Article

2005-04-08 Syria-Lebanon-Iran

Bashar lauds Turkey for resisting US pressure

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Posted by Fred 2005-04-08 00:00:00|| || Front Page|| [11125 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Recep Tayyip Erdogan and his Justice and Development Party are leading Turkey towards a military and political disaster. Visibly distancing itself from and aligning itself against the US is not healthy in the modern world. The EU has negligible military power and its nation states fragile economies. It is hard to see how EU membership in 10 -15 years and the Chinese military will be a substitute for the US as an ally. As some of the Turks are speculating in their press, the US should replace its bases in Turkey with bases in Kurdistan and let the chips fall where they may.

Posted by RWV 2005-04-08 12:28:51 AM|| 2005-04-08 12:28:51 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 Excellent idea, good riddance of US bases.

Posted by Murat 2005-04-08 4:35:19 AM|| 2005-04-08 4:35:19 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 Say your goodbyes to EU entry in that case.

Posted by Howard UK 2005-04-08 5:05:45 AM|| 2005-04-08 5:05:45 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 Bye to US bases in Turkey, hello to US bases in Northern Kurdistan, after the Kurds rip their territory free from the grip of the remnants of the Ottoman Empire. For it is no longer a forward looking modern nation called Turkey, its drifting into being a backward Arab-type Islamic republic.

Murat, you lose America, you lose the only thing holding the Kurds back from revenging themselves on Turkey for centuries of oppression and attempted genocide.

And there are now Free Kurds next door to supply them, train them, send them funds and armaments. Once they taste freedom and self government, they will never go back - and Ankara can kiss Eastern Turkey goodbye as it becomes part of Greater Kurdistan.

BWAHAHA

Posted by Ghost of Kemal Attaturk 2005-04-08 5:38:18 AM|| 2005-04-08 5:38:18 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 And there are now Free Kurds next door to supply them, train them, send them funds and armaments. Once they taste freedom and self government, they will never go back - and Ankara can kiss Eastern Turkey goodbye as it becomes part of Greater Kurdistan.

So? What will be the difference, youâre already doing that, the US is the biggest bigot funding terrorism all around the world anyway.

Posted by Murat 2005-04-08 7:04:13 AM|| 2005-04-08 7:04:13 AM|| Front Page Top

#6 500 years of history going down the drain

Posted by gromgoru 2005-04-08 7:32:18 AM|| 2005-04-08 7:32:18 AM|| Front Page Top

#7 Murats are what we produce.

Posted by Kemmalist Thought Club 2005-04-08 7:41:41 AM|| 2005-04-08 7:41:41 AM|| Front Page Top

#8 Saw a docu on Discovery Times(Must have different editors than the dead tree press)on Eur-a-peon Anti-Americanisam.Seems they do not consider the World a dangerous place and do not need a signifacant military.Ok,fine by me.Pull our military out(Eur-a-peon's do not need our protection anymore),disband NATO(What use is a military alliance that has no reason for being?).The corespondent met with the group who were most responsable for Euro pre-war demostrations.The part that sticks in my mind most is they feel that Liberty and Democracy can not be won through military force.Now picture this part in your mind:10 or 12 dweebs sitting around a table with the corespondent,they were asked(paraphrase)"Wasn't French Liberty won,twice in the same century,with the might of the American Military?"The way they jumped back from the table you would have thought they had just been slapped.Guess they do not like to be reminded of that little bit of history. JFM,TGA run don't walk to the nearest airport.I agree Mu-rat,move our bases to Kurdistan.Once U.S. bases are out,I wonder how long it will take before Turkey is fighting a massive Kurdish insurection,or an invasion from you brothers to the east(Iran).

Posted by raptor 2005-04-08 9:44:20 AM|| 2005-04-08 9:44:20 AM|| Front Page Top

#9 Excellent idea, good riddance of US bases.

I'll second, third, and fourth that.

