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| Iraq-Jordan |
| Willy Pete used in Fallujah |
| 2004-11-23 |
| "Usually we keep the gloves on," said Army Capt. Erik Krivda, of Gaithersburg, Md., the senior officer in charge of the 1st Infantry Division's Task Force 2-2 tactical operations command center. "For this operation, we took the gloves off." Some artillery guns fired white phosphorous rounds that create a screen of fire that cannot be extinguished with water. Insurgents reported being attacked with a substance that melted their skin, a reaction consistent with white phosphorous burns. Kamal Hadeethi, a physician at a regional hospital, said, "The corpses of the mujahedeen which we received were burned, and some corpses were melted." |
| Posted by:Zhang Fei |
| #38 WP is for smoke. Period. End Of Story. |
| Posted by: OldSpook 2004-11-23 1:55:37 PM |
| #37 WP is for smoke. Period. End Of Story. |
| Posted by: OldSpook 2004-11-23 1:55:37 PM |
| #36 Willy Pete? What? Oh! I'd have used it against that sob Fucker Tredrikson if I'd had any. Check out these Golden Flakers here, got a good crunch and even you can afford em..... |
| Posted by: Bill Peterson 2004-11-23 4:26:16 PM |
| #35 They should not, however, be employed in such a way as to cause unnecessary suffering to individuals. Er, well-done instead of medium rare? As long as the compound has oxygen, it will continue to burn until the compound burns itself out. Sounds like a magnesium fire. Teacher in metal shop in HS melted down a small bar of that stuff as a demo and it burned white hot down to a little pile of ash. |
| Posted by: Bomb-a-rama 2004-11-23 3:37:14 PM |
| #34 It always amazes me when "war critics" jump on our tactics. Not you guys, but the reporters in the story and such. White Phospherus (forgive my spelling) is one of the nastiest things around. As long as the compound has oxygen, it will continue to burn until the compound burns itself out. As far as using WP for only smoke (old spook), not true. Mix it with High Explosive artillery rounds and you have what is called a "shake and bake". Guarnteeed to lay some serious shapnel and burning damage on the enemy. But it is not a chemical weapon and its not just for smoke anymore. Depleted Urainium (DU) is used in every modern tank as part of it armor. I stress the word modern. The A-10 uses DU rounds to punch through steel and other types of armor. The DU round gives off way less radiation then watching a TV. True statement. When we did site clean up in Bosnia, the DU had the same background radiation as dirt, steel and concrete. Ergo, you got the same radiation effect you get from being exposed to the sun. |
| Posted by: Pissed off Army 2004-11-23 2:44:47 PM |
| #33 They should not, however, be employed in such a way as to cause unnecessary suffering to individuals. Sounds like the "necessary suffering" with WP is more than good enough. |
| Posted by: Xbalanke 2004-11-23 2:21:37 PM |
| #32 WP is for smoke. Period. End Of Story. |
| Posted by: OldSpook 2004-11-23 1:55:37 PM |
| #31 Adding to what AC said, here is the official US position (which ICC aside, is the only position that matters to the commander in the field) on the use of incendiaries, from FM 27-1, The Law of Land Warfare: 36. Weapons Employing Fire The use of weapons which employ fire, such as tracer ammunition, flamethrowers, napalm and other incendiary agents, against targets requiring their use is not violative of international law. They should not, however, be employed in such a way as to cause unnecessary suffering to individuals. |
| Posted by: 11A5S 2004-11-23 1:22:15 PM |
| #30 You can cook 'em, but not with gas. |
| Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy 2004-11-23 1:08:51 PM |
