Article

2006-09-27 Home Front: Culture Wars

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Steve White 2006-09-27 00:00|| || Front Page|| [3 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 "... 300-foot zone "is large enough that it would restrict communications intended for the general public on a matter completely unrelated to the funeral as well as messages targeted at funeral participants," Caldwell wrote in a ruling issued in Frankfort."

A military person goes half-way around the world to die for freedom and we can't mandate a football field worth of quiet for the family as the space might inconvenience nitwits who are using the burial as venue for their jackassery.

We don't need an ordanance, we need vigilantees with clubs.

Posted by Super Hose 2006-09-27 00:13|| 2006-09-27 00:13|| Front Page Top

#2 Google sez she is a Bush appointee (2001).

Posted by USN,Ret 2006-09-27 00:32|| 2006-09-27 00:32|| Front Page Top

#3 Everyone is fed up with this asshole. It's going to get ugly if this group is allowed to continue.

Posted by Captain America 2006-09-27 03:27|| 2006-09-27 03:27|| Front Page Top

#4 They're not vigilantes with clubs, but the Patriot Guard Riders seem to be doing a fine job.

Posted by exJAG 2006-09-27 04:41|| 2006-09-27 04:41|| Front Page Top

#5 Nothing that a few sessions of energetic parking lot therapy can't cure. This is the scumbag crew of that twisted phreak, Fred Phelps. May they all fester and rot in their own eternal Christian hell. I wish the topside photo had a nice red laser dot between this sick fuck's eyes, just like I want for all the psycho imams.

If fundamentalist Christianity ever wonders why they have such a hard time gaining acceptance with secular America, look no further than Fred Phelps. I hope he is found dead of a heart attack in the arms of his AIDS infected underage homosexual transvestite prostitute lover.

If I haven't made myself clear enough, let me go on to say ... waaaaahgh!

[big hook emerges and yanks Zenster off soap box]

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 05:35|| 2006-09-27 05:35|| Front Page Top

#6 I suspect there'd be jury nullification of any charge not involving death.

Posted by Nimble Spemble 2006-09-27 06:32|| 2006-09-27 06:32|| Front Page Top

#7 If fundamentalist Christianity ever wonders why they have such a hard time gaining acceptance with secular America, look no further than Fred Phelps.

Well, not to be picky, but Fred Phelps doesn't represent Fundamental Christianity any more than OJ represents the NFL Hall of Fame.

Fundamental Christian just means a Christian who believes in the fundamentals of the faith as non-negotiable, believes in the authority of scripture, and governs their life accordingly. While the scripture does condemn homosexuality as an abomination in several places, it never says a Christian should be the one doing the condemning. That's God's arena, not man's.

A Christian's reaction to what the Bible considers sin should be the same reaction as Christ's. His message was one of forgiveness and reconciliation with God. He spared his harshest criticisms and condemnations for the religious leaders of his day, who were too busy condemning other people to see their own spiritual needs.

As a Christian who believes in the fundamentals of scripture, and as a Baptist, I can tell you this guy does not reflect the thinking of Baptists in any way shape or form. 1 Jn. 4:8 says 'He who does not love does not know God, because God is love.'I sense no love for man in Mr. Phelps.

As to secular America's reaction to Christianity, the secular world has always been hostile to the true teachings of scripture. The Bible calls evil what it is, and the vast majority react to that with hostility --- and understandably so. This should in no way change the message. Christ never wavered in his message of truth, and what was the world's ultimate reaction to that? (I seem to remember something about a cross) The list of people who have been persecuted, imprisoned, mutilated, burned, etc. for their unwavering faith is too long to write.

The person who wishes to live a Biblical Christian life should expect hostility from some, but in no way should he seek confrontation in order to bring it out. Speaking the truth in love will do that just fine.

Does this guy hurt the cause of Christ? Of course he does. But, there are nutjobs in every religion. Paul said it as "there are some who trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ".

Posted by mcsegeek1 2006-09-27 09:06|| 2006-09-27 09:06|| Front Page Top

#8 Yes, but then again aren't such bans on demonstrations at abortion clinics long on the books and upheld?

The whole friggin 'justice system' is a cluster of individual princes deciding what they feel like today with inconsistancy between various federal districts and regions. It certainly brings credibility to the system doesn't it.

Posted by Glerong Unock6380 2006-09-27 09:23|| 2006-09-27 09:23|| Front Page Top

#9 #8 Yes, but then again aren't such bans on demonstrations at abortion clinics long on the books and upheld?

