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2007-01-30 Home Front: Politix

Hillary Talks Up Ethanol In Iowa; But Voted Against It 17 Times

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Posted by Anonymoose 2007-01-30 00:00|| || Front Page|| [11132 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Well, darn! I agree with her (when not in Iowa). Corn ethanol is a boondoggle.

Posted by Jackal">Jackal 2007-01-30 07:19|| http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html]">[http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html] 2007-01-30 07:19|| Front Page Top

#2 Farmers are saying that there is a limited ability to make major increases in corn production.

Supply countries like Nigeria could extract much more oil if there was greater stability. The US could assist in that regard.

Posted by Sneaze Shaiting3550 2007-01-30 07:40|| 2007-01-30 07:40|| Front Page Top

#3 She voted for the Iraq Resolution ... before she voted against it. What a superficial maroon!

Posted by doc 2007-01-30 08:17|| 2007-01-30 08:17|| Front Page Top

#4 I don't think Hillary knows squat about the details of ethanol use as a motor fuel, but then none of the other politicians (including W) know either. The MSM plays along with this political pandering by always omitting the key facts. On Jan. 17 the wholesale price of ethanol in Des Moines was $2.04. Ethanol only delivers 2/3 the energy of gasoline as a motor fuel, this would be like paying $3.10 wholesale for pure gasoline without ethanol, about $3.60 after fuel taxes are applied. Yesterday's price at the Murphy USA on the NE side of Des Moines was $1.89/gal, probably for 10% gasohol, it would have been cheaper if they left the ethanol out!
US ethanol production is made financially possible by a $0.54 a gallon tariff on imports. This had been set to expire in October, but our gracious Congress voted last month to extend it through 2009. (Hillary's record on this?) Congress also supports the industry by tax breaks to refiners & wholesalers.
I think the US would be better off by putting the same tariff on imported petroleum and letting the ethanol industry live or die on its own merits. This will not happen. For the next 17 months or so we will all have to suffer from this s*****y posing, reporting and analysis, from pols and newsmen alike.
At least the ethanol boondoggle is raising the price of corn for Iowa farmers...

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2007-01-30 09:10|| 2007-01-30 09:10|| Front Page Top

#5 We can assess a tax of $1.00 a gallon and use the money to subsidise ethanol.

Posted by Ptah">Ptah 2007-01-30 09:35|| http://www.crusaderwarcollege.org]">[http://www.crusaderwarcollege.org] 2007-01-30 09:35|| Front Page Top

#6 Why not drill for more Oil and increase your refining capabilities until you know what you are going to do? Everybody talks about alternative until the rubber meets the road and then they learn that it is just too expensive or inefficient. Don't even go into the subsidy game. That is one sure way to fail.

Posted by newc">newc 2007-01-30 09:54|| 2007-01-30 09:54|| Front Page Top

#7 Call the tariff a "war tax", raise it $1 a gallon every 2 years until it gets to $5. Use the funds to pay for the counter-jihad & all associated costs, like supporting a degree of energy independence, caring for the wounded, widows & orphans of the conflict. Not. Going. To. Happen.

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2007-01-30 09:56|| 2007-01-30 09:56|| Front Page Top

#8 I've read that as part of their first 100 hours, the House donks have pushed a bill that is nothing more than a tax on domestic oil production.
Which side are they on again ?

Posted by wxjames 2007-01-30 09:57|| 2007-01-30 09:57|| Front Page Top

#9 The cheap oil in the US has already been extracted. Now drilling for more domestic oil makes more sense the higher the price of imports becomes. Higher priced oil encourages consumers to find alternate ways to live their lives, and not just by using oil more efficiently.

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2007-01-30 10:03|| 2007-01-30 10:03|| Front Page Top

#10 #8 - we know most of the congressional donks are working for the jihad.

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2007-01-30 10:04|| 2007-01-30 10:04|| Front Page Top

#11 It's not just Iowa, either, there are several states with abundant grain production that stand to gain by investments in bio fuels. It's putting Americans to work doing what can be done to replace dependancy on lunatic Arabs. There's a lot more to be gained in bio fuels than in stem cell research.

Posted by wxjames 2007-01-30 10:05|| 2007-01-30 10:05|| Front Page Top

#12 #11 - it's a boondoggle when tariffs and tax supports are essential to promote ethanol use & development. Let the industry sink or stand on its own. I can see the government investing tax money in research to make ethanol production more efficient and less costly, but not in articially propping up the entire industry.
If W's recent proposal to use alternative fuels actually happens, more than the entire US annual corn production will be used for ethanol production before his proposed goal is reached. The hitch there is than corn is needed for other uses also. Are we supposed to start importing corn so we can produce tariff-supported ethanol?

