Article

2011-04-04 Afghanistan

UN Blames Florida Pastor for Violence in Mazar-e-Sharif

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Fred 2011-04-04 00:00|| || Front Page|| [3 views ] Top

#1 Americans have too many freedoms! Just ask Mohammed.

Posted by Ulimp Lover of the Jutes7874 2011-04-04 00:31|| 2011-04-04 00:31|| Front Page Top

#2 "I have just released a statement on behalf of Nato and Isaf forces in Afghanistan. In that statement we condemn the action of individual in the United States who burnt a holy Koran, That action was hateful, it was intolerant and it was extremely disrespectful. And again we condemn it in the strongest manner possible," General Petraeus told TOLOnews on Sunday. Mr Petraeus urged the Afghans to demonstrate calm and do the opposite of what the pastor in the United States has done.

Urged Afghans to "demonstrate calm"....stopping just short of urging them to refrain from killing one another and UN personnel, which of course a lesser concern than that of Koranm burning, which is much, much, much, more serious than constitutionally protected US flag burning.

Yesterday, the Afghan Police loyal to President Karzai rolled through a nearby city informing everyone via loudspeakers mounted on their Ford Rangers that "rioters would be immediately shot!" (meaning shot or arrested and disappeared within 48 hours) Sort of put a damper on demonstractions in this sector.

Posted by Besoeker 2011-04-04 01:01|| 2011-04-04 01:01|| Front Page Top

#3 Listening to Petraeus' message one could get the impression that he views Jones, an American residing in the US, as an enemy because he exercised his constitutional rights.

Is there any reason why Jones' constitutional rights and freedoms should not be fully protected by the US gov?

Hopefully this won't be seen as a green light for attacks on Jones and/or his congregation by islamofascists inclined to resort to such a response.

BTW, has Petraeus ever condemned the hateful and murderous intolerance of the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan "in the strongest manner possible?"

Posted by Cluns Unavirong6767 2011-04-04 01:19|| 2011-04-04 01:19|| Front Page Top

#4 Yesterday, the Afghan Police loyal to President Karzai rolled through a nearby city

Thank you for reporting for the area, Besoeker. Stay safe and have fun!

Posted by trailing wife 2011-04-04 03:24|| 2011-04-04 03:24|| Front Page Top

#5 Hopefully this won't be seen as a green light for attacks on Jones and/or his congregation by islamofascists inclined to resort to such a response.

Apparently there is a death fatwa with a (if I recall correctly) US$2.5 million reward on his head, Cluns Unavirong6767. He has a small police guard as a result.

Posted by trailing wife 2011-04-04 03:34|| 2011-04-04 03:34|| Front Page Top

#6 So, who to believe; the UN (ptui), Karzai's brother, or Petraeus.

I believe none of the above.

I DO believe that Afghanistan is the cesspool of 'nations' and should be left to 'work it out among themselves'.

Posted by Whiskey Mike 2011-04-04 04:19|| 2011-04-04 04:19|| Front Page Top

#7 Whiskey Mike probably represents a lot of Americans now.

This latest atrocity will probably drive the poll numbers of the 'time to leave Afghanistan' opinion into the 60s.

Posted by Lord Garth 2011-04-04 06:16|| 2011-04-04 06:16|| Front Page Top

#8 A Death Fatwa is a given, but I'm concerned about the tone of the statements by Western military and political leaders (Petraeus, the NATO ambassador, Reid & Graham.)

One could get the impression that they're declaring Jones an 'enemy' and that attacks on him would not lead to a serious punitive reaction by the US as he is 'fair game.'

All of this is done with a 'Wink and Nod' and plausible deniability, of course. Hopefully these leaders don't actually mean to convey this message but they might be misunderstood.

Words mean something, "strongest possible manner" means something.

When leaders in certain islamofascistic hellholes speak about their subjects in this manner said subjects are marked for death.

