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Sharm el-Sheikh Boomed
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Page 4: Opinion
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London bomber was motivated by Newsweek lies
Article in The Australian; EFL

ON his last visit to relatives in Pakistan this year, one of the July 7 London bombers, Shehzad Tanweer, spoke of wanting to die in a terrorist attack to avenge the way Muslims were treated. Suicide bomber indeed.

While his family in Britain still claim they had no idea about his suicide mission, Tanweer confessed to his admiring cousin his ambition to become a "holy warrior".

At his father's home village, about 50km from Faisalabad, Mohammad Saleem described how Tanweer, 22, hero-worshipped Osama bin Laden. And he never mentioned that to any relatives or Moslem friends in the UK. Of course, they knew nothing! Anyway, who doesn't hero-worship Osama?

Mr Saleem who also hero-worships Osama bin Laden supported his cousin's bombing of a train at Aldgate Underground station, which killed seven people, saying: "Whatever he has done, if he has done it, then he has done right." Because Moslems always act as Allah dictates, victims be damned.

He recalled how Tanweer argued with family and friends in the Pakistani backwater about the need for violent retaliation over alleged US abuse of Muslim prisoners at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba. He couldn't quite recall Tanweer's argument linking London civilians with Guantanamo.

Tanweer was no stranger to the village of Chak No477, where his grandfather and several cousins live as parasites on money shipped from their cousins in the UK. During his last trip, the college dropout was visited regularly by another of the July 7 bombers, Mohammad Sidique Khan. Hi, fancy meeting you here! do you have any plans?

... Mr Saleem said Tanweer had spent only a short time at the village before going with Khan to study jihad and develop their hero-worship at a madrassa, an Islamic school.

"Whenever he would listen about sufferings of Muslims he would become very emotional and sentimental," Mr Saleem said. Cue wailing, shooting guns in the air, and watching Osama videos. "He was a good Muslim ... he also wished to take part in jihad and lay down his life." Cue bomb-making and martyrdom. He said Tanweer had never mentioned links with any militant group. We don't need groups. We're all militant.

"He knew from Newsweek that excesses are being done to Muslims. Incidents like desecration of the Koran reported by Newsweek have always been in his mind," Mr Saleem said, referring to Newsweek's irresponsible lies about US guards at Guantanamo allegedly throwing a copy of Islam's holy book in a toilet. Hence, Londoners must die!

What's that idyllic Pakistani location, anyway? ... Chak No477 is one of the more prosperous villages around Faisalabad. The better-off live in sprawling villas thanks to remittances from relatives who emigrated to Britain in the 1970s. Tanweer's father was one of those, settling in England in 1978.

After Tanweer's death, more than 2000 villagers turned out last week for a service in his memory. Because they all know that "Whatever he has done, if he has done it, then he has done right."
Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) || 07/23/2005 16:29 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [541 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I wonder if Newsweek and the Democrats give a fat rat's ass that their tawdry political grandstanding just got 50+ Londoners murdered?

I doubt they'd even understand that question...
Posted by: Dave D. || 07/23/2005 19:39 Comments || Top||

#2  Did the story get them killed, or would the good Mr. Tanweer have come up with some other excuse? I don't mean to excuse the nastiness at Newsweek et al, but these foot soldiers of jihad don't really need any reasons. Andalusia would be enough, or some obscure reference about infidel Arabs in the Koran.
Posted by: James || 07/23/2005 21:40 Comments || Top||

#3  Since Tanweer argued with relatives, it is obvious that he had to make a case for his actions and that he was himself satisfied with it.
How large a role the Newsweek claims played in this decision is unknowable, but it would have to be significant since he mentioned it specifically.

Culpable incitement to violence is a common-law crime. The Allied Tribunal addressed that very issue during the trial of Julius Streicher at Nuremberg. Streicher was charged with inciting genocide. The conclusion was that he was not as guilty as those who acted on his incitement, but he was still guilty enough to go to the gallows.

To be culpable, an act of incitement must generally display depraved disregard for both the truth and the consequences of the incitement. Newsweek is culpable in that the story was a wilfull fabrication, and that those concocting it either knew or reasonably could have known that it would incite violence.
Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy || 07/23/2005 22:12 Comments || Top||

#4  Do you think this little tidbit will be mentioned by the MSM?

Me neither. They will ignore it or spin it as 'koran descecration motivated bomber'....
Posted by: CrazyFool || 07/23/2005 22:24 Comments || Top||

Telegraph: Ten urgent steps to make Britain safer
The country is stunned by a series of violent and terrifying events in London. These "incidents", as the police insist on calling them, have the potential to instil a permanent state of fear among the population. Action, both bold and sensitive, is required to prevent more of them.

Ultimately, terrorism will only end through a change of heart to the non-beating mode among the fanatics who are prepared to immolate themselves and others in the name of God. The war on terror is a war of culture, between the civilisation which stands for freedom and democracy and the corrupt mentality which sees death and destruction as the only acceptable alternative to the establishment of Islamic theocracy.
Getting warmer, but no cigar.

This war must be fought on both the cultural and the security fronts. We here set out a list of 10 proposals which, we believe, should be implemented as a matter of urgency. It is unfortunate that just as Britain faces its most severe internal security threat in decades, MPs have this week risen for a three-month holiday. We strongly urge the Government to recall Parliament to debate and enact this legislative programme.

1. Confidently assert British values

The Government, schools, the BBC and other cultural outlets should launch a campaign to celebrate the virtues and values of Britishness, and to inculcate these values in the children who grow up, and the migrants who settle, in our country.

2. Exclude foreign undesirables

The Government should unilaterally withdraw from the 1951 Convention and other related protocols. This will, inter alia, allow us to return unwanted arrivals to the last safe country they visited before arriving in Britain.

3. Repeal the Human Rights Act

Judges have also used the European Convention on Human Rights (incorporated into UK law by the 1998 Human Rights Act) to second-guess government decisions, arguing that Article Three of the ECHR gives people the right not to be returned to countries where they may face degrading or inhumane treatment.

This is not an argument which troubles other signatories to the ECHR (notably France, which frequently returns undesirables to Algeria). The Government should repeal the Human Rights Act and consider withdrawing from the ECHR altogether.

4. Crackdown on propaganda

London is a global centre for the dissemination of Islamist propaganda. The Government should expand the legal provisions against the incitement of violence. A specific law banning "religious hatred" is unnecessary; anyone encouraging or exulting in the murder of the citizens of Britain or her allies should be liable to prosecution.

5. Intercept evidence admissable in court

The Government has consistently refused to allow intercept evidence (phone taps and other surveillance techniques) to be used in court to aid the prosecution of terrorism suspects. Astounding! But if we are serious about preventing attacks before they happen, and locking up those who plan them, we must allow these most informative of techniques to be legally admissable.

6. Visible police presence

The Government should abandon its planned legislation for identity cards. By far the most effective preventative action we can take against terrorists is to increase the number of front-line officers dedicated to listening to and reporting on suspicious activity in the Muslim community, and to patrolling likely target sites. Therefore, ministers should devote the estimated £584 million annual cost of the ID card scheme to increasing the numbers of police officers on duty in Britain's streets and transport networks.

7. Sensible policing

As well as growing in number, the police should be freed to exercise common sense in their pursuit and questioning of terrorism suspects. Following the Macpherson Report of 1999, the Government has required police officers who stop and question a member of the public to fill in a 40-question form reporting the encounter, including information on the racial profile of the suspect.

The effect of this requirement, which was intended to restore confidence in the sensitivity of the police to ethnic minorities, is to alienate the police from the community by erecting a barrier of officialdom between policeman and citizen. "Sensitivity", in today's context, is a policy of wilfully ignoring the individuals most likely to be terrorists. In the face of the threat of terrorism, we must all accept an impact on the way we live: the unfortunate additional burden borne by British Asians must be an inevitable increase in frustrating attention from the police.

8. Expectation for Muslims to join the police and security forces

Asians will more happily accept being stopped if it is Asian officers doing the stopping. I'm not sure this one is true. My experience is that many blacks in the US who are stopped by a black cop just see him as an uncle Tom doing the Man's work for him. Britain is also badly disadvantaged by the lack of Muslim police and security officers who could infiltrate radical Islamist networks in Britain.

9. Effective border controls

Only when the national government assumes and enforces absolute control over entry to and egress from these islands will we have the capability to contain the threat of terrorism from abroad. Sounds familiar

10. Increased detention facilities

Currently there are only 1,200 places available for the detention of would-be migrants and refugees who arrive in Britain without adequate documentation, or who arouse the suspicion of the authorities.

Many thousands of migrants are admitted to the UK each year and allowed to move freely around the country before security checks are performed on them. We must considerably enlarge Britain's detention facilities.
You could just reject them faster, too.
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 14:33 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [344 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "...ministers should devote the estimated £584 million annual cost of the ID card scheme to increasing the numbers of police officers..."

Why, that's enough money to maintain several thousand special agents to monitor and infiltrate Moslem groups across the country. Sounds like a better use of money. If they also move to summarily try and execute all Islamofascist leaders.
Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) || 07/23/2005 15:13 Comments || Top||

#2  Interesting! 2 and 3 mean they get that International Law (TM) and the UN are the cause of this problem.
Posted by: phil_b || 07/23/2005 15:23 Comments || Top||

#3  Well, the Telegraph is normally on the side of the good guys aren't they?
Posted by: AzCat || 07/23/2005 15:43 Comments || Top||

#4  "11. Hang George Galloway.

12. See 11."
Posted by: Matt || 07/23/2005 15:57 Comments || Top||

#5  If the UK is to win the war against Islam...

Someone needs to set up a simple interrogation to allow each adult Moslem to explain his opinion on jihad and sharia vs the law of the land.

Deport anyone who supports the submission of the UK to sharia. Execute anyone who supports jihad against non-Moslems.

Then monitor all mosques and deport anyone in attendance who doesn't immediately go to the police to denounce Islamofascist preachers. Execute Islamofascist preachers.

After a year or two, the Moslems who still live in the UK would be the famous "moderate" ones we've been looking for.
Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) || 07/23/2005 16:07 Comments || Top||

#6  Actually ,parts of 2,all of 3 and 9 are attributable to the EU.
Posted by: Stephen || 07/23/2005 18:46 Comments || Top||

25% of muslims in UK sympathise with terrorist bombers
A new poll says about a quarter of British Muslims sympathise with the motives of the London bombers, if not their methods.
And the survey in London's Daily Telegraph shows one-third of British Muslims believe Western society is immoral.

The poll asked Muslims if they felt the July the 7th suicide attacks in which 56 peopled died were justified, and six per cent said they were.

71 per cent said they weren't justified at all, and 11 per cent said they weren't justified on balance.

But asked whether they had sympathy with the feelings and motives of the four British Muslim bombers, 13 per cent said they had a lot of sympathy and another 11 per cent had a little.

A similar poll for The Sun newspaper showed 91 per cent of the Muslim respondents didn't feel the suicide bombings were justified by the Islamic holy book, the Koran.
This is the problem. A large portion of the british Islamic population either supports, or really doesn't give a fig about the bombings. Better whitie than them, I guess.
Case in point, 13 per cent said they had a lot of sympathy and another 11 per cent had a little. What happened to the other 76%? No comment?!?! No MMM I think.
Asshats better wake up and either toss the radical's out of their communities, or be prepared to suffer the radical's fate.
Posted by: mmurray821 || 07/23/2005 11:33 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [978 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "Nearly half, 47 per cent, say they would also go to the police if they believed an imam or other religious person was trying to radicalise young Muslims by preaching hatred against the West."

That sounds weasely. Let's re-word it slightly:

"Fewer than half, 47 per cent, say they would also go to the police if they believed an imam or other religious person was trying to radicalise young Muslims by preaching hatred against the West."

There, that's more to the point: Britain, you've got a BIG problem.
Posted by: Dave D. || 07/23/2005 12:15 Comments || Top||

#2  Only 25%. Not possible.

AAl muslims sympathize with terror bombings and terrorists.

After all, they hate us. Thats all.
Posted by: Glereper Craviter7929 || 07/23/2005 12:51 Comments || Top||

#3  Here're the responses. Most of the other 76% said they had "no sympathy at all" for the motives of the bombers.

Other fun numbers: 27% would not tell the police if they suspected someone they knew was planning an attack on London; 32% believe western society is evil and Muslims should bring it to an end; only 32% feel Muslims now have a "great deal" of responsibility to prevent such attacks or bring the perps to justice; 42% don't agree with Blair that the ideals of the bombers were "perverted and poisonous".

Posted by: AzCat || 07/23/2005 13:28 Comments || Top||

#4  Since sympathy for terrorists is a horrible thing to express in most rational people's eyes, it is likely that many respondents chose the safe answer (not sympathising with terrorists) over what they actually believe.

Further, the Moslem principle of taqiya (deception of non-believers) requires them to lie to non-Moslems in order to promote the aims of Islam.

Still looking for the mythical "moderate" Moslem leaders and activists.
Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) || 07/23/2005 13:40 Comments || Top||

#5  Lying isn't required Kalle, it's merely allowed if the person in question feels that telling the truth about their faith would put either them or the faith itself in danger. But the effective result on the non-Muslim listener is about the same: we'll have no way to separate honest answer from dishonest ones thus placing a huge premium on the actions of the Islamic community in the west over their words.
Posted by: AzCat || 07/23/2005 14:59 Comments || Top||

#6  But these numbers are incredibly high. They seem like an admission against interest. The Brits don't need to wait for more actions based on these results. The real question is how do they separate the good ones from the bad?
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 15:04 Comments || Top||

#7  One of those scales as seen in Monty Pythons “Search for the Holy Grail”? That makes about much sense as this whole survey.

We are faced with a religious movement (Islam) which provides, encourages and allows for outright lies to be told in furtherance of Islam. This is not a subject open to debate, it is a fact.

