Riyadh - Saudi security forces have arrested 92 men after they stormed a party and found them wearing make-up and wigs and dancing in women's clothes, an Internet newspaper reported on Sunday.
Hummmm, maybe those guys they catch wearing burkas aren't really trying to hide.
Al-Wifaq said some of the men at the ``deviants' party'', a phrase usually used to refer to homosexuals, were drunk and had taken drugs. Saudi forces raided the party in the Qatif district in eastern Saudi Arabia at 1am on Friday morning, according to the website. Most of the men detained were from the conservative Muslim kingdom but others were from Qatar, Kuwait, Bahrain, Lebanon and Syria.
When I think of a place to hold a gay transvestite dance, Saudi is the last place that comes to mind.
Officials were not immediately available to comment on the report.
Busy trying to find a way to blame this on the Joooos.
Last month human rights group Amnesty International launched an urgent appeal on behalf of 35 people it said were at risk of being flogged after attending what Saudi newspapers had described as a gay wedding. Amnesty International said the men were sentenced to between six months and two years in jail, and from 200 and 2,000 lashes each.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/23/2005 14:28 ||
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#1
Looks like it's up to Kevin Bacon to teach the Saudis how to dance - and love - again.
#2
It starts out innocently enough with the man dresses, funny hats and eyeliner. But before they know it, they are in full body makeup, dressing like Boy George, dancing to David Bowie hits. Such are the subtle ways of Shaitan.
Posted by: ed ||
05/23/2005 15:07 Comments ||
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#3
ROFL!
---- Beverage Alert! ----
Oh baby, you guys owe me a half bottle of Windex each, shit! *applause*
"When I think of a place to hold a gay transvestite dance, Saudi is the last place that comes to mind."
Steve, lol, I worry about belaboring the point, which I once made rather often back in the old days on RB, but Arabia is the current Home of Gay. Greece may have given them a run for their money back upon a time, but there's no comparison, today.
It's very simple, actually. I'll speak to the situation in Saudi, since I know first-hand what the "game" entails. Obviously, there are two parts...
You're a young woman. You are a marketable commodity. Dowries are just like real estate prices - they fluctuate but, on the long-term scale, just keep on rising. Daddy will sell arrange for you to marry. The considerations will be influence and wealth. Period. If your family is already near the top of the pile that is the society under the House of Saud, you might be able to soften Daddy's heart a little to keep him from peddling you to an utter brute or Wahhabist. Maybe. I worked in an area at Aramco that dealt with the Dept's that actually had Saudi wymyns. To get on-board, the wymyns had to come from such influential families. I came to know one of them as well as circumstances permitted - I pushed it once by speaking to her outside the building (read: in public, gasp!), causing her brother to throw quite a fit - a sort of Big Brother and Answer Man for things Western. Her father was the extreme of tolerance and she told me about the whole game, including the other extreme and what fell between. She knew she was one of the luckiest femalians alive in SaudiLand.
You're a young man. You family's wasta, dat be raw influence and connections, will determine what your future holds. If you are very fortunate, you will be able to attend a university, such as KFUPM (King Fahd University of Petroleum and Mining in Dhahran) and, if you graduate - we'll leave the curriculum of Wahhabism vs Engineering aside for the moment, and if you are sufficiently awash in wasta, you might be offered a job at Aramco. That's a helluva chain of ifs 'n buts, folks. You are the creme de la creme (read; Lucky MoFo) of Saudi non-Royal society. Your marriage prospects are thusly described... Your family will want the best mix of alliance and price they can find. Men getting married seldom move up (in wasta) by marriage, it is lateral or neutral on average. A chance to marry up would likely have a price tag beyond the family's and young man's means unless the young man is tapped (there are a few "sponsor" types around) for great things due to natural abilities - I knew one such guy at Aramco, so it can happen. But for the average creme de la creme Aramcon Saudi, price is the dominant issue. It's a trade off - your time as a bachelor to accumulate wealth and status + whatever the family's wealth and wasta brings to the table vs. the brides on the market. No, you prolly won't see her face until the deal is made - and even then perhaps not. Better be on good terms with your Mother - she's the only one likely to know if your bride is a dump truck or a Maserati before negotiations get serious, heh. On average, and yes this is real, you will not be able, despite your Aramco job, et al, to afford marriage before you're around 30. Got that? This is about the best of the lot for non-Royals.
It get progressively worse, as you would expect, the further below this creme de la creme thingy you go...
Okay, back to the Lucky MoFo at Aramco -- now do the math about male virility, hormones, and age. Most young Saudis have, as outlets, homosexuality, hard work to improve their lot financially, religious fervor, or suicide (overlap with the fervor thingy here) as options.
Sort of makes much of what we see and hear about Islam, particularly as practiced in Saudi, a little bit clearer and a little (a lot?) more boggling, no? And hell, let's face it, I've uber-simplified and sugar-coated the reality. Not to put too fine a point on it, it's fucking insane.
On a final note, a personal one, in my early days there I happened to tell a Saudi "friend" about a certain birthday of mine, when I took Marilyn and Carolyn, The Titty Twins, an "open minded" pair (or quartet, if you will), to the drive in. A very good time was had by me, I assure thee. I can't recall how many times he had me repeat this story, for him alone and for the benefit of others who he knew and dragged over when he saw me, but it was often - more than 10 for certain. I like to think, in some small way, I did my part to promote freedom, if only to describe what it was like to almost suffocate under the weight of sweater meat, heh. I told him a couple of other stories, but that was his favorite. Prolly had something to do with the multiple wives thingy.
Okay. I'm done. Won't repeat all this for another year or so, I promise, heh.
#4
Sounds like a society tailor-made to generate large numbers of frustrated, crazy, angry, repressed males who get enraged at the thought of liberal Westerners having all the fun.
Posted by: Dave D. ||
05/23/2005 17:48 Comments ||
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#5
Not that it's being done on purpose, or anything.
#7
I want to hear more about the Titty Twins. Details, please, including a blow-by-blow account of the evening.
Posted by: Dave D. ||
05/23/2005 18:15 Comments ||
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#8
Ptah - You aren't thinking about naming names, are ya? Not me, bro. I'm not the Black Helicopter Conspiracy Freak, I just prefer not getting more than the 400 spam emails per day I get now - and opening myself to the asshats I sometimes decide to have fun with hereabouts, heh. So I hope the posts, though anecdotal, are good enough, lol! Seek out an expat non-idiotarian Aramcon for confirmation and much, much, more.
#9
Dave - do you want the 35 yrs later recollection, in all its glorious lurid wonderful detail -- or the truthful glorious lurid wonderful detail? ;-)
It was My Wildest Dreams, Realized, lol! I consider just getting them to double-up one of my greatest achievements in life. They were in serious competition with each other, you see, and I turned that seeming show-stopper on its head as the coup de grace argument... me being the "judge", of course. Another coup idea that sold it was pointing out how different they were, whoa - Big JuJu to twins, my man! Each was a "winner" - in a different "category", of course - making me a friend for life and leading to a few repeat performances when the circumstances were right, heh. My reputation soared, lol! I took some small measure of pride in having reconciled them to being friends, again, in fact. Made me feel I was ready for the ITT Truckdriving and International Diplomacy course, doncha know... Sigh, the things we do for freaky circus-style no limits sex peace and harmony in the world. High School. Sigh. Prolly the most insane thing I've ever experienced - including SaudiLand.
#10
I dated twins in high school. At the time, thought I was only dating one of them; years later, found out they'd been taking turns. Bummer. It would've been so much more interesting if I'd known...
Posted by: Dave D. ||
05/23/2005 18:48 Comments ||
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#11
Oh - that's terrible! And a far more common example of identical twins' behavior - Marilyn and Carolyn were not identical twins - which was a key, I'm sure. Just think: just smidgen of healthy competition, instead of conspiracy, and voila! Win-Win-Win! Lol!
#12
Mr. Wife's hatred for all things Saudi is only less than yours, .com, by the amount of time he spent there. He was involved in several production start-ups at one of his company's plants over there, as the product development engineer. Each start-up, as all you engineers know, takes about 6 months, with the PD engineer wandering in and out taking samples for testing, optimizing the process, and so forth. Mr. Wife did fly back to the States at intervals, just to reconnect with reality. You can imagine, especially after some of .com's more lurid tales, how much he hated the place; no man was ever more grateful to be able to use his wife's religion as justification for turning down a transfer opportunity.
Anyway, Mr. Wife, in explaining to me why he never went into Saudi coffee houses, explained that only the man on the receiving end is deemed homosexual over there. The other guy is just doing what men need to do (I suppose when no goats are available, or something --ick). What a messed up society!
#16
There is also the possibility that, having reduced women to chattels,the men are desperate for some real companionship. There are some interesting similarities between the scene .com describes and Demosthenes as quoted and expanded upon by Will Durant: "We have wives to bear us legitimate children, concubines for daily health of our bodies, and prostitutes for variety." Men were legally required to marry by age 30 but put it off as long as possible, then married a girl of about 16 who had never been allowed out of the house, except for the occasional religious festival. So they had no real relationships with women except for their mothers and sisters; and even there, mothers and sisters were deemed inferior to the males in the tribe. Guaranteed screwed up personal lives.
#17
Okay, some quick visuals... Bahrain was a popular venue - make a run over the causeway which connects it to Saudi. You have to pass thru the borders, with all the attendant immigration and customs hassle, but, on average, it would take no more than 45-90 minutes for the whole thing. Then, once in Bahrain. you'd encounter Saudis everywhere, malls, restaurants, hotel bars, etc.
One of the funniest moments I ever had over there was in 92 at the Starlight Lounge - basement of the Gulf Hotel. There was this really stupid musical group - 2 men playing organ and synthesizer, black lights, and these 3 young wymyns wearing white gloves. The lights went out and they did this silly-assed routine with the white gloves glowing - nothing else could be seen. The Saudis loved it. Totally apeshit hooting and hollering. Not sure why, lol!
Then the lights same back up a little and there were Saudis running up the aisles toward the bathrooms, throwing up en route. We had been warned not to sit on the aisle bu old hands as some didn't make it to the john before those sweet Singapore Slings and such suddenly decided to reappear. Target vomiting was what we called it. I was astounded to hear Bobcat Goldthwaite use the same term several years later in a comedy routine.
There are more stories, but watching the Saudi dance was something else. Standing, arms extended toward the ceiling, swaying and sorta chanting along with the music - the whole "nightlife" scene in Bahrain was surreal. The only wymyn you'd see in the bars were pros - and they gravitated to the expats (Duh, wonder why?) and mainly during the day. At night, well, everything was pretty much already set for the night.
There were the usual "special" hotels that were known for companionship. One of the best was only about 4 blocks from the Grand Moskkk in Manama. Over time, the femalians changed from mainly Syrian and Egyptian to Eastern Europeans, Russians, mainly. All those blonds were, of course, a popular commodity.
I can say no more! Lol! Surreal is how I remember it.
On topic (maybe that'll save me, heh) in the same hotel, The Gulf, I encountered both hetero and homo situations. The bldg isn't square - it has jogs in the hallway which are tricked out with a couch or chairs, lamp table, potted plants, etc. Little "nooks". Well, rounding one of these jogs I came across one guy down on his knees with his head buried in another guy's lap. That'll put you off breakfast.
Is that what you had in mind, or something less Arab, perhaps? Lol, sorry - but it is rampant there and most expat guys try to avoid the places where it's in your face.
