Article

2003-05-01 Europe

Russia and France To Up Military Cooperation

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Posted by Tadderly 2003-05-01 08:33 am|| || Front Page|| [8 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 countries want to develop weaponry that could be sold to third countries and to hold joint training exercises Jeeze - Sadaam steps out of the picture as a sponsor of terrorism and these two step in to take his place.

Look at the ignoble goals they get from it. France gets to continue to pretend that it has more power than it really has. Russia gets to keep up the fight against democracy at the expense of its own people.

I think what we are seeing here is the tatters of an alliace that was being formed when Iraq convinced the leaders of France, Russia, Turkey, Germany and all the other usual suspects that they could take on the US and be the stars in a new balance of world power. Thankfully, Germany seems to be sobering to the realization that it's a game of chicken that is far too dangerous, and it's not really in their best interests to play.

Posted by Becky 2003-05-01 09:17:26|| 2003-05-01 09:17:26|| Front Page Top

#2 Wow ! am I wrong to think that something like this would concern Poland and perhaps a few other Eastern European countries. All we need now is a resurgence in Russian nationalism..

Posted by Domingo 2003-05-01 09:25:16|| 2003-05-01 09:25:16|| Front Page Top

#3 Actually it's the best France can do. Germans won't have much of a problem with some soldiers wearing a German-French-Belgian badge. But Russia? Nope.

German defense minister Struck will meet Rumsfeld in Washington and Colin Powell is due in Berlin later this month. The Frankfurter Allgemeine reports that leading German exporters are putting discreet but efficient pressure on Schroeder and it seems to work.

Best U.S. policy? Mending fences with Germany without hugging Schroeder and preparing the ground to restore the excellent transatlantic relationship in earnest once the CDU takes over.

If France beds down with Russia Germany can still hold good relations with Russia but in the same time reassure Eastern Europe that this alliance won't fly. Germany cannot oppose France openly but I think Chirac is doing his best to make sure that the new Franco-German alliance won't work for long.

Posted by True German Ally 2003-05-01 09:52:13|| 2003-05-01 09:52:13|| Front Page Top

#4 Alliot-Marie stressed that France and Russia historically had strong military ties that could help the two countries develop better relations in the 21st century.

That Napoleon thing worked out just fine, didn't it?

The French are patting Putin on the back, looking for the soft spot to sink the knife.

Posted by Raj 2003-05-01 09:52:31|| [angrycyclist.blogspot.com] 2003-05-01 09:52:31|| Front Page Top

#5 TGA--I hope you're right. I'd like to see the US/UK give Germany an out at the same time Chiraq distances you by cozying up to the Russians. We want Germany's friendship far more than France's fickle and begrudging tolerance.

Posted by Dar 2003-05-01 10:01:07|| 2003-05-01 10:01:07|| Front Page Top

#6 Ah, yes. Michele Aliot-Marie, also known as MAM in the French papers. She's a Gaullist party hack who, if I remember correctly, was chairperson of the RPR, now UMP (Former and current acronyms for Chirac's party). In the aftermath of Chirac's victory over Le Pen last year, she was given the defense portfolio. A total incompetent who doesn't know a thing about war/military but is a useful female token. I mean, look at this quote, " Aliot-Marie stressed France and Russia historiclly had old military ties..." Huh? When? Crimea? WWI? MAM, you sly coquette. Do you mean the cat's out of the bag? You mean during the Cold War, or just since 1989? Was that statement passed to her from her "senior aids that have family ties to Russia"? Molly Ivins, Helen Thomas, I've got an investigative reporting project for you!! Forget Harken and Halliburton! BTW, saw Molly's new look above her column in today's Chicago Tribune. I didn't know whether to jump out the window or charge through the nearest wall when I saw it. Cut short, permed, and blond. Starts the blood flowing just thinking about it.