Thus this survey is useless, statically or otherwise.
Posted by: Sock Puppet 0’ Doom || 07/23/2005 15:15 Comments || Top||

#8  May I suggest another survey. This time with a "loaded" question. As in, you sympathise, you go away?
Posted by: Captain America || 07/23/2005 15:18 Comments || Top||

#9  perhaps a recount, but roving bands of soccer hooligans knocking down the door, asking the questions at 11PM. You'd get Taqqiya lies, but the impression might be left that time's up, best get thee back to Islamoland
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 15:51 Comments || Top||

#10  Next time, the survey should be done by policemen in civilian clothes.

Any Moslem who feels the 7/7 mass-murder was justified without qualification -- arrest them and execute them. Deport their widows and kids.

Any Moslem who feels a lot of sympathy for the feelings and motives of the 7/7 bombers -- you know the routine.

Any Moslem who would not tell the police if they suspected someone they knew was planning an attack on London -- same routine.

In each such case the particular Moslem would have declared himself at war with Britain. That probably includes dealing with more than 25% of Moslems in the UK, plus shipping out their immediate relatives, say getting rid of 60-70% total.

There is an estimated 2 million Moslems in the UK. Half a million of them consider themselves at war with the UK.

How many Nazis/Germans were allowed to proselytize and live freely in Britain during WW II?
Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) || 07/23/2005 15:55 Comments || Top||

#11  I mean: any Moslem feeling that 7/7 was justified no matter what qualification they might add (the eternal "but" of Islamofascist propaganda).
Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) || 07/23/2005 15:57 Comments || Top||




Posted by: Viking || 07/23/2005 18:04 Comments || Top||

#13  TypograPhers of the World UnitE!
Attack and demand descenders from the frighten Helvetican hordes.

This demands Lead!

And more lead!

and a smidge more.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 18:31 Comments || Top||

#14  Again, a simple answer to a clear problem. It's them or us. My answer is to run 'em out. Now. Send them back to the hellholes they came from. Tolerance of their hatred for us is simply acquiescing in slow motion to our own destruction. Muslims out of both Europe and America. Now.
Posted by: mac || 07/23/2005 20:36 Comments || Top||

Swedish man linked to London blasts suspect praises Bin Laden
Now the Swedes are becoming terrorists!!!
A man suspected of being linked to the deadly London bombings told a Swedish newspaper that he was not involved in the July 7 attacks, but praised Osama bin Laden and threatened Sweden if it extradited him to the United States or Britain.
No! Not Sven and Oleg!
"You (Sweden) will get the biggest punishment if I am extradited to the US or Britain," the 39-year-old Swedish citizen of Lebanese origin told the Expressen paper.
oh. never mind.
The man, who has been identified in British media as Oussama Abdullah Kassir, is suspected of attempting to create a jihad training camp in the US state of Oregon in 1999 with Haroon Rashid Aswat, who is reportedly being held in Pakistan under suspicion of masterminding the deadly London attacks. He told Expressen however that he did not know Aswat. "Haroon Rashid is not a new name to me. When (Swedish security police) Saepo arrested me in 2003 I was asked questions about this man. I don't know who he is. I have never met him," he said. Kassir was arrested in 2003 under suspicion of planning terror acts, but those charges were later dropped. He did however serve 10 months in a Swedish jail for illegal possession of weapons. Saepo has refused to confirm that Kassir is a suspect in the ongoing investigation into the July 7 attacks in the British capital that left 56 people dead. Kassir himself adamantly denies any involvement. "I'm not involved in the attacks on the subway in London. I haven't left Sweden for the past three years, so how can I be involved?" he asked.
"It is a puzzlement. But don't look too hard at my phone bill, ja?"
He did however express admiration for the London suicide bombers. "They are martyrs and I hope to be a martyr myself one day. They are not terrorists since they did what Islam demands," he said.
"Allan is a demanding master, truly."
"The attacks in London could be a reaction to what is happening in Iraq. Each country that is involved in war on Muslims will share the same fate," he added, going on to praise al Qaeda leader Osame bin Laden. "Of course I love sheik bin Laden. He is a believing Muslim and a real mujahid", he said. Kassir insisted that he would not cooperate with Swedish, British or American security services. "They'll have to come and get me here with violence," he said.
Posted by: PlanetDan || 07/23/2005 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [604 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Are the swedes that big of pussies that they would actually let this guy stay?
Posted by: Shainter Elmaviger6816 || 07/23/2005 0:40 Comments || Top||

#2  The fact that anyone actually has to ask that question, answers it.
Posted by: gromky || 07/23/2005 1:58 Comments || Top||

#3  Oussama Abdullah Kassir... I need to brush up on my Swedish....
Posted by: True German Ally || 07/23/2005 2:11 Comments || Top||

#4  Are the Swedes that big pussies ...

Posted by: too true || 07/23/2005 2:54 Comments || Top||

#5  Yaa sure, you betcha by golly
Posted by: Captain America || 07/23/2005 3:39 Comments || Top||

#6  When a Moslem says "[the Moslem mass-murderers in London] are martyrs and I hope to be a martyr myself one day" we should take him at his word and have him shot immediately.

If someone walks around a mall saying that he intends to commit mass-murder and die while doing it, would the police just watch and wait?
Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) || 07/23/2005 3:43 Comments || Top||

#7  Hate to name drop but Hans Blitz, a name that puts everything in prospective.
Posted by: Captain America || 07/23/2005 3:56 Comments || Top||

#8  "You (Sweden) will get the biggest punishment if I am extradited to the US or Britain," the 39-year-old Swedish citizen of Lebanese origin told the Expressen paper.

Not a problem. A sniper's bullet in his head will do in lieu of extradition.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 07/23/2005 20:52 Comments || Top||

#9  Just remember how the Swedish guy they kidnapped reacted once he was free. I think this guy is pushing his luck. They are going to flip the Euro's bit.
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 21:16 Comments || Top||

Omar Bakri: "I cannot be British. I cannot be English."
Then begone, you arrogant arsehat.
The radical cleric Omar Bakri Mohammed inflamed tensions further yesterday with an attack on Muslims who took part in inter-faith services after the bombings. He branded any Muslims who attended the Trafalgar Square vigil last week as "hypocrites and apostates". In an interview, Bakri said: "God forbids us from praying with Jews and Christians side by side. These are part-time Muslims or chocolate Muslims. I cannot be British. I cannot be English. Even if I change my colour, like Michael Jackson, I could not be English."
"Read my lips. I hate you. I hate the guy standing next to you. I spit upon your laws, and work every day to plan your death. Now give me some money or I'll seethe some more."
The Home Secretary, Charles Clarke, has said that he will be making greater use of powers to exclude from Britain people already here who encourage violence. And he suggested that such powers might be used against Bakri and other radical clerics who have made outspoken comments.
Yesterday would be a fine day for a deportation, Mr. Clarke. Or even the day before yesterday.
More, much more at the link.
Posted by: Seafarious || 07/23/2005 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [875 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Can you spot THE Root Cause? PS - He doesn't just make up the religious teachings from thin air.
Posted by: AbuRatCatcherToTheStars || 07/23/2005 0:09 Comments || Top||

#2  Put "it", turbin durbin, and teddy on a desert atoll way out in the Pacific.

Install London cams and charge pay per view.
Posted by: blood red dog || 07/23/2005 0:10 Comments || Top||

#3  Great comments, Seafarious! Lol! Hope Clarke retro-activates all those visas for immediate deportation. "Round 'em up, move 'em out!"

There's something I think is particularly ridiculous about all these "out of state" Muslim "leaders"--they're nothing but blab- blab-blabish big shots living n TOLERANT, SAFE environments that allow for their swagger and threats, where their free speech and personal rights are protected. In other words, a bunch of dickless wonders who couldn't find the balls to stay in their own countries and gripe. And in the West, they even get "air time," "celebrity" status. It's sickening. I mean, just look at this guy.
Posted by: ex-lib || 07/23/2005 0:15 Comments || Top||

#4  Send MI6 around with a suppressed 45, put one in his head, leaving him in a pool of blood and piss for his follower to clean up.

There can be no welcome or living with this type in western society.
Posted by: Sock Puppet 0’ Doom || 07/23/2005 0:25 Comments || Top||

#5  Omar Bakri: "I cannot be British. I cannot be English."

Well, I'd say too bad for him...can he be rotting dead corpse in a great big pile of pig dung. I'll wager he can. Course, he could also be tar-coated head on a spike on London Bridge.
Posted by: Silentbrick || 07/23/2005 0:27 Comments || Top||

#6  "I cannot be British. I cannot be English."

Okay, but don't stop there. All out of ideas? I have one: you can be dead. How 'bout that, asshole?
Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 0:29 Comments || Top||

#7  My feelings are that is the only option PD.
Posted by: Sock Puppet 0’ Doom || 07/23/2005 0:31 Comments || Top||

#8  Why the hell do they move to england if they hate the english so goddamned much? Why not move to turkey or something?
Posted by: Shainter Elmaviger6816 || 07/23/2005 0:43 Comments || Top||

#9  Actually Abu, he kinda does. IIRC, he got kicked out of al-Azhar b/c he decided he was smarter than they were ...
Posted by: Dan Darling || 07/23/2005 0:43 Comments || Top||

#10  I love the transparency and arrogance, they make it sooo much easier to show the dunces that tolerance is all one-way. Hell, even Tony B may "get it" soon. Ex-lib nails the hypocrisy and cowardice of these zits on Western society's nose - it's truly breathtaking. It's a good thing that they're blinded by their own bullshit and too self-absorbed to realize what they sound like to non-believers.

So, SPo'D, what's the best method? Hire an out of wet-work Bulgarian who's having trouble fitting in with the democracy thingy and all that troublesome think-for-yourself rot? Lol.
Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 0:45 Comments || Top||

#11  Anybody also notice the "whine" factor so typical of these disgustingly immature, pseudo-men? "I cannot be British. I cannot be English." Uh-huh . . . Okay . . . like so what . . . like, are we supposed to CARE or something? Sounds like your problem, Omar.

These guys are sick, sick, sick, (as in VERY disturbed) "men." They have no legitimacy.

Love the target practice.com. LOL!
Posted by: ex-lib || 07/23/2005 0:48 Comments || Top||

#12  Someone from the Ukraine, Belarus or a Wallachian.

Someone open a paypal account hehehe.
Posted by: Sock Puppet 0’ Doom || 07/23/2005 1:07 Comments || Top||

#13  I understand its $10 in the right neighborhoods...
Now in London I expect a slight inflation.
Posted by: 3dc || 07/23/2005 1:26 Comments || Top||

#14  I cannot be British. I cannot be English

So, go back where you came from... Your mentor needs an administrator for the super-Orcs...Merry & Pippin have Saruman trapped in Isengard...

Mordor is so "lovely" this time of year...Don't you miss it?
Posted by: BigEd || 07/23/2005 1:45 Comments || Top||

#15  How about being "Persona non grata"?
I think authorities should consult with Alaska Paul to find a real nice little Aleutian island where all the Bakris, Galloways and Fisks of this world could live.
Posted by: True German Ally || 07/23/2005 1:59 Comments || Top||

#16  I don't thinkn they need to go that far TGA. There are islands right off of Scottland that will do for that.
Posted by: Sock Puppet 0’ Doom || 07/23/2005 2:04 Comments || Top||

#17  Yes SPoD, but they raise sheep there.
Please think of the sheep!
Posted by: True German Ally || 07/23/2005 2:09 Comments || Top||

#18  We'll put all of PETA there. I'm sure they can protect the sheep.
Posted by: Pappy || 07/23/2005 2:28 Comments || Top||


Yes! Thank you Mr TGA. Please remind the British authorities to think of us... Mr Bakri is baaaaaaaad
Posted by: Orkney Laaamb || 07/23/2005 2:30 Comments || Top||

#20  Yes. We have advised Mr. Blair's office that we don't care how man English Humans die, but forced sodomy with sheep is a criminal offense we care about... No Bakri in Orkney!
Posted by: PETA-UK || 07/23/2005 2:32 Comments || Top||

#21  I suggest the South Orkney Islands (off the Antarctic coast)
Posted by: True German Ally || 07/23/2005 2:35 Comments || Top||

#22  Then forget to resupply them for say 2 or 3 years.
Make sure they are out fitted for the tropics.
Posted by: Sock Puppet 0’ Doom || 07/23/2005 2:43 Comments || Top||

#23  What do you mean by "supply them"?
Allah (swt) cares for everything.
Posted by: True German Ally || 07/23/2005 2:52 Comments || Top||

#24  "God forbids us from praying with Jews and Christians side by side. These are part-time Muslims or chocolate Muslims. I cannot be British. I cannot be English..."

Then why the hell are you there? Get out.

Get out, get out, GET OUT.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 07/23/2005 3:10 Comments || Top||

#25  I object! - I will not have that piece of filth co-habiting with our nice sheep! No sir! some of those sheep are used for wool - and no way! would I be happy to find some henna-dyed 'wool' in my jumper!. (I'll let that visual sink again, and will mention it .... no more)

Blood Red Dog has the right idea - let's get a nice desert island, not too big though, we want these people to meet up every now and then; build some nice huts for them, not too big - we want them to spend most of their time outside 'interacting', provide enough food - not too clean though, we want plenty of cases of the 'trots', not enough toilets (and no toilet paper), plenty of alcohol - more fun there and some of the residents will have a greater need for it (we're not trying to be inhuman here), have loads of cameras around the island watching them and then - well, I think you'll have the best reality TV show ever. Think of the plotlines; "We've left a pistol on the Island, but it only has one bullet in it", "This week, we've replaced all the booze with Cod Liver Oil", "Next week, we're messing with the magnetic field over the island, so Bakris compass will always point vertically!", "In the next season, we'll be introducing big game hunters onto the island - actually, they're the relatives of the 9/11, Bali, Beslan and 7/7 victims". (Do you think I might have a future in TV?)

