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2004-07-30 Arabia

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Posted by Dan Darling 2004-07-30 12:00:00 AM|| || Front Page|| [11134 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Can Powell make a difference and can he keep the progress going?

Posted by Lucky 2004-07-30 1:24:32 AM|| 2004-07-30 1:24:32 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 Thursday's State Department Press Briefing was rather brutal with respect to the questions and follow-ups concerning this issue(and every other issue discussed as well.) Here is a sample:

QUESTION 1: ... In London, an Arab League official said, "any such force would only be acceptable if ordered by the UN Security Council and linked to a specific timetable for withdrawal of U.S. forces from Iraq." How does the State Department feel about those conditions?

QUESTION 2: The Arab League statement isn't attached to any specific difficult or delicate or obscure detail and we all know it's in the preliminary stage. They're saying, "any such force can only be acceptable if ordered by the UN Security Council and linked to a specific timetable for withdrawal of U.S. forces from Iraq." Even though for your own good political reasons you are having the Saudis and the Iraqis up front on this, instead of the U.S., what they're saying deals specifically with the U.S., the Arab League. They say a timetable for U.S. forces. Presumably, the United States remains in control of its own forces. Is the U.S. prepared to withdraw its troops from Iraq in order to have Muslim countries contribute to peacekeeping operations there, as demanded by the Arab League?

I read these questions as a perception by the media that the Arab League plans to spike all Arab involvement until the US is out of Iraq or has set a definite date for leaving. I speculate that the Arab League is hoping that Bush is either defeated or succumbs to election pressure in a way that allows Iran and Syria to escape confrontation by getting American troops out of Iraq in the near term.

Some would say that the attacks in Iraq would tail off if Iraq was eliminated as a staging area for the next chapter of the WOT. I would say that similar thinking held that the removal of American troops from Vietnam would be a panacea for Southeast Asia.

Posted by Super Hose 2004-07-30 3:12:02 AM|| 2004-07-30 3:12:02 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 It's hard to say...we can't babysit Iraq indefinitely or at least I don't think we should get into another 50 year deployment of our troops like we did in Germany.

Frankly, I think we may need to use our military to defend our own borders. I'm serious. I don't think the ocean protects us anymore like it did in WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam. Trying to be an open society with OBL and his merry men recruiting new nutballs to penetrate thru the southern, northern borders is going to need something more than 2000 border guards.

Terrorism isn't going to go away just because Iraq has a democracy. The Muslim extremists hate us and they are reproducing like rabbits. With our immigration based on family reunification, we'll have more and more Arabs passing our borders back and forth...it'll be a matter of percentages, more bad guys will try to come thru.

European cities have military in their airports on their streets. When I was in Rome a couple of years ago, at night the military were at popular tourist sights along side the local cops.

Posted by rex 2004-07-30 3:28:10 AM|| 2004-07-30 3:28:10 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 rex,

Nobody is going to invade the U. S. unless we allow them to. And it won't take the whole Army to do it. Step 1 is build a wall, just like Israel. Step 2 is establish and enforce rigorous immigration laws. Step 3 is attack potential invaders where they live before they leave. It's up to us.

Posted by Mr. Davis 2004-07-30 7:44:06 AM|| 2004-07-30 7:44:06 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 The talk about a Muslim peacekeeping force is just Arab performance art.

The Saudis get to play the good guys by promising funds. The Iraqi govt gets to play the good guys by inviting co religionists to help. The govts of Indonesia, Malaysia, etc. which have competent armies get to be flattered but then get to pretend that they would help except for this and that condition.

However, the likelihood is that nothing will happen and the Iraqi people, will, assuming they win the war against the terrorists, have an extra portion of pride.

Posted by mhw 2004-07-30 9:23:28 AM|| 2004-07-30 9:23:28 AM|| Front Page Top

#6 I think its quite possible Morocco, Tunisia, Bahrain,Bangladesh, etc may manage to put together a modest force - if Albania and Kazahstan could be in the coalition of the willing, why not the above? And I cant see that they would bow to the Arab League.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-07-30 9:29:00 AM|| 2004-07-30 9:29:00 AM|| Front Page Top

#7 Hell the members of the Arab league are going to be arming the insurgents, not protecting Iraq. This whole thing is a crock. I hope that it is just a bone that Powell is throwing to the Arab states or something that he is doing for show to support the election. Having these assholes in Iraq is not going to do one positive thing.

Rex, we can and should stay there for a long time. It is in our national interest. We have to be there to truly learn the culture and have our intelligence get fully integrated into that society. If we are going to defeat our enemy, we have to know our enemy. We aren't going to be able to do that by just hanging in Dearborn, MI.

Posted by remote man 2004-07-30 12:58:24 PM|| 2004-07-30 12:58:24 PM|| Front Page Top

#8 LH-
If Morocco and the other smallish countries manage to provide, say 5000 people or fewer-- won't that small number be perceived by Iraqis as essentially a slap in the face to Iraq?

