Emmanuel Goldstein at Airstrip One takes a couple whacks at me for my comments to Asparagirl's post. (Hand me that ear, will you? I think it's mine...)
So it's just fellow feeling right? Not the fact that the Republican party has significant swathes run by fruit-and-nut postmillennial dispensationalists (fundamentalists to you and me) who see Israel as fulfilling Revelation. The Publicans do have the support of what we call here the "Religious Right." (Who else are they gonna support? The Dems make a point of opposing most issues dear to the socially conservative heart.) But the party's a coalition, not a monolithic organization, and the days of its dominance by our own version of the fundos is past. Don't get me wrong - they're there, they're still somewhat influential, but they're not in charge.
Now, the Religious Right is a good thing in general - and we Brits could do with a bit of moral rearmament ourselves - however their influence on American foreign policy is immense. Of course there are many who see the Religious Right as being massively influential on the Republican Party on issues like abortion or homosexuality, but these moral libertines also tend to be pro-Israel. So they would say that, wouldn't they. Yep. Would and do. But I think you're overestimating their influence on foreign policy.
But consider. Buchanan failed to pick up the evangelical vote that should have been his for the taking in 1992 and 1996. Was it (a) the fundis all read their Adam Smith and said "No Pat, we want free trade", (b) the fundis objected because Pat was a Papist (yet voted for the Roman Alan Keyes) or (c) because Pat wouldn't support Israel? The questions that he kept on receiving were on Israel, not Rome. Now where was the missing margin of victory. We have vastly differing interpretations on Buchanan, who's a paleoconservative, not a fundo. I - and I think quite of few other Publicans - regard Buchanan as a vanity campaigner, with more ego than base. Jumping the party in 2000 was a good thing not for Pat but for the party. (I think he misinterpreted that "Go, Pat, go" thing.) The party didn't have to indulge him anymore, and since his vote was in the 2 percent range they won't have to indulge him again. McCain greeted his departure with a simple "Good riddance," though Bush was more tactful. I don't think being a Papist had anything to do with it - I didn't even know he was one. Being an unpleasant fellow did, coupled with his antagonism to immigration. Immigrants tend to be not welfare recipients as he believes, but entrepeneurs, starting small businesses and prospering more often than they crash. That should make them a natural Publican constituency, which Buchanan as an ideologue turns his back on. Bush, inheriting his father's pragmatism and having better political skills, embraces them. Free trade is also an historical Publican position that Buchanan abandons, and with it large blocs of the party. So he basically shot himself in the mouth.
The Israel question kept the Republican status quo safe to lose against Clinton. The Religious Right are the constituency that keeps the Republicans from taking a moderate stance on Israel. After all what would you do if you were the congressman for Dumpsville and many of your more active supporters and donors got all worked up about levelling the Al-Aqsa mosque and building the third Temple? I don't think Americans really see the opening for a moderate stance on Israel, and believe me, they look for it. We see it as a conflict between Israel and Hamas/Islamic Jihad, with Yasser as an aider and abettor and behind the scenes oft-times driver. Prior to the arrival of Hamas/Jihad we had PFLP and DFLP as the aggressors, shooting up airliners and tossing old men in wheelchairs off cruise ships. It's not just the American religious right but the mainstream who're alienated from the Palestinian position, despite a continuing effort by a liberal press to "understand." We really do put them into the category of Evil.
Why you'd start saying things (roughly) like "Israel's capital should be Jerusalem" (Gingrich) and "The Palestinians have a homeland in Jordan" (I'm not sure who said this, but I thought it was Dukakis)? Hell, if I was concerned about re-election I'd mouth the same sort of platitudes. Truth to tell, I don't care where the capital is, though politicians make their money saying stupid things. Sometimes they even mean them. I think the original idea behind Jordan was as someplace to dump the Palestinians but I could be wrong. The issue that's of most concern to us keeps coming back to the continuing campaign of mindless violence. If that were to stop and the Palestinians were to begin negotiating in good faith - making agreements and keeping them - then American opinion would turn against Israel if they weren't doing the same. But we find the penchant for rioting at the drop of a hat, screaming "Death to [Fill in Name Here]," and continuous indignation repellant. We, the mainstream, also see it as something manufactured; Yasser is just as much a dictator as Saddam, with his own reasons (personal power) for keeping the rabble whipped up.
