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2006-09-29 Europe
Eurocorps Are Only For Emergencies, Not For Afganistan
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Posted by Captain America 2006-09-29 00:00|| || Front Page|| [11130 views since 2007-05-07]  Top

#1 "what is the point?" Exactly, what is there point? Socialism is necrotising and that the rot has set in is demonstrated thus.
Posted by Sock Puppet of Doom 2006-09-29 00:06|| www.sockpuppetofdoom.com]">[www.sockpuppetofdoom.com]  2006-09-29 00:06|| Front Page Top

#2 So, anybody know the EU definition of "rapid reaction"?
Posted by tu3031 2006-09-29 00:15||   2006-09-29 00:15|| Front Page Top

#3 Cowardly, condescending, cheapskates. One of the true pities of the post-Cold War era is the almost total lack of familiarity with the military and military virtues by the populations of the Western democracies and the feminization of the Western male. Old Europe is a total writeoff. Reciprocity should dictate that we let Europe go it alone the next time they get in trouble because, after all, the USMC is for "unseen emergencies and not for propping up an existing mission." And, like the Euros, we define what is an emergency, not them.
Posted by RWV 2006-09-29 00:24||   2006-09-29 00:24|| Front Page Top

#4 It's 15 years past time to leave western Europe and erect reciprocal trade barriers.
Posted by ed 2006-09-29 00:42||   2006-09-29 00:42|| Front Page Top

#5 Rummy's "Old Europe" rules still apply
Posted by Captain America 2006-09-29 00:51||   2006-09-29 00:51|| Front Page Top

#6 "Eurocorps"

Check your spelling, you're missing an "e"...
Posted by Thretle Ebbeger2992 2006-09-29 01:14||   2006-09-29 01:14|| Front Page Top

#7 I guess it's clear why Neumann is Bush's man in Kabul.

What isn't clear is why we continue to deal with these doormats as peers. They're history, literally and figuratively.

Enough of this farce. Enough of all of the farces that pass for "international cooperation", that pass for calling such cowards "allies", that pass for "doing the right thing" on the world stage - even when their own security and survival is at stake, that pass for venues of truth and veracity, that pass for defenders of the principles of freedom. Enough, already.
Posted by .com 2006-09-29 01:51||   2006-09-29 01:51|| Front Page Top

#8 I have never heard of rules of engagement that included: "Don't go out at night." Does that apply in Afganistan only? I guess it would be best if the "day shift" is kept clear of areas where security is dicey. Is there a section of Afghansistan where the OPFOR is extremely lazy and only likes to attack between 10AM and 2PM local? That might be an appropriate place to assign troops that are daylight only. Better yet send the sunshiners back to Europe, but they won't be much help locally as the Ramadan action in Brussels is swing shift as well.
Posted by Super Hose 2006-09-29 01:53||   2006-09-29 01:53|| Front Page Top

#9 Time for GWB to quietly tell ol' Vlad Putin that we won't stand in the way if he wants to have a few Guards Tank Armies go out for a little extended Sunday drive...like down the Kudamm, the Champs Elysees, etc. Only conditions - leave the Poles, Czechs and Baltic states alone. And for chrissakes, don't build any of those butt-ugly blocks of "workers' housing estates" in Tuscany, Provence or the Riviera (at least not until I've had the chance to see them).
Posted by Ricky bin Ricardo (Abu Babaloo) 2006-09-29 02:02||   2006-09-29 02:02|| Front Page Top

#10 "If you can't fight in the place that produced al-Qa'eda and September 11 and a series of terrorist attacks in Europe, what is the point?""

Guess the point is that they never WERE behind us after Sept 11, all drama to the contrary-otherwise, they couldn't possibly refuse such obvious need. The Europeans simply do not believe in using military force; their philosophy is omnipacifism. They don't believe in fighting for anything.
Posted by Jules 2006-09-29 07:35||   2006-09-29 07:35|| Front Page Top

#11 True. John Stuart Mill could have been describing the euros when he said "A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature...".
Posted by mcsegeek1 2006-09-29 08:30||   2006-09-29 08:30|| Front Page Top

#12 No, he's a gutless coward.
Posted by wxjames 2006-09-29 09:09||   2006-09-29 09:09|| Front Page Top

#13 It’s the grand European tradition of the Grand Duchy of East Fenwick Palace Guard. Neat spiffy uniforms. Parades smartly on the steps in front of the Palace People’s Hall of Delegates. Works 35 hour weeks. Three shows a day.