Try Googling up details on a BBC documentary, "Death of a Princess". If there's anything online... The Saudis were apoplectic about it and dire threats were issued to the BBC and UK Govt to stop it from being aired. As far as I know, it did air once, but everything was then locked away somewhere. I was told about ti - did not see it - and thus can't verify I have it right... It's supposedly about a Saudi Royal Princess who was part, just one of many young Royals, in a sort of sex party thing. They'd traipse off into the desert and have no-shit orgies. I don't recall exactly, but there were maybe 20 in the "club". Anyway, they were cautioned to stop, but didn't. Somehow this Princess was singled out, probably with her father's agreement or complicity - Saudi fathers can do some pretty strange shit regards their daughters. She was "tried" by the Wahhabis, found guilty, sentenced to death, and beheaded. I have the image, somewhere showing it. I haven't seen it since I last changed PC's, but everything was backed up, so I've got it somewhere. Anyway, they are, indeed, incredibly repressed - and some just throw caution to the wind when they get a taste, I guess. She obviously thought she was immune. I recall she was directly related, too, and that was part of why she was made an example of. Pretty fucked up, huh?
An official speaking for the Shoura Council said the issue of women driving in the Kingdom would not be discussed in the council. The official told Al-Riyadh newspaper that what had been said in the media and on the Internet about the Shoura discussing the topic was "untrue." He went on to say, "The council has no intentions of raising this topic for discussion despite what has been said in the press."
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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#1
More uppity wymyns! Is there no end to this insulting Western interference? Next thing you know, they'll be saying that wymyns are equal to myns! Schway, schway, doods!
You should see the diamond-studded collar I bought from Neiman's for my 4th wife, the new 12 yr old I picked up at auction. Very cool. What? No, it's a real collar - the picture in the catalog showed a poodle, but I could see immediately how cute she would be in it. Yes, she barks, why?
...[T]he testimony of George Galloway before the US Senate has gone missing. According to VUNet:
The website for the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Government Affairs has removed testimony from UK MP George Galloway from its website. All other witness testimonies for the hearings on the Oil for Food scandal are available on the Committee's website in PDF form. But Galloway's testimony is the only document not on the site... Press representatives for the Committee had no comment. The Senate Committee website itself has these terse entries, here reproduced verbatim which does not say that the testimony has been removed but that "Mr Galloway did not submit a statement"...
The declaration that "Mr Galloway did not submit a statement" is curious given the fact that he spoke for 47 minutes before the Senate, a performance which Christopher Hitchens, no admirer of Galloway, believed was a rhetorical "humiliation" of the Senate... To account for the discrepancy between the factual existence of Galloway's testimony and its nonappearance in the Senate website raises the possibility that Mr. Galloway's oral testimony is considered distinct from a written statement by the Senate rules or it has been expunged from the record because it puts the Senators in a bad light. But there is a third possibility.
...Galloway had come to score press and public relations points at which, by all accounts, he was successful at doing. But Senator[s] Coleman and Levin seemed totally uninterested in responding to Galloway's sharp political jibes. It was almost as if the Senators were deaf to his political posturing. Instead, they focused exclusively and repeatedly on two things: Galloway's relationship with Fawaz Zureikat and Tariq Aziz. Zureikat was a board member of Galloway's Mariam foundation who is also implicated in the Oil For Food deals. Tariq Aziz was Saddam's vice president...
Continued on Page 49
#2
I think Galloway is a small fry in this story. I think that the Senators knew the answers to the questions before they were even asked. I think the disconnest between what Galloway said and the 'facts" don't converge.
I don't attribute the removal of his spoken testimony as anything big or important.
CARACAS, Venezuela - Venezuela is interested in beginning talks with Iran on the possibility of developing nuclear power as an alternative power source in this oil-rich nation, President Hugo Chavez said. "We must start working on the nuclear (energy) issue," Chavez, speaking during his weekly radio and television program "Hello President," said on Sunday. "If we had the technical capacity and the resources right now, we would participate in this effort because it's one of the paths toward diversifying energy sources," Chavez added, without indicating whether he had broached the subject with Iranian officials.
"That oil will run out someday so we need nuclear weapons, er, power plants!"
Chavez, an ally of Iranian President Mohammad Khatami, has defended the Iran's right to develop a nuclear energy program for peaceful purposes despite opposition from Washington, which fears that Teheran may be secretly working developing a nuclear weapons program. Iranian officials have repeatedly denied that claim, arguing that the country's nuclear program is geared toward generating electricity.
Chavez and Khatami - both critics of Washington's foreign policy - have argued that wealthy nations like the United States cannot keep today's energy-related technologies for themselves while developing countries struggle to produce enough energy to satisfy domestic needs. The Venezuelan leader has said that every country in the world has a right to develop nuclear energy. He has held up Brazil's nuclear energy program, which as also come under US criticism, as an example for Third World nations.
In November, Brazil bowed to diplomatic pressure to allow some International Atomic Energy Agency inspections of its uranium-enrichment plant, which would serve Brazil's nuclear power stations. Brazil's reluctance to open up its facilities to full inspections raised worries that other countries being asked to provide full access to their nuclear programs could also follow suit.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/23/2005 12:05:56 PM ||
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The most prominent development in U.S.-Venezuelan relations these days involves the case of Luis Posada Carriles and whether he should be extradited from the United States to Venezuela. There he would stand trial for a third time for his alleged involvement in the 1976 bombing of a Cuban airliner. Meanwhile, a story with the potential to be much more important is being ignored: The growing power and global ambitions of Venezuela's President Hugo Chavez.
To the minute number of people who understand the threat Chavez poses to the United States, his recent hosting in Caracas of Iranian President Mohammad Khatami was disturbing enough. But a high-ranking official for a Latin American government has disclosed to me details about that visit that should send shock waves throughout our government. During a private meeting between Chavez and Khatami, I was told, Chavez made it known to the Iranian leader that he would like to "introduce nuclear elements into Venezuela." My contact said "nuclear elements" meant "nuclear weapons."
Chavez read his tea leaves and saw if you have nukes, the US won't invade. Of course, he missed the part about the Cuban missile crisis and how we react to nukes next door. I imagine his buddy Castro told him how they would have won that one if the russians hadn't blinked.
It will be easy for many to dismiss such talk as false or the fantasies of a madman, but that would be a critical mistake. I have no doubt that Chavez is mentally disturbed, and I also have no doubt that his hatred of the United States and President Bush in particular is dictating his erratic behavior. High oil prices have made Chavez an antagonist to be reckoned with, and we ignore such a menace at our peril.
Standing side by side with Khatami in Caracas, Chavez said, "Iran has every right to develop atomic energy and to continue research in that area. ... Faced with the threat of the U.S. government against our brother people in Iran, count on us for all our support."
After receiving the report that Chavez might be trying to acquire nuclear technology or weapons from Iran, I met with a high-ranking U.S. official to voice my concerns and ask what he thought about such speculation. He answered me point blank: "It would not surprise me. Chavez is dangerous, underestimated and capable of almost anything. We are hearing a number of curious and disturbing reports. He is actively working to recruit terrorist nations and developing countries into his campaign of hatred against the United States."
Toward that end, Chavez recently went on al-Jazeera television to call for Arab and developing nations to unite against the United States and President Bush. Terrorists use this network as a tool against U.S. and coalition forces in Iraq, and Chavez told its viewers, "We have already invaded the United States, but with our oil."
Coupled with the disturbing news that Chavez might be trying to acquire nuclear weapons is the fact that Chavez, a dictator in all but formal title, just concluded a deal with the People's Republic of China to launch a telecommunications satellite for him. So great is Chavez' interest in rockets, space and missiles that the government of Venezuela has created a special commission to advise him on such issues. Chavez with a nuclear weapon is bad enough. Chavez with a medium-range ballistic missile just minutes from the southern United States is a disaster waiting to happen.
Iran would be happy to trade Venezuela a few missiles, no skin off their teeth if Venezuela got wacked for it. What's a few infidels anyway?
I told the senior U.S. official that I thought Chavez posed a greater threat to our national security than Osama bin Laden or any terrorist operating out of the Middle East. He looked at me and said, "You know, I agree with you 100 percent."
So, while Cuban dictator Fidel Castro tries to manipulate world opinion by calling Posada "the most famous and cruel terrorist of the Western Hemisphere" (I was not aware that Castro had relinquished his crown), Chavez, Castro's puppet and a man who thinks he is channeling South American hero Simon Bolivar, may soon have his finger on the trigger of a nuclear weapon. At what point do our nation and the world take this threat seriously? MacKinnon was press secretary to former Sen. Bob Dole. He is also a former White House and Pentagon official, is married to a Venezuelan and has been to the country a number of times.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/23/2005 9:09:24 AM ||
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#1
Chavez made it known to the Iranian leader that he would like to "introduce nuclear elements into Venezuela." My contact said "nuclear elements" meant "nuclear weapons."
So, what does Jimmy Carter have to say about this development?
#2
This is beyond the usual Latin nuisance stage. We've got an anschluss between Castro and Chavez, and a leftist pinhead on the brink of taking power in Mexico. Plus a Honduran state crippled by narco-terrorist regime elements.
Trouble on the southern front. Time for Condi and Bush to turn their attention to our backyard.
The first one is the Soldier (second from right) because he has a MG, heavy machine gun. Then is the stupid Soldier on the left. He is a very easy target (look how he is elevated from the ground), then the Soldier or the reporter carrying the camera. First, because the camera can be used as binoculars; second, it is the most difficult thing to hide the death of a reporter in Iraq.
Posted by: ed ||
05/23/2005 15:45 ||
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The deployment of 36,000 National Guard troops or state militia on the U.S.-Mexico border would stop the illegal flow of foreigners into America, says a congressional report that credits the Minuteman Project with proving that additional manpower could "dramatically reduce if not virtually eliminate" illegal immigration. The 33-page report, written by investigators for the Congressional Immigration Reform Caucus, said the Minutemen -- who shut down a 23-mile stretch of the Arizona border last month -- served as a model for a government effort to reclaim the southern border of the United States. "The tide of illegal crossings on the borders of the United States is beyond unsatisfactory; it is catastrophic. It does not ebb and flow -- it only grows. It is rising without measure and eroding the very fiber of our safety, life and culture," the report said. "As we wage the war on terror in foreign lands, we have all our doors and windows open at home. ... The insanity of such a policy, or silent toleration of such a policy is almost criminal in itself," it said. "The Minuteman Project demonstrated that illegal immigration on America's southern border can be dramatically reduced to manageable levels."
The report, to be released today, also said the U.S. Border Patrol failed "through no fault of its rank-and-file enforcement officers" to protect the United States from an influx of illegals. It said the agency's uniformed leadership should be pointed in a "new direction" as it is in "total denial of the magnitude of the disaster" and -- as currently organized, staffed and supported -- "cannot be relied upon" to remedy the situation soon. "The Border Patrol needs new direction from the Department of Homeland Security if it is to shake off the lethargy from years of undermanned frustration," the report said. "The patrol needs to empower its outstanding field officers to act as necessary to accomplish the patrol's mission ... to energize its leadership to think outside the box."
The report said Congress and the states could sustain the success of the Minuteman Project -- whose members were lightly armed, had no arrest powers, were not paid and traveled to Arizona at their own expense -- with the deployment of National Guard troops or state militia working in coordination with the Border Patrol. The report said that sufficient reinforcements exist in current National Guard units and could be put on the border by governors and the secretary of defense within one month, if the political will exists. As an alternative to using existing powers and forces, the report said, a $2.5 billion annual initiative coordinated through the states for the issuance of Homeland Security grants could authorize and fund state militia, or state defense forces, to assist the Border Patrol. State militia units already exist in 22 states, including Maryland and Virginia. Militia units also are located in the border states of California, New Mexico and Texas.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Steve ||
05/23/2005 10:37:22 AM ||
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#1
"The deployment of 36,000 National Guard troops or state militia on the U.S.-Mexico border would stop the illegal flow of foreigners into America, says a congressional report that credits the Minuteman Project with proving that additional manpower could "dramatically reduce if not virtually eliminate" illegal immigration. The 33-page report, written by investigators for the Congressional Immigration Reform Caucus, said the Minutemen -- who shut down a 23-mile stretch of the Arizona border last month -- served as a model for a government effort to reclaim the southern border of the United States."
