While the world is busy denouncing the United States for the deplorable behavior of a few soldiers, it is oblivious to growing incitement by Islamist clerics against America and the West. Calling for jihad earlier this month in London, Sheikh Omar Bakri Mohammad told his disciples: "All Muslims of the West will be obliged to become his sword" in a new battle. At the same time, another Islamist, Imam Sheikh Abu Hamza al-Masri, is preaching in London that "itâs okay to kill [those who] work against Islam, by slitting their throats, or by shooting them."
Such incitement is prohibited by law in the U.K. Under the heading of "Inciting Terrorism Overseas," section 59 1(a), the Terrorism Act of 2000 clearly states that "a person commits an offence if he incites another person to commit an act of terrorism wholly or partly outside the United Kingdom." Needless to say, such an act would also constitute an offense if committed in England. Yet these imams and their ilk are free to call for murder with impunity.
More at link
Posted by: ed ||
05/11/2004 6:18:05 AM ||
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Food aid. That would be admitting to a sign of weakness.
We want our people to die as glorious martyrs for Mugabe and Communism! (cue Anthem)
#2
In an age where we can't show repeats of old TV comedies for fear of humiliating our immigrant population, this really does cheese me off. The only answer must be that these guys are MI5/6 on the sly.
Posted by: Howard UK ||
05/11/2004 11:39 Comments ||
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Incitement may be prohibited, but it is happening. Add to that lawlessness demands for sharia law in English courts (as have been reported recently), and you have the formula for Western culture being squeezed and intimidated out of England. People are naive if they believe protections of speech will insulate their country from ruination. London is going to have to make a tough decision at some point (the same decision America is facing)--is protecting free speech an absolute--i.e., more valuable than protecting a country against terrorist attacks, more valuable than a country protecting itself against sedition?
LONDON (AP) - Britain's defense secretary said Monday that published photos purportedly showing British troops abusing Iraqi prisoners look "increasingly like a hoax."
The Daily Mirror newspaper, which published the pictures and has stood staunchly by them, said that the government had not proved the pictures were fake. "Nor will we accept that they are not genuine images until incontrovertible evidence is produced to the contrary," said Daily Mirror editor Piers Morgan.
"We've already made up our bloody minds, and they'll stay bloody well made up!"
The pictures allegedly showed soldiers threatening and urinating on prisoners.
Defense Secretary Geoff Hoon told the House of Commons that investigators told him there were "strong indications" the vehicle in which one photo was taken was not in Iraq at the time. Hoon was asked later by Channel 4 News whether that meant the photograph was fake. "Certainly that is the evidence that we have, that this particular truck was not in Iraq. It is now really a matter for the Daily Mirror to indicate whether they are willing to cooperate, as they said they would do, in now investigating what looks increasingly like a hoax."
Hoon spoke to Parliament about an international Red Cross report that described beatings and humiliation of prisoners at Baghdad's Abu Ghraib prison and in the British-controlled southern city of Basra.
It's good to point this out but it can't be used to wish away the real problems.
Posted by: Steve White ||
05/11/2004 12:13:06 AM ||
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The Daily Mirror newspaper, which published the pictures and has stood staunchly by them, said that the government had not proved the pictures were fake. "Nor will we accept that they are not genuine images until incontrovertible evidence is produced to the contrary," said Daily Mirror editor Piers Morgan.
What a coincidence! I will not accept those pics as real until I see incontrovertible evidence to the contrary.
#5
"'...Nor will we accept that they are not genuine images until incontrovertible evidence is produced to the contrary,' said Daily Mirror editor Piers Morgan"
If Morgan's suggesting that his faith in the pictures is conditional on the production of more convincing evidence as to their authenticity, it doesn't sound as though he demanded incontrovertible evidence himself in the first place, does it? That admission pretty much sums up his attitude, and that of most of the rest of the anti-war left-wing media: We're right because we know we're right. For you to be right you need to prove we're wrong. For us, facts and accuracy are immaterial. Emperor Morgan's clothes don't look as fine as people once imagined.
#6
facts and accuracy are immaterial
It's the UK tabloid press.
Good analogy Bulldog: Emperor Morgan. I think we've more or less got the proof that the photographs were staged - I anticipate Mr Morgan's resignation forthwith... (aherm..)
Posted by: Howard UK ||
05/11/2004 6:41 Comments ||
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It's the UK tabloid press
True, but I'm thinking in general about how the anti-war media (I include here the BBC and the left-wing rags the Independent and the Guardian) consistently spin their content to suit their anti-war agendas. Seldom (if ever) mentioning the progress that's been made in Iraq, demonising Israel, and general moral-relativism through which our national enemies can do no wrong, our allies can do no right, black is white, white is black, etc.
Morgan went from eloquent traitor to dumbass traitor when he chose to publish these pictures because he took the usual propaganda too far. The defence it doesn't matter if they're not actually genuine: similar events took place anyway which has actually been put forward by some Mirror defenders illustrates how those types do not value truth at all. Large parts of the media live a culture of lies, and are rarely called to account for it.
I wonder if, or when, the folks responsible for the pictures are going to approach the Sun to tell their stories! They must know the game'll be up sooner rather than later. Hope it's not TA, but it's looking increasingly likely. TA returnees from Iraq? I know quite a few came back disgruntled, and subsequently quit. Getting their own back on the Army, perhaps? Or maybe just motivated by the cash. I doubt that, if it was members of the TA, recent recruits were responsible, as wandering around with rifles (real or replica), posing, etc. couldn't be done under normal circumstances without the assistance of, or at least a nod and a wink from, an NCO.
#8
Morgan should apologise personally to the poor Palestinian who tended the war cemetary in Gaza. The British press have always had their own agendas - or their proprietors' agendas at heart (usually Murdoch's with reference to the Times and The Sun) and have run with them often in the face of general public distaste... Remember the Sun's headline after Hillsborough? The Mirror is doing the same right now - and will only pull back when sales are dinted - hopefully soon.
Posted by: Howard UK ||
05/11/2004 8:52 Comments ||
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I'd prefer to see Piers apologising to the Queens Lancashire from the back of a Bedford truck, before having his day in court as a traitor! A court from which he should be taken to a place of execution. A place at which he should be hung from his neck until he be dead!
#11
ruprecht - the Territorial Army. Reservist volunteers who comprise approximately 25 % of the British Army's potential fighting strength. Members can volunteer to do active service individually, but they can also, in extreme circumstances, be called up to deploy as units. Effectively equivalent to your National Guard, IIUC.
Panama and the United States have agreed on allowing American officials to board ships carrying the Panamanian flag and search them for weapons of mass destruction on the open seas, a Panamanian official said Tuesday. The agreement, to be signed Wednesday in Washington, is similar to an accord the State Department reached in February with Liberia, the world's No. 2 shipping registry. Panama is No. 1. The accord gives the U.S. Navy the right to board thousands of commercial ships in international waters to search for weapons of mass destruction.
"Yar! Heave to and stand by to be boarded!"
"Er, been watching "Pirates of the Caribbean" again, Ensign?"
It comes amid fears that terror networks would take advantage of the relatively lax security on ships for attacks following heightened security on commercial airliners. Panamanian Vice Foreign Secretary Nivia Castrellon said in a recent interview that U.S. and Panamanian authorities are "constantly" negotiating shipping-related issues. As recently as March, however, Will Ostick, a spokesman for the U.S. Embassy in Panama City, said such an agreement was less necessary in Panama's case because drug-smuggling agreements already allow U.S. Coast Guard officials to board many ships with Panamanian registration in search of narcotics.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/11/2004 12:52:51 PM ||
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This is a good thing:
Panama is almost universally regarded as a "flag of convenience" nation, in which virtually none of the 6,000 plus ships registered under its flag are owned by genuine Panamanian companies, or staffed by Panamanian crews and officers. -- Singapore Business Times [link]
EFL
Two factors mainly contribute to this world-shaking development.
· The hollowing out of Christianity. Europe is increasingly a post-Christian society, one with a diminishing connection to its tradition or its historic values. The numbers of believing, observant Christians has collapsed in the past two generations to the point that some observers call it the ânew dark continent.â Already, analysts estimate Britainâs mosques host more worshippers each week than does the Church of England.
· An anemic birth rate. Indigenous Europeans are dying out. Sustaining a population requires each woman on average to bear 2.1 children; in the European Union, the overall rate is a one-third short, at 1.5 per woman, and falling. One study finds that, should current population trends continue and immigration cease, todayâs population of 375 million could decline to 275 million by 2075. To keep its working population even, the EU needs 1.6 million immigrants a year; to sustain the present workers-to-retirees ratio requires an astonishing 13.5 million immigrants annually.
Posted by: Dragon Fly ||
05/11/2004 9:00:39 AM ||
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The Islamic demographic development makes that some European cities will have Islamic majorities within the next 50 years. Check the following link to see the demographic developments in The Netherlands.
http://www.cbs.nl/en/publications/articles/webmagazine/2003/1298k.htm
#2
While Christianity may be hollowed out, that does not mean that there is no religion in Europe, simply that it isn't Christianity, or Islam. When the Islamists start to threaten the materialistic hedonism of the Europeans, it is not hard to imagine a 17th century response.
Posted by: Mr. Davis ||
05/11/2004 11:32 Comments ||
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OOOH BOY, I cant wait until this reaches America. I can't wait to jump up and down on blown up HumVees and cover my head with a checkered diaper.
Can we get those 72 Virgins in advance?
#5
Demographics are never straight line. One of the biggest factors will be the prosperity of Moslems in Europe. When they achieve a certain degree of economic prosperity, their birth rate will drop like a rock. Pretty assured, unless Europe continues to admit lots of new Moslem immigrants.
A third article, like the two from which this story was derived, pointed out that the vast majority of inmates in British prisons are technically Moslems. But not what you would call "real" Moslems. Mostly young men who might call themselves Moslem, but only for the 'perks' of Islam, not for the religion itself.
A nasty bunch, much like typical 2nd generation immigrants, that are neither "old country" or "new country", and form criminal gangs and mafias. They are just punks.
To see what Moslems will look like in a generation or two, look at the Irish or Italians in the US, and how they have integrated. They are no longer "old country" or halfway in between, they are thoroughly American, whether or not they call themselves "American" or "Irish-" or "Italian-American."
When they eventually purge their mosques of radical Wahabbi influences, they will settle down and become religiously conservative as the CofE, complete with boring sermons and dull coffees after.
#7
The decline in white European birth rates started with the availability of the pill in the 60's and accelerated with the changing attitudes towards abortion and life in general. This was the subject in 1980 of Gunter Grass' book Kopfgeburten: Oder Die Deutschen Sterben Aus (Headbirths: Or, The Germans Are Dying Out). It obviously continued to plummet. Now it has reached the point of almost a collective national suicide.
The only thing that could turn around something so entrenched and so pervasive would be a new sense of national purpose, a reason to think that the future could be better than the present. Something to make the petty personal sacrifices associated with having children seem trivial.
Socialist governments have a very hard time inspiring optimism in their peoples. Unless Atlas Shrugs, white Europe just fades away.
#8
Anonymoose, you are neglecting the bit about mussies not integrating, cuz they don't
check it out, arab muslims aint exactly new to the area.
even here in america it is an issue,
anecdote:
a close friend of my family was nearly killed by a muslim father who disapproved of the friend dating his daughter (yes he really tried to kill him, no he did not get in trouble for it(rich))
failing that he had his daughter kidnapped, (yeah she is over 18, no he did not get in trouble for it, he is muslim so it's ok to kidnap his adult daughter, cultural thing)
there is a lot more unpleasentness to the story, buh the family friend like's his privacy and I don wanna give enough for it to be researchable, anyway by now she 99.9999% likly to have been pushed into a forced marriage
this is assimilation?
assimilation is no gurantee
hell, just two examples from my college...
(references below to indians refers to a folks from india, not native americans)
here at drexel I can not hang out with the asian crowd or the indian crowd. Reason: I am white.
(and by crowd I mean crowd, they stick to their own, assimilation my ass.)
I can't get a date with an asian, a black, or an indian either. They don't do white men.
(there are rare excepetions with the asians and the blacks. Buh not the indian folks, even non-whites have a hard time catching 'em, I've never seen one that wasn't with another indian)
(yes that was simplified, pls don nitpick)
it does not even happen here, 'the great melting pot', and you expect it to happen in europe? The only thing europe knows how to do is screw up.
#9
i work with alot of immigrant indians and while they are all married to indians they are embracing american culture as well as their own. the few that have been in america most of there lives are pretty much totally americanized, and their children are much more american than they are indian.
An Iraqi Muslim cleric who preached at a mosque outside Paris has been detained for violating a house arrest order, French judicial sources say. Yashar Ali was taken into custody on Monday in Argenteuil, north-west of the French capital. Mr Ali was placed under house arrest in March pending deportation, but police say he never respected the ruling.
"Infidel laws mean nothing to me, I'm a imam. See my turban?"
France believes Mr Ali is a key figure in the Salafist movement, which has a strict interpretation of the Koran. Last month, a court ruled that the Interior Ministry acted illegally by deporting another imam, Abdelkader Bouziane, to his native Algeria. He had been quoted as justifying wife-beating. The authorities are also considering whether to expel Midhat Guler, a Turkish director of a Paris mosque, accused of leading an extremist Islamic movement, AFP news agency reported. Mr Guler has been placed under house arrest pending review of his expulsion order.
I'm sure he'll obey that as well as Yashar did.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/11/2004 8:38:32 AM ||
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. . .deporting another imam, Abdelkader Bouziane, to his native Algeria. He had been quoted as justifying wife-beating.
As weenie the Frenchman is in battle, there is one thing which will get them upset. They get riled when a woman is physically mistreated. However they are only concerned about French women getting mistreated. They think the rest of the women world can go to hell. Witness Iraq.
Victims of dictatorships from Chile to Iraq, people fleeing violence in the Balkans or the Horn of Africa and rebels and separatists from Indonesia or Latin America have for decades found refuge in neutral Sweden. But as even the most law-abiding corners of the globe get dragged into the "war on terror" pitching the United States and its allies against supporters of al Qaeda and Iraqi resistance, Sweden is taking a closer look at some of its foreign guests. The new head of the SAPO security police, Klas Bergenstrand, pulled no punches when he told national radio: "In Sweden too there are people participating in networks whose ultimate goal is to carry out terrorist attacks." SAPOâs head of counter-terrorism, Margarethe Linderoth, told Reuters in an interview that "all terrorist organisations are more or less represented in Sweden with one or more persons".