I wrote to someone in an e-mail once that the way for the Palestinians to drive a wedge between the US and Israel would be to make peace. Settle down, start some light industry, wave hello to the Jews across the fence now and then, and ignore them. Israel's internal politics have the potential to make it unpleasantly like Greece or Italy on a bad day. There are a lot of stiff necks there, a fair number of indigenous rabbinical goofs to play off against their leftist goofs, and enough people fond of the sound of their own voices to keep the country's internal tensions exacerbated.
So let's lay off the David and Goliath and small l Libertarian stuff. The reason why America supports Israel is that both parties support it, and one of them supports it because much of its grass roots believe that it will bring on the end of the world. I agree that both parties support it, I disagree that the "grass roots" you're thinking of is that powerful. To me, agnostic and cynical, it's the rioting and the bloodcurdling threats and the assassinations. And the lies. Lotsa lies. And bad faith. And posturing. And pretensions to tin-hat dictatorship...
Idealistic, yes. A sane basis for policy, well... Idealistic and principled. Come and join us.
Well said, sir. His protectionism wasn't a selling point, but his ethnocentrism that had border violations into racism and the America First, Second ... and Nteenth mindset were the ones that had me sitting out the 1992 primary.
That was the only time that I skipped a presidential primary/caucus as an adult-I was thinking about the joke on the curmudgeonly woman's voting habits: "I don't vote. It only encourages them."
The GOP breathed a sigh of relief when he took off.
I'm an atheist Republican myself. I support Israel against the Palestinians for a lot of different reasons. However, Biblical prophecy is not really high on my list of reasons for favoring Israel.
In fact, one of my more recent reasons for supporting Israel is the fact that the Israelis were mourning, not celebrating, on September 11th.
By the way, I have some friends who are Christian Republicans (the dreaded "Religious Right"). So I asked them about Ms. Goldstein's idea that they support Israel because it's existence portends the fufilling of Revelations.
They laughed their asses off and begged me for the link to her site, so they could show it to all their friends. Maybe there are some Christian Fundos who buy into the "Israel = Revelations: idea, but apparently it's not a universal opinion. Posted by Patrick Phillips 4/6/2002 1:15:35 PM
You call that criticism? I'd call it fairy tale ramblings mixed with a thimblefull of details to peg it to a current events context. Last I heard Gary Bauer lost the GOP primaries without a whimper, and Colin Powell is a high church Episcopalian. Goldstein is out to lunch on his analysis, as his logically circuitous last sentence shows. Posted by Tom Roberts 4/6/2002 4:56:55 PM
Goldstein's comments were the second where someone in the UK mentioned the "immense" influence the Religious Right has on the Republican party here. It's true that they are a factor, but the party's stand on abortion is more than an issue driven by the Religious Right. It's an issue that gets at the definition of "human rights", and some honest intellectual debates can be seen there.
It's also laughable that the Republican party, even in the Religious Right such as it exists, is influenced at all by apocoliptic prophesy. Christian "fundamentalists" who I know don't express those views. And it's not the kind of thing you would hear at a Rep. central committee meeting or presidential nominating committee statement. If it were, the press would have reported it ad nauseum. Posted by Craig Schamp [www.craigschamp.org/] 4/6/2002 7:19:40 PM
Frankly, the notion that American support for Israel is based on chiliastic delusions is just, well, daft. But I wouldn't be surprised to find that this a commonly held belief in the UK. Posted by Moira Breen [www.moirabreen.com] 4/6/2002 9:16:33 PM
I was going to post a comment on the Airstrip One site about the daftness of believing that the only reason most non-Jewish Americans support Israel is because most Americans are Christian Millenialist Fundamentalists who think Israel will bring about the end of the world... and then I read the next post, a thoroughly confused ramble about (I think) whether or not Isreal is a "Westernized" country or was it "Orientalizing" due to the increased numbers of Sephardic (non-European) Jews, and if the latter is the case then should he, Mr Goldstein, continue to hold Israel up to the "high standards" that he would a "Westernized" country. I can't deal with that kind of blinkered thinking, I'm sorry. I hold every country up to "high" standards, they don't get a pass if they are "Oriental." Now if you'll excuse me, I'm late for my Republican Apocalyptic group's weekly book-burning, Rapture-vigil. Posted by Andrea Harris [www.spleenville.com/] 4/6/2002 11:44:07 PM
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[6 views]
Top|| File under:
Kesher Talk points to some fairly routine (for her) blather by Madeleine Albright.