Indeed! Protesting a life snuffed prior to birth is totally unacceptable. Protesting a life sacrificed for the cause of freedom.... march ON PROTESTORS! It is your "choice" your right under the lst Amendment... say the law givers and judges.

Posted by Besoeker 2006-09-27 09:29|| 2006-09-27 09:29|| Front Page Top

#10 I'm all for this.

It makes the chance of something truely unplesant happening to these assholes all that much more likely!

Posted by DarthVader">DarthVader 2006-09-27 09:50|| 2006-09-27 09:50|| Front Page Top

#11 Well, not to be picky, but Fred Phelps doesn't represent Fundamental Christianity any more than OJ represents the NFL Hall of Fame.

I appreciate your well-thought-out response, mcsegeek1, and have little, if any, argument with what you say.

Nonetheless, I'm sure that we can still agree how OJ probably inspired a whole new generation of racist bigots. In a similar fashion to Islam, Christianity has allowed itself to be hijacked by the likes of Swaggert, Falwell, Bakker, Robertson and so many other high-profile hucksters. I'd be just as happy to see large street demonstrations by Christians against how their faith has been perverted by these money grubbing televangelists. Thank goodness the peaceful nature of Christianity makes this nowhere near the critical issue it is for Islam.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 15:06|| 2006-09-27 15:06|| Front Page Top

#12 Thanks Zen. The voices against the two-bit pseudo-christian con artists are out there, believe me. They just get drowned out by the MSM's glee over the sins of others, and the popular culture's built-in hostility toward anything dealing with Christ.

Also, I don't think I'd characterize these hucksters efforts as a 'hijacking', because that would imply they have control of Christianity's direction, which they do not. For every Swaggart, Hinn, Bakker and Robertson, there are thousands of good, decent, humble and upright men who do the real work of their faith, and have far more influence on real Christianity that these wolves in sheeps clothing ever did. They are the lunatic fringe, just like Phelps. Every family has that one relative who's a complete ass. Christianity perhaps has more than it's share.

Posted by mcsegeek1 2006-09-27 15:20|| 2006-09-27 15:20|| Front Page Top

#13 Yes, but then again aren't such bans on demonstrations at abortion clinics long on the books and upheld?

There are no "bans", this isn't the Nazi nation you make it out to be. There is a "bubble" law preventing protestors from approaching nearer than between eight and one hundred feet, depending upon circumstances. Ill give you an example.

Every Saturday, there are protesters outside of the Planned Parenthood clinic in my neighborhood. They are there because Saturdays are when the abortions are performed, so that the many women who must work for a living can have the operation safely performed and return to their job on Monday.

Please try to remember that around TEN PERCENT of Planned Parenthood's budget goes towards providing abortions. The other NINETY PERCENT goes towards providing low-cost women's reproductive health services to those who can least afford them. We're talking about breast examinations, Pap smears, treatment of venereal disease and a host of other important diagnoses that can save a woman's life while helping to prevent sometimes fatal conditions and often painful and unnecessary death.

Do these protestors care? Quite simply, no.

THEY SIT OUTSIDE OF THE CLINIC WITH HUGE 4'x4' FULL COLOR PHOTOGRAPHIC PLACCARDS SHOWING PARTIAL BIRTH ABORTIONS. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TINY TWISTED BLOODY BODIES AND CAVED IN HEADS OF NEAR-TERM FETUSES.

This is the absolute most repugnant of all types of abortions and there are few, if ANY, doctors who will perform one if the mother's life is not mortally endangered by the prospective birth.

Does this prevent these demonstrators from displaying their damned filth every Saturday when people are walking their children to the library? Does it stop these protestors from yelling, "DON'T KILL ME MOMMY!" to women entering the clinic? It does not, so don't piss and moan to me about the bubble law.

Big clue, there isn't a single woman who wakes up in the morning and says to herself, "I think I'll go out and get pregnant so I can HAVE AN ABORTION!" It is usually an agonizing choice and one fraught with psychological complications a lot of people wouldn't like to live with at all. It often is the one sole alternative to becoming a single mother and destroying any possibility of a woman's financial independence or sustained career.

Do I like abortion? No. I think it is the single worst form of contraception there is short of a wire coat hanger. Should it be outlawed? Not until women have completely equal socioeconomic status in our culture. Something that the glass ceiling puts a total lie to. Women are still consistently underpaid and overlooked for career promotion in today's society.