A unit prepared for inspection is unfit to fight. A unit fit to fight is unfit for inspection.
Posted by Cheath Ununter6466 2006-09-29 09:14||   2006-09-29 09:14|| Front Page Top

#14 Define Emergency?
Posted by 3dc 2006-09-29 09:21||   2006-09-29 09:21|| Front Page Top

#15 35 28.8 hour work weeks.
Posted by ed 2006-09-29 09:50||   2006-09-29 09:50|| Front Page Top

#16 About 12,000 U.S. Troops to Come Under NATO Control in Afghanistan

......An important issue affecting NATO’s ability to succeed in Afghanistan is the need for countries contributing forces to ease or eliminate restrictions, known as “caveats,” on how and where their forces may be used, Scheffer said. He quoted Polish Defense Minister Radoslaw Sikorski as telling his colleagues, “Giving forces without caveats is giving twice.” Poland’s ISAF forces are operating without caveats.

Rumsfeld said it’s important that ISAF forces operate under “as few caveats as possible.”

“It is very difficult for a commander managing the forces from … 35 or 40 different countries -- NATO nations as well as non-NATO nations -- when he is not able to move forces around and to have them go where they're needed, when they're needed to do the things that needed to be done,” he said......
Posted by GolfBravoUSMC 2006-09-29 11:50||   2006-09-29 11:50|| Front Page Top

#17 Thretle: Eurocorps" Check your spelling, you're missing an "e"... LOL!
Posted by anon 2006-09-29 11:53||   2006-09-29 11:53|| Front Page Top

#18 RWV: One of the true pities of the post-Cold War era is the almost total lack of familiarity with the military and military virtues by the populations of the Western democracies and the feminization of the Western male.

I don't think they're feminized as much as anti-American. With the advent of global free trade, there's no real need to go on foreign military expeditions in search of markets and resources. If the free trade regimen ends, and Uncle Sam pulls back to his own shores, expect European armies to once again go forth in search of these things. Euros are merely doing the logical thing. We did it for over a century after independence - why get involved in somebody else's problems, when they'll sort it out themselves, one way or the other.
Posted by Zhang Fei 2006-09-29 12:30|| http://timurileng.blogspot.com]">[http://timurileng.blogspot.com]  2006-09-29 12:30|| Front Page Top

#19 Wow-using the word "logic" to describe modern-day European behavior is quite unexpected, expecially given the real threat Europe faces from Islam. Logic follows that Europe has other militaries they can count on to come and rescue them when hell breaks loose, right?
Posted by Jules 2006-09-29 12:36||   2006-09-29 12:36|| Front Page Top

#20 the EU definition of "rapid reaction":
1) Throwing down their weapons and rapidly running away.
2) Rapidly retreating when the Taliban approach.
3) Rapidly coming up with excuses why they can't do anything.
4) Rapidly sh*tting in their pants when they're shot at. (they don't call it the "runs" for nothing)

Al
Posted by frozen al">frozen al  2006-09-29 15:15||   2006-09-29 15:15|| Front Page Top

#21 Now, now I'm sure the troops are just fine. It's the fluffy politicians that do all the harm. I work with a guy who was special forces in Belgium. He says they were okay, but the officers were total clueless fools. But, even clueless fools gain skills when the bullets start flying.
Leftist pols don't till late election evening.
Posted by wxjames 2006-09-29 15:40||   2006-09-29 15:40|| Front Page Top

#22 J: Wow-using the word "logic" to describe modern-day European behavior is quite unexpected, expecially given the real threat Europe faces from Islam.

Demographic threats have to be resolved using a tougher immigration policy that forces illegals out (and perhaps shoots the ones who try to come back in). Muslim citizens might need to be denaturalized and expelled en masse. This is police work and does not require much assistance from their militaries.

