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2004-01-06 Home Front

They have found the homeless and they are Vets!

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Posted by Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) 2004-01-06 12:45:32 PM|| || Front Page|| [10 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Guess they all spent the Clinton years on vacation? Did hear about them much back then. They must've been in Aruba or someplace...

Posted by tu3031 2004-1-6 12:48:33 PM|| 2004-1-6 12:48:33 PM|| Front Page Top

#2 Cyber Sarge:

I am always weary of these articles. While there is no doubt that many vetrans of war face difficulty upon returning home, little is ever written about those who go on to be successful sound citizens.

What is your opinion of Stolen Valor? I found it to be a compelling book.

Posted by Dragon Fly 2004-1-6 1:23:49 PM|| 2004-1-6 1:23:49 PM|| Front Page Top

#3 Speaking as a disabled vet, there are things this administration could do to make the lives of veterans better. The entire "military veterans" issue needs to be re-thought from top to bottom - something neither Congress or the chowderheads who are getting a free ride at the VA or the Pentagon are willing to do. These are not things that "just popped up" - they've been around since at least the late 1960's, if my research is any indication. One of the reasons most homeless vets are that way is because they've come "home" to a place that's no longer home. They've changed, and to an even greater extent, society has changed. Most homeless vets will admit, if approached with the right attitude - with the respect and dignity they feel is their due, that they don't feel comfortable in our society any more.

Some adjust, over time. Some never do. I have a friend - a fellow disabled veteran - that lives a few hundred feet west of I-25 between Pueblo and Walsenburg. He has about 200 former vets that 'visit' him every year, moving north in the spring and south in the fall. He tried to build a shelter for them, but they refused to use it. They pitch a small tent (frequently home-made), build a small fire, and stay a day or two, then head out again. He doesn't shoot at them, he doesn't call the sheriff, and they don't trash his property. It frustrates him he can't do more, but these people treat him with a great deal of respect - he honors their wishes and desires, and doesn't hassle them. He's NEVER had a problem with any of the people that stay on his property. Some of these people have been visiting him regularly since 1973, shortly after he moved there.

The answer to the problem definitely isn't more money for programs, or even new programs. The issue is too complex for easy answers, and apparently too complex for the sponge-head writing this article to understand.

Posted by Old Patriot 2004-1-6 1:33:27 PM|| [http://users.codenet.net/mweather/default.htm] 2004-1-6 1:33:27 PM|| Front Page Top

#4 I am pretty sick of the same old slandering leftist BS where they purport to care for "the veterans" but are in fact making them just another client supplicant for their groupthink. I went to the original article to write to the author of this garbage, and found the following:

"Constitutional attorney and author John W. Whitehead is founder and president of The Rutherford Institute. He can be contacted at johnw@rutherford.org,. Information about the Institute is available at www.rutherford.org".

I can't seem to make the link to his org work. Funny, that. I'll try a few more times.

Posted by Whiskey Mike 2004-1-6 1:39:45 PM|| 2004-1-6 1:39:45 PM|| Front Page Top

#5 Whiskey Mike: This worked for me.

Posted by Old Patriot 2004-1-6 1:55:45 PM|| [http://users.codenet.net/mweather/default.htm] 2004-1-6 1:55:45 PM|| Front Page Top

#6 Dragonfly, I havenât read this book, but I remember seeing articles about these âveterans.â Like I said, people lie (for whatever reason). I am sure this book only scratched the surface of the many charades being played on the public. Thank God for the Internet, because now we can expose and depose these stories a lot easier. FYI I did not serve in Vietnam, but my Father did (He is not homeless and raised three boys with varying success).

Posted by Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) 2004-1-6 2:01:05 PM|| 2004-1-6 2:01:05 PM|| Front Page Top

#7 Just got through going to the source, and reading the article there. Sounds like John Whitehead is an ok guy, and the Rutherford Institute is actually a Townhall member - not some left-wing slush tank. I just think the guy got a bunch of bull from the "establishment" - both government and NGO - about homeless vets, and didn't do any field research. There are a lot of homeless "vets" in the Washington, D.C., area, but I wouldn't trust much of what they say. Visit some of them that camp out in Texas through Arizona during the winter, and all over during the summer, and you'll get a different view.