But while acknowledging that Swedenâs asylum policy and membership of the European Unionâs border-free Schengen zone made it hard to check the flow of people, she said new laws passed in 2003 should help ensure Sweden is "not a safe haven". Recent arrests of suspected Islamic militants in Stockholm and Malmo have brought home the idea that even Sweden, which has not been to war for 200 years and does its best to project an image of compassionate neutrality, is not immune. In a poll by the tabloid Aftonbladet, over 90 percent of 20,000 respondents said "terrorists" were hiding in Sweden. It is one of Europeâs fastest-growing immigrant destinations and among the fifth of the population born abroad or to foreign parents, many are from troubled zones including 70,000 Iraqis and 60,000 Iranians. That makes it easy to find cover, say SAPO.
Gunnar Jervas, terror expert at the Swedish Defence Research Agency, told Reuters that the ethnic mix, generous asylum laws and welfare and "the fact that the police are not on your tail" meant that "in principle Sweden should be a very good country for terror planning purposes. It is entirely reasonable to believe that there could be âsleeping cellsâ here that are planning terror actions abroad." Anders Hellner at the Foreign Policy Institute wrote in a column that Sweden hosted "many groups and cells who support al Qaeda and other similar terror organisations-many more than we know about. Some are very active and willing to take up terrorist methods to reach their political goal".
Sweden has been visited by al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden: a snapshot shows him as a teenager with 22 of his siblings next to a pink Cadillac during a family holiday in Sweden in 1971. Back then in the Cold War NATO outsider Sweden was becoming a favoured guerrilla hideout and in 1988 police discovered that radical Palestinian group Abu Nidal had set up a cell here with an arms cache in a forest near Arlanda international airport. But the vulnerability of Swedenâs "open society", where bodyguards were not needed, was dramatised in 1986 with the murder of Prime Minister Olof Palme and last year when Foreign Minister Anna Lindh was killed by a mentally unstable man. When police arrested four suspected Muslim extremists in April, Swedenâs largest such swoop since the September 11, 2001 attacks on the United States, and a Malmo post-mark showed up on a threat against Thailand for sending soldiers to Iraq, Prime Minister Goran Persson said the "war on terror" had come to Sweden despite its opposition to the U.S.-led war on Iraq. "The fight against terrorism must also take place in Sweden, when it is called for we must not hesitate," Persson said. "Sweden is waking up, at last, to the fact that they have dangerous elements here," observed a Middle Eastern diplomat.
With 400,000 Muslims living in Sweden and the ruling Social Democrats unswerving in their devotion to equality, authorities are careful to avoid offending any ethnic or religious group. "I donât think there is a single Muslim in Sweden who deserves to be called terrorist and nobody with any links to terrorism," said Mahmoud Aldebe, a Muslim community leader. Diplomats from countries involved in long guerrilla wars say Sweden seems keen not to be considered a "safe haven" for rebel groups or supporters. When Palestinian militant group Hamasâs Web site was found in March to be hosted on a server in Sweden, SAPO referred it to prosecutors and the site was taken down. Colombiaâs FARC guerrillas ran their own "news agency", ANNCOL, out of Sweden, until police took unspecified action and it relocated to Denmark. Colombiaâs vice-president, Francisco Santos, told Reuters in Stockholm in March that "there were abuses" but Swedenâs asylum policy had changed. One group eager to see if that is true is the Free Aceh Movement (GAM), seeking independence from Indonesia. Its exiled leaders, based in a Stockholm suburb for 20 years, recently took on lawyers "as a precaution" after Swedish prosecutors went to Indonesia in March to investigate Jakartaâs charges that they were terrorists directing the armed struggle from Sweden. "We are ready for any eventuality. With our people being killed at home we fear nothing, but we believe there is law and justice in Sweden," said GAM spokesman Bakhtiar Abdullah. "We believe that when they find out these people break the law by performing terrorist acts, the Swedish government should know what to do with them," countered an Indonesian diplomat.
Posted by: TS(vice girl) ||
05/11/2004 7:32:48 AM ||
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It's all one paragraph in the original article too.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester ||
05/11/2004 7:43 Comments ||
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"In Sweden too there are people participating in networks whose ultimate goal is to carry out terrorist attacks."
Some people require many strikes from the clue bat before it gets their attention. Consider this just one more to assist them in getting a clue.
It would be funny, watching them have to readjust all their hate-America mindsets, if it wasn't so deadly.
#3
Im going to Sweden in 3 weeks and I cant wait to wear my big BUSH/CHENEY shirt amongst those socialists. I will report on how many times I get spit at.
A Spanish judge formally accused a Moroccan suspect of working with those thought to have carried out the Madrid train bombings, a court official said on Monday.
The phone number of Saed el Harrak, arrested last Thursday, was found in the wreckage of a flat where seven suspects in the attacks blew themselves up on April 3 when cornered by police.
Harrak is thought to have made contact with several of them, the court official said.
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
05/11/2004 1:48:41 AM ||
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A day before the Oklahoma City bombing, Timothy McVeigh walked into a salon with a dark-skinned man who resembled an FBI suspect sketch released early in the investigation, two hairstylists testified at the trial of conspirator Terry Nichols. .... Kathy Henderson, who worked in a hair salon in Junction City, Kan., testified Monday that the sketches of McVeigh and John Doe No. 2 look "almost exactly" like the men who came into the salon together. Tonia Rumbaugh, another employee, said the unidentified man appeared to be Hispanic, with thick, gray-tinged dark hair. McVeigh stood at the door while the other man asked for a haircut, but there were no open appointments, Rumbaugh said. ....
Posted by: Mike Sylwester ||
05/11/2004 1:16:21 PM ||
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Senator âOutraged by Outrageâ at Prison Abuse Talk about large nougahs!
As others condemned the reported abuse of Iraqi prisoners, U.S. Sen. James Inhofe on Tuesday expressed outrage at the worldwide outrage over the treatment by American soldiers of those he called "terrorists" and "murderers." As I promised : politically incorrect
Iâm probably not the only one up at this table that is more outraged by the outrage than we are by the treatment," the Oklahoma Republican said at a U.S. Senate hearing probing the scandal. Senator, you are probably the only one at that table that has a grip on reality.
"These prisoners, you know theyâre not there for traffic violations," Inhofe said. "If theyâre in cellblock 1-A or 1-B, these prisoners, theyâre murderers, theyâre terrorists, theyâre insurgents. Many of them probably have American blood on their hands and here weâre so concerned about the treatment of those individuals." Kennedy, Biden, Daschle, and Kerry forget these facts
In heated remarks at odds with others on the Senate committee who took aim at the U.S. militaryâs handling of prisoners at the Abu Ghraib prison outside Baghdad, Inhofe said that American sympathies should lie with U.S. troops. NOVEL IDEA!
"I am also outraged that we have so many humanitarian do-gooders right now crawling all over these prisons looking for human rights violations, while our troops, our heroes are fighting and dying," he said. Tsk tsk tsk. Politically incorrect again senator. What are we going to do with you?
Inhofe, who visited Iraq in March, is described on his senatorial Web site as a leading conservative voice in the Senate, advocating "common sense Oklahoma values including less government, less regulation, lower taxes, fiscal responsibility and a strong national defense. With all due respect, Senator, those arenât just Oklahoma values.
#1
Sweet--nice to know someone has the courage to stand up and speak his mind. Of course, now there will be the obligatory outrage over the outrage over the outrage, but c'est la vie...
Posted by: Dar ||
05/11/2004 13:29 Comments ||
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Sen. Inhofe is hereby awarded the Brass 'Nads award (thereby circumventing the usual nomination process) for the Most Righteous Nationally Televised Bitch Slap 0f 2004.
Posted by: Rex Mundi ||
05/11/2004 13:31 Comments ||
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Fred - I posted this yesterday, but it didnât go up until close to midnight. Iâm re-posting to give it a wider audience; delete if you want.
By Rich Galen (recently retured from 6 months in Baghdad) - 5/10/04
Yes, I know itâs technically a blog essay, but it needs to be spread over the world.
⢠I am now officially sick-and-tired of the self-serving and largely uninformed hand-wringing about the goings on at Abu Ghraib prison outside of Baghdad. Join the crowd. As someone who has actually been on the grounds of Abu Ghraib prison unlike the media whiners and Congressional handwringers, let me explain a few things.
⢠First of all, there is no excuse for what a few soldiers did; but there is also no reason to make this into the moral equivalent of the Black Plague.
⢠It should be pointed out that the prisoners at Abu Ghraib are not Boy Scouts rounded up for jaywalking. Really? Iâm shocked. Does CBS know? These are bad guys who either blew up or shot a coalition member; or were caught assembling an explosive device; or were caught in a place where the makings of explosive devices were found; or were caught with a cache of weapons. See the pattern here? Anyone with half a brain cell does; guess thatâs why the media and most of the Dems donât.
⢠In short they were trying to kill me and others like me. And if they succeeded in doing that, they were going to come over here and try to kill you. A thought lost on the media "elite," who think their self-important status somehow grants them special donât-kill-me status.
⢠Ugly thought? You bet. But that is the kind of prisoner being held in the terrorist section at Abu Ghraib.
⢠The Roar du Jour Love that phrase; think Iâll steal it from those who want to get into this story by beating their chests over how terrible it all is, keep telling us that this has damaged American credibility in the Middle East. It hasnât; being nice and PC is what damages US credibility in the ME.
⢠Letâs look at that.
⢠First, lots of Arabs donât like us in the first place. Mein Gott! Iâm shocked. Who knew? Those Arabs will not like us any less for this incident.
⢠That dislike has nothing to do with our cultural insensitivities. It has to do with Americaâs refusal to allow those same Arabs, many of whom have been bankrolling the Palestinian terrorists for decades, to wipe the State of Israel off the face of the Earth they way they have wiped it off the face of their maps. Ooo, Rich, you told the truth. The LLL wonât like that.
⢠Second, those who claim that the Abu Ghraib situation will poison the well of American goodwill for decades, are really the ones who are under rating Arabs. They have to believe that all Arabs will assign the actions of perhaps a couple of dozen soldiers to the 280 million Americans who have pledged to help the Iraqis attain security, independence, and prosperity. Which is what the whining handwringers have done; itâs called "projection."
⢠Those making that claim must, therefore, believe that all Arabs have the intellectual capacity of a frog (a real frog, not a French person) and the emotional development of a three-year-old (a real three-year-old, not a French person). Heh-heh. Imaginative Frog-bashing. I love this man.
⢠Finally, our friends on the Left are so very, very concerned about how foreigners (read, Europeans) will see us.
⢠I donât care what the French, the Germans, or the Spaniards think about us. Get in line for that around here, Rich. The French and the Germans are up to their elbows in the fraud and theft of billions of dollars in what is called the Oil-for-Food Program but which was really the Oil-for-Palaces Program. What? Our "closest allies" corrupt? Say it ainât so!
⢠It will be interesting to see if the intellectual elites on the Upper West Side of Manhattan are as upset with their vacation buddies in the Paris 16th as they are with Secretary Rumsfeld when it becomes clear that their pals were fully engaged in the systematic depravation of the people of Iraq. Theyâll pay no attention whatsoever; intentions are all that matters, and everyone knows that the UN has good intentions. (Never mind where that road leads.)
⢠Very often doing the right thing is also the hard thing. The easy thing is to close your eyes to evil; or to make a bargain with the devil. Itâs official; the LLL are easy.
⢠You cannot stop doing the right thing because it is hard, or because you are worried about what those who would make a deal with the enemy in an attempt to rent safety GREAT turn of phrase, might think about you. Listen up, Kerry. This means YOU.
⢠The actions of a few soldiers in Abu Ghraib were wrong. But we cannot allow the spotlight currently shining on them to cast a shadow over the other 135,000 soldiers who are in Iraq doing their jobs professionally, properly, and with honor. Yes. Though the leftist media is doing their damndest to do just that. Theyâre not anti-war; theyâre just on the other side.
Not edited for length. He says so well what Iâve been thinking (along with hoards of others). Rich Galen is a treasure; Iâm glad he made it back home safely.
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut ||
05/11/2004 10:19:11 AM ||
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Sen Inhofe just said the same thing at the hearings!
Posted by: Dave ||
05/11/2004 11:03 Comments ||
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Ranger Rick is f'n badass.
I thoroughly loved his Good Morning Mesopotamia blog journal.
A senior intelligence officer says that U.S. intelligence agencies are creating a new counterintelligence doctrine that will restructure counterspy agencies to focus more on offensive operations and interagency communication. In the past, the official said, the U.S. government has failed to adopt a strategic view of counterintelligence -- using spies and other intelligence techniques to stop foreign spies and terrorists. As a result, the counterintelligence community "is not organized or integrated to accomplish a national mission," leaving the United States vulnerable to foreign policy and public-influence operations, as well as the theft of government and industry secrets
Posted by: Dragon Fly ||
05/11/2004 8:57:07 AM ||
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That's good. It seems to me that all they did was to collect information and more information and more information. To use drugs as an example, t's great to follow the little guy to the drug kingpin - but it seemed to me that they just watched as the drugs became so entrenched that by the time they finally got to the Kingpin - the drug trade was firmly established and the neighborhoods shot, and too many addicts for it to ever go away.
Just watching the bad guys and making charts about whose who in their organizations is useless if you allow the organization to establish roots in the process.
Posted by: B ||
05/11/2004 11:29 Comments ||
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#2
As a result, the counterintelligence community "is not organized or integrated to accomplish a national mission," leaving the United States vulnerable to foreign policy and public-influence operations, as well as the theft of government and industry secrets ...
This is old news. Back in the 1980s Japanese clients would visit our thin films deposition laboratory and brazenly attempt to bring cameras into the facility with them. We knew well enough to place all unrelated supplies or charts out of view but the chutzpah of these wankers was still a bit galling.
Instead of Japan, it's now China who is raping our technology. With all the money at stake, I'm obliged to wonder if there will ever be any significant repercussions for how China is routinely destroying other global economies with its artificially pegged currency, institutionalized intellectual property theft and product counterfeiting.
.... In one case, disclosed last month by the Denver Post, three Army soldiers from a military-intelligence battalion were accused of assaulting a female Iraqi inmate at Abu Ghraib. After an administrative review, the three were fined âat least five hundred dollars and demoted in rank,â the newspaper said. ....
