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Afghanistan/South Asia
Afghan FM rejects amnesty for fugitive Taleban leader, warlord
2005-05-19
TOKYO - Afghan Foreign Minister Abdullah Abdullah ruled out an amnesty for the leader of the ousted Taleban regime and a most wanted warlord after a commission suggested bringing them into the political mainstream. Afghanistan's reconciliation commission said on May 9 that former Taleban leader Mullah Mohammed Omar and veteran guerrilla Gulbuddin Hekmatyar could be pardoned if they disarmed and obeyed the new government. But Abdullah, in an interview published Thursday in the Yomiuri Shimbun, Japan's top-selling daily, dismissed the proposal by the autonomous commission. "The two men are terrorists who are said to have links with the international terrorist group Al Qaeda. They should not be part of that" amnesty offer, he said.
They're also increasingly irrelevant.
Omar has been fleeing on the run since his hardline Islamic regime was toppled in a US-led invasion following the September 11, 2001 attacks in the United States. A Taleban source earlier said Omar would not accept an amnesty.

Hekmatyar, a former prime minister and warlord who throws like a little girl fought the Soviets in the 1980s, heads the fundamentalist Hezb-i-Islami faction and has been declared a terrorist by Washington for trying to destabilize Afghanistan. Afghan President Hamid Karzai offered an olive branch to rank-and-file Taleban fighters last year and said all but a hardcore of 150 militants wanted for human rights violations would be able to rejoin the political process.
Posted by:Steve White

#14  .com, if you are right, then fry 'em up will indeed be the only option. We all know that, Libhawk included. And I'm quite certain they will be shocked when our effect inconceivably intersects with their cause, leaving very small particles in its wake. Thus proving Star Trek prophetic.

Now I need a cup of tea.
Posted by: trailing wife   2005-05-20 00:05  

#13  D'oh! lrage eraged = larger engaged...
Posted by: Frank G   2005-05-19 22:53  

#12  A good friend is very leftist. Today he said this about the Pepsico speech: Interesting. I suppose the speaker is feeling somewhat like our state's governor at the moment. She shouldn't, as far as I'm concerned. I do wish someone would finally say that civility is a 2-way street. The US is always being chastized to understand this and that third-world member. How about them giving at least token efforts to understand the US? It's hard to be sympathetic toward religious perverts upset that a sacred book of theirs has alledgedly been abused while they're parading around burning our flag and screaming death to all Americans.


So Old Dogs change.... The left is reducing its numbers everytime it opens its mouth. In addition note how it morphed into the Koran Issue.

Posted by: 3dc   2005-05-19 22:50  

#11  active muslim will equal enemy of a lrage eraged power on the next attack on American soil - do they understand? I don't know, and don't care anymore
Posted by: Frank G   2005-05-19 22:36  

#10  BTW. I reached "fry 'em up" the hard way. And I do not want to have to explain it to my grandchildren, should I live long enough to converse with them. I just finally realized that we won't be given the choice. It will be made for us while we're still ditherin' about what shit means and whether we're "confortable" with what it implies. Life has a way of forcing things.
Posted by: .com   2005-05-19 22:31  

#9  Though I believe the Moderate Muslim is a Myth - I posted the second bit in anticipation of this moment.

So what, if there are N "Moderate Muslims"? They aren't Lot. That second post is keyed upon what we call a History Match in the oil biz. The logic (or simulation model) uses knowns to test model accuracy before anyone trusts the future predictions. No different from demanding that theories match experience. What is our experience, pray tell, if not as described therein? They are either baggage or simply inactive enemy.

The positive connotation is false. Inactive is neutral, at best. A resource pool is not neutral.

Muslim First. It's a fact that will, someday, become so obvious as to be an accepted figure of speech and rule of thumb.
Posted by: .com   2005-05-19 22:25  

#8  .com, if I thought you didn't know shit, I would have said so. I know you don't see any real alternative to fry 'em up, and there are many days when I feel unhappily forced to agree with you.

But -- do you remember the story in Genesis, about the destruction of the cities of Sodom and Gommorrah? (spelling?) Later comes the whole Pillar of Salt thingie, but before that, God tells Abraham that the two cities are so full of evil people that He is going to wipe them out. And Abraham argues with God that it would not be fair to destroy all if there are some good men there. So God agrees, and promises not to destroy the cities if 100 good people can be found. Abraham eventually bargains Him down to 10. As we all know, in the end the only good man was Abraham's nephew, Lot (he of the salty wife), who manages to escape the destruction with the rest of his family.

To make a short story long, Liberalhawk is playing Abraham to your fry 'em all Godness (no blasphemy intended here, guys, especially as .com is one of our resident atheists, ok?). LH is trying to find the 100 good people so that the whole of Islam need not be destroyed. This may well be a fruitless exercise, but I cannot say he is wrong to make the attempt, nor will anything change while he is doing so --- except perhaps the measure of your blood pressure.