Finally some common sense.....lets hope for once that congress addresses this issue with some common sense.
#2
36,000 NG troops aren't needed. A hight fence and a few hundred snipers will be cheaper and more effective. If you can't protect your borders, then you are not a nation. You're Belgium.
Posted by: ed ||
05/23/2005 12:19 Comments ||
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#3
I agree Ed. Build a 100 foot wall above and below the border. Stretch it from Cali to Tex. Put signs on it, (in espanol of course) - enter at your own risk, tresspassers violating the sovereignty of the U.S. will be shot. That's what needs to be done a side from N.G. troops. Unfortunately no one in our congress or admin has the ballz to do either.
#6
hmmm - imagine that! Illegal immigration CAN be addressed... go figure
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/23/2005 16:20 Comments ||
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#7
PSHAW! 36,000! Hah! Look at the border. Where are the existing crossings? There are only a tiny handful, because the rest of the border is nasty, and sometimes horrific desert on both sides, with no towns, no roads, nothing. Nowhere to go from and nowhere to go to. Nobody is going to cross there. On top of it, the military doesn't have to do the job themselves. The Border Patrol will still be there, at the main crossing routes. All the Army has to do is man the marginal crossing routes. Maybe a few hundred a day could *possibly* cross the harshest places of the entire border. But a few hundred illegals is manageable, compared to 5,000 to 10,000 a day or more right now.
An Attempt at Damage Control by Evan Thomas and Michael Isikoff NewsweekMay 30 issue - What really happened at Guantanamo? Last week, amid the heat of the controversy over NEWSWEEK's retracted story, new details about the issue of alleged mistreatment of the Qur'an emerged.
"Maybe we better go back and have another look..."
The International Committee of the Red Thingy Cross announced that it had provided the Pentagon with confidential reports about U.S. personnel disrespecting or mishandling Qur'ans at Gitmo in 2002 and 2003. Simon Schorno, an ICRC spokesman, said the Red Cross had provided "several" instances that it believed were "credible." The ICRC report included three specific allegations of offensive treatment of the Qur'an by guards. Defense Department spokesman Lawrence Di Rita would not comment on these allegations except to say that the Gitmo commanders routinely followed up ICRC reports, including these, and could not substantiate them. He then gave what is from the Defense Department point of view more context and important new information.
So the ICRC got its info from the prisoners, who're not the most honest fellows in the world, passed it on to the military, who did what I'd guess were routine investigations. He said, she said, and nothing came of it. That leaves us, and Newsweak, with the choice of believing the Bad Guyz or the military.
It is clear that in 2002, military investigators became frustrated by the unresponsiveness of some high-profile terror suspects, including one who had close contact with the 9/11 hijackers. At the time, fears of another attack from Al Qaeda were running high, and the Pentagon was determined to make the terror suspects talk. The interrogators asked for, and received, Pentagon permission to use tactics like isolation and sleep deprivation. Less clear, however, is what happened to more run-of-the-mill detainees among the 800 or so housed at Guantanamo at the time.
Less clear, however, is what the concern with them is at this point. Sounds to me like they're saying "We don't know, but we suspect the worst..."
According to Di Rita, when the first prisons were built for suspected terrorists at Guantanamo in early 2002, prison guards were instructed to respect the detainees' religious rituals. The prisoners were given Qur'ans, which they hung from the walls of their cells in cotton surgical masks provided by the prison.
That's pretty much standard procedure. Had I been in charge and had I had the remotest chance of getting away with it, there wouldn't have been a Koran within 90 miles of the place.
Log entries by the guards indicate that in about a dozen cases, the detainees themselves somehow damaged their Qur'ans. In one case a prisoner allegedly ripped up a Qur'an; in another a prisoner tore the cover off his Qur'an. In three cases, detainees tried to stuff pages from their Qur'ans down their toilets, according to the Defense Department's account of what is in the guards' reports.
Publish their names. Since they defiled the holy book, obviously they must be killed.
(NEWSWEEK was not permitted to see the log items.)
Thereby implying they don't really exist.
The log entries do not indicate why the detainees might have done this, said Di Rita, and prison commanders concluded that certain hard-core prisoners would try to agitate the other detainees by alleging disrespect for Muslim articles of faith.
No reason the log items should indicate the why of it all. They're maintained as a record of what happened, not why or how somebody felt about it.
In light of the controversy, one of these incidents bears special notice. Last week, NEWSWEEK interviewed Command Sgt. John VanNatta, who served as the prison's warden from October 2002 to the fall of 2003. VanNatta recounted that in 2002, the inmates suddenly started yelling that the guards had thrown a Qur'an on or near an Asian-style squat toilet. The guards found an inmate who admitted that he had dropped his Qur'an near his toilet. According to VanNatta, the inmate then was taken cell to cell to explain this to other detainees to quell the unrest.
The detainees were just about as willing to believe him as Qazi and Fazl and Sami are to believe Newsweak's retraction of the story. We believe what we want to believe, and we often discard evidence against anything we want to believe. That's just human nature, before the taqiyya's added in...
But the incident could partly account for the multiple allegations among detainees, including one by a released British detainee in a lawsuit that claims that guards flushed Qur'ans down toilets.
Holmes! How do you do it?
In fewer than a dozen log entries from the 31,000 documents reviewed so far, said Di Rita, there is a mention of detainees' complaining that guards or interrogators mishandled their Qur'ans. In one case, a female guard allegedly knocked a Qur'an from its pouch onto the detainee's bed.
Oh, horrors! Onto his bed? Where he wets every night?
In another alleged case, said Di Rita, detainees became upset after two MPs, looking for contraband, felt the pouch containing a prisoner's Qur'an.
"Yeah! They felt up my Koran! It wuz disgustin'!"
While questioning a detainee, an interrogator allegedly put a Qur'an on top of a TV set, took it off when the detainee complained, then put it back on.
"'Don't put it on the teevee set?' Y'mean, like this?"
"He did it again, Mahmoud!"
"These infidels are a merciless lot, Ahmed!"
In another alleged instance, guards somehow sprayed water on a detainee's Qur'an.
"Yeah! We wuz just havin' a little riot, an' the firehose got my holy book all soggy!"
This handful of alleged cases came out of thousands of daily interactions between guards and prisoners, said Di Rita. None has been substantiated yet, he said.
I'd start with the case of the Koran on the teevee. See if it's still warm. Of course, I'm surprised it didn't erupt in flames when Desperate Housewives came on.
In December 2002, a guard inadvertently knocked a Qur'an from its pouch onto the floor of a detainee's cell, Di Rita said. A number of detainees protested.
"He did it on purpose! We know he did! We seen him!"
That January, partly in response to the incident and partly to provide precise guidelines for new guards and interrogators, the Guantanamo commanders issued precise rules to respect the "cultural dignity of the Koran thereby reducing the friction over the searching of the Korans." Only chaplains or Muslim interpreters were allowed to inspect detainees' Qur'ans. "Two hands will be used at all times when handling Korans in a manner signaling respect and reverence," the rules state. "Ensure that the Koran is not placed in offensive areas such as the floor, near the toilet or sink, near the feet, or dirty/wet areas..."
Like I say, no closer than 90 miles. That'll address the problem.
Di Rita said that the Pentagon may look further into the reports found in the logs. The Pentagon is not ruling out the possibility of finding credible reports of Qur'an desecration. But so far, said Di Rita, it has not found any.
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 09:28 ||
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Koran stuffing...For a alternative location.....check out the pic.
Posted by: Sir Crapper ||
05/23/2005 11:17 Comments ||
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They got TVs and the ingrates are still complaining? Do they also have satellite and do they get reruns of My Three Terrs or Three's Company (Saudi Style)?
Posted by: ed ||
05/23/2005 11:46 Comments ||
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They got TVs and the ingrates are still complaining?
At Gitmo all they'd get is AFRTS. They'll need to stand in line behind the GI's to get to the complaint box.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/23/2005 16:23 Comments ||
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Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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Of course they did. Now you can only go as far as the babysitter for the daughter of the 2nd cousin of your best friend's dentist. Rumors originating more than 27 links away must be typed and clearly legible, though 7th generation copies in Southern Swahili are still acceptable. This new directive will be rigorously enforced by Blind Edwardina, our "4 boxer". Black, blind, female, and handicapped. She made room in the headcount formula for the entire Editorial Staff Management to hire their mistresses and gigolos. Win-win. We are an Equal Opportunity Moonbat Rag.
...According to a Defense Department source citing internal Pentagon documents, the ICRC team leader told U.S. authorities at Camp Bucca: "You people are no better than and no different than the Nazi concentration camp guards." She was upset about not being granted immediate access shortly after a prison riot, when U.S. commanders may have been thinking of her own safety, among other considerations.
A second, senior Defense Department source we asked about the episode confirmed that the quote above is accurate. And a third, very well-placed American source we contacted separately told us that some kind of reference was made by the Red Cross representative "to either Nazis or the Third Reich"--which understandably offended the American soldiers present.
snip
Which brings us back to the "Nazi" reference by that ICRC official at Camp Bucca. We wouldn't normally report the remarks, however offensive, of a single official. But after we started asking about the incident, we began to hear from other sources that someone was attempting damage control by alerting the ICRC's friends in the media and State Department about what we might report. One media proponent of the "torture" allegation against the U.S. warned on the Internet that we were out to smear the ICRC (which, we should add, is not the same as the American Red Cross).
No. We are trying to understand how a representative of an organization pledged to neutrality and the honest investigation of detainee practices could compare American soldiers to the Nazi SS. And considering the timing and content of several ICRC confidentiality breaches concerning the U.S. war on terror, it's fair to ask if similar views aren't held by a substantial number in the organization.
The world needs a truly neutral humanitarian body of the sort the ICRC is supposed to be. But the Camp Bucca incident--in addition to the leaked Gitmo and Abu Ghraib reports--is evidence it isn't currently up to the task.
Posted by: Mrs. Davis ||
05/23/2005 08:52 ||
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At least they've become aware that there are those who don't approve of such language. Previously, they wouldn't have bothered to go to damage control mode. A very slight improvement to be sure. But then, the IRCR did not protest the Nazi concentration camps at the time, so I don't see what they are fussing about now.
#2
Nazi in the 21st Century does not mean Nazi of the 1920-1945 fame. Its the linguistic substitute for ni**er which carries with it the same indication of the intelligence and civilization of the individual uttering it.
US condemns UN inaction in true abuse cases (in Afghanistan, Sudan, Somalia, ZimBOBwe, Iraq, Saudi, China, Syria, N. Korea, Iran and on and on and on).
Posted by: BA ||
05/23/2005 8:41 Comments ||
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Bangkok Post - Students at a private Islamic school in Pattani that was recently raided by soldiers confessed that Islamic teachers, or ustazes, had provided weapons training and also taught them how to make explosives.
cuz there ain't nothing more islamic than blowing stuff up
However, all four students, who were held in military custody following last week's raid on Jihad Witthaya school in Pattaya, denied any involvement. ``Some students confessed that ustazes served as weapons instructers. They taught students how to fire guns and make bombs. But the four students insisted they were not involved, saying they only knew about those activities,'' said Col Chatuporn Kalampasut, commander of the 22nd Task Force.
"No, no, we didn't have anything to do with them. We was, er, down at the malt shop."
On May 19, troops from the 22nd Task Force raided Jihad Witthaya school at Ban Taloh Kapo village in Pattani's Yaring district. During searches of 15 students' living quarters, the task force found several CDs showing al-Qaeda terrorist-style weapons training and documents inciting people to fight for an independent state. The documents were written in Arabic, with the cover of the documents showing pictures of the Krue Se mosque and the two-century-old Phya Tani cannon.
