Article

2005-12-31 Europe

Hamas publication calls for Muslim conquest of Spain

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Posted by Dan Darling 2005-12-31 00:25|| || Front Page|| [3 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Spanish Foreign Minister Miguel Angel Moratinosâ efforts earlier this year to remove HAMAS from the European Unionâs terrorist list,..

Check his lips. I'll bet they have a bit of a brown hue to them...

Apparently encouraged by successful Jihad against Israel,..

"Successful"? Hardly. Israel still exists.

Posted by Bomb-a-rama 2005-12-31 01:02|| 2005-12-31 01:02|| Front Page Top

#2 This muslim angst at the loss of Andalusia is most unseemly.

They seem to have forgotten the advice given by Aisha, mother of the last Moor king Muhammad XII (Boabdil) when he stopped to look back at the city he surrendered to Ferdinand and Isabella.

"You weep like a woman for a city you could not defend like a man!"

Muslims need to get over it. Ya lost.

Posted by john 2005-12-31 07:19|| 2005-12-31 07:19|| Front Page Top

#3 This is ridiculous. Islam has already conquered Europe.

Posted by Curt Simon 2005-12-31 08:00|| 2005-12-31 08:00|| Front Page Top

#4 Not yet.

And the anger of the native populations grow...

Posted by john 2005-12-31 08:57|| 2005-12-31 08:57|| Front Page Top

#5 Qaradawi ruled that Muslims should re-conquer â'former Islamic colonies' in Andalus (Spain), southern Italy, Sicily, the Balkans and the Mediterranean islands."

Yeah, lets allow these young kids to be brainwashed. I hope this PC attitude of acceptance of diversity will be seen for what it really is. If it has taken hold, then we have a much larger fight ahead of us.
It's important to stop this mind set passed on over and over.
Yeah, reconquer my A**.

Posted by Jan 2005-12-31 09:20|| 2005-12-31 09:20|| Front Page Top

#6 Spanish Foreign Minister Miguel Angel Moratinosâ efforts earlier this year to remove HAMAS from the European Unionâs terrorist list, have done little to change HAMASâ agenda.

Sooner or later, the lefties in the Spanish government will figure out that appeasement doesn't work.

Yeah, I'll put $20 on later...

Posted by Raj 2005-12-31 10:25|| 2005-12-31 10:25|| Front Page Top

#7 "MILKY WAY ? WHAT MILKY WAY ?! IT'S THE PROPHET'S GALAXY !"

muslim leaders rambling in a padded room, in the year 2016...

Posted by Poitiers-Lepanto">Poitiers-Lepanto 2005-12-31 11:01|| 2005-12-31 11:01|| Front Page Top

#8 don't know if Europe will figure it out in time, but at some point the hipsters, the cool, the all knowing wise, the intelligencia, the "elite", will finally grasp that the Muslim fanatics are not playing by their PC rules. The EU-PCnics are still playing by the same ones that the marxist, communists, and many others before set up - where you claim to help the little guy, and get him to rally round you - send you money and get you elected to power where you continue to claim you are fighting him for him, but you are really just lining your pockets with his tax dollars and claiming his continued plight is caused by "the other guy" - even though you are in charge.

The Muslim fanatics work by their own set of rules. They are very simple: If you are weak, they conquer you. The lions of Islam, like real lions, chase the herd and spot the weak, the wounded and eat them first.

I think the reason the EU-PCnics have such a hard time understanding it, is because it is so simple and honest that they just can't grasp it's lack of nuance.

Posted by 2b 2005-12-31 11:14|| 2005-12-31 11:14|| Front Page Top

#9 Americans are Christian children of the Enlightenment and Reformation. We know man is incorrigibly imperfect but things can be made incrementally better. Europeans are Rousseauian intellectual faddists who have yet to emerge from the Romantic. They believe man is perfectible if only they adopt the proper ideology; democracy, fascism, communism, etc. Thus, they have no real alleigence to any ideology, particularly after each is shown to be wanting. Many, many of them will be willing to adopt Islam voluntarily now that the scales are falling from their eyes about their beloved communism. There will be a great internal division and conflict over the voluntary adoption of Islam. If the Saudi Wahabis were really clever, they would ditch the violence bit, except wrt Israel, and become the true ROP with submission as the path to perfection. The Euro-dummies would fall for it in a nano second. But by playing the bomb game, they reveal themselves to far too many for what they actually are. Nonetheless, plenty will fall for it and there will be a bloody resolution this century. We should open our doors to those who wish to escape as we did not in the 1930s and ignore what happens to the rest as we did not in the 1940s. Europe can join arabia and it will make no difference to us as the future is in the Pacific. The Europeans are not worth the bones of a single Pennsylvanian grenadier.

