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Marines administer ceasefire thumping in Fallujah
Today's Headlines
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Arabia
Saudi Blogger gives away Secret Saudi Military Protocol
Here he is making fun of the official Saudi reports that Saudi security personnel have the terrorists surrounded.
EFL
Yes it’s that same old siege, same old group of terrorists. I must admit I had a shudder when I saw that headline. "Band of Terrorists"? Like "Band of Brothers"? Are we working up to a mini-series here?....We are subtle. We are infinitely patient. Our ancestors would wait for a week under a palm until the dates were fully ripe. There’s no point in rushing. It takes 406 days to make a baby camel, no matter how much you wave your stick. God does things in his own good time, and so will we.

Anyway, Prince Nayif has explained our latest tactics. First we surround them. Then we completely surround them. Then we keep them there until they:

1) Say "Sorry" or

2) Eat all their vegetables or

3) Tidy their bedrooms properly
does Lilek have any Saudi relatives; this guy writes just like him
Posted by: mhw || 04/27/2004 8:55:35 AM || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:

#1  . . . does Lilek[s] have any Saudi relatives?

High praise, indeed. (Deserved, too.)
Posted by: Mike || 04/27/2004 10:25 Comments || Top||

#2  This blogger is so good, he makes me doubt he's really a Saudi.
Posted by: Tresho || 04/27/2004 20:54 Comments || Top||

#3  Well, at least he's not an effete brat like Salaam Pax.
Posted by: Pappy || 04/27/2004 21:59 Comments || Top||


Saudi foreign minister sounds alert on US-Saudi relations
Saudi Arabian Foreign Minister Prince Saud al-Faisal warned on Monday that US-Saudi relations were being dangerously undermined by misconceptions about alleged Saudi support for militant groups. In a speech to the Foreign Policy Association in New York, Prince Saud said he wanted to “sound the alert that the harmony of our long and fruitful relationship is threatened.” Blaming elements of the media for demonising his country, the foreign minister cited a recent clutch of books that sought to portray Saudi Arabia’s internal social and political makeup as one that nurtures extremism and feeds terrorism. “Nothing could be further from the truth,” he said. “After last week’s events in Riyadh, I don’t think any reasonable person can cast doubts about our commitment to waging a relentless war on terrorism.”

While Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden was born in Saudi Arabia, Prince Saud stressed that his ideology and terrorist methodology had been developed in Afghanistan. Equating the actions and ideologies of the hijackers with those of the Saudi people as a whole was, Prince Saud argued, not only erroneous but also counter-productive in the war against terrorism. “It is ironic that those who most vociferously attack Saudi Arabia are unwittingly serving the purposes of Al Qaeda ,” he said. “The attacks lead to undermining a country that is probably most capable of not only waging the war against (Al Qaeda ), but also in preventing (Al Qaeda ) spreading their cultist ideology in the Islamic world.”
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:42:03 AM || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:

#1  me think he doth prostest too much.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 1:09 Comments || Top||

#2 
...Prince Saud said he wanted to "sound the alert that the harmony of our long and fruitful relationship is threatened."
Translation: "Run for the hills! The American Street is waking up, and they're pissed!"
Posted by: Old Grouch || 04/27/2004 1:23 Comments || Top||

#3  "Children Killed in Iraq Attack
Naseer Al-Nahr, Arab News

BAGHDAD, 26 April 2004 — US troops have been accused of firing indiscriminately into a crowd of schoolchildren celebrating the attack on a military convoy here yesterday. At least four children were killed and five injured."
http://www.arabnews.com/?page=4§ion=0&article=43851&d=26&m=4&y=2004

So, Prince Saud is "Blaming elements of the media for demonising his country, the foreign minister cited a recent clutch of books that sought to portray Saudi Arabia’s internal social and political makeup as one that nurtures extremism and feeds terrorism"

What does he, the prince, call publishing news like the one posted above in a newspaper that is a 100% controlled by him and his 7,000 relatives?
Is this news not enciting hatred towards Americans?
The hipocrasy of these people is nauseating!

Please, do check this newspaper to see the accompanying photo.
Posted by: Anonymous3964 || 04/27/2004 4:55 Comments || Top||

#4  There is no photo at link.

BTW, I thought when I heard the report that the kids were probably hit by rounds cooking off in the fire. They were dancing round a burning military vehicle. Not very smart!
Posted by: Phil B || 04/27/2004 5:18 Comments || Top||

#5  Saudi Arabia is owned and ruled by one royal family. Prince Saud al-Faisal is the foreign minister because he is a prince, a direct descendant of the family patriach. A citizen who is not a prince cannot aspire to such a position. Prince al-Faisal should explain why this one family insists that Saudi Arabia remain a kingdom and not become a democracy in which all citizens enjoy equal rights.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 7:01 Comments || Top||

#6  Hey Saud, maybe you should ask yerself why you are hated! Try to open your mind and explore the root causes, or some sh*t like that.
Posted by: Cthulhu Akbar || 04/27/2004 10:24 Comments || Top||

#7  Phil,

Go to the paper's website directly. I provided the link in my previous message. I think the article is a fabrication. The author does not provide a source but instead uses an unrelated photo taken by AFP, as if to imply that the article is also by AFP. I looked in the AFP website and came up with nothing of the sort. Have you seen the article in question in any other newspaper?
Similar articles appear every single day in the Saudi English Newspapers. Can you imagine what they print in arabic?
Posted by: Anonymous4617 || 04/27/2004 12:37 Comments || Top||

#8  Dang! Does RB have the best anon or what?
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 16:27 Comments || Top||

#9  Saudi Arabian Foreign Minister Prince Saud al-Faisal warned on Monday that US-Saudi relations were being dangerously undermined by misconceptions about alleged Saudi support for militant groups.

Probably a lot of present and former US State Dept. types now wondering if their Saudi-401Ks are secure...
Posted by: Pappy || 04/27/2004 22:04 Comments || Top||


Al-Muqrin's still in the mountains
Saudi security forces say they believe they have cornered four suspects, including al Qaeda's top coordinator in the Arabian Peninsula, in an area northwest of the capital Riyadh. Security forces went to Al-Amariya -- about 25 miles outside of Riyadh --on Sunday on information that four wanted men were hiding in the mountains. One of those men is believed to be Abdul Aziz al-Muqrin -- a "big fish," according to police. Al-Muqrin is the main liaison between al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda members in Saudi Arabia, Saudi Interior Ministry officials say. Two of the three men with al-Mukrin are also believed to be on Saudi authorities' list of men wanted in connection with terror attacks in the kingdom, police said. The original list contained 26 names but arrests, surrenders and deaths have cut the list to 18. One of the men has been wounded in the standoff, police said. Police vowed they will remain in Al-Amariya until the wanted men give up or are killed, according to journalists there.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:27:38 AM || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:

#1  It's time for armed Predator flights over this region. Any chance the Soddys will allow that?
Posted by: Tibor || 04/27/2004 0:40 Comments || Top||

#2  Security forces went to Al-Amariya -- about 25 miles outside of Riyadh --on Sunday on information that four wanted men were hiding in the mountains.

What is it with these guys hiding in the mountains? Is this an OB-1 Kenobi fixation?
This old man psycho in the cave stuff is really tedious. Can't they think of something more original? I mean if they are so hung up on the 72 virgins, they should be more in the open. They are not committed martyrs if they are truly hiding and trying to stay alive.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 0:53 Comments || Top||

#3  What mountains? They are rocky hills devoid of all vegetation. These hills might have small structural caves where they could hide but they are not very deep.
Posted by: Anonymous3964 || 04/27/2004 5:18 Comments || Top||

#4  Damn 3964 what are you? Some kinda troublemaknig geologist? Saudi say mountains.... there're moutains.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 18:13 Comments || Top||


Britain
UK Suicide Bomber’s Perverted Sister Encouraged Dimwit Brother
The sister of the first British suicide bomber recruited by Hamas actively encouraged her brother, sending him an e-mail in case his resolve faltered at the last minute, an Old Bailey jury was told yesterday. Omar Sharif, 27, and his 21-year-old friend, Asil Hanif, both British Muslims, slipped into Israel posing as tourists in April last year and checked into a hostel in Tel Aviv. In their room they shaved their bodies "because martyrs want to be clean when they enter paradise", assembled the bombs, strapped them to their torsos and hid them under their clothes. But before Sharif set out for a busy waterfront area he received an e-mail from his sister Parveen, 36. It urged him: "We all have to be firm and focused with reality as time is slipping away, and there is really no time to be weak and emotional. Stay focused and determined."

Sharif and Hanif set out with their bombs and waited until the area got busier and there were more potential victims to kill and maim. Hanif detonated his bomb outside Mike’s Place, a popular bar, killing himself, three others and injuring 65. Sharif’s bomb failed to go off and he fled, dumping it nearby. Twelve days later his body was found in the sea off the Israeli coast. "The circumstances of his death are not clear, although the post mortem findings are consistent with drowning," said Jonathan Laidlaw, prosecuting. Parveen Sharif, a supply teacher, pleaded not guilty to inciting Omar Sharif to commit an act of terrorism and failing to disclose information about terrorism.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 8:17:14 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  she needs to go swimming with a heavy load
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 20:51 Comments || Top||


Moslems, Don’t Speak to Kufr Reporters, Who Spread Lies and Fabrications
An Appeal to all Al-Muhajiroun Members
As Salamu Alakum Wa rahmatullahi Wa Barakatu...
An appeal to all members of Al-Muhajiroun not to speak to any non-Muslim (Kufr) media bodies following the recent lies and fabrications spread by them about Sheikh Omar Bakri Muhammad and Al-Muhajiroun. Rather any interviews must only be conducted with Muslims because non-Muslims are biased against Islam and Muslims even if a Muslim works for a non-Muslim media outlet since in this case he will be a slave to the editors policies.
[signed]
Jazakallah Khair
Wai’lakumussalam Wa rahmatullahi Wa Barakatu...
Same to you, fellah!
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 7:55:45 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Klattuu Barratta Nicto to you too.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/27/2004 21:11 Comments || Top||

#2  "Kufr reporters spread lies and fabrications."

OK, he's got us on that one.
Posted by: Matt || 04/27/2004 22:01 Comments || Top||

#3  Looks like all the apologists are flinging solo from now on. They'll have to acquire their quotes Jason Blair style.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 22:06 Comments || Top||


Captain Hook gets 9 more months in the UK
ABU HAMZA, the radical Muslim cleric who has been linked to five Islamic terrorist groups, has secured the right to stay in Britain for another nine months - in spite of the government’s attempts to deport him. The Special Immigration Appeals Commission yesterday postponed the hearing until 10 January, 2005, after several problems, including Mr Hamza’s refusal to appear in court during the Muslim month of fasting in Ramadan.

The delay came as several new details emerged about Mr Hamza’s links to terrorist organisations in Britain and beyond, leading Muslim groups and MPs to unite in denouncing the delay in his hearing. Ian Burnett, QC, representing the Home Office, yesterday told a bomb-proof hearing room in London that the government can prove Mr Hamza offered "support and advice" to al-Qaeda before the terrorist attacks in the United States on 11 September 2001. There is also evidence linking the cleric to terrorist cells including the GIA in Algeria, the IAA in Yemen - where he is wanted on terrorist charges - and a Kashmiri terrorist group known as the HUA. But Mr Hamza was granted the nine-month extension after he refused to submit evidence in his defence and changed his solicitor. There has also been debate about whether he was entitled to up to £250,000 in legal aid.
I think the entire West is crazy...
Mr Hamza, who has been banned from preaching in the Finsbury Mosque, London, by the Charities Commission, was not in court because he has filed no relevant papers in the last 12 months. Mr Burnett expressed the disappointment of the government that the proceedings against Mr Hamza, which began in April last year, look set to go on for two years, and that officials could not act sooner.
Justice delayed is justice denied...
He added that the cleric has used the Finsbury Mosque as a "centre of extremism and a safe haven for Islamic terrorists, enabling them to develop the support and contacts necessary to further violent aims." The judge, Mr Justice Ouseley, also expressed dismay that Mr Hamza was entitled to such a long delay in his hearing. "For my part, I find it difficult to see why the timetable was not adhered to," he said. Fury over the nine-month delay was yesterday echoed by the Islamic Society of Britain (ISB), which said Mr Hamza’s presence in the country is harming the reputation of Britain’s Muslims throughout the country. "He should be removed just as other members of extremist factions," said Naeem Raza, a director of the ISB. "He deserves to be thrown out. It is disgusting that he is still here."
Even the turbans don't like him. C'mon, guys! What would Good Queen Bess do?
Naseem Mohammed, the chairman of the Birmingham Central Mosque, said: "Mr Hamza needs to be removed and 99.9 per cent of Muslims do not agree with what he says. He is simply a madman."
But still they keep him around...
SECRET tapes containing the rantings of Abu Hamza were revealed in the Daily Mail yesterday. They outline his twisted views on suicide bombings, the West’s war on terror and his thoughts on Tony Blair, the Prime Minister, and George Bush, the US president. On suicide bombings, he tells supporters: "You don’t have to travel thousands and thousands of miles to become a shaheed [martyr] - you can be a shaheed right on your own doorstep. May Allah open our eyes for what’s good for us - so we don’t waste our efforts and our Muslim blood far away."
If Sir Walter Raleigh could end up with a very short haircut, why can't Captain Hook?
And on the UK terror crackdown, he says: "These laws are now coming one after the other. And the main goal is to destruct Islam and Muslims from Islam because Islam now is what makes their life difficult." The tapes also repeat his views on 11 September: "Wherever you are, death will catch up with you - even if you are in high elevated towers. Where is their ‘Superman’? They only know how to fly through windows. Who is to blame? The American government and their pressure cooker policy which exploded in their faces." He later adds: "These scenes are going to repeat." On Osama Bin Laden, he says: "Sheikh Bin Laden is not a normal person. He is an example for all mujahideen with his past experience, goals and achievements." And he mocks Mr Blair and Mr Bush, saying on the tapes: "The people who are spreading terror all over the planet, the people who have sanctioned children, they are killing them for tens of years; the people who have killed millions of children."
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:46:46 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  With apologies to Disney,

Outside the drinking, a guy with one eye and a hook can find a lot in common with this :

Yo Ho, Yo Ho! A pirate's life for me.

We pillage, we plunder, we rifle and loot.
Drink up me 'earties, Yo Ho!
We kidnap and ravage and don't give a hoot.
Drink up me 'earties, Yo Ho!

Yo Ho, Yo Ho! A pirate's life for me.

We extort, we pilfer, we filch and sack.
Drink up me 'earties, Yo Ho!
Maraud and embezzle and even hijack!!!

Drink up me 'earties, Yo Ho

Yo Ho, Yo Ho! A pirate's life for me.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 2:02 Comments || Top||

#2  A4052 - appreciate the great humour but living in London and catching the tube every day, and in light of Madrid, lines like this perturb me:

On suicide bombings, he tells supporters: "You don’t have to travel thousands and thousands of miles to become a shaheed [martyr] - you can be a shaheed right on your own doorstep.

Convenient flypaper for other Islamotwerps or not, he must be locked up. I think I'll move to the outer Hebrides while our government proves incapable of fulfillig its duty of care to the majority of its citizens.
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 4:38 Comments || Top||

#3  I totally agree Howard , our government is incapable of fulfilling its duty of care . The flower children who write wishy washy liberal media are to blame for this mess ,and the fact that the government relies on their votes . My opinion is being politically correct is soooooo 90's ... Its time to take the bit between the teeth and move forward in this millenium and deal with this threat with an iron hammer . Dont deport the prick , kidnap him and keep him in a little hole in ground totally isolated whilst maybe occasionally droppng a bacon sandwich ( haha ) down there to keep him vaguely alive . Failing that , dont he look over weight and heart attack prone? ...........
Posted by: MacNails || 04/27/2004 4:59 Comments || Top||

#4  Inflate large paper bag and approach stealthily from behind... snigger.
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 5:09 Comments || Top||

#5  The composition of the Special Immigration Appeals Commission ought to become a political issue in the UK. A nine-month delay now, after the previous ridiculous delays, indicates that the top apparatus is incompetent and indecisive.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 7:12 Comments || Top||

#6  It's hard to say which is more amazingly insane -- this story or the Finsbury Park Mosque re-opening story.

What part of the Izzoids' message is not understood by the UK functionaries in those positions of authority responsible for these two decisions?

My sincere sympathies to our UK colleagues - this is right out of Braveheart - (paraphrasing) "God tells me I'll be okay, but I think you're fucked."
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 10:19 Comments || Top||

#7  We're fucked allright and the majority here know it.
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 10:23 Comments || Top||

#8  We're fucked allright and the majority here know it.
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 10:23 Comments || Top||

#9  What the hell is wrong with England? This crap wouldn't have flown when I was last there.
Posted by: mojo || 04/27/2004 10:43 Comments || Top||

#10  Howard UK -

I didn't mean to unnerve anyone, but to humorously ridicule the Australopithecae
that we are facing in the war on terror helps.

Before 9/11 I was a service person working on phone systems in various buildings in the Los Angeles area. My employer at the time had clients in the "707 Wilshire" building, which is the 2nd tallest building in LA after the so-called library tower. We recently found out the "Library Tower" was a cicada(my spelling) potential target. I was scheduled to do a service call in the "707 Wilshire Building" on 9/11 so some what-ifs are going thru my mind as well.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 13:40 Comments || Top||

#11  I appreciate humour and comic relief. I think I was grouchy because it was too a.m. This guy isn't so much the worry as the system's failure to deal with him appropriately in light of events like 9/11. My Uncle used to Maitre d' in Windows on the World. He's still alive tho'
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 15:43 Comments || Top||


Finsbury Park mosque to reopen
The notorious North London powerbase of hook-handed preacher Abu Hamza is to reopen in three months. The Finsbury Park mosque was closed in January 2003 when CS gas and a stun gun were found there. Hamza is still banned from preaching in the building but other radical extremists have vowed to return and promote hatred of Britain and the West. Sheikh Omar Bakri, whose followers recently burnt the Union Flag, said: "I regularly gave sermons and I will do so again."
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:26:24 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Go ahead, multiculturalist PC jerks, defend the guy and his incitement.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 04/27/2004 0:32 Comments || Top||

#2  The Finsbury Park mosque was closed in January 2003 when CS gas and a stun gun were found there.

Oh my Bombarama - You mean you havent heard of the stun-gun round dance?

And the CS gas is used for special initiation rites. You will become a member of the Imam's special Green Guard. (The color you turn when you get a whiff of the gas)

We have to be sensitive to the cultural practices of others, don't you know? Tsk tsk tsk
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 0:49 Comments || Top||

#3  The Finsbury Park mosque was closed in January 2003 when CS gas and a stun gun were found there.

Not to mention fake passports and credit cards...
Sheikh Omar Bakri must be on a desperate mission to meet up with Abu Qatada in Belmarsh. Next time you burn the flag have the balls to do it outside a football stadium. Pr*ck.

Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 4:33 Comments || Top||

#4  Howard:

I remember in wake of the MU-Liverpool bomb plot you pretty much said if the plan had gone through then football fans would've run riot in Muslim neighborhoods. Do you think there's any chance that could happen even if a game isn't blown up?

I'm really curious about the state of ethnic tension in the UK.
Posted by: growler || 04/27/2004 10:21 Comments || Top||

#5  I know for a fact that the summer of unrest in 2001 in predominantly Muslim towns was started when Stoke and Oldham 'fans' rampaged through Oldham in response to a D-Day vet having the proverbial kicked out of him by Pakistani teenagers. I think if a bomb went off over here then those who choose to be unassimilated into UK society would have a very tough time in their ghettoes.
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 10:29 Comments || Top||

#6  #5. Well, that's some good news. Thanks.

Did anyone do anything when they burned the flag? Just curious.
Posted by: ex-lib || 04/27/2004 11:13 Comments || Top||

#7  I work within view of the park where it happened. No-one did anything. However, had I known or happened across it, I would probably be posting an article about myself punching The Sheikh (or getting a sound beating!).
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 11:48 Comments || Top||

#8  Howard UK: if it ever happens again, I have an idea. Quickly pass out large photos of football favorites, with "Omar sucks pig" in very small letters across the bottoms, tops, and sides of the photos. (Then run.) The Islamic flag burners will be burning the photos in no time. You can then, from a position of safety, notify the fans in the surrounding neighborhoods.

That oughta get things riled up appropriately.
Posted by: ex-lib || 04/27/2004 17:02 Comments || Top||


Europe
Spain to Float Iraq Proposal to France, Germany
Spain will ask anti-war allies Germany and France to join in a proposal calling for a U.S. exit from Iraq and a new international presence in the country, a Spanish government source said Tuesday.

"The idea is to see if Spain, France and Germany can help the United States find an exit from Iraq...and devise a formula for an international presence there that would not be perceived as an occupation by most of the population," the source said.

New Spanish Prime Minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero, whose first decision on taking office was to withdraw troops sent to Iraq by his predecessor, said Tuesday the last of Spain’s soldiers will have left Iraq by May 27.

Zapatero will make the proposal during talks with German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder in Berlin Wednesday and with French President Jacques Chirac in Paris Thursday. Germany has already expressed interest in it, the source said.

Asked whether Spain would be prepared to send troops back to Iraq under such a formula, the source said it was too soon to say.

Any joint Spanish-French-German initiative would probably unfold in the U.N. Security Council -- all three are members -- though the source said the form it might take had not been decided.

Spanish Foreign Minister Miguel Moratinos has mentioned the possibility of sending Arab forces into Iraq, and of a future international presence that would not include soldiers from countries which have been a part of the U.S.-led coalition.
Posted by: TS (vice girl) || 04/27/2004 9:02:21 PM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Haahahahaha, Spain isn't in a position to make proposals. The only thing Zapatero is free to do is grab his ankles for his Al Qaida masters.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 04/27/2004 21:57 Comments || Top||

#2  Last I heard the Iraqis don't want the UN and wouldn't be to keen on most Arabs given both pandered SH for years.
Posted by: Phil_B || 04/27/2004 21:59 Comments || Top||

#3  Looks like Zapatero isn't satisfied with being out in the cold today. He wants to be out in the cold for decades. What a moron...
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 04/27/2004 22:10 Comments || Top||

#4  G7 - votes no.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 22:12 Comments || Top||

#5  But, but, but, but Binny told them to leave Iraq!!
Posted by: Rafael || 04/27/2004 22:21 Comments || Top||

#6  What's next from the Vichy Spain government? A Blue Division sent to help the islamofascists?
Posted by: Jackal || 04/27/2004 22:25 Comments || Top||

#7  This is an interesting political gambit almost certainly meant to provide Kerry with a credible 'multilateral' alternative to Bush's cowboy approach to Iraq. Watch for them to float terms in the Security Council that are unpalatable to the Bush admin such as total US withdrawal to be replaced by morally superior and financially disinterested 'blue helmets'.

If we're smart, we'll probably play along for a bit and maybe even coopt this initiative if possible. However, it's clearly a bluff as Europe cannot come up with the cash or troops to do the job unless India or China somehow pony up.

I normally question the political emphasis of some RB posters, but watch Kerry's foreign policy speech this week. I guarantee they're throwing him a bone and he'll try to catch it.
Posted by: JAB || 04/27/2004 22:32 Comments || Top||

#8  I'm starting to lose respect for these Spaniards. How about we kill a few of them and then just tell them what to think? It worked for the Izlamonutz, it could work for us too.
Posted by: Rawsnacks || 04/27/2004 22:46 Comments || Top||

#9  ah poor Spain right in the other side of the border... Zapa seems to be beyond stupidity

Asking for Arab countries help that arent at all interested in a Iraqui democratic regime?!

UN= internal conflicts, nuanced views that perpetuates inaction, , ignorance and stupidity in security matters, and naif Rules of engagement.
And with so many political corruption i am sure Islamofascists will know any plans before even a final decision...

= worst than any Balkan/Rwanda disaster
Posted by: Anonymous4602 || 04/27/2004 23:07 Comments || Top||

#10  You are starting I think they are the worst thing since Neville Chamberlain.
Posted by: Ol_Dirty_American || 04/27/2004 23:16 Comments || Top||

#11  Watch for them to float terms in the Security Council that are unpalatable to the Bush admin such as total US withdrawal to be replaced by morally superior and financially disinterested 'blue helmets'.

Even making these proposals after chickening out in Iraq is, to put it mildly, unpalatable. If I were GWB, I'd laugh out loud in public if some reporter were to ask about Zapatero's "ideas".
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 04/27/2004 23:20 Comments || Top||

#12  This is Euro politics at it's best.
Spain had balls before this clown was elected. Does anyone really think this guy Zappo has any creditability? He has done nothing but run away. Anzar put this country back on the map. This idiot is going to put them right back to where they were before, a puppet of the EU but mostly for the French and Germans. If he thinks that the French and Germans are going to forgive Spain for being part of the "New Europe", this Zappo moron is one lost ignoramus. Who would you want backing you?The Germans and French or the USA? Looks like a no brainer when you look at it in black and white. I wonder if this idiot even asked himself that question?
Posted by: Long Hair Republican || 04/27/2004 23:38 Comments || Top||

#13 
Spain will ask anti-war allies Germany and France to join in a proposal calling for a U.S. exit from Iraq and a new international presence in the country
Hahahahahahahaha!

I want some of what Zappy's been smoking.
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 04/27/2004 23:46 Comments || Top||

#14  As British Prime Ministers traded back and forth in the years between WWI and WWII, were the British people any less our friends and allies? I don't know whether the Spanish are our friends or whether Aznar was our friend, but I don't intend to judge them on Zippy the pinhead. Remember that the average Joe in Peoria didn't change a wit just because we decided to promote Plains, Georgia's village idiot into one of the most powerful offices in the Free World. We would probably know if we could monitor the calls on Spanish talk radio, but I doubt they have such a thing. I would trust what JFM says over the information that Rueters wants me to receive.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 23:52 Comments || Top||

#15  I publicly apologize for suggesting here right after the Spanish election that Zaperto might rise to the occasion. He is a baffoon who apparently lacks the self-awareness to foresee that his proposal would reveal him as a ridiculous coward.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/28/2004 0:01 Comments || Top||

#16  The Former Anonymous4052

From the desk of PM Zapatero, Spain

To fellow members of the axis of weasels :

In order to show my sincerity as the newest member of your group, I wish tomeet and urgently discuss means of appeasement with anyone who will listen. I invite all of you to meet with me at a time and place of your choosing ASAP.

Sincerely
J L R Zapatero
Prime Minister
Spain
Posted by: BigEd || 04/28/2004 0:06 Comments || Top||


Spain Completes Troop Pullout From Iraq - 'Nuff Said
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 13:27 || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  pussies. AQ will still kill the Spanish.
Posted by: anymouse || 04/27/2004 13:32 Comments || Top||

#2  Yesterday, Iraki insurgents tried to ambush a Spanish patrol. Five bad guys were killed, seven captured for no losses on Spanish side.

Like said in a the "Poema del Mio Cid":

"Oh, how fine a vassal, if he had a good lord".

Unfortunately Spanish soldiers have a scoundrel as their lord.
Posted by: JFM || 04/27/2004 13:36 Comments || Top||

#3  Spain Completes Troop Pullout From Iraq

Not a problem. File it away for future reference.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 04/27/2004 13:41 Comments || Top||

#4  Makes sense. They're going to need the troops at home.
Posted by: Cthulhu Akbar || 04/27/2004 13:55 Comments || Top||

#5  I do feel bad for the spanish grunts - they saw the facts on the ground and i am sure they are not feeling honarable in the way thier govt. pulled out...

i heard we had around 200 or so soldiers take thier place and already did a number on sadr.......
Posted by: Dan || 04/27/2004 14:00 Comments || Top||

#6  Forgot to tell that the day before that very same patrol had been ambushed resulting in two scumbags dead for no Spanish losses.
Posted by: JFM || 04/27/2004 14:04 Comments || Top||

#7  Who you gonna call, Zappy, when the terrorists strike you again? You know they will, they've determined you are an easy mark to make headlines - and they care far more about than than whether or not you are a nice guy or not.

They want Spain in their global conquest - they only care if you intend to make it easy or hard for them. They won't spare you for being nice anymore than a hunter spares a bear who could have killed him but decided not to.

Won't be able to blame Uncle Sam, next time, it will be ALL YOU!!

Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 14:10 Comments || Top||

#8  Spanish left, but the Poles took up the slack. No more Polish jokes.
Posted by: RWV || 04/27/2004 14:13 Comments || Top||

#9  I haven't heard a Polish joke since the late 70's. I think they have fallen out of fashion, particularly due to recent events ... =)
Posted by: docob || 04/27/2004 15:03 Comments || Top||

#10  What's black and blue and floats down the river on its back?

The next person to tell a Polish joke.
Posted by: Eric Jablow || 04/27/2004 17:31 Comments || Top||

#11  Excellent JB, I am now PJ free.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 18:16 Comments || Top||

#12  especially since the Poles essentially started the downfall of the Soviet Union, and took many casualties for the Solidarity cause. Bravery and Poles are no strangers
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 18:26 Comments || Top||


6 new warrants issued for Madrid bombings
The Spanish Interior Ministry has distributed the photographs of five men wanted in new international arrest warrants in connection with the Madrid train bombings. The ministry also issued the photograph of a sixth man, Said Berraj, who was listed in a warrant issued last month, but who remains at large. "The Ministry of the Interior distributes photographs of six other individuals who have international arrest warrants for alleged participation or collaboration in the March 11 attacks in Madrid," the ministry said in a statement, received by CNN, along with the photographs. The five new suspects were identified as Mohamed Afalah, 28; Mohamed Belhadj, 24; Abdelmajid Bouchar, 21; Mohamed Bouharrat, 24; and Hicham Ahmidan, 24.

Spain's largest-circulation newspaper, El Pais, reported last Friday that Belhadj had rented an apartment to suspected terrorists in the southern Madrid suburb of Leganes. The family name Ahmidan already appears twice on the list of 18 suspects already charged in the case -- the Moroccan brothers Hamid and Mustafa Ahmidan. It was not immediately clear late Monday if Hicham Ahmidan is related to them.
My guess is it's the usual family affair...
The only man who appeared in both sets of international arrest warrant photographs -- those issued last month and the new set on Monday -- is Berraj, a 31-year-old Moroccan. Berraj is allegedly linked to al Qaeda through an October 2000 meeting in Istanbul that was attended by three other al Qaeda suspects, according to a copy of his arrest warrant viewed April 1 by CNN. The warrant said Berraj is also linked to the alleged "coordinator" of the Madrid train attacks, a Tunisian man, Sarhane Ben Abdelmajid Fakhet, whom authorities have identified as one of the seven suspected terrorists who died in the Leganes apartment explosion. Berraj also was linked to a Syrian man, Basel Ghalyoun, who is among those charged in the train bombing case with 190 counts of murder and belonging to a terrorist group.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:49:24 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  They've bagged one of the six already:
Mohamed Bouharrat was one of the six suspects whose photograph was released late Monday night by investigators. [He] was arrested in Leganés, the Madrid suburb where seven terrorists blew themselves up after being surrounded by security forces on 3 April.
Posted by: Seafarious || 04/27/2004 9:36 Comments || Top||


Great White North
Immigrant to Canada Expects He Might Be Deported Back to Pakistan
From Jihad Unspun, written by Abid Ullah Jan (not further identified)
I had a meeting with CSIS [Canadian Security Intelligence Service] once against on April 22nd. ... I was told that I have a meting with immigration but it turned out to be a meeting with CSIS agents. I had no problem volunteering myself for interview because of my previous two interviews with them. However it is mid-night 2:57 am and thinking about he questions in the interview and the kind of response the agent had really scares me to death. Due to the severe problems I am facing at home, here in Canada and as a whole in life, I could not sleep well the night before, I was fasting and I cried all the way from my home to the meeting place with the CSIS officials, asking for help from Allan Allah. You can imagine how disturb and stressed I would be at the time of interview to judge the agents reactions.

Now as I think about his reaction and emphasis on some points, I am scared to death. I do not rule out the possibility of an arrest right now or any time from now. But before I go, let me summaries the points which scare me so much that I am all shivering at the moment despite all my trust in Allan Allah and his protection to the innocents.

I have my Masters degree in Chemistry from University of Peshawar and later worked as a lecturer in Chemistry for about three years in a secondary college. Although I hve the next Master degree in Environmental Management and all my life I worked in fields out side Chemistry, the previous CSIS agent also discussed this point seriously. ....

Secondly, he had, like the previous agents, collected a bundle of my articles and there in he zoomed in to few sentences and words. Of course anything can mean differently when read out of context but in some cases the words are right there and ignored, which leads of a totally different meaning. .... an unknown reviewer criticized my contribution to the book The Place of Tolerance in Islam. ....

