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2006-04-07 International-UN-NGOs
20th-century rules will not win a 21st-century war.
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Posted by Mike 2006-04-07 06:56|| || Front Page|| [11135 views since 2007-05-07]  Top

#1 Why can't people just grasp that morality must be based on reciprocity.
Posted by gromgoru 2006-04-07 09:05||   2006-04-07 09:05|| Front Page Top

#2 The whole concept is stupid to begin with. Name one country the US has fought who obeyed the Geneva Conventions as well as we have? Our troops face barbarism if captured by *everybody* we fight. Only if we went to war against England would these be of any use.

If we are going to follow these stupid things then follow them to the letter. When they violate them then we are no longer bound by them either. Announce this publicly and repeatedly, then carry it out.
Posted by Laurence of the Rats">Laurence of the Rats  2006-04-07 09:14||   2006-04-07 09:14|| Front Page Top

#3 Well, Nazi Germany pretty well followed the Geneva Convention in regards to American troops, with one or two exceptions.
IIRC, they were the only ones we have fought in the last 70 years who did. Ironic, isn't it?
Posted by Sgt. Mom 2006-04-07 09:49|| www.sgtstryker.com]">[www.sgtstryker.com]  2006-04-07 09:49|| Front Page Top

#4 Sgt. Mom: I believe you are correct. Imperial Japan, North korea, Vietnam, Saddam's Iraq, al-Qaida; all routinely violated the Convention with respect to POWs.

Note also that captured members of the uniformed Iraq army were accorded POW status in both GWI and the present conflict.
Posted by Mike 2006-04-07 09:58||   2006-04-07 09:58|| Front Page Top

#5 It's not about our enemies following the conventions, it's about a nation being able to look its self in the mirror. We should always hold the highground on this, without exception.

The geneva conventions has the points for dealing, or removing the rights, of combatants that do not comply with the rules of land warfare. We need to toughen up, regognise those rule don't apply to terrorists and not feel guilty or even debate our treatment of terrorists, just kill them. Civilized treatment is for those who act in a civilized manner, even during wartime.
Posted by 49 Pan">49 Pan  2006-04-07 10:09||   2006-04-07 10:09|| Front Page Top

#6 Our gentleness invites their agressiveness. If we were brutally bloodthirsty, then the enemy would become meek. It's not rocket science.
Posted by wxjames 2006-04-07 11:12||   2006-04-07 11:12|| Front Page Top

#7 The ironic thing is, during the first Gulf War, the regular Iraqi army treated our POWs very well. Once they were handed off the the special police and Saddam's thugs, things went south.

But you guys are right. For the most part, we can't rely on countries/terrorists to treat our people well. The rules do not apply to the majority of the world.
Posted by DarthVader 2006-04-07 11:13||   2006-04-07 11:13|| Front Page Top

#8 Japan and North Vietnam never signed the Geneva Conventions.
Posted by Deacon Blues">Deacon Blues  2006-04-07 12:37||   2006-04-07 12:37|| Front Page Top

#9 49 - I agree with you about keeping the high road. But keeping the high road assures that barbarians are not free to roam at will, killing people in churches, mosques and just minding their own daily business. Life is about balance and balance requires tough choices on what you want to keep and what you need to give up. Saying that we don't have to stoop to barbarism is not the same thing as saying we need to find some sort of balance our fight against barbarians.
Posted by 2b 2006-04-07 12:45||   2006-04-07 12:45|| Front Page Top

#10 The Geneva Conventions and the Treaty of Westphalia were rules adopted by a club of nations in response to a very specific set of circumstances and in congruence with a largely common culture. That same congruence has pretty much rendered war among the members of that club obsolete.

No nation outside of that club is ever going to adopt the rules without strong incentives (the fire and nuclear bombings of Japan come to mind). Enlarging the club is the real goal of this war. Terrorism is a violation of both Westphalia and the GC. So is burning down embassies. Rich, feudal, oil-rich entities sponsoring proxy armies and using religion and emmigration to subvert existing nation states is an even bigger violation.

I don't think that we need to change the GC or give up on the nation state. We need to severely punish the entities that don't adhere to them.
Posted by 11A5S 2006-04-07 15:29||   2006-04-07 15:29|| Front Page Top

#11 2b your right. I am not saying we need to stoop to terrorists or adopt terrorist acts. The terrorists we are fighting do not adhere to the Geneva convention and are not afforded the protection of enemy combatants when captured. You are also right in that we whould not give one inch of ground to them, my position is to kill them. For example: when the IED's would go off in Bagdad people would come and jump on the vehicles and fire AK's into the air. That was until the Stryker BDE's began to ambush them and shoot them. Then the people quit taking part in the bombings. The fact that we would take action drove them away. This is a lesson we must take across the entire battlefield. They understand and respect someone who is not afraid of violence. We should give it to them.
Posted by 49 pan 2006-04-07 15:59||   2006-04-07 15:59|| Front Page Top

#12 Sgt. Mom,

I believe a number of Jewish US soldiers were sent to concentration camps.

Besides, there was the Malmedy massacre. That's more than one or two, I guess.
Posted by Eric Jablow">Eric Jablow  2006-04-07 18:11||   2006-04-07 18:11|| Front Page Top

#13 The Geneva Conventions and the Treaty of Westphalia were rules adopted by a club of nations in response to a very specific set of circumstances
Nice insight. T of Westphalia prevented serious horror war on civillians until 1914. (in Europe)
Posted by 6 2006-04-07 21:52||   2006-04-07 21:52|| Front Page Top

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