Article

2012-09-14 Africa North

Marines At Embassy Not Allowed Live Ammunition

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Posted by Angotle Angaviter7319 2012-09-14 00:00|| || Front Page|| [11127 views ] Top

#1 This has been denied by the Pentagon. FWIW.

Posted by Glenmore 2012-09-14 00:58|| 2012-09-14 00:58|| Front Page Top

#2 when i read the denial, it left room for the marines to have been disallowed ammo. The denial only states that the ambassador did not make the order and that both she and the regional security officer were in agreement as to the security situation at the embassy.

Posted by abu do you love 2012-09-14 03:29|| 2012-09-14 03:29|| Front Page Top

#3 the sad thing is that none of us here would be surprised if Champ (or Jarrett or some other operator in the admin) had ordered that no live ammo be issued. I can totally see the calculus for them that a trashed embassy would be far less damaging an incident than a deader among the rent-a-mob.

Posted by abu do you love 2012-09-14 03:32|| 2012-09-14 03:32|| Front Page Top

#4 In view of the administration's feckless penchant for body counting, it does seem rather odd that there were...... NO reports of dead embassy attackers or terrorists, not even one.

Difficult to believe those former Navy Seals went down without bodies stacked around them like cordwood.

Posted by Besoeker 2012-09-14 04:07|| 2012-09-14 04:07|| Front Page Top

#5 "She neutered the Marines posted to defend the embassy, trusting the Egyptians over the Marines."

Well, after Iraq, it's not like Blackwater would pick up a contract. Maybe they can employ some of those Dept. of Education SWAT teams to do the work.

Posted by Procopius2k 2012-09-14 09:19|| 2012-09-14 09:19|| Front Page Top

#6 Roger-Roger P2k. I'd like to read the After Action Report (AAR) of the Regional Security Officer (RSO).....who evidently survived the attack while his principal the Chief of Mission was murdered. I suspect his next assignment will he'll be as a rangemaster.

Posted by Besoeker 2012-09-14 09:26|| 2012-09-14 09:26|| Front Page Top

#7 A little more complicated than our loving press dictates. First, the Marines are probably not allowed to carry live ammo, or weapons for that matter. But right next to the Marine post is the arms locker for this type of event. Second, the Marine mission is to protect the classified in the building and in the event of an attack, they are to protect it and/or destroy it. Defending the Mission/embassy is the RSO and the dip security mission. The PSD for the Ambo falls under the RSO and he failed this mission costing the Ambo and others their lives.

Posted by 49 Pan 2012-09-14 09:43|| 2012-09-14 09:43|| Front Page Top

#8 Common sense is dead in Washington DC.

Posted by Raider 2012-09-14 09:56|| 2012-09-14 09:56|| Front Page Top

#9
#7 It would seem that the dual missions of protection of the embassy staff and protection and/or destruction of classified security documents both fall on the Secretary of State and ultimately on the commander-in-chief.

Posted by JohnQC 2012-09-14 10:19|| 2012-09-14 10:19|| Front Page Top

#10 JQC, right. At the end of the day - SecState & POTUS is responsible for embassy security.

I can only imagine the press' tsuname of hand wringing if these events had transpired under G.W. Bush...

Posted by Broadhead6 2012-09-14 10:22|| 2012-09-14 10:22|| Front Page Top

#11 When the dust settles we may discover that Ambassador Stevens "went native" and threw caution and security to the wind. I hope I am very, very wrong.

Posted by Besoeker 2012-09-14 10:24|| 2012-09-14 10:24|| Front Page Top

#12 B, I think your probably right on that call. Sad but true. Why an Ambo would only have a few security guards tells me a low situational awareness.

Posted by 49 Pan 2012-09-14 10:41|| 2012-09-14 10:41|| Front Page Top

#13 Well, the alleged movie evidently made a politically extreme lifestyle statement. Was the US Mission the target or was Ambassador Steves specifically tageted as revenge for this statement? Are the reports of torture and sodomy accurate?

Posted by Besoeker 2012-09-14 10:46|| 2012-09-14 10:46|| Front Page Top

#14 B, one other point. You have been in prolonged combat. There comes a time when you realize everyone is out to kill you. You become numb to it and have a hard time deciding what intel is white noise and what intel is the silver bullet and gonna kill you. In that country I would wager there are a lot of reports of attempts on the embassy making it difficult to manage.

Last point. The hit on the Ambo is one thing. At his home and DSS blew it. The walls of the embassy were breached, but the embassy was not taken, that is as I understand it, and the families of essentials have not been neo-d yet. Makes me wonder if they embassy attack was over reported.

Posted by 49 Pan 2012-09-14 10:53|| 2012-09-14 10:53|| Front Page Top

#15 She also broke the law - Embassy Marine details are NOT allowed to be disarmed, ever, by diplo personnel. They can be told to stand down, but NEVER disarmed.

Not that I expect she'll catch any shit for it.

Posted by mojo 2012-09-14 11:36|| 2012-09-14 11:36|| Front Page Top

#16 Clearly now is the time for Romney to apologize.

Posted by F(r)an Galt 2012-09-14 11:40|| 2012-09-14 11:40|| Front Page Top

#17 I suspect his next assignment will he'll be as a range master.

Quartermaster...Adak Alaska.

Posted by Secret Asian Man 2012-09-14 14:31|| 2012-09-14 14:31|| Front Page Top

#18 #6 One of the two that were wounded will be lucky to survive. In critical condition with serious head wounds.

#14 Easy to say when you have no idea what actually happened. He was not at his home. His home was in Tripoli and he was visiting the consulate in Benghazi for a publicized event.

#15 If in fact she disarmed the Marines - what law did she break? Be specific - what section of the US criminal code did she violate? You can't just say some one broke the law and not know the statute. I'm highly suspect of this report.

Posted by Bangkok Billy 2012-09-14 18:13|| 2012-09-14 18:13|| Front Page Top

#19 The classified contract between State and DOD/MCH for Embassy protection services. Facility security, as opposed to DSS.

Posted by mojo 2012-09-14 20:08|| 2012-09-14 20:08|| Front Page Top

#20 BB, the Goldwater-Nichols Act stipulates the legal the 'chain of command', incorporated into Title 10 USC. I don't recall the Ambassador in that DoD chain. Further the military are subject to UCMJ which requires action to be taken only by those in the chain of command. Much like allied commands [ie NATO], there is co-operation but never a surrender of authority to those outside the lawfully designated command and UCMJ authority.

Posted by Procopius2k 2012-09-14 20:09|| 2012-09-14 20:09|| Front Page Top

#21 self-defense is an inherent right. That is taught to all Marines during pre-deployment & MSG training. Beirut taught us our lesson in this regard.

Posted by Broadhead6 2012-09-14 20:58|| 2012-09-14 20:58|| Front Page Top

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