MARGARET BRENNAN: You know, tomorrow morning at the Capitol you and other members of Congress will be there to certify the election win in 2024 of Donald Trump. There’s an unprecedented level of security, in part because of what happened four years ago with the violent attack by his supporters to change the outcome of the last election. Why do you think that so many members of the American public decided that was not disqualifying when it came to reelecting him president?

PELOSI: Well it- again, thank you for the opportunity to talk about this because the denial that they had about the election, which is what they were acting upon, and the denial they’ve had since then about what happened on Jan- January 6 is just appalling. They want to revise history. And they just- they just can’t. But I’m so glad that they have increased security and I’m hoping that this will be very peaceful because- the public knows it. Now to your question, I think- it isn’t, I- I wouldn’t say that the American people disregarded this. They just had a different view as to what was in their interest, economically and the rest. So I don’t- I don’t call this a disregard of January 6. I just call it something that they saw in their interest economically.

BRENNAN: Even just last night at Mar-a-Lago, Donald Trump was screening a documentary about the 2020 election, claiming his win and trying to talk about the legal challenges he had. There seems to be a continued effort to claim that he won in 2020.

PELOSI: It’s really sad. It really is sad. And I don’t know about the film that he had and the rest, but it’s- it’s almost sick that he would be thinking that in 2020. He’s won the election now, that will be clear- that will be clear, and tomorrow he will be clearly- we will be accepting the results of the Electoral College. So he should be triumphant about that. But to be still trying to fight a fight that he knows he lost is- is really sad.

BRENNAN: You know, the President-elect has said that in the first nine minutes of his new term, he will pardon many of those who participated in January 6. He said he’ll look at it on a case-by-case basis, but in looking back at what happened four years ago, there are recordings, there’s video evidence of what happened. This is personal for you, some of these rioters in your office. chanting your name. One of them, one of the defendants, ‘We were looking for Nancy to shoot her in the friggin brain, but we didn’t find her.’ For you, this is personal. So when you hear about pardons, do you think the non-violent attackers deserve to be pardoned?

PELOSI: The non-violent- I think that’s a violent attacker, with the intent–

BRENNAN: – the violence itself.

PELOSI: Yeah–

BRENNAN: –The violent language, you think.

PELOSI: The violent language- yes, the intention. And of course, the intention to attack the Vice President of the United States. Now it didn’t end that day. As you know, he called out to these people to continue their violence, my husband being a victim of all of that, and it still- he still has injuries from that attack. So it just goes on and on. It isn’t something that happens and then it’s over. No, once you are attacked, you have consequences that continue. So I don’t- it’s really a strange person who’s going to be President of the United States, who thinks that it’s okay to pardon people who are engaged in an attack. But let’s- you know, let’s do this. Let’s just say okay to the American people. This is what this is about. Do not be conned by the denial of the election of 2020 and- why would he be saying that? But he- but he is. And then on top of that, the denial of what happened on January 6.

BRENNAN: But some of the 1600 defendants here were really only charged with trespassing. And when you look at the profiles, University of Chicago did a study, half of those who broke into the Capitol were white collar workers. They were small business owners. Didn’t necessarily have a criminal record. When you look at that profile, you said intention. It- it was the intention itself, you think, that needs to be considered more so than the crime. You know that- that it casts the crime itself of trespassing in a different light for you.

PELOSI: Well the President said he would go on a case-by-case basis. So I assume that- that some of those people may not have engaged in the violent activities that some of the others did. Look at this beautiful Capitol, the dome built by Lincoln. Under Lincoln’s leadership during the Civil War, they said, don’t build the dome. It takes too much steel and person power, manpower, they said, from the war effort. And he said, no, I have to show the resilience of America. And then under that dome you saw, you saw flags, the flags that, you know, just horrible flags under the dome of Lincoln. And so it was a tragedy, and we cannot be in denial about what it was. If the President is going to go on a case by case basis, I hope he does, and then maybe–

BRENNAN: –Trespassers, you would be comfortable with pardoning?

PELOSI: Well, just depends on how they define what that is. But the- but I know that some of that encouragement and then the follow up that- that so many people were threatened, including me and- and to my home, looking for me and finding my husband, and as I say, who still suffers from head injuries from- on that day. So these things don’t just happen and go away when you have a head injury. But anyway to- to- to see the threat to so many people in elective office, now going beyond me, but so many people in elective office, it shouldn’t be a threat to your family that you have chosen to do public service.