Now, who to populate it with?; well, it was Blood Red Dogs idea, so he gets first dibs.
So that's Bakri (goes without saying really), Senator Durbin, Senator Kennedy, then we have Galloway, Old-Hooky, Arec Bawdrin (sorry Team America Kimmy accent drifting in there), Micheal Moore, Perv (there's a friend for Bakri), half the Saudi princelings (top half or bottom half - it makes no difference really), half of the BBC (hmm, could be a logistics problem here - no matter, they can create a documentary about their problems! - only we won't give them any power, or tapes - delicious!) and some lepers.

No come to think of it, skip the lepers - those poor bastards don't deserve that!

Think of anyone else?
Posted by: Tony (UK) || 07/23/2005 3:48 Comments || Top||

#26  Deportation is not the answer. It merely shifts the problem in space, and in time.

Arrest Bakrim, try him and shoot him. Then deport his widow(s) and kids. And repeat with all Moslem leaders who express similar hatred of our freedom. Keep doing it until either they're all dead or they figure that we mean business when we say we're willing to co-exist with tolerant people exclusively. Currently my bet would be that they'd all die.
Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) || 07/23/2005 3:50 Comments || Top||

#27  Order change: shoot him, then try him.
Posted by: Captain America || 07/23/2005 3:57 Comments || Top||

#28  Mmmmm, chocolate!

Good, creative thinking, Tony(UK) -- hopefully someone in high places (or at least with a posh accent who invites the right people to her dinner parties!) will check in with Rantburg today, and follow up.

All the cousins continue in our thoughts until this mess is resolved -- so stay safe!
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/23/2005 6:19 Comments || Top||

#29  Isn't there an island off the coast of Scotland that was used for bio-weapons testing of anthrax,and is now off limits in perpituity?That would be the place to send these ass-wipes!
Posted by: raptor || 07/23/2005 8:03 Comments || Top||

#30  I suggest you are "pig dung."
Posted by: Crusader || 07/23/2005 8:09 Comments || Top||

#31  He deserves an island in the tropics, say Johnson or Howland. We can put all the pedophiles, serial killers and islamofascists there. Give them the whole Island. Insert new residents by parachute drop as required. Have monthly drops of supplies. Let them self-administer the Island. Low cost. Easy for the UN and press to monitor for human rights violations.
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 8:09 Comments || Top||

#32  Do you mean Johnston island Mrs Davis?

Where the US tested it's only submarine launched ballistic missile? (600 kT airburst).

Hmmm, guess that'll work too - but I still like my idea of a reality TV show ;)
Posted by: Tony (UK) || 07/23/2005 9:12 Comments || Top||

#33  The same. Sorry for droping the "t".
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 9:31 Comments || Top||

#34  Hmmm, this place sounds perfect.
Posted by: AzCat || 07/23/2005 9:45 Comments || Top||

#35  Mississippi, no cash, no ID.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 10:12 Comments || Top||

#36  "They are chocolate Muslims"?

What the hell? Those hateful words should be emblazened on his forehead in every photo the media uses of him. "Moderate Muslims" in the US who also happen to be black need to be confronted with the racism in Islam (although every one of them should have already understood that by now with the genocide of blacks in Sudan).
Posted by: jules 2 || 07/23/2005 10:32 Comments || Top||

#37  OK, he cannot be British. That's a peice of cake, he's disavowed his citizenship. For the rest, simply adjust the laws to disallow dual citizenship for adults. If Mohammadan=="citizen of caliphate", remove British citizenship and deport. True, that just shifts the problem, but it reduces the fifth column aspect of it. Kind of hard to plant bombs in London if you're stuck in Turkey.
Posted by: James || 07/23/2005 11:44 Comments || Top||

#38  Just goes to show that Michael Jackson is an object of universal contempt.
Posted by: Super Hose || 07/23/2005 14:13 Comments || Top||

#39  AzCat, Unfortuantely, the Chechens have fille dthe place up.
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 14:18 Comments || Top||

#40  This guy needs to be chased down a tube station, onto a train and then given the five rounds to the head treatment (courtesy the Metropolitan Police encounter squad).

A very British apology could then follow.

Let me see another imam open his filthy mouth...

Posted by: john || 07/23/2005 14:47 Comments || Top||

#41  There is a simple answer. Confiscate his assets and deport him to Pakistan immediately along with all his family members. Give the cash equivalent of the assets to ISI and tell them to return to him whatever amount they think he will need while living in Pakistan. I'd bet the boy would quickly have a fatal accident once back in PakiWakiLand--those ISI guys wouldn't want to part with the cash. Towelheads don't like infidels but they treat their own like bastards too--they wouldn't have much sympathy for an idiot like Bakri.
Posted by: mac || 07/23/2005 20:20 Comments || Top||

#42  That just makes it better Mrs. D., if there's one thing the moose-limbs like better than killing infidels it's killing each other. Build a wall, drop 'em in by air.
Posted by: AzCat || 07/23/2005 20:51 Comments || Top||

Caribbean-Latin America
Washington Secures Long-Sought Hemispheric Outpost In Paraguay
On June 1, 2005 the Paraguayan National Congress entered into an agreement with Washington that allows U.S. troops to enter into Paraguay for an 18-month period. The troops will help train Paraguayan officials to deal with narcotrafficking, terrorism, government corruption and domestic health issues. The agreement grants the U.S. troops legal immunity from possible offenses committed during their stay.

Washington has long sought similar immunity for its troops in the Southern Cone, but Argentina and Brazil have firmly restricted granting such judicial liberty to U.S. troops. Bolivian officials and its press are also speaking out against the agreement, fearing the U.S. presence as a means to control the petroleum and natural gas sources in their country. Though Asunción and Washington claim that the U.S. has no intentions of establishing a permanent base in Paraguay, history shows a strange resemblance between the current situation in Paraguay and the development of the Manta base in Ecuador from a "temporary" facility into a major base...

...While it is clear that direct U.S. interests in the region subsided after the Cold War, and even came to a staggering halt after September 11, the United States is once again at work trying to build a quasi-military grid in Latin America. By entering into an agreement with Paraguayan officials, the U.S. will be able to successfully keep an eye out for the political unrest in Bolivia, maintain an influence in the highly sensitive Triple Border region and monitor activities of the de-facto left leaning alliance. Up to now Washington has expressed concern for the leftist regimes in Brazil, Uruguay, Argentina and Venezuela, with the likelihood that Bolivia, Ecuador and Mexico (if Lopez Obrador triumphs in that country’s 2006 elections) might join. While Paraguay alone exclusively has made an agreement that could very well infringe on its judicial power and ultimate sovereignty, the entire South American region could soon feel the after-effects of its domestic decision. Argentina and Brazil have successfully held off the U.S. military forces from gaining immunity in the area, but after several failed attempts to acquire a South American base of power, the U.S. now has a road paved for them by Paraguay’s 18-month agreement.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 07/23/2005 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [331 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Ha Ha, Hugo! Lick our asses!
Posted by: bigjim-ky || 07/23/2005 0:44 Comments || Top||

#2  The Council on Hemispheric Affairs, founded in 1975, is an independent, non-profit, non-partisan, tax-exempt research and information organization. It has been described on the Senate floor as being “one of the nation’s most respected bodies of scholars and policy makers.”

Why do I hear warning bells?
Posted by: Pappy || 07/23/2005 2:31 Comments || Top||

#3  Well Pappy Perhaps it might be because they are a bunch of fudge packing lefty loons. But that is just a guess. When I read discriptions like that presume that is the case.
Posted by: Sock Puppet 0’ Doom || 07/23/2005 2:50 Comments || Top||

#4  Well Pappy Perhaps it might be because they are a bunch of fudge packing lefty loons. But that is just a guess.

Ya think?
Posted by: AzCat || 07/23/2005 7:07 Comments || Top||

#5  Remember that isolated triangle where 3 countries meet in South America? The one where, it is rumored, Al-Q training camps exist?

This could be a very important step in managing what I fear will be the next wave of terror / instability, i.e. to the south of us.
Posted by: too true || 07/23/2005 12:42 Comments || Top||

Caucasus/Russia/Central Asia
Znamenskoye perps identified
Two perpetrators of the terrorist attack committed July 19 in Chechnya's northern village of Znamenskoye have been identified, Chechen President Alu Alkhanov said Thursday. The president declared July 21 Mourning Day in Chechnya.

On July 19 militants fired at a police vehicle in Znamenskaya, killing one police officer. When policemen arrived at the site, they heard an explosion. The attack killed 14 and left 27 people wounded. "I want people to be sure that none of the perpetrators of this bloody crime will go unpunished, and soon the people of the Chechen republic will see this for themselves," the president told a government session.

The session started with a prayer. Then the government held a minute's silence in memory of those killed. "I am concerned by attempts by illegal armed formations to destabilize the situation," Alkhanov said. The president said Chechnya's law enforcement agencies should take all necessary measures to ensure security. He said the security forces had stepped up their activities and regularly conducted special operations to eliminate members of illegal armed formations. He said that as such a large terrorist attack had happened, the authorities must have miscalculated somewhere. He insisted that the law enforcement agencies strictly followed their instructions. Alkhanov has said the terrorist attack was ordered by Chechen terrorist leader Shamil Basayev.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 07/23/2005 01:24 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [312 views] Top|| File under:

Report: North Korea says ready for visit from President Bush
North Korea has told the United States it is ready for visits from President George W. Bush or Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice as a step toward normalizing relations and getting a shot at the leftovers from the meals for his entourage, a news report said Saturday.

North Korea relayed the message during a meeting of diplomats from the two countries held in New York in late June and early July, Kyodo News agency reported from Beijing citing diplomatic sources it didn't identify Pyongyang Cateing, LLC. Those meetings were attended by Joseph DeTrani, the U.S. special envoy for North Korean negotiations, and Ri Gun, chief of the North Korean Foreign Ministry's U.S. Affairs Department.
U.S. representatives said North Korea should also send senior officials to the United States to visit Safeway, but the discussions ended without any commitments after North Korean officials expressed doubt about Washington's intentions to issue visas for a visiting delegation, Kyodo said.

North Korea and the United States are preparing for a new round of six-nation talks aimed at dismantling the communist country's nuclear weapons program and giving Jesse Jackson lessons in how to shakedown governments. The negotiations, which also include delegates from South Korea, Japan, China and Russia, are set to begin in Beijing on Tuesday after a 13-month hiatus.

North Korea has made improved relations with the United States a requirement for abandoning its nuclear program. Leaders of the two countries have never met, and their governments don't have embassies in each other's capitals and Kimie is ronery..

A separate news report said Saturday that the United States, Japan and South Korea will jointly offer the North security guarantees, normalized relations and energy aid at the Beijing disarmament talks, if the communist nation agrees to give up its nuclear weapons. But they're holding out on the demand for alfalfa.

If North Korea also addresses concerns about its missile development and human rights, Japan and the United States will take further steps toward normalizing diplomatic relations, Japan's Nihon Keizai newspaper said. Japan also has no diplomatic ties with North Korea, but Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi has twice journeyed to Pyongyang for summits with North Korean leader Kim Jong Il since 2002.
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 08:32 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [528 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Heh. Heh, heh. Lol. LOL. ROFL! ROFLMAO!

Uh, huh, sure thing, Mr Ronery. You just hold your breath till you hear Dubya come bopping down the stairs from AF ONE saying "dirka dirka".
Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 9:38 Comments || Top||


Sure, Kimmie.

Hold your breath.
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 07/23/2005 12:48 Comments || Top||

#3  They just don't get it do they?
They have no idea how the outside world sees them.

There are only a handful of outlaw nations whose diplomats routinely engage in drug smuggling and counterfeiting, which allows export of ballistic missile technology and which is in violation of their NPT obligations.

And they expect a visit from the US President.

Where could they have gotten this idea from?
Perhaps a certain ill advised visit from the then American Secretary of State Madeleine Albright?

Posted by: john || 07/23/2005 14:06 Comments || Top||

#4  Unfortunately for the Norks, Bush isn't quite ready to pay them a visit ... yet.
Posted by: AzCat || 07/23/2005 15:09 Comments || Top||

#5  North Korea has told the United States it is ready for visits from President George W. Bush or Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice as a step toward normalizing relations and getting a shot at the leftovers from the meals for his entourage, a news report said Saturday.

Not without an agreement signed, and a satisfactory verification regime in place. Of course, there's still a little matter of NKor honesty/integrity where previous agreements are concerned....
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 07/23/2005 16:42 Comments || Top||

#6  They wanted to have a pissing match last week and now they want to be buddies. Forgive me a skeptical chukle, but do you think they have gotten serious about this in so short a time? Something has changed that we don't know about yet.
Posted by: bigjim-ky || 07/23/2005 23:57 Comments || Top||

DPRK Delegation Leaves for Six-Party Talks
From the Dept. of Things That Make You Go Hmmm...:
A DPRK delegation led by Kim Kye Gwan, vice-minister of Foreign Affairs, left here Friday to participate in the six-party talks for settling the nuclear issue between the DPRK and the United States to open in Beijing on July 26. It was seen off at the airport by Kim Yong Il, vice-minister of Foreign Affairs, officials concerned, Wu Donghe, Chinese ambassador to the DPRK, and Andrei Karlov, Russian ambassador to the DPRK.
China and Russia kissing the NorK delegation g'bye at the airport.

Posted by: Seafarious || 07/23/2005 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [315 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Something has happened. We don't know about it yet, but something has changed since last week.
Posted by: bigjim-ky || 07/23/2005 0:46 Comments || Top||

#2  The bark and grass crops failed, and the stones have turned to dust (which makes dreadful soup, dontcha know)?
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/23/2005 6:22 Comments || Top||

#3  e don't know about it yet, but something has changed since last week.