Posted by Bomb-a-rama 2005-04-08 11:25:34 AM|| 2005-04-08 11:25:34 AM|| Front Page Top

#10 Raptor

France's Liberty was not saved twice in the same century by American military. The troops sent by America in 1918 were equipped mostly with French and in a lesser degree British armament (take a look at the TO&E equipment for World War II second line American units and you will find the 75 French gun of WWI fame). And even in November 1918 the American troops on the French front were still outnumbered by both France's and the Commonwealth troops (even if I think that the freshness of American troops, America's demographic pool who allowed to send only the fittest and youngest, and America's gun culture made them higher quality than the war weary French who in addition included a number of men in their fourties). While without the Americans the thing would have been dragged on and ended in a draw or even in case of victory left France still more exhausted I remind you that in WWI the Germans never took Paris.

But I certainly give more credit to the Americans for WWII than 99.9% of French.

Posted by JFM 2005-04-08 11:45:30 AM|| 2005-04-08 11:45:30 AM|| Front Page Top

#11 Murat told:

the US is the biggest bigot funding terrorism all around the world anyway.

I have ever found curious than the supposedly Kemalist, at least that is what he said to use on one occasion, Turk named Murat ever, ever, ever posts a drivel who could have been written by an Islamist Arab.

Posted by JFM 2005-04-08 11:49:05 AM|| 2005-04-08 11:49:05 AM|| Front Page Top

#12 I would not argue much with you,JFM,you would know more about French history than I.However,IIRC,mutiny,incompentence,and adherence to old ways of fighting had desimated the French army.At the time the French .75mm field gun was considered the best in the world"6 rounds in the air,1 in the chamber".Also when U.S. troops started to arrive British and French generals did not want an American command,they wanted to strip American units for replacments for thier own armies.Armies that had been nearly destroyed due to incompetance at High Command.Fortunatly B.J.Pershing put a stop to that.

Posted by raptor 2005-04-08 12:20:10 PM|| 2005-04-08 12:20:10 PM|| Front Page Top

#13 Here's my understanding on WWI; feel free to correct me if you think I'm off:

In 1918, both the Allies and the Central Powers were nearly "burned out" in terms of manpower and resources. The entry of the US into the war forced the German surrender, not so much by the troops engaged, but by the prospect of more where they came from. The Central Powers couldn't match that, and they knew it.

Posted by Mike 2005-04-08 12:43:42 PM|| 2005-04-08 12:43:42 PM|| Front Page Top

#14 I wargamed 1917-18 with the US removed. The Ludendorf offensive is able to get through because with just the French and Commonwealth in the line, they don't have enough reserves and replacements. The US didn't win the war alone, of course, but without them, it wouldn't have been possible that late (Russia already gone, and France/Britain have already thrown away their best troops in 1915-16).

Posted by Jackal 2005-04-08 1:33:08 PM|| [http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html] 2005-04-08 1:33:08 PM|| Front Page Top

#15 You play Europa too? I'd sure love to, I've got most of the games but its hard to find time and space to actually play them (or any other games, I also like GMT's SPQR and other Great Battle of History series).

MtV/Over There I've been wanting to play for a long time.

Posted by Laurence of the Rats 2005-04-08 2:31:32 PM|| [http://www.punictreachery.com/] 2005-04-08 2:31:32 PM|| Front Page Top

#16 Raptor

I told a few days ago about the harm done to the French Army by the re-war purges of Catholic officers and the blatant favoritism toward religion hostile officers: in the first six months of war one half of French generals had to be fired for total incompetence and we can think that it was still worse at lower levels. I also spoke about the criminals who equipped the french army with navy blue jackets and bright red trousers in the era of machine guns.

However the mutinies in the French Army after the bloody failure of the Nivelle offensives were not of the same nature than the Russian mutinies. It was the reaction of people who were tired of being sacrificed stupidly but who still ardently wanted to win the war: they dragged on for months until the Germans attacked. That German attack had the effect of having the mutineers return to duty while in Russia they deserted.

BTW one of the things who helped to keep the mutineers in line was the nomination of a general who had got a reputation for getting the job done while sparing the lives of his soldiers. He also managed to keep the insurrection in line with a minimum of repression (around thirty executions for a mutiny encompassing over a million soldiers). That general was Philippe Petain. But the cult towards him between veterans (who felt they owed him their lives for his restraint in the mutiny and his economic tactics), had the effect that it was the people who should have been the natural leaders of resistance in 1940 (the veterans and specially the decorated ones) who were calling for blindly following Petain.

Posted by JFM 2005-04-08 3:22:40 PM|| 2005-04-08 3:22:40 PM|| Front Page Top

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