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| Science & Technology |
| Urban turbines struggle to turn a profit |
| 2007-02-17 |
| Having spent £13,000 on installing a wind turbine at his home, John Large is disappointed at the return on his investment, which amounts to 9p a week. At this rate, it is calculated, it will take 2,768 years for the electricity generated by the turbine to pay for itself, by which time he will be past caring about global warming. The wind turbine was installed at the engineer’s home in Woolwich, southeast London, four weeks ago and has so far generated four kilowatts of electricity. An average household needs 23kw every day to power its lights and appliances. Mr Large said that his difficulties highlighted the problems faced by consumers who wanted to buy wind turbines to save money and to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. Like many small turbines, the model owned by Mr Large puts power directly into the national grid, but the requirements of the grid mean that power can start being transferred only once blades have been turning fast enough for several minutes nonstop. Despite the wind usually being sufficient to turn the blades of Mr Large’s turbine, it has been unable to generate a constant supply that can be put into the national grid. Unless a minimum generating capacity has been met, all the power that the turbine is capable of producing is lost. Mr Large questioned the ability of the micro-generation industry to make clear to the general public all the pitfalls. Highlighting the range of turbines available, the need for planning permission, the difficulties in receiving grants and the electronics that need to be installed with the mini-wind-mills, he said: “I’m an engineer and I’m generally au fait with it, but when you put all these together you get a load of huff for very little puff.” Mr Large says that the turbine’s performance fails to match its specifications. This claim is dismissed by the manufacturer, Proven Energy, which along with the installing company, Sundog Energy, says that Mr Large ignored advice that the site was unsuitable. Mr Large denies this claim, but he and Sundog are in agreement that more and better information about wind energy needs to be made available. Martin Cotterill, of Sundog Energy, said that, although turbines generally worked well in exposed places, it was difficult to find suitable sites in urban areas because of turbulence and obstructions blocking the wind. He said that it was a common misconception that wind that was sufficient to make the blades go round would always generate power. “Just because a turbine is turning does not necessarily mean it’s a turbine generating,” he said. Mr Cotterill said that the industry had been encouraged to try to establish international standards for wind turbines. Groups such as the British Wind Energy Association were trying to agree standardised data so that consumers had information on performance that was easy to understand. He added: “There’s been a massive increase in the number of people wanting wind turbines. We take a lot of calls from people then we have to explain that it’s inappropriate for them. Solar panels are much better for an urban setting.” Despite so little power being generated by his new turbine, Mr Large remains enthusiastic about the potential for power production by micro-generators. “I’m undaunted,” he said. “I feel like I’ve been sold a pup but it’s not a bad experience — it’s a learning experience. Maybe I was a little bit ambitious.” |
| Posted by:John Frum |
| #9 such as the death of a loved one If one of my relatives died in a wind turbine, I'd be upset too. |
| Posted by: SteveS 2007-02-17 23:43 |
| #8 Goodness, Redneck Jim, are you sure you want to say all that to Old Patriot, of all people? I read his post as advocating going all out for nuclear power in the short term. |
| Posted by: trailing wife 2007-02-17 21:54 |
| #7 Let the wind turbines work by Darwinian selection. |
| Posted by: Anguper Hupomosing9418 2007-02-17 21:54 |
| #6 You would rather have Live Birds, and no lights? OK Fine by me. When your ass is freezing because there;s ni power to run your gas or oil furnace, and enviro regulations prevent building a fire in your own fireplace, then I hope you'll realize the stupidity, but I believe It'll take something serious, such as the death of a loved one before you wake up and realize the stupidity of putting beliefs before survival. on the other hand, if you're willing to say "Screw the Laws, and light that fireplace, then there's hope for you. Decide now before the decision is taken too far and too late, it's called foresight, and planning. Decide what course you'll take NOW, survival, or stupidity. |
| Posted by: Redneck Jim 2007-02-17 17:42 |
| #5 One other problem with wind turbines is that if the wind is TOO strong, you lose your turbine. We had gusts to 60MPH here in Colorado Springs, and some places along the Front Range had gusts to 120MPH. That does a job on your turbine. The whole "alternative energy" schtick has massive problems that are being glossed over by its proponents. What we really need is to convert as much as possible to nuclear power NOW, and work on sustainable alternative energy until it's perfected. We also need to find a way to keep wind turbines from killing birds and other creatures, as they're doing in many places. |
| Posted by: Old Patriot 2007-02-17 13:54 |
| #4 "...the manufacturer, Proven Energy, which along with the installing company, Sundog Energy, says that Mr Large ignored advice that the site was unsuitable." The title should be "Engineer makes gross conceptual error in wind turbine project. Blames others for his incompetence." |
| Posted by: Penguin 2007-02-17 13:28 |
| #3 I have a Mexican racehorse named PeakOil, who's in for a share? |
| Posted by: Shipman 2007-02-17 13:04 |
| #2 Four weeks in mid-winter doesn't seem like a long enough 'trial period'. |
| Posted by: Seafarious 2007-02-17 11:12 |
| #1 I've personal experience with wind turbines, I made my own and used it to partly power my home, The Big mistake he's making here is trying to sell power back to the grid, they only pay wholesale rates, much less than the price he pays to buy power, average is 3 to 4 hours of generated power equals one hour of purchased power. To make the system work profitably, you need to use a Direct Current system, store "Your" power in Batteries, and use it yourself, either by converting it to AC with an inverter, or using it directly to power such things as light bulbs that don't care if they run on AC or DC, it's more expensive initialy, but works far better in the long run. |
| Posted by: Redneck Jim 2007-02-17 11:06 |