Finally there was stressed on a person who is known to me since 1982 as our sports team mate when were part of the Athletic team. His name is Sohail Shehzad, later on he moved to Afghanistan and started calling himself Sohail Farooqi there since his sisters were married to the Taliban. .... He established an NGO in Afghanistan, called Afghanistan Humanitarian, Rehabilitation and Development Organisation (AHRDO). He had a registration and references from the Taliban government and the ambassador of Pakistan in Kabul. He approached me in 1998-99 for linking his organization to UNDP for possible assistance in launching a poverty alleviation programme in Afghanistan. I arranged the Taliban officials meeting with a senior advisor to UNDP. The senior advisor to UNDP then send me as a team members on official visit to Afghanistan in July 1999. ....

The last time I met Sohail Farooqi was in August 2001 when he helped me reach Osama for a discussion and possible comments on my book through his neighbour in Kabul who was an Arab. Then came September 11 and the fall of the Taliban and since then I do not know what happened to that Sohail Farooqi as he was a Pashtoon, part and parcel of the Taliban, and in Kabul. So, I do not know about his fate. ...

Then there were questions about an organization that the Pakistani nuclear scientist, Bashir ud din Mahmood had established in the name of Ummah Tameer-e-Nao. I heard it in passing from Sohail Farooqi about it that Bashir ud din Mahmood has established this organisation for helping the poor and war affected people in Afghanistan and that’s it. I was not taking interest in these things .... Anyway since September 11, Ummah Tameer-Nao, is considered as a terrorist organisation, or as far as I can conclude from my meetings with CSIS, because I didn’t hear such things when I was in Pakistan. Founder of Ummah Tameer Nao, Bashir ud Din is a free man in Pakistan, I believe. But I am asked, Dr. Israr wrote a post-word on your book but is he linked to Umma Tameer-e-Nao? For me this is a joke because I met Dr. Israr not more than a couple of times ....

I was also told that some portions of my write ups could be called as “hate speech” and challenged in the court. In total contrast to my interviews with other CSIS agents on the same questions before, I feel really and extremely uncomfortable this time. The more I think about his responses: “Hummmm Chemistry,” and his repeated questions such as: “So you called Sohail you friend????????” the more I get nervous. .....

I just wanted to take down these notes and sent out to well-wishers so that everything is known. Lastly, I swear to Allah that in Pakistan I had problems but I had the peace of mind that worse come to worst, I will leave and settle down in Canada until the situation gets normal. Now, not only I feel extremely un-secure but also I find all doors closed on me. ....

I just do not want to get deported which will turn my problems from bad to worse in Pakistan as I would not be able to even make it outside the airport. ... I request for leaving Canada voluntarily and with honor. I came here in an honourable way, let the Canadian government not send me back humiliated and labeled with worse accusation than I faced in Pakistan. It should let me and my family leave together voluntarily. .... I think the decision has already been taken in my case.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 9:09:55 AM || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Damn right - chemical expert, known links to AQ and Binny. Feel lucky you're not in Gitmo right now. Cheerio!
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 9:18 Comments || Top||

#2  The Canucks were damned fools for letting you come in the first place. Back to the Turd World for you, scumbag, and I hope somebody there gives you what you've got coming. Of course, you can't possibly be afraid to be delivered back into the hands of such devout followers of the RoP as there are in Pakville, could you? May you be the first of many involuntarily deported because people like you don't deserve to live in the civilized West. AMF, and good riddance.
Posted by: mac || 04/27/2004 15:30 Comments || Top||


Home Front: Politix
Village Voice : John Kerry Must Go
Note to Democrats: it’s not too late to draft someone—anyone—else
Oh nuts, it was startin’ to get fun!
With the air gushing out of John Kerry’s balloon, it may be only a matter of time until political insiders in Washington face the dread reality that the junior senator from Massachusetts doesn’t have what it takes to win and has got to go. As arrogant and out of it as the Democratic political establishment is, even these pols know the party’s got to have someone to run against George Bush. They can’t exactly expect the president to self-destruct into thin air.
This is so much fun that fellow bloggers should read this for themselves!

panic - alarm - destruction - famine - plague
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 6:04:32 PM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  As Kaus sez: It's the Torricelli option.....
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 20:08 Comments || Top||

#2  Waitaminnit... I thought the Democrats were supposed to be united as never before?

It's a blessing, I suppose, that my parents didn't live to see what's become of their beloved Party. Yeeesh...
Posted by: Dave D. || 04/27/2004 20:26 Comments || Top||

#3  So what happens next. They try to convince his delegates to vote for someone else? They try to convince Kerry to step down and tell his delegates to vote for someone else? If either happened Kerry would make history, and not in the way I think he'd like to be remembered.

I think he'll tough it out and go down fighting, however meekly, to the end.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 20:39 Comments || Top||

#4  there is some beauty to such a strategy though, if you could get Kerry to go for it, he could go supernegative and trash Bush. Then Edwards shows up all squeeky clean.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 20:39 Comments || Top||

#5  Sounds like the Dems are pulling a Torricelli (last-minute substitution) maneuver. Will they draft Hillary?
Posted by: Zhang Fei || 04/27/2004 20:43 Comments || Top||

#6  If the Dimmy's are taking their marching orders from the Village Voice, they're in even deeper shit then I thought.
But nothing would surprise me.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/27/2004 20:53 Comments || Top||

#7  Methinks they'll try to draft Rudy Giuliani.After coming against the FMA,it's not like he's going to ever become a Republican president - right?So from a purely mercenary perspective,this would be a good time to jump ship.
Posted by: El Id || 04/27/2004 21:05 Comments || Top||

#8  El Id,the Demo's absolutely HATE Rudy.They'll nominate Rudy as their Pres. cadidate the day after OBL coverts to Judaism.
Posted by: Stephen || 04/27/2004 21:21 Comments || Top||

#9  So, the Dem hierarchy will regret screwing Howard the Screech?
Why, for pity's sake?
That tells you where Ridgeway is coming from in this article: the weird-left wing of the Dems, the fruitbats as I (and other die-hard Truman-Rayburn Dems) call them.
The Vietcong Village Voice is practically their journal of record, when they aren't slumming at the Daily Worker.

I knew the lefty fruitbat establishment in the Democratic party would eventually catch on to something I've been trying to tell you guys all along: Lurch is not their man in spite of his moth-eaten hippy rebel credentials.
I thought this revolt would happen after the election, if Kerry happened to win, but the lefties have apparently decided that it is better to demonize Bush for another 4 years than one of their own.
Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy || 04/27/2004 22:05 Comments || Top||

#10  Heh..heh..it took 30 years, but he's finally getting his due.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 22:20 Comments || Top||

#11  If I were running the DNC, I would throw Biden out there late in the game. Edwards, Clark, and Dean are all damaged. Hillary would certainly energize the base but I'm not sure which base. As soon as Kerry is toast, the DNC will run a real centrist. Nader will immediately drop out - he is only there to make Kerry look centrist and to drop out at the last minute passing the bottled-rage of Deaniacs off at the last minute before they can become apathetic and embittered.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 22:33 Comments || Top||

#12  The real problem is, Kerry is the best the Dummycrats have. Kennedy's got more baggage than he's got blubber, and that's saying a lot. Daschle's going to have a hard time keeping his Senate seat. Hillary's political career crashed with the twin towers. Edwards is all image and no substance. Dean is 40 fingernails on a nationwide blackboard. Joe Lieberman would be a good choice, but the Clintons hate him with a fiery passion, and Terry McAuliffe still controls the Democratic purse strings. The only Democrat that could attract centrist voters is Zell Miller, and he's already said he'll support Bush.

It's going to be a very interesting fall...
Posted by: Old Patriot || 04/27/2004 23:52 Comments || Top||

#13  OP, do you think they will be smart enough to go with a low profile guy? Wouldn't it be harder to counter a last minute nomination of Richardson - I think his name is - from Arizona. In each case it has taken quite a while for the populous to develop a disliking for DNC candidate. There may not be enough of a chance for the garbage to ferment in the hot sun before the American people understand the faults of a last minute entry.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 23:57 Comments || Top||


Home Front: WoT
Potentially Dangerous Chemical Stolen In Bogota, NJ
A large amount of chemicals, about 3,300 gallons, have been stolen from a concrete plant in Bogota, N.J. has sent law enforcement officials on high alert, WNBC-TV is reporting on its Tuesday morning news program. The chemical Rheocrete, a form of nitrate, is commonly used to prevent corrosion in steel, but officials said it could be used as a deadly chemical weapon, WNBC-TV reports. Police said they believe the theft of tanker truck in New Jersey earlier this month could be connected. WNBC-TV reports that a nationwide alert has been sent out.
Posted by: TS (vice girl) || 04/27/2004 8:27:17 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


A new wind’s blowing
Via Occam’s Toothbrush/Dhimmi Watch - sorry if it’s been posted before Not editing.

If straight talk of savagery offends you, if you believe in ethnic and gender diversity but not diversity of thought or if you think there is an acceptable gray area between good and evil, then turn to the funny pages, and take the children, too.

This piece is not for you.

We published pictures Thursday of burnt American corpses hanging from an Iraqi bridge behind a mob of grinning Muslims.

Some readers didn’t like it.

We published pictures Thursday of burnt American corpses hanging from an Iraqi bridge behind a mob of grinning Muslims.

Some readers didn’t like it.

Mothers said it frightened their children. A woman who works with Muslim physicians thought it might offend or endanger them.

Well, we sure don’t want to frighten, offend or endanger anybody, do we? That’s just too much diversity to handle. I mean, somebody might get hurt.

We could fill the newspaper every morning with mobs of fanatical Muslims. They can’t get along with their neighbors on much of the planet: France, Chechnya, Bosnia, Indonesia, Spain, Morocco, India, Tunisia, Somalia, etc. etc. etc. Can anybody name three ongoing world conflicts in which Muslims are not involved? Today, where there is war, there are fanatical Muslims. We might quibble about who started what conflicts, but look at the sheer number of them.

One thing is sure. Muslim killers started the one we are in now when they slaughtered more than 3,000 people, including fellow Muslims, in New York City.

Madeline Albright, the former secretary of state and feckless appeaser who helped get us into this mess, said last week Muslims still resented the Crusades. Well, Madame Albright, if Westerners were not such a forgiving people, we might resent them too.

Let’s recap the Crusades. Muslims invaded Europe and when they reached sufficient numbers they imposed their intolerant religion upon Westerners by force. Christian monarchs drove them back and took the battle to their homeland. The fight lasted a couple of centuries, and we bottled them up for 1,000 years. (Now why did Babylon 5 and The Shadows pop into my head?)

Now, a millennium later, Muslims have expanded forth again. Ask France. Ask England. Ask Manhattan. Two-and-a-half years ago fanatical Muslims laid siege to us. We woke up to the obvious. Our president announced it would be a very long war, then took the battle to the Islamic homeland. Sound familiar?

Let’s consider the concept of a “long war.” Last time it was 200 years, give or take.

Anybody catch Lord of the Rings? You know, the good part, the part that wasn’t fiction, the part that drew us to the books and movies because it was the truest part: the titanic struggle between good and evil, between freedom and enslavement, between the individual and the state, between the celebration of life and the worshipping of death.

That’s the fight we are in, and it never ends. It just has peaks and valleys.

There may be a silent majority of peaceful Muslims – some live here – but that did not save 3,000 people in the World Trade Centers, the millions gassed and butchered in the Middle East, the tens of thousands slain in Eastern Europe and Asia, the hundreds blown to bits in the West Bank and Spain, or the four Americans shot, burned and hung like sausage over the Euphrates as a fanatical minority of Muslims did the joyful dance of death.

Maybe we are so tolerant, we are so bent on “diversity,” we are so nonjudgmental, we are so wrapped up in our six-packs and ballgames that our brains have drained to our bulbous behinds. Maybe we’re so addled on Ritalin we wouldn’t know which end of a gun to hold. Maybe we need a new drug advertised on TV every three minutes, one that would help us grow a backbone.

It doesn’t take a Darwin to figure out that in this world the smartest, the fastest, the strongest, and the most committed always win. No exceptions.

Look at your spouse and children. Look at yourself in the mirror. Then look at the pictures from the paper last Thursday. You better look at them. Those are the people out to kill you.

Who do you think will win? You? Or them? Think you can take your ball and go home and they will leave you alone? Read a little history. Start with last week, last month, last year, and every other year back for half a century. Then go back a thousand years. Nobody hides from this fight.

Like it or not, that’s the way it was and that’s the way it is.

But many Americans don’t get it.

That’s why we published those pictures.

If they jarred you off the sofa, if they offended you, if they scared your children and sent you into a rage at mass murderers or heartless editors, then I say, it’s a start.
Posted by: Anonymous2U || 04/27/2004 5:46:30 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Wow
Posted by: Yosemite Sam || 04/27/2004 18:16 Comments || Top||

#2  Posted yesterday, but WELL worth a repeat! Wish this guy's editorials were published in the national press.
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 04/27/2004 18:23 Comments || Top||

#3  Fucking-A!

Send this link out far and wide.

Thx, Anonymoud2U - excellent post!
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 18:24 Comments || Top||

#4  excellent read - even the second time.

Each day, more Americans and Euroweenies DO get it. It's a clash of civilization. It used to be unpc to say it, but not anymore.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 18:46 Comments || Top||

#5  Thank you.
Posted by: RWV || 04/27/2004 19:49 Comments || Top||

#6  B - it's a clash of civilization (us) and the lack thereof (them).

How's that for non-PC?
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 04/27/2004 20:12 Comments || Top||

#7  Why does Islam remind me of the Borg Collective? Mindless drones. "Resistance is futile." (Except that they have nobody as hot as 7 of 9; and if they did, they'd cover her with a camel blanket or something.)
Posted by: Infidel Bob || 04/27/2004 22:51 Comments || Top||


Army Wants Howitzers Back From Ski Areas
The U.S. military is demanding the return of five howitzers that two Sierra Nevada ski resorts use to prevent avalanches, saying it needs the guns for the fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan. Alpine Meadows and Mammoth Mountain received the artillery pieces on loan from the Army and began using them last year to fire rounds into mountainsides and knock snow loose. But the ski resorts received word earlier this month that the Army’s Tank Automotive and Armaments Command at the Rock Island Arsenal in Illinois needs the howitzers back immediately. "I need to have them back in the troops’ hands within 60 to 90 days," said Don Bowen, the Army command’s team leader in charge of the howitzers. "It’s a very short timeframe to get them serviceable and back into the theater in southwest Asia. Afghanistan-Iraq is the immediate concern." The ski resorts said they will comply. "Given it’s a war effort, their needs are greater than ours," said Larry Heywood, Alpine Meadows director of mountain operations.
More at the link. It’s an interesting read.
Posted by: Seafarious || 04/27/2004 5:00:31 PM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  It's almost May anyway. The resorts shouldn't miss the guns for the next several months and will have time to figure something out in case they can't get replacements.
Posted by: Dar || 04/27/2004 17:48 Comments || Top||

#2  John F. Kerry goonnna be pissed........
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 18:17 Comments || Top||

#3  Help Wanted:
Forward air controllers who like to ski.Ability to direct precision air strikes on mountainous terrain a must.Must be able to get results when working w/novice personel.Language requirements-MilSpeak,English,DudeSpeak and EastCoastLiberal.
Interested?Call 1-555-SNO-BOMR
Posted by: Stephen || 04/27/2004 18:27 Comments || Top||

#4  This is a little odd tho.
5 arty guns?

Could this indicate a perceived security risk?
or...
Could this indicate a possible escalation and broadening of conflict. (Syrian/Iranian border? Anyone?) :D

Is the army hurting for the howitzers??? I mean, I didn't think any arty assets were lost in the war. Maybe a few to wear and tear but... hmmmm.

FASCINATING.
Posted by: Anonymous4021 || 04/27/2004 18:52 Comments || Top||

#5  The M119A1's weren't made in large numbers I understand, as the artillery has nearly all gone over to 155's. I think they are the only guns left in the inventory that are helicopter-portable.

Posted by: buwaya || 04/27/2004 19:42 Comments || Top||

#6  Is the army hurting for the howitzers??? I mean, I didn't think any arty assets were lost in the war. Maybe a few to wear and tear but... hmmmm.

They're relatively light and suitable for mountainous terrain. Buwaya's right - not many were made. 155s were most likely determined to be more suitable for use in a European-theater war. The news article noted that the cost of building new ones would be expensive.
Posted by: Pappy || 04/27/2004 22:19 Comments || Top||

#7  Maybe we should buy some D-30's from the Russians. It's a decent howitzer, easily transported, and at 130mm, a decent size weapon. Or perhaps the Russians would "lend" us a few, part of the repayment of "lend/lease" during World War II. The shipping would be a lot less, too - I mean, I'm sure there are still plenty of them in the Ukraine, central and western Russia.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 04/28/2004 0:00 Comments || Top||


Bringing a fallen Marine home to rest
This is Marine Lieutenant Colonel Strobl’s account of escorting the remains of Lance Corporal Chance Phelps home to be buried, as posted by milblogger Blackfive. EFL. Read the whole thing. You will be moved.

Most of the remains are taken from Dover AFB by hearse to the airport in Philadelphia for air transport to their final destination. When the remains of a service member are loaded onto a hearse and ready to leave the Dover mortuary, there is an announcement made over the building’s intercom system. With the announcement, all service members working at the mortuary, regardless of service branch, stop work and form up along the driveway to render a slow ceremonial salute as the hearse departs. Escorts also participated in each formation until it was their time to leave.

On this day there were some civilian workers doing construction on the mortuary grounds. As each hearse passed, they would stoop working and place their hard hats over their hearts. This was my first sign that my mission with PFC Phelps was larger than the Marine Corps and that his family and friends were not grieving alone. . . .

"Tell Britain, ye who mark this monument,
Faithful to her we fell, and rest content."
--The War Memorial, Southport, England
Posted by: Mike || 04/27/2004 4:42:23 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Everyone oughta read this in its entirety.
Posted by: ex-lib || 04/27/2004 17:15 Comments || Top||

#2  Thx, Mike - ex-lib is right...
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 17:32 Comments || Top||

#3  I heard that 3,000 people attended his funeral. The town is only 800 people. Won't be reading that in the NYT or WAPO - now will we?
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 17:38 Comments || Top||

#4  God gives free pass to Marines. It's part of the bargain.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 17:57 Comments || Top||

#5  Yep.
Posted by: Lou Diamond || 04/27/2004 18:07 Comments || Top||

#6  I served with Mike when we were LT's back in the late 80's and early 90's. Like PFC Phelps, LTCOL Strobl is an artilleryman. Marines (and Soldiers) will always take care or our own. I actually received this email last week. Semper Fidelis PFC Phelps.
Posted by: Alofty1 || 04/27/2004 19:02 Comments || Top||

#7  Chicago Tribune usually runs a column 1 - 2 times a week with extended obits of our guys who've fallen in Iraq or Afghanistan. Each obit runs about 4 to 6 paragraphs, and they're always in the first (front) section of the paper. I read every one.
Posted by: Steve White || 04/27/2004 19:20 Comments || Top||

#8  On 4/10 I attended the graveside service of one of the contractors lynched in Fallujah March 31st. The family had gone on record as requesting the public participate in all events. The local TV stations reported "thousands" attended visiting hours at the funeral home, hundreds attended the church's funeral service, and several hundred drove the 50 miles from Cleveland to the National Cemetery where the man was buried. It took a half hour for the funeral procession to enter the cemetery and park for the service. Services covered by the area's broadcast and print media. (In 2003 similar coverage had been given to the funerals of 2 KIA's from Jessica Lynch's unit, those who were from the Cleveland area.) Yesterday one of the Cleveland TV anchors made a slip of the tongue and referred to the fighters opposing the Marines in Fallujah as "terrorists." Attitudes are firming up out here in the hinterlands.
Posted by: Tresho || 04/27/2004 21:06 Comments || Top||


Southeast Asia
13 Said Killed in Thailand Gunbattles
CNN just reported 24 dead. Things are really heating up.
Suspected Islamic militants clashed with police in several gunbattles in southern Thailand Wednesday, leaving at least 12 gunmen and one officer dead, officials said. The clashes erupted after militants launched simultaneous attacks on police bases and checkpoints in several districts of Yala and Pattani provinces, police Maj. Gen. Thani Thawisri told The Associated Press. Officials said the fighting was the heaviest so far this year in the region, which has been plagued by violence blamed on the militants. Thani said several groups of insurgents opened fire at police outposts around dawn, triggering gunbattles, the worst of which left eight militants dead in Banangstar district of Yala province. He said two more insurgents were killed in Yarang district of Yala and two in Nongik district of Pattani province. One policeman was killed and four injured in Kruesie district of Pattani, he said. Pattani, Yala and Narathiwat are Islam's bloody border the only Muslim majority provinces in predominantly Buddhist Thailand. Muslims there have long complained of discrimination in jobs and education.
Posted by: Phil B || 04/27/2004 9:18:09 PM || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  CNN is now reporting 61 dead, 20 'insurgents' surrounded in a mosque.
Posted by: Phil_B || 04/27/2004 22:02 Comments || Top||


Filippino government, MILF row over JI suspects
President Arroyo on Monday ordered Presidential Adviser on the Peace Process Teresita Deles and the panel negotiating with the Moro Islamic Liberation Front (MILF) to present to the rebel leaders evidence that had led to the recent arrest of four suspected Jemaah Islamiyah members in Mindanao. In effectively vetoing a request to release the suspects to the MILF, she simply urged them “to avail themselves of the cease-fire process to thrash out any controversy.” The suspected J.I. terrorists are also members of the MILF. She said, “The peace process must go hand in hand with the antiterrorism campaign to box out terrorists to deny them sanctuary. Both the government and the MILF leadership are committed to fighting terrorism and we must not allow a wedge to divide this common stand.”

In Cotabato City the MILF immediately accused the military of torturing two of the four suspects to force them to confess they formerly worked with a senior J.I. leader and participated in previous bomb attacks. MILF spokesman Eid Kabalu said in a telephone interview Monday that Sammy Abdulgani alias Boy and Abu, Datu Puti Ungka alias Pots, Montasser Ismael alias Raffy, and Badrodin Dalungan alias Badz, are MILF members and innocent of the allegations against them. He alleged having information about bruises and markings from torture on the bodies of their men -- one of them apparently Abdulgani -- and added they are contemplating suspending the peace talks until the suspects are released. The other “confessed J.I. member” had not been publicly identified yet. Kabalu added the MILF will demand that a committee of government and rebel representatives investigate the allegations.

But in another interview in Koronadal City over radio, Kabalu said another thing. He told a radio interviewer the peace talks “would not really be affected” by the arrests and the MILF would still continue talking peace with the government even as he slammed the military for presenting the suspects “without passing through the appropriate channel.”
Meaning to get MILF approval?
“They [military man] bypassed the joint CCCH [Coordinating Committee on the Cessation of Hostilities]. Considering that they are legitimate members of the MILF, they should have first sought the CCCH as this is the appropriate body that should look in the issue,” added Kabalu.
'At's what I thought...
Vice chief of staff Lt. Gen. Rodolfo Garcia, also a member of the cease-fire committee, said he will wait for the guerrillas to file a complaint of mistreatment before discussing with them the allegations against the suspects. On the claim of Kabalu that being MILF members the four should be released, Garcia said that, “Whether they are MILF or not it doesn’t really matter because they were caught red-handed.” Seized allegedly from the suspects were 4 kilos of trinitrotolouene (TNT), 20 rounds of rocket-propelled grenades, 10 rounds of 81mm mortars, pistols and hand grenades.
That does make it inconvenient, but to a true MILF negotiator like Lipless Eddie the facts are irrelevant...
Garcia said the suspects have already confessed to links with J.I. and gave as reason that “the MILF no longer wants to practice terrorism.” In a radio interview the suspects supposedly said their terror activities may not be sanctioned by the MILF leadership.
Thereby putting a nice face on it for MILF...
Kabalu also rejected the claim by Sixth Infantry Division chief Maj. Gen. Generoso Senga in a radio interview that the suspects have confessed their involvement in bombings. Kabalu alleged that Ismael, Abdulgani, Ungka and Dalungan were tortured and were forced to admit during interrogation that they participated in previous bomb attacks on Tacurong City in Sultan Kudarat and Datu Odin Sinsuat and Parang towns in Maguindanao. “It is a standard operating procedure of the military to torture enemies of the State they arrest. Even I myself was tortured before by soldiers,” said Kabalu. “Our Central Committee already asked both members of the government and MILF Coordinating Committee on Cessation of Hostilities to convene any time this week to handle and investigate the allegation of the military.”
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:54:56 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Dang I wish these guys would take a different acronym. "MILF" is just embarassing.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 04/27/2004 11:51 Comments || Top||


Ambon violence enters third day
Fresh clashes erupted on Monday between Muslims and Christians in Indonesia's eastern city of Ambon and officials said the death toll from two days of violence had risen to 23. In the latest violence, a mob of men, many of them wielding knives, attacked dozens of women and children as they disembarked from a ship at Ambon's main port, residents said, but there were no reports of anyone killed in the attack. "Some children were hurt but so far we have received no reports of death," one government official told Reuters from Ambon city.
"nthing to see here. Move along..."
A nurse at the city's Bhakti Rahayu hospital said dozens of children and woman were hurt, including one elderly woman who suffered serious injuries. Police was not available for comment and it was not clear if the mob was made up of Christians or Muslims.
Maybe it's something in the holy water?
Earlier, a city official said the death toll in the violence that erupted on Sunday was 23. Officials put the number of wounded at about 140. It was unclear if any of the deaths were from the fresh clashes or from fighting the previous day. Police have sent 200 reinforcements to Ambon, 2,300 km east of Jakarta. More police and two army battalions are also expected to arrive in the next day. Evening drizzle put out fires from buildings and houses torched by rampaging mobs, once a scenic seaside town but which partly lies in ruins following years of sectarian violence. As night fell, residents reported sporadic gunfire across the capital of the Moluccas as police and army reinforcements arrived to quell the unrest. It was not clear who was firing. "I can still hear some explosions every now and then but it's getting less, maybe because it's already dark," another government official said. Earlier, mobs torched several buildings and part of a Christian university. Shops were closed and public transport was scarce.

Sunday's clashes began after police arrested people trying to raise the banned flag of a little known and mostly Christian rebel group, the South Moluccas Republic Movement (RMS), on the anniversary of a failed independence bid 54 years ago. That anniversary has sparked fighting in the past. Experts on the region said the clashes were not between the grassroots of both communities, who they said were sick of violence. Residents from Muslim and Christian communities, which had been starting to reintegrate, were now wary of passing through each other's neighbourhoods, they said. Interior Minister Hari Sabarno said the violence was not sparked by religion. "This is not a religious matter because it stemmed from the separatist commemoration and there was a group loyal to the Republic of Indonesia showing resistance to such a movement."
"They just happened to have turbans and the other side didn't..."
A U.N. office in Ambon was among several buildings set ablaze on Sunday by mobs wielding machetes, knives and homemade guns. None of the 27 Indonesians working for the United Nations in Ambon was hurt but cars were torched. U.N. official Caroline Tupamahu said she did not expect staff to be evacuated. Thamrin Amal Tomagola, an expert on the Moluccas at the University of Indonesia, said the United Nations was seen by some Muslims as partial to Christians. "(But) the real trigger was the complacency of the Moluccas police. They should have anticipated that every April 25, RMS supporters celebrate the group's anniversary," he said. The South Moluccas Republic Movement has a very small following, unlike Indonesia's separatist provinces of Aceh and Papua, where demands for independence are widespread.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:44:37 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Police was not available for comment and it was not clear if the mob was made up of Christians or Muslims.

Oh just a wild guess that the machete weilding mob who attacked civilians (including children) getting off of a ferry were Muslim.
Anyone willing to bet against me?
Posted by: TS (vice girl) || 04/27/2004 12:49 Comments || Top||


Standoff as cops question Bashir
Indonesian police Monday postponed plans to question jailed Muslim cleric Abu Bakar Bashir as a terrorism suspect after he and his lawyers complained that the summons was legally flawed. "Allahu Akbar!" (Holy shit! God is greatest) shouted about 50 supporters of the elderly cleric as police announced the delay outside Jakarta’s Salemba prison. "Fight American intervention," read posters displayed by members of the Islamic Defenders Front and other supporters from the Javanese city of Solo. "Drag and hang Bush," read one placard.
Friendly folk, aren't they?
Bashir, 65, is due to be freed on Friday after serving a sentence for immigration offences. But his release is uncertain after police formally declared him a terrorism suspect. Hardline and some mainstream Islamic groups say police are being pressured by the United States to keep the cleric behind bars. "I have a conviction that my arrest has been demanded by America. The US government, not American people, are infidels who are fighting Islam and we must not yield to their demand," Bashir told reporters after being visited by popular preacher Abdullah Gymnastiar. "I want to make an enemy — which is America — angry, and that is a good deed," Bashir said.
Congratulations, you've done your good deed. Now die.
Gymnastiar was among several moderate Islamic leaders who have visited Bashir in jail in a show of contempt for perceived foreign meddling in the case. Mohammad Assegaf, a lawyer for Bashir, said a police officer visited the jail earlier Monday to try to serve a summons. But they rejected it since it was only issued Sunday night. He said that by law police must submit a summons three days before a planned interrogation. Had they allowed Bashir to be taken to national police headquarters for interrogation, investigators might have continued his detention till Friday, he told reporters. "On that day they could issue a new arrest warrant," said Assegaf, who insisted that his client has the right to walk free on Friday. National police spokesman Bashir Barmawi said police plan to question Bashir sometime this week and would only determine his status afterwards. Bashir on Monday reiterated that he would cooperate with the police investigation as long as they did not try to keep him in jail during the inquiry.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:39:50 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1 
The US government, not American people, are infidels

About 99% of us are infidels.
.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 7:43 Comments || Top||

#2  um...in America, the American people ARE the government. This concept really just seems to pass these people by.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 7:52 Comments || Top||

#3  The US government, not American people, are infidels About 99% of us are infidels. .

Sounds to me like the entire jihadi world has been clued into peacenut rhetoric. Fascinating...
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 8:19 Comments || Top||

#4  Unreal. And I've never been more proud to be a "red, white, and true blue" infidel, you Islamic morons.

These (types of) guys were spewing this exact same thing at my university more than twenty years ago. "It's the government of the American people, not the American people we have a problem with . . ." At that time they planned to use it as a direct-line strategy against America, by fooling the American people into protesting against the government, and planned on getting their little "message" of solidarity with "Americans" (they like us so very much, you see) out through the press.

Heard it from the horse's mouth.

B: I told them the same thing. And yes, it does pass them by. They have this big bad 'father' image to contend with in their thinking about governments. But they are smart enough to realize that the people have "some" influence on U.S. politics, so . . .
Posted by: ex-lib || 04/27/2004 13:32 Comments || Top||


Syria-Lebanon-Iran
Lebanese Political Leader Exemplifies Arab Analysis of Recent Events
... Who invented Osama bin Laden?! The Americans, the CIA invented him so they could fight the Soviets in Afghanistan together with some of the Arab regimes. I am of the opinion that somewhere, someplace, there is an intelligence agency profiting from Al-Qa’ida and Osama bin Laden. Osama bin Laden is like a ghost, popping up when needed. This is my opinion.

Even 9/11. Since there are many circumstances
 Why didn’t the sirens go off when the four hijacked planes took off? This happened only after an hour and a half or an hour and twenty minutes. That is peculiar. The largest country in the world, with the largest intelligence budget of $70-80 billion for various agencies, could only put out a warning after an hour and twenty minutes?! A peculiar story. ...

[The blast] in Madrid is suspicious. I condemn what happened in Madrid, but it is suspicious
 If tomorrow there will be another bombing, in France for example, who will gain power? Of course not Jacques Chirac, but Le Pen. There is a racist attack against Muslims, and Arabs, Algerians, Moroccans, and Tunisians in France. This is why there is something suspicious in the Madrid bombing. ....
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 8:03:31 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  It sounds as if he is implying that Zappy's leftish leanings are window-dressing and he will soon conduct some ethnic cleansing. Maybe that's why he wanted all Spainish troops back in the homeland.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 22:02 Comments || Top||


Syrian Security Forces Clash With "terrorist Band"
DAMASCUS, Syria (AP) - Attackers firing automatic rifles and grenade launchers fought police in a diplomatic quarter of the Syrian capital Tuesday, witnesses said. Syrian state media said security forces confronted a "terrorist band."
A U.N. spokeswoman said a building formerly occupied by the United Nations may have been targeted.
UN bugged out left before the attack

At least one attacker was killed and another captured, according to initial reports. Syria has not seen such violence in years.
Normally it's a export product

Syrian television, in a brief statement, said security forces gave chase and were in control of the situation. It gave no other details. Syria's official news agency SANA, quoting a security source, said "a terrorist band shot this evening indiscriminately in the Mazza area." Late into the evening, smoke was seen billowing from Mazza and ambulances and police cars rushed to the area, which had been sealed off by security forces.
In New York, Marie Okabe, a U.N. spokeswoman, said the targeted building may have been the former offices of the U.N. Disengagement Observer Force, which oversees an agreement between Israeli and Syrian forces in the Golan Heights. "It is our understanding that a building formerly occupied by UNDOF, which is still known as a U.N. building, may have been hit," she said. "Our preliminary information is that all U.N. staff and facilities are safe and accounted for," she said. The United Nations Development Fund and its Children's Fund also are in Mazza.
Witnesses, who said the violence started about 7:20 p.m. and lasted 70 minutes, gave different reports that could not immediately be reconciled.
What else is new?

