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2006-12-26 Terror Networks

Reacquainting ourselves with the unthinkable

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Posted by .com 2006-12-26 03:43|| || Front Page|| [11128 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 I neither advocate this possible response nor condemn it. I just think it's essential we know what path we're on in this long war because, under the right conditions, nothing remains unthinkable.

Soon enough Barnett may find it necessary to make up his mind. Soon enough all of us will need to begin assessing just how badly we want our constitutional freedoms and how hard we're willing to fight for them. One thing Barnett is absolutely correct about is how a successful battle against present day Islam leaves out very few militaryalternatives, if any at all.

I'm halfway through his book: The Pentagon's New Map. In the image below, the dark blue areas represent what he calls "The Non-Integrating Gap". As distinguished from "The Functioning Core", this is how Barnett bases his assessment of world regions that will continue to present problems including global terrorism and tyranny in general.

Click here for a different and more detailed image of his map: (too big for page)

I'd welcome comments regarding his work. He is certainly able to articulate the issue and appears the have the military's ear. I have seen him be in turns both critical and supportive of Bush. Now that the holidays are over, I'll need to finish this interesting volume.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-12-26 04:57|| 2006-12-26 04:57|| Front Page Top

#2 "The Non-Integrating Gap". =

Dumb Fuck Zone
Lands of Low Comfort
Area of Dimwittery
Here Be Slime Eaters
Out-of-Warranty Land
Upazillas-of-Madness

Posted by Shipman 2006-12-26 08:18|| 2006-12-26 08:18|| Front Page Top

#3 Lol, Ship.

Posted by .com 2006-12-26 08:21|| 2006-12-26 08:21|| Front Page Top

#4 Wrechard did the game theory on this long ago....

Posted by Mark E. 2006-12-26 09:05|| 2006-12-26 09:05|| Front Page Top

#5 Lands ripe for conquest and colonization.

Posted by ed 2006-12-26 09:07|| 2006-12-26 09:07|| Front Page Top

#6 Zenster,

Very interesting book. Have you read Civilization and its Enemies: The Next Stage of History by Lee Harris? I recommend it. It presents a very interesting view on tribalism and what Harris calls the muzzy "Fantasy Ideology". Very interesting.

Posted by jds 2006-12-26 10:00|| 2006-12-26 10:00|| Front Page Top

#7 How many nukes would it take to totally erase this Taliban "mini-state"? I can think of no compelling reason not to do this, if it's technically feasible.

Posted by Jereting Elminemp7907 2006-12-26 10:51|| 2006-12-26 10:51|| Front Page Top

#8 Why stop at the "mini-state" when the "maxi-state" in Islamabad is the one building the nukes?

Posted by Excalibur 2006-12-26 10:58|| 2006-12-26 10:58|| Front Page Top

#9 Notice the areas? Almost 90% of the world's Muslim population is in there. Same goes with the drug lords and heroin/cocain producing areas.

Makes you wonder which is the cause and effect.

Posted by OldSpook 2006-12-26 10:58|| 2006-12-26 10:58|| Front Page Top

#10 While it would be worthwhile to radiate these tribal shitholes, why waste valuable bombs ? We know the real targets. Islamabad, Tehran, Riyadh, Cairo. You take these out, and the heart is cut out. The body will shrivel and die soon after. This should be made public knowledge by presidential declaration. Any further atrocities in Western world whatever is to be followed by immediate immolation of named capitals. No more need be said.

Posted by SpecOp35 2006-12-26 11:36|| 2006-12-26 11:36|| Front Page Top

#11 I can also recommend Benjamin Barber, Jihad vs. McWorld, published in 1996. He believes that McWorld will eventually win over jihad, and actually represents a greater threat to individual liberty than benighted tribalism:

Neither Jihad or McWorld promises a remotely democratic future. On the contrary, the consequences of the dialectical interaction between them suggest new and startling forms of inadvertent tyranny that range from an invisibly constraining consumerism to an all too palpable barbarism. The market's invisible hand is attached to a manipulative arm that, unguided by a sovereign head, is left to the contingencies of spontaneous greed. Tyranny here is indirect, often even friendly. Alexis de Tocqueville first captured its character 160 years ago when he wrote: "Fetters and headsmen were the coarse instuments that tyranny formerly employed; but the civilization of out age has perfected despotism itself."

However, in 1996, bin Laden wasn't on his radar. Barber was more concerned with Waco, Oklahoma City, and the militias than the WTC bombing and al Qaeda. He grossly underestimated the potential for violent Islamist jihad and misunderstood the nature of Islam ("[Islam] has displayed considerable tolerance for other religions."). He does understand that democracy is incompatible with Islam.

