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2009-05-10 India-Pakistan
Villagers trapped between Taliban and Pakistan's war machine
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Posted by john frum 2009-05-10 08:33|| E-Mail|| Front Page|| [6525 views ]  Top

#1 Redux: Novemebr 1917
Posted by hammehead 2009-05-10 09:47||   2009-05-10 09:47|| Front Page Top

#2 There are plans to take army units to Kuwait for instruction in counter-insurgency..."

... a little late in the game, no?
Posted by Captain Grineter4539 2009-05-10 12:04||   2009-05-10 12:04|| Front Page Top

#3 The farmers and traders who had fled with Mr Khan had little faith in the army's ability to drive the gunmen out of their beautiful valleys. One gnarled old man pointed out that the army constantly announced body counts of Taliban but rarely showed photographs of the dead, as was customary in Pakistan.

A lot of people think the same thing. Everything is always very good news coming from the PAK govt until they change their story.
Posted by Kofi Claitle6576 2009-05-10 12:18||   2009-05-10 12:18|| Front Page Top

#4 instruction in counter-insurgency

In 1999 the city of Srinagar was declared a 'liberated zone' by Islamic militants who had driven out the Police and civil administration.
The place was awash with militants trained in Pakistan, all heavily armed.

The Indian Army 15 Corps led by Lt. Gen. Mohammad Zaki (a Muslim) conducted a 'police operation' and took back the city. No heavy weapons or airpower was used. They didn't require training in Kuwait.

The Pakistani army and the Indian army both originate from the Raj era British Indian army. They shared the same traditions, training etc.
Posted by john frum 2009-05-10 12:26||   2009-05-10 12:26|| Front Page Top

#5 For the ones who leaned toward the taliban, that's not even too bad. For the ones who played both ends against the middle, a learning expeirence. For the rest, well, you didn't speak up sooner, didja?
Posted by M. Murcek">M. Murcek  2009-05-10 12:26||   2009-05-10 12:26|| Front Page Top

#6 Even though they came from the brits, I think the ethnic mentality is very different.
Posted by Kofi Claitle6576 2009-05-10 12:44||   2009-05-10 12:44|| Front Page Top

#7 Counterinsurgency (basically taming the frontier) has always been part of the training inherited from the British. The Pakistanis seem to have lost this entirely.
Posted by john frum 2009-05-10 12:53||   2009-05-10 12:53|| Front Page Top

#8 Meanwhile in India...





Army personnel(4RR) maintaining strict vigil during search operation at village Mudssa near Domail in Bhadarwah tehsil of Doda in Jammu and Kashmir as after heavy gun battle between security forces and militants. Lashker-e-Toiba(LeT) militants have taken shelter in the dense near by forest .The gunfight erupted when security forces were carrying out search-and-cordon operations last night and operation is going on

Search-and-cordon operations - basic counterinsurgency.
Posted by john frum 2009-05-10 12:55||   2009-05-10 12:55|| Front Page Top

#9 No artillery... boots on the ground.. including Police




Indian Central Reserve Police Force patrol during a strike in Srinagar on May 6, 2009
Posted by john frum 2009-05-10 12:59||   2009-05-10 12:59|| Front Page Top

#10 since the Pak military has run the insurgents, they probably never thought about how to do counterinsurgency. "Why do we need to learn how to fight our own weapon?"
Posted by Frank G">Frank G  2009-05-10 14:06||   2009-05-10 14:06|| Front Page Top

#11 The Pakistani army and the Indian army both originate from the Raj era British Indian army. They shared the same traditions, training etc.

Yeah, John, but the Indian Army is run by a government that at least understands that war is hell, and to be avoided if possible. The Pakistani Army is neck-deep in fomenting rebellion and strife at home and abroad. Maybe the same base, but not the same ideology. Makes a big difference both in effectiveness and loyalty.
Posted by Old Patriot">Old Patriot  2009-05-10 14:30|| http://oldpatriot.blogspot.com/]">[http://oldpatriot.blogspot.com/]  2009-05-10 14:30|| Front Page Top

#12 Frank's got it.

Interesting thing about this, of course, is that the Talibs, the military and ISI cooperate in generating lots and lots of 'refugees' (or 'internally displaced people' if you prefer). Those folks need food and tender loving care, and that takes money.

Lots of money.

Lots and lots of money.

Expect the Special Wrapper for Human Rights at the UN to make a plea, and expect Bambi to fork over lots of money.

As the Colonel used to say, "I love it when a plan comes together!"
Posted by Steve White 2009-05-10 15:08||   2009-05-10 15:08|| Front Page Top

#13 And when the Saudi funded Islamic charities run by the Deobandis are finished with these people?
Posted by john frum 2009-05-10 15:30||   2009-05-10 15:30|| Front Page Top

#14 Here is a photo - 9th Gurhka Rifles basic training with a drill instructor playing a villager subjected to a cordon and search by recruits. Authentic hut, goat, and contrite villager.

photo
Posted by john frum 2009-05-10 19:15||   2009-05-10 19:15|| Front Page Top

#15 Interesting photos as always, john. Question: are those female soldiers in #9?
Posted by trailing wife">trailing wife  2009-05-10 23:27||   2009-05-10 23:27|| Front Page Top

23:56 trailing wife
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