

Posted by mhw 2005-03-01 4:48:54 PM|| 2005-03-01 4:48:54 PM|| Front Page Top

#26 Sun's Temper Blamed for Arctic Ozone Loss

Posted by Sobiesky 2005-03-01 5:41:03 PM|| 2005-03-01 5:41:03 PM|| Front Page Top

#27 mhw, my point was that we are seeing real unprecedented climate related phenomena that are ignored becuase they do not fit the 'CO2 is the problem' agenda. The article is a good example, in that record atmospheric cold is used to support an agenda - the ozone hole - and its implications for climate change are ignored. Science has to explain all the data. As soon as you pick and choose what data you explain, it is no longer science, it is politics. Prior to the hijacking of the climate change debate by 'CO2 is the problem', a lot of the focus was on the effect of atmospheric dust as the primary driver of short to medium term climate change. I for one are convinced it (atmospheric dust) is the problem we should be concerned about and almost all the risks are on the cooling side. The Sheveluch eruption looks big. latest reports are of a dust cloud 500 kilometers long and tens of kilomters across. If it continues to erupt we will know within months if we in for a period of cooling.

Posted by phil_b 2005-03-01 5:44:10 PM|| 2005-03-01 5:44:10 PM|| Front Page Top

#28 phil - I have trouble with "unprecedented" - look back long enough and cycles are there

Posted by Frank G 2005-03-01 5:55:31 PM|| 2005-03-01 5:55:31 PM|| Front Page Top

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