When women have that equal socioeconomic status, then watch out. There will have to be some major revisions regarding a sorely overlooked portion of civil law dealing with paternal rights. Eventually, a man should also have some sort of say in whether his offspring is aborted. The one technological advance that should put an end to all of this debate is the invention of an artificial womb. If government thinks that they can be so intrusive into a persons individual life as to insist that a fetus be brought to full term, then they had best provide the means to do so if a woman is not of sufficient physical, financial or mental health to carry that pregnancy to full term. Until these issues have been resolved, we need government to stay the hell out of our lives.

When I see those clinic demonstrators volunteering down at the orphanage or helping over at the homeless family shelter (where I have volunteered as a chef), theyll have a lot more credibility in my eyes. Even if they demonstrated the conviction to picket the clinic a full six days each week during the hours when it is open, that would carry more weight with me. But showing up for a few hours on one day a week to specifically torture the women who often have little, if any, choice about what theyre having to do cuts ZERO ice with me.

As to the actual topic of this thread, Ill go with Darth Vader.

I'm all for this.

It makes the chance of something truely unplesant happening to these assholes all that much more likely!

A little parking lot therapy will go a long way with cowardly assholes like Phelps gang of Bible thumping thugs.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 16:01|| 2006-09-27 16:01|| Front Page Top

#14 Good point, Zenster. And in that logic, I'm sure you will soon be taking to the streets to condemn the men in this world who abuse women, sexually harrass them and exploit them. IIRC something like on rape happens every sixty seconds or something like that. Being a man - clearly you want to organize something to disassociate yourself from that - right?

Posted by anon 2006-09-27 16:01|| 2006-09-27 16:01|| Front Page Top

#15 What is your point, anon? Are you merely baiting or do you actually have something to say? Feel free to clarify.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 17:35|| 2006-09-27 17:35|| Front Page Top

#16 I still think Fred Phelps and his crew should have some non-fatal accidents - such as having their kneecaps moved to their hips by white ash axehandles. "I know nothing, nothing!"

Posted by Old Patriot">Old Patriot 2006-09-27 17:42|| http://oldpatriot.blogspot.com/]">[http://oldpatriot.blogspot.com/] 2006-09-27 17:42|| Front Page Top

#17 For every Swaggart, Hinn, Bakker and Robertson, there are thousands of good, decent, humble and upright men who do the real work of their faith, and have far more influence on real Christianity that these wolves in sheeps clothing ever did.

mcsegeek1, I sincerely hope and actually do believe that you are right. Please know that I, personally, do not view Falwell et al as true representatives of Christianity. Sadly, much of America's television-watching population is less able to clearly discern the distinctions you rightfully make. While the media largely is to blame, I wish that more Christians would vociferously denouce these ungenerous televangelist maggots.

Legend has it that Billy Graham gathered together Falwell, Swaggert, Bakker and other major televangelists in a meeting where he addressed them about ethical fundraising on television. Graham's words reportedly were met with hysterical laughter.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 17:45|| 2006-09-27 17:45|| Front Page Top

#18 But showing up for a few hours on one day a week to specifically torture the women who often have little, if any, choice about what theyre having to do cuts ZERO ice with me.

Sorry, but they had more than a little choice. They could have remained celebate, or determined only to have sexual relations with men that were worthy of becoming fathers. Once they ignored those available choices, there's still reason aplenty not to throw away an unborn.

Posted by Crusader 2006-09-27 19:57|| 2006-09-27 19:57|| Front Page Top

#19 Can't wait until he croaks. I may show up at his funeral with a "God hates dead assholes!" sign...

Posted by tu3031 2006-09-27 20:07|| 2006-09-27 20:07|| Front Page Top

#20 Zen - the above was a load of crap. You can do better

Posted by Frank G 2006-09-27 20:49|| 2006-09-27 20:49|| Front Page Top

#21 Please elucidate, Frank.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 21:09|| 2006-09-27 21:09|| Front Page Top

#22 Personally, getting back to the point at hand, I think a 300' zone is reasonable. Good grief, how many cemetaries are out there that are smaller than 300'? Not many, I'd guess (except in the wilds of the west and maybe the south). My point being, these so-called Christian freaks (Phelps et al) could STILL BE INSIDE THE CEMETARY and not be closer than 300'. And, if there's a crew of them, 300' isn't probably enough distance to drown out their "hate speech." Personally, I somewhat agree with Phelps' theory (on God's hand of protection on this nation), but you will NEVER find me spewing crap like he does, and I consider myself a Fundamentalist Baptist too.