.... on January 13th, a military policeman presented Army investigators with a computer disk containing graphic photographs. The images were being swapped from computer to computer throughout the 320th Battalion. .... One of the first soldiers to be questioned was Ivan Frederick, the M.P. sergeant who was in charge of a night shift at Abu Ghraib. .... Frederick later formally agreed to permit the agents to search for cameras, computers, and storage devices.
On January 16th, three days after the Army received the pictures, Central Command issued a blandly worded, five-sentence press release about an investigation into the mistreatment of prisoners. .... On January 19th, Lieutenant General Ricardo S. Sanchez, the officer in charge of American forces in Iraq, ordered a secret investigation into Abu Ghraib. Two weeks later, General Taguba was ordered to conduct his inquiry. He submitted his report on February 26th. ....
... many senior generals believe that, along with the civilians in Rumsfeldâs office, General Sanchez and General John Abizaid, who is in charge of the Central Command, in Tampa, Florida, had done their best to keep the issue quiet in the first months of the year. ... Secrecy and wishful thinking, the Pentagon official said, are defining characteristics of Rumsfeldâs Pentagon, and shaped its response to the reports from Abu Ghraib. ....
The Pentagonâs impatience with military protocol extended to questions about the treatment of prisoners caught in the course of its military operations. Soon after 9/11, as the war on terror got under way, Donald Rumsfeld repeatedly made public his disdain for the Geneva conventions. Complaints about Americaâs treatment of prisoners, Rumsfeld said in early 2002, amounted to âisolated pockets of international hyperventilation.â
The effort to determine what happened at Abu Ghraib has evolved into a sprawling set of related investigations, some of them hastily put together, including inquiries into twenty-five suspicious deaths. Investigators have become increasingly concerned with the role played not only by military and intelligence officials but also by C.I.A. agents and private-contract employees.
In a statement, the C.I.A. acknowledged that its Inspector General had an investigation under way into abuses at Abu Ghraib, which extended to the death of a prisoner. A source familiar with one of the investigations told me that the victim was the man whose photograph, which shows his battered body packed in ice, has circulated around the world. A Justice Department prosecutor has been assigned to the case. The source also told me that an Army intelligence operative and a judge advocate general were seeking, through their lawyers, to negotiate immunity from prosecution in return for testimony.
The relationship between military policing and intelligence forces inside the Army prison system reached a turning point last fall in response to the insurgency against the Coalition Provisional Authority. âThis is a fight for intelligence,â Brigadier General Martin Dempsey, commander of the 1st Armored Division, told a reporter at a Baghdad press briefing in November. .....
Two months earlier, Major General Geoffrey Miller, the commander of the task force in charge of the prison at Guantánamo, had brought a team of experts to Iraq to review the Army program. His recommendation was radical: that Army prisons be geared, first and foremost, to interrogations and the gathering of information needed for the war effort. âDetention operations must act as an enabler for interrogation . . . to provide a safe, secure and humane environment that supports the expeditious collection of intelligence,â Miller wrote. The military police on guard duty at the prisons should make support of military intelligence a priority.
General Sanchez agreed, and on November 19th his headquarters issued an order formally giving the 205th Military Intelligence Brigade tactical control over the prison. General Taguba fearlessly took issue with the Sanchez orders, which, he wrote in his report, âeffectively made an MI Officer, rather than an MP officer, responsible for the MP units conducting detainee operations at that facility. This is not doctrinally sound due to the different missions and agenda assigned to each of these respective specialties.â .... Taguba noted that Millerâs recommendations âappear to be in conflictâ with other studies and with Army regulations that call for military-police units to have control of the prison system. By placing military-intelligence operatives in control instead, Millerâs recommendations and Sanchezâs change in policy undoubtedly played a role in the abuses at Abu Ghraib. General Taguba concluded that certain military-intelligence officers and civilian contractors at Abu Ghraib were âeither directly or indirectly responsibleâ for the abuses, and urged that they be subjected to disciplinary action.
In late March, before the Abu Ghraib scandal became publicly known, Geoffrey Miller was transferred from Guantánamo and named head of prison operations in Iraq. âWe have changed thisâtrust us,â Miller told reporters in early May. âThere were errors made. We have corrected those. We will make sure that they do not happen again.â
Military-intelligence personnel assigned to Abu Ghraib repeatedly wore âsterile,â or unmarked, uniforms or civilian clothes while on duty. âYou couldnât tell them apart,â the source familiar with the investigation said. The blurring of identities and organizations meant that it was impossible for the prisoners, or, significantly, the military policemen on duty, to know who was doing what to whom, and who had the authority to give orders. ....
One of the employees involved in the interrogations at Abu Ghraib, according to the Taguba report, was Steven Stefanowicz, a civilian working for CACI International, a Virginia-based company. .... Stefanowicz and his colleagues conducted most, if not all, of their interrogations in the Abu Ghraib facilities known to the soldiers as the Wood Building and the Steel Building. The interrogation centers were rarely visited by the M.P.s, a source familiar with the investigation said. The most important prisonersâthe suspected insurgency members deemed to be High Value Detainees â were housed at Camp Cropper, near the Baghdad airport, but the pressure on soldiers to accede to requests from military intelligence was felt throughout the system.
Not everybody went along. A company captain in a military-police unit in Baghdad told me last week that he was approached by a junior intelligence officer who requested that his M.P.s keep a group of detainees awake around the clock until they began talking. âI said, âNo, we will not do that,ââ the captain said. .... The M.I. officer took the request to the captainâs commander, but, the captain said, âhe backed me up. Itâs all about people. The M.P.s at Abu Ghraib were failed by their commandersâboth low-ranking and high,â the captain said. âThe system is brokenâno doubt about it. But the Army is made up of people, and weâve got to depend on them to do the right thing.â
In his report, Taguba strongly suggested that there was a link between the interrogation process in Afghanistan and the abuses at Abu Ghraib. .... One of the most prominent prisoners of the Afghan war was John Walker Lindh, the twenty-one-year-old Californian who was captured in December, 2001. Lindh was accused of training with Al Qaeda terrorists and conspiring to kill Americans. A few days after his arrest, according to a federal-court affidavit filed by his attorney, James Brosnahan, a group of armed American soldiers âblindfolded Mr. Lindh, and took several pictures of Mr. Lindh and themselves with Mr. Lindh. In one, the soldiers scrawled âshitheadâ across Mr. Lindhâs blindfold and posed with him. . . . Another told Mr. Lindh that he was âgoing to hangâ for his actions and that after he was dead, the soldiers would sell the photographs and give the money to a Christian organization.â Some of the photographs later made their way to the American media. Lindh was later stripped naked, bound to a stretcher with duct tape, and placed in a windowless shipping container. Once again, the affidavit said, âmilitary personnel photographed Mr. Lindh as he lay on the stretcher.â On July 15, 2002, Lindh agreed to plead guilty to carrying a gun while serving in the Taliban and received a twenty-year jail term. During that process, Brosnahan told me, âthe Department of Defense insisted that we state that there was âno deliberateâ mistreatment of John.â His client agreed to do so, but, the attorney noted, âAgainst that, you have that photograph of a naked John on that stretcher.â
The photographing of prisoners, both in Afghanistan and in Iraq, seems to have been not random but, rather, part of the dehumanizing interrogation process. The Times published an interview last week with Hayder Sabbar Abd, who claimed, convincingly, to be one of the mistreated Iraqi prisoners in the Abu Ghraib photographs. Abd told Ian Fisher, the Times reporter, that his ordeal had been recorded, almost constantly, by cameras, which added to his humiliation. He remembered how the camera flashed repeatedly as soldiers told to him to masturbate and beat him when he refused. ....
Posted by: Mike Sylwester ||
05/11/2004 12:03:19 AM ||
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#1
"Soon after 9/11, as the war on terror got under way, Donald Rumsfeld repeatedly made public his disdain for the Geneva conventions. Complaints about Americaâs treatment of prisoners, Rumsfeld said in early 2002, amounted to âisolated pockets of international hyperventilation.â "
Really Seymour? Then why not include quotes of Rumsfeld publicly disdaining the Geneva Convention. Should be very easy. Do a Google. I did and I can't find squat. Please provide supporting quotes.
"The photographing of prisoners, both in Afghanistan and in Iraq, seems to have been not random but, rather, part of the dehumanizing interrogation process."
No kidding?
The photograph of Johnny Taliban? That came from CNN! Jeezus.
See Hersch can't confine himself to real incidents of abuse. Doing that wouldn't "widen" the story, which he MUST do to keep it alive.
So he throws in an anecdote about how bad it was to keep prisoners up awake until they talked. The horror!
#2
In all the hoopla, I have yet to see a clear statement from any of the brass concerning what is allowed in relation to deliberately depriving interrogation suspects of sleep, or warmth, or clothing, or food.
Depriving someone of sleep for 24 hours will probably not permanently harm him. Depriving him of sleep for 10 days will undoubtedly kill him.
So - where do you draw the line? 30 hours, 60 hours, 110 hours? Where does "professionally handled disorientation" turn into "abusive torture"?
If you take a prisoner in shorts and a T-shirt, and lock him up in a holding cage, with no warmth - to "soften him up" - where does "prfessional pre-interogation stress" turn into "abusive neglect"? At 20 degrees C for six hours? At 15 degrees C for 20 hours? At -5 degrrees C for a week? At 20 degrees C soaking wet, with a fan blowing?
I remember going through SERE training at Ranger School in 1976 - as a POW in a mock POW camp, run by Ranger Instructors (RI's). No permanent damage - but I'll tell you, that being beaten with a wet towel on the back and buttocks and legs - by a 250 lb Fijian RI - for about 30 strokes, with vigorous effort - that was about the worst beating I've ever received - and it was simply as part of training. Well, I wouldn't take money to go back to that again - but it was part of the training, to prepare for fighting.
Navy SEAL trainees shivering in the cold, early- morning surf at Coronado aren't having much fun either - and it doesn't matter if you are SGT Rock, or how tough you are - when hypothermia is half killing you, only the grit in your soul keeps you going. I remember crawling back and forth through the Ranger School "worm pits" at 3:00 am - and 4:00 am and 5:00 am. 'Not something I'd do to a POW under my control. But I understand the purpose, in the Ranger School context.
So - can prisoner detainees be exposed to the same conditions that we purposefully inflict upon our own elite trainees?
I think that until someone comes out with a REALLY clean standard for what is acceptable, in terms of "softening up" detainees ahead of interrogation, the situation will never be corrected.
It takes balls to simply be the top guy, set clear rules, and then demand compliance. It is cowardly leaders who simply mumble about it being the "repsonsibility of military intelligence" managers - or whatever.
The last thing you do as a member of the chain-of-command is to simply delegate all authority down to the lowest joe (or jane) tentpeg, and let them decide how far to go in "softening up" prisoners.
I don't have all that much sympathy for the "abused" detainees - my guess is that they ones we've seen in the photos weren't very nice people, and probably deserved worse than they got. But - I also understand that a leader can't maintain military discipline if he defers to "law of the jungle" between restrained prisoners and bullying guards.
#3
I deplore those who would say that torture is tough love. Torture is not tough love. Tough love is not torture. I deplore torture even if it is done in the name of tough love. If the American people can't understand my thinking, they can all go to hell. And don't question my resolve to kiss Saudi butt every chance I get.
Posted by: George Wahabi Bush ||
05/11/2004 3:20 Comments ||
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#4
On January 16th, three days after the Army received the pictures, Central Command issued a blandly worded, five-sentence press release about an investigation into the mistreatment of prisoners.
Clearly Centcom should have issued a book-length, over-wrought press release!
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
05/11/2004 7:08 Comments ||
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#5
Recently listened to some Ranger training stories involving long marches, no sleep and cold... having to "cuddle" with "Sgt. Rock" to make it through the night. When the question of "Did you think you were ready to quit?" came up, the response was "Hell NO... I thought they (instructors) might kill me with the cold, but quitting after all that effort was not even in my mind." I was pretty awed by that distinction and really glad, mostly proud, they are on our side.
Muslim leaders in Thailand had joined to denounce recent violence in the Muslim-dominated south, saying it was not jihad (holy war) but works of "religious outcast," local press reported on Tuesday.
Insurgent groups behind the bloody clashes in April were distorting the principle of an Islamic doctrine to mislead Muslim men into fighting against the authorities in the erroneous belief they would go to heaven if killed in action, Waedueramae Mamingji,chairman of Pattaniâs provincial Islamic committee, was quoted by Bangkok Post as saying.
"The groups are inciting teenagers and young men to view soldiers and police as the enemy whom they must vanquish. Their deaths in the fight would be a sacrifice and they would become jihad warriors," Waedueramae said.
More than 100 young men, mostly Muslims, on April 28 simultaneously launched desperate attacks against government places in the southern provinces of Pattani, Yala and Songkhla.
The clashes ended with the government troops taking over the ancient Krue Se mosque holed up by the last batch of insurgents and altogether 113 people were killed in the incident.
Despite the governmentâs repeated declaration that the attacks were neither related to religious conflicts nor international terrorism, local reports running stories indicating the opposite possibility.
Many of the insurgents shielding only machetes reportedly shouted slogans such as "Fighting for the God" while carrying out their attacks.
It was also reported that families of several killed attackers chose not to bathe their sonsâs bodies before funeral ceremonies as local Muslim traditions requiring, indicating they had died fighting a holy war.
However, Waedueramae denied Islam would teach followers to die in such a way or to kill others.
"These people have been lured to believe that they are under a spell and thus are invulnerable and invisible, so they dare hold knives to fight against guns, and were thus killed."
"Itâs a pity that young men have lost their lives this way," he said.
Thailandâs Central Islamic Committeeâs vice chairman Vinai Sama-oon on Sunday also told a gathering of 500 Muslims at a mosque in the south that the Muslims killed on April 28 were not considered jihadis.
A jihadi was one who fought against a religious insult or an attempt to expel Muslims from their land, but in Thailand the constitution already eliminated these conditions because it guaranteed the freedom of religion, he said.
Thai Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra said the latest violence was out of hands of interest groups, Mafia and corrupt politicians, but military and intelligent resources were quoted by local reports as saying there might be separatist groups influence in the violence.
Coming under direct rule of Bangkok only in the year 1902, the kingdomâs deep south community, used to belong to several small sultanates, has relatively remote to the central government and a handful separatists have continuously acted in the region.
With local separatist movement petering out in late 1980âs, the place has been disturbed by sporadic violence created by a handful of remaining separatists grouped with gangsters engaged in drug dealings, weapon smuggling and money laundry.