China decided to start the float of the Yuan.
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 8:23 Comments || Top||

#4  Why would that change things for North Korea, Mrs. D?
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/23/2005 11:38 Comments || Top||

Down Under
Al-Timmi preached jihad in Australia
RADICAL Australian Muslims were exposed to the extremist teachings of an American cleric who has been jailed for life in the US for inciting his followers to commit jihad against the West.

The cleric, Sheik Ali al-Timimi, was invited to speak in Australia by this country's most senior fundamentalist cleric, Sheik Mohammed Omran, and gave lectures in Melbourne and also at the controversial Sydney prayer hall in Haldon St, Lakemba, which is run by Sheik Abdul Salam Zoud.

Senior Islamic sources say some of Sheik Timimi's sermons, given during a visit in 2000, were recorded and continue to be sold at the bookstore in Sheik Omran's prayer hall in Brunswick - one of several bookstores that have come under scrutiny this week for selling radical Islamic texts.

A US court last week sentenced Sheik Timimi to life in prison for his actions in 2001 in inciting Muslims to jihad against the West and, in particular, against Western forces in Afghanistan - only months before Australian troops are scheduled to arrive in that country to help fight the Taliban.

Sheik Timimi's call was heeded by a group of followers in the US, 11 of whom were charged with conducting paramilitary training to prepare for "holy war" abroad.

The case resulted in nine convictions, the largest number in a US terror case since the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001.

Prosecutors described Sheik Timimi as a "purveyor of hate and war" for his role in inciting his followers, and his hefty sentence has sparked debate in the US about the limits of free speech in an era of terrorism.

A similar debate has broken out in Australia this week following calls by Australia's best-known Islamic leader, Sheik Taj Din al-Hilali, for bans on extremist Islamic literature and for the deportation of Islamic clerics who incite their followers to commit violent acts.

Sheik Omran has flatly rejected Sheik Hilali's proposals.

Attorney-General Philip Ruddock told The Australian yesterday the Government already had in place measures to ensure potential visitors who might incite violence could be refused a visa.

"If you look at the visa arrangements in relation to character testing, we have a lot of people who might euphemistically be described as sheiks who are denied entry to Australia because they might bring discordant messages," Mr Ruddock said.

Sheik Timimi enjoys a broad global following among radical Muslims, including in Australia. In an internet message in 2003, he described the destruction of the space shuttle Columbia as a "good omen" for Muslims in an apocalyptic conflict with the West.

Sheik Timimi called on his followers to commit jihad against the West only five days after the September 11 terror attacks.

Several of them then travelled to Pakistan, where they received military training from Lashkar-i-Taiba, an organisation that has since been branded a terrorist group by the US and Australia.

Mr Ruddock said Australia already had laws relating to incitement to commit a terrorist act, but retained an open mind about whether further changes were necessary.

"If you are talking jihad, does that constitute incitement to commit a terrorist act? It probably doesn't. Everything depends on the facts," he said.

"Do you start trying to define what aspects of a sermon might constitute a criminal offence?"

He said he would take a close look at the British Government's plans to create a new offence of "indirect incitement" to commit terrorist acts. But he cautioned that Canberra would not necessarily follow Britain's example.

Mr Ruddock said that in some of its proposed counter-terrorism measures, Britain was playing "catch-up" with Australia.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 07/23/2005 01:36 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [734 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Sheik Omran appears to be the head Wahabi in Australia, and has a lot of unpleasant acquantinces. Hopefully it won't take an attack in Sydney before he is dealt with.
Posted by: Paul Moloney || 07/23/2005 1:54 Comments || Top||

#2  Since Australia seems to be very similar to the US, i.e. a hardcore idiotarian press with a public Kool Aid following below majority, and has a real leader like Howard (major kudos to the man), I have real confidence that they are watching the London events very closely - and none of the lessons currently being learned will be lost on them.

I figure the UK will join the Dutch and begin to grab a clue about their suicidal level of multi-culti foolishness, often mischaracterized as "tolerance" - and it will be a tipping point for those Western countries which are still trying to ride the razor blade. Once a couple of the biggies "get it" and start openly deporting or jailing the imams and their followers in self-defense, others will follow suit. No one seems to want to be the first - the multi-culti "club" is very intolerant of splitters, apparently. Choosing between the club and public safety / survival should be easy enough - but we'll see. BTW, I don't have any respect for the Chirac regime's public symp mouthings vs their tougher non-public actions - it needs to be open and obvious policy or it will have no useful deterrent effect. Just more Chirac duplicity and disingenuous self-interest.

I think the Ozzies will get it early and apply it often. Will they get hit at home? Yeah, probably.
Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 3:28 Comments || Top||

#3  John Howard has been in London the last few days with Tony Blair during all the latest violence, he was also in Washington DC on 9/11, so he has learned all the lessons he needs to, it's just a matter of action.

In Australia any Isamist terror attack is likely to involve Lebanese, who are the same success story that the Paks have been in England, the Algerians in France, the Moroccans in Holland etc.

I'd guess we are about 10 years behind those countries when it comes to Jihadi threats, but the warning signs are there, with Australian Muslims having high unemployment levels, poor education, high birth rate and making up gangs that dominate parts of Sydney.
Posted by: Paul Moloney || 07/23/2005 4:20 Comments || Top||

#4  trying to ride the razor blade

Now that is an uncomfortable image!
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/23/2005 6:24 Comments || Top||

#5  John Howard has been in London the last few days with Tony Blair during all the latest violence, he was also in Washington DC on 9/11 ....

Cue next Islamo-nutcase conspiracy theory in 5 ... 4 ... 3 ....
Posted by: AzCat || 07/23/2005 7:11 Comments || Top||

#6  American cleric is really a stretch. How about terrorist? Why is taxpayer money being wasted on this prick?
Posted by: John Q. Citizen || 07/23/2005 7:55 Comments || Top||

#7  Speaking as an immigrant to Australia and someone who most of the people I socialize with are non-white immigrants or married to same, then most immigrants don't want multi-culti as .com put it. They want their kids to be real Aussies. The problem is with the usual suspects, professional leftists, the media and the immigrants who don't want to assimilate.

I'll tell you a story. The best know and best host of a current affairs program here (who incidentally the Aboriginals I used to work with insisted was one of them) had a piece featuring a professor who was anti African and Asian immigration. The guy was obviously selected as someone who would portray the issue in the worst light. Frankly the guy was an idiot and most here could put up a better argument. Nonetheless, the phone poll afterwards had 85% supporting his position. My point is that Australia is still a relatively homogenous society, and when and if the shit hits the fan most immigrants will side with the majority and despite the media hype most Australians (certainly all that I know) will side with the immigrants who want to be Aussies. The endgame is, those who don't will be seperated out somehow and likely deported or otherwise isolated.
Posted by: phil_b || 07/23/2005 8:05 Comments || Top||

#8  Phil, do you think that is true for Sydney and Melbourne? I got a much different feeling there, more Euro multi-culti, than in Adelaide, Brisbane or Perth.
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 8:18 Comments || Top||

#9  Mrs D, perceptive. I've been in Melbourne recently, but not Sydney. My personal opinion is that the centre of gravity in Oz politics is shifting away from Sydney and Melbourne and towards Perth and Brisbane. The perception with considerable justification is that we make the money and they spend it.
Posted by: phil_b || 07/23/2005 8:34 Comments || Top||

#10  "Australian Muslims . . . making up gangs that dominate parts of Sydney." Could you explain "dominate?" and what they do, actually? It would be really helpful.

Also did not understand "the perception with considerable justification is that we make the money and they spend it." Thanks phil_b.
Posted by: ex-lib || 07/23/2005 16:12 Comments || Top||

#11  And WHICH specific parts of Sydney?
Posted by: ex-lib || 07/23/2005 16:12 Comments || Top||

#12  Could you explain "dominate?" and what they do, actually? It would be really helpful.

Lebanese gangs control much of the organised crime in Sydney, from car stealing racquets to extortion to drugs. The only main competition comes from South East Asian gangs, who prey mostly on their own community than the community at large.

They mainly operate in South Western Sydney, and certain streets are no go zones for police unless they come in force.
Posted by: Paul Moloney || 07/23/2005 19:54 Comments || Top||

#13  when are the crackers gonna enforce their rule, dammit
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 20:09 Comments || Top||

France to step up surveillance of radical imams
CALVI: French Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy promised Friday to step up surveillance of radical Islamic clerics following the wave of failed bomb attacks in London. "Everyone in France has the right to practice his religion ... but when you look at the age of these young suicide bombers in London you can see the influence of radical preachers on these weak spirits. I do not intend to tolerate it," he said on a visit to Corsica. "We have decided that we must increase our means for video surveillance, speed up the introduction of the latest in telephone technology and information-prcessing and launch a large-scale project for the early detection of radicalising elements," the minister said.
Posted by: Fred || 07/23/2005 00:32 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [331 views] Top|| File under:


Oui! We must watch ze terrorists so zat zey do not make ze bumb and blow up ze Eiffel Ta-were

I am ready for ze mission maintenant!
Posted by: BigEd || 07/23/2005 2:26 Comments || Top||

#2  But they didn't take part in Iraq so they have nothing at all to worry about....Right? I don't get it....(scratching head)...What could there be to worry about?
Posted by: John in Tokyo || 07/23/2005 7:32 Comments || Top||

#3  Stepping up surveillance on the Imans should be really really easy.
Posted by: John Q. Citizen || 07/23/2005 7:57 Comments || Top||

#4  Well, on the other, the muslim brotherdhood radicals are officially made partners of the gvt with the CFCM (french council of muslim religion, dominated by representatives of foreign powers and islamist orgs); for example the then interior minister Dominique Galouzeau "de villepin" (who is a man) backpedaled on the issue of muslim chaplains in jail, who are now going to be chosen by the MB/Uoif, there is one mosque built every week, the local authorities are appeasing whenever they can, up to the point of police stations in muslim areas not reporting antisemites assaults, the official french "Arab policy" is still to lick the naughty bits of every dictator in the ME and NA coupled with a strident antizionism that's a a perfect excuse for jewish hatred, etc, etc...

There is talk of amending the 1905 law on the separation of State and Church, to let the taxpayer fund the imam's curriculum and the mosque (ie giving islam a state-funded status that none of the other religions enjoy); one of the main proponents of that swell idea is... Nicolas Sarkozy, the current interior minister and Chirac's arch-rival.
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 07/23/2005 12:22 Comments || Top||

#5  The frogs are good at appeasement (capitualation). However, appeasement does not work. The bar is increasingly raised with a strategy of appeasement. You end up losing.
Posted by: John Q. Citizen || 07/23/2005 13:49 Comments || Top||

Italy to set up anti-terrorist prosecutor's office
ROME: Italy's cabinet on Friday approved a package of measures to counter the threat of a London-style terrorist attack, including the establishment of a special prosecutor's office to coordinate the investigation of terrorist crimes. The cabinet agreed to establish a so-called "super-prosecutor's" office which will combine probes into terrorist and Mafia-related crime, Equal Opportunities Minister Stefania Prestigiacomo told reporters. The measures include extending preliminary detention from 12 to 24 hours, residence permits for immigrants who help in inquiries, easier access to Internet and mobile phone data and the right to carry out questioning without a lawyer being present. Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi, who acknowledged in the wake of the July 7 London attacks that Italy was in the "firing line" of terrorists, said the measures had been unanimously agreed by ministers.
Posted by: Fred || 07/23/2005 00:31 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [320 views] Top|| File under:

Home Front: Politix
Lt. Gov PeaceNut Crashes Dead Marines Funeral
Duplicate post.
Posted by: Captain America || 07/23/2005 16:58 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [330 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Does Knoll have no respect? Bet that bitch wishes she was protesting viet-nam and has delusions of being part of some bulshit history. Rest well Staff SGT Goodrich, you are in our prayers. Lt Gov Knoll-FUCK OFF!!!!
Posted by: 49 pan || 07/23/2005 17:06 Comments || Top||

#2  Evil bitch. She owes a personal apology to SSgt. Goodrich's family, a personal apology to his entire unit, and an apology to the people of Pennsylvania. And then Governor Rendell should fire her sorry ass.

The government of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania is "against the war"????? Well, it sure as hell wasn't "against it" back in 2003 after our troops took Baghdad, when I snapped this picture of Gov. Ed Rendell as he addressed a Support Our Troops rally in Media, Pa on April 6, 2003.

What's going on here, anyway? We got an election coming up or something?????

God, I hate Democrats...
Posted by: Dave D. || 07/23/2005 17:37 Comments || Top||

#3  Maybe Catherine Knoll should join Pastor Fred Phelps' Westboro Baptist Church in Kansas. The uncouth bitch would fit right in.
Posted by: GK || 07/23/2005 18:12 Comments || Top||

#4  This gotta be Urban Legend Bs..... please if not. Maybe I do need to rethink my position on mortar ownership.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 18:15 Comments || Top||

#5  Shipman,I just checked Snopes. The Mikkleson's don't have anything on this story. So what sort of mortar did you have in mind?
Posted by: GK || 07/23/2005 18:36 Comments || Top||

#6  Enough of this "politeness" crap. If I had been killed in military duty overseas, I would expect it of my family to beat seven bells out of anybody who wanted to be a royal jerk at my funeral. These imbeciles have no tact, do not understand offense, and must be trained to respect their betters. Until they are taught, and severely, to mind their manners, they should be taught to fear opening their mouths less some anonymous fist find refuge between their teeth.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 07/23/2005 18:48 Comments || Top||

#7  Enough of this "politeness" crap. If I had been killed in military duty overseas, I would expect it of my family to beat seven bells out of anybody who wanted to be a royal jerk at my funeral. These imbeciles have no tact, do not understand offense, and must be trained to respect their betters. Until they are taught, and severely, to mind their manners, they should be taught to fear opening their mouths lest some anonymous fist find refuge between their teeth.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 07/23/2005 18:48 Comments || Top||

#8  Hmmm. In PA, is the Lt Gov post traditionally reserved for a total fucking moron? Sorta like the State Jester or something?

