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2006-12-29 International-UN-NGOs

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Posted by .com 2006-12-29 00:00|| || Front Page|| [11126 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 I say send her along and hang her too. it's people like her who held Saddam's coat.

Posted by Sock Puppet of Doom 2006-12-29 01:08|| www.sockpuppetofdoom.com]">[www.sockpuppetofdoom.com] 2006-12-29 01:08|| Front Page Top

#2 Saddam right now is indir symbolic of any and all STATE GOVTS = STATE PLANNING anywhere, ergo "the State" can either never make a mistake, or in the altern can never be punished for the wrongs/crimes committed under public authority. Thats why the Chicoms can plan to politely but necessarily exterminate 200Milyuuuhn-plus Americas; or Radical Intellectualists/Scientists >the Earth must lose 2/3-3/4's of its total population, BUT NO ONE CAN BE PUNISHED FOR IT. IT WAS "NECESSARY/VITAl, ITS GOOD FOR EVERYONE, PLANET SUN + UNIVERSE, EVEN FOR WARMONGERING IMPERIAL FASCIST AMERICANS. OUR GENOCIDE IS GOOD FOR US, FOR EVERYONE + EVERYTHING.

Posted by JosephMendiola 2006-12-29 01:28|| 2006-12-29 01:28|| Front Page Top

#3 For the predictably lame crtique of the Dujayl trial, see Human Rights Watch. For the more impressive critique by the organization that actually had a rep present for most of the trial, see the International Committee on Transitional Justice (ICTJ). For the rebuttal of most of the ICTJ's critique, see .... well, I've got a pretty good response done by the court advisor's office at the embassy, but suffice it to say that the several legitimate complaints made by ICTJ wouldn't appear to the normal reasonable person to bring the basic fairness of the trial into question.

The court was green (as is the whole power structure), the pressures were tremendous, the personalities were what they were, so the thing had some warts. But to my eyes the only thing that materially touched on fairness was the incompetence and bad faith of most of the defense counsel. And this is a bit of a dilemma, I believe in any system (napoleonic code or common law) - only so much can be done by the court to compensate for poor performance by defendants' counsel of choice. In this system, at least, the panel of judges (who are deemed expert and serve as both judge and jury in our concept of a court) can make any allowance they deem proper for incompetent defense counsel (e.g., disregard evidence that the defense failed to adequately challenge if they think it's suspect).

ExJAG, or other legal types, you around to help correct or amplify on this point?

If even unwittingly, and of course with no moral authority and even a reasonable presumption of bad faith hostility on her part, the insufferable Arbour does get one thing right: it was in everyone's interest that the process be seen as reasonably fair and credible. That it may not be, however, may be largely due to characteristically poor media coverage that misportrayed the proceedings and gave superficial treatment of evidence and legal issues involved. The irresponsible and arrogant - not to mention small-minded - refusal of the UN to have anything to do with the court didn't help in that regard either.

My sources tell me things inside the court went a bit off-the-rails back before verdict day, and today's confused coverage of just what's gonna happen with No. 1, and when, and with whose say-so, seems to confirm that. The court was always able to issue contradictory and confusing info (boy can I testify to that), but today's muddle marks a new high(low) point, given the issue involved.

Posted by Verlaine 2006-12-29 01:53|| 2006-12-29 01:53|| Front Page Top

#4 there were concerns about the fairness of the original trial.

Fairness? Hah! More likely, Saddam has some unpaid markers left over from the UN's Oil for Palaces program. Good luck collecting on those, suckers!

Posted by SteveS 2006-12-29 02:30|| 2006-12-29 02:30|| Front Page Top

#5 The appropriate comparison is not the OJ trial but the trial the Kurds received before they were gassed. These are not judicial proceedings, they are political show trials to prepare the public for the ultimate political truth; lose a war, hang till dead.

Posted by Nimble Spemble 2006-12-29 08:03|| 2006-12-29 08:03|| Front Page Top

#6 And from the Kuwaiti Ambassador to the UN... I think I see both hands in the air... yes, yes, thumbs pointing DOWNWARD!

Posted by Besoeker 2006-12-29 08:29|| 2006-12-29 08:29|| Front Page Top

#7 I mean, what are you worried about, Louise? That after he takes the big drop some evidence comes out that it was all a big frameup?
You're the "High" commissioner all right...

Posted by tu3031 2006-12-29 08:45|| 2006-12-29 08:45|| Front Page Top

#8 SPoD is right. The UN was on Sammy's gravy train for a long time. He was their boy - they miss all that oil for palaces $. The Iraqis should hang the lot of 'em.

Posted by Spot">Spot 2006-12-29 09:09|| 2006-12-29 09:09|| Front Page Top

#9 This whole farce is so stupid. Is there anyone out there possessing multiple neurons who think Saddam didn't order thousands of murders? The purpose of a trial is to find out what happened. We know what happened; it was documented all over the place (though mostly confined to the memory hole since 2003). This is just more grandstanding by transi groups that always support evil. Ban them from any civilized (or becoming thus) place, with immediate executions for those who disobey.

Posted by Jackal">Jackal 2006-12-29 09:09|| http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html]">[http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html] 2006-12-29 09:09|| Front Page Top

#10 If the UN is agin it, it's high time to move forward.

Posted by eLarson 2006-12-29 09:36|| http://larsonian.blogspot.com]">[http://larsonian.blogspot.com] 2006-12-29 09:36|| Front Page Top

#11 Great comment, Verlaine.

Let me note one thing: the issue of 'fairness' is determined, in large part, by the preconceptions of the people making the judgment. Louise was convinced before the trial started that it wouldn't be 'fair' (as I recall she said so), as were many others at the UN and in the human rights/legal community. Well sure enough, we've had a trial and they're still convinced it wasn't 'fair'.

The real issue is whether the Iraqi people believe that it was fair enough, and whether they believe justice is being done. There's time in the future to edumacate the Iraqis on the finer points of western jurisprudence; what's needed now is a quick trial that allows most Iraqis to say, 'yup, he had his chance and yup, he's getting what he's got coming'.

And then, of course, hang him.

The Old West saying of 'try him fair and hang him fair' really applies here.

Posted by Steve White">Steve White 2006-12-29 10:42|| 2006-12-29 10:42|| Front Page Top

#12 This kind of idiotic spam again demands everyone ask...just why in hell do we participate in this circus of losers. No more US taxpayer funding to be thrown into this sewer. Give them a 30 day eviction notice to pack up and quit polluting our air.

Posted by SpecOp35 2006-12-29 12:09|| 2006-12-29 12:09|| Front Page Top

#13 Well, at least they're loyal to the bitter end to their old sugar daddy. It's almost touching, really, to see that they still have feelings for him even though he hasn't sent these old whores a check for a very long time.

Posted by Swamp Blondie 2006-12-29 14:32|| http://azjetsetchick.blogspot.com]">[ http://azjetsetchick.blogspot.com] 2006-12-29 14:32|| Front Page Top

#14 The UN reps are what Heinlein would call 'honest politicians'. They stay bought. Even to the bitter end.

Posted by DMFD 2006-12-29 18:31|| 2006-12-29 18:31|| Front Page Top

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