"[S]he's a little surprised that Powell is leaving next week and not sooner. She said she presumes that he has been talking to the leaders by phone but that there's nothing like face-to-face interaction." Either Madeleine is going to look like a goof when this has played out, or I am, and VodkaPundit is, PejmanPundit is, and Sullivan is, and Junkyard Blog is, and Mark Byron...
Oh, Cheeze... Susan Estrich is on FoxNews and she agrees with us. I might have to rethink this position... Posted by Fred 4/6/2002 2:40:06 PM
Two things about Estrich, and they are related. First, she's not stupid, and she's Jewish. She knows that she'd be wearing the Judensterne in any PA successor state to Israel. Albright thinks that she's a born again Episcopalian, at least enough to fool herself into thinking that the thugs around Arafat would forget her racial guilt for how all Palestinians are victims of the Jews. Posted by Tom Roberts 4/6/2002 4:42:48 PM
FoxNews reports Sharon called Bush in response to his press conference today and said he snap it up. Little slip there... Posted by Fred 4/6/2002 5:57:19 PM
Agreed that Estrich is smart enough to realize she's Jewish. She still sounds like Carol Channing. I keep expecting her to remake "Hello, Dolly." Posted by Anonymous 4/6/2002 7:41:51 PM
Estrich could be a Methodist and to the Islamofascists she would still be "Jewish." Jewish, Christian, it's all the same to them, we're all infidels. Posted by Anonymous 4/7/2002 12:26:50 AM
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[1 views]
Top|| File under:
Taliban and al-Qaida supporters in Afghanistan are offering rewards of up to $100,000 for capturing or killing Westerners, U.S. Army officials said Friday. Pamphlets slipped under people's doors during the night promise $50,000 for any Westerner delivered dead, and double that for people taken alive, said Maj. Iris Hurd, an officer with the Army's Information Operations division. The pamphlets, known in Afghanistan as "night letters," also threaten Afghans with violence if they support the coalition troops or the interim administration of Hamid Karzai, Hurd said.
Oh yeah, right. And where does the Murderous Entrepreneur go to collect his reward? That info's not on the night letter. Can't be to a bank -- there aren't any in Afghanistan. And how does the ME prove he's killed an American? Drag his corpse around for days like the headless calf in Afghanistan's national sport until he finds the rewarder? A body part you say? "Bring in an American ear, they're distinctive!" I suppose the tattooed are targets of choice.
Posted by Anonymous 4/7/2002 12:28:43 PM
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
North Korean leader Kim Jong-il has expressed his intention to resume dialogue with the United States and to revive stalled inter-Korean rapprochement, South Korea's special presidential envoy Lim Dong-won said on Saturday. It's like watching a day-to-day tennis match...