They also found a weapons training site behind the school with empty cans that had been used as targets. Bullet holes were found in coconut trees in the area. The school's owner, Dulloh Waemano, 55, fled before the raid.
"Curly toed sandles, don't fail me now!"
The four students held in a military custody for interrogation were identified as Arduenan Jae-arsae, Wae-arfit Kaetong, Suelan Damae and Abdulloh Kajae.
Sources said the students told the military that ustazes had told them to prepare for a major attack. But the students said they did not know the location of the attack or when it would take place.
Translations of some of the Arabic-written documents detailed al-Qaeda-style weapons training and bomb-making. ``There has been no evidence about a link between al-Qaeda terrorists and this school and its students. [But] the school has used al-Qaeda-style weapons training as guidelines in its training,'' said Col Chatuporn.
Hello! Clue Alert! Anyone?
Meanwhile, vandals went on the rampage in several districts of Yala province yesterday, burning national flags and attacking public and private property. In Muang district alone, at least 18 spots were vandalised or defaced. Some were painted with the message ``Independence for Pattani''. Around 6.30am, a road-side shelter in tambon Lidol was slightly damaged in an arson attack. Half an hour later, villagers spotted a suspicious-looking package at an empty gas station in tambon Tha Sap.
Security forces, using a M-16 rifle, fired 20 rounds at the box which gave off white smoke. A high-pressure water gun was directed at the package to blow it apart. It was found to contain a gas cylinder and a clock but no traces of gunpowder. National flags were set alight and the remains found at the entrance to Ban Krong Pinang school. A bridge was spraypainted with the message ``We want our land back''.
In Narathiwat's Rangae district, a former soldier was shot and killed when answering the door to his house yesterday morning. Asira Ahwae, his wife, said that two men had shouted for her husband, Supachai Honsaengdee. He was shot as he opened the door.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/23/2005 14:10 ||
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Blowing sh*t up was the sixth pillar of Islam, before they, er, blew it up.
JAKARTA: Hardline Indonesian Muslims at a rally by thousands on Sunday vowed to wage war against America and said those who desecrate the Quran should be killed. "Destroy America and its allies! Kill those who desecrate Islam!" Muhammad Iqbal alias Abu Jibril, from the Indonesian Mujahedin Council (MMI), exhorted thousands of protestors through a public address system outside the US embassy. Muslims around the world have demonstrated in recent days against alleged abuse of the Muslim holy book at the US detention facility in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.
This article starring:
ABU JIBRIL
Indonesian Mujahedin Council
MUHAMAD IQBAL
Indonesian Mujahedin Council
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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Wotta load. Seethe du jour. Of course they do.
While the Western Moonbats dither about what's fair and reasonable to do about Indonesian Muzzies who blow up people at nightclubs and hotels.
"Destroy America..." Shouldn't we be thinking reciprocally about murderers and scumbags? I mean, hell, we wouldn't want them to feel slighted or anything.
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 7:45 Comments ||
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#4
Most of these people don't even know what is written it that book they are getting all upset about. To them it is just another "holy relic" for them to worship. If the words in it were what truly mattered then the paper it is made of wouldn't mean anything.
#5
If they were truly serious about waging war on us, why didn't they storm the embassy? I mean, surely "thousands" of protestors could take on a handful of Marines guarding the place couldn't they? Or have they actually paid attention to what happens when you cross us (e.g. Fallujah)?
Posted by: BA ||
05/23/2005 8:43 Comments ||
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Distribute Chocolate Korans to the hungry idiots..
(eating a Koran will definitely be a sin.)
Print Koran's with invisible ink on their .... then have a tell all on TV where a "mullah" shows that spraying lemon juice on the toilet paper shows the hidden text. So they are all damn'ed! Damned!
Posted by: Deacon Blues ||
05/23/2005 12:32 Comments ||
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Only REAL men where the shambie pants in the caliphate. Sweatpants will suffice but you must bring your sharpest kitchen tool. Remember to show up deranged, or not at all Brothers.
#11
3dc - what makes you think these savages clowns use toilet paper?
Or even know what it is?
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut ||
05/23/2005 13:02 Comments ||
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#12
How come these dudes never show their faces? Afraid to be recognized for what they stand for I guess. OTH, if I was running around in public wearing my mother's night gown I wouldn't want anyone to see my face either.
#13
Isn't this the same sh!thole country that we visited last December to put back together because of some sort of big wave? The ignorant a55holes wanted us out then, but only after we got the lights back on. Maybe we need a new island for a Navy bombing range since we gave up Puerto Rico several years ago.....
Blame the protesters, not the country. For example,
Muslim protesters today called for the bombing of New York in a demonstration outside the US embassy in London. There were threats of "another 9/11" from militants angry at reports of the desecration of the Koran by US troops in Iraq.
See Flames of hate (20 May 2005). That ugly protest outside our embassy in London doesn't mean we should bomb London. IMO, those who support the U.S. in Indonesia far out number those who are against us. Who, though, do you think the LLL MSM will focus on?
A senior Iranian official said yesterday that crisis talks this week with Britain, France and Germany are likely to be the last chance for the two sides to reach a deal on the Islamic republic's nuclear program. Speaking in Brussels, British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw acknowledged the talks were set to be "tough" but nevertheless said he was optimistic.
"Nothing special would happen" if the talks failed, national security official Ali Agha Mohammadi told the student news agency ISNA, adding that Iran would simply continue the "natural process" of pressing on with controversial nuclear fuel work. "We would reach the conclusion that we haven't got along with them," said the spokesman for Iran's Supreme National Security Council.
Iran may view this as being "nothing special", but a breakdown in the talks and a resumption of nuclear fuel work — the focus of suspicions that Iran is seeking to develop the atomic bomb — could see the country referred to the UN Security Council. Emergency talks between Iranian nuclear negotiator Hassan Rohani and the three European foreign ministers — Straw of Britain, Michel Barnier of France and Joschka Fischer of Germany — are due to take place in Geneva tomorrow, the day after an "experts" level meeting in Brussels.
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 20:47 ||
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So this is it. Iran has issued the warning... that this is Europe's last chance?
Posted by: Phil Fraering ||
05/23/2005 23:18 Comments ||
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"George W. Bush has unleashed a tsunami on this region," a shrewd Kuwaiti merchant who knows the way of his world said to me. The man had no patience with the standard refrain that Arab reform had to come from within, that a foreign power cannot alter the age-old ways of the Arabs. "Everything here--the borders of these states, the oil explorations that remade the life of this world, the political outcomes that favored the elites now in the saddle--came from the outside. This moment of possibility for the Arabs is no exception." A Jordanian of deep political experience at the highest reaches of Arab political life had no doubt as to why history suddenly broke in Lebanon, and could conceivably change in Syria itself before long.
*snip*
To venture into the Arab world, as I did recently over four weeks in Qatar, Kuwait, Jordan and Iraq, is to travel into Bush Country. I was to encounter people from practically all Arab lands, to listen in on a great debate about the possibility of freedom and liberty. I met Lebanese giddy with the Cedar Revolution that liberated their country from the Syrian prison that had seemed an unalterable curse. They were under no illusions about the change that had come their way. They knew that this new history was the gift of an American president who had put the Syrian rulers on notice. The speed with which Syria quit Lebanon was astonishing, a race to the border to forestall an American strike that the regime could not discount. I met Syrians in the know who admitted that the fear of American power, and the example of American forces flushing Saddam Hussein out of his spider hole, now drive Syrian policy. They hang on George Bush's words in Damascus, I was told: the rulers wondering if Iraq was a crystal ball in which they could glimpse their future.
*snip*
As I made my way on this Arab journey, I picked up a meditation that Massimo d'Azeglio, a Piedmontese aristocrat who embraced that "springtime" in Europe, offered about his time, which speaks so directly to this Arab time: "The gift of liberty is like that of a horse, handsome, strong, and high-spirited. In some it arouses a wish to ride; in many others, on the contrary, it increases the desire to walk." It would be fair to say that there are many Arabs today keen to walk--frightened as they are by the prospect of the Islamists coming to power and curtailing personal liberties, snuffing out freedoms gained at such great effort and pain. But more Arabs, I hazard to guess, now have the wish to ride. It is a powerful temptation that George W. Bush has brought to their doorstep.
From your pen to [insert diety of your choice]'s eyes and heart, Mr. Ajami.
Read the whole thing at the link.
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut ||
05/23/2005 11:41 ||
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In syria the Josh Landis has an article on a discussion they had on whether it would be better to have regime change now or wait five years.
Its remarkable that such a conversation should happen (and Josh tends to be somewhat pro Assad).
#4
Ajami's a treasure. Interesting to compare a real scholar like him, who's traveled frequently and extensively in the region during the last three years and who has deep expertise in modern Arab politics, with a clown like Juanito Cole, who hasn't even been to Iraq, has no expertise in the modern Arab world and can't even speak arabic.
#5
Amusing note: I wonder what the tally would be if you counted "old Europe" as blue States, and all the countries indebted to the Bushes and Reagan as red States.
A London-based Arabic daily reported Monday Syria's ruling Baath Party leaders are expected to introduce major changes when they meet next month. The London-based al-Hayat, distributed in most Arab capitals, said from a report in Damascus Syria's regional Baath Party conference was set to bring "big changes in its leadership" that would strip a large number of the "old guard" from their positions.
Sniff, sniff, I smell a purge
The Saudi-financed paper said next month's conference of Syria's ruling party was expected to witness "candid discussions" on Syria's foreign policy, especially regarding Iraq and Lebanon. It added party members would review the country's domestic, foreign, economic and structural political reports "that will end with recommendations expected to leave a large effect on political life in the next few years." The paper said these recommendations will be adopted only if the Baath remains the ruling party and the National Progressive Front remains the political coalition for registered parties.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/23/2005 11:12:36 AM ||
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These birds obviously need to be scared, and yet not a single member of the guardian council has been assassinated, nor has there been any noteworthy attempts on the life of the supreme asshole. This has got to change. They need a shot in the chops to wake up from their arrogance.
Leaders of major Damascus-based Palestinian factions held a rare public meeting to follow up on a truce with Israel reached earlier this year and on the situation in the occupied Palestinian territories. The meeting came as Prime Minister Ariel Sharon reaffirmed his demand that Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas rein in militants before peacemaking can resume.
In Damascus, Hamas political leader Khaled Mashaal - making his first public appearance in the Syrian capital since the government closed down offices of Palestinian groups in 2003 - said that the leaders discussed ways of boosting Palestinian national unity. During the three-hour "consultative" meeting, the leaders also followed up on the March "Cairo Declaration," in which Palestinian factions committed themselves to a period of pacification with Israel, Mashaal said. Sharon and Abbas declared an end to violence at a February 8 summit in Sharm el-Sheikh, Egypt. In March, Hamas and other Palestinian groups agreed to a temporary and conditional cease-fire during a meeting in Cairo with Abbas. On Saturday, Hamas threatened to walk away from the truce because of a dispute with Fatah over municipal elections in the Gaza Strip. In a sign of concern about the situation, Egyptian officials, who helped broker the "cooling-down" period, are due in Gaza on Monday for talks with Palestinian factions to shore up the truce.
President of the Democratic Gathering and Chouf MP Walid Jumblatt said the creation of an armed Palestinian brigade attached to the Lebanese Army Command would resolve the issue of the refugee camps' disarmament. Jumblatt also reiterated his support for the implementation of the Taif Accord in order to establish a modern nation that fulfills the interests of the majority of its citizens. He further said the international probe into the assassination of former Prime Minister Rafik Hariri should not include other internal issues.
During an interview with the Abu Dhabi television channel Saturday, Jumblatt said the upcoming parliamentary elections do not meet the expectations of the Lebanese but represent the country's transitional period. "We are witnessing a transitional period in the wake of the assassination of (former Prime Minister) Rafik Hariri," he said. Jumblatt also denied the existence of American or French interference in the country's elections and said he had forged alliances with his former enemies in order to establish true accord.