Just askin'.
Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 18:59 Comments || Top||

#9  In Pa., all government posts are reserved for TFMs...
Posted by: Dave D. || 07/23/2005 19:08 Comments || Top||

#10  Heh, I hear you, Bro. I'm sure our MA guys feel your pain, too.
Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 19:13 Comments || Top||

#11  I think it is time for Tar and Feathers. They were quite effective against "government" agents in the 1770s. There seem to be many parallels between that time and this.
Posted by: SR-71 || 07/23/2005 19:19 Comments || Top||

#12  Still shaking my hed in disbelief... this is nutz.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 19:24 Comments || Top||

#13  Someone call Websters - We have a good picture to go along with their definition of bitch...

I hope her opponents (if its an elected position - the Governers opponents if appointed) use this when the sow is up for reelection again.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 07/23/2005 20:17 Comments || Top||

PA Lt. gov. crashed Marine's funeral, kin say
(HT to Crackerbarrel Philosopher - wished he'd post more often)
The family of a Marine who was killed in Iraq is furious with Lt. Gov. Catherine Baker Knoll for showing up uninvited at his funeral this week, handing out her business card and then saying "our government" is against the war.

Rhonda Goodrich of Indiana, Pa., said yesterday that a funeral was held Tuesday at a church in Carnegie for her brother-in-law, Staff Sgt. Joseph Goodrich, 32. She said he "died bravely and courageously in Iraq on July 10, serving his country."
In a phone interview, Goodrich said the funeral service was packed with people "who wanted to tell his family how Joe had impacted their lives."

Then, suddenly, "one uninvited guest made an appearance, Catherine Baker Knoll."

She sat down next to a Goodrich family member and, during the distribution of communion, said, "Who are you?" Then she handed the family member one of her business cards, which Goodrich said she still has. evidence of boorish behavior - hang her "Knoll felt this was an appropriate time to campaign and impose her will on us," Goodrich said. "I am amazed and disgusted Knoll finds a Marine funeral a prime place to campaign."

Goodrich said she is positive that Knoll was not invited to the funeral, which was jammed with Marines in dress uniform and police officers, because the fallen Marine had been a policeman in McKeesport and Indiana County.

"Our family deserves an apology," Rhonda Goodrich said. "Here you have a soldier who was killed -- dying for his country -- in a church full of grieving family members and she shows up uninvited. It made a mockery of Joey's death." What really upset the family, Goodrich said, is that Knoll said, 'I want you to know our government is against this war,' " Goodrich said.
and she would know - Ed Rendell said so.... bet he doesn't say that tomorrow...
She said she is going to seek an answer from Gov. Ed Rendell's administration if it opposes the fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Knoll was drinking heavily traveling yesterday, away from the Capitol, and couldn't be reached. But an aide said she "extends condolences to all families who have lost loved ones" serving in the military.

Without having talked to her, the aide, who asked not to be named, said, "The family members of fallen soldiers are in our hearts and prayers. Our prayers go out to their loved ones in their hour of grief."

Asked to comment on Goodrich's complaints about Knoll's conduct at the funeral, the aide said that "would be inappropriate."
just like the politician's behavior
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 16:43 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [325 views] Top|| File under:

#1  First! Sorry Capt America, usually it's the AOS that does it to me... :-)
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 17:03 Comments || Top||

#2  No prob Frank, I like your's better anyway. And the pic shows the face of one f+ed up a+hole.

PA deserves better.

Brings back memories of our family preventing Clinton admin from greeting the flight at Arlington when my brother was returned from Saudi.

These people have no class.
Posted by: Captain America || 07/23/2005 17:29 Comments || Top||

#3  agreed - she looks like a Madeleine Halfbright wanna-be
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 17:32 Comments || Top||

#4  See my comment on the other posting; I haven't been this goddamn angry in at least a decade...
Posted by: Dave D. || 07/23/2005 17:45 Comments || Top||

#5  It just doesn't make it sense. It's crazy.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 18:36 Comments || Top||

#6  how far can Rendell move away from this fiasco by Monday? Ima thinkr arizona?
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 18:49 Comments || Top||

Home Front: WoT
Massive Backlog, Long Waits for Green Cards
While I want us to screen out Islamacists, MS13 members and other undesireables, this country thrives on the energy of good immigrants. The feds need to get their act together on this. If you don't want jobs going overseas - or if you want us to remain the most competitive country for the best of the best - support the integration of good people into our economy here.

Hundreds of thousands of immigrant workers trying to stay in the United States find their journey halted somewhere along a maze of boxes, filing cabinets and cubicles of government contractors.

The backlog of foreign workers seeking green cards, which allow immigrants to live and work in the United States permanently, numbers more than 330,000. In September, the Department of Labor set up a center here and another in Dallas to quicken the first step of processing for employment-based green cards.

But while the federal agency said it has spent time and money to ease a complicated traffic jam, immigrants, their employers and lawyers have been growing impatient.

"It's too long," said Rajesh Poudyal, who emigrated from Nepal 15 years ago on a student visa. His employer, a contractor for NASA in Greenbelt, applied for his green card in November 2001. "You don't know if it's going to be another three-year wait. You keep thinking, 'It's gonna happen. It's gonna happen.' "

And yet it hasn't.

Government officials say the wait has been too long for most of the immigrant workers hoping for their green cards. The oldest case is from August 1998. Jebus. On March 28, the Labor Department introduced a computerized fast-track processing system to handle new applications, doling them out to two centers. Between the backlog centers and the new sites, labor officials said, they have streamlined a multi-layered process that could have had some waiting as long as six more years. Now, they say, the backlog should be cleared within two years. Okee dokee ....

In employment-based green card applications, the Labor Department essentially certifies that the employer exists and that the immigrant is being paid the prevailing wage for the job described. In most cases, employers must also prove that they sought to hire U.S. workers for the job but could not. As proof, they provide classified advertisements, competing résumés and summaries of their recruitment methods.

From this stage, known as labor certification, the application travels to the Department of Homeland Security, which conducts its own review and decides whether to allow the immigrant to petition for residency status.

Before the backlog accumulated, immigration attorneys say, labor certification generally took 30 to 90 days.

Under the new fast-track system, labor officials say, the process should routinely take up to 60 days.

But there is no such expectation for the 174,000 people awaiting processing here from about half the states, including Maryland and Virginia, and the District. reminds me of the Italian post office that just dumped a huge backlog of undelivered mail Besides 10 federal workers, the remaining staff of 100 work for Exceed Corp., the company that successfully bid for the backlog contract.

Starting last year, all 50 states sent boxes upon boxes to one of the two backlog sites. Officials said that they hope to act on the applications on a first-in, first-out basis and that they have entered about 80 percent of the applicants' data into a computerized system over the past year.

"In government terms, that has been quite a short amount of time," said Emily Stover DeRocco, assistant secretary of labor for employment and training.

The backlog stems from the passage of legislation that allowed undocumented immigrants or immigrants who had overstayed their visas to apply for green cards if a family member or employer sponsored them -- but they had to do it by April 2001. The result was a surge of green card applications.

The result has also been some resentment of workers who have not been in the United States legally from workers who have.

Continued on Page 49
Posted by: too true || 07/23/2005 12:08 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [697 views] Top|| File under:

#1  These are the types of immigrants we want to welcome to our shores - LAW ABIDING and productive.

Meanwhile, in Washington D.C. George Bush wants to give virtual amnesty to millions of people who violated federal law and entered the US illegally. Pissing in the eye of every single one of these people.

I say if you want a guest worker program then fine - but dont give any out until every single legal immigrant (including those who have not filed yet) have been given their turn.

It takes nearly 5 years for a petition for a relative (non-citizen son/daugher) to even be looked by the USCIS
Posted by: CrazyFool || 07/23/2005 12:25 Comments || Top||

#2  The facts are the managers of this department are totally incompetent. Fire them. I they can't get this work done quickly and efficiently fire them. The Secratary of Labort needs to be fired as well.

Apperently the "Department of Labor" doesn't know how to work. These approvals shouldn't take days, months or years, They should be able to be made in minutes.

Posted by: Sock Puppet 0’ Doom || 07/23/2005 12:58 Comments || Top||

#3  Microsoft Corp. Chairman Bill Gates has repeatedly advocated removing caps on H-1B visas.

Ah, yes, the unlimited labor market, no more supply and demand to contend with. H1Bs started at under 10K authorized and has grown care of both parties to over 200K per year. So why in the hell study computer science at all in America, cause the big companies will just hire foreign. Been in the game. First HR prints a help wanted listing that is a page long with qualifications [of which one or two humans on the planet might have most]. When no 'qualified' individual is found, they get an H1B visa authorization to hire foreign. There is no follow up to see how close the hired person matches the original listing. Its all a HR game. Companies complain they can't find people with 'experience', but won't employ Americans so they can get the experience. Companies complain they can't find the right skill combinations, but won't pay for the training. Damn, seems the Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines not only pay for your time but also train you. However, Mr. US Business will not pay for training cause you might move on with the skills and the company doesn't want to issue a contract of obligation cause then the labor moves from resource to liability.

If you want unlimited labor, I want all barriers to products and services removed too. All those little Congressional paybacks to protect companies from international competition. I want full enforcement of Sherman Antitrust so that all cabals to rig prices are literally put out of business.

As for the Hundreds of thousands of immigrant workers trying to stay in the United States, thank all the illegals and their apologists who skip the line and divert resources from your applications.
Posted by: Hupavith Gletle6588 || 07/23/2005 15:54 Comments || Top||

#4  gotta take care of this process - make it reasonable for people willing to go through it. Don't reward the fence-jumpers
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 16:14 Comments || Top||

#5  To hell with all these bastards. Send them all packing back to wherever they came from. Next time you get on a freeway at rush hour ask yourself how many more people, particularly from elsewhere, we need to have in this country. There isn't one problem, not one, in this country that wasn't more easily addressed in a country of 150 million people than in a country of 300 million.
Ship 'em back and close the door for good. If we need more people here, they're easily made at home here in the U.S. by unskilled labor who enjoy their work.
Posted by: mac || 07/23/2005 20:31 Comments || Top||

#6  Where does it say it will be quick and easy to get a green card or citizenship in the US? It doesn't so knock of the god damned whinning. We let them stay while the process is going on so what is the prob? They are lucky we let anyone in at this point.
Posted by: bigjim-ky || 07/23/2005 23:47 Comments || Top||

Memo warns of hospital threat
Action News 8 has learned of a memo in which the California Department of Homeland Security warns state hospitals they should consider themselves potential al-Qaida terror targets.

Earlier this month, the U.S. government learned that hospitals across the country could be terror targets, which is why the California Hospital Association sent a letter to hospitals statewide, warning them of the threat.

In the letter, the California Department of Homeland Security warns that al-Qaida may be planning attacks on hospitals in September or October of this year.

Although the government says the information is uncorroborated, it is urging hospital employees to be vigilant.

The source specifically mentioned the Los Angeles and San Diego areas, but emergency centers nationwide have been warned.

"Hospitals are a key piece of infrastructure," said California Homeland Security spokesman Gary Winuk. "If there is to be an attack somewhere, particularly biological or chemical, they're the first line of defense. So, we're very concerned about them and a number of other sectors."

The government source told homeland security officials that nuclear facilities and military and civilian airports are also possible targets.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 07/23/2005 01:21 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [330 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I can't think of a place, other than schools, that would raise the anger of a populace more. When it was reported that one of the thursday bombers had run into a hospital I was thinking that if it detonated there, all bets would be off, and things would turn hideous.

I'm certain that the same response would happen in the US.

An attack on a 'target' like this will only serve to galvanize the populace, and make 'em mean.
Posted by: Tony (UK) || 07/23/2005 2:47 Comments || Top||

#2  The ones that really count are already pissed. Its the loony Left that needs a frontal lobotomy. Maybe if someone took away their teddy bears that might get upset for a day.
Posted by: Captain America || 07/23/2005 3:55 Comments || Top||

#3  Tony, that's the point. I've been dancing around pointing out the obvious targets for a while now, but this is one.
Posted by: phil_b || 07/23/2005 8:23 Comments || Top||

#4  Yes, phil_b, I remember your comment of a few days back - I thought you might have meant targets like this.

I feel that the response if these types of targets are hit will be dramatic.
Posted by: Tony (UK) || 07/23/2005 8:59 Comments || Top||

#5  It's no secret.

Baseball games
Football games
Beauty Pageants.

It's all in the clear.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 10:20 Comments || Top||

#6  Beauty Pagents?? Seriously?
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/23/2005 11:42 Comments || Top||

#7  Beauty Pageants with contestants donning burkas is the objective. Replaces swim suit competition. Nice eyes.
Posted by: Captain America || 07/23/2005 12:14 Comments || Top||

#8  TW: They want to target what they see as our arrogant and Allan-less way of life. So of course beauty pagents. Ya gotta think like them. Not the cannon fodder, but the planners. What makes them tick? Remember a lot of them came here to study. To study, then go home and be technocrats in their corrupt home countries. But what happened? They drank too much and got laughed at. They tried to hit on the blonde in the tight skirt and got laughed at _and_ scorned. They tried to fit in and were rejected. They saw that our capitalist economy put everything they ever learned about economics in the good ole U of Lahore to shame. They are filled with shame, anger, and resentment. They want payback!