I think that there is something up with Kim Jong Il. Sex, drugs, or rock-n-roll. My guess is all three to excess. Posted by Tom Roberts 4/6/2002 4:59:02 PM
When the dictator dictates and he's contradicted the next day, that implies he's not as in charge as he thinks he is. The question is, how to turn him from Leonard Brezhnev into Egon Krenz? Posted by Fred 4/6/2002 6:18:52 PM
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
A top Osama bin Laden lieutenant remained composed and defiant when he was taken into U.S. custody last week despite three gunshot wounds, the medical staff who treated him said Saturday. Abu Zubaydah, possibly the third-ranking figure in bin Laden's al-Qaida terrorist network, was shot in the stomach and leg during a joint U.S.-Pakistani raid March 28 on a hide-out in the southern city of Faisalabad, doctors said by telephone on condition of anonymity. Rushed to the city's state-run Allied Hospital for treatment, Abu Zubaydah remained "composed and confident," according to one of the doctors who treated him. His main concern was who took care of him, staff said. "He said: 'I should not be touched by Americans,'" a nurse said. Not yet, you haven't been. Give it time, Abu...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
About 4,000 militants in Pakistan and Pak-occupied Kashmir are waiting for the snow to melt on the mountain passes along the Line of Control to cross over to Kashmir for stepping up violence during the coming assembly elections. Conservative estimates put the number of such militants between 3,000 to 4,000, Inspector General of Police, Kashmir, K Rajendra, told reporters. The gunnies are after soft targets, killing political workers, especially of ruling National Conference, to create fear among the people so as to keep them away from the electoral process, he said. Good thing Perv cracked down on terror networks.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
The Islamic militant group Hamas confirmed six of its members, including Qais Idwan, head of its military wing in nearby Jenin, were killed when the house they were in was bombarded by Israeli tanks and helicopter gunships. "Our retaliation will be very harsh and cruel according to the measure of the crime," Sheikh Jamal Abu al-Heija, a Hamas political official in Jenin, told Reuters. Wotta surprise.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
In Nablus, Nasser Awais, leader of the Al Aqsa Martyrs' Brigade, was killed when explosives strapped to his body went off prematurely, said a militia spokesman, Abu Mujahed. The Al Aqsa militia is linked to Arafat's Fatah movement. Ain't life, er, death a bitch?
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
Fighting spread Saturday through the alleys of densely populated West Bank refugee camps, where Palestinian militants reportedly were handing out explosives-packed belts to residents willing to strap them on and challenge Israeli soldiers. Israeli forces continued to surround Balata refugee camp in Nablus, and at a camp in Jenin, another northern West Bank city, residents said Israeli helicopter gunships targeting anything that moved were keeping people inside.
Outside the siege area, Palestinian militants also attacked a heavily fortified Israeli settlement in the Gaza Strip early Saturday with guns and grenades, according to Israeli army officials. An Israeli soldier was killed and four were injured, they said. Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility and said two of its militants were killed.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
IDF Armor force stationed at the Askar camp near Nablus identified a group of snuffies laying explosive devices on the road leading towards the camp. The force fired tank shells at their direction. Consequently, four snuffies were killed and ten injured. Another IDF force stationed near the Jenin refugee camp spotted a boomer carrying an explosive belt. The force fired at the sucker, detonating the explosives. All the parts of him they could find were dead.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
Hamas, Islamic Jihad and Tanzim terrorists are inside the church.
An ultimatum was not given to the church personnel
In no way did we fire at the church
Concerning explosions - there was a building housing armed Palestinians near the church. IDF forces blew in the door of the building and not that of the church. Essentially, IDF forces did not detonate anything in the church.
IDF forces communicated with both the Palestinian political echelon and the heads of the terrorist infrastructures, in order to attempt to get the people out. They were offered medical assistance, medicines, doctors and food, but they refused.
In terms of the IDF, we would like to get the people out unharmed and we have patience. We have no desire to damage the church or any other holy institution in the city.
The IDF secured the release of four clergymen from the Church of the Nativity in Bethlehem. The IDF transported the four, at their request, to Jerusalem, where they arrived safe and sound. It was clear from their testimony that the Church of the Nativity in Bethlehem has been forcibly seized by a group of armed terrorists who have taken hostages, among them members of the clergy, inside the church building.
According to a reliable source, those occupying the church complex include various PA officials, such as Governor Muhamad Al-Maadani, Abdallah Daud, Head of the General Intelligence Service, and Majdi Al-Matri, Commander of the Preventive Security Service. In addition to them, some of the "most wanted" of Palestinians terror suspects have also taken refuge in the church. IDF views these circumstances as a hostage scenario. With the possible exception of Zimbabwe, this might be the only "government" in the world where they take hostages...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
The following was captured in two sites in the city of Nablus:
Uncovered in the Governor's Residence were 9 armed wanted terrorists, 3 Kalashnikov assault rifles, 6 pistols, 1 shotgun, 1 telescopic rifle and large amounts of ammunition. Those detained were turned over to security forces for interrogation. They'd just popped in to borrow a cup of hummus...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
In another building, in the apartment adjacent to that belonging to Faris Al-Amani, Commander of the Palestinian "Blue" ("Civilian") Police, a large explosives lab, 10 kg. of explosives, detonators for bombs, vests fitted with explosives, paraphernalia for the preparation of explosive charges, costume wigs, and gas masks were found.
