Archived material Access restricted Article
Rantburg

Today's Front Page   View All of Wed 12/08/2004 View Tue 12/07/2004 View Mon 12/06/2004 View Sun 12/05/2004 View Sat 12/04/2004 View Fri 12/03/2004 View Thu 12/02/2004
1
2004-12-08 Iraq-Jordan
US Marine claims unit killed Iraqi civilians
Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.
Posted by God Save The WOrld 2004-12-08 8:21:35 PM|| || Front Page|| [11131 views since 2007-05-07]  Top

#1 "four separate cars which each failed to respond to a single warning shot and respond to hand signals"... "no weapons in the vehicles or evidence that those killed were anything but innocent civilians"

It' s called a war. If you are that stupid that you do not respond to clear signals, then you must be presumed that you have hostile intent. It is as simple as that.

"I was never clear on who was the enemy and who was not"

Yea, they seem to look alike and the enemy does not have "enemy" note written by sharpie on the forehead. It is kinda on purpose.

This is such a bunch of crap that iritates me to no end.
Posted by Sobiesky 2004-12-08 1:02:05 AM||   2004-12-08 1:02:05 AM|| Front Page Top

#2  "in graphic testimony to a Canadian tribunal probing an asylum claim by a US Army deserter."

The DNC couldn't have written a better script.

I'm sure if the civilians had reacted to 1) a warning shot and 2) hand and arm signals these civilians would NOT have been shot. It's called "Rules of Engagement" and the "deserter" should have studied them a little more. The soldiers were well within their rights and I would have made the same call.

Come back and talk to me when we start shooting people at random without warning for no reason.

Posted by 98zulu 2004-12-08 1:52:48 AM||   2004-12-08 1:52:48 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 Winter Soldier II.
Posted by .com 2004-12-08 1:55:16 AM||   2004-12-08 1:55:16 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 Could it be that the deliberate use of suicide carbombs as a tactic of war caused US forces to drop the Officer Friendly attitude to any vehicles that didn't stop at checkpoints? Our tsk-tsk loving neighbors to the north don't seem to realize that carbombs are considered outside the "rules of war". Maybe the upstanding Canuckistaners will outlaw carbombs so they will never be used again.
Posted by ed 2004-12-08 4:00:32 AM||   2004-12-08 4:00:32 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 Ed, our upstanding Canusckistaners can outlaw anything, but the question is if it is relevant any.

Anyway, I doubt that IRB would be inclined to involve somme fuzzy feelings in regards to the claimant and buy that crap. I mean, we don't have much of an army and this would set a bad precedent (not sure where canuck soldiers would claim asylum, North Korea?), it was a bit different with conscripts during Vietnam war, but in this case it's someone who signed up.
Posted by Sobiesky 2004-12-08 5:46:05 AM||   2004-12-08 5:46:05 AM|| Front Page Top

#6 It's good that war is so terrible --- otherwise we'd learn to love it.
Posted by gromgorru  2004-12-08 7:06:30 AM||   2004-12-08 7:06:30 AM|| Front Page Top

#7 US Army deserter say no more.
Posted by 2b 2004-12-08 7:23:57 AM||   2004-12-08 7:23:57 AM|| Front Page Top

#8 Yeah, by the article's own reporting, this Marine is suffering from PTSD and severe depression. The PTSD means he might be hallucinatory, and the severe depression means that he has a problem with magnifying and dwelling upon negative stimuli and warped recollection of past negative stimuli. The combination ought to render him incompetent to offer testimony in any well-run court.

GSTW, FOAD.
Posted by Mitch H.  2004-12-08 8:15:43 AM|| [http://blogfonte.blogspot.com/]  2004-12-08 8:15:43 AM|| Front Page Top

#9 Any bets his asylum is rejected ?
Posted by crazyhorse  2004-12-08 8:50:09 AM||   2004-12-08 8:50:09 AM|| Front Page Top

#10 So, no self-serving interest in lying there, huh?
Posted by mojo  2004-12-08 11:15:26 AM||   2004-12-08 11:15:26 AM|| Front Page Top

#11 Is he planning to run for President in 30 years?
Posted by bw 2004-12-08 11:45:01 AM||   2004-12-08 11:45:01 AM|| Front Page Top

#12 Marine Corps spokesman Maj. Douglas Powell at the Pentagon said Massey's charges had been investigated and were unproved. Massey is a former Marine recruiter who served in Iraq as the staff sergeant for a platoon that ranged from 25 to 50 men. He said his men, fearing suicide bombers, poured massive firepower into cars that did not stop as they approached the roadblocks. In each instance, he said, none of the cars was found to have contained explosives or arms.