| #29 #2 You have encountered a very old, and very common, lefty distortion, dating back at least to the Korean War. As usual, the left-conformists delight in crude semantic distortions, a common characteristic of mediocre minds who mistakenly regard themselves as cutting-edge elitists: WP is a "chemical," "chemical weapons" are prohibited, therefore WP is prohibited. As you correctly point out, such substances as TNT, dynamite, and even the gasoline used by "revolutionaries" in their molotov cocktails are also chemicals, yet these are not banned. In any case, here is the material you need, straight from the horse's mouth, the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (this is the official organization set up to implement the Chemical Weapons Convention of 1972): These Military Chemicals are Not Considered to be Chemical Weapons |
| Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy 2004-11-23 1:07:47 PM |
| #28 Did a look-see on HowStuffWorks.com (which everybody here should have bookmarked already, right?). They say the powder is regular corn starch or talcum powder. Nothing fancy. |
| Posted by: Dar 2004-11-23 1:04:52 PM |
| #27 Hey Dar, thanks for that explanation. Makes absolute sense. |
| Posted by: Thavising Thomoter9371 2004-11-23 12:52:28 PM |
| #26 The airbags are packed with a powdery substance that is intended to serve as a lubricant when the airbag deploys, and the heat of the friction from the rapidly deploying bag usually burns it up. If you got burned, it was probably either from the powder as it burned up or the friction of your skin on the airbag as it was still deploying. No WP in there! I can't imagine WP could be classified as a chemical weapon either. It's incendiary--not designed to be inhaled or absorbed through contact--although it burns on contact! I recall reading of one engagement near the end of WWII when a Sherman gunner used WP against two Tiger tanks. Realizing his AP ammo wouldn't penetrate the Tiger's frontal armor, he used WP which caused the Tiger crews to think their tanks were on fire. They bailed out, leaving the two intact Tigers to be captured and disabled before they could chew up a bunch of Shermans. |
| Posted by: Dar 2004-11-23 12:10:07 PM |
| #25 Thanks for your feedback. I was wondering if any of you could provide a solid argument on why WP is not a chemical weapon. The difference, etc. In my non-military opinion, WP is like a 'nade version of a flame thrower. But, I'd like to get a better argument than that next time I cross path with a "America is Evil" student. |
| Posted by: Thavising Thomoter9371 2004-11-23 11:39:41 AM |
| #24 "Willy Peta, gonna make you a believa" |
| Posted by: Sparks 2004-11-23 11:31:40 AM |
| #23 Well I guess we wil have to switch to some kind of Magnesium type round then. Gosh you all got cars with air bags? Us po folks can't afford anything that new. |
| Posted by: Sock Puppet of Doom 2004-11-23 11:11:51 AM |
| #22 Yah, I have a bit of a scar from my airbag too. Could not breathe from the powder when the thing inflated. Thanks for the info. |
| Posted by: Seafarious 2004-11-23 10:56:21 AM |
| #21 Anonymous2u, most automobile air bags use lead azide (PbN3) for propellant. Azides give off nitrogen gas (N2) quite explosively. |
| Posted by: Eric Jablow 2004-11-23 10:53:54 AM |
| #20 The left maintains that any weapon that is effective against the enemy is immoral. WP and CS gas are two examples, and so are cluster bombs, mines and DU rounds. During Vietnam it was napalm and the good ol' 50-cal. |
| Posted by: Robert Crawford 2004-11-23 10:21:40 AM |
| #19 melting huh? Just a preview of your afterlife, muj assholes. Kinda hot down there? Raisins too cooked to eat? |
| Posted by: Frank G 2004-11-23 10:06:13 AM |
| #18 white phosphere (sp) is an inciendenary device, but is it a chemical weapon? I would argue that it is not. It ain't the WP that hurts you, it's the extremely f*cking hot fire that the WP creates. |
| Posted by: BH 2004-11-23 10:01:09 AM |