The region has fallen into spiraling violence since Jan. 4, when armed men simultaneously torched down 20 schools, looted more than 300 weapons and killed 4 soldiers.
Posted by: TS(vice girl) ||
05/11/2004 9:41:34 AM ||
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CAIRO (AP) â A video posted Tuesday on an Islamic militant Web site showed a group affiliated with al-Qaeda beheading an American civilian in Iraq, saying the death was revenge for the abuse of Iraqi prisoners by American soldiers.
The video showed five men wearing headscarves and black ski masks, standing over a bound man in an orange jumpsuit â similar to a prisonerâs uniform â who identified himself as Nick Berg, a U.S. contractor whose body was found on a highway overpass in Baghdad on Saturday.
"My name is Nick Berg, my fatherâs name is Michael, my motherâs name is Susan," the man said on the video. "I have a brother and sister, David and Sarah. I live in ... Philadelphia."
After reading a statement, the men were seen pulling the man to his side and putting a large knife to his neck. A scream sounded as the men cut his head off, shouting "Allahu Akbar!" â "God is great." They then held the head out before the camera.
Berg was a small-business owner from the Philadelphia suburbs, his family said Tuesday.
"For the mothers and wives of American soldiers, we tell you that we offered the U.S. administration to exchange this hostage with some of the detainees in Abu Ghraib and they refused," one of the men read from a statement.
"So we tell you that the dignity of the Muslim men and women in Abu Ghraib and others is not redeemed except by blood and souls. You will not receive anything from us but coffins after coffins ... slaughtered in this way."
The video bore the title "Abu Musab al-Zarqawi shown slaughtering an American." It was unclear whether al-Zarqawi â a lieutenant of Osama bin Laden â was shown in the video, or was claiming responsibility for ordering the execution.
The Web site on which the video was posted is known as a clearing house for al-Qaeda and Islamic extremist groupsâ statements and tapes.
The family of Berg, 26, of West Chester, Pa., said they were informed by the U.S. State Department on Monday that Berg was found dead near a highway overpass in Baghdad.
Bergâs mother, Suzanne Berg, said her son was in Iraq as an independent businessman to help rebuild communication antennas. He had been missing since April 9, she said.
"He had this idea that he could help rebuild the infrastructure," she said.
The U.S. military Tuesday said an American civilian was found dead in Baghdad, but did not release his identity. State Department spokeswoman Susan Pittman said she couldnât release the name of the dead American, but said she not aware of more than one civilian found dead in recent days.
The military said there were signs of trauma to the body. Suzanne Berg said she was told her sonâs death was violent but did not want to discuss details.
Berg, who was in Baghdad from late December to Feb. 1, returned to Iraq in March. He didnât find any work and planned again to return home on March 30, but his daily communications home stopped on March 24. He later told his parents he was jailed by Iraqi officials at a checkpoint in Mosul.
"He was arrested and held without due process," his father, Michael Berg, told the Daily Local News of West Chester recently. "By the time he got out the whole area was inflamed with violence.
The FBI on March 31 interviewed Bergâs parents in West Chester. Jerri Williams, a spokeswoman for the Philadelphia FBI office, told The Philadelphia Inquirer the agency had been "asked to interview the parents regarding Mr. Bergâs purpose in Iraq."
On April 5, the Bergs filed suit in federal court in Philadelphia, contending that their son was being held illegally by the U.S. military. The next day Berg was released. He told his parents he hadnât been mistreated.
The Bergs last heard from their son April 9, when he said he would come home by way of Jordan, Turkey or Kuwait. But by then, hostilities in Iraq had escalated.
Suzanne Berg on Tuesday said she was told her sonâs body would be transported to Kuwait and then to Dover, Del. She said the family had been trying for weeks to learn where their son was but that federal officials had not been helpful. "I went through this with them for weeks," she said. "I basically ended up doing most of the investigating myself."
Posted by: Bill Nelson ||
05/11/2004 1:35:50 PM ||
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#1
Bastards. Expect more chechen-style propaganda videos of beheading, executions and bodies desecration: theses are discretly used as propaganda tools for recruiting pious muslims for the jihad, even here in Europa. The religion of pieces.
#2
Any bets that even as we speak there are Democrat operatives going to Philadelphia to get the family to say something bad about Bush?
Posted by: Bill Nelson ||
05/11/2004 14:19 Comments ||
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#3
Berg's father has already slammed the Bush administration. He even admits he and his son disagreed. Nick Berg, his father says, was a Bush supporter.
"Michael Berg lashed out at the U.S. military and Bush administration, saying his son might still be alive had he not been detained by U.S. officials in Iraq without being charged and without access to a lawyer.
"Nick Berg, a small telecommunications business owner, spoke to his parents on March 24 and told them he would return home on March 30. But Berg was detained by Iraqi police at a checkpoint in Mosul on March 24. He was turned over to U.S. officials and detained for 13 days.
"His father, Michael, said his son wasn't allowed to make phone calls or contact a lawyer.
"FBI agents visited Berg's parents in West Chester on March 31 and told the family they were trying to confirm their son's identity. On April 5, the Bergs filed suit in federal court in Philadelphia, contending that their son was being held illegally by the U.S. military. The next day Berg was released. He told his parents he hadn't been mistreated."
Mr. Berg "blamed the U.S. government for creating the circumstances that led to his son's death." He added "I don't think this administration is committed to democracy."
While I am very sorry for the Berg family's loss, this is misdirected anger. Unless it's Bush, Cheney, Rove, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz under those hoods, the Bush administration is not responsible for Nick Berg's death -- THE F*CKING MURDERING ISLAMOFASCISTS ARE!!!!! And to say that this administration is not committed to democracy while our soldiers and Marines are fighting and dying for just that in Iraq is way off base. God willing, I will never be in the position Mr. Berg is in -- having to bury a murdered child. But if I were, I hope I could direct my anger and aggression at the murderers.
I hope it doesn't come to pass, because his loss is already very great, but based solely on this article, I would not be surprised if Mr. Berg appears in a John Kerry ad or at a rally somwhere. His son's story has all the elements the left loves -- blame for GWB, complaints about civil rights, hatred or disdain for the US military and nary a word of condemnation for Muslim killers.
I pray that Mr. Berg can overcome his grief and think a bit more clearly about who's really responsible for his son's death.
Posted by: Tibor ||
05/11/2004 17:13 Comments ||
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#5
BigEd,
My condolences to his family, but did his father have to sell out the cause his son died for?
Nick Berg, 26, owns a business called Prometheus Methods Tower Service Inc.
His father's endorsement of an ANSWER Call to Action dated March 20 while his son was in Iraq:
Michael S. Berg, Teacher, Prometheus Methods Tower Service, Inc.,
West Chester, PA
Take a look at the top endorsers of ANSWERs Call to Action. None of them would be opposed to the death of his son.
I also urge you to go to hannity.com and watch the Daniel Pearl video as they force him to:
Confess he is of Jew
Parrot Islamic propaganda
Scenes of cutting his head of his dead body
Their demands (including F16s for Pakistan)
Hannity also will link Nick Berg's murder footage. Watch and learn about the evil in their Islamic hearts. Get used to much more of this and harden your hearts. F the bastards and their sick religion.
ANSWER link found via a google search that hit another Free Republic thread.
Posted by: ed ||
05/11/2004 17:28 Comments ||
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Posted by: ed ||
05/11/2004 18:34 Comments ||
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#7
Pill chucken Rush "Oxycontin" Limbaugh already uses Nick Berg on his website.
Be an "Oxycontin DittoHead"! Close your eyes to the VP(what his name) master of redirection and games and focus on fags marrying and Iraq, OK.
DittoHeadDittoHeadDittoHeadDittoHead
#9
When will people realize that our enemies are nothing more than scum. They celebrate cowardly murder. I can only rest assured in my Christian faith that all these people will suffer in Hell. And if this offends muslims, well I just don't care anymore about cultural sensitivity. The muslims need to get it in their heads that if they do not control these people, then we can just eleminate all of them. The day that they set off a nuke in the US is the day that the American people decided that the world no longer needs muslims or arabs.
"Just watched the video. Kill the evil motherfuckers! Allahu Akbar my fucking ass. Allah is a limp dick!
"I want the President to give an Animal House speech -- Zarqawi . . . DEAD! Zawahiri . . .DEAD! Arafat . . . DEAD! Bin Laden . . . ALREADY DEAD!"
Posted by: Tibor ||
05/12/2004 0:40 Comments ||
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#11
These fanatical Muslim death cult lice are constantly boasting of how the long to meet their imaginary moon god, let's make their demented, sick dreams come true as soon as possible.
The absolute revolting horror perpetrated in the al-Qa'ida released video, by jihadic minded savages better wake up even the sell out liberals, since they too are so-called 'infidels'.
Some how, the American government must be able, through advanced tracing technology, track down each and everyone of the animalistic motherfuckers and send them to the location they are already heading, hell!
Posted by: Mark Espinola ||
05/12/2004 1:06 Comments ||
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#12
We talk a lot about the âarab streetâ. Well, let me tell you a little bit about the âAmerican streetâ and what I am angry about:
1) We have 3 CIA agents murdered in Palestine: no one caught or punishedâ¦â¦
2) We have 6 Israelis killed in Gaza, and body snatchers around picking up parts for ransomâ¦â¦..
3) We have, in Iraq, four Americans murdered, mutilated, and their perpetrators not caughtâ¦â¦very good example to the âarab streetâ (they can get away with anything).
4) Now, we have another D. Pearl style atrocity. This time in Iraq. Another American murdered, and to pacify the âarab streetâ lets not say âmumââ¦.
5) We have a military base in Qatar.We also have Al Jazeera not mentioning one word about the beheading of an American.
6) We give Mubarak 2 billion dollars a year in aid of my taxpayerâs money, so his controlled press can continue to attack us. How about giving him 70 % to encourage him to behave more nicely.
7) FINALLY: In the subject of the hypocrisy on the prisoners abuse on Iraq.: I am going to apply for a job as an interrogator in Iraq. Since I was raised to say please and thank you, I should qualify 100% for, what I suspect, will be the new âguidelinesâ for interrogating prisoners. It will go as follows: Please Mr. Muhammad Ali Baba, please please tell me what you know about the beheading of an American in Iraq, please please. I have to tell my superiors that I have said many times pleaseâ¦â¦.
8) As the wife of a Viet Nam veteran, if those American kids go down I also want to see 2 and 3 star generals going down. (We had enough incompetent generals in Nam).There is no way that you could convince the âAmerican streetâ that their behavior was not encouraged from the very topâ¦â¦.S. Hamilton
Posted by: steve ||
05/12/2004 20:03 Comments ||
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#14
It's good to see that there are people out there who don't have their head up their ass. Tibor, I completely agree with you re: Mr. Berg's blame of the Bush admin. Thats a bunch of CRAP!!! If Nick Berg died for anybodys sins...it was the sins of the terrorists of 9-11
Honestly, I'm tired of walking on eggshells with this war. I say nuke the bastards!
Posted by: Mike Sylwester ||
05/11/2004 9:03 Comments ||
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#3
Fascinating article.
I tend to want to believe it... but something is bothering me.
I blame my lack of understanding in foreign politics and diplomacy, but WHY IS THE CURRENT ADMINISTRATION NOT TOOTING IT'S HORN OVER THIS STUFF?
This, UNSCAM, WMDs etc... If it's true, it makes for an EXTRAORDINARY case in favor of the administration's decisions and intelligence. But we hear NOTHING about it.
US-led forces will hand over Saddam Hussein to Iraqi authorities by 30 June, according to a top lawyer in charge of co-ordinating his trial. Salem Chalabi said 100 officials of the former regime, like Tariq Aziz and "Chemical" Ali Hasan Majid, would also be returned ahead of any tribunals.
"They will be transferred to us before the transfer of power," he told reporters in Kuwait. The US-led coalition is to return sovereignty to Iraqis by 30 June. Mr Chalabi, who is in Kuwait to collect evidence against the detainees, said he hoped trials would begin early next year.
"We will put 100 people... including Saddam Hussein, on trial," he said in remarks quoted by the Associated Press news agency. Iraqâs war-crimes tribunal has appointed judges and prosecutors, but no charges have yet been filed. The former Iraqi president is currently being held as a US prisoner of war. Correspondents say international law stipulates that a POW can only be handed over to a sovereign state that has signed up to the Geneva Conventions. Iraq only becomes sovereign on 1 July.
âMost wantedâ
Saddam Hussein has been held at an undisclosed location since his capture by US forces in December and is being interrogated by the CIA and FBI. The International Red Cross has paid two humanitarian visits to check the conditions under which he is being held. Saddam Hussein was the Ace of Spades in the United Statesâ set of playing cards depicting "the most-wanted members of the former Iraqi regime". His cousin, Ali Hasan Majid, was known as "Chemical Ali" for his alleged role in the use of poison gas against Kurds in 1988.
He had earlier been reported killed in a coalition air strike on his house in Basra. Former Deputy Prime Minister Tariq Aziz is accused by Indict - the committee that sought to prosecute the Iraqi leadership for war crimes - of complicity in war crimes against Iran, Kuwait and his own people.
NAJAF : Rebel Shiite cleric Moqtada Sadr offered to end his insurgency in Iraq if the US-led coalition agreed to negotiations, according to leaflets handed out by his office in Najaf.
"I am ready to end everything if the occupation forces officially ask for negotiations on condition that these negotiations are just and transparent and under the stewardship of the Shiite religious authorities," according to a statement signed by him on Tuesday.
So much for fighting to the death
Sadr's Mehdi Army militia has suffered heavy losses during battles with the US-led military during fighting in the capital Baghdad and in southern Shiite cities.
If he is looking for a way out, I'd say they've been chopped to pieces.
Sadr is wanted by the US military in connection with the murder of a rival cleric last year. He has been holed up in the holy Shiite city of Najaf for more than a month where he has issued a series of dire threats against the US forces.
"If I accept or don't accept negotiations, they (the US) are the ones who are escalating the situation and who don't want peace," said the statement.
Ok, I guess we'll just keep fighting then.
"The calls for the Mehdi Army to leave Najaf and other cities are on the order of the biggest villain of them all, (US President George W.) Bush," according to the statement being handed out by supporters outside his office in Najaf.
That's right and he's kicking your ass.