One witness said four gunmen came out of a white van on the main Mazza Boulevard in front of the Canadian Embassy and started shooting indiscriminately.
White van, huh? Someone alert the FBI

A police car on patrol in the area rushed to the scene and came under fire. The police shot back and police and plainclothes security forces reinforcements arrived, the witness said.
Note to Saudi, this is how you do it.

Three gunmen were killed and a fourth was taken into custody, the witness reported.
Soon to be very unhappy

Five cars were gutted and there was a fire at the building where the United Nations used to have offices. Police explosives experts were brought to the scene to examine the bodies of the dead gunmen to make sure they were not booby-trapped.
Another witness said the attackers were riding in two cars. Two explosions were first heard and a heavy exchange of fire ensued. More than 15 explosions followed, said the witness.
Syrian political analyst Imad Shuaibi told The Associated Press he had learned that two men "attacked with hand grenades and gunfire near the Iranian and Canadian embassies." "One was killed and the other was captured," Shuaibi said.
Ok, that clears everything up.

Mazza, on the western edge of Damascus, is home to a Saudi consulate, the British ambassador's home, offices of the Iranian state news agency, the Iranian Embassy and the Canadian Embassy are in Mazza.
What you call a target rich environment.

British and Iranian diplomatic officials said their embassies were not targeted in the attack.
Syria has been on the U.S. State Department's list of terror-sponsoring nations for its support of groups like Hamas and Hezbollah that attack Israel. Syria, though, says the anti-Israeli groups are not terrorist, and that it has an interest in fighting Islamic extremist groups like al-Qaida.
And I have an interest in nailing Cathrine Zeta Jones. Neither are likely to happen

Syria has come under intense pressure, particularly from Washington, to crack down on militants based in the country who are opposed to Israel or purportedly entering neighboring Iraq to fight U.S. soldiers. Neighboring Jordan said several suspected terrorists entered the country from Syria last month in a foiled plot to carry out attacks on targets including the U.S. Embassy in Amman, the prime minister's office and the secret service agency. Damascus denied claims that suspected terrorists entered Jordan from Syria and has said it is trying to stop foreign fighters from cross from its territory into Iraq, but that the long, porous border is hard to police.
Uh huh.

During the late 1970s and early 1980s, Syria's hard-line government fought a fierce war with Islamic fundamentalists of the Muslim Brotherhood, which was blamed for a 1980 assassination attempt on President Hafez Assad, the country's authoritarian leader who died from natural causes in 2000. Assad was succeeded by his son, Bashar Assad.
Who ain't his daddy's son.

In 1982, the Muslim Brotherhood staged a rebellion in the northern province of Hama. During the clashes, Syrian forces razed much of the city, killing as many as 10,000 people and finally crushing the Brotherhood after a five-year war.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 4:38:01 PM || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  sounds like "freedom fighters", right, al-jizz?
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 17:38 Comments || Top||

#2 
Syria has not seen such violence in years.
Normally it's a export product
ROFL! You nailed it, Steve.
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 04/27/2004 18:30 Comments || Top||

#3  This is making little sense... I'm wondering if the Kurds got loose.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 20:03 Comments || Top||

#4  this does make little sense...unless it distracts from the latest problems in jordan coming from Syria. "Look we are fighting terrorists too, not just exporting them"
Posted by: scott || 04/27/2004 20:34 Comments || Top||

#5  I agree! Small boom at empty UN building. Very fishy. Next step is Kurds get blamed.
Posted by: Phil B || 04/27/2004 20:41 Comments || Top||

#6  If the official mouthpiece of the Syrian regime calls them terrorists, perhaps they are freedom fighters.

I'd be very surprised if jihadis are actually turning against the Syrian regime. I guess I can't say "shocked" though, since timing doesn't seem to be in their vocabulary.
Posted by: eLarson || 04/27/2004 20:45 Comments || Top||

#7  Wonder if it is Kurdish rebels, being helped very quietly by their cousins to the northeast. Kurds got beat on recently in Syria, and I think the Kurds are world-class grudge-nursers.

Hmmm, Kurdish Syria and Kurdish Iraq, free and semi-independent. A natural for each other. Hmmmm.
Posted by: Steve White || 04/27/2004 21:51 Comments || Top||

#8  One witness said four gunmen came out of a white van on the main Mazza Boulevard in front of the Canadian Embassy and started shooting indiscriminately.

'FBI analyst': Ah, a white van, it was obviously the work of four white male loners... all working together...proabably got their weapons from a gun show in Damascus....

/satire
Posted by: Pappy || 04/27/2004 23:42 Comments || Top||


Explosions heard in Damascus
Newsflash - no link yet...

A hit on Khaled Meshaal? Attack on western embassies/interests?? Internal strife???
Posted by: Lux || 04/27/2004 1:40:47 PM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  {BBC} A series of explosions and gunfire rocked the Syrian capital Damascus on Tuesday evening, reports say. Sources in the city said between three and five explosions were heard starting at about 1600 GMT. The blasts were followed by repeated gunfire. The explosions are said to have occurred near the Iranian and Canadian embassies in the city. They took place on the Mesa highway leading into central Damascus from the Lebanese capital Beirut.
Posted by: Lux || 04/27/2004 13:48 Comments || Top||

#2  Israelis celebrating?
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 13:54 Comments || Top||

#3  Does nobody read the damn labels on their Iraqi WMDs?

"Store at room temperature."

Jeez, Syria, follow the friggin instructions.
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats || 04/27/2004 14:01 Comments || Top||

#4  Dammit Hamid, careful - you let the blue wire touch the yellow wire!
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 14:04 Comments || Top||

#5  LGF poster saying car bomb outside of British Embassy.... 4 other explosions gunfire etc.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 14:06 Comments || Top||

#6  near the Iranian and Canadian embassies

FIGHT! FIGHT!
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 14:07 Comments || Top||

#7  wonder if they had any poison gasses left over from the raid.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 14:12 Comments || Top||

#8  near the Iranian and Canadian embassies

Hmm, will the Canadian's be able to stop the attacks upon them by hanging a banner on the wall that sez "We ain't Americans, eh." ;)
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats || 04/27/2004 14:12 Comments || Top||

#9  Seriously, though, I'd bet this is more of Syria's proxy war. First: funnel jihadis into Iraq, destabilize it. Second: support terrorist attacks against moderate Arab states, for example, Jordan. Third: token terrorist attacks on own soil, aimed at Western nations; any locals killed are propaganda fodder ("we are victims too!").
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 14:12 Comments || Top||

#10  Sky News has this

SERIES OF BLASTS REPORTED IN DAMASCUS

There are reports of a series of explosions in the Syrian capital Damascus, near to the Iranian ambassador's residence.

Up to five blasts, accompanied by heavy gunfire, were heard in an area of the city where the British embassy is located, though the Foreign Office said it was not the target.

The blasts rang out at around 8 pm local time near a district housing the UN representatives' offices as well as the embassies of Canada and Iran, according to the AFP news agency.

Local residents said sirens blared after the explosions and that security forces had cordoned off the area.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 14:14 Comments || Top||

#11  "Between 3-5 blasts, sirens, heavy shooting in western district of Syrian capital Damascus, which Syrian security forces have cordoned off. Damascus hospitals placed on the ready. DEBKAfile’s sources add: Initial accounts indicate area of British ambassador’s residence, Canadian and Saudi embassies in W. Damascus targeted in series of terrorist attacks by car bombs and gun squads. More details awaited."
Posted by: Evert V. in NL || 04/27/2004 14:14 Comments || Top||

#12  Did the security forces have the area cordoned off before the blasts. That is the question...
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats || 04/27/2004 14:19 Comments || Top||

#13  Just in from Haaretz flash:

21:15 Syrian TV reports that Syrian security forces clash with `terrorist band` in capital of Damascus
Posted by: Evert V. in NL || 04/27/2004 14:20 Comments || Top||

#14  guess you can call it short travel time to targets..
Posted by: Dan || 04/27/2004 14:21 Comments || Top||

#15  ...Holy S**t...I'm wondering if the terrs haven't decided to make a play for taking over Syria...

Mike
Posted by: Mike Kozlowski || 04/27/2004 14:22 Comments || Top||

#16  I doubt its state sponsored attacks on the embassies.
1. Totalitarian states generally dont like ANY kind of disorder in their capital - once things look disorderly, you can lose control and ANYTHING can happen. Teheran 1979 was different - there was internal strife within the Revolutionary govt, with the Ayatollahs trying to push out the 'leftists'.
2. The list of targets makes no sense - the Canadians???

No, its either Israelis (kinda makes sense that Meshaal would hide in the diplo district, thinking hes safer there - OTOH didnt the Israelis just say to Zahar that they wont hit him unless Hamas hits them again - why wouldnt this 'hudna' apply to Meshaal?) or internal strife - perhaps with a little outside encouragement;)
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 14:23 Comments || Top||

#17  Do the Israelis use car bombs?
Posted by: Seafarious || 04/27/2004 14:26 Comments || Top||

#18  alternatives
1. It is State sponsored, purely to put on a show of how tough the Syrians are on terrorists ("hey mahmoud, if Karimov can get aid, the Saudis can get help, the Moroccan, WHY CANT WE!!!)
2. The Syrians have covertly been clamping down themselves(due to US pressure?), and now AQ is striking back
3. Or its just people who dont like the govt of Syria
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 14:26 Comments || Top||

#19  The list of targets makes no sense - the Canadians???

They're kufr just like the rest of us.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 14:27 Comments || Top||

#20  FoxNews is saying Arab TV claims 15 blasts heard plus gunfire - locations in Diplo area - near Saudi Amb's residence. Talking head sez this may be Muslim Brotherhood - which Daddy Assad virtually wiped out a few decades ago. He describes it as less strictly Islmaist than Wahhabism - much like the Egyptian version, he sez. Mebbe AlQ Lite? (lol)

So, "they're baaaaack"???
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 14:28 Comments || Top||

#21  Liberalhawk - To the untrained eye Canadians look a lot like us. The slang word, "Eh?" is lost on the 'qadas, etc.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 14:28 Comments || Top||

#22  The list of targets makes no sense - the Canadians??? They're kufr just like the rest of us.

Oh yeah, it makes sense it the perps are AQ, who are targeting Kufr without distinction. It DOESNT make sense if its the Syrian govt, pursuing some political strategy, like Teheran 1979.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 14:34 Comments || Top||

#23  To the untrained eye Canadians look a lot like us. The slang word, "Eh?" is lost on the 'qadas, etc

Again, I was responding to the hypothesis that the Syrian govt is behind it (did they cordon off the area BEFORE the bombs went off etc) I think thats a reasonable question, given that at least some elements in the Iranian govt supported the takeover of the US embassy in Teheran in 1979. I was suggesting that if the Syrian govt were doing something like that at all (which i doubt) they wouldnt pick the Canadians (and I presume Syrian intell and anyone working for them can tell which embassy is which)
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 14:37 Comments || Top||

#24  LH -- Syria supporting AQ would be riding the tiger. In any case, why would they care of the Canadian embassy were hit? What would Canada do?
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 14:39 Comments || Top||

#25  LH -- Syria supporting AQ would be riding the tiger. In any case, why would they care of the Canadian embassy were hit? What would Canada do?
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 14:39 Comments || Top||

#26  Egyptian muslim brotherhood started as broader Islamist, but with a domestic focus. OTOH they gave rise to Sayad Qutb, the UR philosopher of Islamofascism, and the inspiration for antiwestern Jihad, and at least one branch of the "brothers" evolved into Egyptian Islamic Jihad, which later merged into AQ (that al Zawahiri) Mainstream Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood gave rise to Hamas as the Pal offshoot. The Syrian offshoot rebelled against Daddy Assad about twenty years ago, and took over the town of Homs. Daddy Assad then had the Syrian military level the center of town, with, IIRC, at least 10,000 civilian deaths.

Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 14:43 Comments || Top||

#27  Reports that the Damascus UN building is on fire.

I would assume that this was a jihadi group, either directly supported by Syria or operating with tactic approval, that has went 'rouge' and decided to sh*t where they eat.
Posted by: Lux || 04/27/2004 14:45 Comments || Top||

#28  Lh - Spot-on with FoxNews "expert" - only diff was he thought as many as 20,000 died when Daddy wiped out their strongholds. Great BG data, Thx!
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 14:46 Comments || Top||

#29  1. Why would Syria do it? I can understand they might support AQ in Iraq, or to destabilize Jordan. But why would Syria give the go ahead to AQ to launch attacks in Damascus???
2. Canada could cut off trade contacts, and encourage Euros to do the same. Syria dont got oil - their products are much more "boycottable" - Baby Assad has been trying to convince everyone hes reformed so he can get trade and investment. Now if there are elements in Syrian intell who are trying to undermine Baby Assad ..........
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 14:47 Comments || Top||

#30  If this gets out of hand, then the Marines/Army on the Iraq/Syria border may have to deal with refugees.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 14:50 Comments || Top||

#31  I think it's time we all grasp the concept that there are infidels and non-infidels. With this in mind, you don't need to wonder why they attack Spain or France or Syria when it doesn't seem to be in their best interests to do so.

All targets are viable. I said it on another post and I'll say it again...does the hunter shoot one bear over another because one bear could have, but didn't attack him?

NO! He kills one bear over another because it was easier to kill than the others. Given the choice of two bears, he will choose the one which makes a better trophy to place over his mantel.

Everyone needs to let go of the idea that Islamonuts will let those who don't attack them off the hook. They don't pick their targets that way any more than a bear hunter selects his.

Easy kill - good.
Impressive kill - good

Nice bear - meaningless.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 14:52 Comments || Top||

#32  Canada could cut off trade contacts, and encourage Euros to do the same.

You mean like what happened with Saddam's Iraq? That worked well, didn't it?

Sorry for getting you so wound up. It was wild speculation on my part; I didn't expect anyone to go berserk over it.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 14:55 Comments || Top||

#33  B - I wasnt talking about AQ. I was talking about the Syrian govt, based on the hypothesis that they are somehow behind this. They would have a strategy - not having to do with niceness, but with a strategy. In Teheran 1979, it was the US embassy that was seized - not cause everyone else was nice, but cause that was the embassy seizure that could rally the students to the ayatollahs, and could drive the 'moderates' out of the govt, which was apparently the goal of the Ayatollahs. I assume that Baby Assad is strategic, and has a reason for whatever he does - the Assad family are a bunch of machiavellian schemers, NOT nutcases lashing out at all Kufrs. Indeed Daddy Assad was more or less what the left has claimed (incorrectly in my view) that Saddam was - a deterrable survivor, who was rational at bottom. Doesnt mean that the region wont be better off with the Assads gone.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 14:58 Comments || Top||

#34  Iraq - OIL
Syria - NO OIL

Iraq - mad ruler, waiting out the sanctions.
Syria - machiavellian ruler, looking for economic development.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 14:59 Comments || Top||

#35  what with all the bear killin today.
Posted by: muck4doo || 04/27/2004 15:01 Comments || Top||

#36  "what with all the bear killin today."

They were bear necessities, simple bear necessities, metaphor-wise speaking.
Posted by: balloo || 04/27/2004 15:14 Comments || Top||

#37  LH..it's hard to know if it is AQ or Syrian govnt. I'll say first, I don't know.

But I do think that there is some confusion, especially among Euroweenies, Canadians and socialists in their belief that if they just hate the Jews and GW enough..then they can be friends with AQ.

AQ sees the world in black and white: infidels and believers. All infidels are fair game. Being nice, like Zappy, or Chirac, just makes their job easier.

Since Mucky is upset about all the bear killing, think of AQ as serial killers. If a serial killer wants to kill prostitutes...he looks for the easiest target. If she is nice to him, it only makes it easier for him. The bottom line is she's a prostitue. NOTHING else matters. And so it is with AQ and infidels. Once you grasp that, AQ seemingly self-destructive actions make more sense.

They aren't interested in our own conflicts between left and right. Those distinctions are as completely meaningless to them. All infidels make good victims. The more sensational, the better.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 15:19 Comments || Top||

#38  So, has the UN pulled out of Syria yet?
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 15:21 Comments || Top||

#39  Nobody's said Kurds yet. They're the latest victims in Syria.

I find it very difficult to believe that the Muslim Brotherhood would have been permitted to reconstitute in Syria. Daddy did a fine job of eliminating that threat.
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 04/27/2004 15:29 Comments || Top||

#40  Sudanese returning those Syrian weapons, maybe?
Posted by: snellenr || 04/27/2004 15:30 Comments || Top||

#41  sneller...funny.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 15:32 Comments || Top||

#42  from what i have read baby assad does not control the hold over adviser from papas' reign - who are much more militristic...
Posted by: Dan || 04/27/2004 15:36 Comments || Top||

#43  On the other hand,we know lots of people have been getting into Iraq from Syria.We also know US Marines have stepped up patrols on border and have apparently been permanently stopping a bunch.It is just possible that attack(s) in Syria were by bunch of frustrated jihadis who no longer felt they could get into Iraq and fight the Americans.If they can't get into Iraq(may be shortage of guides and smugglers now)why not strike the infidels they can get to in Syria.If this is correct,we will see Syria crack down on the jihadis and no longer accept them,making it easier for US in Iraq.May also be explanation for failed attack on Jordan-if Syria is closed off,the jihadis would have wanted to open Jordan borders.
Posted by: Stephen || 04/27/2004 15:46 Comments || Top||

#44  Nobody's said Kurds yet.

Murat's still in bed.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 15:59 Comments || Top||

#45  Ifin it is the brotherhood, who in the hell do we root for? Or just say go teams? Jeeeeez. This is making no sense.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 20:06 Comments || Top||

#46  Murat's still in bed.

Probably depressed that things aren't "going well" in Fallujah...
Posted by: Pappy || 04/28/2004 0:03 Comments || Top||


Sudan Orders Syrian WMD Out Of Country
via Instapundit
Sudan has ordered the removal of Syrian missiles and weapons of mass destruction out of the African country. Arab diplomatic and Sudanese government sources said the regime of Sudanese President Omar Bashir has ordered that Syria remove its Scud C and Scud D medium-range ballistic missiles as well as components for chemical weapons stored in warehouses in Khartoum. The sources said the Sudanese demand was issued after the Defense Ministry and Interior Ministry confirmed a report published earlier this month that Syria has been secretly flying Scud-class missiles and WMD components to Khartoum. The sources said the Bashir regime has been alarmed over the prospect that the United States would discover the Syrian arsenal and conclude that Damascus and Khartoum were cooperating in the area of missiles and WMD. They said this would have delayed or dashed U.S. plans to lift sanctions from Sudan.
As it should...
A U.S. official confirmed the Syrian missile shipments to Sudan, saying they were meant for use against rebels in the south. But the official said the U.S. intelligence community has not determined that Syria sent WMD systems to Khartoum.
Now where would Syria have got theses WMD’s? Hmmmmm - any f*&king idea Mr. Magoo Hans?
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 9:47:19 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Another vindication of the pre-emptive Bush Doctrine, which has successfully turned WMD's from a perceived asset into a perceived liability.
Posted by: mjh || 04/27/2004 10:45 Comments || Top||

#2  oops - duplicate - need my coffee this AM, apparently
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 10:46 Comments || Top||

#3  ABC, CBS, NBC? This should be ALL over the TV.
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 04/27/2004 11:48 Comments || Top||

#4  Mahmud, then we must hide our WMD, in an allied country that is in negotiations with the Great Satan?

But, Ahmed, won't the allied country reveal the presence of the weapons as a bargaining chip during the negotiations?

Humm, Mahmud, I shall contemplate your objection, but for now continue to operate the pallet jack.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 12:10 Comments || Top||

#5  Actually, there is nothing that precludes the Syrians from having Scuds. Either these missiles belong to Sadaam or the story is kah-kah.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 12:39 Comments || Top||


Terror Networks
Doubts over al-Qaeda having nukes
Al Qaida has claimed that it has acquired nuclear weapons.
Groan, not this again.
But Western intelligence sources still doubt the veracity of that claim.
So do we. For the same reasons?
Islamic sources said Al Qaida procured tactical nuclear weapons in 1998 from Ukrainian scientists. The sources said the weapons came in suitcases and were delivered by the scientists when they visited the Afghan city of Kandahar. The sources, who spoke to such Arab media as the London-based Al Hayat and Qatar's Al-Jazeera television, said Al Qaida could use the weapons inside the United States or against U.S. targets in other regions. Such an attack, they said, would be launched if Al Qaida was threatened with elimination.
The result would be their total elimination, to include the places they came from...
The U.S. intelligence community has long suspected that Al Qaida has obtained components of nuclear or radiological weapons. Evidence of nonconventional weapons were found in Afghanistan in wake of the U.S. invasion in October 2001.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:52:05 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Samsonite Bomb Part XXI.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 8:46 Comments || Top||

#2  This is ridiculous... if they'd received nukes in 1998, they'd have been used in 1998. Moderation doesn't appear to be a word in their vocabulary...
Posted by: snellenr || 04/27/2004 9:29 Comments || Top||

#3  Everytime I read a story like this I think of Back to the Future, in which the Professor sold a suitcase filled with pinball machine parts to the Libyans instead of the nuke they expected.

Perhaps they bought 'nukes'. They probably even tried to set them off once or twice. But you see, even the Russian Mafia is somewhat patriotic (nuke might be used on Moscow after the Chechnya thing), and pin-ball machine parts aren't that explosive.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 10:49 Comments || Top||


Home Front: Culture Wars
Several years later, Hillary speaks out against Sexual Harassment.
EFL - cut various other silliness. Read the articleonly if you’re curious about waht Whoppie said while brandishing a coat hanger.

Democratic Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York urged marchers to vote in big numbers on Nov. 2 to evict an administration "filled with people who disparage sexual harassment laws, who claim the pay gap between women and men is phony ... who consider Roe v. Wade the worst abomination of constitutional law in our history."
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 11:37:12 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


Caucasus
TERRORIST IMPLICATED IN ABDUCTION OF RED CROSS WORKERS DETAINED IN CHECHNYA
Terrorist Viskhan Israilov, implicated in the abduction of the International Red Cross and Prosecutor’s Office staffers in Chechnya in 2002, was detained in the course of a joint operation of the law-enforcement bodies of Chechnya and Daghestan, when he was crossing the border between Russia and Azerbaijan, a source in the republic’s Prosecutor’s Office said.
Posted by: TS (vice girl) || 04/27/2004 8:33:40 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


Iraq-Jordan
More US armour headed for Iraq
THE US military may send more heavy armour to Iraq, the top US general has said, amid concerns that even new armoured Humvees do not offer enough protection as attacks on coalition troops intensify. General Richard Myers, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said commanders have indicated they were going to ask for heavier equipment although he had not yet seen a formal request. “Some of these units, you know, left a lot of their heavy equipment back because the task was not suited to M-1s and Bradleys as much as it is to other means of conveyance and other ways of doing the job,” he said. “So some of them may have changed,” he said. “As the situation changes, they’ll adapt to them.”

The 1st Cavalry Division, which took over responsibility for Baghdad earlier this month, deployed to Iraq without most of its heavy armour because the mission appeared at the time to call for more mobile, light infantry forces. The 1st Marine Expeditionary Force, now fighting in the insurgent-held city of Fallujah, deployed with only about 16 tanks, a marine spokesman said. It has enough light armoured reconnaissance vehicles to equip a battalion, and a smaller number of amphibious tracked vehicles. Both units found themselves thrust into some of the bloodiest fighting in nearly a year soon after arriving in Iraq. Myers said amounts of heavy equipment being sought were modest and did not represent “a major change in philosophy” on the kind of forces needed to fight the war.

General John Abizaid, the commander of US forces in Iraq, had asked for a lighter force tailored to the kind of simmering low intensity conflict that had characterized the conflict after Baghdad fell to US troops last year. But the eruption of fighting in Fallujah, followed by a wave of uprisings by Shiites in Baghdad and several southern cities this month, has raised concerns about the vulnerability of US forces facing escalating urban combat. Newsweek reported this week that an unofficial study by a defense consultant found that of a total of 789 coalition deaths as of April 15, 142 were killed by land mines or improvised explosive devices, while 48 others died in rocket-propelled-grenade attacks.

General Larry Ellis, head of the army’s Forces Command, warned in a March 30 memo that armoured Humvees have not proven to be the solution that the Army had hoped to achieve. He urged that funding be found immediately to double production of light armoured vehicles Stryker vehicles. But Myers said the protection offered by the Stryker vehicles is about the same as an armoured Humvee. Even tanks have been blown over by roadside bombs made with artillery rounds, he said. “None of these systems provide 100 percent protection. That’s the fact,” he said.

He said the military has made a big effort to replace thin-skinned Humvees with armoured Humvees. There are now a little over 2000 of the armoured Humvees in Iraq, about half the number required, and production has been ramped up to the limit of the manufacturer’s capability, he said. But Myers admitted, “The requirement continues to go up as the nature of this fight changes, as we adapt to the enemy tactics.” “And what people forget sometimes, that we’re actually at war here. And we have adversaries that think, and they adapt to our tactics,” he said.
Posted by: tipper || 04/27/2004 6:49:20 PM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I knew this wasn't from an American paper as soon as I saw the title. It's "armor" over here.

British spelling is so cute. :-p
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 04/27/2004 18:59 Comments || Top||

#2  If sent heavy armor over there it probably mean Iran and Syria can start sh*tting themselves.
Posted by: djohn66 || 04/27/2004 19:35 Comments || Top||

#3  Barbara - The English and Americans are two peoples separated by a common language. :)
Posted by: eLarson || 04/27/2004 20:21 Comments || Top||


THE SELF-DESTRUCTION OF SADR: (Link from Allah)
Posted by: Roland || 04/27/2004 17:02 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  In this instance, but not Fallujah, I agree with the thrust of the story: Sadr is doomed because the people of Najaf hate him.

We do what we're doing. Stay out of town. Kill his guys if they come anywhere near the perimeter.
The townspeople and the vigilantes are going to get Sadr...he's a thug and he's unwelcome.

Fallujah is a very different story. Move in and take out those who resist. Period.

I like the way we're playing it right now.
Posted by: RMcLeod || 04/27/2004 19:30 Comments || Top||


Israel-Palestine
Israeli Warships Open Fire off Gaza
Israeli warships opened fire with machine guns off the Gaza coast after nightfall Tuesday, witnesses said. It was not immediately clear what the target was.
Late nite Hamas beach party?
No casualties were reported. Witnesses said there were no Palestinian smuggling suicide fishing boats in the water at the time.
The Israeli military had no immediate comment.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 3:59:18 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  The Palestinian Navy again, most likely. Three guys in a rowboat. To say nothing of the dog...
Posted by: mojo || 04/27/2004 16:04 Comments || Top||

#2  busy combat day.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 16:06 Comments || Top||

#3  or three men and a rubber ducky
Posted by: Dan || 04/27/2004 16:25 Comments || Top||

#4  I'm going with three men in a rubber raft shaped like a duck.
Posted by: Charles || 04/27/2004 16:33 Comments || Top||

#5  It's not fair!
Posted by: AntiPasto || 04/27/2004 16:54 Comments || Top||

#6  Answer: They're own spy satellite picked up close scuba activity.
Posted by: smn || 04/27/2004 17:45 Comments || Top||

#7  It was not immediately clear what the target was.

Damn, evidently I'm a genius.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 19:54 Comments || Top||


Iraq-Jordan
Major shelling attack in Fallujah
A U.S. military gunship and coalition tanks waged a heavy attack Tuesday on suspected insurgent positions in Fallujah, attacking weapon storage sites used by anti-American forces. The fierce attack — captured on television cameras using night-vision technology — produced a series of around 25 explosions. An AC-130 gunship flying above Fallujah targeted its 105 mm howitzer guns on two positions 150-yards apart from each other on the ground, sending showers of sparks and flames into the air. The strike coincided with the deadline U.S. military officials imposed on insurgents in Fallujah to turn in their weapons. It was not immediately clear if there was a direct connection between the two. In recent days, U.S. and coalition officials have suggested they were willing to let negotiators on the ground have more time. But Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld suggested Tuesday before the attack that the talks might not work. "If you've got some very tough people in a city that are terrorists ... you have to expect that they're not going to be terribly cooperative," Rumsfeld said.

Earlier in Fallujah, a city around 35 miles west of Baghdad that has been site of strong anti-American protests, joint patrols of U.S. Marines and Iraqi police that were scheduled to begin Tuesday have been put on hold until Thursday because of violence. Fighting on Monday that was captured by television news crews showed Marines fighting from inside apartment blocks, firing from window to window, stacking up sandbags and eventually calling in airpower for assistance.

Enemy forces in Fallujah and elsewhere have been using holy sites for shelter as they fire upon the U.S. military. On Monday, U.S. troops came under heavy attack, a day after U.S. officials decided to extend a cease-fire rather than launch a full-scale offensive on that city. Eight suspected insurgents and one U.S. Marine were killed. Military officials were hopeful that talks between city leaders and insurgent groups were making progress, and that another offensive would not have to be launched. "The Marines on the ground seem to be quite pleased with the way things are going there" in Fallujah, Kimmitt told Fox News on Tuesday. "I think the sense on the ground is, as long as we're making progress, let's see if this political track can work."
Posted by: Sherry || 04/27/2004 2:51:56 PM || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:

#1  15 - 20 explosions
Posted by: Sherry || 04/27/2004 14:54 Comments || Top||

#2 
Posted by: Yosemite Sam || 04/27/2004 14:57 Comments || Top||

#3  And you know where they store ammo. Seething in 5..4...3...2...
Posted by: Cthulhu Akbar || 04/27/2004 15:00 Comments || Top||

#4  AC-130 gunships pounding two enemy positions, going after ammo dumps, weapons sites.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 15:01 Comments || Top||

#5  Hoooooooo-eeeeee! That blewed up reeeeal good!
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 04/27/2004 15:07 Comments || Top||

#6  Y. Sam - is the battle continuing or is it settling down?
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 15:10 Comments || Top||

#7  So you spend the weekend deciding whether to all-out take Falluja. You pick yes. Obviously you let the enemy (via CNN) think you picked no. Now the hard work starts.
Posted by: BruceBruce || 04/27/2004 15:12 Comments || Top||

#8  Fox sez that moskkks are playing chanting / music -- and it's way past last prayertime. No idea what his means, unless they've suddenly come up with Sun ni John Phillip Sousa...

Regards other story here on RB about laughter / LSD bullshit, this guy is saying the Marines were broadcasting laughter tapes in PsyOps activity.

Appears that this is Marine Cmdr's response to lack of ceasefire (the loonies never stopped) and deadline for the weapons. He gave up on the joint patrol idea because it would just have resulted in getting Marines and Iraqi Spec Forces killed since the bad guys never stopped. Apparently, this is a Marine offensive to shut down the sector of city where concentrations of fighters were known to be - Al Jalan district (Jolan Heights in jarheadspeak, heh) in NW corner of city.

Now commentator is saying that the chanting / music is just Imams reciting Qu'uranic verses. How, uh, typical.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 15:15 Comments || Top||

#9  Apparently there are plenty of secondary explosions going off, looks like they're hitting the right stuff.
Posted by: Jamraza || 04/27/2004 15:17 Comments || Top||

#10  any word if Iraqi SF are participating in the operation???
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 15:18 Comments || Top||

#11  Fox reporting, AC-130 fired 15-20 105mm rounds, secondary explosions seen. Fires are now going out.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 15:18 Comments || Top||

#12  Regards other story here on RB about laughter / LSD bullshit, this guy is saying the Marines were broadcasting laughter tapes in PsyOps activity.