Jumblatt proposed the formation of a Palestinian brigade attached to the Lebanese Army as a solution to the dispute over the disarmament of Lebanon's 12 Palestinian refugee camps. This brigade, which would act much like the armed Palestinian brigades in Jordan and Syria, would disarm the camps under orders from Lebanese Army command. Jumblatt also believes the Palestinian brigade might lead to a solution to the raging controversy over Hizbullah's weapons. He said: "I think the creation of an armed Palestinian brigade attached to the Lebanese Army would represent the best solution for the Palestinians' arms in the refugee camps."
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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Ah, Warlord Wally reverting to form. Just like the good old days, eh, Wally?
Yeah, an armed brigade of Hezbollah freaks, that's the ticket! No, they'll be no threat. Nope, nope. Liberty and freedom here we come!
#3
This is a smart move and there is a long tradition of turning irregulars into military formations in order to bring them under government control. Otherwise Jumblatt is a genocidal war criminal and if ethnic cleansing was the cause du jour in the 80s, he would be in some Euro-slammer.
BEIRUT: Anti-Syrian Christian opposition leader Michel Aoun said on Sunday he would run in Lebanon's parliamentary election despite difficulties in forging an electoral alliance with Muslim opposition leaders. The fiery retired general said talks on linking up with Druze leader Walid Jumblatt and Saad al-Hariri, a Sunni Muslim, had produced no agreement on a joint ticket for the polls.
He said time was running out for a deal between the three men, the most prominent figures in the disparate opposition that helped end Syria's 29-year military presence in Lebanon. The Feb 14 assassination of Hariri's father, former Prime Minister Rafik al-Hariri, triggered a wave of peaceful street protests in Lebanon and intense international pressure that forced Damascus to withdraw its forces last month.
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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Behind the increasing number of Israeli Arabs:
This past Sunday the government approved a change in immigration regulations governing the conferral of Israeli citizenship on Palestinians from Judea, Samaria and Gaza. From 1993-2003, some 130,000 Palestinians received Israeli citizenship by marrying Israeli Arab citizens. In 2003, after a number of these new citizens were actively involved in terrorism against Israel, the Knesset approved the government's temporary ban on all "family reunification."
Under the new regulation adopted on Sunday, Palestinian men over the age of 35 and Palestinian women over the age of 25 who marry Israeli citizens can again apply for Israeli citizenship and receive residency rights in Israel.
In so acting, the government paid no attention to the views of respected leftist Zionist legal scholars Profs. Amnon Rubinstein and Ruth Gavison. In an interview with Haaretz Rubinstein argues, "no country allows into its territory people who have attachments to the side that is fighting against the country during an armed confrontation." Rubinstein recommends that in any permanent immigration law, Israel should restrict the entry of nationals from enemy states into Israel.
Continued on Page 49
#2
One of those well-intentioned experiments. In future they should allow the new spouse to be removed to the far side of the Wall with his/her in-laws.
#3
it is true that some of the new arab Israelis (NAIs) have aided terrorism; what is not noticed however is that a lot of the NAIs have turned out to have good connections on the West bank and these connections were used in counterterrorism; also some of the NAIs actually became counterterrorism agents themselves (mostly the Christian Arabs).
Moderators: Please delete if you think this advert for Robert Spencer's new book is inappropriate.
The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam (and the Crusades) (Regnery Publishing) by Jihad Watch director Robert Spencer is now available for pre-ordering at Amazon.com.
Amazon has it listed as coming out on September 25, but I am told that it will actually be available on August 8. At least as things stand now. The cover says:
You think you know about Islam and the Crusades. But did you know:
⢠The Crusades were defensive conflicts
⢠Muslim persecution of Christians has continued for 13 centuries -- and still goes on
⢠Islam teaches that Muslim must wage war to impose Islamic law on non-Muslim states
⢠American Muslim groups are engaged in a huge cover-up of Islamic doctrine and history
⢠Today's jihad terrorists have the same motives and goals as the foes of the Crusaders
⢠Muslims are killing non-Muslims for their beliefs -- in Western countries, today
What's with the little pig at the top? Politically Incorrect Guide. Get it? This book is the second in a projected large series of Politically Incorrect Guides, of which the pig is the mascot.
Posted by: ed ||
05/23/2005 15:27 ||
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The Crusades were defensive conflicts
IMO this statement is incorrect in regards to the First Crusade. I have read several books on this, and though religious ferver and doctrine as well as "geopolitical" considerations were a significant basis for it, to a great extent the First Crusade was driven by plain old out and out adventurism and even greed on the part of the nobles and political interests involved.
Posted by: DO ||
05/23/2005 16:29 Comments ||
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Bush's thinking is shaped by India's democratic values in contrast with China's authoritarianism. Its strategic essence is the US view that India as a second Asian giant, capitalist, multicultural and democratic, will exert a gravitational pull that must limit China's aspiration as a future hegemon and help to balance its rise. This is a new long-run US position (and it doesn't assume that India can overtake China).
It should test how far India's elite has transcended the Nehruian diplomatic legacy. It seems, however, that Singh will accept the US overtures and India will negotiate to get the best deals possible. By saying yes to the US, India is hardly selling its soul. It is not being asked to become an ally similar to Japan or Australia since that would be impossible anyway.
India thinks it can manage this US embrace on its own terms. It knows that China and the world will have to take India more seriously and India will have to give China assurances it is not joining any US "containment of China" strategy. All this is already under way.
Singh's media aide Sanjaya Baru says: "India is an ancient civilisation and has a mind of its own on each issue. But our views are moving in parallel with the US and Anglo-Saxon world." Baru sees a new realism in India's policy that dates from the 1991 economic reform era with growth now running at 6 per cent to 7 per cent each year.
Ironic that Phwance is making nice with authoritarian free-rider China. Or maybe not so ironic after all.
NEW DELHI — Pakistani armed forces may be given a contract for the security of the 760-km stretch of the Iran-India gas pipeline transiting through Pakistan for an annual fee of $100 million.
Wouldn't that normally be their job?
The fee would be in addition to the transit fee Islamabad would earn for allowing the $4.16 billion pipeline to pass through its territory. At the meeting of the Task Force on Iran-Pakistan-India gas pipeline in Teheran on May 2-4, the Iranian side proposed that "the entire security of the pipeline be handed over to the Pakistan armed forces for a fee of $100 million per year," a senior government official said.
Hummm, trying to rent the entire Pak Army, are we?
Indian Petroleum Minister Mani Shankar Aiyar is likely to take up the transit issues like route of the pipeline, transit fee and security of the line when he visits Islamabad next month.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/23/2005 11:29:22 AM ||
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I understand there's a new Hez Brigade that may be available from Lebanon. Will the Paki's fight Bugti's? Linear petro transport hate is strong, very strong amost the Bugti.
That they're both still stealing oxygen from the rest of us. :-(
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut ||
05/23/2005 12:05 Comments ||
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Thank the Lord we didn't have to see HER in underpants...
Posted by: M. Murcek ||
05/23/2005 12:55 Comments ||
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#3
Why should the idiot be given any underwear to wear? They should make him wear them on his head like a diaper!! They should castrate him***
Stretch him~~~~ hurt him as he did to so many other's. No violin plays for him in my heart!
Andrea Jackson
Posted by: fruit of the loom ||
05/23/2005 13:39 Comments ||
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#4
Thank the Lord we didn't have to see HER in underpants..
#5
Maybe Raghad would prefer we follow her father's model in administering 'justice'?
I'm sure she will be more then willing to have her eyes gouged out of her head in front of him. We might have a problem finding someone willing to rape her (in front of him) tho....
These 'privledged' people make me sick. They are more then willing to party wildly and rape and pillage innocent men/women/and children but just show one of them in their underwhere and they scream bloody murder!
This story seems to indicate that this vampire lived in Iraq right up until the war - sucking up the blood of innocent men, woman, and children under her father's regime... I gotta wonder what role she might have had in Saddam's crimes.....
#7
And Ms. Ragheader (wonder if she was sporting the headware back in the day) ... uh, Raghad ... wondered why her father is not being treated as a human being and the father of three daughters? Where has she been for the past 20+ years?! I suppose alot of her countrymen could provide a little remedial education about her pappy's way about things. Perhaps she should return to ask folks about it. I love the pampered offspring of corrupt politicians and dictators. They're always absurd and hilarious little reincarnations.
When the story first broke the Intrepid MSM Reporters (TM) fanned out around Baghdad, or at least went to the Internet cafe across the street from the hotel to record the reaction of The Arab Street (TM). One reporter found a suitably outraged Baghdadi, who was quick to denounce Amerikkka. The funny part was the guy was at the cafe Googling: "Saddam + sex." I didn't see the rest of the report 'cos my eyes had rolled all the way back in my head.
#13
Under Fred's new system if you look at the comments for this thread you see Saddam's daughter followed by .com's jpg, with the guy casting his eyes in her direction. I don't think that's exactly what the young Iraqi had in mind.
Strong family resemblance -- I wonder why she doesn't let her moustache grow.
Posted by: Matt ||
05/23/2005 18:48 Comments ||
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#14
Look at how cold her eyes are in the photo. She knew enough of what Daddy was doing, and didn't disagree.
#15
She knew damn well what her daddy and brothers were doing I suspect. But lets assume she's innocent until proven guilty Ok?
However her bitching about Saddam's underoos after Saddam has had thousands raped, tortured, and murdered shows that she has no remore for her fathers actions and makes one suspect that this heartless bitch had a lot more to do with his reign then if she had truefully regretted his actions.
Does anyone know what her role in Saddam's reign was? Was anyone killed or tortured on her orders?
Her actions now seem to indicate that she well might have....
The U.S. is cutting off financial and technical assistance for an increasing number of weapons development projects done in cooperation with Israeli companies. These include the F-35 aircraft, the Arrow 2 anti-ballistic missile and the Tactical High Energy Laser project. The United States is not happy with the degree to which Israel is selling American military technology to China. Israel has received hundreds of billions of dollars in military aid from the United States over the years, and a lot of that was in the form of military technology that Israel was allowed to use as a basis for developing additional weapons and equipment. But Israel had to agree to safeguard the underlying American technology secrets. Israel has not been doing this with China, which is notorious for stealing technology any way it can. Israel and China say that U.S. tech is not being shipped to China. American intelligence agencies and the Pentagon say the Israelis and Chinese are lying. The Israelis admit they need the sales to China, because in a post-Cold War world, there aren't as many customers for military technology as there used to be. Jobs, and votes for Israeli politicians, are more important than the possibility of American troops getting killed by Chinese weapons using stolen (via Israel) American technology. Apropos comments on Pollard elsewhere on RB today
#3
Our backing may be vital to Israel, but Israel is not vital to us in any sense. They are a liability. They need to decide whether they want to be for us or agin us, 'cause being their ally has been pretty expensive.
Posted by: Mrs. Davis ||
05/23/2005 12:57 Comments ||
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Well, yesterday there was a post on "Prophet of Doom", so I don't have to be ashamed to post about a comics book, do I?
This is a very un-PC rendition of the various superstitions and plain stupidities in the life of the Prophet(Tm), as reported by the Master Religion itself.
I've known this through the belgian http://www.coranix.com/ site, in a french translation. Available online or as a downloadable .pdf, and apparently as a real-life item for Us customers (?).
Note that the site owner had to relocate, after some pious, devout, peace-loving muslims (is there any other sort?) made a few threats and complained to the hoster.
May 23, 2005: Keeping track of who is winning in the war on terror is complicated by the other "wars" that have become entangled with the conflict against Islamic terrorism. Party politics in the United States, and ideological, commercial and cultural differences with Europe and other parts of the world have made difficult to agree on what is victory, and what is defeat.
