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| Britain | |
| Blow to Blair as majority say war not justified | |
| 2003-09-23 | |
| Tony Blair has decisively lost the debate over Iraq with a clear majority of voters now saying that the war was unjustified, according to the results of this month’s Guardian/ICM poll published today. The survey shows that British public opinion on Iraq has moved sharply over the summer in the face of the Hutton inquiry, the failure to find weapons of mass destruction and the continuing instability in Baghdad. In the immediate aftermath of the war in April public support for the war peaked at 63%. By July it had slipped to 51% but a majority still said the war was justified. Now for the first time a clear majority are saying the war was unjustified (53%), and only 38% believe it was right to invade Iraq. The survey also shows that the Brent East byelection has provided a dramatic boost to the Liberal Democrats, who are now only two points behind the Tories and enjoying a 28% share of the vote, their highest poll rating for 14 years. The ICM poll shows Labour maintaining a five-point lead over the Conservatives but reveals serious erosion in the government’s reputation for economic competence in the last six months. On Iraq, the poll signals that the public is no longer giving Mr Blair the benefit of the doubt on the war. Every lie comes to an end mr. Pinokio, crime does not pay off always.
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| Posted by:Murat |
| #27 Folks, you know what CLINTON'S job ratings were 14 months before the Nov. 1996 election? 43% approved of the way he was doing his job in September 1995 and it stayed sub-50% until, surprise, the primary season began in March. American presidents almost ALWAYS lose popularity in the year before they run for re-election. Familiarity breeds a little contempt. But when the real thing gets closer, when people actually have to consider a choice between two candidates, when it matters, these things can change very radically...and usually in the incumbent's favor. The general electorate doesn't know much, YET, about the erratic Wesley Clark and very little about the other 9 dwarfs. Hell, remember 1988? People thought Mike Dukakis was the bomb...until the campaign started. Oh, and by the way, Clinton actually went below 40% a couple of times in his first term... http://www.harrisinteractive.com/harris_poll/index.asp?PID=180 |
| Posted by: R. McLeod 2003-9-24 1:28:15 AM |
| #26 This was Al Guardian's own poll. You might as well have asked Joseph Goebbels what the Dutch thought in the summer of 1943. Guardian is in the business of inciting, manipulating and exploiting the traditional bigotry of the British status-seeker classes. In the current context this means academic confomists, media-slaves and Arab-investment arse-kissers. |
| Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy 2003-9-23 7:28:07 PM |
| #25 Turkey's honorless grovelling for EU admission LOL. Rather pathetic really. But.. one can always dream. |
| Posted by: Rafael 2003-9-23 7:04:19 PM |
| #24 If Bush declares victory and gets out of Iraq by next September that could all change.... If GWB does just that, he's going to LOSE my vote. Abandoning the Iraqis in haste will surely result in one hell of a bloodbath, which would be inexcusable. Since we are in there, and fully involved, the wisest and most responsible course of action is to see it through until they are reasonably ready to take their own steps. It may not take a whole year to reach that point, and quite frankly, I wouldn't expect it to. If it did, great, but that's not a realistic target to hope or shoot for. |
| Posted by: Bomb-a-rama 2003-9-23 4:00:30 PM |
| #23 At least the Turks get the enjoyment of policing Falluja. That's been a hotbed for our boys. |
| Posted by: Bill 2003-9-23 3:12:36 PM |
