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2007-07-31 Europe
EU demands equal U.S. visa treatment for all of the bloc's citizens
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Posted by lotp 2007-07-31 00:00|| || Front Page|| [4 views ]  Top

#1 They need our tourism way more than we need theirs. Until Europe addresses the threat of Islamic terrorism in a far more substantial manner, they can blow it out their metric diameter tailpipes.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2007-07-31 00:23||   2007-07-31 00:23|| Front Page Top

#2 Quite fair. We won't give no stinkin' visas to any of you. You either adhere to our few small rules or stay the hell home.
Posted by Woozle Elmeter2970 2007-07-31 01:39||   2007-07-31 01:39|| Front Page Top

#3 The visa thing for Poland, Hungary and then Czechoslovakia was to keep their people from staying on illegally to work. I had an au pair who got caught up in that, when we wanted to bring her with us skiing in Colorado (so we ended up going to Switzerland instead). At this point, with all the Polish plumbers and such in England, and their own economies growing nicely the last time I looked, it might be time to readdress this.
Posted by trailing wife 2007-07-31 05:14||   2007-07-31 05:14|| Front Page Top

#4 Well, OK. But first you have to pare yourselves down to one seat in the UN -- including the security council.

Or maybe you can keep all of yours, and we'll toss in another 49 for ourselves.
Posted by Rob Crawford">Rob Crawford  2007-07-31 05:28||   2007-07-31 05:28|| Front Page Top

#5 They need our tourism way more than we need theirs.

I'm buried in other things right now and can't verify or disprove that claim - could you provide stats to back it up?

Business travel on short notice is another major issue here, besides tourism. Stats on that would be interesting as well.

Preferably adjusted for shifts in exchange rates, but any stats along these lines might be insightful.
Posted by lotp 2007-07-31 06:22||   2007-07-31 06:22|| Front Page Top

#6 Well, OK. But first you have to pare yourselves down to one seat in the UN

You mean like Burkina-Faso's?

I say let the Euros have their seats. And give us one seat for each state, plus maybe one for Puerto Rico as well.
Posted by lotp 2007-07-31 06:25||   2007-07-31 06:25|| Front Page Top

#7 How about they can have our seat at the UN, too? Take the whole thing and shove it where the sun don't shine.
Posted by Spot">Spot  2007-07-31 08:25||   2007-07-31 08:25|| Front Page Top

#8 I'm a UK citizen not a EU citizen.

Maybe the US should make it next to impossible for EU passport holders to come to the US, their likely to be tranzis anyway.
Posted by Bright Pebbles 2007-07-31 11:25||   2007-07-31 11:25|| Front Page Top

#9 I like your thinkin' RC (#4), and even more so, Spot (#7).

And, this has been discussed before, but how much water does this "business trip" argument really hold? How many folks really go on a last-minute trip overseas (within 2 days) w/o tons of preplanning. Or, on the flip side, if a deal is really that last minute and/or important, can't it wait 2 days?
Posted by BA 2007-07-31 14:20||   2007-07-31 14:20|| Front Page Top

#10 Asking always works better then demanding.

Demanding is an aggressive act.
Posted by 3dc 2007-07-31 14:45||   2007-07-31 14:45|| Front Page Top

#11 They're on a shopping spree thanks to the weak dollar. When EU and UK have to stop laundering AQ then we'll talk.
Posted by regular joe 2007-07-31 16:26||   2007-07-31 16:26|| Front Page Top

#12 We once moved continents in 19 days... and Mr. Wife's company once tried on Monday to get him to start a new assignment in Beijing on Friday with family to follow as soon as I could organize it, but I don't remember any emergency business trips. That doesn't mean there weren't any since he was first given international responsibilities in 1985, but still. Anything that urgent can generally be handled by phone, fax and email.

Of course, Mr. Wife isn't a senior executive, or going to the farthest-off-the-beaten-track locations (none of which are in the U.S. as far as I know). I'm not a business person myself, but I can't come up with an emergency situation that couldn't be handled with phone, fax, email, and a local contact. No statistics, though, lotp. Sorry.
Posted by trailing wife 2007-07-31 16:32||   2007-07-31 16:32|| Front Page Top

#13 I'm buried in other things right now and can't verify or disprove that claim - could you provide stats to back it up?