There is a lot of disagreement over Iraq. Taking the war to Iraq was a decisive move, in that it brought the war on terror to the terrorist homeland (the Persian Gulf in particular, and the Middle East in general.) Al Qaeda was forced to declare Iraq a major battleground, and eager terrorists have flocked to Iraq. There, the terrorists have made themselves thoroughly unpopular with most Iraqis, and an increasing number of Moslems outside Iraq. But much of world opinion has decided (for a cluster of ideological, commercial and cultural reasons) that the war in Iraq is illegal and wrong. The United States is pretty much ignoring world opinion, and a lot of Americans who share that opinion (largely liberals and Democrats). Because the left in the United States has decided that the American government has no plan and is without a clue, you cannot even discuss war on terror strategy without getting put down straight away. But there is a strategy, and it is working.
Taking the war to the Islamic heartland wasn't easy. Most of the world was unwilling to offend Saudi Arabia, the world's largest oil producer, with accusations that Arabia was the source of most of the increasingly lethal Islamic terrorism. But Iraq provided a better target, because the Baath Party in Iraq had made itself a pariah state because of unprovoked attacks on neighbors Iran and Kuwait. Everyone believed that Iraq had biological and chemical weapons, and was trying to get nukes. While many now deny this was the case, anyone can check the news stories before 2003 to see the near unanimous agreement that Iraq was not in compliance with UN demands to come clean about its "weapons of mass destruction."
Iraq brought Islamic terrorism to the Islamic heartland, and the locals don't like it. Before 2003, Islamic terrorism was popular in this part of the world. Expatriates in Saudi Arabia were unnerved by how many Saudis seemed happy and pleased about the September 11, 2001 attacks. Many Moslems had convinced themselves that their problems with local tyrants and poor economic performance were caused by external forces. This, "it's not my fault" attitude has been a problem for centuries. A serious problem as can be seen by the lack of economic progress, despite trillions of dollars in oil sales and decades of development efforts. Even the Turks, who ruled the Middle East for centuries, despaired of ever curing the Arabs of their delusions, and self-destructive habits.
That attitude was slowly changing before the September 11, 2001, Afghanistan and the invasion of Iraq. But once Islamic terrorists began killing Iraqis and Saudis on a large scale, the "maybe it's our problem and we should fix it" school of thought became a lot more popular. Unfortunately, because most mass media have a vested interest in disaster and defeat, this aspect of the war on terror is little discussed. Good news is not welcome.
No matter, the war goes on, and increasingly it's being fought, and run, by SOCOM (the U.S. Special Operations Command.) This organization has more experts in the language and cultures of Islamic countries than the rest of the United States government combined. This irritates the State Department, and a lot of other organizations both foreign and domestic. But that's not considered a major problem by SOCOM.
SOCOM has learned a lot about what works, and to what degree, in Iraq, Afghanistan and dozens of other countries where it is operating. One major finding is that it will be easier to stop, or greatly diminish, Islamic terrorism, than it will be to fix the social and economic problems in Moslem nations. The biggest weakness of Islamic terrorists is their intolerance. Islamic terrorists will freely kill fellow Moslems, and not just those who are, or appear to be, "collaborating" with the enemy. Islamic terrorists had tried to avoid this sort of thing, as they realize their source of money and new recruits comes mainly from Moslem nations. But the Islamic radical movement is on a Mission from God, and there is a competition to see who is the more terrible terrorist. Killing Moslems is not considered a problem to many of the Islamic terrorists. Thus, as Islamic nations get a dose of Islamic terrorism, attitudes shift. The result is a larger proportion of the terrorist recruits and money support are now coming from Islamic communities in Europe, where local laws and customs make it easy for transplanted Moslem communities to survive, safe from the effects of Islamic terrorism. It's easier for a Moslem to support Islamic terrorism as a spectator, rather than as a victim.
Nearly all Islamic nations are willing to fight Islamic terrorists, although most are less eager to work on the underlying problems (mostly political and economic) that created Islamic radicalism in the first place. But the United States has managed to get everyone, especially the worldwide mass media, to agree that democracy and clean government in Moslem countries is a good thing. This in itself is a major victory. But reversing thousands of years of bad habits (especially tolerance for despotism and corruption) won't happen quickly. However, because of the growing availability of international media, most Moslems are at least aware that there are better ways to run a country, and an economy. This provides an opening for reform.
SOCOM, and other elements of the Department of Defense, have developed some detailed methods for measuring progress in the war on terror. Unfortunately, these metrics are too complex for snappy headlines, and too dependent on sensitive sources for wide distribution. But even without access to all that, you can see the strategy, and the progress. As was said, early and often after September 11, 2001, it's going to be a long war.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/23/2005 8:38:27 AM ||
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Fourteen Palestinian prisoners held by the Palestinian Authority in Jericho went on a hunger strike for a third day Monday to press for their release. A statement by the militant Islamic Jihad group said the prisoners, who were detained for their ties with groups advocating armed resistance against Israel, were being held in non-humanitarian conditions.
At the same time the group is calling for the release of all its members from Israeli prisons, the Palestinian Authority continued to detain its "heroic" fighters in the Jericho prison, ignoring agreements reached in Cairo with all factions of the resistance movement, the statement said. The group said it held the PA responsible for the safety and health of the prisoners, who are reportedly being held under extremely bad conditions. "We call for the immediate release of the prisoners who are observing a hunger strike to protest their imprisonment," the statement said.
I know that nano-violin is around here somewhere.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/23/2005 8:08:30 AM ||
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#1
Those poor Palestinians.
I feel soo sorry for them that tonight on my way home I am going to buy a half rack of ribs in solidarity with them.
RELATIVES today said their prayers had been answered after the release of three Romanian journalists in Iraq, while their Government denied paying any ransom or agreeing to pull out troops. The journalists and their guide were set free after a two-month hostage ordeal, the Romanian Government said overnight.
Good news.
President Traian Basescu said Romania hade made neither foreign policy concessions nor paid a ransom to secure their freedom and that a plane had been sent to bring them home. "I assure you that Romania negotiated neither its present and future foreign policy, nor paid a ransom," he said.
Outstanding, President Basescu.
The Romanians, a woman and two men, were abducted on March 28 in a suburb of Baghdad, along with their guide, a businessman with both Iraqi and US citizenship. Their kidnappers, a group calling itself the Muadh Ibn Jabal Brigade, had at one point threatened to kill them if Romania refused to announce the withdrawal of its 860 troops from Iraq by April 27. The release was greeted with joy in Bucharest where the hostages' families, backed by Opposition parties, had desperately pleaded with the Government to heed the kidnappers' ultimatum. Mr Basescu had stood his ground on the Iraq troop presence during the crisis, with Foreign Minister Razvan Ungureanu pointing earlier in May to Romania's commitments under a UN Security Council resolution. Speaking before the release was announced, Defence Minister Teodor Atanasiu said it was "unlikely" that Romania would withdraw its troops from Iraq this year. "Romania is involved in different missions in Iraq, including training the Iraqi army, which is not yet ready to replace coalition troops," he was quoted as saying by Mediafax. "That is why a withdrawal during the course of the year is unlikely." Romania also has 500 soldiers deployed in Afghanistan as part of the US-led operation Enduring Freedom to flush out Islamic extremists.In late April, as the clock ticked down on the execution ultimatum, hundreds of Romanians had demonstrated in central Bucharest, urging the Government to withdraw its forces.
#1
Excellent. No surprise though - a nation that triumphed over Ceausescu won't allow itself to be conned or cowed by subgrade fascists in psot-Saddam Iraq.
#2
"I assure you that Romania negotiated neither its present and future foreign policy, nor paid a ransom"
So some businessman paid it, in return for future favors. Why else would they be released? The kidnappers got a case of the happies?
"The release was greeted with joy in Bucharest where the hostages' families, backed by Opposition parties, had desperately pleaded with the Government to heed the kidnappers' ultimatum."
#3
My good friend Sgt Harvey jsut got back from Iraq. He had a lot of good things to say about the Polish troops, Urkranian troops, and Japanese although the Japanese are not fighting. He really trashed the Spaniards. I didn't ask him about the Romanians but I will the next time I see him.
Posted by: Deacon Blues ||
05/23/2005 7:30 Comments ||
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#4
Why else would they be released?
Midnight visits to the families of the terrorists by Romanian special forces?
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
05/23/2005 14:01 Comments ||
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Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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#1
Can't wait to see how the MSM treats this. If at all. Simple fact is that Sharon is taking enormous risks on behalf of peace, and that he is doing so only because Arafat is dead and Bush has signalled there will never again be any US support for terror-mongering fascist Paleo leaders like Arafat.
Prediction: NYT will bury on page A17. Rest of MSM will not pick it up.
#2
I'm generally a pro-Israel guy but this Jonathan Pollard stuff gets me steamed. How dare they?! The guy was spying. I don't care if it's for a trusted ally - that's treason. They should be grateful that his life has been spared as a consideration to our Israeli friends. But calling for his pardon/freedom is pushing the limits. This was one pardon call that Clinton wisely didn't grant and Bush had better do the same in '09.
Posted by: John in Tokyo ||
05/23/2005 3:58 Comments ||
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#3
I'm am very much a pro-Israel guy. This Jonathan Pollard stuff gets me steamed too.
As far as Pollard is concerned, he got paid which wrecks Pollard case that he did it idealism and he spied for more countries then just Israel. Not that that would make much difference as under the law it makes no difference whether you spy for one or more countries and whether you did spied for an ally or an enemy.
Overall I have no problem with all spies getting life or being executed. What I do have a problem when some get off in a few years and others get life!
But I don't think that he did get an unreasonable sentence compared to others, eg
Aldrich Ames: Life without parole.
Ronald Pelton: Three concurrent life sentences.
Arthur Walker: Three life terms. Fined $250,000.
John Walker: Life.
Jerry Whitworth: 365 years (eligible for parole after 60 years) Fined $410,000
Note Pollard did not receive as tough a sentence as the above as he has been eligible for parole since he hit his ten-year anniversarty. The others cannot be paroled. Since he is elligable for parole, he has a right to be heard now.
On a personal note, I could not care whether he is released or not.
Note if the Israeli catch a US spy in Israel, there will be hell to pay.
#4
On a personal note, I do care if he is released. Spying on our intelligence and defense structures on behalf of a foreign power for money is the worst type of treason possible and warrants the death penalty and forfeiture of all assets and property within the reach of our government. The man should never again see the light of day regardless of whether he's working for the Pope, Iceland, Sri Lanka, Belgium, or China! It is that simple. Why the hell should we, the taxpayers and citizens of the country he betrayed for money, pay to keep his carcass alive?
#5
Amen Tkat,John....On a personal note, I do care....F*ck him, he can rot!
Posted by: Mini Mullah ||
05/23/2005 11:32 Comments ||
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#6
As far as I am concerned, demanding the release of Pollard destoys American sympathy for Israel as quickly as Israelis selling F-16 tech to China, alledgedly including the real jewels, the avionics source code. He spyed, got caught, and will die in prison. Get over it and be thankful he wasn't slowly garroted, like he deserves.
BTW how is Israeli JSF participation going? What you've been frozen out? Pity.
Posted by: ed ||
05/23/2005 12:04 Comments ||
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#7
I agree Ed. Pollard needs to be shot as do the rest. Non-negotiable. I have no sympathy for Pollard or those demanding his release. They can go f*ck themselves.
#8
it should be remembered, that during Oslo the US told Israel that Pal prisoners should be released since the conflict was now in the past, and their deeds were now irrelevant. At the time many Israelis wondered why this shouldnt apply to Pollard also, since his deeds involved trying to get information on arab countries, which were now "at peace" with Israel.
Sy Hersh did an article, based on anonymous sources at the CIA, saying that what Pollard got was not just related to the Mideast, but was Soviet related stuff that the Israelis traded to get Jewish scientists out of the USSR. This was the justification for not releasing him in the spirit of Oslo. You may believe Hersh or not as you wish.