The apartment in question was summarily demolished that evening by IDF troops. If this wasn't so serious it'd be a thigh-slapper.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[6 views]
Top|| File under:
The top Palestinian negotiator said on Saturday Palestinian officials would not meet Secretary of State Colin Powell during his visit next week if he refused to meet Palestinian President Yasser Arafat. "If Powell chooses not to meet Arafat, he will not meet any Palestinian official," senior Palestinian negotiator Saeb Erekat told Reuters, adding Arafat was the elected representative of the Palestinian people.
White House spokesman Ari Fleischer told reporters on Friday Powell had no plans "at this moment" to meet Arafat. Powell said there were no plans at present but that did not mean there would no such plans "in due course." Erekat said he was responding to "trial balloons" concerning Powell's visit, which he said he hoped would not be used, and said he hoped Israel would have withdrawn its forces from the West Bank by the time Powell arrived. "I hope that by the time Powell gets here, we will not have the Israeli forces in our towns and we will not have the closures," he said. It's kinda like a bum being offered a free meal and turning it down because the wine's domestic.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
Jamal Abu al-Haija, a local Hamas leader, said a Palestinian woman, Ilham Dosuki, blew herself up early Saturday when soldiers approached the door to her home in the camp, also killing or injuring some of the soldiers. The Israeli military didn't immediately comment on the report about Dosuki blowing herself up.
Palestinians said that in Nablus a 22-year-old identified as Jamil Arboudi blew himself up among a group of Israeli soldiers, killing or injuring four. The Israeli army denied such an attack took place.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[3 views]
Top|| File under:
Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat threatened to commit suicide in front of Israeli soldiers who came face to face with him, German weekly magazine Focus, due out Monday, says. The magazine quotes an Israeli soldier who said he was part of a group of soliders surrounding Arafat's West Bank headquarters in Ramallah who found themselves by mistake facing Arafat. He said Arafat pointed a gun to his head and threatened to pull the trigger if the soldiers approached any further. And they backed off? Makes me doubt the truth of the story. Would have settled a lot, right there - and no Israeli would have pulled the trigger.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
Two wanted members of the Palestinian militant group the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP) were captured by Israeli security forces on Saturday in east Jerusalem. Mahmud Ahmed Uda had been accused of taking part in the October assassination of Israeli tourism minister Rehavam Zeevi, while Israel accused Shadi Mahmud Ahmed Shurfa of several car bombings inside Jerusalem. The two men were arrested by Israeli security in an Arab neighborhood in east Jerusalem several days after they fled from the West Bank town of Ramallah when Israeli tanks rolled in on March 29. Both had been arrested by the Palestinian Authority shortly after the Israeli minister's assassination, but claimed that they were released within days. Bet they aren't sprung anytime soon this time.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[3 views]
Top|| File under:
FoxNews reports shelling at Yasser's compound in Ramallah, with four of the Chairman-for-Life's bodyguards wounded. The Israelis say the shelling was in response to fire from the compound. The PA says that rounds fell within the room Yasser was, but that he's safe.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
Israeli attack helicopters and soldiers traded round-the-clock fire Saturday with Palestinian gunmen for a third straight day in Nablus and Jenin. But the soldiers were again unable to take full control of the two cities as they faced the toughest resistance yet in their West Bank offensive. With the gunmen firing from apartments and homes in narrow streets and alleyways, the Israeli troops have taken only parts of the two cities and have not entered the nearby refugee camps, which are strongholds for the militants. One Palestinian fighter said bombs and weapons were being passed out to residents to defend the camps.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
Tens of thousands of activists marched through Paris and Rome on Saturday calling for Israel to stop its offensive in the West Bank and expressing solidarity with the Palestinians. More than 20,000 people marched in the French capital to the Place de la Bastille, where hundreds of police stood by. Some protesters carried shredded American flags and shouted slogans against Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon. I won't forget. How about you?
Posted by: Fred Pruitt ||
04/06/2002 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[5 views]
Top|| File under:
A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.
Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing
the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.
Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence
over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has
dominated Mexico for six years.
Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No
trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
