Article

2004-11-09 Iraq-Jordan

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Bulldog 2004-11-09 7:26:56 AM|| || Front Page|| [11127 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 I'm sorry to see it, but this does confirm that different enemies call for different tactics. The Scots are looking more American every day now that they've met the Sunni.

Posted by Mrs. Davis 2004-11-09 7:33:19 AM|| 2004-11-09 7:33:19 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 Yep. The softly-softly, flexible, approach may have helped keep hearts and minds in Basra, but up north the they'll have to be protected, and wary of everyone, at all times. Bit of a culture shock for the boys. They've crossed to Derry from Londonderry.

Posted by Bulldog 2004-11-09 7:42:03 AM|| 2004-11-09 7:42:03 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 Yup B, time to deploy a nasty nasty approach , screw hearts and minds , theres too much at risk for the long term future of operations with that approach . Our silky gloves need to come off , the local population is with us or against us , simple . So what if we are hated up there , we are already .

Sniper deployment and snatch/bag raids please . Ohh and Tony B , send another support battalion out there please just to show we mean business , and watch the lefties scream !

Posted by MacNails 2004-11-09 7:56:09 AM|| 2004-11-09 7:56:09 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 Aye, high time to kick in a few doors..

Posted by Howard UK 2004-11-09 8:22:27 AM|| 2004-11-09 8:22:27 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 Aye, high time to kick in a few doors..

....toss in grenade, rinse, repeat.

Posted by Steve 2004-11-09 9:19:13 AM|| 2004-11-09 9:19:13 AM|| Front Page Top

#6 Bulldog: Yep. The softly-softly, flexible, approach may have helped keep hearts and minds in Basra, but up north the they'll have to be protected, and wary of everyone, at all times.

No offense, but I don't think the softly-softly approach did anything for British forces. They were simply lucky because the mass of the population were cooperative, and Sadr chose to make his stand in US-held territory. American troops were super-trusting of locals, even in hostile territory, until they started getting shot in the head at close range, while the locals cheered.

British exceptionalism in guerrilla warfare is a figment of the imagination. During the Malayan* Emergency, the British colonial authorities adopted nightly curfews through Malaya during the entire time they were in-country against a guerrilla force that was a fraction of the force in Iraq, and routinely hung captured communists. The soft-softly approach was a reaction to the low level of threat posed by non-entities like the much-hyped up and romanticized IRA. In Malaya, where, like Iraq, the opposition was actually capable of winning power via military victory, the British adopted harsh tactics that included compulsory relocation from vast areas of countryside and public hangings.

* Now Malaysia and Singapore

Posted by Zhang Fei 2004-11-09 10:04:48 AM|| [http://timurileng.blogspot.com] 2004-11-09 10:04:48 AM|| Front Page Top

#7 "When you have them by the balls, their hearts and minds generally follow." --LBJ

Posted by Psycho Hillbilly 2004-11-09 10:09:24 AM|| 2004-11-09 10:09:24 AM|| Front Page Top

#8 The Isrurgents are trying to 'punch' through; their supply lines are being choked off by the 'Black Watch', the US was correct in this assessment!

Posted by smn 2004-11-09 11:18:53 AM|| 2004-11-09 11:18:53 AM|| Front Page Top

#9 Good comment, Bulldog. The Black Watch has gone from Waterside to Bogside..

Posted by Alaska Paul 2004-11-09 11:27:45 AM|| 2004-11-09 11:27:45 AM|| Front Page Top

#10 I bow to your superior assumption-based assessment of the situation in Southern Iraq, Zhang Fei. If I follow you correctly, losing a mere twenty men to hostile action since the end of April last year has clearly just been down to 'luck'. Perhaps you ought to contact British military authorities in Basra and tell them how you could have slashed that number had you been in command.

You call it luck: I'd call it a proportionate response to the threat level posed. British forces have faced a number of uprisings in Basra and elsewhere, and have managed, each time, to quell the opposition using a combination of sufficient firepower and good cooperation from the locals. The US have been in a different situation and have handled things a different way. I'm not going to assume that I know how to do things better than the US military command, and I suggest you show a bit more humility towards the guys making the decisions on the ground on the British side. Flexibility is the key to effective military operations; your attitude seems pretty rigid to me. The Black Watch will adapt to their new environment just as the US military has.

The IRA are 'non-entities', 'much hyped' and 'romanticized'? Tell that to the relatives of the thousands who have died as a result of the Troubles, in Northern Ireland, Ireland, mainland UK and elsewhere, over years.

Posted by Bulldog 2004-11-09 11:43:47 AM|| 2004-11-09 11:43:47 AM|| Front Page Top

#11 Well, Bulldog, should the Loughlin (?) Hall action of 1987 be repeated en masse?

Posted by Phutch Javish6999 2004-11-09 12:27:02 PM|| 2004-11-09 12:27:02 PM|| Front Page Top

15:39 BH
15:39 BH
15:37 BH
15:37 BH
14:51 Old Grouch
14:51 Old Grouch
14:46 Old Grouch
14:46 Old Grouch
00:04 Bomb-a-rama
00:00 Ol_Dirty_American
00:00 SOG475
00:00 Phil Fraering
23:58 Ol_Dirty_American
23:57 SteveS
23:56 SOG475
23:55 Bomb-a-rama
23:54 Mike Sylwester
23:52 Aris Katsaris
23:50 SOG475
23:49 Sock Puppet of Doom
23:40 Aris Katsaris
23:40 OldSpook
23:38 Zenster
23:37 OldSpook