Certainly most American Jews are reluctant to speak up for Pollard. The actions of a man like Pollard endanger the career prospects, and ultimately the security, of American Jews. Those who work in the national security area are obviously most directly effected. Israelis, obviously, dont have the same concerns.
Its hard to compare Pollards sentence to his deeds without a precise picture of his deeds, which obviously must remain secret. Some of the spies whove gotten the harshest sentences actually blew US spy networks, resulting the deaths of US agents. Im not sure thats true for all of them, though.
#12
There's a few things this ArabNews article left out. Telegraph: Laura Bush heckled on Jerusalem visit
A small crowd of about two dozen people surrounded Mrs Bush as she entered the Dome of the Rock mosque in Jerusalem's walled Old City.
A Palestinian worshipper cried out at her: "You are not welcome here. Why are you hassling our Muslims? How dare you come in here?"
Mrs Bush, who later made an appeal for peace, did not respond then or an old woman inside the mosque shouted "Koran, Koran" at her in Arabic.
Posted by: ed ||
05/23/2005 16:50 Comments ||
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#13
Corrina, Corrina?
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/23/2005 18:17 Comments ||
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#14
I just want to go on record that as a Jew and a Navy Veteran, I would volunteer to shoot Jon Pollard.
When he was around Stanford way back, everyone in the community thought he was a loon.
Jealous over the US edition getting so much publicity for their retracted qu'uran in the toilet story, the Japan edition's editorial staff tried to upstage them with their latest cover showing the US flag in a trash can.
#5
This Newsweek cover's just another example of the MSM's political niche marketing trend. In this case, the niche is a foreign audience that is thought to be hugely receptive to a (literally, in the Newsweek Japan case) trash America message.
It's all about money for Newsweek and every other MSM organization whose financials are going down the drain. When the market fragments, and your company's market share shrinks, time to abandon the mass market strategy in favor of niche products that can compete more effectively in growing areas-- in this case, the overseas market.
Prediction: the MSM will soon distribute doctored news accounts as per the target audience. We may even reach the point where here at home, the MSM product is tweaked for different psycho-political niches: one version for the bicoastal blue urban metrosexual audience, another for the upscale "Economist" corporate elite, another for the flyover state broad middle market, another for red state NASCAR types, and so forth.
#6
This is all about a business proposition, pure and simple.
MSM domestic market: fragmenting; intense competition from bloggers and new media; rising skepticism and mistrust of MSM from consumers. Sharply diminished profitability and steadily declining market share.
MSM's international market: growing market and increasing market share. Less competition due to heavy state intervention, fewer blogs. Higher and more sustainable profitability than domestic market.
Solution: pander to anti-American foreign audiences. Write off declining US market. Increase profitability and placate shareholders.
Posted by: Karl Rove ||
05/23/2005 1:21 Comments ||
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#7
thibaud (aka lex)
Just to add...The MSM was bashing America,soldiers,Repubs,Conservatives etc. long ago when domestic cosumption was king, while at the same time elevating 'their' LLL asshats to hog the best light.
Of course your point is well taken because it's much worse now due to the lust for money. They'll sell us out (5th columnist bastards) by pandering to the worst elements anywhere for market share.
Posted by: Mini Mullah ||
05/23/2005 1:33 Comments ||
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#8
Whilst I made similar comments to Lex when this was posted yesterday, I don't think is as bad as some of you paint it. Newsweek is a business selling a product. Demand declines in one market (or markets) then they go after the market with the most potential and that is non-english speaking markets where the blogosphere is a much newer phenomena. While the blogosphere only reaches a few percentage points of the english speaking population they are overwhelmingly the heavy (serious) news consumers and represent a large percentage of that market. So in response the MSM will naturally go down market as well as target non-english speakers. As the market watching types say 'The trend is your friend.' I like the trend to serious news stripped of MSM spin a lot.
#10
I prefer to think of it as given a shovel, the MSM keeps digging.
They used to be professionals, now they are whores. No long term goals for these guys - just pay the rent that's due tomorrow - who cares how it's done.
This desperate willingness to throw away years of goodwill is a sign they are in a downward spiral and know it.
Pages from the Koran are more absorbant, but pages from Newsweek are smoother.
Which would you choose?
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
05/23/2005 9:18 Comments ||
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#12
RC - Dude, using Newsweek doesn't cause riots, so go with the Koran every time. When that chili dog give you pain, pass it on. ;)
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats ||
05/23/2005 9:25 Comments ||
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#13
CNN will eventually give up on the US market and get its growth and profit from Eurabia. A bit like the tobacco companies giving up on the US for high-growth markets in Asia and East Europe.
#14
This cover is from February ... which is just one example of the fact that CNN, Newsweek and their ilk shifted their marketing strategy away from the US a good while back.
Posted by: too true ||
05/23/2005 10:07 Comments ||
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A meeting of the provincial Majlis-e-Shoora and executive committee of the Jamiat Ulema-e-Pakistan-Noorani (JUP-Noorani) on Sunday asked the Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal (MMA) Supreme Council to allow Opposition Leader in the National Assembly Maulana Fazlur Rehman and NWFP Chief Minister Akram Khan Durrani to attend National Security Council (NSC) meetings in the greater interest of the NWFP. Owais Ahmad Qadri, JUP-Noorani provincial ameer, told reporters after the meeting that his party had suggested the Supreme Council let Fazl and Durrani participate in NSC meetings for the sake of the province. He said their participation would improve and strengthen relations between the central and provincial government.
The provincial chapters of the Jamiat Ulema-e-Islam-Fazl (JUI-F), Jamiat Ahle Hadith and Millat-e-Islamia Pakistan, component parties of the MMA, had already asked the Supreme Council to allow their participation in the NSC. MMA leader Hafiz Hussain Ahmad had said a few days ago that Durrani had threatened to resign from the chief minister's office if he were not allowed to participate in the NSC. However, Durrani denied making such a statement the next day. JUP-Noorani, also an MMA component, passed resolutions against the desecration of the Quran at Guantanamo Bay and the disgracing of Muslim prisoners at US detention centres in Iraq and Afghanistan.
This article starring:
AKRAM KHAN DURRANI
Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal
FAZLUR REHMAN
Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal
HAFIZ HUSEIN AHMED
Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal
OWAIS AHMED QADRI
Jamiat Ulema-e-Pakistan-Noorani
Jamiat Ulema-e-Pakistan-Noorani
Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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A growing nexus of local tribesmen and religious extremists have disallowed women from filing their nomination papers for the 33 percent seats reserved for them in the local bodies (LB) elections in Diamer district of the Northern Areas, sources said on Sunday. The by-elections on the seats reserved for women are scheduled to be held today (Monday). However, official sources said that women were not allowed to file their nomination papers before the deadline as local tribesmen opposed their participation in the local bodies. The officials quoted local tribesmen as saying that "it is against our traditions and tribal norms to allow our women sit alongside male counterparts in the male-dominated councils and participate in public gatherings".
Sources said in some districts including Skardu, Gilgit, Ghizer and Gangche, the seats reserved for women were already filled, but by-elections were being held for some vacant seats in union councils, municipal committees and district councils.
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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#1
Uppity wymyn. How dare they?
I believe the picture is of the Punkto Valley PTA. The femalian bottom left is a party favor.
LAHORE: A 14-year-old girl died on Sunday when a homemade bomb exploded at her house in the Lower Mall area. Police said Mehrunnisa, daughter of labourer Muhammad Ashique, packed explosives in a glass bottle and set it off. Flying shards of broken glass from the explosion cut her face and throat. The body was handed over to the family without an autopsy.
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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#1
So THAT'S where they get their virgins! I've been wonderin' about that.
Posted by: Tom Dooley ||
05/23/2005 1:44 Comments ||
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#2
No doubt Paki's will riot over the government's failure to provide the most fundamental of educations to the children of Allan, namely, the safe manufacture of bombs.
Iraqi authorities have released a top official in Saddam Hussein's former regime because he is apparently terminally ill.
Make sure he dies soon.
Ghazi Hammud Al-Obeidi, former regional chairman in the southern Iraqi city of Kut for the former ruling Baath party, was the first to be released among detained former regime members who were on the list of 55 most wanted Iraqis. "Ghazi Obeidi is suffering from cancer and according to my information he has been released for health reasons," Justice Minister Abdel Hussein Shandal told The Associated Press. "Only for health reasons." Shandal did not elaborate but Obeidi's lawyer, Badee Izzat Aref, said he was released April 28 because he was suffering from what appears to be terminal stomach cancer.
Painful. I like that.
Aref said that he met Obeidi, 65, recently and described his condition as "very bad" and added that he was in a wheel chair. He also appealed for the release of Huda Salih Mahdi Ammash, known as "Mrs. Anthrax," because she was suffering from breast cancer. Ammash was one of the two other people featured in pictures published Saturday by the British tabloid The Sun, along with photos showing an imprisoned Saddam, including one where he is clad only in his underwear.
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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#1
a village court, headed by the village elders, found her uncle Muhammad Akmal guilty of sleeping with another manâs wife and fined him Rs 230,000, and ordered him to wed his niece (when she turns 14) to the wronged 40-year-old Altaf Hussain.
So it's very bad, and very stupid, but not true paedophilia as implied by the headline. And it is true that arranged marriages are the norm; in fact a love match in that part of the world can get the participants killed. :-(
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 00:00 ||
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#1
Ah, coming from Ali Aswad Al-Aseri, Saudi Ambassador to Pakistan, all makes sense. In a way, I quite agree with him, the "western media" is projecting the wrong image of Islam, they're far too sympathetic, apologetic, swooning, and ass-kissing in their coverage.
Jewels: "There is no provision for terrorism in Islam. Terrorists have no religion. Islam is a religion of peace, brotherhood and tolerance."
"Islamic culture is very rich and what we need is to introduce it to the outer world effectively."
Uh, huh. He must be talking about the other Islam, definitely not the one I've seen -- in his home country.
#3
Everything I knew that was worth knowing about Islam, I was reminded of on 9/11.
Posted by: Dave D. ||
05/23/2005 6:41 Comments ||
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#4
Very well stated, Dave D. I would imagine that they don't consider beheadings, beatings, killings, sharia, women as 2nd class citizens, etc. as "Terrorism." It's all in a good day's work for the jihadi faithful!
Posted by: BA ||
05/23/2005 8:39 Comments ||
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#6
'Western media projecting wrong image of Islam'
For some reason, the idea of western media presenting "another" image of Islam makes me wonder if jerking-off with the other hand is really "doing it different".
#9
gag--query on the 194 jihad verses in the kkkoran--remember hindu kush means hindu slaughter--guess who done the slaughtering--estimates of 60 million hindus killed in the jihadi takeover of the subcontinent--put that in your koran and flush it
Posted by: SON OF TOLUI ||
05/23/2005 16:06 Comments ||
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#10
At the time of the 60 million slaughter, the world population was 300 million.
Just a snip:
The Department of Transport, which regulates the industry, said the major reason for bags and their owners being separated is because of the industry's efforts to keep connection times at airports to a minimum. A spokesman added: "Since Lockerbie, an airline must know the status of each bag it carries, whether accompanied or unaccompanied. Unaccompanied bags go through additional screening and we don't believe they present an additional security risk."
But Dr Jim Swire, the Lockerbie campaigner who lost his daughter Flora in the bombing, said: "I'm afraid I see the same complacency that was evident in the 1980s. Every time an unaccompanied bag travels on an airline, it illustrates that the international standard is a smokescreen to reassure the public and underlines the fact that airlines put profits before safety and that governments allow them to do that."