It's an interesting book, written about the time that bin Laden left the Sudan for Afghanistan.

Posted by KBK 2006-12-26 12:18|| 2006-12-26 12:18|| Front Page Top

#12 Have you read Civilization and its Enemies: The Next Stage of History by Lee Harris?

No, but I'm adding it to my reading list. Thank you, jds.

Notice the areas? Almost 90% of the world's Muslim population is in there.

Barnett is totally unapologetic about this direct assertion. He views lack of connectedness (i.e., uncensored newspapers or media but telecom and Internet especially) as a chief driver in both the despotism and non-integrating aspect of this region.

We know the real targets. Islamabad, Tehran, Riyadh, Cairo. You take these out, and the heart is cut out. The body will shrivel and die soon after. This should be made public knowledge by presidential declaration. Any further atrocities in Western world whatever is to be followed by immediate immolation of named capitals. No more need be said.

Can't argue with you in the least, SpecOp35. This is part of the Riot Act that must be read to Islam. Let the occupants of these capitals begin chasing down all of the psychotic murderers they have loosed upon this world lest they themselves be incinerated for the misdeeds of those they trained.

In a feat of monumental hubris and an act of prestidigitation worthy of a Houdini, Islam has somehow managed to make the West responsible for fighting terrorism. Their foisting of this obligation upon us has seen the weaponizing of our culture's finest traditions as Islam turns them against us.

We are under ZERO obligation to carefully winnow through the world's Muslim population in order to delicately isolate Islam's more virulent strains. That job belongs to Islam alone and the onus of that immediate task must rest on their shoulders and no one else's. So long as there are no substantial consequences for inaction, we will be greeted with Islam sheepishly shrugging off its responsibilities while falsely protesting its inability to reverse what it has itself knowingly started.

This bullshit must end. The ball must be placed squarely back in Islam's court. If it requires reassembling the entire Muslim diaspora back in their lands of origin so that they can sort things out on their own home turf, so be it. But sort it out they must and sort it our they will or face the consequences that you suggest, SpecOp35.

We are squandering the precious lives of our young soldiers and BILLIONS of dollars in what can only be at best a partially effective campaign to limit the swath of damage being done by Islamic terrorists. Screw this nonsense. Let Islam clean its own house or face severe consequences for sowing endless furrows with the hydra's teeth.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-12-26 13:37|| 2006-12-26 13:37|| Front Page Top

#13 Zenster,
I find the book is can be attacked on 2 levels:
1) It is too pessimistic about parts of the world - especially Central and South America, the Balkans, and Southern Africa. All of these areas are much better off than the Middle East.

2) It is too optimistic about China, which the book believes will integrate nicely into the global economic system. This is crucial, because, it the enemy is jihadi/criminal, you need fast lightly armed troops to hunt them down. If the enemy is a conventionally armed China, you need a heavily armed force that can take a punch and keep on fighting.

This is the crucial decision we have to make in organizing our forces.

Al

Posted by Frozen Al 2006-12-26 15:04|| 2006-12-26 15:04|| Front Page Top

#14 This swath of remote mountain ranges has never been effectively governed by distance Islamabad, or by distant Karachi, or by distant Delhi, or what have you. But a bunch of Arab hoodlums and Afghan rubes is able to waltz in and take over.

I think the answer is in the question, Fred. This swath of remote mountain ranges cannont be governed at a distance, no more than could the cantons of Switzerland, back when civilization was feudal and the Switzers were cowhide-wearing barbarian tribal types. But Mr. O. son of Laden and his Talibani and Al Qaeda henchmen aren't at a distance, they're smack dab in the middle marrying the local chieftains' daughters, nieces and aunts.

Posted by trailing wife 2006-12-26 16:08|| 2006-12-26 16:08|| Front Page Top

#15 That's something that really puzzles me. This swath of remote mountain ranges has never been effectively governed by distance Islamabad, or by distant Karachi, or by distant Delhi, or what have you. But a bunch of Arab hoodlums and Afghan rubes is able to waltz in and take over. Is there a reason for that? Or is the basic premise silly?

They're not governing it. They just brought the old Pathan game of raiding to a new high.

Posted by gromgoru 2006-12-26 17:03|| 2006-12-26 17:03|| Front Page Top

#16 I think, one day, counterterror by some relative of some victim of Islamic terror will exterminate these regions.

Posted by 3dc 2006-12-26 21:11|| 2006-12-26 21:11|| Front Page Top

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