Posted by Cluns Unavirong6767 2011-04-04 06:24|| 2011-04-04 06:24|| Front Page Top

#9 But, see - they're not barbarians because it's not just any old religion Pastor Jones offended. Those are Allen's words, dictated to Moe in arabic, not written years after Moe's passing and translated from some dead language and then changed again into King James, RSV, New Life, New Hope, New Dope, etc.

It's the only religion. Just like all the others. Why would an all-powerful God present himself in only one form?

Posted by Bobby 2011-04-04 06:36|| 2011-04-04 06:36|| Front Page Top

#10 Lord Garth, Whiskey Mike's sentiments represent mine. I think Afghanistan is a waste of blood and treasure for us.

Does someone out there think that our mission in Afghanistan will succeed and is worth the tremendous effort? If so, please speak up or post a link.

Posted by Penguin 2011-04-04 08:45|| 2011-04-04 08:45|| Front Page Top

#11 I think it's hilarious that Pastor Jones is next planning to put Mohammed on trial for all sorts of crimes.

The interesting part will be the sentencing. Personally, I think that Jones should wax poetic:

"In the name of the peoples with one God, who follow the covenant with Adam, Mohammed is condemned to Hell. And in the name of the peoples with one God, who follow the covenant with Noah, Mohammed is condemned to Hell. And in the name of the peoples with one God, who follow the covenant with Abraham, Mohammed is condemned to Hell.

"Let all who kneel in Sajdah and pray to God know that because of Mohammed, their prayers instead go to Hell and the mouth of the unclean one. Let them know that because of this, the Muslim is cursed to live a life of misery, poverty, failure, and despair, because they do not worship God, but evil and death.

"That all those who worship God, and even the atheist, may trod on the backs of the Muslim who follows Mohammed, because their prayers are not heard in Heaven. That even the unclean beast is more beloved in Heaven than the Muslim who follows Mohammed.

"As evidence of this, the Muslim that takes up arms will always fail, and remain in the pit of despair and damnation. But the Muslim who forgets Mohammed, and prays only to God, living in peace with all mankind, enjoys the blessing of heaven and prospers.

"Yet for diverting the belief in God of Muslims from Heaven to Hell, Mohammed lives in the arms of Satan, forever damned and in agony, despised of God, in darkness. And once again his sentence is affirmed by men.

"Those that protest this sentence, and commit further acts of violence and hate, let them know that they do not worship God, but instead worship the damned Mohammed, death and Satan in Hell, where they seek to cast their own souls."

Posted by Anonymoose 2011-04-04 09:49|| 2011-04-04 09:49|| Front Page Top

#12 Mr Staffan De Mistura blamed the violence on the Florida pastor, describing the burning of the holy Koran as "insane and totally deprecable gesture by one person".

B.S.

Unless we are going to get serious about the war in Afghanistan, we should get out. Getting serious to me means something like Sherman's march to the sea or the campaign through the Pacific islands or Truman's decision to use the bomb during WWII.

Posted by JohnQC 2011-04-04 09:49|| 2011-04-04 09:49|| Front Page Top

#13 So (to borrow from a comment in a different thread) acording to the U.N. we should Nuke Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Iran, etc...

After all they burn probably hundreds of confiscated bibles every day.

Posted by CrazyFool 2011-04-04 09:52|| 2011-04-04 09:52|| Front Page Top

#14 Just a bit of background info:

Mazar-e-Sharif is a Pashtun enclave in Tajik/Uzbek territory. It was also a Taliban stronghold before the 2001 campaign. I am sure the Taliban were involved in the riots and yes, I am sure the burning was just an excuse for the riots.

Al

Posted by Frozen Al 2011-04-04 11:16|| 2011-04-04 11:16|| Front Page Top

#15 The burning story almost got no play in the press. It was stupid ass Karzai that decided to make a stink of it - inflamed the nutters to kill all those people over it.

Posted by newc 2011-04-04 11:20|| 2011-04-04 11:20|| Front Page Top

#16 Mazar-e-Sharif is a Pashtun enclave in Tajik/Uzbek territory.