Posted by Nimble Spemble 2005-12-31 11:34|| 2005-12-31 11:34|| Front Page Top

#10 Whenever I hear right-wingers complaining about "EU-PCNics" or "multiculturalism", or any of these nice vague meaningless words, it reveals to me that they don't actually have something concrete to complain about. (Same way when left-wingers complain about vague meaningless words like "globalisation".)

They just repeat words whose utter vagueness means you can utterly vaguely (and meaninglessly) condemn them and blame everything on them, and whose only defense can be similarly vague and meanigless.

What is the supposed PCNic-ness of Europe? Is it
like when France forbid the wearing of the Islamic scarf by schoolgirls, and when the European court decided that similar prohibitions in Turkey don't violate human rights when they are made in protection of secularism?

I'd like some concrete examples of the supposed EU PCnic-ness that's supposedly hurting Europe. (The importation of foreign workers ofcourse has nothing to do with PCnic-ness and everything to do with economics, btw)

Posted by Aris Katsaris">Aris Katsaris 2005-12-31 11:36|| 2005-12-31 11:36|| Front Page Top

#11 Aris - I have read your comment. I'm sorry that you don't understand. However, I do not feel compelled to explain it to you. Have a nice day.

Posted by 2b 2005-12-31 11:44|| 2005-12-31 11:44|| Front Page Top

#12 Aris:

1. Appeasement by France of the Islamofascists.
2. Appeasement by Spain of the Islamofascists.

Posted by Elmeregum Pheque8342 2005-12-31 11:48|| 2005-12-31 11:48|| Front Page Top

#13 Actually, Aris, I think the headscarf thing is a good example. It has a lot of symbolic value but I don't think it's accomplishing anything.

OTOH, if you call violent rioters "thugs," you're upsetting the natural order of things; see what happened wrt Sarkozy here:

http://rantburg.com/poparticle.php?ID=138159&D=2005-12-23.

In fact, look at France's weak reaction to the riots, and to other ongoing violence in the cite's (sorry, I don't remember how to do French characters on this keyboard; just imagine I spelled it right, OK?)... they have an immensely bad problem in these areas (see anonymous5089's comments here and the main thing you're talking about is banned headscarves?

(Of course, the riots may have less to do with Islam than many of the people here would be willing to believe, which may in fact make the situation even less conductible to management-by-banning-moslem-clothing than people think.)

Posted by Phil 2005-12-31 12:40|| 2005-12-31 12:40|| Front Page Top

#14 2b> As long as you have it clear in your own mind, I suppose it doesn't matter that you don't deign to explain it to us inferior creatures.

Assuming you don't have a problem if others erroneously mistake your unwillingness to respond with inability to do do. Have a nice day.

Elmeregum Pheque8342> Now you speak of appeasement -- which is a different concept than (and almost completely unrelated to) either political correctness or multiculturalism.

I can think of several examples of "appeasement", not just to Islamofascists, but to Russia as well, but what have they do with multiculturalism and so-called "EU-PCnicness"? Appeasement tends to usually be a function of either greed or weakness, not of the supposed idealism you despise.

Posted by Aris Katsaris">Aris Katsaris 2005-12-31 12:42|| 2005-12-31 12:42|| Front Page Top

#15 Phil, the reason I mentioned muslim clothing is because it relates to *culture*, and thus becomes a datapoint on whether e.g. France attempts to be "multicultural" or not. It seems to me that France isn't attempting any such thing.

One way or another my point remains that I don't understand the meaning of "multiculturalism" as used by 2b, atleast if it's supposed to be something that European nations are following to any greater extent than e.g. the United States are.

As for Sarkozy, he's still a popular politician I gather, and still likely to become the next leader of his party, and if anything his unPC comments are a point against the argument that France suffers from an inordinate amount of such.