The offer followed a demand by the new provincial governor of Najaf, Adnan al-Zorfi, that Sadr disband his militia. Zorfi also announced he was seeking 4,000 new members of the paramilitary Iraqi Civil Defense Corps to keep the peace in the city.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/11/2004 1:07:57 PM ||
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Bush is a genius. Duh! Post-Occupation Iraq, will be a pro-American government. Duh! The American social-political model is exportable to the Arab savages. Duh! The $300,000,000,000 spent by Bush on nominal counter-terror, has yield good work product. Duh!
Please look in the mirror, and repeat the following with conviction: "The face that I see belongs to a fucking idiot."
Posted by: Man Bites Dog ||
05/11/2004 13:48 Comments ||
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Is it just me, or does it seem like trolls like to drop their spoor on good news? Almost like they don't want anyone to pay attention to it.
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
05/11/2004 15:00 Comments ||
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Marked for trolling and being off-subject, which the subject is al-Sadr crying uncle in what may be a mix of external military pressure with Shia establishment acquiesce and a "counter-resistance" by disgruntled Iraqis in the form of the Thulfiqar Army that's been confirmed to have made war on the Mehdi Army ...
Posted by: Edward Yee ||
05/11/2004 15:04 Comments ||
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#4
The headline should've been "Tater totters."
A future story on his interrogation could be entitled "Tater grilled."
If he gets the electric chair, it'll be "Tater fries."
If Italian troops had attacked Najaf, we might've seen the headline "Tater's forces mashed with garlic" -- but, sadly, that won't happen now.
Posted by: Mike ||
05/11/2004 15:43 Comments ||
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Six Israeli soldiers are dead after their armored personnel carrier drove over a 100-kilogram explosive planted under the road in Gaza. Hamas terrorists gleefully displayed and played with the body parts in front of cameras. "Just desperate, oppressed people fighting back the only way they can"---lefty asshelmet.
In response, an Israel Air Force missile bombed a target in Gaza this afternoon, killing one and wounding three.
Cause -> Effect...
Prime Minister Sharon has called an urgent mini-security cabinet meeting for this evening at 8:30 PM. This morningâs attack that killed the six soldiers occurred towards the conclusion of a heavy battle waged in spurts in the Zeitun neighborhood of Gaza City. IDF forces entered the city on a mission to locate and blow up explosives labs, destroying at least two of them; several others of the 20 suspected labs were also located. The forces include combat helicopters, jeeps, bulldozers, and tanks, and additional forces were later brought in. Cycle of violence: just stop blowing up bomb factories and they will stop making bombs. Errr....
The Israeli forces remained in the area for longer than planned in a tireless effort to rescue the bodies. The families of the six have been notified, though their names have not yet been released for publication. The identification process took a long while, as the bodies were in very bad condition, and not all the body parts were found. The destroyed vehicle, which had a capacity of 12 soldiers but was carrying only six, was carrying large amounts of explosives. Two news agencies transmitted video from the scene showing Gaza Arabs dancing in the streets with pieces of the destroyed IDF vehicle and the dead soldiersâ body parts. Hamas has claimed responsibility for the murderous attack. IDF soldiers encircled the homes of terrorists during todayâs battle, and killed 3-5 Arabs - two Hamas terrorists and a Fatah terrorist leader. One IDF soldier was wounded lightly in an earlier clash of the battle, following which Israeli forces returned fire. The IDF, responding to promptly raised questions as to the wisdom of ground operations of this nature, said that it chose not to attack from the air in order not to incite BBC and Al Reuters endanger the civilian Arab population on the ground. Similar operations to find and destroy weapons-producing factories have proved very successful. The Jewish town of Netzarim, a few kilometers to the south, is closed off. The army is not allowing any entry or exit from the town, and the residents are left to hear the sounds of the battle.
Reactions:
* Finance Minister Binyamin Netanyahu said that Israel must fight its war against terrorism "with no connection" to the diplomatic issues, while at the same time finding ways to keep its soldiers safe. He said that the murderous attack today was not at all related to the disengagement plan.
* MK Aryeh Eldad (National Union) called upon the Prime Minister to order the Air Force to bombard the terrorist infrastructures in Gaza, and "not to endanger IDF soldiers for no reason."
* MK Yossi Sarid (Meretz) said that todayâs victims were in vain.
* MK Ehud Yatom (Likud) called for another Operation Defensive Shield, this time in Gaza.
Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy ||
05/11/2004 10:56:12 AM ||
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If the IDF Yassined these pieces of human feces while celebrating, they could dance with the virgins.
Reuters. EFL.
Hundreds of Iraqis marched in Najaf Tuesday calling on militant cleric Moqtada al-Sadr to withdraw his fighters from the Shiâite holy city. It was the biggest and most public display yet of mounting local exasperation with an uprising launched last month against the U.S. occupation and follows a U.S. crackdown on Sadrâs Mehdi Army, which says it plans to open up new fronts in its war.
Posted by: Mike ||
05/11/2004 9:30:21 AM ||
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Get the F outta here, Sadr, and take your scumbags with you. We want to live or lives, and you are in the way.
JPost - Reg Reqâd
IDF forces are combing the Zeitun neighborhood in the Gaza Strip for body parts of six soldiers killed Tuesday morning when their armored personnel carrier was struck by a Palestinian explosive device at the end of an operation to seek and destroy arms-manufacturing factories
A security official quoted on Army Radio said that Israel will not negotiate for the return of the body parts if they are in fact in the hands of terrorists. great - the animals Paleos are holding body parts hostage?
The six Givati soldiers were securing engineering corps forces in an operation mounted Monday night in the Zeitoun neighborhood.
An army official told Army Radio that the operation had been executed by land forces to avoid harming innocent lives. Earlier Tuesday, foreign affairs and defense committee chairman Dr. Yuval Steinitz had said that Israelâs caution was costing dear lives. True - time to attack a car swarm or two? Send the roaches scurrying with their bloody hands and body parts?
A senior army officer told reporters that the armored personnel carrier exploded as troops began to pull out of the area, when it drove over a bomb detonated by terrorists.
He said the APC contained 100 kilograms of explosives that were to be used by the soldiers to blow up factories used to manufacture rockets and mortars. The armored vehicle was blown to bits by the force of the blast he said.
Due to the denseness of the area and the heavy gunfire, IDF forces were reported having difficulty in evacuating the bodies, prompting the need for reinforcements.
IDF forces have isolated the area where the detonation occurred, and are still under heavy Palestinian gunfire. Following the incident, extra troops were deployed in the area and are conducting house to house searches for the soldiersâ body parts as other soldiers set up positions on rooftops. sounds like gunship time - level the area fireâs coming from? Iâm sure Iâm not the first to think of that, thoâ....
The IDF officer was unable to confirm reports by the Hamas, who claim to have in their possession body parts of some of the soldiers and vowed that troops will not leave the area until all the bodies are recovered.
He said the Zeitoun neighborhood in Gaza is a known Hamas and Islamic Jihad stronghold and that the operation to demolish the factories was planned several weeks ago. He noted that the terrorists were prepared and waited for the entry of the troops into the area, something that cannot be avoided as locals spot the entry of tanks and APCâs involved in such operations he said.
The Hamas military wing, Izzadin al-Kassam claimed responsibility for the explosion, saying it had filmed Israelis evacuating their casualties from the scene.
Al-Arabiya reported that Al-Quds Brigades, the military wing of the Islamic Jihad, and the Al-Aqsa Martyrsâ Brigade, which is affiliated to Palestinian leader Yasser Arafatâs Fatah movement, have also claimed responsibility for the bombing of the APC.
The army has divided Gaza into three parts, and has closed the Karni-Netzarim road, and the Karni crossing to prevent the passage of Palestinians in and out of the Zeitoun area.
Earlier, one soldier was lightly wounded when a bulldozer ran over a mine. The mine was dressed as an ISM activist?
According to Palestinian reports seven armed Palestinian gunmen, including a senior Hamas member, were killed. tag em and bag em
Some 50 Palestinians were wounded in the fighting, including eight who were in critical condition, Palestinian doctors said. Among the wounded was an 11-year-old boy with a head wound who was placed on life support.
IAF helicopters fired missiles into a number of weapons factories in the area used by terrorist organizations to manufacture Kassam rockets and mortars.
During the operation 20 factories used to manufacture rockets and mortars were demolished. thatâll hurt the Paleo industrial output figures for the quarter
The IDF operation is part of ongoing raids conducted by IDF forces in the Gaza Strip to damage the terrorist infrastructure, which began after the targeted killings of Hamas leaders Sheikh Ahmed Yassin and his successor Abdul Aziz Rantissi.
The last operation in the Zeitoun neighborhood was in January, when Shimshon infantry troops killed nine Palestinians in a one-day operation.
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/11/2004 10:04:27 AM ||
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Here is a main difference between the Jews and the Moslems. The God of the Jews says that in the above circumstance, body parts or no, there is no lessening of those who died, or any rewards in the afterlife.
However the god of the Moslems is resolute. Get blown up with pigfat - tough luck. Down to the lower regions you go, with the man with horns and a red suit. Doesn't matter how you lived your life. You are toast.
The Australopithecae don't understand this. The IDF would like to have the remains, but it has no effect on the souls of the soldiers.
(No - I'm not Jewish, but I sometimes listen to Dennis Prager, and he will give a non-Jew a personal insight into the way Jews view stuff)
#2
the Paleos have been watching the official conservative Jews who go around after the booming to collect the parts strewn (you've all seen them in photos). The Jews believe it is their duty to bury the bodies as whole as possible, but I don't see bargaining for bits as a viable negotiation. The Paleos totally misunderstand civilized cultures
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/11/2004 11:19 Comments ||
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At least eight Palestinians were injured yesterday in the center of Nablus when a gunfight broke out between Hamas and Fatah activists. It is believed to be the first incident of its kind since the start of the intifada.
Let's hope it continues
The gunfight took place against the backdrop of elections to the student council of the Open Al-Quds University, based in the city's Rafadiyeh neighborhood.
Cheerleader tryouts must end with artillery duels if the nerds on the student council have gunfights.
Palestinian sources said it began as a brawl between Hamas activists, who were looking to set up a campaign booth on the university grounds, and Fatah youth, who wanted to stop them. The brawl and shouting match soon turned into a knife fight, the sources said, adding a large group of Fatah activists then arrived on the scene and set fire to furniture and office equipment belonging to Hamas and Islamic Jihad opposition groups on campus. Shortly thereafter, the gunfight began.
It's nice to see students taking such a interest in school.
Four of the injured sustained gunshot and knife wounds and were evacuated to city hospitals.
Let's pray for a nasty infection.
Later in the day, the sources said, senior Fatah and Hamas officials intervened in an effort to restore calm. The university's administration published a leaflet condemning the violence. Before and during the intifada, there have been a number of armed clashes between members of Hamas's military wing and the Palestinian security forces, primarily in Gaza. However, Fatah and Hamas activists, despite their differences, have always shied away from taking up arms against one another.
At least, in any way that can be proven
Some six months ago, Palestinian sources reported a number of clashes between Hamas and Islamic Jihad student activists and their Fatah counterparts at various universities in the West Bank. These incidents, however, did not end in firefights.
Humm, I've got to go to the store. I'm running out of popcorn.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/11/2004 9:20:42 AM ||
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posted another example of Paleo "peace and love on the path to the eradication of Israel Roadmap" but it's trapped in Editor-Limbo apparently
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/11/2004 10:11 Comments ||
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Steve - contact me; I've already called dibs on the popcorn concession. :-p
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut ||
05/11/2004 10:37 Comments ||
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Interresting. Arguing who hates the "joooos" more.
The trial next week of an American military policeman on charges of mistreating Iraqi detainees at Abu Ghraib prison is likely to disappoint people eager for a thorough airing of the available evidence. It may also frustrate those who would like to see tough punishment should his guilt be established.
Both the speed with which the policeman, Specialist Jeremy Sivits, has been brought to trial and the relatively minor sanctions he faces suggest that prosecutors are working their way up the chain of culpability from the bottom. These factors also suggest that Specialist Sivits has entered into a plea agreement in exchange for his testimony at later trials. Six other soldiers are also facing criminal charges in the abuse and humiliation of Iraqi prisoners at Abu Ghraib.
"They've probably got a domino theory of prosecutions," said John D. Hutson, the dean of the Franklin Pierce Law Center and a former judge advocate general of the Navy. "And there may be a race to the courthouse among the potential defendants to see who can get the best deal."
If there is a plea agreement, it is likely that only limited evidence, relevant to the appropriate punishment, will be presented. "The facts are probably not going to be aired at the first trial," said Michael F. Noone Jr., a law professor at Catholic University and an expert in military justice. "Critics of the administration are going to say there is a cover-up here."
Sound prosecutorial strategy, then, in the short term at least, may frustrate the administration's stated goal of showing the world that the proceedings will be transparent. The trial of Specialist Sivits is set to start on May 19. Trials of the six other American soldiers have not been scheduled. Seven other soldiers who held supervisory roles have received letters of reprimand.
Specialist Sivits will be tried in a somewhat streamlined proceeding known as a special court-martial, as opposed to a general court-martial. The most notable feature of special courts-martial is that the maximum penalty is not particularly severe. At worst, Specialist Sivits faces a year in confinement, a demotion, fines and a bad-conduct discharge.
Even so, the speed of his case has surprised some experts. "It's clearly attributable to the need to respond domestically, internationally and within Iraq to the demand for justice," said Miles P. Fischer, the chairman of the Committee on Military Affairs and Justice of the Association of the Bar of the City of New York. "It potentially compromises the rights of the accused because of what I'm sure his defense counsel will call a rush to judgment."
Others said the speed of the proceedings was unremarkable. While the abuses came to light only recently, they said, investigations into them have been under way for some time. "The military tries its cases very quickly," said Lee D. Schinasi, a law professor at the University of Miami School of Law and a former vice dean at the Army Judge Advocate General's School in Charlottesville, Va. "We don't have the crowded docket problems or scheduling problems with private practitioners." Mr. Hutson said the nature of the case might account for the pace. "It's not really a terribly complicated case," he said. "You've got pictures, for God's sake."
Holding the trials in Iraq rather than in the United States is also unremarkable, legal experts said. "It is not at all unusual to conduct courts-martial in the theater of operations," said Ronald W. Meister, a New York lawyer who served in the Judge Advocate General's Corps in the Navy. Mr. Meister said about 25,000 courts-martial were held in Vietnam. Holding trials near the scene of the crime also makes it easier to secure evidence and testimony, he added. Those accused in the military justice system are entitled to military lawyers provided by the government, and they may retain civilian lawyers at their own expense. In most other ways, courts-martial mirror the rules of procedure and evidence used in criminal trials in the federal courts. Except for uniforms, Professor Schinasi said, "it would be invisible to you which was a civilian trial and which was a military trial."