Creative - Well Seasoned - Provocative

And may I add : ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 15:20 Comments || Top||

#13  Sounds like the OP is all air???
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 15:21 Comments || Top||

#14  Apparently they were using tanks as well (according to MSNBC)
Posted by: Jamraza || 04/27/2004 15:22 Comments || Top||

#15  Major Bob on Fox said AC-130 could be firing on one side of the street and troops could be working the other side. Gotta bet those Marines are moving.
Posted by: Sherry || 04/27/2004 15:23 Comments || Top||

#16  What Jamraza said - tank(s) also involved sez Fox, too. No word on whether or not Iraqi SF was participating in ground movements.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 15:25 Comments || Top||

#17  Sounds like the OP is all air???

And forward observers/air controllers.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 15:26 Comments || Top||

#18  Has anybody managed to figure out yet if this is just the Marines beating down a couple of blocks, or are they really going downtown?

Being stuck in a veal pen cubicle sucks...
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats || 04/27/2004 15:27 Comments || Top||

#19  God bless them all and keep them safe. Come home boys and girls!! Come home safe. We're praying for you.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 15:28 Comments || Top||

#20  Any close-up night vision tape will be interesing.

Any more "subliming" Qaedas after encountering the helicopters?
Poof if you reach for that grenade launcher. . .
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 15:29 Comments || Top||

#21  good - prep the field before sending in the troops..
Posted by: Dan || 04/27/2004 15:30 Comments || Top||

#22  Earlier in the day, U.S. aircraft dropped white leaflets over the city west of Baghdad, calling on insurgents to surrender.
"Surrender, you are surrounded," the leaflets said. "If you are a terrorist, beware, because your last day was yesterday. In order to spare your life end your actions and surrender to coalition forces now. We are coming to arrest you."

Bwahahahaha!
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 15:34 Comments || Top||

#23  arrest? snicker, not from what we're seeing. Maybe he meant arrest you as in.. cardiac arrest.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 15:36 Comments || Top||

#24  From a Marine Lt. Col yesterday about the area they are fighting today -- Jolan heights, as com said --

"There may be neighborhoods in the city that are ready for the kind of security that joint patrols can provide," Olson said, adding that the neighborhood his battalion operates in is probably not one of them.

The northwest corner of the city along a huge "S" bend in the Euphrates River has been the main battleground between American forces and the insurgents since the Marines surrounded the city April 5, when they lost their first man minutes after arriving, and where they lost two more in Monday's battle.

The area, known as Jolan, is the old heart of the city, Olson said, with narrow and irregular streets, and small winding alleyways. It is the most densely populated part of the city and military officials say they believe it is home to the largest concentration of Iraqi insurgents and foreign fighters.

Military officials say it could be an extremely difficult place for Marines to fight.

While they said joint patrols and other measures could stabilize some neighborhoods, military leaders said other regions such as the Jolan are still too solidly in the hands of the rebels to venture into without force. In those neighborhoods, mainly in the west, a military offensive seems to remain on the table.

"In areas where we can do that, we're going to do that," Olson said of joint patrols Monday.

In others, he said, "We'll continue military operations where that is necessary."
Posted by: Sherry || 04/27/2004 15:41 Comments || Top||

#25 



Fallujah from CNN

Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 15:41 Comments || Top||

#26  A glorious sight.
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 15:50 Comments || Top||

#27  Now where's that aerial map of Fallujah when you need one....
Posted by: Rafael || 04/27/2004 15:52 Comments || Top||

#28  hi all after a long time, just had to say how much i enjoyed the wicked show in Fallujah this evening, loved watching those buildings going boom,lets hope the MOAB gets its combat debut within the coming days :)
Posted by: Shep UK || 04/27/2004 15:54 Comments || Top||

#29  Rafael et al - We need to know some reference on the map. PS Anyone hearing Hannity - Ollie Noprth is coming up after the break 13:00 PDT/16:00 EDT

Fallujah Aerial Map
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 15:58 Comments || Top||

#30  Don't want to turn in your weapons?...alrighty then.
Posted by: TS (vice girl) || 04/27/2004 15:58 Comments || Top||

#31  #22 Steve that's rockin' good news - I hadn't seen that anywhere else. Prayers for our troops....toe-tags for our enemies.
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 04/27/2004 16:04 Comments || Top||

#32  Amen to that Mr Rex. I also like the laugh track psyops!
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 16:06 Comments || Top||

#33  Hi to you too Shep. That's a purdy big bonfire out Fallujah way...
Posted by: Seafarious || 04/27/2004 16:15 Comments || Top||

#34  Hi there Shep. Didn't see all this on the beeb site!
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 16:19 Comments || Top||

#35  Ollie North Sez -

Crude summary - I was typing as Ollie was talking

Insurgents tried top make a move on a Marine position, responded with toe missles, and then AC130s to places they were being fired on from. The Marines occupied some of the positions in Northwest Fallujah.

1500-2000 jihadists with AK47s, RPG, etc. small-medium arms. Iraqi troops are working with us.

Picking off the jihadis one at a time with night vision goggles and appropriate weapons.

Gen.Mattis says that this is the most effective way to eliminate jihadis, one at a time.

Many jihadis are foreign; from Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria, and Egypt.

Ollie says a Navy Medic he met has been wounded 3 times and insists on staying. Hint hint Kerry.

Ollie left battle zone with some wounded. They appeared they didn't have life-threatining injuries, though a few might be evacuated to Reimsten, GER
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 16:21 Comments || Top||

#36  Welcome back, Shep.

As Howard UK says, "A glorious sight."


"It's gonna be a bright . . .bright, sunshiny day . . . "
Posted by: ex-lib || 04/27/2004 16:21 Comments || Top||

#37  Go Marines! Come home safely and kill the bad guys. (Actually do it in the reverse order.)
Posted by: remote man || 04/27/2004 16:26 Comments || Top||

#38  Didn't see all this on the beeb site!
See what I mean...you can smell/feel their desperation. Do they really think we won't notice? They are soooo desperate, they don't even care anymore.

Bwahhahahahahaaaaaaa! It's almost painful to watch.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 16:27 Comments || Top||

#39  Anybody see the marine engagment on CNN just seconds ago? It was from days ago, but it showed the marines under fire and calling in an airstrike. BTW, they were swearing at the terrorists.
Posted by: Charles || 04/27/2004 16:31 Comments || Top||

#40  "Iraqi troops are working with us. Picking off the jihadis one at a time with night vision goggles and appropriate weapons."
Neener-neener-neener to J. F'himself Kerry and Sen. Hillary, Queen of the Dead (Fallujans)!

"Many jihadis are foreign; from Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria, and Egypt."
So, this is a multicultural experience for them.

This just in: Islamic "paradise" running short of virgins!
Oh well, they've always got each other to fall back on. And the sheep in Iraq can finally breathe a sigh of relief. Sounds like a win-win for everybody.
Posted by: ex-lib || 04/27/2004 16:31 Comments || Top||

#41  Yeah Charles, saw that. I didn't get what happened to that Marine near the end of the clip? Did he get hit? M203 misfired?
Posted by: Rafael || 04/27/2004 16:35 Comments || Top||

#42  Sun ni John Phillip Sousa...
Ifin the culture could do that we would be fighting em.

52 get a name we need you.

I'm thinkin this is scambling the eggs o the battlefield.
YOU AIN'T SEEN NOTHING YET
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 16:36 Comments || Top||

#43  Did he get hit? M203 misfired?

If I heard right he suffered a minor flesh wound from a richocheting bullet. Not bad enough to take him out of the fight though, not by a long shot.
Posted by: Charles || 04/27/2004 16:38 Comments || Top||

#44  WTF!? CNN just showed a political cartoon with Bush looking like a dummy with big ears and saying " Iraq is not like Vietnam........I actually went to Iraq. "

Even when our soldiers are risking their lives they have to take a pot-shot at Bush!
Posted by: Charles || 04/27/2004 16:44 Comments || Top||

#45  To Shipman et al - I will change from A4052 to BigEd tomorrow. I want to keep A4052 for the rest of the day for consistencey sake.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 16:50 Comments || Top||

#46  Cool 52. The AC130 are laying down 105 fire. I'm thinking the pause at least gave the air forces a few minutes to update targets.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 16:52 Comments || Top||

#47  Just watching the BBC news here
did you know the yanks are losing?

I'm going back to throwing more stuff at the T.V. now. This is getting a bit to silly.
Posted by: Evert V. in NL || 04/27/2004 17:07 Comments || Top||

#48  I wouldn't say losing from the camera shake. maybe the cameraman was being blown at the time.
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 17:16 Comments || Top||

#49 

Yup, BBC, looks like the Marines are losin' it to me!
It's as plain as that light in the night sky.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 17:28 Comments || Top||

#50  Check out the link, video from inside Falluja, Marines dug in some Iraqi's house.
Posted by: CobraCommander || 04/27/2004 17:51 Comments || Top||

#51  I was in Paris a few years ago and the tour guy stated that Napolean tore down all the gheto buildings and rebuilt the areas with the large roads and bigger public housing. This was done to make it easier to control the city. Sounds like the NW part of Falluja could use this tactic.
Posted by: Patrick || 04/27/2004 18:24 Comments || Top||

#52  Some good eyewitness accounts in the BBC. Still hard to figure out the target. It wasn't the UN building or the embassies. Apparently it occurred in an area with lots of Baath party housing.
Posted by: 11A5S || 04/27/2004 18:42 Comments || Top||

#53  "Eyewitness Accounts" link above is to BBC's story on explosions in Damascus, Syria.
"There were at least a dozen blasts and several rounds of gun fire," one witness told BBC News Online.
"We could hear the explosions which began around 7pm and continued sporadically for at least 15 minutes. We could also see smoke rising from the Mezze area."

And it's Another ('scuse me, where's my helmet) Exciting Evening in the Middle Eeast.
Posted by: Old Grouch || 04/27/2004 19:01 Comments || Top||

#54  BTW, they were swearing at the terrorists.

I'm taking note of this and it will be reported.
What's that man's Number?
11 Sir.

Write it down!
Yes Sir.

Now Erase It!
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 19:44 Comments || Top||

#55  Wrong thread. Sorry.
Posted by: 11A5S || 04/27/2004 19:53 Comments || Top||

#56  To answer a question posed much earlier, I just heard on FoxNews from Ret. Marine Col Ed Badolato that there is a battalion of Peshmerga operating with the Marines. He mentioned something to the effect that they were prolly quite happy to be allowed a chance to get a shot at the Sunnis, heh.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 20:10 Comments || Top||

#57  Damn. Just got home and I missed all of the fireworks.

Any good online vids out there?
:(

I saw the Foxnews one. Kinda meh, but that's a shitload of firing there.
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/27/2004 20:50 Comments || Top||

#58  I suppose that by asking for their arms, the Marines could be called the Falluja branch of Handgun Control, Inc.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 04/27/2004 22:13 Comments || Top||


Israel-Palestine
Sharon Threatens ’Much Harsher’ Reprisals
Israel’s response to Palestinian violence after its pullout from the Gaza Strip would be harsher than its present military operations, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said Tuesday. Interviewed on Israel’s Channel 10 TV for Israel’s independence day, Sharon defended his "unilateral disengagement" plan, including a pullout from the Gaza Strip. Members of his Likud Party vote on the plan in a referendum on Sunday. After a pullout, Palestinians could no longer explain violence by saying that Israel was occupying their land, Sharon said, "and Israel’s responses (to violence) would be much harsher."

He refused to give specifics, beyond noting that Israel is already taking stiff measures, an apparent reference to the killing of Hamas founder Sheik Ahmed Yassin on March 22 and his successor, Abdel Aziz Rantisi, three weeks later...
Posted by: Lux || 04/27/2004 1:21:05 PM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I would assume this is because without settlers to act as launching off points for any raids the IDF will be forced to use much more brutish tactics if they ever have to into Gaza again. Either that or just bomb 'em with missiles.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 15:08 Comments || Top||

#2  If Israel pulls out and Gaza attacks Israel, then it's scorched earth time. A strip of Gaza will then become a barren DMZ. Seems obvious -- and probably unavoidable in the long run.
Posted by: Tom || 04/27/2004 15:43 Comments || Top||

#3  He's so polite. The message: "After we pull out, the whole damn area's a free-fire zone, so DON"T PISS US OFF!"
Posted by: mojo || 04/27/2004 15:45 Comments || Top||

#4  I see a best seller circa 2006

"I Remember Gaza"
Posted by: Abu Bug-eyed Screen Star || 04/27/2004 19:56 Comments || Top||


Robbers die trying to hold-up suicide bomber
A Hamas suicide bomber blew up two armed Palestinians who tried to rob him at gun point in the Gaza Strip. Hamas claimed the “stickup men” worked for Israeli intelligence, while Palestinian security forces said the two were ordinary thieves. Rather than give up his explosives, the bomber detonated them, killing himself and the two robbers near the border fence between Gaza and Israel.

Palestinian security officials said the the gunmen were criminals who were involved in a car theft ring that brought stolen vehicles from Israel to Gaza. Hamas said the bomber was on his way to try to infiltrate into Israel, accompanied by another Hamas member and a guide, when they were stopped by the armed men. The robbers forced the bomber to lie on the ground and tried to steal the bomb, but the militant detonated it, killing all three. The other Hamas man and the guide escaped.

There have been cases of rival groups stealing each other’s explosives, but no group claimed the two gunmen, and their families did not go to the hospital to take the bodies, indicating that the two were not militants, who are revered in Palestinian society...
Posted by: Lux || 04/27/2004 1:09:46 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  When Hamas makes a citizen's arrest they don't mess around.
Posted by: Stephen || 04/27/2004 13:20 Comments || Top||

#2  thing are in bad finanshul shape when they are have to rob and steal just to get decent suicide belt.
Posted by: muck4doo || 04/27/2004 13:25 Comments || Top||

#3  p.s. antiwar going be pissed about this as being oppresion.
Posted by: muck4doo || 04/27/2004 13:25 Comments || Top||

#4  when they are have to rob and steal just to get decent suicide belt.

that was funny..mucky.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 13:30 Comments || Top||

#5  Ye Gods! What was the robber's approach? "Your suicide bomb or your life?"
Posted by: Mike || 04/27/2004 13:33 Comments || Top||

#6  Now I know wherethe writers for SNL get their inspiration. Life immitates Python.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 13:37 Comments || Top||

#7  And then this necrophiliac walks by and....
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 13:38 Comments || Top||

#8  I'm sure either the Joooooos or Bushitler or one of his evil minions actually orchestrated this boom.

It's the only logical explantion.
Posted by: spiffo || 04/27/2004 13:44 Comments || Top||

#9  If crooks wanted to steal a suicide bomb-belt there has to be a market for them.What kind of sales pitch do you make on a suicide bomb belt-"It's cherry,never been used.Feel the fine Corinthian leather behind the explosives."What kind of deposit do you have to give if you ask "Can I take the belt for a test drive?"
Posted by: Stephen || 04/27/2004 13:44 Comments || Top||

#10  muahaha! this just too funny!
Posted by: Anonymous4602 || 04/27/2004 13:49 Comments || Top||

#11  I'm thinking the pali peoples are ready for a state.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 13:52 Comments || Top||

#12  No, Ship, they're already in a state. I'll leave to your imagination just which one it is. Hint: insanity would be a good start.
Posted by: mac || 04/27/2004 14:00 Comments || Top||

#13  "Dude, you don't want my wallet."
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats || 04/27/2004 14:02 Comments || Top||

#14  hehe they must be nuts stealing cars in Isreal and then driving them to Gaza . Just confirms it when they attempt to rob some poor unsuspecting suicide bomber on his way to work ! JEEZ hehe . and thats just your average joe thief over there !
Posted by: MacNails || 04/27/2004 14:51 Comments || Top||

#15  Oh, my, from a law-enforcement POV, that was certainly...ummm...effecient. And funny, in a warped and perverted kind of way. Sure is hard being a working satirist, these days.
Posted by: Sgt. Mom || 04/27/2004 14:59 Comments || Top||

#16  Just shows that the Israeli incursions, bank seizures, and the 'Wall' are having an affect on the paleos ability to get bomb materials. Of course you have to love the sheer irony of trying to rob someone of a suicide belt! In the words of Dr. Phil: "What the hell were you thinking!" Question to Korann Scholars: Do any of these three 'brave arabs' get into heaven? Do they get 72 virgins, just two, or do they have to share?
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 04/27/2004 15:02 Comments || Top||

#17  "Mamhoud, this one has a radio in his fanny-pack, see the wires coming out of it? Help me open . . . ." BOOOOOOOM!!!!
Posted by: sludj || 04/27/2004 15:41 Comments || Top||

#18  now this is funny......thief just stole my booooms
Posted by: Dan || 04/27/2004 17:04 Comments || Top||

#19  ROFLMAO! That's priceless. Somebody nominate the 2 thieves for a Darwin Award!

As we say in the rescue business, "Too stupid to live should be a valid diagnosis." (And in this case, it was. :-p)
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 04/27/2004 18:25 Comments || Top||

#20  The Palestinian Anti-Mugging Device! Coming soon to a souk near you...
Posted by: Pappy || 04/27/2004 23:30 Comments || Top||


Hamas Fugitives Gunned Down
Israeli troops killed two Hamas fugitives and seriously wounded a third in a gun battle in a West Bank refugee camp today. The firefight erupted after troops raided the Tulkarem refugee camp in the northern West Bank with jeeps and armoured personnel carriers, and conducted house-to-house searches. The wounded man was taken to an Israeli hospital. The Israeli military said the three had been involved in attacks on Israelis, but would not elaborate.
"I can say no more."
In the Gaza Strip, the body of a third Palestinian was found early today near the scene of an explosion last night. Security officials initially said two Palestinians died in the blast near the border fence with Israel, on the edge of the Mughazi refugee camp. Palestinian reports said the three were killed when a rocket they were setting up exploded prematurely.
"Mahmoud, do you need a flashlite?"
"Nah, all I need to do is connect these two..KABOOM!"
However, Palestinian security officials said they also heard the sound of machine gun fire after the blast. The Israeli military said it had no forces in the area.
"Nope, wasn't us."
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 12:54:25 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


Home Front: Tech
General Touts U.S. Missile Defense Plan
"Attention, Kimmie" EFL - caught via Drudge
The chief of the military’s missile defense programs said Tuesday he expects to be able to protect all of the United States from a North Korean attack by the end of 2004, but said failures in two upcoming tests could mean "big problems" for the controversial program. Air Force Lt. Gen. Ron Kadish, director of the Missile Defense Agency, told reporters that a decision when to put the first missile interceptors on alert has not been made, but that plans call for several to be ready to fire by September.

By the end of the year, close to 10 interceptors are expected to be on alert at two sites: Fort Greely, Alaska, and Vandenberg Air Force Base, Calif. They will be linked to a specialized radar able to track inbound missiles over the Pacific Ocean. But the interceptors face two upcoming tests of their ability to find and destroy incoming ballistic missiles, the first expected in late spring or early summer. "If they both fail, we’ve got big problems," Kadish said. "We expect them to be successful."

He stopped short of saying two failures would delay deployment of the first interceptor missiles in Alaska. Officials note those first interceptors will serve a dual role: as subjects of further testing, as well as actual defenses in an emergency. The Bush administration has made the deployment of missile defenses a key aspect of its national security policy, saying it is vital to defend the nation against missiles launched by hostile nations
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 12:24:45 PM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I hope the Gipper has a few lucid moments now and then, so he can see his dream starting to come true.
Posted by: Jackal || 04/27/2004 16:59 Comments || Top||


Iraq-Jordan
Lileks on the Jordan Chemical Plot
GRTWT (Go Read The Whole Thing)
This is just an odd story, for many reasons. It hasn’t gotten much play in the last week. It might not get play in the future because a confession in an Arab state often involves jumper cables.
I wish I'd said that.
The report says they intended to mix a combination of 71 lethal chemicals, which they said has never been done before, including blistering agents to cause third-degree burns, nerve gas and choking agents.

If it’s all true, then it would seem to indicate that they guys lack the tactical acumen. They have several goals: first, get the US out of the region. Second, destroy all the regional governments they don’t like. Third, conquer the world. If they were as crafty and canny as feared they’d take these steps in the proper order, but they appear to want to do #1 and #2 simultaneously, which is remarkably stupid. The US, in response to terror attacks in Iraq, will carefully attempt to convert the miscreants to jam, if that’s what it comes down to. But if the Al Qaeda et al hits Saudi Arabia and Jordon before achieving the first objective, they just get more grief: Arab governments are less likely to play nice. They’re more likely to disappear huge numbers of people, raze villages, apply cheese graters to your scalp to get confessions, etc. Your average Jordanian may be passively rooting for American defeat out of the usual stupid sense of solidarity, but take out 15 blocks in Amman and suddenly he wants something done against these guys. This may be the one thing that makes the Arab Street rise up: it gets leveled, by Arabs.
Note to self: add "cheese grater" to style book.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 10:31:18 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Abdul, do I add the Mr Clean before I add the 7 cups of Comet cleanser?

Akmed, you fool, that is Windex not Mr Clean. Flush the toilet and we shall start anew.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 11:51 Comments || Top||

#2  I refer to my earlier post on an article re: same subject - - -

It has been decreed that there are no WMDs
Hans Blix, John Kerry, and Sean Penn say so.

Chemical weapons?
Just somebody trying to steal the recipe for Raid Roach Killer

Bio Weapons?
Simply Manufacture of Smallpox and Anthrax Vaccines!

This isn't chem or bio weapons. Just like all the rest we've heard about the past year. . . .

King Abdullah is paranoid, don't you know. How could you ever think this is a special find. Why this would ruin CNNs constant diatribe about Bush lying. Now we can't have that can we?
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 12:26 Comments || Top||

#3  Maybe the Mujahideen are updating their handbook
Posted by: tipper || 04/27/2004 19:10 Comments || Top||


Africa: North
Not all that Glitters is Gold: Gaddafi to West: Don’t Force us Back to Bombing
EFL
Hat tip to LittleGreenFootballs
Libyan leader MadHatter Muammar Gaddafi appealed to the West Tuesday to take up Libya’s offer of peace and not force his country back to its old days of sponsoring and harboring what he called "freedom fighters."
That'd be a real bad move.
"We do hope that we shall not be obliged or forced one day to go back to those days when we bomb our cars or put explosive belts around our beds and around our women so that we will not be searched and not be harassed in our bedrooms and in our homes, as it is taking place now in Iraq and in Palestine."
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 04/27/2004 11:17:39 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Okay. I am an assclown. I meant to write: Not All that glitters is gold.
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 04/27/2004 11:19 Comments || Top||

#2  If you had said, "All that glitters is not gold"
you would have been spot on.
You won't go wrong if you assume that most Arabs are base metal.
Posted by: tipper || 04/27/2004 11:30 Comments || Top||

#3  PUter?
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 11:41 Comments || Top||

#4  Mumu still has a natural inclination to extort the West. Didn't he have a daughter, at one time?
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 11:54 Comments || Top||

#5  This isn't any surprise. The unwillingness to use decisive force to deal with Fallujah and al-Sadr is being seen as wobbling, and people like Quedaffy are noticing.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 04/27/2004 12:22 Comments || Top||

#6  Quadaffi probably expected iran and syria to be overrun at this point. Our tolerance in Iraq ties down troops there is taken as weakness, and he is feeling a little too secure.
Posted by: flash91 || 04/27/2004 14:14 Comments || Top||

#7  Gaddafi is just playing to his audience. He plays nice with the US, but realizes the Europeans can be threatened easily enough so he talks threatening. Nothing concrete so he can backtrack.

Isn't France still threatening to hold the sanctions on Libya if Qaddafi doesn't fork over more money for that French plane the Libyans downed?
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 15:19 Comments || Top||

#8  Exactly right Ruprecht--this is a shot across the bow at Brussels
Posted by: Not Mike Moore || 04/27/2004 20:43 Comments || Top||


Iraq-Jordan
Confessions of Al-Qaida Suspects Who Allegedly Planned Attacks Aired
Al-Qaida plotted bomb and poison gas attacks against the U.S. Embassy and other targets in Jordan, suspects confessed in a videotape that aired Monday on Jordanian state television. A commentator said the plotters hoped to kill 80,000 people. One of the alleged conspirators, Azmi al-Jayousi, said he was acting on the orders of Abu-Musab al-Zarqawi, a Jordanian wanted by the United States for allegedly organizing terrorists to fight U.S. troops in Iraq on behalf of al-Qaida. U.S. officials have offered a $10 million reward for his capture.

Al-Jayousi, identified as the head of a Jordanian terror cell, said he met al-Zarqawi in neighboring Iraq to plan the attacks. The 20-minute taped program contained what were described as confessions by the suspects, who were arrested a month ago. Officials said four terror suspects believed linked to the conspiracy died in a shootout with police in Amman last week. A commentator on the tape, who wasn’t further identified, said the plotters targeted Jordan’s secret service, its prime minister’s office and the U.S. Embassy. "At least 80,000 people would have been killed," the commentator said. Al-Zarqawi "is the terrorist" who plotted this operation."

Another Jordanian suspect, car mechanic Hussein Sharif Hussein, was shown saying al-Jayousi asked him to buy vehicles and modify them so that they could crash through gates and walls. The bearded Hussein, looking anxious, said al-Jayousi told him the aim was "carrying out the first suicide attack to be launched by al-Qaida using chemicals ... striking at Jordan, its Hashemite (royal family) and launching war on the Crusaders and nonbelievers."

"I have pledged loyalty to Abu-Musab to fully be obedient and listen to him without discussion," al-Jayousi said in the Jordanian television segment. He said he first met al-Zarqawi in Afghanistan, where al-Jayousi said he studied explosives, "before Afghanistan fell." He said he later met al-Zarqawi in Iraq, but was not specific about when. The videotape also showed still photographs of al-Jayousi and nine other suspects. The commentator said four had been killed in clashes with security forces. Three of the slain men were identified as Syrians. But Syria has denied Jordanian claims that militants involved in the plot entered Jordan from Syria. Al-Jayousi said he received about $170,000 from al-Zarqawi to finance the plot and used part of it to buy 20 tons of chemicals. He did not identify the chemicals, but said they "were enough for all the operations in the Jordanian arena."

Images of what the commentator said were vans filled with blue jugs of chemical explosives were included in the broadcast. Hussein, the car mechanic, said he met al-Jayousi in 1999 but did not clearly say when the terror plans were laid out. Al-Jayousi said he and Hussein bought five vehicles, including a truck which was to be filled with explosives and used to attack the intelligence department. At least two vehicles had forged license plates and car registrations. Citing unidentified technical experts, the commentator said al-Jayousi had made enough explosives to cause "two explosions - conventional and chemical - which were to have directly affected an area within a 2-kilometer (one mile) radius." Al-Jayousi said he began making the explosives in a secret lab. Another detained terror suspect, Ahmad Samir, said that he worked in one of the labs for two months. "I never had the chance to leave it at all ... for the protection of the operation."

No trial date has been set in the case. Airing suspects’ confessions before their trial is unusual in Jordan. In 1998, six men accused of affiliation with a militant group confessed on television to planting a bomb that exploded outside an Amman hotel. Five years later, a court found them innocent. The unusual move may be an attempt to answer critics who claim the government has exaggerated the terror danger to justify tightening security. Officials in Jordan, a moderate Arab nation with close ties to the United States and a peace treaty with Israel, say the kingdom has been repeatedly targeted by al-Qaida and other militant groups.
Posted by: Jesika Espinola || 04/27/2004 1:22:58 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This plot reeks of some government's involvement. Look at the resources these people had. $170K in funds and a dozen or two people, equipment, supplies and a year or so in preparation. Where are all these resources and support coming from? Someone with deep pockets is funding the Jihadis-- private Saudis, Syria, or Iran are paying for all this.
Posted by: Anony-mouse || 04/27/2004 11:03 Comments || Top||

#2  Any reports on what the stuff was? Some said it was a binary compound mixable in the field. Like the VX Saddam wouldn't account for, and which Blix later said didn't exist...
Posted by: Ptah || 04/27/2004 11:15 Comments || Top||

#3  ptah - source on VX? all ive heard is sulfuric acid and other widely available bulk chemicals.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 11:18 Comments || Top||

#4  all ive heard is sulfuric acid and other widely available bulk chemicals.

Yeah, that's all I've been able to find. Looks like they learned chemistry from the Koran. If one chemical is bad, two are more bad. Seems like the plan was to buy everything that said "hazardous" on the lable, pile it on a truck, add explosives and hope for a large body count.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 11:26 Comments || Top||

#5  pardon, my error. The CNN report DOES quote Jordanian sources that there were nerve and blistering agents. Dont say which ones. We'll see
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 11:30 Comments || Top||

#6  From the Australian: Government sources say the cocktail of chemicals planned to be used included acetones, nitric acid and sulphuric acid.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 12:24 Comments || Top||

#7  The 20-minute taped program contained what were described as confessions by the suspects, who were arrested a month ago.

But of course. The tape was made earlier. The suspects don't look so good now.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 13:02 Comments || Top||


He Who Hesitates
OUR troops in Iraq are fighting a 21st-century war. And they’re winning on the battlefield. But they’re being defeated by diplomats seeking a 20th-century peace.
Paul Bremer, Washington’s scoutmaster in Baghdad, is a solid, hardworking 20th-century bureaucrat. But the future of Iraq - and the entire Middle East - demands a 21st-century strategist who can escape the cant of the foreign-policy establishment and the lure of failed models of nation-building.

We created the problem of Fallujah - through neglect. Had we had adequate forces on hand a year ago in the immediate aftermath of combat to permeate the Sunni Triangle with troops, and had the administration had the clarity of vision to declare martial law, the current violence would have been averted.

Instead, we handed gold-plated lollipops to killers and worried about hurting the feelings of Saddam’s hard-core supporters. We looked away as the terrorists gripped one Iraqi city after another - because we lacked the forces to put a military "cop" on every beat. Our enemies didn’t need to hide - we weren’t around often enough to see them.

Nonetheless, when the revolt began in Fallujah earlier this month, our Marines, supported by the U.S. Army, hammered the terrorists into the dirt. We took casualties - but the losses were overwhelmingly on the enemy’s side, as they always should be.

The Coalition Provisional Authority’s response? And the Bush administration’s? They made the Marines stop well short of the goal post. Listening to Iraqi leaders who have their own personal power - not Iraq’s interests or ours - at heart, our civilian leadership ordered the Marines to break off combat operations before the job was finished. We let the terrorists off the ropes, granting them time to recover for another, inevitable round.

Next, I suppose we’ll establish a DMZ.



Since the cease-fire, our troops have had to endure the ludicrous charade of "negotiations" with the Fallujah city fathers - breaking the rule that we never negotiate with terrorists or their surrogates. The resulting "agreement" to turn in heavy weapons led to the mockery of sending the Marines a pick-up truck full of junk while the terrorists gained weeks to prepare their defenses, construct ambushes and organize a far tougher resistance than they could have presented two weeks ago.

Our enemies are laughing at our folly, while creating a myth of heroic resistance in Fallujah - for which we will pay dearly in the months and years ahead.

Make no mistake: There can be no compromise in Fallujah. If we stop one inch short of knocking down the last door in the last house in the city, our enemies will be able to present the Battle of Fallujah to their sympathizers as a great victory: They fought the Americans to a stalemate (with the implication that, next time, the Americans will be defeated and driven from the Middle East).

Of course, we could defeat them. We know that. But in the broken world between the Bosporus and the Indus, seductive lies trump hard facts. Our insipid diplomacy plays into the hands of our enemies: It looks like cowardice. And it is.

We must not only win, we must be seen to win, graphically and decisively.

"Experts" warn that we mustn’t alienate the hard-core Sunnis or the fundamentalist Shia’s. Wake up and smell the cordite: They’re already alienated. They’ll never love us. So we’d better make damned sure they fear us.

The Battle of Fallujah isn’t about one city. It’s about the future of the entire Middle East. Despite the low number of casualties in historical terms, this could prove to be one of the decisive battles of history in its long-term effects.

We must win. If the enemy fights from mosques, level the mosques. If they fight from hospitals, gut the hospitals. If they open fire from orphanages, turn them into blackened shells. We cannot allow terrorists any sanctuaries. The men we face - and the watching world - interpret our decency as weakness.

The diplomats have had their chance. Now it’s time to fight.

Unfortunately, our Marines and soldiers are in the position of a man in a fistfight in an alley. The other guy has total freedom of action, while our man’s "friends" keep tugging at his arms and trying to restrain him. Guess who gets his teeth knocked out?

The president needs to lead, not equivocate. If there is any emerging resemblance to Vietnam, it isn’t on the battlefield, but in the White House, where no one seems to have the will to win.

The terrorists pull the triggers and detonate the bombs. But the Marines and soldiers who come home in flag-draped coffins are Donald Rumsfeld’s dead and Paul Bremer’s corpses. President Bush is listening to the kind of men who destroyed LBJ’s presidency and ravaged a generation of young Americans.