That's the psychological angle. They want to get the biggest bang for their buck, too. Their doctrine holds that the action which creates the most terror in the minds' of their opponents is the best course of action. What creates the most horror in the mind of an American? How much news coverage does a child abduction get in this country? What about that pretty girl lost and presumed shark bait in Aruba? What if I could kidnap a whole hall of pretty girls and start beheading them one at a time? Hell they might even be able set set up an internet connection and get a few of the videos out to the "brothers" before it got shut down.

I concur with Shipman. All of the potential targets are listed on goverment and government sponsored white papers in the public domain. Google is your friend. What people shouldn't be posting to the web are tactical and intel lessons learned.
Posted by: 11A5S || 07/23/2005 13:53 Comments || Top||

#9  Thank you, 11A5S. I fear I never will think that way, which is why I'm a sheep, and you-all are the sheepdogs protecting the herd from the jihadi wolves. And why the trailing daughters, silly girls that they are, don't like me to talk to strangers (it's not clear to me how they think I survived before they took on this responsibility, but some arguments can't be won, I suppose). ;-)
Posted by: trailing wife || 07/23/2005 19:34 Comments || Top||

House votes to keep Patriot Act
The House, overriding fears that Americans' freedoms are being restricted, voted to make permanent provisions of the Patriot Act that gave authorities more investigative power in the aftermath of the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks. Lawmakers voted 257-171 Thursday to make permanent 14 of the Patriot Act's 16 sections that are scheduled to expire in December, rejecting the civil liberties concerns of Democrats and some Republicans who wanted to limit several provisions of the anti-terrorism law.
Posted by: Fred || 07/23/2005 00:07 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [349 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "overriding fears" ... "civil liberties concerns"

Given that there is not one instance of abuse to point at and cry "Wolf!", the wank-o-matics continue their lame pathetic innuendo memery. Sorry, SFGate, you'll have to surrender to dhimmitude without dragging the rest of us down with you. So sad. Now fuck the fuck off you fucking fuckwits.
Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 1:01 Comments || Top||

#2  The police in China have about a billion more powers granted to them than the Patriot Act (worst name ever) grants, and I wouldn't call China a "police state".
Posted by: gromky || 07/23/2005 2:02 Comments || Top||

#3  Not sure Falun Gong, Catholics or the folks who ended up under tanks in Tianamen Square would would agree with you there, G. And irregardless of the merits of the Patriot Act (doesn't seem to be the source of many actual problems to me), since when is "hey, we're better than China" good enough?
Posted by: VAMark || 07/23/2005 6:57 Comments || Top||

#4  I actually don't like the "permanent" part. I would rather Congress had an up-or-down vote every few years. Of course, I think they should do that with the income tax, too...
Posted by: Jackal || 07/23/2005 9:54 Comments || Top||

#5  One question. Do you want Hillary Clinton and a Jannet Reno with the Patriot Act?
Posted by: Sock Puppet 0’ Doom || 07/23/2005 14:03 Comments || Top||

Thailand criticised for state of emergency: UN HRC
Thailand's new state of emergency has been challenged by the head of the United Nations panel examining the country's human rights record.
Everyone go get a nice cup of Here We Go Again.
The Thai Government has been in the dock in Geneva this week, forced to defend its record on detention of suspects without charge; the disappearance of activists; abuse of refugees, ethnic minorities and migrant workers; media censorship; and the state of emergency recently imposed in the mostly Muslim south. "We have a lot of problems with this state of emergency in Thailand," said Catherine Chanet, the chairwoman of the UN Human Rights Committee. "We are very worried about that."
Of course, the Thai government might be worried about 800+ of its law-abiding citizens who suddenly found themselves without their heads, or shot dead from a passing auto-rickshaw.
The committee warned it would place Thailand under "harsher follow-up procedure" as a result of the state of emergency, and demanded the Government provide an official translation of the decree by this weekend.
Gads. The Un really really means it this time!
A Thai Government delegation appeared before the committee on Tuesday and Wednesday to respond to 26 issues raised by the committee under the mandate of the International Convention on Civil and Political Rights, which Thailand signed in 1996. The committee requested extra information on violence in the south, where there is a low-level but deadly insurgency; the war on drugs, in which more than 2500 alleged drug users and dealers have been killed extrajudicially; and the fate of Somchai Neelapaichit, a high-profile Muslim lawyer who is missing and believed murdered after he represented four men accused of being associated with the Islamist terrorist group Jemaah Islamiah. The men were later cleared of all charges.
Whence they immediately went back on the active roster, and prolly got sent to Iraq for 'outreach.'
Mr Somchai's wife testified in Geneva this week on her husband's disappearance. "Without justice and an end to impunity, forced disappearances risk becoming common and acceptable in our society," Mrs Angkhana Neelapaichit reportedly told the committee. "If my children and I did not feel so hopeless and had not been suffering from the psychological torment caused by [Mr Somchai's] continuing disappearance, I would not be here to call for justice."
"No justice, no peace."
The UN committee expressed concern that the emergency law allowed detention without charge for 30 days, up from 48 hours previously.
Concern expressed, stand by for sternly worded memo. 'Cept Thailand is a infidel state, they may actually try to make Thailand pay.
Ms Chanet was quoted in The Nation newspaper: " In this law they say there is impunity for any policeman or soldier whose behaviour is against human rights. It's a provision of the law and we said it was absolutely not in conformity." The Thai Government has defended the security decree as a necessary step to restore law and order in the three southernmost provinces, Narathiwat, Yala and Pattani. More than 800 people have died in the insurgency since it flared again in January 2004.The UN committee will release its findings on the Thailand hearing next Friday.
Posted by: Seafarious || 07/23/2005 04:43 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [334 views] Top|| File under:

#1  The UNHRC, given the composition of "member states" who've been running it for some time now, is a classic contradiction in terms. A rebuke from them should be taken as a certain sign you're doing something right.

Flip 'em off Thaksin, and get down to business. Your first and only concern should be for your citizens, not the approval of a concentrated collection of the world's worst thugocracies.

Fucking UN. Flush this bitch, already.
Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 7:37 Comments || Top||

#2  This stinks. It's wrong on many levels - what about the 800+ dead people? Who speaks for them? Bastards.

Great inline comments Seafarious!
Posted by: Tony (UK) || 07/23/2005 7:49 Comments || Top||

#3  You are absolutely right that Thailand is being targetted by the U.N. because they are not Muslim (and are actually fighting back...) while the Sudan government is given free reign to rape and murder.

As for the lawyer - he is probably in hiding or lying headless somewhere - lie down with dogs and wake up with feas and all that....
Posted by: CrazyFool || 07/23/2005 8:43 Comments || Top||

#4  I would tell Thailand to just ignore these assistants to genocide and murder and take care of your own.

UNHRC is a joke. Point at them and laugh. Then slap them around.
Posted by: Sock Puppet 0’ Doom || 07/23/2005 13:05 Comments || Top||

Southeast Asia
The usual suspects vow fight against Thailand emergency law
In Thailand, nameless civic groups, journalists and opposition politicians are vowing to fight new government emergency measures aimed at quelling 18 months of violence in three southern provinces. Thai security officials say the measures are necessary because the attacks are becoming more sophisticated and more deadly, but unnamed critics fear the government will use the situation to roll back democratic freedoms.
Whereas the Thai gov't fears its citizens are being slaughtered like sheep.
Night was beginning to fall last Thursday in Thailand's southern city, Yala, on the eve of Friday prayers when a series of explosions plunged much of the town into darkness. In the 30 minutes that followed an estimated 60 attackers rampaged through the town, firebombing hotels, shops and a police booth. Two policemen were killed in a shootout and 22 civilians were wounded. The following day an angry Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra announced his government would pass a new law granting emergency powers to control the unrest.
Government spokesman Chalermdej Jombunud says the government for some time has wanted to overhaul a group of old laws, decrees and emergency measures, in order to unify the chain of command and strengthen security efforts in the south. "We combined seven laws together to become the new royal decree," he said. The measures, which replace martial law in three southern provinces, allow authorities to detain suspects without charge, ban public protests, listen in on phone calls, and censor the media. The law also gives legal immunity to officials who carry out such acts.
The Thai Patriot Act. John Ashcroft would be proud.
Security officials fear that the southern violence, once considered to be a mix of quarrels among local Muslim separatists, criminal gangs and corrupt officials, could be reaching more dangerous levels. A professor at Bangkok's Chulalongkorn University, Panitan Wattanyagorn, says the attackers have become more sophisticated and better organized. "They are now behaving very much like a terrorist group or a terrorist movement, not yet fully emerged as a well-organized organization, but they are on their way to becoming one impressive organization very soon if not controlled properly," he said. Experts say the insurgency so far has been mostly a local movement with little influence from outside Thailand. However, Professor Panitan says this is changing. "It is more and more understood that these groups are not just local groups anymore," he said. "They have now been assisted or connected in various ways, especially in terms of charity and tactics. And this is making a new dimension in the south."

The secretary-general of the Islamic Center of Thailand, Prakorn Preeyakorn, says most Muslims in the south are living in fear and support government efforts to end the violence. "Most of them do agree with the government's move at the moment. But they think [it better] if the government can control the situation without violating human rights," he said.

However, the new law has brought protests from unnamed civil rights activists, intellectuals and journalists, who fear the government will use it to undermine democracy. The chairman of the Senate Foreign Affairs Committee, Kraisak Choonavan, says the new law will not end the violence. "Terrorists, the insurgents are a very small number and yet they are able to prolong and increase their activities because of people's support," he said. "Now, if you continue to intimidate the people with this law which will make intimidation legal, you will see no end to the insurgency."
"They just can't help themselves, see...the Buddhists are driving the poor Moose limbs into a frenzy."
Senator Kraisak says the insurgents' aspiration for their own state has been boosted in part by international Islamic militancy, but he says support for the insurgents has been especially strengthened by the security crackdown. The Thai government in recent months has pursued a spectacularly unsuccessful policy of dialogue in the region. It appointed a reconciliation commission, which has recommended lifting martial law to ease public resentment toward the central government. And despite the new law - which some unnamed members view as a setback to their efforts - the commission says it will pursue its efforts to bring an end to the violence through peaceful means.
If I recall correctly, in Thailand it is against the law to speak poorly of their King, with actual jail time and everything. It's 'understood' that that's the Thai 'cultural thing.' I wonder if the imams are ever cited under those statutes?
Posted by: Seafarious || 07/23/2005 04:57 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [317 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Article: "Terrorists, the insurgents are a very small number and yet they are able to prolong and increase their activities because of people's support," he said. "Now, if you continue to intimidate the people with this law which will make intimidation legal, you will see no end to the insurgency."

This is demonstrably wrong. Thailand has had long-running Communist and Muslim insurgencies that it has suppressed for decades. The Communist one died when the Chinese stopped funding it in the 1970's. The Muslim one died when they killed or captured most of the firebrands. And emergency laws far more draconian than the current ones were in place then.
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 07/23/2005 7:11 Comments || Top||

#2  How about air-dropping more origami into the South? heh
Posted by: Grush Shomogum2379 || 07/23/2005 8:17 Comments || Top||

Martial law declared in Mahabad, Iran
HT Regime change in Iran

KURDISTAN, July 22 (DozaMe.org) - 13 days after the killing of Shivane Qadri, demonstrations are raging on in the city of Mahabad in eastern Kurdistan (northwestern Iran). Two more Iranian soldiers have been reported killed by demonstrators.

The Iranian government has now declared martial law and curfew in the Kurdish city. Demonstrators who defy the curfew are still protesting on the streets. A clash on July 18 between Kurdish demonstrators and Iranian soldiers has left two soldiers killed.

For the first time after 10 years, the Iranian military is now setting up bases inside the city. Bases have been set up at the Independence Square, who has historically witnessed many popular revolutions, and at Shivane Qadris home district of Pisttep.

Clashes between people and military are increasing and there is no more tranquility in the city, Kurdish news agency MHA's war correspondent Sherko Mehabadi reports. Iranian soldiers have unsuccessfully tried to clamp down on the protesters, leading to tens of protesters and tens of soldiers injured.

Iranian security forces have also cut off the water in the Fergengiyan district and the gas in the Teppey-Qazi district, local sources report. Security forces have until now arrested more than 200 demonstrators and few who have been released report intensive torture of arrested protesters, including themselves.

Iranian soldiers and police are now patrolling the streets in hunt for demonstrators. Groups of more than three are being scattered brutally and during curfew, which starts at 22:00 (10 pm) every evening, groups more than three are being arrested.

Eastern Kurdistan has not felt this tension since the 80ies. This has led to the governor of Mahabad threatening the Kurdish people in radio and TV statements saying, "Stop the demonstrations! You don't want the 80ies back, I assure you".

Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 17:27 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [327 views] Top|| File under:

#1  good news - take it to the MM's
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 17:52 Comments || Top||

Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 19:59 Comments || Top||

#3  likely their fodder carried the signs and took the SAVAK beatings - the MM's were too holy to suffer the consequences of their preachings. F*&kers
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 20:08 Comments || Top||

Home Front: Tech
Report paints USS San Antonio as lemon
A Navy inspection report describes the USS San Antonio as having "great potential for future useful service to the fleet."
Operative word: potential.
After years of work, the vessel billed as a stealth ship is infested with corrosion, badly wired, poorly built, and deemed so unsafe that Navy inspectors warned its crew shouldn't take it to sea.
Inspectors examining the San Antonio from June 27-July 5 found safety deficiencies throughout the ship. Construction and craftsmanship standards, they said, were "poor."
Workers left a "snarled, over-packed, poorly assembled and virtually uncorrectable electrical/electronic cable plant." Watertight integrity was compromised throughout the ship by multiple cable lines.
The inspectors predicted the San Antonio "will be plagued by electrical/electronic cable plant installation deficiencies throughout its entire service life" if corrective work isn't done.
Though those actions are on the drawing board, they warned the ship shouldn't take on its crew until "significant" damage control and firefighting systems are put into operation.
But the Navy and shipbuilder Northrop Grumman Ship Systems say the San Antonio, the first amphibious transport ship in its class, actually has encountered fewer problems than other vessels like it in recent years.
"It is the first of class, and every first of class has significant challenges," Northrop Grumman Ship Systems spokesman Brian Cullin said Thursday.
The first U.S. warship named for the Alamo City was handed to the Navy this week with little fanfare. It passed inspection after winning "satisfactory" scores in seven performance areas of the Builders Sea Trial and Acceptance Trial conducted by the shipbuilder.
San Antonio, though, was deemed "an incomplete ship," missing everything from deck drains to berthing compartment sprinkler systems and fire extinguishers, the Navy Board of Inspection and Survey said.
Design changes driven by shrinking defense budgets have robbed the ship of some of its stealth characteristics — one of its marquee features.
The ship's specifications included significant radar cross-section reduction technology. As construction ensued, the report stated, "design reduction decisions were made because of constrained funding. RCS effectiveness is now reduced."
Examples of problems in reducing the ship's radar signature include life raft RCS covers, which weren't funded and catwalks and platforms that didn't have shrouds or covers.
However, the Navy has hailed the San Antonio, which is designed to take Marines into dangerous locales, as a ship of firsts. It's the Navy's first stealth ship, using fewer angles from protruding pieces of steel and a pair of eight-sided twin masts that reduce its radar signature.
It's the fleet's first "gender-neutral" ship, with living quarters and showers for women. Designed entirely on computer, the San Antonio was to be the first of 12 amphibious transport dock ships built under a $16 billion program.
Today, cost overruns have chewed into the Navy's budget, reducing the number of San Antonio-class ships to nine. The ship's cost has soared from $830 million to a projected $1.85 billion.
Northrop Grumman's Cullin said costs increased in part because the ship still was being designed two years into its construction. High-tech systems installed in the ship also were a factor.
"I can understand why the Navy and Northrop Grumman are defensive about this," said retired Rear Adm. Steve Pietropaoli, a former top Navy spokesman. "But the fact is we're not getting the product we need to support Marines in the future."
San Antonio's production woes and rising price are typical of Pentagon weapons systems. Cost has emerged as a big issue both in the Defense Department and on Capitol Hill.
Navy Secretary Gordon England has launched a study into the matter in his capacity as acting deputy secretary of defense, a job previously held by Paul Wolfowitz.
Pietropaoli hadn't seen the inspection report and declined to speculate about the severity of the San Antonio's problems. But former Assistant Defense Secretary Lawrence Korb said the problems cited in the Navy report seemed worse than usual.
Both Northrop Grumman's Cullin and Cmdr. Herman Phillips, a spokesman with the Naval Sea Systems Command, said the ship hasn't been put into commission. The Navy and the company had identified the San Antonio's problems, they said, and would fix them.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 07/23/2005 16:21 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [499 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Jeebus...almost $2B for a gator freighter? And the damn thing doesn't even work?!? Thought that kind of cash would buy a Burke-class Aegis DDG.

I did a little Googling on Northrop Grumman Ship Systems, and, considering the contents of this article, was not one little bit surprised to find out that NGSS was formerly known as Litton Industries, operators of a notoriously inept shipyard in Pascagoula, MS. I was stationed in Long Beach, CA in the late 1970's, when the USS Tarawa (LHA-1) came to the LB naval shipyard for what was supposed to be a "post-shakedown availability" of apx. 2 months. It essentially turned into a full-blown overhaul of more than a year's duration - the guys in her crew echoed many of the same criticisms seen in the Navy's report about the USS San Antonio.

The "LHA" in the Tarawa's designation officially stood for "Landing Helicopter Assault", but the crew always said it stood for "Litton's Huge Abortion". You'd have thought the Navy would have learned something over thirty freaking years & had Bath Ironworks or Newport News build these damn things - I didn't think anyone was even LISTENING to Trent Lott (MS Senator) anymore!
Posted by: Ricky bin Ricardo (Abu Babaloo) || 07/23/2005 17:47 Comments || Top||

#2  You gotta problem with the Way Tren Loot's voters build a boat?
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 17:49 Comments || Top||

#3  Yur saying this isn't a new thing Ricky?
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 18:38 Comments || Top||

#4  Shipman, I concur with Ricky. Litton Pascagula has been known for shoddy work that slides by on first glance since the 80s, and maybe before.
Posted by: Jackal || 07/23/2005 21:50 Comments || Top||

Afghanistan/South Asia
US offers warships to India for first time
For the first time, the United States has offered India military hardware including warships like minesweepers and big landing ships, Chief of Naval staff Admiral Arun Prakash said here today.
Posted by: john || 07/23/2005 14:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [352 views] Top|| File under:

#1  The big item is selling them P-3 Orions. Why would the Indians need those, I wonder?

Prakash also referred to a "big void" in the country's underwater capability and pointed out that the pending multi-billion Euro deal on acquisition of Scorpene submarines from France would be renegotiated to cover pricing, cost escalation as well as to insert transparency and integrity clauses in the deal.

France...integrity... I think this guy has stumbled on the oxymoron of the century.
Posted by: Mrs. Davis || 07/23/2005 15:58 Comments || Top||

#2  Big landing ships? Landing ship docks or the last way cool landing ship tanks? No! maybe a couple of retired LPHs?
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 16:06 Comments || Top||

#3  The big item is selling them P-3 Orions. Why would the Indians need those, I wonder?

Pak has bought 3 Agosta submarines from France (1 built in France, the next 2 under assembly in Pak) that are more advanced than anything in the Indian Navy. Any Chinese SSN or Kilo in the bay of Bengal also needs to be dealt with.

The Il-38 Mays and Tu-142 Bears operated by the IN are getting near the end of their service life and replacements are needed. While T-22 M3 Backfires are said to be part of the Gorshkov carrier deal, the IN prefers more advanced sensor suites.

(The rusting Admiral Gorshkov was "given" to India but it had to pay for upgrade and conversion to STOBAR. The IN also bought Mig-29Ks for the carrier wings of the Gorshkov and the ADS carrier being built in an Indian shipyard. There are reports that the deal also includes the M3 Backfires and two SSNs of the Akula 2 class)

Posted by: john || 07/23/2005 16:20 Comments || Top||

#4  planes that don't kill the trainees = good thing
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 16:33 Comments || Top||

#5  Backfires are attack bombers ( a sort of scaled down B1)and not comparable with Bears and Il-38 Mays.

Posted by: Hupomoque Spoluter7949 || 07/23/2005 17:06 Comments || Top||

#6  Yes Backfires are attack bombers, but you mate them up with good comm, Harpoon-class sea skimmers, and droppable torpedos with the proper sonar tracks programmed in, and suddenly all those subs and surface ships in the area become very endangered. Example, 20 Harpoons and 24 torpedos per Backfire and suddenly the Paki and/or ChiCom fleet is not so impressive.
Posted by: Shieldwolf || 07/23/2005 17:59 Comments || Top||

#7  Jeebs.... I'd love to see a BackFire drop on a Sub! Train wrecks are so rare anymore.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 18:24 Comments || Top||

#8  Be sorta like seeing a B-58 attack a PT Boat.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 18:26 Comments || Top||

#9  I have a sneaking suspicion that both China and India are gearing up for a big land war. Certainly China and the US are at odds, but they are far away from each other. India is the next door neighbor, lost the last round, and both sides have way too many extra young men that need to be culled. Call it a "war based on demographics". The loss of 30 million men on each side would do much to restore the ecological balance.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 07/23/2005 19:14 Comments || Top||

#10  Makes sense. NMSBS
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 19:28 Comments || Top||

#11  I understand the purchase of P-3's. I don't know that LST's would be useful. I wouldn't mind seeing them obtain Perry class FFG's or Spruance class Destroyers.
Posted by: Super Hose || 07/23/2005 19:50 Comments || Top||

Home Front: Culture Wars
Man pleads not guilty to threatening Patriot member
A man who allegedly threatened to shoot a member of the Yuma Patriots in the head pleaded not guilty to a misdemeanor Thursday morning in Somerton Justice Court. Harry Brooks Norris, 59, a U.S. citizen who says he has lived in Mexico for the past decade, entered the plea to a charge of threatening and intimidating when he was arraigned before Somerton Justice of the Peace Manny Figueroa. Norris is out on a $1,004 bond that he posted.

Adam Sharrar, whom Norris allegedly threatened, attended the hearing along with three members of the Yuma Patriots and their legal representative, attorney John Minore.

The Yuma Patriots are a local group of about 40 volunteer civilian border-watchers. Their aim is to assist Border Patrol agents by calling them on radios or cell phones to report illegal immigrants crossing into the U.S. Sharrar said the group, which is unarmed, has made 19 successful patrols along the levee road near the border and hasn't ever had a serious incident occur.

Sharrar said he's still upset over the incident because his mother and a friend were involved in location scouting that day. Flash Sharrar, Adam's father, founded the group following the reported armed robbery of another of his sons, Matthew, on Easter Sunday in the Imperial Sand Dunes Recreation Area.

But Sharrar, who decided to take legal action against Norris, wasn't the only member of the group who sees the danger in what happened. "I've been shot before, so when someone threatens to shoot me, I take them at their word," said Yuma Patriot member Jack Choate.

According to court records, on June 18, Sharrar had been driving along the levee scouting the area, along with several other members of the Patriots, looking for a place for the group's next patrol. As he was coming off the levee onto 3rd Street in Gadsden, Norris allegedly approached his vehicle and asked him a question, court records indicated.

After that, Norris supposedly asked Sharrar what he was doing on the levee. When Sharrar told the man he was involved in surveillance efforts for the Yuma Patriots, Norris responded by asking him if he was part of the "racist and anti-immigration (expletive)" and threatened to shoot him in the head and anyone he associates with, according to court records. Sharrar said Norris drove by the entire group a short time later while they were parked outside the sheriff's substation on 4th Street and Highway 95 in Gadsden and pointed at them while honking his horn. "I'm not surprised at all by this," Minore said. "There is a lot of ignorance out there."

Norris, who denied he threatened Sharrar, could be sentenced to up to six months in jail, receive a $4,059 fine and as much as five years of probation if convicted of the misdemeanor charge. When asked by Figueroa if he had a mailing address of any kind in Arizona, Norris provided the number of a post office box in San Luis, Ariz., saying, "I haven't lived in this country in the past 10 years and don't ever intend to again."

In addition to setting a trial date of Sept. 6, Figueroa also appointed Norris, who receives approximately $3,300 a month in disability and social security, a public defender.

Norris, who said he a psychologist, also asked the judge to exonerate his bond, saying he needed the money to pay for naturalistic cancer therapy, but Figueroa declined the request saying he felt it would ensure Norris' continued attendance at any future proceeding. Figueroa also issued a court order that Norris not have any contact with Sharrar or any other member of the Yuma Patriots.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 07/23/2005 09:55 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [520 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Oh he hates the US, but he's happy to take our money - leftist leach.
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 07/23/2005 10:13 Comments || Top||

#2  I for one am still stunned by the success of the volunteer border watchers, I assumed it would be nutcake heaven.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 10:17 Comments || Top||

#3  Me too Shipman. I thought it would degenerate very quickly into nutsville on both sides. I am happy to see only the left has gone that route, while the patrollers have maintained a professional attitude about it. It really adds to their credibility.
Posted by: mmurray821 || 07/23/2005 11:19 Comments || Top||

#4  Yeah, I'm glad it didn't turn into a 90's militia movement thing. Those dudes were wakt.
Posted by: bigjim-ky || 07/23/2005 11:22 Comments || Top||

#5  I don't know why people are surprised at the success of the border watchers. During WWII we had beach watchers. People that were too old for active duty could volunteer to watch the beach for Nazis who might land by submarine. I think a lot of citizens would be interested to help out and get involved in the war on terrorism if it did not seem to be so exclusive.
Posted by: John Q. Citizen || 07/23/2005 11:55 Comments || Top||

#6  It's because they aren't "vigilantes" - they call in transgressors rather than arrest them, themselves. Smart move. Talk to the locals along the border and we're fed up. No more!
Posted by: Frank G || 07/23/2005 12:43 Comments || Top||

#7  Why would Norris want to help Mexicans invade North if he thinks that the US is a bad place to live? Is he trying to screw them over? Shouldn't he be counseling all Mexicans to continue to reside in their utopia?
Posted by: Super Hose || 07/23/2005 13:41 Comments || Top||

#8  "...he needed the money to pay for naturalistic cancer therapy."

