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2019-10-09 -Short Attention Span Theater-
Army Combat Fitness Test Fiasco! Slides Reveal 84% of Women Failing ACFT
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Posted by Procopius2k 2019-10-09 00:00|| E-Mail|| Front Page|| [1296 views ]  Top

#1 Prediction: Within six months the Army will have done away with the ACFT and transitioned to a program of physical fitness self-assessment.
Posted by Besoeker 2019-10-09 01:40||   2019-10-09 01:40|| Front Page Top

#2 It's a feature not a bug. In the Ardennes in '44, Tet in '68, and the 50th Maintenance Company In Nasiriyah, Iraq in '03, there were no cooks, clerks, or mechanics, just plain infantrymen.

This issue has been a big coverup by the command chain for over a couple generations unwilling to face the truth but to follow political orders. Every company CO and 1st Sgt has had to live with first hand, double standards.

It's also an indictment of trying to make one size fit all. Look there are auxiliary functions and direct military functions. The institutional bias has been trying to force the military structure on things that do not fit nicely into it's organization. Quit trying to make it something it is not. It's already being done through the work around of civilianizing and contracting many support functions out.

Combat is Darwin writ large. The enemy doesn't care one bit about 'political correctness', just victory.
Posted by Procopius2k 2019-10-09 01:50||   2019-10-09 01:50|| Front Page Top

#3 ack 507th
Posted by Procopius2k 2019-10-09 01:51||   2019-10-09 01:51|| Front Page Top

#4 How much of this fiasco is attributable to Zero's imposed changes?
Posted by Lex 2019-10-09 02:39||   2019-10-09 02:39|| Front Page Top

#5 To the best of my knowledge, started long before Obama.
Posted by g(r)omgoru 2019-10-09 03:37||   2019-10-09 03:37|| Front Page Top

#6 ...Back after the first Gulf War there was a IG of the Army report that read of the significant number of females who got pregnant in order to get out of theater of operations. The Army leadership choose to whistle past the grave yard. That was the Bush I era.
Posted by Procopius2k 2019-10-09 06:42||   2019-10-09 06:42|| Front Page Top

#7 Ref #6: ..Back after the first Gulf War there was a IG of the Army report that read of the significant number of females who got pregnant in order to get out of theater of operations.

I knew an aviator who never made it to the fight. He spent his time in a theater repo-depot supervising a detachment that processed PG cases for re-deployment stateside.
Posted by Besoeker 2019-10-09 06:58||   2019-10-09 06:58|| Front Page Top

#8 I have first hand experience of something along these lines albeit on a smaller scale. My federal law enforcement organization was required, by law, to establish physical fitness standards. We hired an outside consultant to survey our agents and develop a job task-based test. I was part of 30 agent group of lab rats. We spent 2 weeks learning the skills and practicing testing protocols. On game day - we all took the test. Every female in the group failed - about 7. Last I ever heard of that test.
Posted by Bangkok Billy 2019-10-09 07:30||   2019-10-09 07:30|| Front Page Top

#9 Biology is sexist
Posted by Frank G 2019-10-09 08:05||   2019-10-09 08:05|| Front Page Top

#10 Grom, I don't see reports of females in the IDF having this issue. This true or just a blind spot in my reading?

If they don't, I would recommend adopting the Israeli methods.
Posted by DarthVader 2019-10-09 09:15||   2019-10-09 09:15|| Front Page Top

#11 Combat is Darwin writ large.

Yes. And very few women have the gross strength of men. In my youth we gymnastics team girls did 60 army push-ups and 120 tuck sit-ups (much harder than those sissy bent-knee things men do) to warm up before working on our routines, which put me at the far end of the female fitness curve. But Mr. Wife could bench press double what I could.
Posted by trailing wife 2019-10-09 09:33||   2019-10-09 09:33|| Front Page Top

#12 Darth. IDF tried it couple of times - didn't work out. Today there are units of remote operators etc...

TW it's not so much a matter of physical strength as of biological value. Men are adapted to fighting - both physically and psychologically - because males are expendable.

Posted by g(r)omgoru 2019-10-09 09:48||   2019-10-09 09:48|| Front Page Top

#13 Is the test biased or are we raising couch potatoes who spend all their time playing video games in the basement?
Posted by JohnQC 2019-10-09 11:07||   2019-10-09 11:07|| Front Page Top

#14 Prediction: Within six months the Army will have done away with the ACFT and transitioned to a program of group self-assessment and fitness self-marked coursework.

Posted by Bright Pebbles 2019-10-09 11:30||   2019-10-09 11:30|| Front Page Top

#15 Prediction: Within six months the Army will have done away with the ACFT and transitioned to a program of group self-assessment and fitness self-marked coursework.