We cannot waste the lives of our troops for yesterday’s bankrupt theories of international relations. Stop worrying about making our mortal enemies happy. We must either make up our minds to win, or bring our soldiers home.

Ralph Peters is a regular Post contributor.

Posted by: tipper || 04/27/2004 10:01:30 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This guy is shouting it loud and clear. Is anyone in the administration listening?
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 04/27/2004 10:23 Comments || Top||

#2  Ralph Peters has been talking like this for a while. I wish those in charge would listen.

Though maybe there is hope:

During the two-hour midday fight, in which at least eight U.S. troops were wounded, a Marine tank demolished the 150-foot-tall minaret of a mosque, from which machine-gun fire had been raining onto Marines 200 yards away.
Posted by: growler || 04/27/2004 10:25 Comments || Top||

#3  Jed Babbin, who I consider of similar quality to Peters, has a similar message today. His column includes a depressing email from a deployed officer.

Still, these 2 writers might be a bit too pessimistic. It appears there's more than meets the eye going on in Fallouja. Also, the military itself seems to acknowledge that the political context of actions must be taken into account and that restraint may be occasionally justified on this basis. Babbin and Peters seem to disagree on the degree to which we should go after Sadr's militias, which illustrates the complexity of the situation on the ground.

To me, the worst news is that the Whitehouse is injecting itself into tactical decisions. Hopefully that is overblown.

Bottom line is that it's a lot easier to tell what's wrong with our policies than what we ought to do to correct them. But, as Peters and Babbin imply, we should err on the side of being feared rather than loved.
Posted by: JAB || 04/27/2004 10:38 Comments || Top||

#4  The current diddle-farting about with ceasefires and "holy" cities and putting up with Brahimi's "negotiating" the shape-of-the-table twaddle reminds me of that last-ditch waste of motion when Bush tried the UNSC one last time before the war began.

I fully expect this arm-waving to yield the same dazzling results. And I then expect Dubya to issue orders to those with the brains to recognize what works, and what doesn't, when dealing with Arabs. There are only two options: force or failure. They are either at your throat - or at your feet. Pick one and follow through. How you follow through is where you can offer carrots: we'll stop our advance 24 hrs after you surrender every last asshole in [insert confrontation locale here]. All this laughable sensitivity and "holy" shit just lets the bad guys and their pet fools insert a billion shades of gray - where none actually exists in their own view. Arguments to the contrary are wasted on me, so don't bother. :-)
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 10:45 Comments || Top||

#5  If we had met resistance like this when we first went in, would we still be sitting in front of Basra trying to negotiate? I have followed this website and many military blogs and Iraqi websites. My daughter just came home from Iraq after spending fourteen months there. I realize that most of Iraq is doing well and I am thrilled for them, but even they are complaining about the tactics in Fallujah(?). I see from a story here that the citizens of Najaf are themselves getting sick of Sadr and his men. Do you think that is what our plan may be in Fallujah, to wait for some kind response from the citizens themselves that they are ready to join the rest of Iraq? I am very patient and I see how our patience has paid off in the past, but I am beginning to lose perspective in this prolonged "cease-fire" that only allows the insurgents to continue their fantasies. Actions speak louder than words. I know this is a cliche but it is for a good reason. It is true. By our actions, the insurgents,I know, are bragging that they have stopped us and urge others to join them. I would sure appreciate some feed back from you guys as to what you think the battle plan is for Fallujah.
Posted by: Carolyn || 04/27/2004 10:49 Comments || Top||

#6  Carolyn, it's nice to see your comment. Thanks are due to your daughter for her service and to you for your support. Here at Rantburg we all find a pressure release valve to report, discuss, and speculate. Also laugh and grieve when we need to. Hope we see you in the comments more...and your daughter too! Welcome.
Posted by: Seafarious || 04/27/2004 10:56 Comments || Top||

#7  Carolyn,


1. We easily have the force to take out the 2000 baddies in Fallujah, and Sadrs boys in Najaf. We DONT have the force in Iraq to put down the a rebellion supported by 80% of the population. Wed need more like 300,000 or 400,000. Even if we could assemble that many ground pounders at this point(arguable) the US population wouldnt back it. Period. So it comes down to whether you think "taking the gloves off" however defined will result in a rebellion of 80% of the population. Certain posters here are convinced that it would not. Evidently Peters is convinced it would not also. Other people, some with experience in Iraq, arent so sure.

2. "They are either at your throat - or at your feet" The logic of this is that we shouldnt have gone in at all, since we arent going to put the force there needed to keep them at our feet indefinitely.

3. The USMC, afaict, is using the ceasefire intelligently - put the moral honus of breaking it on the insurgents, show theyre trying to work with the locals, and kill the baddies by the dozen whenever the baddies break the ceasefire. The USMC seems to put value on the "moral honus" part. Some here do not - "let them fear us, only way to deal with them" Those who say that dont have the responsibility of keeping order in Baghdad.

4. Najah aint holy to me. But it is holy to she Shiites. You cant deal with that fact, you should have opposed going in. We can beat Sadr in Najaf, and youre on the right track about how we will do it.

5. Brahimi is there to negotiate the make up of the transitional govt to take over on June 30. Do folks here not want there to be such a transitional govt?? Do they want the US military to run Iraq??? And to do so indefinitely?? I dont think the US military wants to do so.

By the way, I dont expect replies from anyone on whom argument is wasted - this is intended for those who take this war seriously enough to have open minds about strategy.


Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 11:08 Comments || Top||

#8  I'm beginning to see a gem of a set of tactics being used in Iraq. Lots of hotheads have been calling for immediate attacks in Najaf and Fallujah. No quarter for the enemy. Level the city, and all that. They demand the United States commit an atrocity as grim as any done in history. Why? Because they have forgotten why we are in Iraq.

We are there to create an Iraq that is stable, democratic, and not a threat to its own people or its neighbors. We are outside Najaf and Fallujah to restore control of these cities to the central government. Our actions, such as negotiation, are aimed as fulfilling these goals.

The terrorist enemy appears to have no patience. Repeatedly over the last several weeks they have attacked our troops in such a manner as to allow our military superiority to destroy them. There are reports of 100 killed here, 20 there, and so on, with no American deaths, or perhaps one or two. The enemy is coming to us.

That is the gem of a tactic. Exploit the enemy's lack of patience. Probe, prod, taunt and tease them. Then kill them when they attack.

House to house fighting would take a toll on our troops in far greater numbers than is happening now. If the enemy wants to come to us and die, we should be obliging them. Remember, they want us to fight house to house. Any tactic that prevents that foils their aims.
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 04/27/2004 11:10 Comments || Top||

#9  Oh, foo. This guy is an armchair general who doesn't have a clue what is going on, on the ground. The roach motel known as Fallujah is the perfect trap as far as the Marines who have been working it are concerned. A strong military axiom is to not stop the enemy when they are making a major screw up.

Wackos from the entire region flooded in there with the belief that "If you go to Fallujah you can kill Americans." What a golden opportunity! We surrounded the trap, and they ain't getting out. But to continue to demonstrate that we are the good guys, we have limited the fighting to an industrial area, away from residential areas.

Haw! The morons are sooo itchy to kill Americans that they come into the industrial area, to find little, puny and easily beat up Marine units they "hopelessly outnumber". The headlines next day is that a bunch of recalcitrants are now being greeted by Virginians. And maybe one Marine is wounded with a real sore trigger finger that his Gunny will have to kiss to make the boo-boo go away.

In other words, we're kicking seven bells out of the worst of them, and NOT killing civilians.

Even the diplomatic pauses work to our benefit, allowing us to firm up our positions and reinforce lines; while throwing the baddies into confusion, their "unified" opposition breaking down into a 'what do we do now?' mode of argument and infighting.

The bottom line is that every one of these eaters of pork and copulators of she-asses that we cap means that Iraq will be that much nicer a place to live in the future.

As far as Paul Bremer goes: he is truly a gift from Allah to Iraq--perhaps the most brilliant civil administrator of all time. Were the US to believe less in the character of the good Iraqis, well, let's just say that "Benjamin Butler" comes to mind.

In the short term, I look for al-Sadr to be having a US medic shine his flashlight into his mouth soon.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 04/27/2004 11:11 Comments || Top||

#10  what chuck said.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 11:22 Comments || Top||

#11  Well, I'm "shamed" by yet another armchair "strategy" wizard stalking an imaginary high-road posture. Been there, done that, have you? Right. I do admire the worst-case approach you take when anyone posts anything that differs with your extra-special unassailable opinion. And making it personal again. Tsk, tsk. For someone who seeks to portray himself as so civil and erudite can't you disagree without being an ass? You really are a, um, uh, piece of work, Lh.

I would much prefer Carolyn's daughter's critique of the situation than another of your predictable post-all-possible-outcomes CYA comments.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 11:36 Comments || Top||

#12  First: Carolyn, please thank your daughter for me for doing a brilliant job in Iraq.

Second:"#10 what chuck said." I second that.
Posted by: Evert V. in NL || 04/27/2004 11:40 Comments || Top||

#13  BTW, for those who have access to FoxNews - they've been running live video from a frontline Marine OP in Fallujah - an abandoned house - for about the last hour. It was recorded sequences at first, but has been live for the last 30-40 minutes.

It's the loudest ceasefire I've ever seen / heard. And the bad guys are making 95% of the noise. Remarkable footage.

Now off on some domestic politics story, but they'll bring it back soon because nothing is as riveting as combat. Certainly nothing focuses the mind in quite the same way.

Tune in, if you're able - it will make you proud beyond words to watch your Marines and see their faces and the fact that they don't fire without targets, which means they are watching and waiting most of the time. In effect, video such as this proves there's no wholesale random violence from our end.

Coming back on after this commercial.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 11:57 Comments || Top||

#14  Decisive action is always the best course of action. When the enemy is on the run, you pursue him. When he is tired and out of breath, you kill him or capture him.

Some of you all are advocating Westmoreland's strategy. Put our units out there and let the enemy come to us. Flypaper. Graduated reponse. Carrot and stick.

It didn't work in Vietnam and it will not work in Iraq. Khe Sanh didn't defeat the NVA. Verdun didn't defeat the Germans. You must attack the enemy in depth with combined arms. You must destroy his will to resist, his ability to react. You have to attack his logistics, command and control, recruiting efforts, sanctuaries, etc.

Humans are remarkably adaptable. Whenever you give them breathing space, they will find a way to adapt, improvise and overcome. They will find better ways to kill you. Your tactical edge will dull as the enemy sharpens his.

Decisive action is also the most humane course of action. Fewer people -- civilian and military -- died in the invasion than during the occupation. It's a paradox: more violence causes fewer deaths. But it is the empirical truth as demonstrated in battle after battle.
Posted by: 11A5S || 04/27/2004 12:07 Comments || Top||

#15  it did work in Vietnam, am serious, do your own research, note the # of dead Charlie vs. the # of dead Americans, apply some of that math you learned back in school and come back with the ratio, if you display that ratio and still claim the tactic was failure in Vietnam.. well we will know you are a diehard 'lefty'

our anti-spy capability is what failed us, kgb likes to brag these days about how they practically ran the peace movements during Vietnam (which was what ended the war)
Posted by: Dcreeper || 04/27/2004 12:18 Comments || Top||

#16  dot com

I have reread my post for personal things. The only thing that was personal was that "I dont expect replies from anyone on whom argument is wasted" Which was a direct response to your saying that arguments would be wasted on you.

Yet you respond. Well, what is it?? Are you open to counter arguments, or arent you? I have no patience for people who say "heres what I think" and then say "oh by the way, i dont care what you think, im not listening, nyahh, nyahh, nyahh" If you want to have a polite discussion, fine. If you only want to vent, and dont want to have a polite discussion, thats your business, but dont expect me to treat your posts with respect in that case.

For someone who is so tough, youre damned thinskinned.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 12:28 Comments || Top||

#17  Dcreeper: Everyone here knows that I am not a die hard lefty. I just wrote several paragraphs saying we should hit the enemy harder for God's sake.

I think that we are arguing about two separate things. Tactically, we won all the battles. I never mention tactics in my screed above. My post was about strategy. Kill ratios do not win wars. Decisive action does. That by the way is US Army doctrine. If you don't believe me, go read FM 3-0, Operations. It's online.

If we had fought decisive battles in Vietnam instead of attritional battles, the KGB never would have had time to mount a successful antiwar measures because the war would have been over in 1967. Do you understand what I'm trying to say now?
Posted by: 11A5S || 04/27/2004 12:32 Comments || Top||

#18  Belmont Club has an encouraing take on the situation.
Posted by: growler || 04/27/2004 12:33 Comments || Top||

#19  I would much prefer Carolyn's daughter's critique of the situation

I would too. Unfortunately she didnt post one. Am i to blame for that?


than another of your predictable post-all-possible-outcomes CYA comments.

Sorry if Im predictible - I dont think I am more so than most posters here. And yes, there are many possible outcomes. Thats the point. War is risky. To advocate for a strategy, and to assume that all goes well, and to ignore the risks, is irresponsible. Hell, if I said lets get out of Iraq, and Saudi, and Afghanistan, and stop supporting Israel, and then the Muslims will be nice to us, I think youd be the first to outline the risks inherent in that strategy. And youd be right. Similarly a Bomb them all to hell strategy has risks, as does the current admin strategy, of being agressive but political. I think any intelligent discussion has to include the reasons WHY the admin is not bombing them all to hell. I think I outlined those reasons - I was neutral not for CYA, but because I did NOT want to start another A Priori filled argeument about whether its better to be loved or feared. Sorry if that strikes you as CYA.

Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 12:35 Comments || Top||

#20  "Experts" warn that we mustn’t alienate the hard-core Sunnis or the fundamentalist Shia’s.

No, they warn that we mustnt alienate ALL the Sunnis and all the Shias.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 12:37 Comments || Top||

#21  Fox has clarified that the video they've been showing is from yesterday.

Dcreeper - regards your second point, agreed. Walter Crankcase and his peers did what Giap couldn't do: destroyed the public will. As for your first point, are you serious? You should clarify your point. The kill ratio wasn't the real point of 11A5S's post and nobody with a brain would say 11A5S is a lefty - unless he's baiting him.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 12:40 Comments || Top||

#22  11a5s

IIUC, we essentially killed the VC as force, essentially by attrition, by summer 1968. After that we were essentially fighting NVA. In Iraq there IS no equivalent to the NVA. We are essentially fighting the "VC" alone, and a smaller VC at that. What supply lines, etc do we get by hitting harder in Fallujah??? All we do is speed up the attrition, but at political cost.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 12:41 Comments || Top||

#23  It will be intersting to some day find out about the command structure of the jihadies in Falluja. One chief or many with each keeping an eye out behind their back.

The main thing is not to let it end in a stalemate. It's turn in your weapons or die. It can't go on for to much longer is my gut feeling.

Saw the Jarines Dot. Pros.

Carolyn, high five your daughter for me.
Posted by: Lucky || 04/27/2004 13:00 Comments || Top||

#24  .com. Thanks! How've you been?

Liberalhawk: But the point is, we lost the war. In the end, it didn't matter that the VC had been destroyed or that the NVA had had their asses handed to them at Khe Sanh. They won! Our attrition strategy allowed the Soviets the time and latitude to win the information war and turn the American people against the confict (dccreeper is right about that).

Attrition works if you are fighting against an enemy with no outside support. It worked against the Native Americans and the Moros. The war in Iraq does not not meet this criteria. There is money coming in from Saudi and Iran. Cannon fodder is being infiltrated from Iran and Syria. There are corps' worth of ammunition floating around the country -- of which the rebels have used only a small amount. The rebels have sanctuaries in Iran and Syria where they can rest, rearm and refit.

Wars of attrition last a very long time. The Roman war against Hannibal lasted over a decade, IIRC. This would probably be OK in a preindustrial society. But there is an information and propaganda war going on in parallel. As long as the Jihadis can continue to pump in cannon fodder and money, they can keep the information war going as the Vietnamese did.

Democracies don't fare well in information wars.

Let's look back past Vietnam to 1864. Lincoln was in bad shape politically. Unrest was rampant. The country was ready to seek a negotiated peace. It was Grant and Sherman's decisive military action that changed public opinion and allowed Lincoln to bring the war to a successful close.

As I stated before, more violence means fewer casualties. Operation Cobra was one of the most violent military operations ever. The alternative was a Verdun like slogging match while the allies struggled to build up combat power across tenuous supply lines. Seriously, I recommend that you read Grant's autobiography, anything on Curtis Lemay, Scipio Africanus' campaign in Carthage, and on Operation Cobra. It is truely a paradox, but if we were to destroy the opposition in Falljah and Najaf in a no holds barred attack, I predict that fewer would die and this war would end more quickly.
Posted by: 11A5S || 04/27/2004 13:15 Comments || Top||

#25  11A5S - Your points and use of history to illustrate response possibilities and ramifications rock! And, for the edification of those who did not participate in the political fuckfest called Vietnam, they would do well to listen a bit closer! Obviously, no one advocated commiting any "atrocity" - nor did anyone advocate leveling the city. Fighting those who wish to fight us - employing our normal ROE - is certainly neither of those things. I appreciate your superior eloquence (jealous is more accurate) and much broader knowledge - please forgive me when I inadvertantly involve you! You certainly need no help in locating worthy debate nor assistance in advocating intelligent consideration in coalition responses!

Lh - "Arguments to the contrary are wasted on me, so don't bother. :-)"

Sigh. The little "smiley" obviously didn't indicate sarcasm to you, though that was my intent. No matter. I do, indeed, find a significant portion of your remarks to be couched on specifics from my post... But, but... Gosh, it must just be me, again - being thin-skinned and all! Lol! I love it - you're the #2 Artful Dodger of words in RB. Then, and I must take my hat off to you, you play the classic "Who me?" game. Kudos. I am in the presence of a master, a rarified air surrounds your posts and leaves me, well, breathless.

Regards the Sunni Triangle - it has never been militarily engaged in any real sense up until now. Your military recommendation, regards your response to 11A5S is what, exactly? Oh, never mind - disregard the question - he'll ask you himself, if he desires it.

Please, continue to counsel extremely active caution and extremely cautious action. I will continue to marvel at your posts. I'll cast aside all my experiences as they continue drag me down to the level of meeting challenge with strength (within the American ROE that's fire with fire, of course) as I learned from my Arab encounters. I am abased and abashed. And thin skinned, too - I'll work on that, thanks.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 13:37 Comments || Top||

#26  patience grasshoppers.

Maybe we will destroy them..give it time. I won't play armchair general - cause I really don't know what the best course of action would be, but maybe the real generals want enough time to dot their i's and cross their t's before they stomp on the roach motel.

It's too soon to declare that the ceasefire is a failure. If they do it today or tomorrow - isn't as important is it is if they just do it.

Nike.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 13:48 Comments || Top||

#27  .com...please use caution when wielding your mighty word sword against LH. Oh sure, he's a liberal and as such sees things through goofy liberal eyes...but I like him because he reminds us how our (non-looney) left-brained liberal friends see the same events we do through very different eyes.

Don't go and scare him off now...he's probably the only sane liberal we've got. Your pen can be might sharp now...you be careful.
Posted by: anonymouse || 04/27/2004 13:58 Comments || Top||

#28  anonymouse - Lol! That's about the most severely tongue-in-cheek post I've ever seen! Are you in pain?!!?!? Anbesol, bro / sis - that'll help!

Nay, I'm surrounded by eloquence, veritable virtual Blog Bards, methinks, so I know you could not be serious! Don't tease me like that! Lol!

Lh is a intelligent, articulate, and oh so careful poster. Only one other RB regular is his better (someone who claims NEVER to have EVER posted anything that wasn't factually correct, a no-shit fucking miracle, no? boggles...) and that's sure as hell not me. If he left me out of his magical tightrope object lessons, I'd give it a pass at least 99% of the time. Don't bait him, please, maybe he'll go chew on someone else!
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 14:17 Comments || Top||

#29  I think LH forgot to consider that the best way to UNalienate Sunnis, Shias, and whoever else in Iraq is to stop the violence. Listen to any Iraqi on TV and you'll hear that their biggest complaint is the lack of security. Unfortunately, as long as American troops are there, they will act as magnets for all sorts of suicide bombers and exploding roadside Coke cans. But leaving is not an option either. So the best thing to do is to clean out the garbage already in Iraq, stop the inflow of more garbage from the neighbours, and establish some form of rule of law. The ceasefires and waiting did nothing except embolden the garbage to fight.

And about the supporters of "holy" clerics: the only way that people will understand that picking up an AK47 is wrong and illegal, is to give a good thumping to anyone who does this. A decision has to be made: either you allow domestic militias to run about the country, or you say it's wrong and stamp out the offenders, not letting anyone escape.

Otherwise you will not have any meaningful reconstruction of the country. And we might as well leave.
Posted by: Rafael || 04/27/2004 14:29 Comments || Top||

#30  FoxNews showing IR view of Fallujah (about 10:40 PM there, I think) - lit up like a bonfire. Reporting very heavy fighting right now: cannon, gunfire, and 15-20 explosions.

Now Bret Baier reporting AC-130 gunship is in action, much of the fire / explosions are secondaries from ammo dump.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 14:41 Comments || Top||

#31  Hey! .com - you really do wield a mighty pen! Looks like they took your post to heart.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 14:44 Comments || Top||

#32  B - Lol! "They" being US Mil Cmdr on the scene? Ha! Fox earlier reported that he had been given the leeway to deal with the situation as he saw fit.

Today was the deadline for turning in the weapons. They didn't do it - so when an ammo dump and/or base was discovered, they acted. The IR view showing one main point - huge secondaries. Amazing - much like the famous Baghdad IR anti-air fire in Gulf War I.

It's REALLY blazing now. Huge secondaries and multiple locations. If you can get to it, turn on FoxNews.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 14:57 Comments || Top||

#33  "someone who claims NEVER to have EVER posted anything that wasn't factually correct, a no-shit fucking miracle, no? boggles"

Actually the only thing I've ever claimed in regards to this is that I have never *insulted* someone for correcting me on a factual mistake.

Here's the thread you are referring to: http://www.rantburg.com/poparticle.asp?D=4/11/2004&ID=30223&HC=Main and here's the exact sentence I used: "I will apologize to *everyone* whom I ever insulted because they corrected me on factual mistakes I made. But the number of these people is a big fat ZERO. I appreciate corrections and have never once in my life insulted people for offering them. Nor will I ever insult them."

Btw, I hope that people here have noticed how .com has tried to bait me with a lie against me in this this thread, even as he had tried to bait me with other lies in that one. Both times he's been successful ofcourse.

People have accused me of being a troll, but in reality he's the troll -- he simply chooses to bait select people rather than a whole group at once.
Posted by: Aris Katsaris || 04/27/2004 15:07 Comments || Top||

#34  we called a ceasefire, we gave the Iraqi pols and the local tribal chiefs a chance to yap, showing we respected them and all, and THEN, when the hostiles DIDNT turn in their heavy weapons, we gave the military commanders the green light to go after the baddies.

While at the SAME TIME allowing more low level ex-Baathists to get their jobs back, and allowing some ex-Baathist generals to join the new Iraqi army, (after suitable vetting, one hopes)

and we attack on one front at a time. In Najaf we carefully attack BETWEEN Kufa and Najaf, avoiding central Najaf, while allowing the locals to pressure Al Sadr.

Sounds very much like cautious action to me. Or active caution if you prefer.

We'd better have the patience for cautios action/active caution (how about CA/AC for short - I think we've got a new buzzword, a worthy successor to "Peshawar") if we're going to make this work - thats what "empire" necessarily involves.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 15:10 Comments || Top||

#35  .com never mentioned Aris by name, did he?
Posted by: docob || 04/27/2004 15:20 Comments || Top||

#36  "'i can call spirits from the vasty deep'
'but when you call them, wiil they come?'
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 15:27 Comments || Top||

#37  docob> Nah, he didn't, which is even more shameful on his part. In Greek it's called "hiding behind one's finger".
Posted by: Aris Katsaris || 04/27/2004 15:28 Comments || Top||

#38  I don't think he was hiding behind a finger, I think he was, as we call it, giving one.

But hey! I could be wrong.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 15:31 Comments || Top||

#39  Otherwise you will not have any meaningful reconstruction of the country. And we might as well leave.

But NOT before declaring the official recognized existence of Kurdistan.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 04/27/2004 15:32 Comments || Top||

#40  It takes far less folks to defend a position than it does to attack an enemies position. A static army is far less likely to have a blue-on-blue problem with the stuff flying overhead. It's easier to embed reporters in a fixed position and easier to maintain supply and communications lines. And the problem of innocents getting in the way is a non-issue.

Just keep insulting them and egging them on and killing them when they charge. When they stop attacking our boys we still have the city surrounded and can change tactics.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 15:35 Comments || Top||

#41  Aw, I've offended. My finger is nowhere near wide enough. Of course I'm a troll: I know nothing and am always either off-topic or just wrong. Anyone disagreeing is obviously right. Please disregard all of my posts. Perfection isn't one of my flaws, so I'll readily admit I make mistakes. He who is not named is right, as always. :-)

BTW, has he hit the tip jar heavily to cover the incredible bandwidth and storage resources consumed? Just curious. 8-)

--30--
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 15:36 Comments || Top||

#42  B> Nonetheless: It'd be more honest on his part if he would insult me by name, not through hints -- and even more honest if he could do it without the use of slander and lies.
Posted by: Aris Katsaris || 04/27/2004 15:38 Comments || Top||

#43  .com: You make me blush, really. You made a good point about the ROE. I never want to suggest that we violate the laws of war -- just that we fight to win.

I was thinking on the way into work today, what if we did take Peters' advice and level a mosque filled with gunmen? What if we invited Al Jazeera and Al Arabiya to film the whole thing? You and I and others here have speculated that Islam is a hollow log ready to collapse. What if we just took a big sledge hammer to all the magical thinking? What if we showed them that Allah ain't going to protect them?

Posted by: 11A5S || 04/27/2004 15:41 Comments || Top||

#44  as for me

1. I DO make factual mistakes. I try to admit them when they occur
2. I confess to seeing many sides of every issue, and to listing many possible outcomes. Thats partly cause of why im here - im NOT here for ideological cheerleading, i could find that better at some more moderate sites like Tacitus. winds of change, or (my fave) oxblog. I come here to speculate about strategy, and that, to me, means discussing alternative outcomes.
3. I admit to getting personal occasionally - im sometimes a tad thinskinned myself (but then i dont claim to be the toughest hombre in town)
4.And i try to never go off topic.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 15:44 Comments || Top||

#45  LH: "(how about CA/AC for short - I think we've got a new buzzword, a worthy successor to "Peshawar")"

How about "thinking strategically?" We take some risks now to make sure we have alliances and bases when we address the bigger targets to the east and southwest later.
Posted by: James || 04/27/2004 15:44 Comments || Top||

#46  When they stop attacking our boys we still have the city surrounded and can change tactics.

The trick is to get them to stop attacking eventually. Otherwise it becomes another Palestinian-Israeli conflict but with different participants.
Posted by: Rafael || 04/27/2004 15:47 Comments || Top||

#47  I hope that you're right, Liberalhawk. I'm done arguing for today. See you all tomorrow!
Posted by: 11A5S || 04/27/2004 15:50 Comments || Top||

#48  in respone to rafs Israel-Pal analogy, and 11's Vietnam analogy, i think the situation is different here. Time is NOT on the side of the deadenders in Fallujah - while they try to attrit US into a VN type retreat, WE are putting a new regime in place in Baghdad, and finally doing a better job of vetting and training local Iraqi forces. The hostiles MUST win SOON, or they lose, and they KNOW it, which is WHY theyve come out in the open now.

Definitely different from Isr-Pal. And different (though more subtly) from VN.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 15:52 Comments || Top||

#49  Time is NOT on the side of the deadenders in Fallujah

I wholeheartedly disagree. In the long term (years), yes. But in the short term, any pause in the combat is a chance to resupply and reinforce.

And as soon as attention drifts away from Fallujah, the whole process starts over, with another "uprising" six months from now.
Posted by: Rafael || 04/27/2004 16:06 Comments || Top||

#50  11A5S - Sorry - I shouldn't have put the ROE reference in the block posted to your attention (shit!) as it was meant as a generic response to others. Miscommunicated again! Arrrggghhh!

Aris - Get OVER yourself. I've insulted you? So fucking what? Who the hell cares besides you? Better yet, why would they? You whine and seethe like a veteran Paleo. Talk about thin-skinned - you're pure wimp. Fred can ban my ass from posting / viewing anytime he wants. I'll handle it.

BTW, socialist -- Have you donated to the upkeep of RB? C'mon, have you? Big time, verboseboy? You're the biggest single resource hog on the site. Be offended. Rant and rail - at me / the whole world. Post all you want and call the whole world idiot. It's become rather endearing...

BUT: Put your MONEY where your MOUTH is. Hosting your posts is not the honor you probably think it is.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 16:08 Comments || Top||

#51  Raf

If we've got them cordoned off well enough they shouldnt be able to resupply. Or reinforce.

Of course it is possible they will try again somewhere else in 6 months. But the military is still saying that this largely ex-Baathists (in finite supply) foreigners (who can be cut off at the borders) and some locals (Fallujah being an extreme place even for the triangle, for a number of reasons)
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 16:15 Comments || Top||

#52  Time is NOT on the side of the deadenders in Fallujah

This isn't Vietnam. I think time will have the opposite effect as Americans realize the nature of our Islamic foes. As each day goes by, the looney left gets more shrill and seems more looney and out of touch. And the Islamists get better understood.

It is a clash of civilization - not the North against the south. Each event just makes this more clear and brings more Americans on board.

Trying to relive the 60's is for retro wannabe's and grannies trying to relive the summer of love. Everyone else has moved on.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 16:22 Comments || Top||

#53  Ooh, ticked you off, .com, didn't I? That always happens to liars when their lies are exposed.

"Aris - Get OVER yourself. I've insulted you? So fucking what? "

No, you don't get it. You "slandered" me, not insulted me. So fucking what? The "so fucking what" is that whenever you slander me, I'll be posting the proof of your lies.

If that annoys you, don't lie in the first place.

"Fred can ban my ass from posting / viewing anytime he wants. I'll handle it."

Did I ever say you wouldn't? He can also ban mine, and I will also handle it.

"BTW, socialist"

I don't consider myself a socialist, even though I most recently voted for the socialist party. I'm more of a laissez-faire liberal myself.

"Have you donated to the upkeep of RB?"

I have no credit card, therefore I can't use Paypal. So no.

"Hosting your posts is not the honor you probably think it is."

I don't think it's an "honor". If the privilege of posting here is denied me, I'll go away without annoyance or bitterness. Fred's choice who he chooses to have post in his forum.

And frankly, if he doesn't want me posting here anymore he doesn't even need to ban me -- he can simply choose to tell me to go away and I will. Just say the word and I'm off.

But the fact of your own annoyance at being exposed for what you are, doesn't automatically make you a substitute for him. That's still Fred's choice to make, not yours.
Posted by: Aris Katsaris || 04/27/2004 16:33 Comments || Top||

#54  Get a grip Aris. (BTW I've a goldie that knows exactly where the grip is)

Aris you got any relatives living in Leon County FL... I'd just remembered that Ken Katsaris was high sheriff awhile back. He also had an excellent mushroom pasture (or so I'm told) I think he was 3rd generation but I'm not certain.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 17:01 Comments || Top||

#55  LOL. I just read KK website. Holymoly I once took 3 lbs. of happy fungus off his ranch.

That was a long time ago and I don't suggest you try this at home.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 17:06 Comments || Top||

#56  Shipman> No relatives anywhere in the American continent, AFAIK.
Posted by: Aris Katsaris || 04/27/2004 17:11 Comments || Top||

#57  Lol! You couldn't take yourself more seriously, IMO - and that IS just a statement of opinion! No one is ever merely incorrect or mistaken, nor do they ever merely misspeak or misquote... No, lol, no not if there's a difference with your opinions! No, indeed, they are liars and speak lies! Nothing can assuage such grievous harm in recompense for your imagined defamation except your factually perfect and righteous megaposts! *shiver!* No nit is too small to pick to death and no slight goes unnoticed! Blogging is, in the final tally, mere ego and verbal voyeurism - an extended Dangling Conversation. I hope you don't miss any (of my) posts or any buried potential slurs... I don't feel your pain, but that's just me! Lol!
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 17:28 Comments || Top||

#58  Oh, many things are merely incorrect or mistaken, and many people merely misspeak or misquote.

But in your case, you simply lie. Here's proof of that -- you keep on insinuating that I had ever claimed my posts were "factually perfect", even after being shown I never once claimed that.