What he doesn't get (Phelps) is the irony of "protesting" men and women who die to protect this nation (many whom are Christians themselves, and "doing God's work" in defending this nation) and most of whom probably agree with his stance on homosexuality. If he truly thinks the gays are the reason we got struck on 9/11, shouldn't he protest those pushing the gay agenda? Protesting the soldiers who die so that he can spew his hate is absolutely bass-ackwards. Much like the liberal far-left (the gay-agenda pushers, the extreme secular humanists, etc.), he doesn't get that if he TRULY got his way, and Islam came to power here, he/they'd be the first to be "silenced," if you get my drift.

Posted by BA 2006-09-27 21:31|| 2006-09-27 21:31|| Front Page Top

#23 Sorry, but they had more than a little choice. They could have remained celebate, or determined only to have sexual relations with men that were worthy of becoming fathers.

Crusader, in an ideal world, such would be the case. Currently, there is a lot of resistance to decent sex education in our schools. Due to that, few teenagers have the least idea about how to maintain a responsible relationship. Couple that with the low-emphasis that so much of modern movie and television media places upon moral behavior and it's a wonder that we've been able to reduce teen pregnancy rates at all.

From what I've been able to gather, very few modern parents take the time to sit their children down and explain the workings of rational philosophy and how it applies to daily life. This, pretty much, cripples any sort of prudent decision-making capacity right there. Expecting young kids to evaluate their dates in terms of marriageable prospects requires a depth of consideration that simply isn't being taught nearly often enough at home or in the schools.

Furthermore, I've yet to see many parents who convey their love for children in straight-forward and well-thought-out terms. Too often it is merely vague touchy-feely crap or just going through the motions and most kids can sniff out that sort of perfunctory bullshit in an instant. Confronted with a lack of genuine love at home they will find it somewhere. Often in the arms of a boyfriend or girlfriend.

When America begins to provide its children with honest love and affection, coupled with truly useful education that includes critical analysis and some concept of morals and ethics, we'll see some changes. So long as kids continue to be fed garbage like; "You can't know anything for sure", "Everything is just shades of gray" and "Truth is relative" along with all that other moral relevatism bullshit, don't expect too much to change.

That same sort of empty-headed crap will be carried forward into relationships and manifest as high divorce rates, broken homes, unwanted pregnancies, abortion and unwanted children. Just ask yourself where all of the young gang members come from.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 21:35|| 2006-09-27 21:35|| Front Page Top

#24 he's an attention whore. He stands for nothing. He's plain crazy too. I'm tired of every crazy, wacked-out, nut-job, psychotic getting the headline news. In fact I'm getting really sick of it. The more completely f*&^ed up you are the more attention you get. I'm not a prude. I have no problem with people having fun, making some mistakes and living life. But I'm getting really, really, really, sick of the 24/7, 365 days a year, year after year, dysfunction that is being shoved down our throats by the media culture. I'm not sure exactly when it changed from a celebration of dysfuntion into a worship of it.

It's like watching someone puke. It's fascinating and you feel compelled to watch, but not something you want to have to endure day after day.

Posted by anon 2006-09-27 21:44|| 2006-09-27 21:44|| Front Page Top

#25 If he truly thinks the gays are the reason we got struck on 9/11, shouldn't he protest those pushing the gay agenda?

Because a lot of gays wouldn't think twice about stomping the living shit out of these bilious microencephalitic fuckwads. Cowards like these always go after the soft targets, you know, like grieving widows and families.

Much like the liberal far-left (the gay-agenda pushers, the extreme secular humanists, etc.), he doesn't get that if he TRULY got his way, and Islam came to power here, he/they'd be the first to be "silenced," if you get my drift.

Yup. I've had to convince multi-cultural type gay people that Islam will kill them first. I liken this to the Neo-Nazi skinheads who adore Hitler, not even realizing that real Nazis would shove inbred morons like them into the cattle cars ahead of the Jews.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 21:44|| 2006-09-27 21:44|| Front Page Top

#26 Billious Microencephalitic ?

Zenster.....did he have a brother named Leonard living near Americus by chance?

Posted by Besoeker 2006-09-27 21:48|| 2006-09-27 21:48|| Front Page Top

#27 I'm not sure exactly when it changed from a celebration of dysfuntion into a worship of it.