| #17 The left maintains that any weapon that is effective against the enemy is immoral. WP and CS gas are two examples, and so are cluster bombs, mines and DU rounds. |
| Posted by: Chuck Simmins 2004-11-23 8:38:21 AM |
| #16 Smokeysinse, we care. Our military cares, because it ultimately degrades morale and unit cohesion. War is organized violence - "kill people, break things". It takes leadership and discipline to walk the fine line at which we are effective without destroying future effectiveness. |
| Posted by: rkb 2004-11-23 8:20:49 AM |
| #15 Tide's turned. MSM and arab media realize it but aren't yet willing to admit it. |
| Posted by: lex 2004-11-23 8:09:57 AM |
| #14 yeah why haven't there been a few airstrikes on these cornered yet? And who cares if it is chemical i say they should have gassed them anyway. |
| Posted by: smokeysinse 2004-11-23 8:07:41 AM |
| #13 1200 dead Arabs and the silence from the MSM and the Arab media is deafening. I think I detect a glow in the lightbulb. |
| Posted by: phil_b 2004-11-23 8:00:34 AM |
| #12 WP is not classified as a che weapon.During the tunnel battles of Vietnam anti-war activst tried to claim using CS gas in the tunnels was chem warfare,didn't work. |
| Posted by: raptor 2004-11-23 7:43:46 AM |
| #11 Good point phil_b - but I really doubt that it has. Now, if there's an airstrike called in on where those 'insurgents' are cornered by the Black Watch, they *may* get a clue. If not, rinse and repeat... |
| Posted by: Tony (UK) 2004-11-23 7:21:37 AM |
| #10 Marines just introducing the "insurgents" to the concept of BBQing. |
| Posted by: Charles 2004-11-23 6:57:49 AM |
| #9 They were expecting an Israeli-style proportionate response and got a slaughter. I wonder if the lightbulb's gone on yet? |
| Posted by: phil_b 2004-11-23 5:03:53 AM |
| #8 #5 melting insurgents 'like cheese' has a nice ring to it! Now all we need is the toast! I swear I saw the image of the Virgin Mary on a melting jihadi. It's a miracle. Quick Achmed! Freeze him and auction him off on ebay! |
| Posted by: Penguin 2004-11-23 3:11:06 AM |
| #7 farmaceuticum=pharmaceuticum, or simply drugz. I sometimes slip into phonetic spelling. Must be the rewiring. :-) |
| Posted by: Cornîliës 2004-11-23 3:04:55 AM |
| #6 I've seen this mentioned before. The melting, that is. Some dude decrying the dangers of depleted uranium, "witnessed" in Afghanistan, after a battle, birds melting into tree branches. I think that there was a substance present, but not the depleted uranium. Now, don't get me wrong... I am not a dope, but some 30 years ago, some joker dropped into my beer a farmaceuticum designed for schizophrenics, called trifenidyl. On normal people, it works like a strong hallucinogen. The reality changes dramatically, no visions like LSD, but inanimate objects become animate and yeah, the melting, plenty of it, it is almost zen-like. It took 3 days to wear that off completely. Since then, I am a bit weird. :-) It rewired my brain. I say the doc should lay off the dope. |
| Posted by: Cornîliës 2004-11-23 2:59:56 AM |
| #5 melting insurgents 'like cheese' has a nice ring to it! Now all we need is the toast! |
| Posted by: smn 2004-11-23 2:08:08 AM |
| #4 Isn't that stuff used in airbags? If so, I have the scar to prove it. |
| Posted by: anonymous2u 2004-11-23 2:04:52 AM |
| #3 Willy Pete is kosher. |
| Posted by: Zhang Fei 2004-11-23 1:58:32 AM |
| #2 white phosphere (sp) is an inciendenary device, but is it a chemical weapon? i overheard a guy in class claiming its a chemical weapon, making the bigger claim that the US is evil, yadda, yadda. Does anyone have views on this? I always thought that it was an incienendary dispersal device - sure it maybe "chemical" based, but so it a stick of TNT> |
| Posted by: Thavising Thomoter9371 2004-11-23 1:55:10 AM |
| #1 LMAO ! |
| Posted by: God Save The World 2004-11-23 1:51:56 AM |