Posted by mhw 2004-07-30 1:07:16 PM|| 2004-07-30 1:07:16 PM|| Front Page Top

#9 We have to be there to truly learn the culture and have our intelligence get fully integrated into that society

And what a success story it was when we had troops in Soody Arabia learning about the culture, integrating our intelligence into the society, and learning more about the enemy. Yahoo! Now that was a winning strategy, wasn't it, folks.

Sorry, been there, done that, #7, and all we get in return is increased anti-American Arab Muslim hatred for being "infidels" soiling their magic religious soil. I'd give our presence in Iraq another 5 years MAXIMUM before it starts back firing BIGTIME on our GI's and on us. As I've said before, the faster we get our military out of sacrosanct Sunni/Shiite Iraq, the better.

Next idea, please...

Posted by rex 2004-07-30 1:13:11 PM|| 2004-07-30 1:13:11 PM|| Front Page Top

#10 From what I've read on Iraqi blogs, things are going quite well in Iraq, despite the efforts of several thousand foreign terrorists. After a shaky start, the Iraqi army and police forces are beginning to coalesce into a capable force, and are striking back, hard. We will need to stay in Iraq until those forces can become fully capable to defend Iraq on their own. That may be a year, it may be three years, it may be ten years. I doubt it will be more than five, personally, but that's just one slightly-uneducated guess, as opposed to a large number of other, equally uneducated guesses.

Right now, terrorist groups are pushing as hard as they can, hoping to influence the upcoming US election and defeat George Bush. If Bush wins, things will rapidly slack off in Iraq, as the potential for an early collapse of the Iraqi interim government will be virtually nil. Once we're passed the November elections (assuming a majority of the American electorate are not complete and total idiots), I expect a major counter-terrorism push by both US and Iraqi forces that will cause some significant, LASTING harm to the terrorist movement. I also expect that, either Syria, Iran, and Saudi Arabia will reduce or eliminate their support to terrorist groups in Iraq, or they will face military consequences for their continued activities.

The crap about "Islamic sentimentalities" is just that, CRAP. The Islamofascists don't want us in any nation where they are because we spoil their plans. The plain truth is that a lot of the people in Iraq, Afghanistan, and a few other places are damned happy we're there, and don't want us to leave until things are much more secure than they are at present. The ordinary people know the whining, seething, and spittle-spewing is being done primarily by types that want to put a foot on their necks, and they want no part of it.

As for securing our borders, the Israeli wall will be less than 200 miles long. It's a hell of a long way from Brownsville to Tiajuana, and most of it's pretty difficult terrain. The bad news is, that's the SHORT border. While we could build a fence, I'd bet the cat's whiskers most of the wire would be stolen before it was up two weeks. A concrete fence would take up about half the world's concrete for a year or more. There are other, better ways to secure the border, but they're not "nice", and our "friends" the Dummycheats won't let us play unless we're "nice".
Being "nice" to everybody is what's gotten us into this situation in the first place. I think it's time to tell the world, in the words of "St. Teresa", to "shove it", and back it up with an axehandle across the knuckles when they step out of line. Kofi "Cash for Terrorsts" Annan should be target #1.

Posted by Old Patriot 2004-07-30 6:00:25 PM|| [http://users.codenet.net/mweather/default.htm] 2004-07-30 6:00:25 PM|| Front Page Top

#11 Excellent sit rep analysis, as always, OP!
Thank you.

Posted by GreatestJeneration 2004-07-30 6:02:45 PM|| [http://www.greatestjeneration.com] 2004-07-30 6:02:45 PM|| Front Page Top

#12 Insightful comments, Old Patriot, not to mention that you also managed to keep everyone happy by coalescing seemingly conflicting opinions to make them work in concert woth one another. Are you a business manager or something like that where you need to herd cats[staff] in the same direction?

Posted by rex 2004-07-30 9:16:27 PM|| 2004-07-30 9:16:27 PM|| Front Page Top

#13 Actually, Rex, I spent 26 years learning how to read government pap and make sense of the small grains of truth buried in it. I also worked with enough classified information (reconnaissance imagery, technical reports, raw intercepts, you name it) to understand how the world really works, and how mindless, timid morons try to bury unwelcome news in bull$$$$. My military service, my retirement, and my current situation is old news to most Rantburg regulars.

Posted by Old Patriot 2004-07-31 12:01:08 AM|| [http://users.codenet.net/mweather/default.htm] 2004-07-31 12:01:08 AM|| Front Page Top

04:39 nuke israel
10:00 Anonymous6096
07:25 Dragon Fly
15:44 god save us from boors
09:45 GreatestJeneration
09:11 Aris Katsaris
06:16 98zulu
02:43 GreatestJeneration
02:18 Bulldog
02:13 Super Hose
02:10 Super Hose
00:56 Capt America
00:38 Old Grouch
00:38 Old Patriot
00:31 rex
00:30 Dar
00:22 Old Patriot
00:19 Red Lief
00:15 Old Patriot
00:06 Old Patriot
00:01 Old Patriot
23:23 sc88
23:21 Super Hose
23:18 Barbara Skolaut