Article

2015-11-24 The Grand Turk

Putin calls Turkey's downing of Russian jet a 'stab in the back'

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Posted by g(r)omgoru 2015-11-24 08:40|| || Front Page|| [11129 views ] Top

#1 Hard to argue with that. The question is how will he respond, and how will NATO respond if Turkey is attacked. There is potential here for very bad things - see Sarajevo, 1914 - though I doubt we will see a NATO response to a Russian retaliation against Turkey beyond a harshly worded letter. That, of course, would further embolden Putin to do whatever he wanted (in this case, slapping Erdogan is fine with me, just on general principles.)

Posted by Glenmore 2015-11-24 08:55|| 2015-11-24 08:55|| Front Page Top

#2 Expel Turkey from NATO.

Posted by swksvolFF 2015-11-24 09:00|| 2015-11-24 09:00|| Front Page Top

#3 The same Turkey that once it granted Obama operational space in Incirlik turned around and immediately attacked the Kurds who were fighting ISIS?

Posted by Procopius2k 2015-11-24 09:07|| 2015-11-24 09:07|| Front Page Top

#4 I have no doubt the Russians will punish Turkey. E.g. send weapons to the Kurds, maybe shoot a couple of Turkish planes down if they venture close enough to Syrian airspace.

Of deeper consequence is what NATO will choose to do. The usual cowardice, or courage to identify and deliberately oppose the enemy?

Posted by si vis pacem, para bellum 2015-11-24 09:48|| 2015-11-24 09:48|| Front Page Top

#5 Expel Turkey from NATO. They are not friends of the West, and haven't been for a while. Let them choke on their own ashes.

Posted by Whiskeymike 2015-11-24 09:48|| 2015-11-24 09:48|| Front Page Top

#6 The same Turkey that didn't stand with us in 2003?

Posted by Steve White 2015-11-24 09:49|| 2015-11-24 09:49|| Front Page Top

#7 "Of deeper consequence is what NATO will choose to do. The usual cowardice, or courage to identify and deliberately oppose the enemy?"

I think the definition of enemy is vague given the region/situation/point in time. Which party is more likely to stand with us against the Islamists? Putin would be a better frenemy in that case. I am NOT a fan of Putin, but Erdoğan is not our friend.

Posted by Whiskeymike 2015-11-24 09:58|| 2015-11-24 09:58|| Front Page Top

#8 The Rooshuns were acting as if they owned all the airspace above and around Syria. The Turks have repeatedly warned the Russians (and Syrians) to stay out of their airspace. So yesterday they made good on that. You have to back up your warnings, after all.

Posted by Steve White 2015-11-24 10:03|| 2015-11-24 10:03|| Front Page Top

#9 Valid point, Steve.

Posted by Whiskeymike 2015-11-24 10:05|| 2015-11-24 10:05|| Front Page Top

#10 This is all just as stupid as 1914. It is also a direct result of our meddling in the Middle East. And for what? How did it benefit us to get rid of Saddam, Qdaffy, Mubarak? How would it benefit us to get rid of Assad?

Oh well, maybe another world war will clear the air. Make the world safe for democracy or something.

Posted by Abu Uluque 2015-11-24 10:21|| 2015-11-24 10:21|| Front Page Top

#11 maybe another world war will clear the air
No, but the dust cloud would kick in the nuclear winter effect, and counterbalance the global warming that is responsible for Islamic terrorism.

Posted by Glenmore 2015-11-24 10:30|| 2015-11-24 10:30|| Front Page Top

#12 The Rooshuns were acting as if they owned all the airspace above and around Syria. The Turks have repeatedly warned the Russians (and Syrians) to stay out of their airspace. So yesterday they made good on that. You have to back up your warnings, after all.

Seems to me the Russians were relying on a common sense response from Turkey. Seems to me some Turkish general was out to prove his manhood. This should have been dealt with behind closed doors, not in real time.

Posted by gorb 2015-11-24 11:39|| 2015-11-24 11:39|| Front Page Top

#13 Indeed. Scrambling a flock of interceptors to chase the intruder off is one thing, actively shooting down the plane quite another. The Turks were mad because the Russians are killing their pawns. I'm surprised Erdogan was willing to take this to the next level.

Any naval movement towards Constantinople?

Posted by SteveS 2015-11-24 12:15|| 2015-11-24 12:15|| Front Page Top

#14 SteveWhite. A long time ago Russia and America were allies against the Nazis. Time to dust up that alliance this time against the islamo-nazis.

But of course that will not be made until Omuslim is out of the WH. I fear what can happen in the interim

Posted by JFM 2015-11-24 12:36|| 2015-11-24 12:36|| Front Page Top

#15 Taking out Saddam was not a mistake. Given the time and issues surrounding 9/11 it was necessary. The aftermath was not well done.

Taking out Mubarak, Qaddaffi, going after Assad were pointless and screwed the region for good and all.

Erdogan thinks he is the big boy on that block now and deserves a slap down. Arranging/allowing for Putin to do it would be another colossal mistake but is about what I expect from our current regime.

Posted by AlanC 2015-11-24 12:40|| 2015-11-24 12:40|| Front Page Top

#16 Reportedly the order was given directly by Prime Minister Erdogan... If the Russian plane did enter Turkish airspace, it was only a few seconds according to US Defense analysis.