I'll give you a hint. Look at when television media was reoriented over to lowest common denominator programming. Shows like "All in the Family" that glorified bigotry. Soap operas with their titillating and completely amoral plot lines. Thinly disguised softcore pornography like "Baywatch", once rated as the world's most popular television show. "Squeal of Fortune" with its exalted air-head bimbo. "Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous" with its glorification of conspicuous consumption and wretched excess. Movies like "Forrest Gump" that elevate stupidity into the realm of worthiness. All of the slasher movies that promote victimization of women. The current crop of "reality shows" that have nothing to do with reality. "Idol" shows that rely on a thin veneer of talent to drive a hugely profitable pay-per-call telephone voting system.

Need I go on? The day television network broadcasters stopped selling their content to us, the viewers, and began marketing us viewers to their advertisers was the day that the dumbing down of America officially began.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 22:03|| 2006-09-27 22:03|| Front Page Top

#28 Zen - the above was a load of crap. You can do better

And you can do lots better than some sort of cheapass drive-by sideswipe, Frank. Spit it out, what's your beef?

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 22:58|| 2006-09-27 22:58|| Front Page Top

#29 Methinks Frank is hitting at your abortion rant in #13. Let's keep the enemies in mind. We have both internal and external enemies. Phelps and his crew are just a mere "sideswipe" at getting attention off of the real world.

Like I said before, I think Phelps is a complete nut job (and I consider myself a Fundamentalist/Baptist). However much I may agree with his theory on God taking His hand of protection off of our nation (and, no, I don't think it's just the gay-agenda pushers, but goes further back to the hippies/free-love era and abortion, honestly), you'll never find probably almost ANY OTHER baptist boycotting with Phelps, that's for sure. In fact, my Baptist church honors our troops (heck, we have a HUGE banner on each side of our worship center w/ a troop pictured and sayings like, "Never forget to thank God for our troops and our Freedom," etc.) almost every week. There's a young Marine who always attended church in his uniform (until he shipped out recently) and another buddy of mine at church (Reserves) just shipped out this week to Iraq. I don't think your "typical" Baptist would protest like Phelps does, and, in face, we'd protest the gay-agenda pushers, if truth be told.

Posted by BA 2006-09-27 23:16|| 2006-09-27 23:16|| Front Page Top

#30 whoops, ....in fact...

Now, carry on.

Posted by BA 2006-09-27 23:17|| 2006-09-27 23:17|| Front Page Top

#31 Re:13, Zenster, I agree with your line of reaoning 100%. My girlfriend, now my wife of >33yrs, and I got careless and had to make probably the most difficult choice of our lives; we were not in any sort of position to support ourselves, much less a baby and a safe abortion was the only way out. She had to travel (alone) to a big city after making all the arrangements via telephone. We have told no one of this, but given the chance for a do-over, I beliee we would make the same choice. So those protesters at the clinics and those at military funerals deserve nothing less than our complete contempt (and a kick in the ass).

Posted by USN,Ret 2006-09-27 23:21|| 2006-09-27 23:21|| Front Page Top

#32 Thank you, USN,Ret. Please accept my condolences on your long ago loss. I'll just say how glad I am that your relationship had the strength to prevail over such sadness. I'll also take a moment to thank you for serving our great country. America's debt to its fighting men and women is endless.

I can still remember going to Planned Parenthood so that my highschool girlfriend and I could get the counseling for her to obtain oral contraceptives. Getting her pregnant would have destroyed both of our lives, instead, even though we are no longer together, our relationship was one of love and caring.

However much I may agree with his theory on God taking His hand of protection off of our nation

I beg to differ, BA. Even as a scientific agnostic, if there is one nation that shall never be cast from beneath the shelter of God's wing, it is America. Never has another country done so much for so many with so little thanks to show for it save our own enduring freedom and that of millions upon millions of people world wide. Look at all of the nations we have vanquished with out taking more than a scrap or two of land in conquest.

What you say borders far too closely to "America deserved 9-11" for my own tastes. I can only hope you might reconsider such a direly misplaced notion.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2006-09-27 23:56|| 2006-09-27 23:56|| Front Page Top

23:56 Zenster
23:50 Super Hose
23:49 JosephMendiola
23:42 JosephMendiola
23:38 JosephMendiola
23:33 Anonymoose
23:31 trailing wife
23:21 Alaska Paul
23:21 USN,Ret
23:18 JosephMendiola
23:17 BA
23:16 BA
23:11 Super Hose
23:10 wxjames
23:07 Zenster
23:02 Super Hose
22:58 Zenster
22:53 Shieldwolf
22:52 Zenster
22:48 JosephMendiola
22:45 JosephMendiola
22:42 Zenster
22:39 BA
22:36 JosephMendiola