Here's yet again in bold letters: I NEVER ONCE CLAIMED THAT MY POSTS WERE FACTUALLY PERFECT In fact I freely admit that I've made many mistakes in the past. Right now I don't remember a specific factual one in Rantburg (since my interaction here is mainly based on the level of opinions (and insults), not facts), but there's a ton of them in other forums and groups. You could probably google some of them up.

Anyway, when you intentionally repeat a so-called "mistake" even after being shown it's wrong, (as you've just done, in post #57 by insinuation and in previous threads also) that's a lie.

And since you have followed that tactic before, I don't need to give you the benefit of doubt anymore to call you a liar from the very first time.

(Ofcourse when especially ticked off, I sometimes accuse people of lying without first giving them the benefit of the doubt e.g. when Jen said I was constantly sympathizing with the Islamists, something I'd never once done. Sorry Jen!)
Posted by: Aris Katsaris || 04/27/2004 17:46 Comments || Top||

#59  TOUCHSTONE
Salutation and greeting to you all!

JAQUES
Good my lord, bid him welcome: this is the motley-minded gentleman that I have so often met in the forest: he hath been a courtier, he swears.

TOUCHSTONE
If any man doubt that, let him put me to my purgation. I have trod a measure; I have flattered a lady; I have been politic with my friend, smooth with mine enemy; I have undone three tailors; I have had four quarrels, and like to have fought one.

JAQUES
And how was that ta'en up?

TOUCHSTONE
Faith, we met, and found the quarrel was upon the
seventh cause.

JAQUES
How seventh cause? Good my lord, like this fellow.

DUKE SENIOR
I like him very well.

TOUCHSTONE
God 'ild you, sir; I desire you of the like. I press in here, sir, amongst the rest of the country copulatives, to swear and to forswear: according as marriage binds and blood breaks: a poor virgin, sir, an ill-favoured thing, sir, but mine own; a poor humour of mine, sir, to take that that no man else will: rich honesty dwells like a miser, sir, in a poor house; as your pearl in your foul oyster.

DUKE SENIOR
By my faith, he is very swift and sententious.

TOUCHSTONE
According to the fool's bolt, sir, and such dulcet diseases.

JAQUES
But, for the seventh cause; how did you find the
quarrel on the seventh cause?

TOUCHSTONE
Upon a lie seven times removed:--bear your body more seeming, Audrey:--as thus, sir. I did dislike the cut of a certain courtier's beard: he sent me word, if I said his beard was not cut well, he was in the mind it was: this is called the Retort Courteous. If I sent him word again 'it was not well cut,' he would send me word, he cut it to please himself: this is called the Quip Modest. If again 'it was not well cut,' he disabled my judgment: this is called the Reply Churlish. If again 'it was not well cut,' he would answer, I spake not true: this is called the Reproof Valiant. If again 'it was not well cut,' he would say I lied: this is called the Counter-cheque Quarrelsome: and so to the Lie Circumstantial and the Lie Direct.

JAQUES
And how oft did you say his beard was not well cut?

TOUCHSTONE
I durst go no further than the Lie Circumstantial,
nor he durst not give me the Lie Direct; and so we
measured swords and parted.

JAQUES
Can you nominate in order now the degrees of the lie?

TOUCHSTONE
O sir, we quarrel in print, by the book; as you have books for good manners: I will name you the degrees. The first, the Retort Courteous; the second, the Quip Modest; the third, the Reply Churlish; the fourth, the Reproof Valiant; the fifth, the Countercheque Quarrelsome; the sixth, the Lie with Circumstance; the seventh, the Lie Direct. All these you may avoid but the Lie Direct; and you may avoid that too, with an If. I knew when seven justices could not take up a quarrel, but when the parties were met themselves, one of them thought but of an If, as, 'If you said so, then I said so;' and they shook hands and swore brothers. Your If is the only peacemaker; much virtue in If.

JAQUES
Is not this a rare fellow, my lord? he's as good at any thing and yet a fool.

DUKE SENIOR
He uses his folly like a stalking-horse and under
the presentation of that he shoots his wit.

So "If" you weren't such an egregiously self-absorbed and pedantic asshole, I'd care. As it is, en guard, already!
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 18:10 Comments || Top||

#60  someone who claims NEVER to have EVER posted anything that wasn't factually correct, a no-shit fucking miracle, no? boggles

you rang? im always fat checking myself its healthy and leads to good government
Posted by: HalfEmpty || 04/27/2004 18:27 Comments || Top||

#61  .com> If you don't like the fish you caught, I ask you remember that it's you who trolled for me in this thread, not once but twice before I cared to respond.
Posted by: Aris Katsaris || 04/27/2004 18:34 Comments || Top||

#62  Greek dot com blossoms
Behind fat fingers grapple
Fierce bi-polar bears
Posted by: mrp || 04/27/2004 20:03 Comments || Top||

#63  "He who hesitates" - is bossed.
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 04/27/2004 20:14 Comments || Top||


Afghanistan/South Asia
EU asks Pak to explain '98 nuke test
ISLAMABAD : The European Union parliament has unanimously passed an amendment seeking to know urgently from Pakistan whether its 1998 nuclear test was a joint programme with North Korea,
"No, no! Certainly not!"
observing that "totally unaccountable" control of Pakistan Army on its nuclear programme led to proliferation of the sensitive technology."
Did this letter start out "You incompetent meatheads"?
Did it end with "Please, please tell us? Please?"
(The European Parliament) urgently requests further information from Pakistan regarding the nuclear test from 30th May 1998 in Balochistan which showed traces of plutonium and which is thought by some to have been a joint test for a North Korean nuclear weapon," the amendment, passed by the EU parliament in Brussels , this week said.
This would explain why the Norks haven't tested one at home, they outsourced the test to Pakistan.
The Paks may have shared this with every nuclear wannabe.
It said "(The House) draws attention to serious concerns of the international community about Pakistan's role in the proliferation of nuclear weapons, with the allegations and evidence against Pakistan hardening day by day; while acknowledging that President (Pervez) Musharraf has been right to insist upon a detailed investigation and that he is right when he claims that the (AQ) Khan "incident" happened because of the secretive nature of Pakistan's nuclear weapons programme."
The amendment was passed after the Parliament voted in favour of a resolution approving a new trade agreement with Pakistan and another expressing concern over restoration of democracy and human rights there.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 9:19:38 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This would explain why the Norks haven't tested one at home, they outsourced the test to Pakistan.

Pakland's new growth industry. Nuke Tests are Us
Posted by: cheaderhead || 04/27/2004 10:43 Comments || Top||

#2  EU asks Pak to explain '98 nuke test

Okay, first ya take a little of What God Said Don't Mess with. Cut that sucker in halt, commence to built allans own target rifle...... what never mind.l...
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 17:46 Comments || Top||


Dr AQ Khan ‘may be killed to silence him’: Benazir
Nuclear scientist Dr Abdul Qadeer Khan could be murdered to prevent him from revealing that he acted under government orders when selling nuclear secrets, former prime minister Benazir Bhutto has alleged in an interview. Dr AQ Khan confessed in February to transferring sensitive technology to North Korea, Iran and Libya for money. "There is a concern amongst many of us that Dr Khan may be killed to silence him, and that it will be shown as a heart attack or something else," Benazir told Australian Broadcasting Corp television.
Gee, ya think maybe Benazir has been reading Rantburg?
Details of the interview were released to the media before it was scheduled to air later Monday on ABC’s Four Corners programme. Benazir claimed Khan would never act alone. "I just know that wherever he went, he went under orders," she said. "I know he didn’t do it on his own. They played to his ego, but he didn’t go on his own. He went because he was ordered," said Benazir.
Or at least had permission.
Officials at the Pakistan Embassy were not available for comment on Monday, a public holiday in Australia. It was unclear when the interview was recorded.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 9:16:09 AM || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:


Iraq-Jordan
American Soldiers’ Laughter Indicates Use of Halucinogenic Pills
From Jihad Unspun
Mafkarat al-Islam’s correspondent in al-Fallujah reports that for more than 10 days the Resistance fighters in the besieged city have been remarking about a phenomenon that they find strange and surprising. Resistance fighters have frequently noticed that many of the American aggressor troops are laughing as they storm into districts in al-Fallujah. The Mafkarat al-Islam correspondent personally witnessed this clearly when he was close to the events as US aggressors tried to storm an-Nizal neighborhood in the besieged city on Saturday.

The correspondent wrote that he saw two American soldiers laughing, such as to arouse pity for them, despite all the Resistance gunfire being poured at their position and their comrades dying around them. Both of the Americans were later killed in the battle. The Mafkarat al-Islam correspondent writes that the Resistance learned later from interrogations of captured American Marines that the US military medical service distributes a type of halucinogenic pill to the troops that prompts laughter and reduces the sense of fear in combat conditions.

The reverse situation has been revealed in the despair and terror exhibited by the US troops when their lines of supply of food and medicine have been cut – a phenomenon that has been witnessed by nearby Resistance fighters.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 8:53:32 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Someone certainly seems to be on drugs, but it ain't the marines...
Posted by: Bulldog || 04/27/2004 9:02 Comments || Top||

#2  ...the American aggressor troops are laughing

Yes. That's right. Coward, I would like to introduce you to courage. We call them Marines.
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 04/27/2004 9:10 Comments || Top||

#3  Wrong, they're laughing because you ragheaded idiots keep running in front of their bullets.
Posted by: JerseyMike || 04/27/2004 9:13 Comments || Top||

#4  It's a cultural thing -- the jihadis don't realize that, during the attacks, the soldiers are fondly reliving memories of the time they spent at the arcade playing "Whack-a-Mole".
Posted by: snellenr || 04/27/2004 9:27 Comments || Top||

#5  prompts laughter and reduces the sense of fear in combat conditions: - that's not from a pill, it's from the brave Islamic Heroes™ shitting their robes when a sniper takes them out one by one
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 9:41 Comments || Top||

#6  Those that believe Jihad Unspun and Al Jazeera are in for another big world turning suprise when al-Fallujah falls to the US Marines and the tall tales of heroic defense and Marines crying is exposed as total crap.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 10:15 Comments || Top||

#7  We think of the Marines as superhuman...the jihadists don't stand a chance...comply or die...
Posted by: jawa || 04/27/2004 10:16 Comments || Top||

#8  Actually, this claim is a deliberate attempt to reverse the situation.

The marines have found drugs alongside several of the suicide bomb depots & there is some evidence that the suiciders are getting high before going off to blow themselves & others up.

This is, of course, counter to Islam, so the authors of this little piece are trying hard to deflect the attendent criticism.
Posted by: rkb || 04/27/2004 10:21 Comments || Top||

#9  They ain't laughing... they're whooping. Scared the sh*t out of the Germans, and it'll scare your boyz too.
Posted by: Cthulhu Akbar || 04/27/2004 10:38 Comments || Top||

#10  No US troops were killed in Fallujah on Saturday. And thanks to the half-assed "ceasefire," no troops are "storming" neighborhoods; instead, they're sitting there waiting to storm. And I'd like to know where those supply lines have (supposedly) been cut. Then I'd like to know how those "nearby" resistance fighters are still alive.

The sad thing is, there's people who will believe this horseshit. And not just Iraqis. I've gotten in several arguments with folks I know who actually believe the propaganda that US snipers are targeting women and children.
Posted by: growler || 04/27/2004 10:45 Comments || Top||

#11  And the winner of the "Islamic Lie of the Day" goes to . . .


Gotta love the "ooogah-boogah" emotion factor in their "reports":

"the American aggressor troops "

"American soldiers laughing, such as to arouse pity for them"

"despite all the Resistance gunfire being poured at their position and their comrades dying around them"

" the despair and terror exhibited by the US troops when their lines of supply of food and medicine have been cut"

AND THIS IS THE BEST ONE:

Resistance learned later from interrogations of captured American Marines "Captured?" Captured Marines did ya? Uh-huh. Sure ya did.

And they were quaking with fear, too, at the sight of you, huh? And they peed themselves too, didn't they? And they cried for their mothers too, when the brave fighters of the uprising entered the "interrogation" room, and they fell on their knees and begged you for mercy--mercy from the holy resistance fighters. And as they hung their heads in shame and regret, they promised, by Allah, they'd do anything if you would but show even a small measure of mercy to them, as unworthy as they were of it. So then you told them they would be released on one condition--that they would go and tell the world the truth about American aggression and all the women and children that have been bloodied, maimed, and killed by the drug-using, babyeating, parent-slayer Marines. And then they all converted to Islam.

This leads me to one very important conclusion. When things settle down over there, there's going to be a REALLY big market for comic books.
Posted by: ex-lib || 04/27/2004 10:46 Comments || Top||

#12  "Yeah, Mahmoud, I'm just laughing my butt off at those Marines. That sniper over there can't hit a damn-"
Posted by: Matt || 04/27/2004 11:09 Comments || Top||

#13  The marines have found drugs alongside several of the suicide bomb depots & there is some evidence that the suiciders are getting high before going off to blow themselves & others up.

Uh oh... does Allan deduct virgins for BUI?
Posted by: eLarson || 04/27/2004 11:17 Comments || Top||

#14  When things settle down over there, there's going to be a REALLY big market for comic books.

Way funny. Sitting around reading Sgt. Mo sipping on a Mecca cola.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 11:51 Comments || Top||

#15  Tha Arab mind never ceases to amaze me! No matter how badly they get the shit kicked out of them it is we that are in fear? In about 48 hours we are going to be scared shitless because the Marines are drop down on them like a ton of bricks. At least with Baghdad Bob you got some entertainment value from his speeches. "There are no American Forces in the city!"
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 04/27/2004 11:54 Comments || Top||

#16  Tha Arab mind never ceases to amaze me! No matter how badly they get the shit kicked out of them it is we that are in fear? In about 48 hours we are going to be scared shitless because the Marines are drop down on them like a ton of bricks. At least with Baghdad Bob you got some entertainment value from his speeches. "There are no American Forces in the city!"
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 04/27/2004 11:54 Comments || Top||

#17  The original Bagdad bob was better. This person is only a pretender -- and not a very good one at that.
Posted by: CrazyFool || 04/27/2004 12:22 Comments || Top||

#18  They are laughing at you, fool...because you are laughable.

I think jihad unspun is confused because they thougt Americans were docile, weak, crippled by the thought of civilian casualties, not willing to fight for what we value.
Whoops, guess you miscalculated, f'ers.
Posted by: TS (vice girl) || 04/27/2004 12:30 Comments || Top||

#19  The Marines are laughing in gut busting derision. Much more used to fighting a trained and disciplined enemy that fights within some arena of rules, honor. Even chivalry.

Not a rag-tag herd of towel-head shooting from hospitals, Mosques, and behind women and children!
Posted by: Jack Deth || 04/27/2004 12:44 Comments || Top||

#20  snellenr - Video games? Naw, its memories of a wild turkey shoot, gobble-gobble-gobble.

I heard this AM we got 43 of them and (hopefully) didn't lose anybody in Najaf. Its gotta be because of turkey shoot memories. By the way 43 jihadians in "paradise" works out to 3,096 virgins.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 12:45 Comments || Top||

#21  I miss the good ol' days...
Posted by: Yosemite Sam || 04/27/2004 12:50 Comments || Top||

#22  It is not true, Mr. Sam. Najaf has no firefight, but it is true Mr. Sam that the Marines are taking all kinds of things, Mr. Sam.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 12:52 Comments || Top||

#23  The sad thing is that many impressionable and mis-educated people in the Arab world actually believe this Goebbels-inspired bullshit.
It is almost all they see from outlets like Al-Jazz and Al-Arabiya, with the blessing and encouragement of western media collaborators like Robert Fisk and Michael Mooore.

Similar lies have inspired thousands to leave their homes and join the jihadis.
I feel little sympathy for these misguided souls, but I have none at all for the cynical propagandists who incite them knowing full well that most of them will never come home. They have blood on their hands and they should be held to account for it.
Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy || 04/27/2004 12:53 Comments || Top||

#24  Cyber Sarge: "the Marines are drop down on them like a ton of bricks. "
You got it all wrong, Sarge! All the Marines converted to Islam after being interogated. I read it somewhere. It's true.

Forgot about good ol' Bagdad Bob. Thanks! That is definitely going to be the trade name of my comic book series which I will market in the New Iraq. "Bagdad Bob Comics." Reminds me of "Bazooka Bubble Gum." Has that ring to it. I'll include some of that gum with each comic book.

Whoa--I'm going to make a fortune . . .

Posted by: ex-lib || 04/27/2004 12:55 Comments || Top||

#25  the arabs will always believe what they want (no matter what we do) - it is never the arabs fuault...blah,,blah,,blah - let them believe whateve they want but with a good dose of marine humor...now who will get the last laugh in falluja....
Posted by: Dan || 04/27/2004 13:11 Comments || Top||

#26  rhb: Counter to Islam, maybe, but it has a history. The Agha Khan used to hop up his boys on hashish, prompting folks to call them hashishim, or assasins..
Posted by: mojo || 04/27/2004 14:23 Comments || Top||

#27  Things have been really popping in the last hour in Fallujah. Ol' Rush is describing TV coverage and says lots of stuff is blowing up.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 14:42 Comments || Top||

#28  many impressionable and mis-educated people in the Arab world actually believe this Goebbels-inspired bullshit.

Don't be so hard on them. So do our own overeducated elite.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 14:43 Comments || Top||

#29  I forgot to add - I guess there's a lot of meth going down with what's being seen in those night-vision goggles.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 14:44 Comments || Top||

#30  there is some evidence that the suiciders are getting high before going off to blow themselves & others up.

Well there you have it. This explains why they see the Marines laughing.

Actually, getting high is a tactic that was used in Afghanistan during the Soviet days as well. I wouldn't be surprised if every suicide bomber from Gaza to Chechnya used this method to get themselves "inspired", so to speak.
Posted by: Rafael || 04/27/2004 14:44 Comments || Top||

#31  Well here's the contact address for that dork who posts alot of this crap, sorry to see its a Canuk, I was hoping we were getting back to our old allied/friend position with them :( Maybe one of our Maple Leaf pals can ask this guy what his malfunction is?

Jihad Unspun
Bruce Kennedy
#300 - 1497 Marine Drive
West Vancouver, BC V7T1B8
CA
Phone: 604-913-2241
Fax..: 604-913-2240
Email: bkennedy@jihadunspun.net
Posted by: Old Sarge || 04/27/2004 14:52 Comments || Top||

#32  Didn't I see that the Marines were using a recording of laughter? That must unnerve the jihadis to see a bunch of serious snarling Marines glaring at them and hearing laughter coming from the same spot.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 16:57 Comments || Top||

#33  It's psy-ops. They are blasting the laughter from speakers.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 22:44 Comments || Top||


Fallujah Rebels Execute Female Doctor Sent by Iraqi Ministry of Health
From Jihad Unspun
Mafkarat al-Islam’s correspondent reports that Iraqi Resistance fighters in al-Fallujah arrested 20 American agent Iraqis who had snuck into al-Falluja along with returning families in the hopes of facilitating an American assault on the besieged city. With the help of the local people, however, the Resistance forces were able to expose and arrest the would-be saboteurs. The agents underwent interrogation in the last few days and they confessed to various crimes. Their confessions were recorded and they were all executed.

One of the American agents was a female physician from Baghdad who had been sent by the puppet so-called ministry of health, ostensibly to help local doctors treat the wounded. But the local people grew suspicious of her because of her intentionally bad work. She was investigated for two days and finally confessed to her crime and revealed the outlines of the enemy plan to battle the Resistance from within. Accounts were settled with her as with the other spies.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 8:51:01 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  nice - guess you won't be needing any other food, medical assistance, water, then? Shut the water, power in the town off.
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 10:05 Comments || Top||

#2  This just another reason to go into Fallujah, and kill all "Iraqi Resistance fighters" that are found. No capture, no interrogation, no imprisonment. KILL ALL OF THEM.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 04/27/2004 10:27 Comments || Top||

#3  Bush should let the dogs of war loose on these asshats....we have them cornered in one larege section of falluja - let them know the wrath of the marines!
Posted by: Dan || 04/27/2004 10:51 Comments || Top||

#4  Barbarians
Posted by: cheaderhead || 04/27/2004 11:05 Comments || Top||

#5  Mafkarat al-Islam’s correspondent reports that Iraqi Resistance fighters in al-Fallujah arrested kidnapped 20 American agent Iraqis aid workers who had snuck into gone to al-Falluja along with returning families in the hopes of facilitating an American assault on trying to clean up the besieged city. With the help use of the local people as human shields, however, the Resistance forces thugs were able to expose and arrest hold hostage the would-be saboteursaid workers. The agents underwent interrogation torture in the last few days and they confessed to various crimeswere beaten to an incoherant state. Their confessions unconscious ramblings were recorded and they were all executedmurdered.

One of the American agents aid workers was a female physician from Baghdad who had been sent by the puppet so-called ministry of health, without a burka, ostensibly to help local doctors treat the wounded. But the local thugspeople grew suspicious of her because of her lack of a burka intentionally bad work. She was investigated tortured for two days and finally confessed to her crime and revealed the outlines of the enemy plan to battle the Resistance from withinsaid what we wanted her to to make her death less long. Accounts were settled with her as with the other spiesWe then butchered her.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 13:15 Comments || Top||

#6  "Amerikanski spion!"
Posted by: mojo || 04/27/2004 14:25 Comments || Top||

#7  hey anti-war ...shouldn't you have remembered to change your hat?
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 14:32 Comments || Top||


Afghanistan/South Asia
Zardad's Dog gets 1-round splitting headache
Afghanistan has carried out its first execution since the fall of the hardline Taliban, putting a bullet to the head of a former military commander convicted of more than 20 murders. The government did not acknowledge the April 20 execution of Abdullah Shah at a jail just east of the capital until it was revealed by Amnesty International in an e-mailed protest letter Tuesday. The international human rights group accused the government of carrying out the sentence without affording the accused "even the most basic standards" of fairness, ...
That sounds familiar. Didn't some other group in Afghanistan used to behave that way? I think AI might have whispered something about that. Once.
... and said the suspect was likely silenced so he could not testify against commanders allied to the government who have allegedly carried violated human rights. "Amnesty International fears that Abdullah Shah's execution may have been an attempt by powerful political players to eliminate a key witness to human rights abuses," the group said. "During his detention, Abdullah Shah reportedly revealed first hand evidence against several regional commanders currently in positions of power against whom no charges have been brought." The group did not name the commanders.
"It's, um, someone. Lots of 'em. Trust us."
Jawed Ludin, a spokesman for U.S.-backed President Hamid Karzai, said the Afghan leader signed the death warrant reluctantly, in the interest of justice. "The president felt compelled by the need to ensure justice to the victims, especially in view of the nature of the crimes he committed," Ludin told AP. "He personally, obviously, was extremely reluctant, and regrets having to do this, but it was the nature of the case." Ludin said Karzai has personally commuted two prior death sentences, but was compelled by the heinousness of the crime. Shah was convicted of killing one wife by pouring boiling water over her body and murdering his infant daughter by banging her repeatedly against a wall.

Abdul Mahmood Daqiq, the director of the Attorney General's office, said Shah was executed in Pul-e-Charkhi jail with a bullet to the back of the head. He said the death sentence was carried out in front of witnesses including representatives of the Afghan police and the Attorney General's office. Doctors were also on hand.
Whatever for? "Legume! Is he dead yet?"
"I do not know, Inspector, I must consult with the doctor!"
Ludin said Karzai ordered a review of the case after Shah was first found guilty, and that a further investigation also confirmed his guilt. He said the death sentence was delayed for months while the government addressed concerns of local and international human rights groups. "Justice demanded it be delayed no further," Ludin said.
Tell that to the 9th Circuit.
Abdullah Shah was first convicted of more than 20 counts of murder in special court proceedings in October 2002. Nine people testified against him at the trial, including another wife he tried to burn to death by dousing her with gasoline and setting her on fire. The bodies of many of Shah's victims were found in a well in Paghman district, just east of the capital. Shah served under another commander, Zardad, who was a deputy of former prime minister and warlord Gulbuddin Hekmatyar. He earned the nickname "Zardad's dog," because he was known to have attacked people "like a dog" in Zardad's company. In the early 1990s, the two reportedly robbed passers-by on the road from Kabul to Jalalabad.

Amnesty said it was "shocked" that the execution was carried out, and said it contravened an assurance that Karzai gave the group for a moratorium on such punishments. It said Shah was not provided a defense attorney at a secret trial, and that the first judge in his case was dismissed for taking a bribe. The second judge, the group said, came under pressure from the Supreme Court to impose the sentence. Shah claimed during trial that a confession was obtained under torture, but Amnesty said those charges were not properly investigated.
If so, I hope it was by pouring boiling water over him and banging his head against a wall...
At least two other people, suspected Taliban wanted in the November 2003 killing of French U.N. worker Betinna Goislard, have been sentenced to death in Afghanistan. They are appealing the verdict. Afghanistan's hardline Taliban regime used to carry out executions in public, many of them at the war-shattered Kabul stadium, but the practice stopped after they were ousted from power by the U.S.-led coalition in late 2001. Ludin dismissed any comparison to the old regime
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 04/27/2004 07:43 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1 
Shah was convicted of killing one wife by pouring boiling water over her body and murdering his infant daughter by banging her repeatedly against a wall. .... Abdullah Shah was first convicted of more than 20 counts of murder in special court proceedings in October 2002. Nine people testified against him at the trial, including another wife he tried to burn to death by dousing her with gasoline and setting her on fire. The bodies of many of Shah's victims were found in a well in Paghman district, just east of the capital. ... In the early 1990s, [he] reportedly robbed passers-by on the road from Kabul to Jalalabad. Amnesty International said it was "shocked" that the execution was carried out ....

Didn't Amnesty International start out defending people who had been imprisoned for their political opinions?
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 7:52 Comments || Top||

#2  The bodies of many of Shah's victims were found in a well in Paghman district, just east of the capital.

I wonder if this guy has any Thugs in his family tree.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 8:03 Comments || Top||

#3  killing one wife by pouring boiling water over her body and murdering his infant daughter by banging her repeatedly against a wall,another wife he tried to burn to death by dousing her with gasoline and setting her on fire.

Kill him. Oh, they did, Good.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 8:38 Comments || Top||

#4  Wish they had neutured him before the execution so those 72 raisins can laugh at him.
Posted by: Charles || 04/27/2004 8:56 Comments || Top||

#5  Shah was convicted of killing one wife by pouring boiling water over her body and murdering his infant daughter by banging her repeatedly against a wall.Abdullah Shah was first convicted of more than 20 counts of murder in special court proceedings in October 2002. Nine people testified against him at the trial, including another wife he tried to burn to death by dousing her with gasoline and setting her on fire.


Amnesty said it was "shocked" that the execution was carried out

Amnesty International - Different God, Different Mountain-top

Bullet in the head? He died too easy.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 12:38 Comments || Top||

#6  Im' going grey pointing out to you freeper bastards that it is a different culture. Shaheeds no different than unviable tissue mass. Gia aborts them.
Posted by: AntiGum || 04/27/2004 17:51 Comments || Top||

#7  AI. Day late and a dollar short. As usual.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/27/2004 21:08 Comments || Top||

#8  Antgum=dumbass,I'm getting a headach pointing out to you that there is right and there is wrong,toturing your wife and child to death is wrong.
Posted by: raptor || 04/28/2004 9:35 Comments || Top||


Iraq-Jordan
Investigative Report: Saddam’s WMD Have Been Found
EFL...Salt to flavor
New evidence out of Iraq suggests that the U.S. effort to track down Saddam Hussein’s missing weapons of mass destruction (WMD) is having better success than is being reported. Key assertions by the intelligence community that were widely judged in the media and by critics of President George W. Bush as having been false are turning out to have been true after all. But this stunning news has received little attention from the major media, and the president’s critics continue to insist that "no weapons" have been found.
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 04/27/2004 6:52:22 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Of COURSE there were/are WMD's. No matter how much the media repeated the lie that "Bush Lied", it never made up for the fact that every single intel agency in the world believed he had them. With everything that did exsist in the public domain, you really had to suspend all common sense and go into the faith realm to believe that somehow, magically, it was all just a myth.

I think Bush let his opponents put themselves in this position...now they have made the argument for him that they are fools.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 7:50 Comments || Top||

#2  Of COURSE there were/are WMD's.

And from yesterday's news, I'd bet some of them are in the Sudan right now.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 8:05 Comments || Top||

#3  Yep. The WMD's are there . . . and there . . . and there . . . and . . . Just be patient.
Posted by: ex-lib || 04/27/2004 10:11 Comments || Top||

#4  a few are in Sudan, and a few of them were captured in Jordan before they could be used.

And what's the deal with Marines fighting along the Iraqi/Syrian boder near a yellow-cake facility? Can you have a yellow-cake facility for peacefull purposes? Or is the yellow-cake moniker incorrect?
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 10:18 Comments || Top||

#5  Mmmmmmmm.... yellow cake...
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 10:20 Comments || Top||

#6  patience grasshopper
Posted by: Dan || 04/27/2004 10:49 Comments || Top||

#7  October surprise?
Posted by: growler || 04/27/2004 10:51 Comments || Top||

#8  I don't know how it would play as an October surprise. The lunatic fringe is already pre-spinning it to say that they had all been planted.
(Probably by Haliburton, don't ya know.)

I don't know how many serious people will believe such spin, but I know several people whom I otherwise respect who STILL cling to the notion that Bush "stole the election" even all these years later. I think that with respect to their Bush blindspot they might be WANTING to believe such a story.
Posted by: eLarson || 04/27/2004 11:20 Comments || Top||

#9  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 11:52 Comments || Top||

#10  Antiwar, we all thought you were going to watch the Soler documentary about your hero Saddam. You won't like it though--it's extremely critical of him, not meant for Der Jude Suss fans like you.
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 11:55 Comments || Top||

#11  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 12:06 Comments || Top||

#12  Sorry "Anti"war, had my fill of your Jewhatred yesterday, today, tomorrow, so I'm afraid that I won't be following any of your Nazi/Islamofascist links.

You say Saddam "had his faults" (that is, he was a ravening murderer whom you adored, and I'm sure that's the way you would describe Hitler and Stalin too). No, "Anti"war, YOU have your faults (you're ignorant, you hate Jews, you hope others get cancer, etc). Saddam was a Baathist dictator--you merely DEFEND dictators, Jewhaters, and fascists. Saddam needed to get killed as a result, and that's exactly what will happen to him. You're just a powerless white middle-class sheltered semiliterate laughingstock.
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 12:18 Comments || Top||

#13  Sorry "Anti"war, had my fill of your Jewhatred yesterday, today, tomorrow, so I'm afraid that I won't be following any of your Nazi/Islamofascist links.

You say Saddam "had his faults" (that is, he was a ravening murderer whom you adored, and I'm sure that's the way you would describe Hitler and Stalin too). No, "Anti"war, YOU have your faults (you're ignorant, you hate Jews, you hope others get cancer, etc). Saddam was a Baathist dictator--you merely DEFEND dictators, Jewhaters, and fascists. Saddam needed to get killed as a result, and that's exactly what will happen to him. You're just a powerless white middle-class sheltered semiliterate laughingstock.
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 12:18 Comments || Top||

#14  you forgot "stupid pig"
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 12:28 Comments || Top||

#15  Antiwar you are the most digusting piece of sh*t I ever had to read.Saddam had his faults thats all you have to say.
Posted by: djohn66 || 04/27/2004 12:31 Comments || Top||

#16  I don't hate Jews I hate zionists! Some of my best friends are Jews! Really! I had lunch with a Jew once! Happy Independence Day everybody!
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 13:02 Comments || Top||

#17  djohn66--

Look, she blamed Jews for the subhumans' stoning of a kindergarten in Israel yesterday. Why wouldn't she try to excuse Saddam as well?

Frank G--

you forgot "stupid pig"

I stand corrected.
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 13:08 Comments || Top||

#18  Antiwar:in fact,since 3/03 there have been fewer Iraqi civilians killed than in an average year under saddam.ALso,Saddam has been removed and there will be no more mass killing of civilians.But,I understand that,due to your political views,you will never be able to do THAT particular math.
Posted by: WhiteHouseDetox || 04/27/2004 14:15 Comments || Top||

#19  Antiwar probably believes that 9/11 was a Mossad plot.I guess that makes Osama bin Laden a rabbi,eh?
Posted by: WhiteHouseDetox || 04/27/2004 14:17 Comments || Top||

#20  I really think you caught yourself a live one, Fred. "S/he" started with that whole, "gooddaytoya" thing but hir evil oozes all the way through cyberspace.

I could be wrong...I don't know. But if I were betting on WOT...I'd give it 75%.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 14:30 Comments || Top||

#21  Now the US army is QUITE another story...Rest assured your army is the best and that is NOT a compliment.