| #22 Murat wrote: Damn fools of the Turkish foreign ministry declared that Turkish troops would be stationed in the Iraqi Al Anbar province when the parliament approves the bill. Al Anbar province. Wotta shame! Stuck out in the middle of the western desert. Except for the parts that are within the Sunni Triangle. No Kurds, no oil, no greenery, just lots of foreign jihadis and Saddam dead-enders. They won't object at all to potting Turk soldiers -- same as Americans to them. Make sure the Turk soldiers bring lots of sunscreen 'n' bullets! Murat then wrote: Sad news from Mosul, US soldier killed by accidental shooting. Friendly fire????? I'm reading "sad news from Mosul" as if you mean that seriously. It is sad, it's always sad when one of our soldiers die. We'll hear about the cause before too long. |
| Posted by: Steve White 2003-9-23 2:40:17 PM |
| #21 Hey! That's not nice! |
| Posted by: Bag of Cement 2003-9-23 2:39:33 PM |
| #20 Statistics. Support for the War has slipped from 63% high to 38% today. So what? The war is over. Looks like 25% changed their minds. Those 25% probably wake up in the morning and realize they drank too much the night before. Doesn't change the situation does it. |
| Posted by: john 2003-9-23 2:39:33 PM |
| #19 Arguing with Murat is like arguing with a bag of cement. |
| Posted by: tu3031 2003-9-23 1:42:47 PM |
| #18 Wild Dumrul has no honor, like his parasitic namesake. |
| Posted by: Ernest Brown 2003-9-23 12:27:36 PM |
| #17 >Old Patriot--the only poll that counts is the one next November--so I'm not planning to run up to DC yet to welcome in a Democratic President. One thing the poll does show is a trend in public opinion--one I'm sure you and many fellow Rantbourgeois don't like. But don't worry--the American sheeple have the attention span of gnats. If Bush declares victory and gets out of Iraq by next September that could all change.... |
| Posted by: Not Mike Moore 2003-9-23 12:08:36 PM |
| #16 I ask you again Murat, you worthless turd: what is your point? Is it: 1) You believe that Iraq and its people were better off under the dictotorial regime of Saddam and that Iraq posed NO THREAT to either its citizens and neighbors; OR 2) You're merely consumed by hatred of anything and everything American and have thusly appointed yourself resident troll here. Pick one, you gutless punk--no flowery language, no sideshows and diversions, simply tell us all which position most correctly explains why you are such a worthless prick. |
| Posted by: Flaming Sword 2003-9-23 11:37:29 AM |
| #15 US soldier killed by accidental shooting. Friendly fire? This may come as a surprise to you, but nothing is perfect, even military campaigns and occupations. |
| Posted by: Bomb-a-rama 2003-9-23 11:10:36 AM |
| #14 M'rat? blow me |
| Posted by: Frank G 2003-9-23 10:52:16 AM |
| #13 News flash Sad news from Mosul, US soldier killed by accidental shooting. Friendly fire????? |
| Posted by: Murat 2003-9-23 10:32:26 AM |
| #12 You're pointing to a Guardian article? Please. |
| Posted by: Bomb-a-rama 2003-9-23 10:21:47 AM |
| #11 Unfortunately for people like Murat and NMM, USA Today/CNN/Gallup polls are notorious for being biased, partisan, and quite often, far off the mark. Of course, with every "news" organization in the US constantly blaring anti-Bush, anti-war sentiment, warping and twisting every event in Iraq into a negative presentation, what would one expect of someone querried because they "subscribe" to one of the national news medias. That IS where USA Today/CNN/Gallup poll surveyers get their "unbiased random sampling" - from New York Times subscribers. |
| Posted by: Old Patriot 2003-9-23 10:18:17 AM |
| #10 Congrats to the democrats all around. I strongly recommend, though, you do your celebrating now, because in Nov. 2004, you all will be broke and beaten. The problem with this bounce in the polls for democrats is that it is at the cost of national defense. Our enemies are seeing that the president's political opponents are benefitting because of their unfounded criticism of Bush and his handling of the war in Iraq. They see a common cause with democrats. That linkage, once made, will be devastating for the democrats in 2004. My guess is once folks see what traitorous means the democrats used to get these numbers, they will turn on the democrats, and turn to the Republicans for guiding this country in this ongoing war against its enemies. |
| Posted by: badanov 2003-9-23 9:45:38 AM |