Posted by si vis pacem, para bellum 2015-11-24 13:10|| 2015-11-24 13:10|| Front Page Top

#17 Rooshun presidential spox Dmitri Peskov said a Russian military response to the incident is not on the table

Posted by badanov 2015-11-24 13:24|| http://www.chriscovert.net 2015-11-24 13:24|| Front Page Top

#18 "Yippy, try the sushi, it's to die for"

Posted by Frank G 2015-11-24 13:28|| 2015-11-24 13:28|| Front Page Top

#19 At #15: Mubarak's time had come. He was so old he was just about embalmed. Had he stayed on to the end his evil spawn would have taken power. The problem wasn't displacing Mubarak, it was allowing the Muslim Brotherhood to take power. That's completely at the feet of Obama. Sisi was there and ready the entire time.

Taking out Daffy was indeed pointless from a geopolitical standpoint, as he'd been neutered by Dubya. Daffy was still an evil asshole, so I don't regret too much what happened to him. But the 'aftermath' in Libya has been a complete (and foreseeable) Charlie Fox.

And why anyone, anyone in the West thought that a "red line" would unhorse Assad is beyond me. Assad leaves office only when he's dead, and Obama wasn't ready to arrange that.

Posted by Steve White 2015-11-24 13:48|| 2015-11-24 13:48|| Front Page Top

#20 The Russians and Kurds are interfering with the ISIS oil pipeline to Turkey. Can't have that, now, somebody won't get paid.

Posted by Deacon Blues 2015-11-24 14:07|| 2015-11-24 14:07|| Front Page Top

#21 The Russians have played this game before... many times. They had it coming.

Posted by European Conservative 2015-11-24 15:38|| 2015-11-24 15:38|| Front Page Top

#22 SteveW, Mubarak was on the way out naturally, there was no need for the Incompetent/Evil in Chief to try and insert himself/us in the situation. I can't imagine what Bozo would do differently if his goal was the elevation of the MoBro to dominance in the entire region.

The other "incidents" comport with your view, feckless, ignorant and stupid.

Posted by AlanC 2015-11-24 16:55|| 2015-11-24 16:55|| Front Page Top

#23 The Russo-Ottoman now Russo-Turkey rivalry for control of the Bosphorus + Black Sea Region, Trade has been going on for centuries.

OTOH NATO Treaty = US-signed Mutual Defense-Security Treaties wid various East Asia Allies = ONE OF THE BEST WAYS FOR ANTI-US US OWG GLOBALIST POTUS OBAMA TO PCORRECTLY COVERTLY BUT INTENTIONALLY ALIENATE US REGIONAL ALLIES + EMPOWER ANTI-US OWG-NWO + "CO-SUPERPOWER" RUSSIA, CHINA, + IRAN, ETAL. LED OWG GLOBAL FEDERAL UNION IS FOR THE BAMMER = USA TO NOT RESPOND EFFEC TO ANY MAJOR OR PER SE VIOLATION(S) OF SAIDSAME MUTUAL DEFENSE-SECURITY TREATIES.

Again, US-LED ANTI-US OWG-NWO + GLOBALISM = US HELPS ITS GEOPOL RIVALS OR "GREAT POWER" WANNABES - STATES + NGOS - TO BECOME MILPOL OR GEOPOL STRONGER OR MORE POWERFUL RELATIVE TO THE US ITSELF.

Where the US-N-Only-The-US devols itself to being just One-of-Many OWG-NWO "Co-Superpowers".

E.g. Russia = Putin + Lavrov-desired GLOBAL "MULTI-POLARITY", NOT UNI-POLAR.

MINIMA OR ROUGH "PARITY" WID THE US, N-O-T "INFERIORITY" [Not Lessor = Subservience] TO THE US.

HOW RUSSIA = PUTIN RESPONDS = OBAMA/US' LACK OF RESPONSE???

Posted by JosephMendiola 2015-11-24 20:08|| 2015-11-24 20:08|| Front Page Top

#24 Obama, the naiad of the Arab Spring?

Remember all those American NGOs who were issued arrest warrants for illegally politicking? Remember how pissy Obama was when Morsi was ousted; hell contracts were suspended and Egypt scolded. Daffy and Assad were supposed to just hang your hat, old boy, the days of your kind are over. When they fought back, and started winning, is when NATO began military operations - the NFZs, bullets and beans. That effort only left a void in Libya and introduced actual Iranian and Russian troops in Syria.

Could you imagine: an Obama elected -cough- head of government in Libya, Egypt, and Syria, with BFF Erdogon in Turkey, overviewing that trio, and we see where he wants to go, and if Obama's A-Team electioneers had defeated Netenyahu and Israel had their version of John Kerry at the helm?

Erdogon has been trying to get official NATO entry since his F-4 got shot down over Syria. Money from human trafficking. Money from oil. Money for arms trafficking.

Posted by swksvolFF 2015-11-24 20:30|| 2015-11-24 20:30|| Front Page Top

#25 Perhaps BHARAT RAKSHAK + DEFENCE.PK/FORUMS Blogger(s) said it best, namely that "TURKEY WILL FIND OUT IFF THEY ARE A REAL GREAT POWER OR SUPERPOWER [includ OWG Co-Superpower?], OR IFF THEY ARE A GARBAGE DUMP"!?

Yuuup.

By the above scope, Turkey = Russia, China, + Iran, Other? in finding out their role or value to the Globies + future [US-led Anti-US] OWG-NWO.

Posted by JosephMendiola 2015-11-24 22:48|| 2015-11-24 22:48|| Front Page Top

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