Article

2022-07-17 Caucasus/Russia/Central Asia

The Red Army and two million raped German women?

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by badanov 2022-07-17 00:00|| || Front Page|| [11130 views ] Top

#1 oooopf

Posted by Rex Mundi 2022-07-17 00:28|| 2022-07-17 00:28|| Front Page Top

#2 RE-EXPOSED: A horrific story of Israeli rape and murder in 1949
href="hxxps://english.alarabiya.net/perspective/analysis/2015/08/17/RE-EXPOSED-A-horrific-story-of-Israeli-rape-and-murder-in-1949">hxxps://english.alarabiya.net/perspective/analysis/2015/08/17/RE-EXPOSED-A-horrific-story-of-Israeli-rape-and-murder-in-1949

You're warned on your antisemetic crap

Posted by Aca Joe 2022-07-17 00:29|| 2022-07-17 00:29|| Front Page Top

#3 ...There is an extraordinary book called The Bunker by James O'Donnell, about the last days of WWII in Berlin. O'Donnell touches on this subject briefly but powerfully.

Short version: It happened, and the postwar West German leadership did not discuss it.

For fear of pi$$ing off the Russians.

Mike

PS - I cannot recommend this book strongly enough. Superbly researched and reading like a novel. Probably the last word on the final days in the bunker.

Posted by Mike Kozlowski 2022-07-17 07:10|| 2022-07-17 07:10|| Front Page Top

#4 Mankind's known this lesson since they learnt to hit each other over the head. Don't want your people getting raped, don't lose.

I know it sounds insensitive an' all that in light of our great... civilization. But that is just a construct of convenience, like the social contract. Man is an animal, he lives for this shit. Give him a chance and off he'll go.

Which is why people need religion, a moral grounding, some baseline, some substratum of ethics. I suspect communism, other mechanistic or hate filled paradigms strip man of that capability?

Posted by Dron66046 2022-07-17 09:07|| 2022-07-17 09:07|| Front Page Top

#5 That being said, moslems are the most rapey bastitches on earth. So by religion I mean only the Bible.

Posted by Dron66046 2022-07-17 09:15|| 2022-07-17 09:15|| Front Page Top

#6 Pretty ballsy of Russian troops to commit rape, defying a Jan 1945 Order by Stalin that mentioned rape and the likely consequences for those actions by Soviet soldiers.

Posted by badanov 2022-07-17 09:52|| 2022-07-17 09:52|| Front Page Top

#7 We had this inter-agency op, badanov, summer of 2001. Kashmir. Just cleaning up leftover paki insurgents who had hidden within India after the Kargil. Paramilitary, local police, special forces all working under the army operations directorate, to flush them out, hunt them down. Because the Moslems liked to hide them in their homes, lie about them being family, the police boys tended to get a little... creative sometimes. It was only threats and a bit of hassling their girlies mind you. But tolerate that sort of thing once, let it pass and soon you have others taking worse liberties. I'll admit it was bad leadership on the part of the army commanders. The religious and cultural animosity being what it is, there soon occurred some incidents of molestation and one of rape.

In just under a day, the enemy, fuelled with rhetoric from Islamabad to London, had painted the entire Indian army as psycho rapists bashing in doors with their sausages and raping everything that moved. For years, that narrative built up, salted and peppered with masala by Kashmiri Ahed Tamimi types claiming they were all violated by unnamed armymen who 'came in the night' and rappity rape raped them.

So that's narratives.

Posted by Dron66046 2022-07-17 10:17|| 2022-07-17 10:17|| Front Page Top

#8 Don't want your people getting raped, don't lose.

Also beaten up, pillaged, and plundered. Might not happen, but bullying is contagious, especially when far from normal circumstances among the home folks.

On the other hand, the horror stories about what UN troops do to the communities they are there to help — being staffed as they are primarily by rented units from Third World countries, have been discussed here regularly over the years. So being conquered is clearly not the prime requisite for the risk of such treatment.

Posted by trailing wife 2022-07-17 14:56|| 2022-07-17 14:56|| Front Page Top

#9 Many people never find out they are the type to kick a dog while it's down until they actually do it.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-07-17 14:59|| 2022-07-17 14:59|| Front Page Top

#10 Given what the Whermacht much less the SS did in the Soviet Union payback is a bitch. I'm pretty sure Zuckov let it be known the troops would be let off the leash.

Posted by Cheaderhead 2022-07-17 15:03|| 2022-07-17 15:03|| Front Page Top

#11 The rules of war in the east went out the window the moment the German Army was ordered to kill political instructors on sight, starting in July, 1941.

Posted by badanov 2022-07-17 15:41|| 2022-07-17 15:41|| Front Page Top

#12 I am in a shooting war, my mates are dying. Before I go I would just like one more POA.

Posted by Clererong Smiter of the Welsh7874 2022-07-17 15:50|| 2022-07-17 15:50|| Front Page Top

#13 It's worth noting that the actual Nazis hated communists. A lot.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-07-17 15:56|| 2022-07-17 15:56|| Front Page Top

#14
#10 Given what the Whermacht much less the SS did in the Soviet Union payback is a bitch. I'm pretty sure Zuckov let it be known the troops would be let off the leash.
Posted by: Cheaderhead 2022-07-17 15:03

...Indeed. Zukhov's orders were that anyone seen violating that regulation would be punished.

'Seen'.

Even the simplest Ivan understood that you don't do that in from of the old man. Berlin was worst of all, in that the officers were too busy trying to stay alive themselves (it is telling that to this day, the Russians still have not released accurate figures on their losses there) and in a major city, larger than anything 99.9% of the Russians had ever seen, where there were simply so many places to do it and get away with it. O'Donnell mentions one large park in central Berlin that women were taken to en masse, and things were so grim there that even the SMERSH enforcer units didn't dare go in there.

Mike

Posted by Mike Kozlowski 2022-07-17 16:44|| 2022-07-17 16:44|| Front Page Top

#15 (it is telling that to this day, the Russians still have not released accurate figures on their losses there)

More telling is the locations of which units during the war came from German sources. Germann sources in some cases have Russian units thousands of miles from where the Russians say they were. This may be due to sheer mendacity, or even worse, sheer stupidity, on the Russian part.

O'Donnell mentions one large park in central Berlin that women were taken to en masse, and things were so grim there that even the SMERSH enforcer units didn't dare go in there.

You'll never convince me of that. SMERSH units were the most feared since NKVD catchment units of 1941-1942. They reported directly to front headquarters, the last coms node before the Russian general staff.

If you read Russian treatment of this time, they admit there were rapes committed by Soviet solders, but they rather convincingly add that the sources of the stories of mass rapes began with Goebbels. They also added that rapes were not committed by front line troops, the shooters, but by rear echelon troops, probably because they has resources to aid civilian German populations. Whether this was forcible rape or drop to your knees in exchange for bread is a subject of speculation.

Even Harrison Salisbury wrote that the troops which were dodging bullets and those which followed on were different in deportment and behavior, which lends credence to the Russian protestations that mass rapes were a myth.

Posted by badanov 2022-07-17 17:18|| 2022-07-17 17:18|| Front Page Top

#16

Next morning: "Well, really, Ward Cleaver!
I know you're a fervent believer,
And think he's alright,
But that Russian last night
Was a little bit rough on the Beevor!"

Posted by Count Galeazzo the Weasel4987 2022-07-17 18:44|| 2022-07-17 18:44|| Front Page Top