No problemo! We'll just do like the cops & firefighters and decide that being big and strong really isn't part of the job description. With that out of the way and a little paper-shuffling, we can get more women into the upper ranks and meet that quota too. Wins for everyone!
Posted by SteveS 2019-10-09 11:40||   2019-10-09 11:40|| Front Page Top

#16 The long-term plunge in readiness across the military (across both genders and all services) makes me think that this is less a part of gender and more a major institutional failure (with women failing at a much higher rate because they are naturally physically not as able to pass these tests). I mean, this is the same military that wasn't training people how to steer and had ships crashing into each other with an alarming regularity at sea. The fact that the IDF, as noted, hasn't had the same problems, is probably because the constant alert level and general need for soldiers is so much higher. They can't afford to act as stupidly as our bureaucrats.
Posted by Vernal Hatrick 2019-10-09 16:53||   2019-10-09 16:53|| Front Page Top

#17 Popp's take on it.
Posted by DarthVader 2019-10-09 17:01||   2019-10-09 17:01|| Front Page Top

#18 The US is also some 1.3 million active + 800,000 reserve spread across the entire world; its a little different. Shitpot of co-eds on a ship far from home for months at a time.

That said, any advice or improvement is welcome - I won't share the stories I've been told because they are depressing. Are there places in the military for women, sure. Just make sure the truck driver is strong enough to lift the hood to check the oil and clean the filter. At least. Nevermind change a tire.
Posted by swksvolFF 2019-10-09 18:01||   2019-10-09 18:01|| Front Page Top

#19 A lot of the women lasted longer on the PT runs than the beer-bellied staff sergeants. Good thing med-transport was on the scene.
Posted by Skidmark 2019-10-09 18:33||   2019-10-09 18:33|| Front Page Top

#20 Oh oh, somebody got his started.
Posted by al-aShamed 2019-10-09 18:45||   2019-10-09 18:45|| Front Page Top

#21 The IDF issued UZI equivalents to the ladies. Much more accommodating to physical stature than full size battle rifles carried by all US and male IDF.
Posted by Skidmark 2019-10-09 18:48||   2019-10-09 18:48|| Front Page Top

#22 I'd like to point out that a military exists for the very specific purpose of warfare. It's not an expansive corporation of depts and sub-depts that should keep re-inventing itself to suit the employment policies of socially aware governments. Neither is it a place to fulfill one's ambitions of mobility into 'male bastions'.

Compromise the fighting arms with loose links and the security and defense integrity of your country is fucked. There are practical problems with women serving in combat roles, sometimes even as assist in the field.

In my own little view, men exist so women don't have to fight. Of course, because the world is beset by armed hedonism, cruelty and criminality there must be a training regimen and compulsory service like Israel does, and nations that are challenged with malignancies must recruit everyone who volunteers, and my greatest respect to the gals who make the cut.
Posted by Dron66046 2019-10-09 18:48||   2019-10-09 18:48|| Front Page Top

#23 You want commitment, intelligence and dedication to a task, look at the INTEL teams in the field. Most times brute force and ignorance WILL NOT deliver timely mission sensitive satellite tasking and PI exploits.
Posted by Skidmark 2019-10-09 18:52||   2019-10-09 18:52|| Front Page Top

#24 My special missions WANTED a 'mother hen', not an old cock.
Posted by Skidmark 2019-10-09 18:56||   2019-10-09 18:56|| Front Page Top

#25 All right, now we've moved to barnyard animals.
That's enough!
Posted by al-aShamed 2019-10-09 18:57||   2019-10-09 18:57|| Front Page Top

#26 Yes, unarguably true too.
Posted by Dron66046 2019-10-09 18:57||   2019-10-09 18:57|| Front Page Top

#27 Ref #23: PI exploits.

I'm assuming "priority intelligence exploits." AMIRITE ?
Posted by Besoeker 2019-10-09 18:57||   2019-10-09 18:57|| Front Page Top

#28 PI would be 'priority info' or intel, yupp.
Posted by Dron66046 2019-10-09 19:01||   2019-10-09 19:01|| Front Page Top

#29 OldSpook told of how the person who organized his Special Forces missions (he never mentioned rank) was the woman who subsequently became Mrs. Spook...
Posted by trailing wife 2019-10-09 21:01||   2019-10-09 21:01|| Front Page Top

#30 That is *so* romantic!
Posted by SteveS 2019-10-09 21:20||   2019-10-09 21:20|| Front Page Top

23:53 JohnQC
23:10 james
22:59 Frank G
21:41 Seeking Cure For Ignorance
21:36 Besoeker
21:25 Lex
21:22 trailing wife
21:20 SteveS
21:16 Lex
21:15 Lex
21:07 Lex
21:01 trailing wife
20:46 Silentbrick
20:31 charger
20:30 magpie
20:26 Seeking Cure For Ignorance
19:54 swksvolFF
19:48 swksvolFF
19:16 The peanut gallery
19:06 Skidmark
19:04 Skidmark
19:01 Dron66046
19:01 Skidmark
19:00 Besoeker

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