The military has emphasized that the trials will be open to the news media and the public, though not to electronic coverage. None of that is unusual. On the other hand, it is the rare trial that is held, as Specialist Sivits's will be, in the Baghdad convention center. "There's public and there's public," Mr. Fischer said. "They don't normally hold them in convention centers and print out fliers."
The exceptionally public nature of the trial, coupled with the certainty of no more than mild punishment and the possibility of none at all, may create public relations problems. But there is no prospect, legal experts agreed, that the American authorities would allow the accused soldiers to be tried before an Iraqi or international court. "Some of these offenses are arguably war crimes," Mr. Hutson said, "but there is no chance that the United States is going to turn this over to a system of justice other than our own."
That is particularly true in Iraq, Mr. Fischer said. "Occupying powers don't have their troops tried by the occupied country," he said. "That's not how it works." The case against Specialist Sivits is, of course, only the beginning.
"The more important question is, Where does this end?" Mr. Hutson said. "If this ends with a staff sergeant, and everyone else goes home with a chestful of medals, then we've got problems."
For the NYT, this is a remarkably balanced article.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/11/2004 9:09:33 AM ||
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While many detainees were quickly released or no longer mistreated after interrogation, high-ranking officials in Saddam Husseinâs government - including those listed on the U.S. militaryâs deck of cards - were held for months in solitary confinement, The Associated Press has learned. Oh you mean the guys who were mass murderers, rapists and mamers were forced to spend a lot of time naked in a dark cement cell? Poor babies.
The report said some coalition military intelligence officers estimated "between 70 percent and 90 percent" of the detainees in Iraq "had been arrested by mistake(?). How does some mush headed Swiss bureaucrat define mistake?
They also attributed the brutality of some arrests to the lack of proper supervision of battle group units." They are not going to talk about soldiers get a might ticked at being shot at before they capture the a-holes, and have to use force to subdue them. Of course this Swiss paper-shuffler never had to deal with street gangs. This is unlike some of the reservists, who are normally cops in civilian life. Geez. If those damn dirty 13 in Abu Ghraib prison has not been so foolish, this guy would have been ignored. But extracting information about WMDs is irrelevant to him. It is unlikely that Sarin Gas will be used on Berne, Geneva, or Zurich. . . .for awhile.
Posted by: BigEd ||
05/11/2004 1:02:38 AM ||
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#1
I see he has the same fear of razors that Ryan Seacrest has. Kraehenbuehl, out!
#2
Until the ICRC admits the Mogen Adom David, they should be noted as the bigoted antisemitic whorehouse they've become. I see no outrage and condemnation of the use of Red Crescent ambulances for transpoting fighters and arms...
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/11/2004 10:42 Comments ||
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#3
Give to the Salvation Army, not the Red Cross. They do a better job with less publicity seeking and don't charge GIs for coffee or doughnuts.
Posted by: Mr. Davis ||
05/11/2004 11:43 Comments ||
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ICRC Sees American Abuse as Catastrophic, Saddahmâs as Inconsequential
BAGHDAD (AFP) - The US military estimates less than 1,000 members of the Mehdi Army militia of radical Shiite cleric Moqtada Sadr are fighting from their Baghdad stronghold, using women and children as human shields. "I donât think itâs a thousand, itâs probably not a hundred," Brigadier General Jeffrey Hammond, a deputy commander of the 1st Cavalry Division, told AFP about the size of the rebel clericâs army in the slum of Sadr City. In fact, Hammond was betting on bleeding Sadrâs organisation dry even in the district named after his family following last yearâs downfall of president Saddam Hussein. "Certainly when we kill 35 people, those numbers impact on the overall effectiveness of the organisation," he told AFP.
The general was speaking after a turbulent 24-hour period that followed the 1st Cavalry Divisionâs arrest in Sadr City of Amir al-Husseini, considered the right-hand man of Sadr.
Thirty-five Sadr militiamen were killed in the running battles that kicked off Sunday morning after Husseiniâs arrest Saturday in Sadr City and climaxed pre-dawn Monday as teams of four to six men fired off small arms and rocket-propelled grenades (RPG) at US troops. The fighting Monday lasted from midnight to 4 am and saw US forces come under sniper and RPG fire eight times.
"We moved through the town. We used calibrated precision fire to kill them. We eliminated them. They were operating in four-to-six man teams."
"Eliminated" is good.
In the heat of battle, on Sunday, the guerrillas running through the sewage-strewn streets were using "human shields", he charged. "As we were moving through we were engaged by RPG gunmen hidden behind women and children ... Thatâs the way the enemy fights."
Since Sadrâs army kicked off its rebellion on April 4 and killed eight US soldiers in Baghdad, the clericâs militia has laid low in the capital. But the arrest of Husseini on Saturday was a rallying cry for the fundamentalist army, whose fertile recruiting grounds are the abject warrens of Sadr City.
"I think it was their reaction to our action. They were attempting to exert their influence in Sadr City," Hammond said about the sudden spike in violence.
The clashes climaxed with the decision early Monday to flatten Sadrâs Baghdad offices with tank fire. "We eliminated the militia from the building and destroyed the building. It was a reminder that we were not going to let them dictate the terms to the good people" of Sadr City, Hammond said.
Although the army arrested Husseini while Sadr himself is isolated in the central holy city of Najaf surrounded by a ring of US troops, Hammond conceded the Mehdi Army has not been eliminated. "Sadr still has an organised command structure to a degree. He retains an organised command and control structure that we continue to deal with," the general said.
Despite Sadrâs allure to the masses, based on his fatherâs death in 1999 at the hands of Saddamâs regime, Hammond was betting people were not happy with the chaos and the young clericâs call for revolt. Sadr is wanted by the Americans for the murder of a rival cleric last year in Najaf. "They are tired. They donât like the collateral damage and their streets littered with combat debris," the general said.
A key to Hammondâs strategy is the freeing up of millions of dollars to repair the infrastructure in Sadr City. The 1st Cavalry Division is set to start spending 140 million dollars on both Sadr City and Baghdadâs Rashid district to improve the sewage system, the water supply and electricity. The money is expected to create thousands of jobs. Envisioning Sadr City in a full-swing renaissance and the effect it would have on the Mehdi Army, Hammond suggested: "These people are going to be less apt to pick up an AK-47" assault rifle.
Posted by: ed ||
05/11/2004 8:04:15 AM ||
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"In the heat of battle, on Sunday, the guerrillas running through the sewage-strewn streets were using "human shields", he charged. "As we were moving through we were engaged by RPG gunmen hidden behind women and children ... Thatâs the way the enemy fights."
Allah is proud as his fighters rely on the moral principles of the infidels to inhibit their fire. The murder of innocent people through suicide bombs guarantees martydom, but when one of the shields is a casualty, there is "rage" in the streets. Our soldiers are deterred by shields, while their intent, their goal is to murder the innocent and defenseless. It's the difference between the good guys and the bad guys. It's not that complicated, and that is what drives the so called intellectuals crazy.
Posted by: Rock ||
05/11/2004 11:15 Comments ||
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Rock, it aint politicly correct to boil it down to good guys and bad guys. That don't recognize all the subtleties of the situation. You see, them people is just poor and misunderstood, and its all cause we done it to them.
Don't worry though, you makin that simplistic argument don't drive me crazy.
#3
Use a human shield? Lose the top of your head - Sniper's law
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/11/2004 11:37 Comments ||
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#4
"In the heat of battle, on Sunday, the guerrillas running through the sewage-strewn streets were using "human shields", he charged. "As we were moving through we were engaged by RPG gunmen hidden behind women and children ... Thatâs the way the enemy fights."
Who cares... some guard farted in the presence of a detainee in prison.... what humiliation... we better call for Rummy's resignation over it...
Until the military can produce proof (as in pictures or videos) on these 'human shields' nobody will take these accusations seriously.
#5
Didn't al-Sadr start with 2,500 fighters, and now there is less than 100?
Hmm - 2,400 x 72 =. . . . Dang that's over 170,000 virgins!
Take no prisoners. The ones we have are causing a lot of trouble, and want to come here and be constituents of any number of Democrat Senators and Congressmen.
#6
that sadrs guys are bad guys aint complicated at all. Its how to deal with Sistani thats complicated. What to do about the fact that blasting in through Najaf can create problems for Sistani, among Iraqi Shiites who dont much like Muqty, but who dont hate him enough to want to blow up the shrine of Hussein to get him. Thats complicated.
But picking off the thugs when they raise their heads, thats dangerous work for our troops, but not politically or morally complicated, I agree. Our troops have done a good job of precision attack in Sadr City, Najaf, and Karbala. Hats off to our troops!
#7
BigEd - thats less than 100 in BAGHDAD. See what he did was move most of his fighters from Baghdad to the southern cities of Najaf, Karabala, etc. Which looks pretty damn stupid, considering his base of support is in the Shiite slums of Baghdad.
3 possibilities
1. Hes really dumb
2. He thought that once his fighters were there, all the Shiites of Najaf, Karbala, etc would rally around him - see 1.
3. He realized that even in his base the local civilians werent wild about him, and that US strategy of seperating moderates from hostiles, etc would work. Therefore he went to the holy cities where he has two advantage A. the sensitivity wrt to the mosques B. Lots of IRANIAN "pilgrims". He still left behind some fighters in Baghdad, for when the "intifada" went national. Of course it hasnt, and now our troops in Baghdad are picking off the leftovers.
A Dutch soldier was killed and another injured in a grenade attack Monday night in the southern Iraq city of Samawah where Japanese troops have also been deployed, local security officials said. They were the first casualties among the Dutch troops deployed in the city for Iraqâs reconstruction. Dutch politicians call it a catastrophe, itâs just a matter of time now and the Dutch make their blitz exit.
Posted by: Murat ||
05/11/2004 6:43:00 AM ||
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Not as fast as the Turks fled Messopotamia, Arabia, Transjordan, and Syria.
Free Constantinople from Seljuk occupation. Liberate Kurdistan.
Posted by: ed ||
05/11/2004 7:16 Comments ||
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#2
How about Troj, that one we have occupied too, oh right I forgot you sent your national hero (Brad Pit) to liberate.
Well seems that Iraqis changed their tactics, scaring of the allies, let see Spain, Dominican republic, Honduras done, next to follow: the Netherlands, Japan, Bulgaria, Poland.... Blair
Posted by: Murat ||
05/11/2004 7:54 Comments ||
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#3
The Greeks can have Troy. I hear the Olympic construction is just a cover for some equine building project.
Posted by: ed ||
05/11/2004 8:25 Comments ||
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#5
Oh no, not Honduras! We can't hold the Unilateral Coalition together without Honduras.
Posted by: Homer ||
05/11/2004 8:28 Comments ||
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#6
Bulldog,
Yeah buddy, that means ofcourse if the Greeks can finish their olympic stadion in time
Posted by: Murat ||
05/11/2004 8:59 Comments ||
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#7
sorry to dissapoint ya Murat, doesnt look like the dutch are running away from where I am sitting (In Holland)
Posted by: Evert V. in NL ||
05/11/2004 9:42 Comments ||
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#8
Maybe not yet but soon probably, when was your parliament going to decide whether the mission is going to be prolonged Evert V., and what will the decission be when the danger in samawah grows? I have nothing personal against the Dutch but I don't think they are very brave militarily or maybe they don't accept casualties and rather pull back.
Posted by: Murat ||
05/11/2004 10:07 Comments ||
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#9
Murat: with the current government in place, there is not a chance that the troops will be pulled out, and we have no elections coming up so no jihadi-enforced regime change here.
I think the Dutch will surprise ya yet.
Posted by: Evert V. in NL ||
05/11/2004 10:11 Comments ||
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#10
I suspect the Dutch honor their alliances better than the Turks.
(Did I say that out loud?)
Posted by: Robert Crawford ||
05/11/2004 10:14 Comments ||
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#11
Besides, where do you get your information about: "Dutch politicians call it a catastrophe" from? There's certainly nothing like that in the news here.
Posted by: Evert V. in NL ||
05/11/2004 10:14 Comments ||
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#12
Continue on Evert
BBC: Prime Minister Jan-Peter Balkenende and Defence Minister Henk Kamp have cut short foreign trips to return to Amsterdam for consultations. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3703341.stm
Canceling foreign trips at the first casualty? What when more casualties occur, or let me ask it this way, how many soldiers are the Dutch prepared to sacrefise (personally I think that number is not that high)
Posted by: Murat ||
05/11/2004 10:14 Comments ||
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#13
they took the opportunity not to stab us in the back, unlike the unfaithful Turks. Watch your backs here, RB'ers
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/11/2004 10:24 Comments ||
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#14
Oh that, Jan-Peter Balkenende is a public relations disaster, he means well but for some reason always manages to pubicly overreact to things.(very bad spin-doctors)
With te level of training our troops recieve nowadays, I dont think there will be much sacrificing done on our side, but only time will tell.
Posted by: Evert V. in NL ||
05/11/2004 10:24 Comments ||
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#15
And Evert
About 57 percent of Dutch respondents to the most recent poll think the country's troops can't stay in Iraq ``under the present circumstances.'' That figure rose to 67 percent of respondents in the case of a direct attack on Dutch soldiers. http://quote.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000087&sid=a03HhFPq1hag&refer=top_world_news
Posted by: Murat ||
05/11/2004 10:28 Comments ||
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#16
A large portion of the problems we are currently experiencing in Iraq are a DIRECT result of the Turkish betrayal and treachery. It is as bad, arguably worse, than that of France.
ON the evening of April 12, we received fresh orders to move south, link up with regimental combat team 7 and redeploy to near Fallujah. We were to assist other 1st Division troops to secure some of the trouble areas and main roads around the town in an operation called ``Ripper Sweepââ.
We moved to Al Asad, about 150km to the north of Fallujah. We used it as a staging area in preparation for the operation. We moved to clear all roads to the west of Fallujah. Artillery fired over our heads, fixed-wing and rotary-wing aircraft were attacking (insurgent) positions.
It was almost like the war all over again. We were prepared for a big fight as we moved through. Our force was so large and must have appeared so daunting for the enemy that they fled in front of us, abandoning their positions.