Anyway, back to important matters. Chirac in his university days studied Russian language/culture and in his simple way thinks this is a way to counter Anglosphere/New Europe/Smart Countries. Advice to Putin: the French are radioactive. They just want access to your former commie and current dictatorship pals. Think Syria and Libya. Advice to Chirac: The Russians are radioactive. They just want access to your money and former colonial markets. Think Ivory Coast and Central African Republic. What a bonanza! Advice to TGA: Watch your East AND West now. What's your take on this, anyway, TGA? I think it's time Germany stopped being led around by the nose by France. First, it's the Belgian/Luxembourg/French/German HQ construct and now this? Stand up for yourself, Germany, and don't follow these losers.

Posted by Michael 2003-05-01 10:22:42|| 2003-05-01 10:22:42|| Front Page Top

#7 Dar, a lot of the anti-war hysteria in Germany came from the German media who are slowly sobering up, now that millions of refugees and streams of blood have not been showing up. The "war experts" seem to be rather silent these days.

Germans were rather thankful that France (and Russia) helped them out of political isolation that Schroeder had manouvred us in.

But we don't trust neither France nor Russia. For good reasons.

Posted by True German Ally 2003-05-01 10:24:04|| 2003-05-01 10:24:04|| Front Page Top

#8 Michael, I suspect these "ties" have something to do with the fact that the French are rumoured to have had secret deals with the Soviets that the Russkis would not cross the Rhine in case of an invasion.

Mourir pour l'Allemagne? Quelle horreur!

Posted by True German Ally 2003-05-01 10:34:05|| 2003-05-01 10:34:05|| Front Page Top

#9 Seems Poland joined NATO just in time...

Posted by RW 2003-05-01 11:47:24|| 2003-05-01 11:47:24|| Front Page Top

#10 Germany cannot oppose France openly

Why not? They opposed the US openly. Schroder didn't even can his aid that compared our president to Hitler until the election was in the bag.

Posted by g wiz 2003-05-01 11:57:29|| 2003-05-01 11:57:29|| Front Page Top

#11 Eh, you're saying the French made their own Ribbentrop-Molotov pact?

Posted by Dishman 2003-05-01 11:59:02|| 2003-05-01 11:59:02|| Front Page Top

#12 Hilariously stupid. Could the French make east & central Europe any more pissed off / aligned with the US?

Posted by someone 2003-05-01 12:00:39|| 2003-05-01 12:00:39|| Front Page Top

#13 "The meetings took place in a climate of great cordiality, great confidence and a very practical spirit with a look toward the future,"

Diplo-speak for "the Ruskies told us to take a hike"?

Posted by john 2003-05-01 12:31:22|| 2003-05-01 12:31:22|| Front Page Top

#14 I think there was alcohol involved.

Posted by Anonymous 2003-05-01 13:00:12|| 2003-05-01 13:00:12|| Front Page Top

#15 Putin doesn't drink

Posted by True German Ally 2003-05-01 13:31:33|| 2003-05-01 13:31:33|| Front Page Top

#16 liberalhawk-correct analysis.

I think even Schroeder is wisening up gradually so the vision doesn't have to rely that heavily on a CDU victory.

I still believe that Schroeder never wanted to go that far. But of course if you put fire to an oil well it takes a while to extinguish it. And the area around will be contaminated. Even the CDU has to tread lightly there. I don't think that the relations between the USA and Germany can be exactly the same as they were before. But sometimes the tea cups with a little crack hold out longer than the ones without.
Schroeder's relations with Blair are still good. Schroeder doesn't want a policy against the UK so France's options are limited. And Fischer may raise a lot of eyebrows here but without Schroeder he would definitely run a more pro-American ship in foreign policy.
Germany might not oppose France openly. But if France tries to backstab Germany with Russia that will backfire. (Russia won't trade Germany for France anyway, Putin is not stupid.) Germany has more political options than France. This is what France has been worrying about for the last decade.

Posted by True German Ally 2003-05-01 15:34:30|| 2003-05-01 15:34:30|| Front Page Top

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