Tough for them, but they should have stopped.
Posted by Steve  2004-12-08 11:51:44 AM||   2004-12-08 11:51:44 AM|| Front Page Top

#13 Whats that song...

You dont put on superman's cape...
You don't spit into the wind...
You don't pull the mask of the ole lone ranger...
[You dont drive fast toward a MARINE checkpoint...]
And you dont mess around with jim...
Posted by CrazyFool  2004-12-08 12:45:00 PM||   2004-12-08 12:45:00 PM|| Front Page Top

#14 failed to find a weapon?
Cars can be weapons...
forest, for the trees.
Posted by Dishman  2004-12-08 2:42:19 PM||   2004-12-08 2:42:19 PM|| Front Page Top

#15 Pathetic twit. Declare him persona non grata and don't ever let him back in this country.
Posted by RWV 2004-12-08 2:52:41 PM||   2004-12-08 2:52:41 PM|| Front Page Top

#16 This is old news. I remember each one of those incidents being splashed all over the "news" when they happened. They even showed film of one of the incidents when our guys shot up a vehicle that didn't stop at a checkpoint. Tragic, but perfectly understandable under the circumstances. To try to impute a whiff of war crimes to these incidents is just execrable.
Posted by Xbalanke  2004-12-08 3:19:34 PM||   2004-12-08 3:19:34 PM|| Front Page Top

#17 Couple of useful idiots. Don't come back. If you do, you will be persecuted by some pissed off Marines. Pussies.
Posted by Phiter Glolung1555 (aka Jarhead) 2004-12-08 5:34:25 PM||   2004-12-08 5:34:25 PM|| Front Page Top

#18 This is truly out of the Anti-War play book and how far down the road will be an Oliver Stone docu-fantasy ala Born on the Fourth of July. For those of you that missed it:

In BOTFOJ,a teenager (played by Tom Cruise) Kovic joins the Marines, and is sent to Vietnam where he is permanently crippled.

Kovic is sent back home and, at first, pretends that everything is all right – but it isn't. He's soon swearing at his parents, breaking down in tears, yelling about the horrific images he witnessed in Vietnam, cursing America – all this leading to his own self-destruction.

Kovic's story is a true one, but it is also greatly exaggerated by Stone with his use of factual inaccuracies and manipulation of truth. Cruise's performance is one of his finest (and he was nominated for Best Actor in 1989), but both he and Stone try too hard – they take a good story and turn it into an overwhelming anti-war propaganda piece. The movie feels like it has no purpose – as if Stone is using it as an excuse to bombard us with more of his theories about warfare and how wrong it is.

War happens. And we can't ignore it. A movie such as "Born on the Fourth of July" takes a stab at a specific event in America's past, shaming the veterans (Kovic included) through its ignorant and naïve outlook. Stone spends so much time trying to convince us why Vietnam was a blunder, and why it was a disgrace, and why it was a horrible decision, and why Republicans are idiots (check out the grand finale outside the Republican National Convention), and why Kovic's fight for "the truth" is honorable, that he forgets to honor the vets themselves.

As Jarhead said, if his fellow Marines (hey, finally Massey can be accurately called an "ex-Marine", catch up to Massey, they may well help him reprise the Tom Cruise role...broken legs, to match his obvious break with the Corps and his former fellow Marines.
Posted by Uleque Glavise4887 2004-12-08 10:47:23 PM||   2004-12-08 10:47:23 PM|| Front Page Top

06:02 reesh
23:52 Carl in N.H.
23:33 Bomb-a-rama
23:30 anonymous2U
23:21 Uleque Glavise4887
23:12 Alaska Paul
23:11 Bomb-a-rama
23:10 2b
23:06 Alaska Paul
23:06 Uleque Glavise4887
23:02 2b
23:00 True German Ally
22:57 gromky
22:54 Uleque Glavise4887
22:47 Uleque Glavise4887
22:46 Alaska Paul
22:36 Laurence of the Rats
22:23 gromky
22:13 Alaska Paul
22:09 Asedwich
22:07 smn
22:04 Frank G
21:43 Uleque Hupavise4887
21:42 Anonymoose









Paypal:
Google
Search WWW Search rantburg.com