HIS bristling, chest-out performance at the usually soporific US Senate last week gave Americans their first taste of political debate, Dundee-style. Now, it appears, the United States wants more of the indefatigable 'Gorgeous' George Galloway. The maverick Respect MP is being offered a potentially lucrative lecture circuit deal in the US following his appearance before the Senate's permanent select subcommittee on investigations. Galloway's compelling and memorable rebuttal of accusations that he profited from the Iraq Oil-for-Food programme led to him being contacted immediately afterwards by American promoters. They believe Galloway's bombastic rhetoric could electrify campuses across the country.
While the details have not yet been finalised, the deal could see Galloway making appearances at America's Ivy League universities, including Harvard, Princeton and Yale. Galloway could expect to command a fee of around £5,000 per lecture on current rates, to add to the £140,000 he already earns through his MP's salary and as a newspaper columnist. A spokesman for Galloway confirmed: "He is being asked to do a lecture tour in the States which will be done pretty quickly. We were called by a promoter in the USA. If it happens, he will do a series of paid-for lectures, but he will also do some free ones as well."
The deal is just one spin-off from the former Glasgow Kelvin MP's performance last week, which brought him to the attention of the world for the first time, provoking admiration and horror in equal measure. Galloway's Westminster office was deluged with nearly 3,000 e-mails within 24 hours of his appearance before the committee. He received requests for contributions from media outlets across the world, including Bulgaria, Italy and New Zealand. In the US, his performance at the usually sedate Senate hearing drew gasps and giggles of astonishment. The episode has now considerably raised Galloway's profile, especially in the USA, greatly increasingly his earning power. One media commentator in Washington last week commented: "It was the best tongue-lashing since US Army counsel Joseph Welch excoriated Senator Joseph McCarthy over his witch hunt directed at one of Welch's law firm associates who had been a member of the Lawyer's Guild: 'You've done enough. Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? Have you left no sense of decency?'"
Continued on Page 49
#1
Mr Galloway might want to see if he's to be arrested, or subpeonaed (spelling?) for further questioning by the Senate before he goes gallivanting around the U.S. On the other hand, so long as he is gallivanting, he is still on American soil, and can easily be found if he is recalled for further questioning. An amusing little dilemma.
#2
All proceeding according to plan. Next: arrange for Galloway to speak in front of pro-Israel Democrat groups in Florida, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, New York, New Jersey and ask Hillary Clinton to join him on the stage.
Posted by: Karl Rove ||
05/23/2005 1:09 Comments ||
Top||
#3
George Galloway, like Michael Moore, is a tax on ignorance. If people want to pay it, let them. Its no skin off my nose.
#4
Except that the rest of us have to cover their bets.
Posted by: Fred ||
05/23/2005 7:47 Comments ||
Top||
#5
I think it's time somebody looks into Ivy League Tyrant Supporters Speaking Tour and Money Laundering Conduit. This is just a system of paying legal bribes to those who support the overthrow of the US. Time to take a good look and shut it down.
#6
Does he have to pay taxes on that income in the U.S. as well as the U.K.? And if he doesn't, can the I.R.S. demand all of his financial records for the last ten years?
#7
Most excellent. What we want is for him to subject himself to jurisdiction in as many red states as possible. Also, encourage him to raise his right hand before taking the podium.
Posted by: Matt ||
05/23/2005 9:41 Comments ||
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#8
George Galloway, like Michael Moore, is a tax on ignorance.
#9
Now, now, people. Please show some tolerance and enlightened thought when Galloway comes to this Evil Empire of ours to speak. He will undoubtedly draw piously enthusiastic crowds at such progressive venues as Berkeley and the Columbia chapter of Lesbians for Peace and Justice.
If he shows up in your community, please extend him every courtesy due a distinguished visitor, show our tolerance and enlightenment by listening patiently to his dissident but sincerely expressed views, praise him afterward for his sagacity and moral vision and ensure that he is the center of attention at the tasteful gathering of cognoscenti that will surely follow. Then hang him.
#12
"...Next day you couldn't hear nothing around that town but how splendid that show was. House was jammed again that night, and we sold this crowd the same way. When me and the king and the duke got home to the raft we all had a supper; and by and by, about midnight, they made Jim and me back her out and float her down the middle of the river, and fetch her in and hide her about two mile below town.
The third night the house was crammed again -- and they warn't new-comers this time, but people that was at the show the other two nights. I stood by the duke at the door, and I see that every man that went in had his pockets bulging, or something muffled up under his coat -- and I see it warn't no perfumery, neither, not by a long sight. I smelt sickly eggs by the barrel, and rotten cabbages, and such things; and if I know the signs of a dead cat being around, and I bet I do, there was sixty-four of them went in..."
#15
(Blushing) Many thanks TW. I think I learned that from reading British aviation mags when I was a kid. Characters like William Green and Bill Gunston are unknown outside the aero realm but they could have written for anyone (and Gunston still can at age 79). Bill Gunston, incidentally, is a great supporter of Israel. His first serious aviation job, and the adventure of a lifetime, was helping South African swashbuckler Boris Senior smuggle an amazing assortment of aircraft to the infant IDF in 1948. Early in the war of independence, Gunston flew a new Beech Bonanza from Johannesburg to Haifa, clear across Africa, and turned it over to the IDF. He made the final leg by the simple if outrageous expedient of filing a fake flight plan for Cyprus and landing in the enemy capital of Cairo to refuel. He was a Brit with a South African registered plane and the Egyptians apparently didn't suspect a thing. He then disappeared at wave top level and headed for Israel. The little plane was rigged with bomb racks and machine guns and was later shot down by Egyptian AAA.
Oooo....secret troops! Or a secret plan! Whatever! It's a secret....
Yeah. So don't tell nobody!
DEFENCE chiefs are planning to rush thousands of British troops to Afghanistan in a bid to stop the country sliding towards civil war, Scotland on Sunday can reveal. Ministers have been warned they face a "complete strategic failure" of the effort to rebuild Afghanistan and that 5,500 extra troops will be needed within months if the situation continues to deteriorate. An explosive cocktail of feuding tribal warlords, insurgents, the remnants of the Taliban, and under-performing Afghan institutions has left the fledgling democracy on the verge of disintegration, according to analysts and senior officers.
The looming crisis in Afghanistan is a serious setback for the US-led 'War on Terror' and its bid to promote western democratic values around the world. Defence analysts say UK forces are already so over-stretched that any operation to restore order in Afghanistan can only succeed if substantial numbers of troops are redeployed from Iraq, itself in the grip of insurgency. The UK contribution to the Nato-led International Security Assistance Force (ISAF) in Afghanistan presently stands at fewer than 500, compared with the contribution of 8,000 troops to the Coalition presence in Iraq.
Planners at the UK military's Northolt headquarters have drawn up emergency proposals to send up to 5,500 troops to Afghanistan to help avert a descent into more widespread bloodshed. As well as increasing the British presence in Afghanistan 10-fold, it would require additional funding of almost £500m. MoD sources confirmed last night that the secret plans have been firmed up in response to persistent concerns that the notorious rebel commander Gulbadeen Hikmatyar has teamed up with Taliban fighters in the south. An MoD source told Scotland on Sunday: "We are going into an area where there's a civil war going on. It's dangerous and it's somewhere new. People within the MoD are now saying we will have to deal with this and go into the south of the country. What they are saying is, don't do it piecemeal. We will have to do it properly." Senior army and navy officers, along with officials from the Treasury, were in the region last week to survey the options.
Continued on Page 49
#4
they got a huge drug problem. Theres always potential tension as Karzai leans back and forth between the Pashtuns and the pro-Northern Alliance minorities. But the Taliban seem to be in definite decline, either getting killed or surrendering. Its not quite where it should be, but this article is like out of nowhere.
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/23/2005 9:44 Comments ||
Top||
#6
they got a huge drug problem...
They do got a huge drug problem, indeed. And why? Britain's Government, in its wisdom, given the task of dealing with the opium industry issue post-Taliban decided not to pursue an aggressive campaign but to go for some third-way baloney which failed outright, snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. It would only be fair that British troops made up the numbers required to deal with Labour's strategic failure.
You'd have thought they'd know from Northern Ireland that dealing with criminals wearing kid gloves solves nothing.
A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.
Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing
the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.
Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence
over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has
dominated Mexico for six years.
Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No
trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
Riyadh - Saudi security forces have arrested 92 men after they stormed a party and found them wearing make-up and wigs and dancing in women's clothes, an Internet newspaper reported on Sunday. 
An official speaking for the Shoura Council said the issue of women driving in the Kingdom would not be discussed in the council. The official told Al-Riyadh newspaper that what had been said in the media and on the Internet about the Shoura discussing the topic was "untrue." He went on to say, "The council has no intentions of raising this topic for discussion despite what has been said in the press."
The deployment of 36,000 National Guard troops or state militia on the U.S.-Mexico border would stop the illegal flow of foreigners into America, says a congressional report that credits the 
The 
...According to a Defense Department source citing internal Pentagon documents, the ICRC team leader told U.S. authorities at Camp Bucca: "You people are no better than and no different than the Nazi concentration camp guards." She was upset about not being granted immediate access shortly after a prison riot, when U.S. commanders may have been thinking of her own safety, among other considerations.
JAKARTA: Hardline Indonesian Muslims at a rally by thousands on Sunday vowed to wage war against America and said those who desecrate the Quran should be killed. "Destroy America and its allies! Kill those who desecrate Islam!" 
A senior Iranian official said yesterday that crisis talks this week with Britain, France and Germany are likely to be the last chance for the two sides to reach a deal on the Islamic republic's nuclear program. Speaking in Brussels, British Foreign Secretary 
A London-based Arabic daily reported Monday Syria's ruling Baath Party leaders are expected to introduce major changes when they meet next month. The London-based al-Hayat, distributed in most Arab capitals, said from a report in Damascus Syria's regional Baath Party conference was set to bring "big changes in its leadership" that would strip a large number of the "old guard" from their positions. 
Leaders of major Damascus-based Palestinian factions held a rare public meeting to follow up on a truce with Israel reached earlier this year and on the situation in the occupied Palestinian territories. The meeting came as Prime Minister 
President of the Democratic Gathering and Chouf MP 
BEIRUT: Anti-Syrian Christian opposition leader 
Fourteen Palestinian prisoners held by the Palestinian Authority in Jericho went on a hunger strike for a third day Monday to press for their release. A statement by the militant 
A meeting of the provincial Majlis-e-Shoora and executive committee of the 
A growing nexus of local tribesmen and religious extremists have disallowed women from filing their nomination papers for the 33 percent seats reserved for them in the local bodies (LB) elections in Diamer district of the Northern Areas, sources said on Sunday. The by-elections on the seats reserved for women are scheduled to be held today (Monday). However, official sources said that women were not allowed to file their nomination papers before the deadline as local tribesmen opposed their participation in the local bodies. The officials quoted local tribesmen as saying that "it is against our traditions and tribal norms to allow our women sit alongside male counterparts in the male-dominated councils and participate in public gatherings".
LAHORE: A 14-year-old girl died on Sunday when a homemade bomb exploded at her house in the Lower Mall area. Police said Mehrunnisa, daughter of labourer Muhammad Ashique, packed explosives in a glass bottle and set it off. Flying shards of broken glass from the explosion cut her face and throat. The body was handed over to the family without an autopsy.
Iraqi authorities have released a top official in Saddam Hussein's former regime because he is apparently terminally ill.
Now, it appears, the United States wants more of the indefatigable 'Gorgeous' 
DEFENCE chiefs are planning to rush thousands of British troops to Afghanistan in a bid to stop the country sliding towards civil war, Scotland on Sunday can reveal. Ministers have been warned they face a "complete strategic failure" of the effort to rebuild Afghanistan and that 5,500 extra troops will be needed within months if the situation continues to deteriorate. An explosive cocktail of feuding tribal warlords, insurgents, the remnants of the Taliban, and under-performing Afghan institutions has left the fledgling democracy on the verge of disintegration, according to analysts and senior officers. 