I did wonder if this is a Pashtun or Afghan phenomenon, Frozen Al. Could that be why the Swedish and German bases were left strictly alone, or is that because they might actually defend themselves? Ordering Ghurka guards not to shoot the attackers, forsooth! I hope they take a firm position on that, going forward.

Posted by trailing wife 2011-04-04 13:20|| 2011-04-04 13:20|| Front Page Top

#17 How dispiriting to see, once again, the footage of theocratic rage in Kandahar and Mazar-i-Sharif. The same old dreary formula: self-righteous frenzy married to a neurotic need to take offense; the easy resort to indiscriminate violence and cruelty; the promulgation of makeshift fatwas by mullahs on the make; those writhing mustaches framing crude slogans of piety and hatred, and yelling for death as if on first-name terms with the Almighty. The spilling of blood and the spoliation of propertyall for nothing, and ostensibly "provoked" by the corny, brainless antics of a devout American nonentity, notice of whose mere existence is beneath the dignity of any thinking person.

From Christopher Hitchens @ Slate.com

Posted by regular joe 2011-04-04 13:22|| 2011-04-04 13:22|| Front Page Top

#18 Of course the UN does. It's a feeble superfluous organisation that folds at the first sign of bullying.

The people to blame? That's the people who killed, not the person they said inspired them. If we're going to be consistent why isn't their normal actions always blamed on the Koran Hate-manual, as they themselves say they are following his words?

Posted by Bright Pebbles 2011-04-04 13:27|| 2011-04-04 13:27|| Front Page Top

#19
Very disappointing comment from Petraeus. Very disappointing.

Posted by Hellfish 2011-04-04 13:44|| 2011-04-04 13:44|| Front Page Top

#20 I do not believe Petraeus has gone native on us. He's just playing to mob that surrounds him. I would have preferred the old line "this is not helpful" but these nuts don't get subtlety.

Posted by regular joe 2011-04-04 14:29|| 2011-04-04 14:29|| Front Page Top

#21 The problem is that 'going native' is the official policy in Afghanistan sanctioned by the military and political elites in pretty much all western nations.

COIN implies that western troops and western nations in Afghanistan have entered a contest where the competitor is the Taliban the judge is the native population and the prize is the native population's goodwill.

We, the West are literally submitting, ourselves to the judgment of the Afghan people. Thus we are in effect accepting their dominance.

The problem is that by and large the Afghans are adherents of a political ideology that is hostile to western values, and also aggressive and expansionist. They want Danegeld (reconstruction aid) and ideological submission in the West.

The military is in a conundrum. So far they've resorted to telling polite lies to the Afghans. But these lies are exposed by the likes of Jones, Wilders, South Park etc.

To make COIN if Afghanistan succeed the West must submit to Sharia in earnest, and that implies that COIN if Afghanistan is a certain failure.

All of this started well before Obama (see this for example), IMO the rot set in when "Infinite Justice" was turned into "Enduring Freedom."

Bush clung to a post-modern pacifistic worldview when confronted with an act of total war. That didn't make him a bad person, but it was dangerously naive.

Posted by Cluns Unavirong6767 2011-04-04 15:55|| 2011-04-04 15:55|| Front Page Top

#22 I think Petraeus sees the writing on the wall. He is on his way out and he is trying to make it easier for his boys and girls on the ground to ride things out until they are pulled out.

Posted by DarthVader 2011-04-04 18:53|| 2011-04-04 18:53|| Front Page Top

00:02 JosephMendiola
23:55 retired LEO
23:51 JosephMendiola
23:49 remoteman
23:47 SteveS
23:37 JosephMendiola
23:30 JosephMendiola
23:03 Clomoth de Medici9631
22:50 Clomoth de Medici9631
22:46 CincinnatusChili
22:31 Fi
22:24 CrazyFool
22:20 trailing wife
22:13 trailing wife
22:11 trailing wife
22:05 trailing wife
21:48 trailing wife
21:45 OldSpook
21:40 AzCat
21:33 AzCat
21:30 trailing wife
21:01 Cluns Unavirong6767
20:57 JosephMendiola
20:54 Procopius2k