We met little resistance on the opening day. There was one close call when a roadside bomb exploded near a humvee. Luckily, nobody was seriously injured. Over the next few days we searched every house and questioned every male of military age. Some were detained for further questioning.
We found and cleared many roadside bombs along all the roads we covered. We moved further south to cordon the town of Ash Amerya. The town had a population of about 25,000 people. I thought that it was an insurgent stronghold feeding fighters to Fallujah.
We searched the town without incident and re-established law and order. It was assessed that, once again, the enemy had fled the town before we arrived. This was of some concern because it meant that they were able to gain early warning of our movements.
I went with the CO to a bridge at the western entrance of Fallujah. It was like a scene out of World War II. Marines in heavily fortified sandbag bunkers guarded the bridge. The sounds of battle were all around.
It reminded me of when we were preparing to move into Baghdad nearly a year before. I realised that this bridge was the one that (US) civilian contractorsâ bodies had been hung off after being dragged through the streets by a mob of barbaric young men.
My blood boiled as I realised this was what started the whole thing in the first place. Now, people were dying in there. All because of some evil desire to kill Americans and for some hollow cause (if any at all). Marine losses were the highest they had been since our return. That thought angered me as I pondered where all this was going. . . .
Appears to be one article in a continuing series.
Posted by: Mike ||
05/11/2004 6:37:05 AM ||
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#2
The Aussies know that when the day comes that they have to stand against Indonesia that there are only two countries in the world that will stand with them, America and Britain.
The shattered streets of Grozny emptied yesterday as local people feared an imminent crackdown. On the road from the west, groups of gunmen gathered at intersections, some crouched in the firing position.
At the stadium where President Akhmad Kadyrov was killed investigators were milling around a huge hole in the grandstand.
Above the entrance the words "Celebration of Victory Day" were still written. Kadyrov had been watching a parade to mark VE Day, one of Russia's most important holidays.
As elsewhere in the city, there was tension and foreboding. At Hospital No 9, where victims of Sunday's bombing had been taken, a group of gunmen were lounging outside.
On the third floor lay Tamara Dadasheva, Chechnya's leading female singer, who had been singing the moment the bomb exploded. Her right leg was bandaged and her left arm in splints.
"I can't tell you anything about the ceremony at all," she said, clearly terrified.
In the small market opposite there was genuine dismay at the assassination of the president. "It's a tragedy," said Tamara, 62, who was selling medical supplies. "Things were getting better, they were beginning to pay pensions."
Aishat, 48, who was selling food and drinks, said: "Now things are almost certain to get worse." But the men that gathered to listen were less sure. One man said: "Everybody is scared to talk freely. You can just get picked up and dragged away."
Four years after the Chechen war officially ended, the city had barely begun to live, even before yesterday's attack. Even when there is no shooting, most people live like rats in the ruins.
Tuberculosis is rife and medicine in short supply. For most the only wage to be had is in working for the pro-Moscow administration, a move regarded as treachery by the rebels.
In almost every street men lounge with Kalashnikovs - some Russian soldiers, some Chechen policemen, others freelancers who have thrown in their lot with the pro-Moscow regime.
Some say that despite the parlous state of affairs things had improved a little in the last year. The number of both kidnappings and murders has fallen slightly. The infamous Russian zachistki or security sweeps when whole villages were shelled, herded together and beaten or killed have been replaced by more targeted torture and killings.
Some Chechens saw Kadyrov as the best of a bad lot - certainly more popular than the Islamic rebel group led by Shamil Basayev who has been blamed with his assassination and whom most Chechens hate for his hard-line Wahhabi stance.
Ruslan, 54, who works for the state oil company in Grozny, said: "I have a family to feed and at least I get a wage now which is better than before when I had to work for free. Things are bad but they are better than during independence."
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
05/11/2004 1:58:06 AM ||
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The pro-Moscow president of Chechnya, Akhmad Kadyrov, was buried yesterday as Russian security services hunted the audacious killers who derailed the Kremlin's plans to pacify the region.
Attack helicopters swept overhead and soldiers stood guard as Kadyrov's body, covered by a traditional woollen shroud, was carried through his village of Tsentoroi.
His son Ramzan, the thuggish leader of a widely feared private army, was one of the pallbearers and later was appointed Chechnya's deputy prime minister.
Sappers combed the route taken by thousands of mourners to the local cemetery and a military signal-jamming vehicle countered the danger of remote-controlled bombs.
Armed police were posted every 100 yards along one of the main roads through Chechnya to protect officials attending the funeral.
"In general, the situation in the republic is under the control of law-enforcement bodies and federal forces," said General Mikhail Pankov, the newly appointed head of Russian troops in Chechnya. He has taken over from Gen Valery Baranov, who was one of 21 people still in hospital yesterday. He was in a serious but stable condition after having a leg amputated. "He's badly injured but says he wants to continue serving in the army, and in Chechnya too," said Gen Vyacheslav Tikhomirov, head of Russia's interior ministry troops.
Baranov was sitting next to Kadyrov when the explosion ripped through the stadium's VIP section on Sunday morning. Investigators said a device made from artillery shells was hidden beneath the seating within a concrete beam. Repeated searches by sniffer dogs and sappers failed to find it.
Sergei Fridinsky, Russia's deputy general prosecutor, said investigators suspected the involvement of security men in the Dinamo stadium when the bomb went off, or builders who finished repair work there only on Saturday.
"Brilliant, Holmes, brilliant!"
Mr Fridinsky admitted that no one had been "officially" detained over the attack after reports on Sunday of the arrest of five people.
Russian officials accused rebel leaders Aslan Maskhadov and Shamil Basayev of planning the attack but Maskhadov denied responsibility and blamed Moscow for killing the head of its "puppet government" once he ceased to be of use to it.
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
05/11/2004 1:55:26 AM ||
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#1
Compared what our "night shift reservists" did to the Iraqis, to what Putin's boys are going to do to the construction workers who were working in the area before the bomb went off in order to "extract" information.
#2
Good thing they have the rebar-cutting torches handy, they won't have to order them and wait for delivery before starting their "discussions" with the builders
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/11/2004 12:59 Comments ||
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Gen. Vyacheslav Tikhomirov, the commander of Russia's Interior Forces, said that extra military forces could be moved into Chechnya. "A reserve has been set aside so that if there are some changes, it will be possible to move in additional troops, even from outside, if some kind of unpleasant situation develops," he told Russia's NTV television.
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
05/11/2004 1:50:45 AM ||
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#1
Why is it I never read Chechnya is another Afghanistan for Russia???
#4
chechnya is part of the Russian Republic, and Afghanistan was not even part of the USSR. Afghanistan at most represented a threat to USSR control of central Asia (or so was seen at the time) while Chechen terrorists have struck repeatedly in Moscow. Their resolve to fix the problem, one way or another, is firm, though not everyone agrees with Putins approach.
Tribal elders and supporters of Iraqâs highest Shia Muslim authority, Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani, warned on Monday of a foreign plot to sow chaos in this holy city by aggravating the standoff between radical militants and US forces.
Sistani follower and influential moderate cleric Sadreddin al-Kubbanji, convened a meeting of Najafâs tribal elders and repeated his earlier calls for the militia of firebrand Shia cleric Moqtada Sadr to leave the city.
Speaking to an emotional crowd of Sistani supporters, Kubbanji called for a demonstration on Friday, the Muslim holy day, to protest âchaos, lies and occupationâ and warned of a âtreacherous plot being hatched in the name of fighting the US-led occupation."
In a veiled criticism of Sadrâs Mehdi Army militia, which has effectively taken over the area around the cityâs holiest shrine, Kubbanji accused âoutside elementsâ of stoking the insurgency in order to suck the Americans into the heart of the sensitive Shia city.
Kubbanji said loyalists of jailed former president Saddam Hussein and Wahabis, radical Sunni Muslims such as followers of Al Qaeda terrorist leader Osama bin Laden, were behind the conspiracy.
âThe occupation was far away from Najaf and the city was calm, but when they (Sadrâs militia) hit them with stones they were forced to come here,â said Kubbanji, in reference to the thousands of Sadrâs young guerrillas who took over Najaf after launching a failed uprising last month.
He praised the âgood intentionsâ of Sadrâs fighters, who have come from Baghdad and other cities to âdefend Najaf,â but said they had been âsucked into this conspiracyâ and repeated calls for them to them to leave the city. Kubbanji is also the local leader of the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution in Iraq party (SCIRI), a major Shia party which is represented on the US-appointed Governing Council.
As he spoke his audience cheered in support of Sistani and the Najaf-based religious authority. âWe would die for Sistani,â shouted some of the men, while black-veiled women in the back row chanted: âWe follow our religious authority and our learned ones."
Sistani has called for a peaceful resolution to the Sadr crisis and the respect of Najafâs sanctity while steering away from endorsing the young cleric or issuing a religious edict to wage jihad (holy war) against the Americans.
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
05/11/2004 1:39:33 AM ||
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THOUSANDS of mourners yesterday flocked to the funeral of pro-Russian Chechnya President Akhmad Kadyrov, whose assassination on Sunday appeared to bear the hallmarks of an al-Qaeda operation.
The mourners paid their respects in Kadyrov's native village of Tsentoroi, in the country's south, where mourning ceremonies were expected to go on for three days after the explosion at Grozny stadium, which the Grozny emergency medical centre said killed a total of 24 people.
Russian authorities put the figure at six.
With the killing of a man whose election was engineered by Moscow in an attempt to give international legitimacy to the puppet Government in Grozny, Russia now faces a political vacuum. This will make its attempt to extricate itself from the Chechen quagmire immensely more difficult.
The timing of the bomb blast is of enormous significance. It came on the anniversary of VE Day, always a solemn occasion in Russia. On this day the country remembers its victory over Nazi Germany and the 20 million war dead.
The focus since Soviet times has been on the armed forces, honoured for their heroism. To choose this day to humiliate Russia's army in the centre of Grozny was a deliberate show of defiance in the face of years of heavy-handed military operations in Chechnya.
The daring and expertise in placing a bomb right beneath the VIP stand at Grozny stadium suggests meticulous planning.
Mr Putin has long insisted the rebels are backed by foreign Islamist extremists, and recently Moscow has produced evidence that some Chechen leaders have been working in close co-ordination with al-Qaeda. Washington, although concerned by Russia's tactics in Chechnya, has classified the separatists as part of the anti-Western Islamist terrorist movement.
The explosion is almost certainly the promised revenge for the Russian murder of Zelimkhan Yandarbiyev, the exiled Chechen militant who was blown up in his car in Qatar in February.
The killing of Kadyrov was a top priority for the rebels, who have not forgiven the former separatist leader for throwing in his lot with the Russians. Islamist militants see that as tantamount to deserting his religion, for which the penalty is death.
Sergei Abramov, Chechnya's Prime Minister, was named yesterday as acting president, but initial reaction from Mr Putin's camp to Mr Kadyrov's death showed he would find it hard to continue attempts to let Chechens run Chechnya.
Russia insisted yesterday it would not change course in Chechnya, and Mr Putin has repeatedly said that there will be no talks or negotiations with the separatists. But although his popularity remains high and his tough line on Chechnya is widely supported, the festering problem blights a range of policies.
It will make it harder for Mr Putin to push through urgent military reform or to instil a greater degree of professionalism in the army.
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
05/11/2004 1:37:40 AM ||
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"Where's my turban? Where's my gun? We're goin' for ride in a pickup truck!"
Tribesmen in the South Waziristan region of Pakistan say they will raise a force of 1,800 armed men to capture suspected al-Qaeda militants. The force would be the biggest armed militia - or Lashkar - so far raised for such a purpose.
And just as ineffective as the others.
The decision to form it was made by the Ahmedzai Wazir tribe in the main town of Wana, 400 km southwest of Peshawar. It is the first time that all the clans and sub-clans of the region have unified to grab some per diem against al-Qaeda. The main objective of the newly formed force is to grimace frighteningly and look ferocious make foreigners in South Waziristan register their names under the terms of an agreement made last month between tribal elders and the authorities.
The force is due to gather on Tuesday at Wana, when more details of their deployment and terms of reference are expected to emerge. But already its formation has been criticised. A prominent local bigshot tribal militant, Nek Mohammad, told the BBC on Monday that no foreigner was hiding in the South Waziristan area.
"Nope. None. I checked. Didn't see none!"
He has warned that he and his colleagues will again take up arms if the government violated a pledge made in last month's agreement not to launch another offensive in South Waziristan. Mr Mohammad argues that there is no provision for registration of foreigners in the agreement. "It does not contain any clause for registration," Mr Mohammad said. But that allegation has been denied by the governor of North West Frontier Province, who on Monday said that the agreement clearly stipulates that all foreigners were obliged to register with the authorities. A statement released by the governor added that the deadlines for them to register have been extended several times after requests were submitted on their behalf through negotiators. The statement warned of using "other options" if foreigners do not get registered. Foreign ministry spokesman Masood Khan said there would be no compromise if the demand is not met.
"Arrrr! They're gonna get it!" [Grimace!]
"When they register it would become evident whether or not they are terrorists," he said. "If they are not terrorists, they have nothing to hide, they should come forward and register with the authorities. There cannot be any question or compromise on that." The decision to raise the force comes hours before another deadline set by the government for foreigners to register is due to expire.
Posted by: Dan Darling ||
05/11/2004 1:35:54 AM ||
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Federal Minister for Religious Affairs Muhammad Ijazul Haq Saturday declared in clear terms that no religious seminaries were involved in spreading terrorism and ruled out the possibility of any dictated action against religious institutions.
"Nope. None of 'em. Bastions of sweet reason, every one!"
The Minister debunked the rumors hinting at any possible change in the curricula and action against the Madrassas in the country. Ijazul Haq told that he belonged to a religious family while his late father late President General Muhammad Ziaul Haq, was known for his love for religion and this was the only asset which he inherited from his late illustrious father. Thatâs funny, since his father is probably the man most responsible for the state Pakistan is in. At least he seems to acknowledge how corrupt and incompetant his father was.
Therefore, he feels duty bound to counter malicious propaganda against the religious institutions. He told in unambiguous terms that he would prefer to quit the Ministry instead of yielding to any pressure aimed at curbing the role of the religious institutions. He strongly defended the role of these institutions in the spread of religion Islam besides providing education on the contemporary disciplines of knowledge to millions of students free of cost.
Contemporary disciplines like explosives handling, weapons cleaning, and how to wrap a turban...