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2007-01-30 10:11|| 2007-01-30 10:11|| Front Page Top

#13 One of the other results of higher corn prices means higher feed prices for livestock. Those higher prices will get passed on to the consumers in the form of higher prices for beef, pork, chicken, milk, cheese, and eggs as well as all corn-derived products. Cereals, corn meal,canned and frozen corn, all will increase in price. I'm not trying to deny corn farmers a decent price for corn , merely showing wahat a higher price means for the rest of us. This is nothing short of consumer subsidization of the ethanol industry.

Posted by Deacon Blues 2007-01-30 12:23|| 2007-01-30 12:23|| Front Page Top

#14 Plus, of course, to grow corn, you need OIL - lots of it. Fuel for farm machines, fertilizer, processing, etc. I haven't seen the figures of how much oil it takes to produce a gallon of ethanol, but I'll bet it's at least a good portion of a gallon.

Posted by Rambler">Rambler 2007-01-30 12:42|| 2007-01-30 12:42|| Front Page Top

#15 Anguper Hupomosing9418: I love the "war tax" idea. But use it to conquer, occupy and exploit all "Arab" and "Persian" oil fields. The tax vanishes as soon as the matter is in hand.

Posted by Excalibur 2007-01-30 12:46|| 2007-01-30 12:46|| Front Page Top

#16
At least the ethanol boondoggle is raising the price of corn for Iowa farmers...

That's the idea.

It's a a cliche but our oil is under their sand, so we need to make an understandable offer.

Posted by Shipman 2007-01-30 13:10|| 2007-01-30 13:10|| Front Page Top

#17 "But Voted Against It 17 Times"

Of course she did.

After all, her first language is lying hypocrite.

Posted by Barbara Skolaut">Barbara Skolaut 2007-01-30 15:45|| http://ariellestjohndesigns.com/page/15bk1/Home_Page.html]">[http://ariellestjohndesigns.com/page/15bk1/Home_Page.html] 2007-01-30 15:45|| Front Page Top

#18 #8 wx: "Which side are they on again?"

Hint: Not ours.

Posted by Barbara Skolaut">Barbara Skolaut 2007-01-30 15:47|| http://ariellestjohndesigns.com/page/15bk1/Home_Page.html]">[http://ariellestjohndesigns.com/page/15bk1/Home_Page.html] 2007-01-30 15:47|| Front Page Top

#19 We have the room to grow all the corn we need to make the ethanol we need to replace all the oil we need. (With about 30% to spare, if memory of the ol' Popular Mechanics article holds.)

What was a little hazy was how much diesel was used to plant, harvest and transport that corn to make that ethanol.

And we'd have to replace the oil imports with FOOD IMPORTS.

Posted by eLarson 2007-01-30 17:02|| http://larsonian.blogspot.com]">[http://larsonian.blogspot.com] 2007-01-30 17:02|| Front Page Top

#20 The US will run out of corn well before it repolaces a sizable fraction of gaoline. The US used 140 billion gallons of gasoline in 2005 or 200 billion gallons of ethanol equivalent energy. Estimated 2006 ethanol production is 5 billion gallons using 20% of the corn crop. So 100% of the corn crops (25B gal) would only replace 12.5% of the gasoline used. But since Jan 2006, corn prices have increased from $2/bushel to $3/bushel. May 2007 corn futures are at $4/bushel. Great for farmers, terrible for consumers.

To top all that, almost at much fossil fuel energy goes into making ethanol as you get out of it. The net energy gain is 1.34 according to DoE, lower according to most research papers. For comparision, oil drilling to gasoline production energy balance is 15. Add in labor and capital and it's a losing proposition kept alive by tax subsidies and environmental laws.

Btw, Hilary loves ethanol. How you you think she got Bill?

Posted by ed 2007-01-30 17:42|| 2007-01-30 17:42|| Front Page Top

#21 All I know is that the price of taccos in Mexico have gone up 30-60%. Which if you think about it is pretty funny.

Posted by Icerigger 2007-01-30 17:52|| 2007-01-30 17:52|| Front Page Top

#22 Should have brought Ted Kennedy with her. Ted's been a long time supporter of ethanol.

Posted by DMFD 2007-01-30 23:06|| 2007-01-30 23:06|| Front Page Top

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