I've been fighting the military and the VA for 20 years about a disabling backache that's constantly causing me problems. It's taken that long to get the government medical people (both military and VA) to do what was necessary to get a diagnosis: I have three herniated disks in my lower back, spinal stenosis from T3 up through C2, and scoliosis between T2 and L3. I had a two-level cervical fusion at C4-5 and C5-6 in 1990, after complaining about numbness and pain in my arms for fifteen years. I have another surgery at C7-T1 to look forward to soon. I'm sure Doc Steve can verify those can be very painful problems. Why did it take until 2001 to get even the glimmer of a full diagnosis? The problems began in 1964.

The military medical people have one job: to get the servicemember well and back on the job as soon as possible. I think in their haste to do that the frequently overlook (or ignore) long-term problems, since there's nothing they can really "do" about them to satisfy THEIR mission. The vet pays, later. I'm sure I'm not the only veteran with these types of experiences.

Posted by Old Patriot 2004-1-6 2:15:18 PM|| [http://users.codenet.net/mweather/default.htm] 2004-1-6 2:15:18 PM|| Front Page Top

#8 credibility-wise: I've read/heard items from Whitehead and Rutherford for years, and he does seem to be an OK guy with principled agenda that I like...

Posted by Frank G 2004-1-6 2:30:59 PM|| 2004-1-6 2:30:59 PM|| Front Page Top

#9 Wish I could find the cite (maybe there was reference to it on NRO?), but actual research shows that basically all the bums claiming to be veterans are lying.

Posted by someone 2004-1-6 2:37:00 PM|| 2004-1-6 2:37:00 PM|| Front Page Top

#10 For the right money, I can be anyone you want me to be.

Posted by john 2004-1-6 2:47:02 PM|| 2004-1-6 2:47:02 PM|| Front Page Top

#11 DF, I read parts of that book in passing at a B&N. Webb wrote it if I'm not mistaken. Really liked what I read. He also wrote "fields of fire", one of my favorite 'Nam era reads.

Posted by Jarhead 2004-1-6 3:34:52 PM|| 2004-1-6 3:34:52 PM|| Front Page Top

#12 James Webb didn't write Stolen Valor, but it was a good book. Lots of people out there claim PTSD and related problems. I knew a guy in Orange County California, who was getting help from the V.A. because of war related PTSD. I asked him where he was in Viet Nam, he replied that he had been in the Air Force in Germany, but had become very, very nervous because he might have to go. He said he has never been the same since. These idiots get help from the V.A. while people with service related problems don't. Go figure.

Posted by Sgt.DT 2004-1-6 4:48:45 PM|| 2004-1-6 4:48:45 PM|| Front Page Top

#13 "one out of every four homeless males who is sleeping in a doorway, alley or box in our cities and rural communities has at some time put on a uniform and served our country"

Not to deny there are problems, but what's the ratio of those who have served among non-homeless males of the same age? Seems like it would be pretty high, especially for non-homeless males over the age of 50 (who were subject to the draft).

Posted by Tom 2004-1-6 7:43:58 PM|| 2004-1-6 7:43:58 PM|| Front Page Top

#14 I knew a guy in San Francisco, real lefty, who was a Vietnam veteran (not homeless). He claimed to be suffering from PTSD, but he was an airforce groundcrew guy. Can people in that job get PTSD?

Posted by buwaya 2004-1-6 7:59:39 PM|| 2004-1-6 7:59:39 PM|| Front Page Top

#15 Buwaya,
There was a crash of an Italian Air Force acrobatic team at Ramstein AB in the 1980's. Several of my friends were there at the air show, and have PTSD problems. We had a shrink come in and test the guys in our unit (photo intelligence) who had to work the Afghan and Iran/Iraq war - observers, not actual combattants. He diagnosed twenty-two percent of the guys as having mild to moderate PTSD. It's not the job, it's the STRESS. If you lose two or three birds you've worked on, and their pilots, that could accumulate a ton of "post-traumatic stress". I'm sure there are millions of Americans who experience at least mild post-traumatic stress after 9/11. All that considered, I still think many of the people who claim to have post-traumatic stress disorder find it a "convenient" diagnosis, and a way to get some goodies from Uncle Sam. There are also literally millions of people who have the strength of character to work out the problem for themselves, and never show more than mild symptoms, even when faced with significantly more stress than many of the guys complaining about PTSD.

Many of the homeless vets I've talked to (several dozen, over the last 20 years or so) have a strong PTSD problem. Their way of dealing with it is to keep moving.

Posted by Old Patriot 2004-1-6 11:46:26 PM|| [http://users.codenet.net/mweather/default.htm] 2004-1-6 11:46:26 PM|| Front Page Top

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