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| Syria-Lebanon-Iran |
| NGOs accuse Leb army of ‘excessive force’ |
| 2007-07-02 |
| Relief workers yesterday accused the Lebanese army of using "excessive force" to disperse a protest in which dozens of displaced refugees in northern Lebanon were killed or wounded. "The protesters were more than 10 metres (yards) away from the (army) checkpoint and there was gunfire," said Caoimhe Butterfly, an Irish member of the Nahr Al Bared Relief Campaign, a non-governmental organisation. Mahmud Halimi, the NGO's coordinator, called for an independent probe into Friday's violence as Palestinian refugees demanded the right to return to the Nahr Al Bared camp where troops have been battling Islamists since May 20. "The demonstration was going peacefully and unarmed. The soldiers fired first in the air. We sat down to de-escalate, but after that there was gunfire at the demonstrators. There was no communication before opening fire," he said. "Men, women and children were victims of an excessive use of force. We ask for an independent investigation," Butterfly told reporters in Beddawi, a Palestinian camp near Nahr Al Bared and close to the scene of the violence. Medics said three people were killed and about 40 wounded as the demonstration by hundreds of refugees who fled Nahr Al Bared came under fire from Lebanese soldiers at a checkpoint outside Beddawi. A wounded Palestinian, Salim Shamaa, said, "I got shot because I was raising my hand to talk to the people," while 22-year-old Mohammed said he was knifed by Lebanon counter-demonstrators. "People are very angry. They thought they had left Nahr Al Bared to be safe ... The last thing they thought was they could be killed or wounded by coming here," said Mona Waked of the UN relief agency for Palestinian refugees, UNRWA. But the Lebanese army insisted its troops had taken all necessary measures to avoid casualties among the protesters. "They were trying to force their way through the checkpoint, carrying metal objects and sticks, ignoring warning shots in the air," an army spokesman said. |
| Posted by:Pappy |
| #15 If the clowns wanted back in the combat zone, I would have frisked them and waved them through. |
| Posted by: Super Hose 2007-07-02 22:18 |
| #14 My thought too. |
| Posted by: lotp 2007-07-02 21:58 |
| #13 Yes. Which, barring the fog-of-war aspect (something the IDF is really 'good' at), it tends to support the 'dubious fealty' aspect of the Leb army. |
| Posted by: Pappy 2007-07-02 21:52 |
| #12 Remember this incident from last summer? |
| Posted by: lotp 2007-07-02 21:41 |
| #11 Don't get yer suspenders in a bunch Pappy. I don't wear suspenders. And I apologize for using the term 'schtupid'. I meant 'ignorant'. I've followed Lebanon since their civil war in the 1970s. One consistent element has been the ineffectiveness of the Lebanese army. They've been routed by various militias and neighbors for a long time. Then you would have realized that the Leb army was deliberately set up to be ineffectual by the various factions (one of the few things they ever agreed upon). Inasmuch as one of Hezbollah's goals is to establish an Islamic state in Lebanon, you'd think it's army would oppose them or at least have the honor to try (after all their motto is: Honor, Sacrifice, Loyalty). They are basically a militia used to control limited areas and weak types such as Paleo refugees. When you have army with (until recently) little national respect, formed of 60,00 troops of dubious fealty and little combat experience, an air force consisting of unarmed helicopters, and equipment of 1960s vintage, Honor Sacrifice and Loyalty tend to take a back seat. I would love to see them use excessive force against Hezb and keep their country from being used as a battlefield by outsiders. Wouldn't you? And I would have loved to have seen the Polish cavalry destroying Panzers with their lances and stopping the Blitzkrieg. Can't find that in my history books, though. |
| Posted by: Pappy 2007-07-02 21:37 |
| #10 What's the religious makeup of the LA? Does it follow the country's, or are shiite or perhaps christians over-represented (I take druzes are not significant)? |
| Posted by: anonymous5089 2007-07-02 16:18 |
| #9 Don't get yer suspenders in a bunch Pappy. I've followed Lebanon since their civil war in the 1970s. One consistent element has been the ineffectiveness of the Lebanese army. They've been routed by various militias and neighbors for a long time. Inasmuch as one of Hezbollah's goals is to establish an Islamic state in Lebanon, you'd think it's army would oppose them or at least have the honor to try (after all their motto is: Honor, Sacrifice, Loyalty). They are basically a militia used to control limited areas and weak types such as Paleo refugees. I would love to see them use excessive force against Hezb and keep their country from being used as a battlefield by outsiders. Wouldn't you? |
| Posted by: Spot 2007-07-02 16:14 |
| #8 I didn't know the Lebanese Army had any force; they've certainly never used it against the Syrians or Hezbollah. I soooo glad you approve of suicide missions, Spot. Do you ever do homework? Research? Perhaps research on the TO&E, relative strength to Hezb'allah and Syria, and what kind of materiel the Lebanese Army has? No. Of course not. Posting stupid schidt is always easier. |
| Posted by: Pappy 2007-07-02 10:19 |
| #7 UNRWA is the UN relief agency. They've been administering the various Palestinian "camps" for so long that as far as I can tell, they're the closest thing to an actual Palestinian adminstration in existence. As for NGOs... what the hell is the "Nahr Al Bared Relief Campaign"? What's the chances we're looking at a minor militia which has cleverly disguised itself as a NGO charity? That testimony slides interestingly from detached third-person to alarmed first-person. "We sat down to de-escalate"? So the "Relief Campaign" was leading this |
| Posted by: Mitch H. 2007-07-02 09:32 |
| #6 Excessive force. Is there any other kind? |
| Posted by: tu3031 2007-07-02 09:00 |
| #5 I've been waiting for this for weeks. |
| Posted by: gromgoru 2007-07-02 08:55 |
| #4 Excessive force? Are they sure they've got the right army? I didn't know the Lebanese Army had any force; they've certainly never used it against the Syrians or Hezbollah. |
| Posted by: Spot 2007-07-02 08:30 |
| #3 The paleos have their OWN relief agency at the UN?! UNRWA WTF? |
| Posted by: bigjim-ky 2007-07-02 08:23 |
| #2 Caoimhe Butterfly? |
| Posted by: Frank G 2007-07-02 07:58 |
| #1 So whom would you trust? Paleos and affiliated NGO's or LA? Pondering... After 5 seconds, LA wins. |
| Posted by: twobyfour 2007-07-02 00:36 |