Muslim nations pose no threat to Europe - unlike the Arab and Turkish armies of old, they don't have superior technology to overpower the backward Europeans. This time around, it is Europeans are better-armed. Look at it this way - the Canadian Forces aren't in Iraq, and the Canucks don't even have tanks in their military any more. But they are really punishing the Taliban in exchange for minimal losses. I have no doubt that the European formations are just as proficient. Muslim militaries can't hack it - and they know it.

J: Logic follows that Europe has other militaries they can count on to come and rescue them when hell breaks loose, right?

That is correct - it is what NATO is for. A free insurance policy. I have a feeling that our relationship with Europe would be much improved by a withdrawal from the region. Currently, we grovel for the privilege of protecting them. It would be more appropriate for them to grovel for the privilege of being protected.
Posted by Zhang Fei 2006-09-29 15:41|| http://timurileng.blogspot.com]">[http://timurileng.blogspot.com]  2006-09-29 15:41|| Front Page Top

#23 Euros define emergency as my foot up their ass.
Posted by Captain America 2006-09-29 15:58||   2006-09-29 15:58|| Front Page Top

#24 Zhang, exactly correct. We should have been out of Europe long ago. They count on our protection as a given, but continue to degrade us on a daily basis. Let us be gone. Let them protect themselves. Let them beg. Clue: we ain't comin' back to save your bacon again. Get used to it.
Posted by SOP35/Rat 2006-09-29 15:59||   2006-09-29 15:59|| Front Page Top

#25 Zeng did I miss something or wasn't there concerned expressed in France about using the Army to quell the season of car burnings because too much of it was already islamists?
Posted by Flaiting Thirong7227 2006-09-29 16:46||   2006-09-29 16:46|| Front Page Top

#26 In all fairness, Eurabia has surrendered to pIslam already. Why would they go and fight their masters?
Posted by Icerigger 2006-09-29 17:17||   2006-09-29 17:17|| Front Page Top

#27 What! You want the expensive Euro military vehicles to risk getting a scratch?
Posted by DMFD 2006-09-29 18:15||   2006-09-29 18:15|| Front Page Top

#28 Icerigger: In all fairness, Eurabia has surrendered to pIslam already. Why would they go and fight their masters?

Germany once had a Jewish foreign minister, back in the 1910's. And then proceeded to conduct a Holocaust against Jews. Europe's veneer of civility is just that - a veneer. Remember that it was thought that international trade had made war impossibly expensive, and therefore remote - just prior to the deaths of millions on European battlefields in WWI. The American security blanket has produced a temporarily enervated Europe. Remove that security blanket and Europeans will re-learn their ancient martial traditions - the same ones that helped preserve Europe against Muslim invaders hundreds of years ago, and contributed to the continental-scale bloodbaths of the 20th century.
Posted by Zhang Fei 2006-09-29 20:03|| http://timurileng.blogspot.com]">[http://timurileng.blogspot.com]  2006-09-29 20:03|| Front Page Top

#29 and the Canucks don't even have tanks in their military any more.

Um, that's incorrect. We have Leopard tanks.About 60 of them. (Far superior to the M1A1, btw)
Posted by Hupailet Unaiger3912 2006-09-29 20:46||   2006-09-29 20:46|| Front Page Top

#30 Actually, Canada has 1960's Leopard 1 tanks. A peer of the M60 with a 105mm main gun, but at 42 tons (about the weight of a T-72) lightly armoured and fast.
Posted by ed 2006-09-29 21:17||   2006-09-29 21:17|| Front Page Top

#31 Remove that security blanket and Europeans will re-learn their ancient martial traditions -

Maybe. Maybe.
Posted by lotp 2006-09-29 21:22||   2006-09-29 21:22|| Front Page Top

#32 Even if they don't, it won't be our problem any more.
Posted by ed 2006-09-29 22:25||   2006-09-29 22:25|| Front Page Top

23:54 anon
23:53 JustAsking
23:51 anon
23:50 SR-71
23:50 trailing wife
23:48 Iblis
23:47 anon
23:42 Zenster
23:39 Classical_Liberal
23:32 Zenster
23:29 RD
23:27 Sherry
23:16 Zenster
23:10 Old Patriot
22:47 ed
22:36 ed
22:35 gorb
22:25 Ptah
22:25 JosephMendiola
22:25 Hyper
22:25 ed
22:21 Ptah
22:20 anon
22:19 Jackal









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