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2005-01-30 Olde Tyme Religion

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Posted by Mike Sylwester 2005-01-30 1:49:19 PM|| || Front Page|| [11137 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 "Is it haram to make a living playing soccer or other sports?

"Allah TaÃ£la - the Creator of our Universe - declares in the Noble QurÃ£n, 'I have not created Man and Jinn except for (the purpose) of worship.' .... Rasulullah (Sallallaaahu Ãlayhi Wasallam) said, 'Every game of man is Haraam except three: a man plays with his wife, breaking (training) oneâs horse and archery.' Rasulullah (Sallallaaahu Ãlayhi Wasallam) said, 'Teach your children swimming and archery.' ... A sport/game which has no religious Or worldly benefit is not permissible. .... the sport/game should not resemble the sport/games specifically identified with other religious communities e.g. Yoga; which may have some worldly and/or religious benefit but includes an impermissible act e.g. wrestling (exposing the awrah). Due to the many evils in contemporary sports, it is not permissible to earn oneâs living through that."

Good heavens! No golf, baseball, or shooting hoops! And what is the awrah?

Posted by Korora 2005-01-30 4:12:16 PM|| [http://basementburrow.blogspot.com] 2005-01-30 4:12:16 PM|| Front Page Top

#2 fyi

mushrik = polytheist
dua = supplication
shirk = setting up a god or demigod to worship along with allah

Posted by mhw 2005-01-30 4:27:37 PM|| 2005-01-30 4:27:37 PM|| Front Page Top

#3 Thanks, Mike. Bandwidth is like memory, the price just keeps falling.

This should be put with the classics, in case any other Burgers have insomnia.

Posted by Mrs. Davis 2005-01-30 4:53:21 PM|| 2005-01-30 4:53:21 PM|| Front Page Top

#4 I stand beside myself with amazement.

Such a system, where things are so unclear that you must ask the Mullah if you can take a job . . . you cannot play soccer for a living?

As a Mormon, we don't hold with drinking, gambling, etc., but if we go to work for someone it is not our responsibility for selling the stuff (owning the business is distinctly different). You have to use your heart and your head (working for an abortion clinic would cross that line, IMHO) in who you will work for.

But not working for an institution which is in the business of providing captial in a way that no one else can? Even I can think of a multitude of simple methods around the strictures, which makes them meaningless. Have the bank buy the house, then charge you for it twice (look at your mortgage and this is what you are doing).

Posted by Jame Retief 2005-01-30 5:35:44 PM|| 2005-01-30 5:35:44 PM|| Front Page Top

#5 JR - They pay / collect "fees" which are simply usury by another name. Wotta joke.

Can you say Hypocrisy? Heh, I knew you could. ;-)

Posted by .com 2005-01-30 5:46:57 PM|| 2005-01-30 5:46:57 PM|| Front Page Top

#6 I don't understand why interest is such a big deal. You rent my truck, you pay a fee. You rent my money, you pay a fee. What's the difference?

Posted by BH 2005-01-30 6:18:25 PM|| 2005-01-30 6:18:25 PM|| Front Page Top

#7 Interest is a problem for Jews and Christians too because of Ex 22:25, Leviticus 25:36-37. Jews have a partial leniency from Deut 23:19-20 but there are numerous anti interest verses from the prophets.

Posted by mhw 2005-01-30 7:47:21 PM|| 2005-01-30 7:47:21 PM|| Front Page Top

#8 The difference, BH, is that the Koran disallows one, but not the other. When the Koran speaks, reason, logic, even common sense are shut out. When people ask about the Pharisees, tell them they are like Islam, but not so nit-picky.

Posted by jackal 2005-01-30 7:54:55 PM|| [http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html] 2005-01-30 7:54:55 PM|| Front Page Top

#9 Let's take this a step farther:

In the Koran there are two expressions that could be translated as interest:

Riba An-Nasia - Interest on lent money
Riba Al-Fadl - Interest on things, e.g., you lent me a shovel when it snows, then you have to pay back a shovel and a broom.

There are a number of verses in the Quran and many more in the Hadith and still more in the long discussions of the 4 schools of Islam about this. It is possible that, despite this, one could translate these terms as 'usury' rather than interest but its quite a stretch and it requires' basically ignoring huge numbers of legal precedents. In addition, the Quran and the Hadith specify some really, really nasty punishments.

By contrast, Jews and Christians have translated the hebrew words, 'neshekh and mashsha' and the greek word 'tokos'are frequently translated as 'usury' and there is a long history of post Talmudic and Christian jurisprudence that could support such a translation. Finally, the Hebrew and Christian bibles are light on specifying punishment (in contrast to the Quran)

Posted by mhw 2005-01-30 8:51:49 PM|| 2005-01-30 8:51:49 PM|| Front Page Top

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