Article

2008-11-19 -Short Attention Span Theater-

Today in History: The Gettysburg Address

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Mike 2008-11-19 09:01|| || Front Page|| [11126 views ] Top

#1 government of the people, by the people, for the people
The best definition of American democracy ever.

Compare to the UN/EU/O-cult definition:
government of the elite, by the elite, for the elite

Posted by Spot">Spot 2008-11-19 09:29|| 2008-11-19 09:29|| Front Page Top

#2 Short Attention Span Theater?

Posted by European Conservative 2008-11-19 10:23|| 2008-11-19 10:23|| Front Page Top

#3 After all, European Conservative, tomorrow it won't be the anniversary... although I s'pose one could read it again tomorrow to commemorate the day after the anniversary ;-)

Posted by trailing wife ">trailing wife 2008-11-19 10:51|| 2008-11-19 10:51|| Front Page Top

#4 Speaking of elites, the London Times had this commentary on Linclon's Address:

The ceremony was rendered ludicrous by some of the sallies of that poor President Lincoln. Anything more dull and commonplace it would not be easy to produce.

Posted by DoDo 2008-11-19 11:08|| 2008-11-19 11:08|| Front Page Top

#5 I put the "Today in History" items under "SAST" because they don't necessarily fit anywhere else.

Posted by Mike 2008-11-19 14:20|| 2008-11-19 14:20|| Front Page Top

#6 Do you Americans realize how important this moment was?

At this point in time, all the large democracies in the world had failed. The Kings and Counts had returned to rule in Europe, and exerted their control in the colonial areas.

The European aristocracy then, as now, looked down on the USA as commoners and barbarians. They expected such low class people to be incapable of governing themselves without the guidance of their betters.

The aristocracy were expecting the USA to demolish itself, as had the French Revolution and other attempts at democracy. They were waiting for the ruling class to emerge and impose itself, dispose of the rights of the individual, and assert the rights of Kings.

At Gettysburg, it can be said that history was on a knife's edge balance.

Had the US torn itself permanently asunder, then a truly republican democracy, where rights are vested in the individual and the state is restrained, would have faded from the world in the aftermath.

Truly, the heroes of Gettysburg won this battle for all the world, and all the freed peoples, by insuring "that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth."

President Lincoln was wise beyond his time and place when he wrote those words.

Thank you USA.

Posted by Lagom 2008-11-19 14:31|| 2008-11-19 14:31|| Front Page Top

#7 Short Attention Span Theater?
Seeing as that the world little noted nor long remembered what was said there, and all...

Posted by Grenter, Protector of the Geats 2008-11-19 16:03|| 2008-11-19 16:03|| Front Page Top

#8 However...Emancipation Proclamation annexes allowed residual slavery - including some in Gettysburg - until the death of current slaves.

The North didn't confront the South to advance "freedom": the purpose was to "Preserve the Union." Hell is full of politicians who attached "freedom" to private agendas.

"Government by the people"? Hitler was popular until the demise of his regime. Put OUR security concerns over freedom claims of savages. Yah, the Iraqi and Afghan wastes of flesh can go to hell.

Posted by Uleresing Barnsmell6116 2008-11-19 16:16|| 2008-11-19 16:16|| Front Page Top

#9 Hitler most certainly was popular, but his rule could hardly be characterized as democratic... and his ascension to power was a perversion of the Weimar system as well, as I recall.

As for the Proclamation annexes, Mr. Lincoln was a child of the American frontier; hence he was very aware of the real-world limits to idealism, despite his personal hatred of slavery.

Posted by trailing wife 2008-11-19 17:14|| 2008-11-19 17:14|| Front Page Top

#10 The North didn't confront the South to advance "freedom": the purpose was to "Preserve the Union."

Strange how rationalizing people ignore the passage of the 13th, 14th and 15th Amendments. It wasn't a coincidence as to when and why they were passed.

Amendment 13 - Slavery Abolished. Ratified 12/6/1865.

1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.

2. Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

Amendment 14 - Citizenship Rights. Ratified 7/9/1868.

1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

2. Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice-President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.

3. No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

4. The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.

5. The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.

Amendment 15 - Race No Bar to Vote. Ratified 2/3/1870.

1. The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.

2. The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

Posted by Procopius2k 2008-11-19 17:28|| 2008-11-19 17:28|| Front Page Top

#11 Oh, and thank you for, Lagom, for the international perspective so elegantly presented.

Posted by trailing wife 2008-11-19 17:33|| 2008-11-19 17:33|| Front Page Top

#12 Obama thinks he is Lincoln according to Newsweak and Tyhme. So, does he think we are entering a civil war or what?

Posted by Jack is Back!">Jack is Back! 2008-11-19 19:34|| 2008-11-19 19:34|| Front Page Top

23:36 SteveS
23:15 Hammerhead
23:14 Alaska Paul
23:11 Verlaine
23:08 JosephMendiola
22:57 JosephMendiola
22:52 Zhang Fei
22:49 Zhang Fei
22:26 Frank G
22:25 Ready Kilowatt
22:21 trailing wife
21:58 tipper
21:53 3dc
21:51 SteveS
21:44 Old Patriot
21:28 3dc
21:22 3dc
21:10 Rex Mundi
21:05 3dc
20:38 Zenobia Ebbomose aka Broadhead6
20:31 3dc
20:30 Besoeker
20:30 3dc
20:24 3dc