So she hates Jews, and she's anti-American. Is anyone surprised?
Posted by: Rafael || 04/27/2004 15:14 Comments || Top||

#22  Imagine for a moment that Saddam wasn't a total idiot. We know he's not a tactical genious by a long shot but it wouldn't take much to realize that the US military would squash him quickly and if he used his WMD they would be particularly brutal.

Assuming he was unwilling to give in, wanted to live, and hoped to regain his country some day there is only one real solution: Sell your WMD to Al Queda (or destroy them) and have your military disappear rather than be defeated by the Occupation army.

That would leave the US trying to hold the country together while trying to find the WMD while international support slipped away. A coordinated strike on the international components could ensure the support disappeared entirely, attacks on supply lines and a sort of Tet-lite would cause many in the US to go wobbly. The only problem is someone turned in his kids and got them killed, then someone turned Saddam in. So I guess we're back to the idiot thing again aren't we.

Still, if the last couple of weeks was actually planned I have to give someone some credit.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 16:06 Comments || Top||

#23  Probably not planned too very far ahead, but not hard to see that someone might try to organize this sort of thing. Saddam was reported to have distributed much cash and many weapons caches just in case it was possible.

Cleanup on Aisle 2 .... long, tedious and tenuous mop-up going on here, but of far more than Iraqi Ba'athists.
Posted by: rkb || 04/27/2004 16:57 Comments || Top||

#24  Didn't one of the captured al-Qaedas in Jordan admit he had Iraqi training in the "use of toxins"?

I thought that Jordanian King Abdullah mentioned this in a speech after the capture of these goons.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 17:05 Comments || Top||

#25  Hannity is interviewing Timmerman at this moment.

2:10PDT
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 17:14 Comments || Top||

#26  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 18:44 Comments || Top||

#27  Neuterei Karta is a tiny dictatorial cult (by the way the Islamonazi terrorists you love so such mistakenly attacked them once). No wonder you're attracted to it, "Anti"war. All you know about Judaism is what Yasser Arafat wants you to know, and he just loves Neuterei Karta (they even carry PA identification materials and their leader is Arafat's "minister for Jewish affairs"). Do you REALLY think we don't know who they are?
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 18:51 Comments || Top||

#28  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 18:55 Comments || Top||

#29  Sorry, "Anti"war, you've pretty much shot your wad now. We know you like dead Jews, and pro-Arafat Jews. That's about it though.

Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 19:00 Comments || Top||

#30  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 19:13 Comments || Top||

#31  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 19:16 Comments || Top||

#32  Antiwar, those "Jews" are not going to carry the day.
They're a tiny minority and are not the ones leading the Israeli government or even the leading party in the Knesset.
(Sadly, one of the least attractive characteristics of Jews has sometimes been their self-hatred and the group you cite embodies that.)
We, the 90% of RB posters, are Zionists.
Jews have always lived peacefully with their neighbors--there were NO MUSLIMS before the 8th Century.
It's the jihadi Arabs who make war in the region.
You have so many dang books, Anti: why not add "The Middle East for Dummies" to your collection and get a clue.
The Muslims are the problem;
Yasser Arafat started the whole War on Terror in 1972, when his band of "Palestinians" killed the Israeli wrestling team at the Munich Olympics.
Posted by: Jen || 04/27/2004 19:19 Comments || Top||

#33  "Oh and yes how can someone support Hitler AND Stalin????"
What about the Munich Pact they both had?
Most of Europe supported Hitler and Stalin from 1939-1941.
Both men were chronic Jew haters.
In fact, the rumor is that Stalin was murdered in 1953 by his own Politburo because he was about to launch a huge purge of Russia's Jews not unlike the Holocaust.
Posted by: Jen || 04/27/2004 19:22 Comments || Top||

#34  Right, the Chomsky solution--he proposed Lebanon as a model right before the civil war. Surely you have all his works. If you have a few minutes, be sure and read his "interview" (really just PR) with the Pathet Lao "soldier" in Laos: War and Revolution--the one who claims that everyone in Laos will live in peace and harmony in a multiparty, multiethnic democracy. That was given 4 years or so before they started dumping chemical weapons on the Hmong, and of course there's been 25 years of Pathet Lao dictatorship since then. You might talk to Fred Pruitt about how wonderful the promises of the Lao fascists turned out. But I digress.

Tell us, Kapo "Anti"war, which Arab faction, the Arafatist/Aflaq types or the Islamonazi/Qutb ones, both of whom live by the Protocols of the Elders of Zion as much as the Koran, plans on living peacefully with the Jews? And I realize you love revisionism, but can you please explain the Hebron messacre, the jizya and the inability of any Arab nation to provide rights to the minority groups in their midst?

I can see you writing this already: "Mashaal has his faults--but he only killed all the Zionists, not the Jews"
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 19:26 Comments || Top||

#35  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 19:28 Comments || Top||

#36  Oh and yes how can someone support Hitler AND Stalin????

Are any of the 900 books you claim to own by a guy named "Orwell"? Why don't you ask someone who knows how to read to look him up in the library, and read you his essay called "My Country Right or Left." So figure out what the Popular Front was, and maybe you'll learn something. It's been very enlightening to know exactly what people like you know, or think they know. Just extraordinary.
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 19:30 Comments || Top||

#37  Can't you guess who your fellow terrorists are?
(You, NMM, Murat and possibly Katsaris)
No-one in the Holy Land "converted" to Islam.
No-one ever converts to Islam that doesn't have to, unless there's a sword, gun or bomb involved.
The religion just isn't appealing and doesn't have anything for human beings.
The Muslims in the Holy Land are all from other Arab countries who were sent to fight the "holy war" against the "Zionist entity," starting with the Crusades in the Middle Ages.
The Holy Land isn't the Muslims Holy Land because it's not holy to them.
(Besides, the word "holy" is without meaning in Islam anyway.)
Posted by: Jen || 04/27/2004 19:33 Comments || Top||

#38  CONVERTED to Islam

Yes, an imam came and persuaded them gently. Jesus, you really believe everything, don't you?
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 19:33 Comments || Top||

#39  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 19:37 Comments || Top||

#40  Anti, you side with the terrorists, ergo...
As my President--for whom I voted and will vote for again and to whom I've sent hundreds of dollars and whom I also love, as he is one of the greatest American Presidents of all time--said,
"You're either with us or you're with the terrorists."
I don't see anyone in any part of the globe rushing to convert to Islam.
Even the few Americans who did so, like Jose Padilla, John Mohammed and Johnny Jihad, were either losers and closet cases (Johnny Jihad) or converted in prison where they were incarcerated for serious crime.

Whereas I know of many millions who convert to Christianity daily because they want to because it appeals to their heart and soul (something Islam does not) and I've heard of quite a lot of people converting to Judaism.
In the cases of both Christianity and Judaism, no violence or weapons were involved to help the converts make the decision.
Posted by: Jen || 04/27/2004 19:42 Comments || Top||

#41  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 19:48 Comments || Top||

#42  Hi AntiWar! Happy Independen Day
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 19:50 Comments || Top||

#43  I wouldn't vote for anyone else but Bush!
And yes, I've sent him a lot of money and plan to send him more!
(Thanks for the reminder!)
I even got a beautiful Christmas card from George and Laura which I'm going to have framed!
Posted by: Jen || 04/27/2004 19:52 Comments || Top||

#44  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 20:06 Comments || Top||

#45  Of course I did--I love them both.
Shipman was wishing you a Happy Israeli Independence Day.
Am Yisrael Chai!
Posted by: Jen || 04/27/2004 20:07 Comments || Top||

#46  Antiwar, get off your high horse. You’re no peace lover. You showed your true colors yesterday (see here for yesterday’s hateful name calling and ill wishing by Antiwar, amidst a lot of other rubbish -- e.g., still no criticism from Antiwar against Jerusalem Kindergarten Targeted in Rock Attack). Antiwar, you are just an islamofascist apologist. As for the future of your “movement” (New Age or not), I like the picture you were shown yesterday.

We will finish the war the islamofascists started.
Posted by: cingold || 04/27/2004 20:12 Comments || Top||

#47  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 20:13 Comments || Top||

#48  . . . the lives he and you by your support have ruined in Iraq . . .

*Yawns* //sarcasm on// Oh, yah! Those poor unemployed rape/torture room attendants. *Hand to face* What ever will they do now? //sarcasm off//

Get Real!
Posted by: cingold || 04/27/2004 20:17 Comments || Top||

#49  It's my dream to meet President Bush and someday I hope to.
We will celebrate over a fine dinner and Californian champagne the millions of lives in Iraq, Afghanistan, the Middle East and the American Homeland itself that have been either saved, or liberated or both.
You are delusional, Antiwar and I suggest it's time for you to go to work and quit posting here.
You are backing the Islamist terrorist argument and that's a fight you won't win here at RB and that will not be won in the world at large.
Posted by: Jen || 04/27/2004 20:18 Comments || Top||

#50  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 20:19 Comments || Top||

#51  AW, really--GIVE IT A REST.
We don't believe those Arab lies and we never will.
Not at this site.
Go to Democrat Underground or some Arab site but take it outside.
RB doesn't need a Rachel Corrie.
Posted by: Jen || 04/27/2004 20:21 Comments || Top||

#52  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 20:25 Comments || Top||

#53  Yes, a fascist murderer like Saddam makes you hot doesn't it, "Anti"war. "President" Saddam. You do realize that he had to ape Western institutions, right? And on and on about little children...as long as they're not Jews, I see you suddenly have regard for them. Just great stuff, "Anti"war.
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 20:30 Comments || Top||

#54  See ya later AntiWar gotta go feed the puppies, kittens and baby ducks. I use the baby ducks to train the puppies in the autuymn. See Ya!
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 20:31 Comments || Top||

#55  Are you in favor of killing al-Sadr, "Anti"war? Or is it only OK when Jewhaters kill people?
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 20:32 Comments || Top||

#56  Antiwar, get off your high horse. You’re no peace lover. You showed your true colors yesterday (see here for yesterday’s hateful name calling and ill wishing by Antiwar, amidst a lot of other rubbish -- e.g., still no real criticism from Antiwar against *islamofascists* regarding the Jerusalem Kindergarten Targeted in Rock Attack incident -- just vague drivel about "suffering." Let's hear some real condemnation directed against islamofascists of the rock thrower type -- I mean, given how Antiwar abuses RBers who challenge her/him, s/he's got it to give). Face it, Antiwar, you are just an islamofascist apologist. As for the future of your “movement” (New Age or not), I like the picture you were shown yesterday.

We will finish the war the islamofascists started.
Posted by: cingold || 04/27/2004 20:34 Comments || Top||

#57  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 20:40 Comments || Top||

#58  Go ahead, Anti . . . I dare you. I double dare you! Condemn the islamofascist twerps who threw rocks at a kindergarten.
Posted by: cingold || 04/27/2004 20:42 Comments || Top||

#59  killing Al-Sadr no

HE would not have lasted two minutes with Saddam as President

Saddam would have captured him and rehabilitated al-Sadr, then?
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 20:43 Comments || Top||

#60  You've never been to the Middle East have you, "Anti"war? Have you ever been out of Australia? What about across the street?
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 20:45 Comments || Top||

#61  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 20:49 Comments || Top||

#62  When I started coming to RB, there were regular posts of DON'T FEED THE TROLLS when that doped up jackass would post horse caca in the middle of the night. Anti-war is an idiot, plain and simple. She wears a tin foil hat over her mop of hair. He "Mum" is probably pounding the Rolaids as we speak trying not to barf up her lunch listening to the crap coming out of her daughter.

Fred is going in for surgery. Taking up his bandwidth crossing swords with this complete moron is a waste for all involved. So I will implore you all as I have been taught on RB...DON'T FEED THE TROLL!!!
Posted by: remote man || 04/27/2004 20:50 Comments || Top||

#63  Ah, then what's your solution to the al-Sadrs of the world? Back in the 80s, PC lefties like you were all in favor of the Islamic Revolution in Iran from whence the al-Sadrs came. After the Gulf War, you all favored Saddam and seem to like him still (apparently he's better then the al-Qaeda Islamofascists, though he had his own brand of Islamofascism he was pushing). So what's your solution to the nutcase Islamofreaks running around, besides killing every Jew in the Middle East?
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 20:53 Comments || Top||

#64  Remote man, you have a point. But there's something irresistable about hearing her drone on and on, as from a script. Neuterei Karta! God, how it brings me back.
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 20:55 Comments || Top||

#65  Err! I doubt AntiWar is for real. Her/his contrived linguistic style is a give away.
Posted by: Phil B || 04/27/2004 20:56 Comments || Top||

#66  Antiwar is right when it says "There is no need to be so Prejudiced. Stop listening to Mr Bush." Americans have stopped listening to him on the issue of Islam but he keeps on trouting the same old tired lies. Religion of Peace my ass.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 20:58 Comments || Top||

#67  BMN: I know...I live in the SF Bay area and I love to stir it up with the local idiotarians. Their arguments are vacuous and they resort to name calling almost immediately. That said, Anti's schtick is getting tired. She adds nothing and won't go away unless ignored.
Posted by: remote man || 04/27/2004 20:58 Comments || Top||

#68  remote,

Quite so. Sorry.
Posted by: BMN || 04/27/2004 21:02 Comments || Top||

#69  Antiwar, what is your definition of Zionism? Just checking. We might be talking about different things here.
Posted by: Rafael || 04/27/2004 21:06 Comments || Top||

#70  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 21:43 Comments || Top||

#71  antiwar, go fuck yourself
Posted by: Halfass Pete || 04/27/2004 22:38 Comments || Top||

#72  "Zionism's essential goal was and is to change Judaism from a religious to a political entity."
No. That would be Al Queda and Islam.
The state of Israel isn't an "entity;" it's a nation, recognized since its founding by the US and the U.N.
Get used to it.
And if you can't, do what Halfass Pete said.
Posted by: Jen || 04/27/2004 22:42 Comments || Top||

#73  There were/are no wmds in Iraq.They had old worn out conventional weapons never mind anything else. Now the US army is QUITE another story ALL the latest weaponry conventional or otherwise. Rest assured your army is the best and that is NOT a compliment.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 11:52 Comments || Top||

#74  I am in about five mins it's all set. I HAVE seen it before and found it interesting. Yes Saddam had his faults but how does this justify the invasion and occupation of a sovreign nation which has cost countless lives and caused endless suffering.Re Jude Suss look at Nkusa.org and then comment.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 12:06 Comments || Top||

#75  Take a look at Neturei Karta(nkusa.org)it is a JEWISH website. That,s all.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 18:44 Comments || Top||

#76  Well you obviously DON'T.There are OTHER Jewish websites too True Torah Jews(jewsagainstzionism.com)THEY are Jews and against zionism as well.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 18:55 Comments || Top||

#77  You DID look at the websites didn't you? I did NOT say I like dead Jews I SAID I do not believe the Zionist Entity should exist, the only solution for peace is for it to go. Jews lived peacefully with their Christian and Muslim neighbours in The Holy Land and hopefully can again.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 19:13 Comments || Top||

#78  Oh and yes how can someone support Hitler AND Stalin????
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 19:16 Comments || Top||

#79  Jen the people living in the Holy Land CONVERTED to Islam in the 8th century (not all of course). 90% Zionist eh? Who are the 10% here who are not zionists(apart from me)?
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 19:28 Comments || Top||

#80  I am not a terrorist Jen. Islam may not appeal to you as a religion fine,do not convert from Christianity then. There is no need to be so Prejudiced. Stop listening to Mr Bush.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 19:37 Comments || Top||

#81  I know you will vote for GWB Jen. But as you stand in the booth pencil and ballot slip in hand please consider that maybe you are not making the best decision. You ACTUALLY sent HUNDREDS OF DOLLARS??????.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 19:48 Comments || Top||

#82  Jen a fool and her money are soon parted. Did you send George and Laura a card too? Shipman hi but ???????????????
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 20:06 Comments || Top||

#83  Have you met Mr Bush Jen? Maybe you and George and Laura can have dinner some evening and celebrate the lives he and you by your support have ruined in Iraq. Shipman enjoy your day I will not be celebrating it obviously.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 20:13 Comments || Top||

#84  Cingold those little children should not have to suffer. They are only innocent as are ALL little children in the Middle East and elsewhere.YOU are a Zionazi.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 20:19 Comments || Top||

#85  Well maybe your dream will come true Jen the fine dinner part that is not the rest. I start work at 12pm today and I will be shopping and visiting Mum soon.Don't let George drink too much.It sure looks safer in Iraq(lots of sarcasm)you know Al-Sadr etc. HE would not have lasted two minutes with Saddam as President.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 20:25 Comments || Top||

#86  Re killing Al-Sadr no. Re Jewish children I said ALL children Jewish Christian(fill in religion here) so your statement is beneath contempt. Where have I said Saddam makes me hot????
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 20:40 Comments || Top||

#87  Well no Saddam would have killed him. I do not believe in Capital Punishment so I think prison for life is sufficient(parole possible if prisoner shows remorse) Of course those children should not have been attacked.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 20:49 Comments || Top||

#88  Zionism's essential goal was and is to change Judaism from a religious to a political entity.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 21:43 Comments || Top||


A letter from 1st Lt. Robert L. Nofsinger USMC Ramadi, Iraq
EFL
....That is why I am asking for your support. Become a voice of truth in your community. Wherever you are fight the lies of the enemy. Don’t buy into the pessimism and apathy that says, "It’s hopeless," "They hate us too much," "That part of the world is just too messed up," "It’s our fault anyway," "We’re to blame," and so forth. Whether you’re in middle school, working at a 9-5 job, retired, or a stay-at-home mom you can make a huge difference! There is nothing more powerful than the truth. So, when you watch the news and see doomsday predictions and spiteful opinions on our efforts over here, you can refute them by knowing that we are doing a tremendous amount of good. Spread the word. No one is poised to make such an amazing contribution to the everyday lives of Iraqis and the rest of the Arab world than the American Armed Forces. By making this a place where liberty can finally grow, we are making the whole world safer. Your efforts at home are directly tied to our success. You are the soldiers at home fighting the war of perception. So I’m asking you as a fellow fighting man: Do your duty. Stop the attempts of the enemy wherever you are. You are a mighty force for good, because truth is on your side. Together we will win this fight and ensure a better world for the future.
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 04/27/2004 6:25:15 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Go read the whole article and pass it on to all you know. This guy know where its at.

Jack Bross
Posted by: Jack Bross || 04/27/2004 8:26 Comments || Top||


U.S. forces kill dozens of Najaf cannon fodder
U.S. forces backed by aircraft have killed dozens of Shi'ite militiamen in fierce overnight clashes near the Iraqi holy city of Najaf, residents and the U.S. military say. "Forty-three anti-coalition forces were killed near Najaf and an anti-coalition anti-aircraft system was destroyed by an AC-130 gunship," a U.S. military spokeswoman said in Baghdad. She declined to give any more details about the incident near Najaf, where a wanted anti-U.S. Shi'ite cleric is holed up with his militia.

Residents said U.S. war planes fired at a Mehdi Army militia checkpoint on the outskirts of the town of Kufa, some 10 km northeast of Najaf, after fighting between U.S. troops and militiamen broke out in the area. Buildings used by the militiamen near the checkpoint were badly damaged and at least three vehicles were destroyed, witnesses said. Hospital sources said at least six militiamen and 22 other people were wounded in the clashes and the air strike.

The Mehdi Army is led by nutcase firebrand Shi'ite cleric Moqtada al-Sadr. He is wanted by U.S. forces on charges of ordering the killing of a rival cleric. Paul Bremer, the U.S. administrator in Baghdad who had called the situation in Najaf "explosive", had earlier told Sadr to withdraw his militia and its weapons from mosques and schools immediately. "The Coalition certainly will not tolerate this situation. The restoration of these holy places to calm places of worship must begin immediately," Bremer said in his written statement.
Posted by: Lux || 04/27/2004 03:31 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Gobble gobble.
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 6:15 Comments || Top||

#2 
U.S. forces backed by aircraft have killed dozens of Shi'ite militiamen in fierce overnight clashes near the Iraqi holy city of Najaf ....

Najaf is not a holy city. Objective journalists should not use such expresssions in their own statements.
.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 7:20 Comments || Top||

#3  If a square inch of a building is "holy", then the press will report the entire region as "holy". Unless, of course, it's sacred to Christians or Jews, in which case they treat it like it's a bunch of crap.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 8:07 Comments || Top||

#4  Per the Rantburg post yesterday about Sadr's merchandise, it might be a good idea to allow the people of Najaf to have a few more weeks of Sadr's company. By then, they will be in a mood to elect secularists.
Posted by: mhw || 04/27/2004 8:14 Comments || Top||

#5  So Mohammed took a dump there once. Big deal. Bring in the MOABs.
Posted by: Dar || 04/27/2004 8:16 Comments || Top||

#6  Maybe I'm nuts, but I see a gem of a tactic emerging here and up north. The enemy has no patience. If our troops hang around long enough, they'll come to us. Tease them. Taunt them. Piss them off, and they'll meet us on our ground. What's the old saw?

"They kept coming the same old way and we kept killing them the same old way."
Posted by: Chuck Simmins || 04/27/2004 9:20 Comments || Top||

#7  Mhw, at first I thought Sadr should have been crushed without mercy, now I think you are right.

Sadr embarrassed the Shia clergy by his connections to Iran, and his actions. He also showed Sistani's inability to do anything. This is all helpful in the long run.

Now, according to another article on rantburg today some Shia are killing and threatening Sadr and want him out of Najaf.

Sometimes patience has its virtues. I still think we should have wolloped Fallujah hard and fast though.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 10:46 Comments || Top||

#8  See whay they call it "Spooky"? Death from above, mother&#^*$%s...
Posted by: mojo || 04/27/2004 10:49 Comments || Top||

#9  update:

BAGHDAD, Iraq (AP) - U.S. troops fought militiamen overnight near Najaf, killing 64 gunmen and destroying an anti-aircraft gun. An American soldier was killed Tuesday in Baghdad, raising the U.S. death toll for April to 115 - the same number lost during the entire invasion of Iraq last year.

Also Tuesday, a Red Cross team visited Saddam Hussein to see his conditions in U.S. custody, Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt said, but he refused to say where the visit took place. It was the first since the Red Cross visited the ousted Iraqi leader in February.

The battle outside Najaf was one of the heaviest with the militia as U.S. troops try to increase the pressure on gunmen loyal to radical cleric Muqtada al-Sadr. U.S. troops moved into a base in Najaf that Spanish troops are abandoning, but promised to stay away from the sensitive Shiite shrines at the heart of the southern city.
*snip*
Posted by: Frank G || 04/27/2004 12:48 Comments || Top||


Najaf residents turning on al-Sadr
...In another development the Americans were watching, reports from inside Najaf said that the growing anger of residents there against al-Sadr and his men, who have sown a pattern of lawlessness since their uprising in the city began earlier this month, had taken a startling new turn, with a shadowy group killing at least five militiamen on Sunday and Monday.

These reports, from residents who reached relatives in Baghdad by telephone, said that the killers called themselves the Thulfiqar Army, after a two-bladed sword that Shiite tradition says was used by the patron saint of Shiism, Imam Ali, the martyred son-in-law of the Prophet Mohammed. The group distributed leaflets in Najaf threatening to kill members of al-Sadr’s Mahdi Army unless they fled Najaf immediately, according to accounts.

One Najaf resident said that some of al-Sadr’s militiamen were shedding the black clothing that has been their signature. The same resident said he knew of two killings of Mahdi Army members on Sunday and that three others had been killed later on Sunday or Monday.

If reports of violence against al-Sadr’s followers suggested that the American occupiers might be seeing the beginnings of Iraqis taking action of their own to curb the cleric -- as L. Paul Bremer, the chief American administrator, has urged -- events in Baghdad on Monday underscored how potent a force al-Sadr remains, at least among many volatile young Shiites who have found a release from their impoverishment in the cleric’s anti-American oratory...

Posted by: Lux || 04/27/2004 3:30:41 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  the American occupiers might be seeing the beginnings of Iraqis taking action of their own to curb the cleric

Hold on, this guy speaks in the name of Islaaaaam* - he can't be wrong. What are you people doing? - back in your houses and cower in the presence of Allah!! Such apostasy! Tut!
Too good to be true methinks.

(*Al Muhajiroun pron. - esp. Anjem Choudhury)
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 4:21 Comments || Top||

#2  "how potent a force al-Sadr remains, at least among many volatile young Shiites who have found a release from their impoverishment in the cleric’s anti-American oratory..."

Why must Westeners always make excuses for muslim's barbarism?
Do impoverished South Americans strap bombs to their bodies? Do they kill Americans everywhere they are? Take Haiti, for example, you cannot get a group of people more empoverished than that. Are Hatians killing their own people to get to an American? America has intervened plenty in Latin America, why do we not hear about them blowing themselves up and plotting to carry out terror attacks on America soil or on American Interests anywhere in the world?
Islamic terrorism has nothing to do with poverty. It has everything to do with institutionalized hatred from birth to death.
Posted by: Anonymous3964 || 04/27/2004 6:21 Comments || Top||

#3  RTFA

The article is a NY Times sydicated story. Which means it is replete with blatant lies and distortions, unattributed sources, the reporter's leftist opinion and the NY Times very own tweaking of the story to make it even less true than when originally submitted.

The New York Times: When agenda is all that matters.

Kindly look at how cause and effect is framed by the writer. Impoverishment of young Iraqis? After 20 plus years of Marxist economic management? The writer would have told the truth had he atrributed young Iraq's violence against American as being inspired by Sadr, but no. It is poverty which causes violence.

The next thing we will hear from this writer is that Sadr is a charasmatic moderate Shiite moslem who has a message of hope from poverty for young Iraqis.

Incredibley bad journalism.
Posted by: badanov || 04/27/2004 7:16 Comments || Top||

#4 
young Shiites who have found a release from their impoverishment in the cleric’s anti-American oratory

They haven't been released from their impoverishment.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 7:23 Comments || Top||

#5  Anonymous3964, No the Haitians are equal opportunity murderers. They'll kill anyone available. No ideology involved other than "thugs just want to have fun."
Posted by: Random thoughts || 04/27/2004 7:46 Comments || Top||

#6  All the colorful names these groups take unto themselves, Thulfiqar Army, al-Mahdi Army, Badr Brigades, al-Quaeda etc., seem to spew forth from some fanciful random name generator designed for fantasy role-playing games. Actually, fantasy role playing games may be closer to the truth than religious fervor for understanding these murderous mideastern dolts. Maybe if we gave them all Gameboys and an unlimited supply of batteries they'd just fade away.
Posted by: RWV || 04/27/2004 7:55 Comments || Top||

#7  Sadr just needs 250 more experience points to become a Level 4 Cleric, then he can learn the Burning Hands spell (1-8 hit points damage per round).
Posted by: Dar || 04/27/2004 8:20 Comments || Top||

#8  They do act a bit like Sims gone bad.
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 8:36 Comments || Top||

#9  It wouldn't surprize me if the Thulfiqar Army that is bumping of Sadr's goons has had some help from our intel people or from a Ranger or two or three.
Posted by: mhw || 04/27/2004 8:42 Comments || Top||

#10  Isn't there a hadith in there somewhere that says RPG's (role playing games) are un-Islamic?
Posted by: Seafarious || 04/27/2004 9:23 Comments || Top||

#11  young Shiites who have found a release from their impoverishment in the cleric’s anti-American oratory

Yeah.... Death is sometimes called 'release'.....
Posted by: CrazyFool || 04/27/2004 9:35 Comments || Top||

#12  . . . the growing anger of residents there against al-Sadr and his men . . . had taken a startling new turn, with a shadowy group killing at least five militiamen . . .

Home-cooked Tater Tots . . . what a pleasant thought!
Posted by: Mike || 04/27/2004 10:05 Comments || Top||

#13  young Shiites who have found a release from their impoverishment in the cleric’s anti-American oratory

Yep, listening to that "anti-American oratory" will magically put food in a person's stomach and money in their pocket all right. Yessirree.....
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 04/27/2004 10:32 Comments || Top||

#14  I think the Gameboy idea has a lot of merit. ( #6)

"Yes. Just a minute Ahmed! zing, zing I'm coming to fight the jihad, just as soon as zing, zing, bloop, just as soon as . . . Uh, Ahmed, you go on ahead, I'll catch up later . . . zing, blap-blap . . . "
Posted by: ex-lib || 04/27/2004 10:58 Comments || Top||

#15  The same resident said he knew of two killings of Mahdi Army members on Sunday and that three others had been killed later on Sunday or Monday.

If reports of violence against al-Sadr’s followers suggested that the American occupiers might be seeing the beginnings of Iraqis taking action of their own to curb the cleric -- as L. Paul Bremer, the chief American administrator, has urged

Sounds like the plan is working - let the IRAQIS take down Sadr. A win politically as well as militarily.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 11:14 Comments || Top||

#16  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 11:22 Comments || Top||

#17  #7 Sadr just needs 250 more experience points to become a Level 4 Cleric, then he can learn the Burning Hands spell (1-8 hit points damage per round).

Aieeee! Coffee alert!
Posted by: eLarson || 04/27/2004 11:24 Comments || Top||

#18  THREE ANGELS OF DEATH.

I've noticed that there have been reports from all over Iraq, since the fall, of "Three Guys Wearing Motorcycle Helmets", who by some reports have assassinated as many as 1,000(!) former Baathists and other rude boys.

Gee, are these guys prolific.

But it started me thinking: I wonder what their names are?:

"Manny, Moe and Jack?"
"Larry, Moe and Curly Joe?"
"Hinkle, Dinkle and Nod?"
"Groucho, Chico and Harpo?"
"Nick, Mike and Mustard?"

or

"Captain, Sergeant and Sergeant?"
Posted by: Anonymoose || 04/27/2004 11:46 Comments || Top||

#19  The death squads are prolly from Sistanis' Holy Islamic Temple Brigade. AKA the Dragon Slayers. Release the counter terrorist Iraq. Then it really will be your victory and your glory.
Posted by: Lucky || 04/27/2004 12:01 Comments || Top||

#20  Level 4 cleric.

Well we ARE sending in L33t guys with ranged weapons, should keep him from getting a spell off no??
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 12:56 Comments || Top||

#21  "1...2...3...4...5 - a real power stroke, you're lookin' for his backbone...6 - very good. Next..."
Posted by: mojo || 04/27/2004 14:28 Comments || Top||

#22  Sadr sez:

Don't these people understand "the struggle" don't they realize they are lackeys for infidel invaders. Why, why it's an outrage. An outrage!

My men should be able to pillage and destroy for the greater good of ancient Mesopotamia!

By the way you guys, I AM A LEVEL 6 CLERIC!
D-O N-O-T I-N-S-U-L-T M-E!
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 15:01 Comments || Top||

#23  Wait.... isn't 'burning hands' a magic-user (i.e. Infidil) spell? As I recall it was a 1st level MU spell.

Now a Flame Strike is a cool Cleric spell (much like a mini-MOAB). But is way out of Tater's reach (8th. level Cleric as I recall)...

/Ahh.... my wasted youth......
Posted by: CrazyFool || 04/27/2004 16:16 Comments || Top||

#24  Flame Strike is usable by Ayatollah ali-Sistani, who at last report was 9th level. But, he is waiting until after June 30 to decide what he wants to do.
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 16:34 Comments || Top||

#25  D&D turned 30 yesterday. By the way.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 21:00 Comments || Top||

#26  Reap what you sow. I am going to watch my Saddam(directed by Joel Soler ) dvd now.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 11:22 Comments || Top||


Russia
McNamara: Nuclear War Still Possible; NY No. 1 Target
The threat of devastating nuclear attack by Russia against the United States has not diminished, warns former Sec. of Defense Robert McNamara. Writing in Monday’s Los Angeles Times, McNamara and co-author Helen Caldicott claim that the threat of a nuclear catastrophe remains real, “whether by accident, human fallibility or malfeasance.”
Ohfergawdsake. Helen Caldicott. Wotta maroon.
The Soviet Union collapsed on itself and the divide between Eastern communism and Western democracy disintegrated more than 13 years ago. Because of that, the nightmare scenario is not on the minds of many Americans today.
Nor of the Russians. As it happens, we're in similar boats, though not the same one, and chances of war between the two states are minuscule for the foreseeable future...
Nevertheless, the threat remains serious, McNamara and Caldicott argue, because, despite the end of the Cold War in the early 1990's, thousands of Russian nuclear warheads are still pointed at the U.S. targeting many civilian population centers.
I'd prefer they were pointed at Mecca and Medina and Karachi, myself. I'd wager some of them are, too...
McNamara, defense secretary to presidents Kennedy and Johnson, U.S. and Caldicott, a pediatrician and head of the Nuclear Policy Research Institute, say that Russian nuclear targeting strategies haven't changed much — and certainly not enough to reflect the thaw in relations between both nations.
We keep hearing about Vietnam and quagmires. McNamara's the guy who brought on the quagmire. And we're supposed to listen to him on this? And Caldecott's an outright crank.
The pair also cite a January 2002 document from the U.S. Foreign Military Studies Office at Fort Leavenworth, Kan., titled, "Prototypes for Targeting America, a Soviet Military Assessment." The study reports that New York City is the single most important target after military installations on the U.S. Atlantic coast.
At the moment, there's a lot more chance of turbans being involved in anything terrible that happens to New York. Perhaps McNamara and Caldecott should apply some of his management principles and get their priorities straight.
Posted by: Mark Espinola || 04/27/2004 01:19 || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Wow! What a flashingly obvious piece of insight!