Muhammad Ijazul Haq said President General Pervez Musharraf is also appreciative of the positive role of these institutions where religious as well as modern education is imparted to the students. About the hue and cry over change in curricula, he denounced the impression that it was done at the behest of USA.
"No, no! Certainly not!"
However, he admitted some follies in the printing of books, which have been lifted from the markets for reprinting. These mistakes in the printing of textbooks, were made inadvertently, he elaborated. He strongly dispelled the impression the chapter about concept of Jihad has been removed from the textbooks and questioned the credibility of the critics in this regard.
"I mean, if you ain't gonna have jihad, why have textbooks?"
The Federal Curricula Board, he said, has also the representation of MMA on it. He recalled that in fact conspiracy against religion Islam started from 1986 when former US State Secretary Henry Kissinger in his article and Samuel P Hitington in his book "The Clash of Civilization" declared Islam as the main threat to Christianity.
I think they said it was a threat to the world, not just to Christianity...
He said, today allover the World, Muslims are targeted as terrorists while in reality, the hidden hands behind the high profile terrorism cases, were not Muslims but other vested forces.
He means Zionists. Or maybe Bilderbergers. Anybody but Muslims, who're a peaceable, industrious lot...
The time will unveil the conspiracy behind the 9/11 incident as well, he elaborated. The Muslims, he said, could benefit from the teachings and sayings of last Prophet Hazrat Muhammad (PBUH) if they followed it in letter and spirit. The root cause of our fall in the present era is just because of the overlooking of the set principles of Hazrat Muhammad (PBUH), he added.
Posted by: Paul Moloney ||
05/11/2004 1:28:36 AM ||
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#1
Yep, it's true. There is no link between the billions spent by my Saudi paymasters for madrasas that spew murder incitement against America, and terrorism. No connection whatsoever. Just ask Prince Bandar. And tell him to remember the Prez.
Posted by: George Wahabi Bush ||
05/11/2004 3:26 Comments ||
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#2
He told in unambiguous terms that he would prefer to quit the Ministry instead of yielding to any pressure aimed at curbing the role of the religious institutions
Note that this is happening to the corrupt secular parties, rather than the corrupt Islamist parties. EFL
Opposition lawmaker Tahmina Daultana has been followed by plainclothes agents, has received threatening phone calls and has had her home raided repeatedly by police. In the past week, hundreds of opposition activists have been detained as they prepare for the planned return to Pakistan on Tuesday of a brother of former Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif, whose elected government was ousted by Musharraf in 1999. Sharif and his relatives were sent into exile for 10 years. Shahbaz Sharif says heâs coming back to face charges of ordering the 1998 killing of five people when he was chief minister of Punjab province. The Supreme Court has ruled he has the right to return. Many see it as a political gambit to raise the profile of a flagging opposition movement that has done little to stir the publicâs interest and won few plaudits when leading a government widely accused of corruption. But Sharifâs return also serves as a test for the democratic credentials of Musharraf, a military leader who was spurned by the West after his takeover but has earned clout for his bold support of U.S.-led efforts in fighting terrorism and tough talk on tackling Islamic extremism.
In an interview with The Associated Press last week, pro-Musharraf Prime Minister Zafarullah Khan Jamali said the march toward democracy was important to Pakistan, and he brushed off opposition complaints of heavy-handed treatment. "The opposition today has been very comfortable, let me tell you that," Jamali said. "They have not been harassed, there have been no cases against anybody. Nobody has been jailed. Nobody is tortured."
Dozens of party activists have been detained in the past week, police say, and can be held without charge for 90 days to maintain âpublic order.â Sharifâs Pakistan Muslim League-N party, however, claims more than 1,000 have been rounded up, mostly in Lahore, where Daultana - a prominent female politician and critic of Musharraf - is based. She spoke to AP by phone Monday from her hiding place ahead of Sharifâs expected return to the city from London. "The government doesnât want a big exhibition of support for our party and its leadership," said party chairman Raja Zafarul Haq. "But what is democracy? Itâs not just the process of elections. It basically means tolerance, rule of law and respecting fundamental rights - not harassing people for exercising them."
Despite some constraints, there is generally freedom of expression and assembly in Pakistan. Press commentaries often are critical of the government. Religious hard-liners routinely lambast the president for supporting the United States. But the judicial system can come down hard on provocative politicians - particularly from the mainstream parties that dominated Pakistanâs politics in the 1990s and remain Musharrafâs main challengers. Last month, a court sentenced the acting president of Sharifâs party, Javed Hashmi, to 23 years after a closed trial for sedition. The verdict was criticized even by the United States, which counts Musharraf as a key ally. Hashmi, who likely will serve a maximum of seven years, repeatedly had accused Musharraf of treason for seizing power, and was accused of publicizing a fake letter from an army officer criticizing his leadership.
Reinforcing the militaryâs influence, a 13-member National Security Council has been established - approved in a matter of minutes by the upper house of Parliament in April. The government says it is an "advisory" body that will help prevent future coups by giving military chiefs a say in matters of national interest.
Posted by: Paul Moloney ||
05/11/2004 12:38:06 AM ||
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Warning: This article might annoy some readers.
Outrage at the death of a Catholic boy forced to convert to Islam at the hands of torturous abductors has prompted the Pakistan Catholic Bishopâs Commission of Justice and Peace, to take up the legal case. The Christian youth died of injuries inflicted by a teacher and students at an Islamic school. The National Commission for Justice and Peace declared May 4th that the incident reflects a worrying trend of forced conversions.
Javed Anjum, an 18-year-old commerce student was seized by a teacher and students of Jamia Hassan bin Almurtaza Madrasa (an Islamic religious school) on April 17th when he stopped for a drink of water at a nearby tap in Toba Tek Singh, 310 kilometres south of Islamabad. For five days he was tortured until his condition became so serious that the abusers took him to a police station, stating that he had been attempting to steal an electric water pump, and filed a charge of robbery against him. The boy was kept in police custody until April 24th, when he was finally taken for medical treatment. By that time, according to the Bishopâs Commission investigation, it was too late to save him. Anjum died May 2nd, in a nearby Faisalabad hospital, of "renal failure", having also suffered broken ribs and loss of eyesight.
According to the Bishopâs Commission, police refused to investigate the cause of Anjumâs injuries, or the allegation against him. Chairman of the Commission, Peter Jacob said on May 7th that officials at the Islamic school tried to create an impression that Anjum was a drug addict, and now local Muslim political leaders are supporting and protecting the school. "It only shows how desperate and aware the perpetrators are of their crime and what they had done, that they tried through various allegations to cover it up."
The Bishopâs Commission claimed, "Religious intolerance and discrimination is the reason behind the recent incidents where young non-Muslims were forcibly converted and circumcised." In November another Pakistan Catholic boy, 15-year-old Zeeshan Gill, was abducted by a Muslim classmate and forced to convert. He was threatened and beaten by Islamic clerics and made to attend religious classes at Madrasa Jamia al Qasim al Aloom, an Islamic boarding school. He eventually escaped from his captors, but he and his mother and brother have since been in hiding for fear of death.
Beyond its concern for justice in Anjumâs case, the Churchâs commission urged the government of the Punjab province to "take long-term steps to root out religious hatred and take timely action against the perpetrators of hate crimes in accordance with the law. We appeal to the federal government to ensure equality of rights and opportunities, which is the only way to build a society based on justice, peace, and human rights," the commissionâs statement said.
The official teaching of Islam condemns forced conversions of others. They have to say that. Donât take it seriously.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester ||
05/11/2004 12:20:20 AM ||
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#3
The official teaching of Islam condemns forced conversions of others
It is true, what they omit to say is that on everything you can find a surate disapproving it and another one approving it. And that the ones who prevail are the ones written later, that is the Jihadist ones, written at Medina
I wonder if the only reason they held him that long is that they were trying to contact Hannibal Lechter? Yes I know I am using hyperbole, but nothing else is logical.
#5
This didn't happen. Like my Saudi paymasters told me: "Islam is peace." Give a Wahabi a hug.
Posted by: George Wahabi Bush ||
05/11/2004 4:36 Comments ||
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#6
George Wahabi Bush,
What is it that you want from Bush? Did You want him to invade Saudi Arabia instead of Iraq?
If so, please inform yourself as to what the inability of the US to have access to 2 millions BPD of oil in Spare Production Capacity (Saudi's SPC) would do to the economy of the US? Why would you want the US to cut its own throat is beyond my comprenhension!
#8
Anonymous4617 - you know what will happen if we lose access to 2 millions BPD of oil overnight?
We will have hybird cars, fuel cells and oil from Anwar by the end of the week. That's the beauty of a capitalist system. It would be like ripping off a bandaid to us..it would hurt, even bleed, but not for long. As for the Middle East, they have NOTHING left once we make the leap. Back to nomadic dirt farming and selling opium.
In the end, they'd be doing us a favor. Ever read The Goose that Laid the Golden Egg? It's their goose that will be cooked if we decrease our dependence on oil. If they help us kick the habit - we'll just get over it sooner, rather than later. In the long run, we'll be better off - even if the short run will indeed be painful.
KARBALA, Iraq (AP) - Insurgents blasted an oil pipeline, setting off a huge blaze and slashing Iraq's daily oil exports by about 25 percent. Firefighters were still battling a blaze that erupted Saturday after insurgents bombed a pipeline carrying oil for export to a terminal south of the southern city of Basra.
Jabber Luyaibi, director general of Iraq's Southern Oil Company, said engineers managed to divert oil to a second pipeline. But an official for the State Oil Marketing Pipeline told Dow Jones Newswires that the alternative pipeline was too small to handle the additional flow and that, as a result, Iraq's petroleum exports fell by 25 percent to 1.2 million barrels a day.
In London, Paul Horsnell, head of energy research at Barclays Capital, said the damage could be repaired quickly and that the disruption of exports would be temporary. But he said the attack was disturbing because "quite clearly, now the southern infrastructure is a target."
Posted by: Steve White ||
05/11/2004 12:07:25 AM ||
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#3
Regarding Jihad Terrorist Inc & the Use of Oil as a Weapon ;
By Mark Espinola, May 11th, 2004
Do not underestimate the extreme market shrewdness of the financial leadership of these jihadee thugs, plus their methodical usage of insignificant disruptions in crude oil for the sole purpose of instilling fear among global energy traders, thus the price of oil on the world-wide market soars, and they, the terrorists & their monetary backers make even more profits, to spread more terror, which produces more profits, for increased terrorism.
In the case of Iraq; look no further than directly next door, to Iran, as the main exporter of suicide bombers creating the unstable situation among the Shi'ites of Iraq.
Each time Iranian agents commit an well pre-planed act civilian terror, or petrol-sabotage on Iraqi oil pipelines, or other crude installations Iraq is dependant on for outside income, who benefits? Iran, OPEC member Iran, terrorist promoting Iran.
There are a number of news reports which have clearly outlined the intricate financial market skills of al-Qa'ida's top economic 'advisor's in playing the Australian stock market & others, with profits raked in from illegal narcotics traffic that they control.
Instead of earning vast sums of funds in the stock & commodity markets, which could benefit fellow Muslims in poor countries, Islamic Terrorist Inc withdraws profits earned and transfers millions of dollars to jihad bagmen to 'assist' the relatives of youthful, brainwashed psychos, after they blow up themselves along with dozens other fellow Muslims which have the misfortune of being in the wrong place when Terrorist Inc decides it's time it was blown off the map.
It's really incredible! Those which despise the West so much, become part of the very system they hate in order to attempt to destroy it. Like Atta taking flying lesions to only know enough to smash a plane load of innocent passengers into a very tall building with thousands of more innocent people, who showed up to work ...on the wrong sunny morning!
The next time you're driving close to empty and need to buy gas, remember those high unleaded pump prices are being triggered (in part) by nations such as OPEC's Iran, in order to accumulate more profits through their own exported oil, to finance proxies to murder more 'infidels'!
It's high time we zero in on the enemy behind the visible enemy in Iraq, Afghanistan, plus other locations around the globe where the Islamic death cult is gaining footholds.
It's also an enormous injustice to all the fine soldiers serving in the Coalition countering bloodthirsty jihadic killers, if we do not fight this war of national & international survival on all fronts, military and economic!
Posted by: Mark Espinola ||
05/11/2004 1:51 Comments ||
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#4
And that is why the Cartel called OPEC has to be destroyed!
#5
this is why we need fuel cells. Let's face it, we HAVE the technology to decrease our fuel needs with hybrid engines, solar panels, Anwar and more. Would it be expensive? Ask yourself if it would be more expensive than this war that we will fight our entire life time or paying $5/gallon for who knows how long.
The jihadi's will still be able to raise funds - but not enough to do the damage they do now. It's time we cut our losses and moved on. Without their oil money - they are NOTHING. It's time we made that clear.
.... the absence of a central political power may lead to intensified fighting in the republic. Kadyrov was part of a powerful Chechen clan [which] will likely provoke local infighting and blood revenge.
Akhmed Muradov, who heads the Chechen Diaspora of Kazakhstan and is vice president of the World Chechen Congress, said that Kadyrov " ... Now, his son has been put into it, a vendetta will begin according to traditional obligations of the son for the father, and escalation will take place. It is difficult to imagine the consequences of this explosion," Muradov said.
The 52-year-old leader was widely unpopular among Chechens, who said he terrorized local citizens using his private police force, comprising deeply loyal clan members and experienced former rebels. The group is believed to inspire even greater fear among Chechens than federal forces currently serving in the republic as part of Russiaâs second war in the breakaway region in the past decade. The force -- estimated to number up to 4,000 fighters -- is believed to be responsible for numerous human rights abuses, including kidnappings and torture. Kadyrovâs son Ramzan commands the force and is said to operate a private prison on its behalf. ....
RFE/RL correspondent Andrei Babitskii has extensively covered Russiaâs conflict in Chechnya. .... Babitskii said Kadyrovâs assassination will set his private security forces adrift -- and likely leave them demoralized, angry, and ready for revenge. "I think that, of course, a vendetta will take place," Babitskii said. "I think that now, all of Kadyrovâs forces, who already acted very cruelly -- much more cruelly than the federal forces -- they of course will start a hunt. In most cases this hunt will be motivated by revenge. It will aim to avenge the death of a political leader as well, the death of a relative, a man who belonged to the same clan, if you want." ....
Posted by: Mike Sylwester ||
05/11/2004 12:10:43 AM ||
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A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.
Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing
the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.
Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence
over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has
dominated Mexico for six years.
Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No
trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