It is extremely difficult to locate recent spending numbers.

From the Bureau of Economic Analysis in the Department of Commerce in conjunction with Tourism Industries.

U.S. International Travel Receipts and Payments (Millions of Dollars)

[USA versus Europe]

Year 1999 — Inbound travel receipts = $25,971,000

Year 1999 — Outbound travel receipts = $21,066,000

The 1999 numbers are within less than 20% of each other. Due to a huge decline in value of the dollar against the Euro (from 1.20 down to 0.90), the 1999 numbers can only have taken a major hit. While Europeans may account for more tourists in America, we have significantly more productive industrial sectors that reduce our dependence upon tourist dollars from abroad. Europe is heavily dependent upon its tourist economy and the significant reduction in American tourism is ripping them a new one.

An excerpt from the Christian Science Monitor:

Europe pines for big-spending US tourists

But no one has yet managed to lure back the high-rollers of the tourism industry - the Americans. Some have stayed away due to war and terrorism concerns; others have adopted an "America first" patriotic approach to vacationing; still others are deterred by the weak dollar, which makes foreign holidays more expensive.

In Britain - the most popular destination for American tourists to Europe - figures for the first half of 2003 show an 11 percent decline in US visitors. In Italy, it's more than 20 percent, while in France, it's even worse: an estimated 26 percent drop this year.

"Until Sept. 11, about 45 percent of our clients were Americans," laments Mauricio Mistarz, head receptionist at a small three-star hotel on the Left Bank in Paris. "Now, on a good day, Americans fill 20 percent of our rooms."

American visitors tend to stay longer and spend more than any other tourists. In France last year, the Americans spent more than British and Irish visitors combined, despite being outnumbered 5 to 1. In Britain, the average American spends $1,000 a trip, far outstripping European visitors. All of this means that US reluctance to travel costs European tourism dear.
[emphasis added]

I'd say Europe is taking it in the shorts. Which is pretty much what they deserve after riding on America's NATO coat-tails for long only to run away bow out of fighting global terrorism. I'll refrain from going into how they have abetted our worst enemies despite American protests.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2007-07-31 16:55||   2007-07-31 16:55|| Front Page Top

#14 Those're 2003 stats, Zen.

I'd guess that 2007 US travel to Europe is WAY up; EVERYbody I know (present company excepted) has been to Italy this year and reports it was wall-to-wall Yanks.

And US tourism from overseas is definitely down from a few articles I've read. The visa nonsense is a very good explanation. Hassling regular folks gets us exactly NOWHERE in the greater War on Terror.

And never forget the jihadis' goal is to strangle Freedom: Freedom of thought, Freedom of movement, Freedom of choice.
Posted by Seafarious">Seafarious  2007-07-31 17:05||   2007-07-31 17:05|| Front Page Top

#15 But again, this isn't about French or German or Italian travellers. It's about those from Poland, Hungary and the Czech Republic, who are being treated as if the Warsaw Pact still holds. Any fussing by the West Europeans is over the airlines passing on personal information to the American authorities.
Posted by Snotch Grundy3019 2007-07-31 17:47||   2007-07-31 17:47|| Front Page Top

#16 Those're 2003 stats, Zen.

You'd think a three year-old article wouldn't pop up at the top of a Google search. I still maintain that Europe is far more dependent upon international tourism than America is.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2007-07-31 19:34||   2007-07-31 19:34|| Front Page Top

#17 Isn't there a program to pre-screen businessmen?
Posted by CrazyFool 2007-07-31 19:40||   2007-07-31 19:40|| Front Page Top

#18 Wouldn't all this get sorted out real quickly with a bit of, you know, profiling?

Me? I'd have phrases from the Koran woven into carpets at airports (teeny-tiny so's infidels don't see 'em), but that's just me - and I don't count 'cos I don't have an interest group to shriek for me...

I miss the nonchalant approach to air-travel I used to have :(
Posted by Tony (UK) 2007-07-31 20:41||   2007-07-31 20:41|| Front Page Top

23:58 OldSpook
23:57 Zenster
23:48 Xenophon
23:47 Zenster
23:43 trailing wife
23:33 Anonymoose
23:22 JosephMendiola
23:17 JosephMendiola
23:07 Pappy
22:48 Zenster
22:48 Broadhead6
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22:28 Sigmund Freud
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