I'm not arguing against the idea that Europe has a problem with its imported and unassimilated Arab populations. I'm asking however, for concrete example where "EU-PCnicness" or multiculturalism is supposed to have caused or worsened such problems. Specific examples of "PCnicness". Did murderers go free because they blamed societal factors? Is hate-speech allowed if it's couched in religious terminology? (Recently I believe there was a Rantburg article about an Islamist organization calling itself "Multicultural"-something that was *banned* in Germany)

Posted by Aris Katsaris">Aris Katsaris 2005-12-31 12:56|| 2005-12-31 12:56|| Front Page Top

#16 Nible, #9 was a great post. If the Saudi Wahabis were really clever, they would ditch the violence bit, except wrt Israel, and become the true ROP with submission as the path to perfection. SO TRUE!

But I think that is only true through Western eyes because the purpose of the Army of Islam is not to convert the world to Islam, but to destroy the west and establish a caliphate. It's not about conversion, but conquest.

They would be just as happy to kill us as to convert us. Their idea of a prize is the conquest of Spain, France, Australia or any other land, with each warlord secretly believing himself to eventually become the one to wear the biggest turban of all...or least to be guaranteed a place at the right hand of the caliphate. They don't want to move to the future - but return to the glorious past.

Besides, from their perspective - conquest is conversion. It's all one in the same to them.

Posted by 2b 2005-12-31 12:57|| 2005-12-31 12:57|| Front Page Top

#17 It's the Occupation!!!!!!

Posted by Danking70 2005-12-31 13:21|| 2005-12-31 13:21|| Front Page Top

#18 "The Muslim fanatics work by their own set of rules. They are very simple: If you are weak, they conquer you. [...] I think the reason the EU-PCnics have such a hard time understanding it, is because it is so simple and honest that they just can't grasp it's lack of nuance."

My impression is that political correctness doesn't really have all very much to do with it; and whatever the Europeans' reluctance to face the increasingly aggressive, imperialistic nature of Islam, it is mostly a result of their revulsion toward the horrible carnage of WWI and WWII.

I get the sense that they still remain, a half-century later, deeply traumatized by that experience (like, who wouldn't be?) and that many of them cannot deal with it other than by taking a stubbornly pacifistic stance which denies that war is ever a necessity, under any circumstances, or can ever be right.

At some point, though, Europe is going to have to abandon its pacifism, attend to its own survival, and face squarely the Islamic menace that began to rear its ugly head (yet again) a quarter-century ago with the Iranian Revolution. Because Islam wants Europe back, and they intend to take it.

The sooner Europe shows that it is willing to fight for its survival, the less the likelihood that it will actually have to.

Just my opinion, for what it's worth.

Posted by Dave D.">Dave D. 2005-12-31 14:04|| 2005-12-31 14:04|| Front Page Top

#19 maybe if they weren't so friggin stoopid as to subsidize and nurture the jihadi with a welfare stipend and state housing, I'd hope for the best. Instead, I think it will be a nasty brutal explosion of native anger, and we know how well they do collective punishment, don't we?

Posted by Frank G">Frank G 2005-12-31 14:11|| 2005-12-31 14:11|| Front Page Top

#20 "...nasty brutal explosion of native anger..."

And that's the danger right there, as I see it: that the policies of appeasement will be stretched so far that when they finally snap, the rebound will result in yet another round of profligate slaughter.

Posted by Dave D.">Dave D. 2005-12-31 14:24|| 2005-12-31 14:24|| Front Page Top

#21 Don't be mean Frank. That was years ago.

Posted by Leon Clavin 2005-12-31 14:30|| 2005-12-31 14:30|| Front Page Top

#22 Well, I guess an explosion of native anger could happen. If the EU-Constituion had passed a lot of this discussion would be moot.

Posted by Leon Clavin 2005-12-31 14:32|| 2005-12-31 14:32|| Front Page Top

#23 If the EU-Constitution had passed a lot of this discussion would be moot.

How so? I don't see how the largely minor and incremental changes that the EU Constitution would make on the EU's functioning would affect the situation one bit.