And I promise solemnly to tell you clearly when I think you're full of shit. Fair?

Here. Have a cup of tea while you decide whether to blast me where I sit. ;-)
Posted by: trailing wife   2005-05-19 22:00  

#7  I'd have to agree the Islamists rule the herd with the rest of teh sheep silent, afraid they'll be slain by their own. I see "moderate muslim" as embracing only the non-practicing
Posted by: Frank G   2005-05-19 21:26  

#6  One final observation to frame this with some rational perspective.

There are, I guess, 3 things likely to happen in the clash of civilizations between Islam and Freedom...

Wind Down.
Same, Same.
Spiral Out of Control.

In none of these can I see Moderate Muslims playing any positive role. When the heat's on, they will be "radicalized" either pro-jihadi or anti-jihadi - and there's no substantive evidence the latter has or ever will occur. They're merely delicate baggage for us as they are because we abhor collateral damage, but they're a resource pool for the bad guys. The positive connotation is a canard. They are not our friends, they are either guilt objects or an enemy resource.

The Moderate Muslim is, IMHO, much like Turkey or Burlesconi. Someone upon whom you cannot depend, when the pressure's on - except to join the other side. Learn from experience or repeat mistakes. And that's that.

Where, from here?

More of the same - open hostility and war when necessary, but nothing definitive by either side. A grinding slog through the morass of self-limiting PC-istic BS, bleeding from a thousand cuts, dragging on. Until, of course, other building conflicts, such as China, find common cause.

Winding down - I see no reason why this might happen, but I had to include it for completeness. If the Caliphatists lose steam, they will likely step up ops in an attempt to spur support, as the ZarqiBoyz are doing in Iraq. As far as I can see, the Islamists are incompetent boobs - a good thing - and can't manage to mobilize large numbers of the fence-sitters and cannon fodder at once on command. Since they easily outbreed the kill rates, flypaper notwithstanding, it will never end. Certainly, since the hate breeders, the Imams, are immune from accountability, this option is a non-starter.

Ramp up / Spin out of control - A Big Hit or three, to add to the other hits they've already scored, will finally tip over the reticence of regular folks to accept the facts: they really are at war with Islam. And then Shit Really Happens. Mobilization will creep up on both sides, subconsciously. Not actually an organized thing, but a cumulative thing - for both sides. Push / Shove. Rock / Hard Place. Endgame.

The Moderate Muslim is a canard, a straw man, a Tojan Horse - far more a danger than an asset.
Posted by: .com   2005-05-19 20:35  

#5  Lol! You're so right, tw - I don't know shit. Whom am I actually mocking, Frank? Nah, nevermind.

Absolutely. Lh should continue to drop his precious Turds of Wisdom along the Trail of Turds. Fred should institute a Turd Watch, complete with email alerts, so people can zoom to the latest Lh dump. These are not mere brain farts, nay - these babies will green up RB. And why stop there, eh? - he should expand his fertilization program to other topics. Hell, all topics! No one else is so finely attuned to nuance, truth, and wisdom. No one else is so self-sanctimonious. No one else so full of the raw material required. Such a fit - and purest serendipity, not pretentious trollery, nay. It brings a tear to my eye.

Lead us, oh great Lh. Your people call to you, beg of you, lead us!

Lol! Enjoy.
Posted by: .com   2005-05-19 19:29  

#4  pretty courageous, I wouldn't mock her, PD
Posted by: Frank G   2005-05-19 18:58  

#3  Just suggesting that a Muslim country should have relations with Israel can get a person killed in that part of the world, .com. Foreign Minister Abdullah is the norm, not including the many who will accept nothing less than Hitler's Final Solution, achieved. I agree with Liberalhawk on this one.
Posted by: trailing wife   2005-05-19 18:52  

#2  Lol! Oh my! With a negative threshold, anything, anything at all no matter how ethereal or merely gestural, triggers. Lh, with this affectation you define pretentious. Keep it up, it's precious.
Posted by: .com   2005-05-19 12:35  

#1  Moderate Muslim Watch.

In other news, the Afghan minister for Womens affairs (she ran for Prez and lost) has said that Afghanistan should have relations with all of Americans allies, including Israel, and she suggested that Afghan Jews abroad should invest in Afghanistan. Foreign Minister Abdullah said that recognition of Israel would have to wait for a formal peace agreement and 2 state solution (he might as well have said it would have to wait till Pakistan goes first, to insure the safety of Afghanistan, but of course he didnt)
Posted by: Liberalhawk   2005-05-19 11:43  

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