"Damn dealers demand cash for their weed,won't let me get any on credit!"
Posted by: Stephen || 07/23/2005 18:34 Comments || Top||

Afghanistan/South Asia
Pakistani jihadi camps still active
As President Pervez Musharraf renews his crackdown on Muslim militant factions after this month's terrorist bombings in London, new evidence has emerged that Pakistan has continued to let such groups run military-style camps to train guerrilla fighters.
"Say, Chaudry? That's not an elephant in the living room, is it?"
"Why, bless me, I believe it might be!"
For years, the camps have been only half a secret.
I'd say maybe 27 percent a secret...
"Everybody has known they were there, but no one would officially admit it," said a Pakistani official who was interviewed recently and requested anonymity. "And they were kept hidden; no ordinary people could go there."
"Beat it! Yez can't go in! It's fer cannon fodder! An' it ain't here!"
Inconveniently for the government, the camps have gotten a bit more public in recent weeks, in Pakistan's press and a U.S. courtroom. (There has been no suggestion that the London bombers attended any such camp.)
They had to do with Muridke, the Vatican of terrorism...
While the Bush administration has politely portrayed Musharraf as an essential ally in its global war on terror, the training camps reflect how deeply that role has divided the government and its ruling elite. The camps are used by Pakistan-based militant groups such as Jaish-e-Muhammad (Army of Muhammad) and Lashkar-e-Taiba (Army of the Pure). For more than a decade, the Pakistan military's Inter-Services Intelligence Directorate has sponsored such groups to attack India in the conflict over the territory of Kashmir, much as it nurtured the Taliban movement to pursue Pakistani interests in Afghanistan, Western intelligence sources have said.
They've also, as will be written in dry as dust histories of the War on Terror fifty or sixty years from now, been supporting the Taliban while piously denying the fact, just as they've been maintaining the camps while piously denying the fact. Some of us have been watching the hands, not the lips...
While the government has aggressively hunted down Arab and other non-Pakistani militants identified with the al-Qaida movement, and while it formally banned Jaish and Lashkar in 2002, it has never dismantled either the Taliban or the Pakistan-based outfits. The local groups simply renamed themselves and have been spared destruction, even though some are suspected of involvement in assassination attempts against Musharraf and Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz.
They're currently going through the same old round-'em-up-lock-'em-up routine they've done a dozen times before in the past four years, and three months from now they'll all be back on the streets again. Qazi's not in jug, Fazl's not in jug, Sami's not in jug, Hamid Gul's walking the streets, Mirza Aslam Beg's consorting with big turbans, Sajid Mir's still quietly doing business at the same old stand, Masood Azhar's still free, Hafiz Saeed's still free and ranting, Binori Mosque is full, Agora Khattack is full, God's still in his Heaven and all God's chillun got curly-toed slippers. The guys being arrested are ignorant muscle who don't Know Someone™ and trashy street preachers disturbing the peace by hawking their wares through loudspeakers. They're decidedly not the guys holding meetings in back rooms with smooth-spoken emissaries from Riyadh and Jiddah.
Pakistani and foreign analysts say the Pakistani militant groups and their training camps have survived largely because the government crackdown so far has been half-hearted.
Maybe "faint-hearted" would be more accurate, though that's making the assumption Perv actually believes what he's preaching, which probably isn't the case. We're discussing Pakistan, where dissimulation is a way of life...
Many officers in the army, which is Pakistan's real ruling party, "don't want to eliminate these groups that have fought in Kashmir and Afghanistan, because they think they may want to use them again at some future time," said a foreign intelligence analyst who specializes in Pakistan.
I think we've mentioned that a time or two here, as well. It could even be us they're quoting, since they don't give a source...
The problem is, there is no clear separation between the Pakistani groups and the Taliban or al-Qaida. They are routinely seen to overlap, as when Jaish and al-Qaida militants were accused in the 2002 murder of U.S. journalist Daniel Pearl.
Along with muscle from Lashkar-e-Jhangvi. It's not little boxes on an organization chart; it's a spectrum that runs from Binny, comfortably ensconced in Sami's guest house, through the armed and dangerous set, to the "fiery" preacher on the street corner. The flow of resources is mostly toward Binny, the flow of planning and support goes down the ladder...
New evidence of the camps includes this month's cover story in Herald, a Karachi-based news magazine whose reporter toured a training camp hidden up a dirt track in the rugged, wooded hills of Mansehra, a district in north-central Pakistan. Militants carried automatic weapons and wore camouflage uniforms. A dormitory held 60 to 80 sleeping bags laid out on thin mattresses, and another building housed an unknown number of boys taking an "18-day ideological orientation and fitness and arms training."
"Fatimah, I think we should send little Mahmoud to summer camp this year."
"Oh, Ahmed! He's still a baby! How long will he be gone?"
"18 days."
The Herald article and the government official, who asked not to be named, said that since late 2001, when Musharraf signed on to the U.S.-led campaign against militants, the army has forced camps periodically to reduce their operations or move to more hidden locations. For two years, militant groups have had to shrink or conceal public activities, such as soliciting donations and running recruiting offices. An estimated 13 camps in Mansehra were forced to suspend training last year, the Herald reported, but were allowed to resume in April and May.
"Okay! Coast is clear, guys! You can come out now!"
"Aaaaar! Death to the infidels!"
A separate account of a camp emerged in a Sacramento, Calif., courtroom last month when the FBI filed an affidavit citing a young Pakistani arrested as he entered the United States. Hamid Hayat told FBI questioners "he attended a jihadist training camp in Pakistan for approximately six months in 2003-2004," the affidavit said. He faces a criminal charge of having lied to U.S. authorities by initially denying having been trained.
Like I say, dissumulation is a way of life.
Under questioning, he "described the camp as providing structured paramilitary training, including weapons training, explosives training, interior room tactics, hand to hand combat, and strenuous exercise," the affidavit said. Hayat said his camp was run by al-Qaida and trainees "were being trained on how to kill Americans," the affidavit said. Pakistan's interior minister, Aftab Ahmed Khan Sherpao, told the Herald its story was "totally baseless."
And at the risk of repeating myself yet a third time, it's a way of life...
But such blanket denials, repeated by Pakistani officials over the years, were looking a little more tattered after an admission by Yasin Malik, head of the Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front, a Pakistan-backed group.
They were "tattered" the second time they were used. By now, all that remains is the stitching around the button holes. Apparently the Paks haven't realized, and maybe still don't, that the entire world rolls its collective eyes every time they issue a statement. You can't walk ten feet in Pakland without stepping on somebody's lips...
Talking with reporters June 13, Malik praised Pakistani Information Minister Sheikh Rashid Ahmed, saying "few know of his contributions" to the Kashmiri insurgency against India. Malik glowingly explained that, in years past, he and more than 3,000 other men had been trained to fight at a vast farm Rashid owned near Islamabad. Rashid denied the statement, and the next day Malik said he had been "misquoted by the media."
I'm not gonna repeat myself a fourth time. You've got the idea by now...
But the news, once out of the closet, wouldn't go back in. A half-dozen high-ranking Pakistanis from the time - including Army chief Gen. Mirza Aslam Beg and interior minister Naseerullah Babar - matter-of-factly confirmed it. The new reports of the training camps "corroborate what we already have known for years" from interrogations of guerrillas captured in Kashmir, said B. Raman, a former counterterrorism chief at India's main intelligence agency. "The surprise is that they are now publishing it ... in the Pakistani press."
Six months from now they'll be denying it again.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 07/23/2005 02:16 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [941 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I've come to view Musharraf's primary value to the West is as a focal point for some measure of PakiWaki Islamonutz attention / hate / scheming / seething etc - a pressure release valve. On the surface, at least, little more than that. None of his "campaigns" to exert control over PakiWaki territory in support of our efforts in Afghanistan has been worthy of the press coverage, much less US favor. I expect that will never change for the better, either. Other than their nukes, the whole mess strikes me as the Perfect Storm of Factional Islamonutz Insanity.

Dan / Paul / Fred / whomever is interested and knows:
Who's actually in control of their nuke facilities, stock security, and launch control?

I've read that there are US personnel present at some chokepoint and that we have some means to veto use... Can someone illuminate this area a bit?
Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 3:06 Comments || Top||

#2  Far question, I suspect Blair has iassued his ultimatium to Prevez, hence the Prevez mind your own back yard comment to Blair.

Shit hits fan for Paki
Posted by: Captain America || 07/23/2005 3:35 Comments || Top||

#3  What ultimatum could Blair issue to Perv CA? I don't see what levers we have over him - unless we were to ship back a lot of Imams and their followers of course.
Posted by: Tony (UK) || 07/23/2005 8:00 Comments || Top||

#4  Here's yur lever..... purdy too.

HMS victorious
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 9:29 Comments || Top||

#5  Come to think of it HMS TwoByFour would be a fine name for the lead ship of the Lever Class, followed on every other year by BallPeenHammer, Crudgel, LeadPipe, BlackJack and Mace. Keeping R&D going full scale on the advanced ultra stealthy BrickBat Class.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 9:34 Comments || Top||

#6  What, no Truncheon?
Posted by: .com || 07/23/2005 9:41 Comments || Top||

#7  HMS FootballHooligan?
Posted by: Dave D. || 07/23/2005 9:49 Comments || Top||

#8  Truncheons are an obsolete class of Turkish large armoured cruisers.... :)

You can't walk ten feet in Pakland without stepping on somebody's lips... LOL!

Top 50 InLine Commentary.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 10:05 Comments || Top||

#9  Boyz, boes, boies, what lever? mind you. Border, what border? It's called hot pursuit into NW corner Waki land. Dominos fall on Prevz.
Posted by: Captain America || 07/23/2005 12:04 Comments || Top||

#10  That "border" is no longer legal and should be ignored by US troops. The Durand line was demarcated by the British in a 1893 treaty with the then Afghan ruler. That line set one of the borders of British India.

The Raj ended in 1947. The treaty itself expired in 1983 and Afghan governments have refused to renew it with Pakistan.

The areas where US troopers are itching to search are Pathan lands that belong to Afghanistan.

Time for CENTCOM to tell Perv where to shove his worthless army.

Posted by: john || 07/23/2005 13:52 Comments || Top||

#11  The Raj ended in 1947
In that case I call Spinnach.
Let the Worthies handle it.
Posted by: Shipman || 07/23/2005 18:28 Comments || Top||

Clerics condemn terrorism in Friday prayer sermons
LAHORE: Most of the Imams, during Friday sermons, condemned terrorism and declared Islam a religion of peace and tolerance. They did not make provocative speeches on current affairs.
That's "most of the turbans," not all of it. Wonder what they preached at Binori Mosque and Akora Khattack?
However, many people individually protested against the government’s crackdown on madrassas after the Friday prayers and declared the government’s policies unwise and anti-madrassa.
How many gunnies need to be pulled out of madrassas before the policies become wise? We're probably up to a few hundred in the past four years.
There was tight security during Friday prayers as police and other security agencies were deployed outside mosques. Some international media teams were present outside the mosques as well. However, the ban on loudspeakers during Friday prayers was not completely observed and religious literature including newspapers like Zarb-e-Islam, Daily Islam, booklets on jihad (by Maulana Masood Azhar and Mufti Nizamuddin Shamzi) were available outside some mosques.
Nobody was supposed to notice that, of course, or at least comment on the fact...
  • Masjid-e-Shuhda Imam Qazi Younas preached Toheed [Tawhid] (oneness of God) during his 45-minute sermon. He condemned the forces that were portraying Islam as a religion of hatred and terror.

  • Jamia Masjid-ul-Qadsia Imam Hafiz Saeed of Jamaatul Dawa said that terrorists and suicide bombers were totally unaware of Islam and its teachings. He said that jihad was a vital and inescapable part of Islam but added that the concept had been modified by certain religious elements. He condemned President Musharraf’s policies on madrassas and other religious matters and said that no religious organisation was involved in London blasts. He said that the president should protect the masses just like the Caliphs used to do.
    I just gagged on that one. That's gotta be another Hafiz Saeed, not the raving lunatic we've come to know and not really love. Either his lips immediately fell off and he turned to a pillar of salt or he didn't say that — it's completely out of character and at odds with what he's said in the past. And we know it's not Perv he had in mind for Caliph...
    Engineer Saleemullah Khan, while delivering a Friday sermon at Jamia Ghosia Yaki Gate, said that the West was blackmailing Pakistan in the name of terrorism and propagating against madrassas.
    That's more like it. Toss the blame westward and continue what you were doing...
    A disciple of Dr Sarfraz Naeemi delivered Friday sermon on “Tawakal” at Jamia Nomania and did not comment on current affairs.
    "I'm keepin' me mout' shut!"
    The speaker Maulana Tafseer Hussain Zehdi during a Friday sermon in the leading Shia Mosque and madarssa Jamtul Muntizar at Model Town addressed “Respect for parents”.
    His acolytes passed out warm milk to the congregation...
    The speaker at the Main Mosque of Punjab University New Campus mostly spoke about uncontroversial issues, some students told Daily Times. However, some pamphlets regarding debates and seminar on “Islam and Terrorism” were distributed after the Friday prayers. The speaker at Idra-e-Taleemat-e-Majdila, Jail Road, also condemned terrorism. He also defended Islam as a religion of peace and love.
    **Must... control... gag... reflex...**
  • Posted by: Fred || 07/23/2005 00:24 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [372 views] Top|| File under:

    #1  One of the problems with the maddrasses is that they're populated by orphans. Close them and what do you do with all the kids? BUT, that said, these "schools" are such an affront to human beings, being nothing more than brainwashing centers in exchange for food and shelter, it just makes my blood boil. The kids are prisoners of the system. They're forced to "dumb-down" to ape-hood so they don't starve. There is no true learning, no imagination, no playing, no dialogue, no questioning, no learning tools or supplies, no crayons, no books, no stories, no creativity, no constructivist approach--just the Koran. It's bascially child abuse. No wonder so many grow up to be horrors.
    Posted by: ex-lib || 07/23/2005 0:57 Comments || Top||

    #2  It's bascially child abuse.

    If you believe the stories, there is a lot of actual child abuse occuring in these seminaries, from both the Mullahs and the older students.
    Posted by: Paul Moloney || 07/23/2005 1:46 Comments || Top||

    #3  However, many people individually protested against the government’s crackdown on madrassas after the Friday prayers and declared the government’s policies unwise and anti-madrassa.

    How dare they question the boys use as bomb fodder!
    Posted by: BigEd || 07/23/2005 2:36 Comments || Top||

    #4  One of the problems with the maddrasses is that they're populated by orphans.

    Also the many spare sons of the the poor, and the sons of the ambitious but unmoneyed. I realize the formal education available in Pakistan is abysmal, but it is better than that available at the Madrassas. However, only the moneyed are afforded an opportunity to go to "proper" schools, so what are the rest of the Pakistanis to do?
    Posted by: trailing wife || 07/23/2005 6:10 Comments || Top||

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