| #9 Ptah, Murat and his fascism-loving friends were stunned that their backstabbing treachery failed to stop our military successes in Iraq, and he fled like the moral coward that he is. As Iraq develops into a reproach to Turkey's statism, watch him do another fade. As for myself, I'll have fun laughing at Turkey's honorless grovelling for EU admission, all sympathy for their plight drained away by their veneration of Saddam's evil. |
| Posted by: Ernest Brown 2003-9-23 9:39:48 AM |
| #8 The blood of an Armenian a day helps keep freedom away, for the Turks, that is. |
| Posted by: Ernest Brown 2003-9-23 9:36:33 AM |
| #7 Still can't figure out that headline/link thing, eh Mu-Rat? |
| Posted by: Parabellum 2003-9-23 9:17:30 AM |
| #6 Murat and his tyrant-loving ilk (read almost all the media and surrounding Arab countries) must miss Hussein and his sons terribly: They kept Iraq at a sub-optimal level, and allowed them the distinction of being the most advanced of Muslim countries. When (not if, but when) Iraq takes its place in the circle of nations as the most democratic Muslim nation. Poor Turkey will be outclassed and there go Murat's bragging rights. The poll he cites (no link, *wags finger* bad murat. Doesn't want fact checking, obviously), very likely includes disapproval of Bush's handling of the Israeli-palestinian issue: I believe he IS flubbing the ball there and in NKor. Of course, Bush has his ways to respond, and a change going down in, what, 5 months, can be reversed in 14 months: Yeah, he'd probably lose NOW, but we happen to live in a Nation of Laws (one would hope), and it's not being held now. If it was held in August, you'd scream bloody murder, but would approve of it being held now, since it would get rid of him. Remember people, we didn't see Murat for an awfully long time after the War. He can dish it out, but can't take it. I say wait on Bush: The World still hasn't gotten a handle, or a clue, about Texans, much less Murat. He won't give us the pleasure of taunting him in the same way he taunts us now: We're rantburgers, and Loyal. He isn't. |
| Posted by: Ptah 2003-9-23 9:07:58 AM |
| #5 Guys, Murat's pathological hatred is turning him into the Tony Foresta of Rantburg. Either reign him in, or he's going to drive people away from the site. |
| Posted by: Robert Crawford 2003-9-23 8:30:21 AM |
| #4 News flash!!! bwahahhaaahaa Bush rating takes a plunge, hits a new low Washington, September 23: US President George W. Bush's approval rating has hit a new low, according to a poll, with only half of Americans saying they liked the way he's handling his job. That's down from 71 per cent in late March, and from 60 per cent in early August, according to the USA Today/CNN/Gallup survey released on Monday. His disapproval rating, meanwhile, hit a new high of 47 per cent, up from 36 per cent in early August and 25 per cent in late March. The survey also found for the first time that a Democratic candidate could beat Bush if the next Presidential election were held today. Former Nato Commander Wesley Clark would beat Bush 49 per cent to 46 percent, and Senator John Kerry would win 48 to 47 per cent. Bush had only a narrow lead over other leading Democrats, beating former Vermont governor Howard Dean 49-46 per cent, Representative Dick Gephardt 48-46 per cent and Senator Joe Lieberman 48-47 per cent. All those rankings fell within the poll's margin of error of three percentage points, but indicate that Bush no longer has a clear lead over his rivals. Americans are also divided over the war in Iraq, with only half saying that it was worth fighting. Some 63 per cent said it was worth fighting when asked the same question in late August, and 76 per cent backed the war at the time of Saddam Hussein's ouster. |
| Posted by: Murat 2003-9-23 5:53:26 AM |
| #3 News Flash!!! This just in: 50% of the population of the UK are below the intellectual average! And, in an as yet unexplained statistical anomaly, an amazing 90% of Turks are too! More to come... Stay tuned! Doh! |
| Posted by: .com 2003-9-23 5:03:58 AM |
| #2 I am sure Mr. Blair will be most disturbed to hear that, as well. He too was pulling for Baghdad. |
| Posted by: Mr. Davis 2003-9-23 3:54:31 AM |
| #1 Damn fools of the Turkish foreign ministry declared that Turkish troops would be stationed in the Iraqi Al Anbar province when the parliament approves the bill. Al Anbar province |
| Posted by: Murat 2003-9-23 3:44:44 AM |