Posted by Aris Katsaris">Aris Katsaris 2005-12-31 14:52|| 2005-12-31 14:52|| Front Page Top

#24 nice deflection try, greek boy - we're discussing the way Europe is rolling over and taking it like a bitch, and you want to start an EU constitution thread - take it somewhere else. It's not an issue. European character and lack of spine is.

Posted by Frank G">Frank G 2005-12-31 14:55|| 2005-12-31 14:55|| Front Page Top

#25 nice deflection try, greek boy - we're discussing the way Europe is rolling over and taking it like a bitch, and you want to start an EU constitution thread

In case you are suffering from that delusion, "American boy", I'm not Leon Clavin. It was Leon who argued that the EU Constitution was relevant, not me.

Posted by Aris Katsaris">Aris Katsaris 2005-12-31 15:02|| 2005-12-31 15:02|| Front Page Top

#26 Can you imagine the screaming if an American textbook were to call for a Crusade all the Christian cities conquered by Muslims? These people refuse to realize that almost all the lands held by Muslims were taken by force from people of other religions. It's time we stopped bending over backwards to accommodate these inbred, spoiled children. They don't have the power to do anything except export terror and that fact needs to be rammed home. For starters, the Jews should evict the Wa'af and reclaim the Temple Mount. Only very limited numbers of carefully screened muslims should be allowed to visit the Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa museum. The "Palestinians" don't really exist as anything other than second and third generation "refugees" so let's get rid of the fiction that there needs to be a Palestinan state and hand over responsibility for Gaza and the West Bank to nations with adult leadership. The Palestinian authority should be eliminated and Gaza handed over to Egypt and the West Bank to Jordan. Then the West should look the other way while the Egyptian and Jordanian security forces deal with the problem.

Posted by RWV 2005-12-31 15:20|| 2005-12-31 15:20|| Front Page Top

#27 I don't want to get into an argument about the profered EU Constitution. But I expect all reasonable people will agree that a firm Europe would be an advantage here.

Posted by Leon Clavin 2005-12-31 15:22|| 2005-12-31 15:22|| Front Page Top

#28 definitely

Posted by Frank G">Frank G 2005-12-31 15:23|| 2005-12-31 15:23|| Front Page Top

#29 Dave - interesting point. But one thing to consider is that the liberal "elite" point of view here in America is almost identical to that of the EU and we have had no such trauma.

I believe that it stems from a generation that simply does not believe that there are forces that can not be reasoned with. Surely you can find something that will make it worth their while to go away. Throw them more beads and whiskey and soon enough they will be satisfied and go away.

But the Jihadists are not about converting us to their religion - they are about revenge, humiliation and conquest. The goals are not all that different than the hoards that ravaged through Asia - it was just about conquest, rape, pillage and plunder. Burn it down and move on.

The jihadists are not fighting to achieve anything - they are fighting to destroy the west and return to the good old glory days when Muslims were brightest and the best. To compete with the west - they must embrace it. They can't do that - so the west must be destroyed.

Posted by 2b 2005-12-31 18:42|| 2005-12-31 18:42|| Front Page Top

#30 Aris, go do some serious research on rapes in Sweden in the last few years. Dig a little and find out who, by and large, is raping whom.

And then go watch the Swedish government and press do their damndest to avoid saying what is actually pretty widely known and acknowledged privately: that rapes are up more than 4 fold in less than a decade and nearly all of the increase is perpetrated by Muslim males of immigrant background.

It's not "politically correct" to say so publicly in Sweden. Or to openly note that the increased rapes are split between young Muslim girls (8-14 yrs of age) and, increasingly, ethnically Swedish girls and women.

Or to acknowledge the increasingly open boasting of Muslim males that the Swedish females had it coming since they aren't Muslim and "properly submissive".

Even Swedish feminists tend to try to cover this up. Disgusting.

Posted by not PC one damn bit 2005-12-31 18:57|| 2005-12-31 18:57|| Front Page Top

#31 What inspires Jihad and the desire to destroy the west?

Here is a line from Mississippi Burning that I think explains it as well as just about anything can

Anderson:
You know when I was a little boy, there was an old negro farmer that lived down the road from us, named Monroe. He was ... (subtle laugh), I guess he was just a little more luckier than my daddy was. He bought himself a mule. It was a big deal in round that town. Now my daddy hated that mule. Kuse, his friends were always kidding him about, "They saw Monroe out plowing with his new mule and Monroe is going to rent another field now he had a mule." One morning that mule showed up dead. They poisoned the water. After that, there wasn't any mention about that mule around my daddy. It just never came up. One time we were driving down that road and we passed Monroe's place and we saw it was empty. He just packed up and left, I guess, he must of went up north or something. I looked over at my daddy's face, I knew he done it. He saw that I knew. He was ashamed. I guess he was ashamed. He looked at me and said, "If you ain't better than a nigger son, who are you better than?"

Ward: I think that's an excuse.

Anderson: No it's not, excuse. It's just a story about my daddy.

Ward: Where's that leave you?

Anderson: With an old man who just so full of hate that he didn't know that being poor was what was killing him.

Posted by 2b 2005-12-31 19:04|| 2005-12-31 19:04|| Front Page Top

#32 "I'm not arguing against the idea that Europe has a problem with its imported and unassimilated Arab populations. I'm asking however, for concrete example where "EU-PCnicness" or multiculturalism is supposed to have caused or worsened such problems. "

Aris, you are in a better position, living in Europe, to identify how PCnicness has affected European society in concrete examples--IF you are willing to be open to such a possibility.

Try posting an opinion on a mainstream news blog in Europe, as I recently did, using a word that most people in the EU consider unacceptable. I was critical of racism in my post, and used the word "nigger" to make my point. The news blog rejected my email as "racist". I changed the word I typed to "ni**er". They accepted the email but edited it to read "racist insults". This is a bit demonstrative of what we're talking about-it seems that so may times in European discourse, free exchange of ideas is not free at all, and that people are expected to march goosestep with community-approved language. Honest confrontation of real problems is hobbled with that kind of heavy-handed censoring. Silencing speech has a history in Europe, does it not? Or would you actually argue that such silencing can not have "concrete" repercussions for Europe? Europe's one great love is discourse-if it is censored in this manner, what is Europe's strength?

It isn't only Europe that suffers from this PC problem, but it does seem deeply imbedded there. But yes, it does exist-in the US (to a seemingly lesser extent, thank God), in South America, in Europe, in Australia...

How about the recent events in Cronulla, Australia? One side of the story is that a racist mob attacked men of Middle Eastern descent. All sorts of damning language was used against the Anglo/Celt Aussies in scores of news stories. The other side of the story is that Cronulla has been undergoing attacks by Muslims against all kinds of non-Muslims-darkskinned, light-skinned, whatever. Review the multiple internet stories about those events and judge for yourself whether the lion's share of the stories are hyper-critical of the Aussies, and hands off when it comes to the attackers-refusing to use words like "Muslim". In fact, go back even further to see that Muslim harassment against sunbathing females on the beach has not been countered-and what would be the reason? Maybe because Aussies are afaid of being called racists for naming the thing for what it is-Muslim sexual hysteria? This is PC stupidity-this is what we're talking about.

Posted by jules 2 2005-12-31 21:34|| 2005-12-31 21:34|| Front Page Top

#33 I need a gloat meter.

Posted by gromgoru 2005-12-31 22:13|| 2005-12-31 22:13|| Front Page Top

#34 Back to the story...it will be interesting to see whether the Spanish government supports the inclusion of Hamas candidates in the elections in Israel. Somehow, I have a feeling it will.

Posted by jules 2 2005-12-31 22:23|| 2005-12-31 22:23|| Front Page Top

#35 Good thread: I think that appeasement at various levels has created a worldwide situation which encourages the radical Islamists to lose discipline and prematurely, take ambitious actions. This has caused the spreading of hostilities and the continued struggle of anti-culture cavemen against modern civilization. Further, corruption, and failed policies are being exposed, including our own MSM, the UN, various anti-American political positions from around the world, and the pointless democrat party's view of the facts.
There appears to be 3 kinds of people: Normal, modern humans; radical, stupid religious cavemen; and some kind of head-up-the-ass bystander with a self-fulfilling view of events.
If we could shake the bystanders out of their leftist clusterfuck, this whole thing would end and realistic order would be restored.
Happy New Year !

Posted by wxjames 2006-01-01 00:06|| 2006-01-01 00:06|| Front Page Top

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