Future headlines:

McNamara: Muslims Hate Jews

McNamara: Water is Wet

McNamara: I Wet Myself
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 8:10 Comments || Top||

#2  Whatever dude, just keep yourself and your damn "advice" away from all planning at the Pentagon.
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats || 04/27/2004 8:13 Comments || Top||

#3  Don't be sooo mean to Sec. Mac. I miss him. I culda been a contenda.
Posted by: TFX || 04/27/2004 8:44 Comments || Top||

#4  RC, be nice. Based on the article, he's spent 13 years figuring this out... :-)
Posted by: snellenr || 04/27/2004 9:23 Comments || Top||

#5  More proof that there ain't no justice: this old war criminal and human disaster area is still with us.

As JFK's secdef, this pompous fool brought in a crowd of "whiz-kids," academic analysts, to revamp every aspect of Pentagon operations, from procurement and planning to tactical doctrine, for heaven's sake.

He was utterly convinced that he and his gang had all the answers, and that their conclusions should trump professional advice in every case.
The result was a national disaster whose consequences still haunt our national life to this day.

McNamara admitted, finally, that he had been wrong about Vietnam, but his mea culpa largely reflects standard lefty doctrine about the war, and ignores the real cause: the supreme arrogance and stupidity of his own tenure at the Pentagon.
Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy || 04/27/2004 9:39 Comments || Top||

#6  ..Hey Bob, good to see ya!... STFU and drive yer freakin' Edsel!!!!
The DOD is in some ways still trying to shake off the damage this idiot did forty years ago. Either ignore him or tell him to follow the example of SecDef Forrestal.

Mike
Posted by: Mike Kozlowski || 04/27/2004 9:45 Comments || Top||

#7  He's come full cirle: drinks Ensure and wears Depends. You know, when you make it back to diapers and pablum, well, you've been here too long.

But this asshole is "special"... he should've had a close encounter with a friendly frag 35-40 yrs ago.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 10:11 Comments || Top||

#8  You guys do know that Rumsfeld was one of the youngest of the Whiz Kids, right?
Posted by: rkb || 04/27/2004 10:35 Comments || Top||

#9  When I was very young I assumed Johnson & McNamara knew what they were doing, too. I also inhaled. Oh, wait, that's redundant.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 11:01 Comments || Top||

#10  He's just doing it to advertise his new Florida based 1-900 Psychic Tip line.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 04/27/2004 11:48 Comments || Top||

#11  If McNamara says the Russians are going to nuke NYC, I'd start buying real estate there.
Posted by: 11A5S || 04/27/2004 12:11 Comments || Top||

#12  TFX: Almost missed that one. Good, but very obscure.
Posted by: 11A5S || 04/27/2004 12:12 Comments || Top||

#13  Thanks 11A5S. People forget, I was famous once. I didn't get smaller, the vision did.
Posted by: TFX || 04/27/2004 13:11 Comments || Top||

#14  "You guys do know that Rumsfeld was one of the youngest of the Whiz Kids, right?"

Bullshit.
All 10 of the so-called Whiz-kids had been Army Air Force officers in WW2 (when Rumsfeld was still a child) and all had worked at Ford with McNamara.
Rumsfeld never worked for Ford and did not serve in the Kennedy/Johnson DoD. He was elected to Congress in 1962, just a year after McNamara became Secdef. He stayed in Congress until 1971, two years after LBJ had left office.
He had left the Navy in 1957 and served as a Congressional staffer and worked for an investment firm until his election to Congress.
Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy || 04/27/2004 21:44 Comments || Top||


Israel-Palestine
Why the Palestinians are in such a state
By Mark Steyn.

There was an hilarious piece in the Washington Post on Sunday, under the plaintive headline, "Why Did Bush Take My Job?" The author was Saeb Erekat, and the job he claims Bush has taken from him is "senior Palestinian negotiator" with the Israelis. The other day, speaking in support of the Israeli withdrawal from Gaza, President Bush stated the obvious: it was "unrealistic" to expect a return to the armistice lines of 1949, and there’s no point wasting time discussing the Palestinian "right of return" to what’s now Israel, because it’s never going to happen.

But this shift in favour of the "realities on the ground" sent "moderate Arab opinion" into a tizzy. Returning from a visit to America, Egypt’s president, Hosni Mubarak, dropped in on Jacques Chirac in Paris. "Today there is hatred of the Americans like never before," he told Le Monde. And, in what sounded suspiciously like a threat, Mubarak added: "American and Israeli interests will not be safe, not only in our region, but anywhere in the world." Did he mention that when he was back at the ranch with Bush?

And that’s a guy American taxpayers give $2 billion a year to. In return for which, they get Mohammed Atta flying through the office window and vile state-funded Egyptian media that license anti-Americanism as a safety valve for disaffection that might otherwise be targeted more locally. Thanks a bunch, Hosni. The Guardian reported this as a "damaging rebuff to President George Bush’s policies", though it’s difficult to conceive of anything less "damaging" to Bush than being insulted by some third-rate Arab strongman dependent on US aid.

Now Mr Erekat has joined the chorus. "Why did Bush take my job?" To be honest, I’d forgotten whether or not Mr Erekat currently held it. Periodically he resigns from Arafat’s cabinet for some reason or another, but quietly returns to his post a couple of months later - "senior Palestinian negotiator" being the Palestinian equivalent of those ancient Cabinet titles Tony Blair can never quite get rid of.

Edward Heath, in his time as Lord Privy Seal, was once addressed by some foreign dignitary as "Lord Heath" and famously responded that he was neither a lord nor a privy nor a seal. The "senior Palestinian negotiator" is not "senior", speaks for no viable faction within either the dignified (Arafatist) or efficient (Hamas) parts of the Palestinian Authority, and hasn’t negotiated anything in a decade.

He last resigned last summer, after Mahmoud Abbas, the Palestinian prime minister, went off to negotiate with Ariel Sharon and accidentally left his "chief negotiator" out of the negotiating team. I guess someone else was taking Mr Erekat’s job back then.

Mr Erekat’s real job is to look good in a suit and go on television and sound reasonable when, as on September 11, the excitable chaps in Ramallah are dancing in the street and singing the Arabic version of Happy Days Are Here Again. And he is, of course, "democratically elected", being presently in the ninth year of a five-year term. So Yasser keeps him around to do the CNN-BBC interviews when Hanan Ashrawi is washing her hair and they need someone to do the autopilot drone of "root causes", "desperation", "cycle of violence".

But, if Bush did "take my job", it’s because Erekat is not up to it. For 10 years, the world has been trying to give a state to the Palestinians and the Palestinians keep tossing obstacles in their path. The latest innovation was a suicide-bomber arrested with explosives bearing HIV-infected blood, the thinking being that anyone who survived would get Aids. Unfortunately, the heat of the explosion kills the virus. But, in his combination of depravity and incompetence, the "Aids bomber" neatly encapsulates the present state of Palestinian "nationalism". The only way the Palestinians will get any kind of state is if Israel and America inflict it on them and eliminate such lethargic middle-men as Mr Erekat.

So Sharon is withdrawing from Gaza, abandoning the settlements and building a wall. This is bad news for those Palestinians who take a more nuanced approach to Jews - who think that, if you accidentally infect yourself while strapping on the HIV bomb, you should have the right to state-of-the-art treatment from an Israeli hospital. But they’ll have to make the best of it. Israel has concluded that, if you can’t "live in peace" with your neighbour, the priority is to live.

What a strange world the Middle East is. For 10 years, in northern Iraq, the Kurds have run a pleasant, civilised, pluralist, democratic de facto state, but external realities require them to be denied one de jure. For the same period, in the West Bank and Gaza the Palestinian Authority’s thugs, incompetents and bespoke apologists have been lavished with EU aid and transformed their land into an ugly, bankrupt Arafatist squat. But external realities require the world to defer to the "Chairman" as a de jure head of state, lacking merely a state to head.

Meanwhile, Lakhdar Brahimi, the UN’s special envoy to Iraq, has told French radio listeners that "the great poison in the region" is Israeli "domination" and told American television viewers that the Israelis "are not interested in peace, no matter what you seem to believe in America". Well, he certainly hit the ground running. A week in town and he is already sounding like any decades-old Arab despot. In The Spectator a year ago, I warned against handing over Iraq to the UN: it would simply "install as high commissioner a non-Iraqi Arab bureaucrat" who’d "effectively wind up as an Arab League minder, there to ensure that the Iraqis didn’t get any funny ideas (rule of law, representative government) which might unduly discombobulate the Egyptians, Saudis et al." But even I didn’t think they’d ship over such a walking, talking cliché of Arab League man as Mr Brahimi.

If it’s any consolation to Saeb Erekat, Bush may have usurped his job in Palestine, but in Iraq Mr Brahimi is sounding as if he has usurped Bush’s. And that’s a lousy exchange.
Posted by: tipper || 04/27/2004 1:17:21 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Steyn does it again. What a riot.
Posted by: John in Tokyo || 04/27/2004 1:38 Comments || Top||

#2 
Today there is hatred of the Americans like never before

Today there is hatred of Hosni Mubarak like never before.
.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 7:36 Comments || Top||

#3  What would happen if the checks to Mubarak suddenly stopped?
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 11:02 Comments || Top||

#4  Brahimi is a disaster. My guess is that he's the only one in the UN who is not in fear of being indicted in the Oil for Food scam.
Posted by: RWV || 04/27/2004 14:07 Comments || Top||

#5  Amen! Lets stop ALL cash flow to states that think it is ok to slur us and our policies. Never EVER were there any plan to allow Paleos the 'right to return' and destroy Israel from within. That Arafart has led on the people in the refugee camps this long is a crime unto itself. Bush just told it like it is and sunddenly the Arabs are 'hurt' by the REAL world. Will the Arabs support the right to return of ANY of the MILLIONS of Jews that left their countries? I think not. Withdraw, build a wall, and leave them to kill themselves.
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter) || 04/27/2004 15:28 Comments || Top||

#6  One of the truly interesting things about the Palestinians is that the only "Arab" state that ever welcomed them was Saddam's Iraq and that was only as replacements for ethnically cleansed Kurds. (Notice how fast the average Iraqi turned on these leeches after Saddam was gone). Every other Arab country that imported any number as braceros was forced to expel them as troublemakers who were fomenting internal hate and discontent. Ask Jordan, Kuwait, and Saudi about the Palestinians. They love them in the abstract, they just don't want to live next door to the hateful little wretches. Being willing cannon fodder for any terrorist group that will pay hasn't done much to raise their social acceptability.

One of the principal reasons that the Arab states are adamant about the Palestinian "right of return" is that none of them want anymore Palestinian citiizens whose only demonstrable skill is removing charred bodies from rocketed cars while jumping up and down in front of a TV camera. Mubarek is scared to death of picking up a few more million useless mouths to feed.
Posted by: RWV || 04/27/2004 16:24 Comments || Top||

#7  RWV - that about covers it.
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 04/27/2004 18:34 Comments || Top||

#8  Cyber Sarge - let's combine your comment #5 with another deceptively brilliant comment that 11A5S offered in another thread:

"I was thinking on the way into work today, what if we did take Peters' advice and level a mosque filled with gunmen? What if we invited Al Jazeera and Al Arabiya to film the whole thing? You and I and others here have speculated that Islam is a hollow log ready to collapse. What if we just took a big sledge hammer to all the magical thinking? What if we showed them that Allah ain't going to protect them?"

In effect, what IF we just treated the Islamofascists, and along with them all of Islam since en masse they have declined to actually DO anything of substance to prevent their religion being hijacked by the so-called "militants", as we would treat any other group that has declared itself our implacable foe?

What a concept, eh? Credit to you and 11A5S for a good forehead slapping "f**kin' duh!" wake-up. Indeed, let's.
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 18:45 Comments || Top||


Africa: North
Negotiations for GSPC surrender to take 2-3 months
A surrender by the majority of Algeria's Islamic militants will take up to three months while terms are arranged, an ex-rebel leader and negotiator said on Monday. Such a surrender would mark the end of North Africa's largest militant organisation even if its diehard leaders did not particate. It would also end a 12-year uprising that has cost the lives of up to 150,000 people in Algeria. More than 300 members of the al Qaeda-aligned Salafist Group for Preaching and Combat (GSPC) and dozens of rebels of smaller rival Armed Islamic Group (GIA) want amnesty in exchange for laying down their arms, security sources told Reuters. "The process of surrendering is imminent but it will take two to three months. They are just waiting for the legal framework to do so," former rebel leader Madani Mezrag told Reuters by telephone. He said he was one of the negotiators. "Those who are in the mountains are convinced the time has come to come down," said Mezrag, who negotiated in the late 1990s the surrender of his AIS, the armed wing of the Islamic Salvation Front (FIS) party.

Authorities have remained silent on the issue and the Interior Ministry was not available for comment. The sticking point to a surrender was the absence of a law that could grant rebels amnesty as the "civil concord" which gave thousands of militants freedom in 1999-2001 had expired, political analysts said. "An executive order or an amendment to a law would take weeks if not months to push through," said Mounir Boudjema, a local security expert and editor. It was also unclear whether a surrender would automatically mean amnesty or whether some would be given jail sentences. Mezrag said 80 percent of all rebels in Algeria wanted to give up their armed struggle. President Abdelaziz Bouteflika is unlikely to want to rush any deal because of the resentment held against rebels suspected of assassinations over the past decade. "Giving an amnesty to the terrorists could go down badly with the public. He'll have to tread carefully even if he won a landslide election (on April 8)," Boudjema said.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 1:08:16 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  The process of surrendering is imminent but it will take two to three months

Following the Pakistani Roadmap, I see.
Posted by: Steve || 04/27/2004 8:41 Comments || Top||

#2  It's not as easy as it looks.
Posted by: Marshal Petain || 04/27/2004 18:12 Comments || Top||


Iraq-Jordan
US sets limits to Iraqi self-rule
The US has warned that the new government due to take power in Iraq on 1 July will have to delegate some of its powers to the coalition. Secretary of State Colin Powell said it was important that coalition troops continued to operate under US command.

The US has insisted it is sticking to the planned timetable of transferring power to an interim Iraqi government after 30 June despite the upsurge of violence in Iraq. But in an interview with Reuters news agency, Mr Powell said that while the new government would take full sovereignty over the country, it would have to give some of it back to the Americans so that the US would still be in command of its own troops. "I hope they will understand that in order for this government to get up and running - to be effective - some of its sovereignty will have to be given back, if I can put it that way, or limited by them," Mr Powell said. "It's sovereignty but [some] of that sovereignty they are going to allow us to exercise on their behalf and with their permission."
Gotta walk before you run.
Speaking in Washington, Mr Powell said the coalition did not mean to "seize anything away" from the planned caretaker government. "It is with the understanding that they need our help and for us to provide that help we have to be able to operate freely, which in some ways infringes on what some would call full sovereignty," he said.

But in an interview with the Associated Press, the current head of the US-backed Iraqi Governing Council, Massoud Barzani, accused the US of behaving like "an army of occupation".
"If it were me, I wouldn't have allowed it to come to this by making earlier mistakes," Mr Barzani said. "I probably wouldn't have made the mistake of letting an army of liberation turn into an army of occupation."
Yeah, yeah, tough guy, you're so smart you only lived under Saddam for 30 years.
The BBC's State Department correspondent, Jon Leyne, says there is a danger that the new Iraqi government will be seen as a puppet of the American occupiers.
Who cares what he thinks?
Mr Powell insisted that the coalition wanted the new government to have a real part to play in rebuilding Iraq: "From day one on, I hope that they will exercise more and more control over the ministries, over the priorities for reconstruction, over answering questions of their people. It is in our interest to have that happen."
Posted by: Steve White || 04/27/2004 12:56:39 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I'm surprised Powell even "went there" in terms of discussing these issues. Obviously the status of forces agreement and autonomy of US forces was always going to be key, and tricky. But there's nothing to be gained by talking about this openly -- Powell is sharper than this, wonder if he was drawn out on it by questions or something else is going on.

As for Barzani, two points. Frankly, I imagine he might have dealt with the situation better than we did, but we were constrained by our own and world standards, so there we are. Second, I'll personally put him in charge if he can explain what the hell he and others mean by turning "into an army of occupation." There's something negative about this term for him and others, but it's a perfectly neutral term in int. law and practice, and they never explain exactly what the difference is between this and being an army of "liberators". Annoying.
Posted by: IceCold || 04/27/2004 1:46 Comments || Top||

#2  quote 'The US has warned that the new government due to take power in Iraq on 1 July will have to delegate some of its powers to the coalition. Secretary of State Colin Powell said it was important that coalition troops continued to operate under US command. '


Unfortunatley atm Iraqi's couldnt run a bath , let alone their own country .....

Posted by: MacNails || 04/27/2004 5:08 Comments || Top||

#3  Back when the Iraqi Army occupied Kuwait and parts of Iran, the concept of an "occupation army" caused no public criticism among Iraqis.
Posted by: Mike Sylwester || 04/27/2004 7:31 Comments || Top||

#4  Yeah, yeah, tough guy, you're so smart you only lived under Saddam for 30 years.

Just to clarify, he headed part of the Kurdish autonomous zone, (under US/UK air protection, to be sure). So for the last 13 years he WASNT under Saddam. And prior to that hed led rebellion against Saddam.

In any case, are we going to diss anyone who lived under Saddam??? I mean like who are we expecting to run Iraq??
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 11:26 Comments || Top||

#5  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 11:41 Comments || Top||

#6  If you had any doubts about the quality of BBC reporting ... congratulations, you were right. They are quoting their own correspondent as if he were (1) independent of the BBC, and (2) someone whose opinion matters. What a joke, seriously pathetic. Reminds me of when I was ten and my friend and I did a (one-edition) neighborhood newsletter. We interviewed each other too.
Posted by: sludj || 04/27/2004 15:57 Comments || Top||

#7  The US? Well it seems that way or else why invade.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 11:41 Comments || Top||


Afghanistan/South Asia
Top NATO Diplomats Make Afghanistan Visit
The United States pressed reluctant allies Monday to provide more peacekeepers for Afghanistan as top envoys from NATO made an unprecedented visit to review security in the country. The visit by NATO's decision-making body, the North Atlantic Council, was the first since the alliance took over the 6,500-member peacekeeping mission in the Afghan capital eight months ago. It was the first time the 26-nation council met outside Europe or North America. "NATO needs to go faster and accelerate its buildup of troops in Afghanistan," said Nicholas Burns, the U.S. ambassador to NATO after a day of meetings in Kabul. Burns said countries without troops tied up in Iraq, such as Germany, Turkey and France, could do more in Afghanistan, where the alliance is struggling to make good on a pledge to expand its peacekeeping force of 6,500. He also pointed to Spain, which is planning to withdraw its 1,300 troops from Iraq. "There are a number of countries that are not present in Iraq ... and they could do more in Afghanistan," Burns told reporters.
NATO ought to be able to put a peacekeeping force in each of the large cities.
The peacekeeping mission is now limited to the capital and the northern city of Kunduz. Diplomats said President Hamid Karzai renewed his appeal for the alliance to act urgently to send more troops both to expand the peacekeeping operation to more cities and provide additional protection in the run-up to presidential and parliamentary elections scheduled for September. NATO allies agreed months ago to expand the mission and set a target of sending peacekeeping teams to five more cities in the north and west of Afghanistan by late June. However, nations have been hesitant in coming forward with troops for the costly and potentially dangerous operation.
"No one told us this would be costly and dangerous!"
U.S. Gen. James L. Jones, NATO's top commander, told reporters he was confident the alliance would stick to its target. "The force is about 85-90 percent generated ... That's the bulk of it," he said. Lt. Gen. David Barno, the top American commander in Afghanistan, said the expected upsurge of insurgent attacks was less intense than expected, indicating their weakened capacity. "They can't operate in large units any more and they have to look for ways to minimize their vulnerability," he said. Canadian Lt. Gen. Rick Hillier, NATO's commander in Kabul, said there were signs terrorist were seeking to target the peacekeeping force or Afghan government institutions. "We're under no false illusions here there's always a risk."
No source on this...
Posted by: Steve White || 04/27/2004 12:51:12 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


Israel-Palestine
Mahmoud Zahar perdition countdown
EFL. Hat tip LGF
Mahmoud Zahar, a 53-year-old Egyptian-trained physician whose son was killed in an Israeli airstrike, was identified by Israel on Monday as the new Hamas leader in the Gaza Strip. Israeli officials signaled he won’t be targeted for death if the militant group halts suicide attacks.
Better accept Jesus quickly there

Hamas, however, refused to reveal the name of its leader for fear he will be assassinated like his two predecessors.
He will be, the next bus boom...
The Palestinian attorney general said he would speed up prosecution of dozens of suspected collaborators with Israel and search for those who helped Israel kill Hamas leader Abdel Aziz Rantissi on April 17. Fifty-three alleged freedom fighters informers are in Palestinian custody awaiting trial. Rantissi, the successor of Hamas founder Sheik Ahmed Yassin, himself assassinated by Israel, had taken extreme precautions, but Israel spotted him when he made a rare visit home and killed him in with a missile attack.
"AH you got me! HEY! Where’s my virgins!?"
Hamas declared after Rantissi’s death that it would not disclose the name of his replacement. However, speculation centered on Zahar — Rantissi’s deputy, Yassin’s personal physician and for years one of the most visible and uncompromising Hamas spokesmen. Three Israeli newspapers on Monday identified Zahar as the group’s new leader. Several days ago, Zahar told reporters Hamas would not disclose the name of the new leader but did not deny he had the title. Israel’s military chief, Lt. Gen. Moshe Yaalon, told the Yediot Ahronot daily the new Hamas leader had inherited the post "automatically" and reluctantly accepted the position. Yaalon also signaled Israel would avoid attacking him as long as the group remains quiet.
Which Hamas almost certainly won’t
Posted by: Korora || 04/27/2004 12:36:10 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  WOT futures ....I'd like to say less than 2 weeks, but to be safe, I think I'll go for 2 months.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 1:22 Comments || Top||

#2  speed up prosecution of dozens of suspected collaborators HeHe! Israel is following a long tradition of pretending your technical intelligence is human intelligence, and then sit back and watch the enemy tear itself apart trying to find the spies (that don't exist).
Posted by: Phil B || 04/27/2004 1:26 Comments || Top||

#3  Sign me up for 46 days.
Posted by: Tibor || 04/27/2004 1:29 Comments || Top||

#4 


Mahmoud Zahar (1945-2004)

Heeere's Mahmi'

Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 1:31 Comments || Top||

#5  From UK Guardian -

Mahmoud Zahar, believed by many Palestinians to be the new leader of Hamas in Gaza, is the last remaining founding member of the organisation. All the others who created Hamas in 1988 have since been killed by Israeli security forces, two of them in the past month.


Also,
www.us-israel.org says he is 59, not 53, but I don't think that means much
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 1:36 Comments || Top||

#6  A4052 - Yes it does - the older he gets the less fun he'll manage to have with all those virgin teenagers.
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 5:26 Comments || Top||

#7  Happpy Independence Day Anti-War!
Posted by: Shipman || 04/27/2004 8:42 Comments || Top||

#8  www.us-israel.org says he is 59, not 53, but I don't think that means much

It means he's living on borrowed time, but we knew that already. ;)
Posted by: Cthulhu Akbar || 04/27/2004 10:52 Comments || Top||

#9  Can I change my bid? I want to go back to 2 weeks or less.
Posted by: B || 04/27/2004 16:12 Comments || Top||


Iraq-Jordan
Jordan plot update
Jordanian authorities on Monday revealed details of a purported chemical-bomb plot, which they link to al-Qaida and estimate could have killed tens of thousands in the heart of the Jordanian capital. U.S. officials said they take the plot seriously but have yet to confirm that damage could have been so extensive.

Neither Jordanian nor U.S. officials would say what substances were alleged to have been involved in the plan to use chemical-bomb-laden vehicles against Jordan's intelligence headquarters, the prime minister's office and the U.S. Embassy.

"We would agree with the Jordanians that it was a grave, serious and credible threat," said Justin Siberell, a spokesman for the U.S. Embassy. "The investigation is ongoing and it continues in the area of the specific capabilities of the (explosive) devices we are talking about."

Some critics in Jordan have suggested that the government is overstating the threat to justify tightening security. In what might have been intended as an answer to those skeptics, Jordanian state television on Monday night showcased the alleged confessions of four detainees arrested in raids during the past month on suspected al-Qaida-linked safe houses.

The broadcast also showed images of a yellow truck fitted with special steel rams designed, authorities said, to break through security gates, as well as a room full of blue plastic chemical containers and laboratory equipment.

Jordan says the truck and four other vehicles were seized, along with a total of 20 tons of explosives.

Shown in a casual interview setting Monday night, detainees Azmi al-Jayousi and Hussein Sharif Hussein provided calm descriptions of a plot they say was hatched in Iraq and forged in Syria and Iraq.

The purported leader of the plan, al-Jayousi said he took orders from Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, a Palestinian with Jordanian citizenship who has been blamed by U.S. authorities for several of the deadliest attacks in Iraq in recent months. The U.S.-led occupation in Iraq has singled out al-Zarqawi as the pivotal figure in a monthslong bombing campaign. This would represent the first known al-Qaida plot to have been formulated and exported from the foreign terrorists that U.S. officials concede have found a new base of operation in Iraq.

Al-Jayousi did not explain his relationship to al-Qaida but said he first met al-Zarqawi in Herat, Afghanistan, and later in Iraq.

"In Herat I started to train as one of Abu Musab's fellows," according to a transcript of the statement translated and made available by the Jordanian government. "I took explosives courses, poisons, high-level, then I pledged allegiance to Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, to obey him without any questioning and be on his side."

Al-Jayousi said he and another Jordanian, Muwafaq Adwan, were assigned to "instigate military work on the Jordanian arena" and relied on a Syrian national for safe houses from which to operate in Jordan.

The plotters "started to collect the necessary information on the targets," he said in the broadcast. "Then we collected the chemicals to be used for manufacturing the explosives. I started to search for these materials in all institutions that sell chemicals. We managed to buy large quantities from all these companies."

Al-Jayousi, a balding man who appears to be in his 30s, said messengers delivered to him a total of $170,000, in payments of $10,000 to $15,000, as well as "fraud passports, identity cards, car registrations and all that is necessary."

Other detainees identified themselves in the broadcast as 18-year-old Syrian national Anas Sheikh Amin and Jordanian Ahmad Samir. Samir said he "worked on the explosives" at a secret bomb factory in Jordan, where operatives used only nicknames with each other to protect the plan if one was arrested, and barely left the site during two months of preparation. Sedans and trucks were acquired in Jordan and Syria, they said.

A bearded man who identified himself as Hussein said al-Jayousi enlisted him to help obtain cars to "execute an operation to strike on Jordan and the Hashemite (royal family), a war against the crusaders and infidels," according to the transcript. "Azmi told me that this will be the first chemical suicide attack that al-Qaida will execute."

Despite the new details, it remained unclear whether the alleged attackers intended to use industrial chemicals or a weapons-grade material. In a report Monday, CNN quoted an unnamed Jordanian government scientist as saying that the plot called for a combination of "71 lethal chemicals, including blistering agents and choking agents."

According to the broadcast, "the chemical explosion would lead to the emission of poisonous chemical gases which cause physical deformities and direct injuries to the lungs and eyesight."

The Jordanian report estimated that the chemicals could be spread more than a mile in diameter, potentially injuring another 160,000 people. It was unclear whether the aim was for simultaneous bombings at the three sites or for a single concentrated blast at the intelligence headquarters that might damage all three.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:36:14 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This might be the big WMD break many of us have been looking for.
Posted by: Tibor || 04/27/2004 0:42 Comments || Top||

#2  Break?
Tibor : Oh no my my my

It has been decreed that there are no WMDs
Hans Blix, John Kerry, and Sean Penn say so.

Chemical weapons?
Just somebody trying to steal the recipe for Raid Roach Killer

Bio Weapons?
Simply Manufacture of Smallpox and Anthrax Vaccines!

This isn't chem or bio weapons. Just like all the rest we've heard about the past year. . . .

King Abdullah is paranoid, don't you know. How could you ever think this is a special find. Why this would ruin CNNs constant diatribe about Bush lying. Now we can't have that can we, Tibor?
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 1:15 Comments || Top||

#3  . . . estimate could have killed tens of thousands in the heart of the Jordanian capital

Um - - - What is the talk about the anger of the "Arab Street" if there are no Arabs left alive in the street?
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 2:13 Comments || Top||

#4  "This might be the big WMD break many of us have been looking for"

Only if theres stuff the jordanians found that they have told us about - the only chemical ive seen mentioned is sulfuric acid, which is widely available. No nerve gas, no blister agents, etc. We'll see.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 11:16 Comments || Top||

#5  pardon, my error. The CNN report DOES quote Jordanian sources that there were nerve and blistering agents. Dont say which ones. As i said, we'll see.
Posted by: Liberalhawk || 04/27/2004 11:29 Comments || Top||


Afghanistan/South Asia
12 Hizb-e-Islami busted in Kabul
Afghan police in cooperation with NATO-led peace keepers arrested 12 members of a fundamentalist faction believed to be closely allied with the Taliban and al-Qaeda in Kabul, the deputy interior minister said Sunday. "Police in cooperation with International peace keepers Saturday arrested 12 people of Hezb-i-Islami," General Hilaludin Hilal the deputy interior minister told AFP. Hezb-i-Islami is the faction of wanted warlord and former Afghan prime minister Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, who has been designated a global terrorist by the United States which claims he has participated in terrorist acts committed by Al-Qaeda. International Security Assistance forces (ISAF) with police raided the house of a Hezb-i-Islami commander, Naqeebudin, and sized six AK-47s, hand grenades and some other weapons, police said. "Naqeebudin was killed in his house a while ago," but his house was still being used by suspected militants, the state news agency Bakhtar reported late Sunday. The arrest comes three days after ISAF and Afghan police arrested 17 suspected Taliban insurgents in Kabul, one of them carrying a bomb.
"Naqeebudin's titzup! They'll never think of looking for us here!"
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:33:34 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


Africa: Horn
Sudan orders removal of Syrian WMDs
Sudan has ordered the removal of Syrian missiles and weapons of mass destruction out of the African country.
"Cheeze! Get 'em outta here! Are youse guys nuts?"
Arab diplomatic and Sudanese government sources said the regime of Sudanese President Omar Bashir has ordered that Syria remove its Scud C and Scud D medium-range ballistic missiles as well as components for chemical weapons stored in warehouses in Khartoum. The sources said the Sudanese demand was issued after the Defense Ministry and Interior Ministry confirmed a report published earlier this month that Syria has been secretly flying Scud-class missiles and WMD components to Khartoum. The sources said the Bashir regime has been alarmed over the prospect that the United States would discover the Syrian arsenal and conclude that Damascus and Khartoum were cooperating in the area of missiles and WMD. They said this would have delayed or dashed U.S. plans to lift sanctions from Sudan. A U.S. official confirmed the Syrian missile shipments to Sudan, saying they were meant for use against rebels in the south. But the official said the U.S. intelligence community has not determined that Syria sent WMD systems to Khartoum.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:30:58 AM || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Yet another VICTORY in the War on Terrorism and the State Sponsors of Terrorism won by the men and women in the US military battling in Iraq though they fired not a shot in anger in the Sudan.
Posted by: Garrison || 04/27/2004 2:16 Comments || Top||

#2  Sudanese President Omar Bashir has ordered the removal of Syrian missiles and weapons of mass destruction out of the African country.

Yeah, particularly take that canister with the biohazard logo that is hissing! That sucker is spooky!
Posted by: Anonymous4052 || 04/27/2004 2:29 Comments || Top||

#3  This is what Victor Davis Hanson calls the "Ripples of Battle."
Posted by: Dragon Fly || 04/27/2004 7:09 Comments || Top||

#4  Who was calling on the administration to be tougher on the Sudan this weekend? Sounds to me like we've had a reason to be nice to them.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 04/27/2004 8:01 Comments || Top||

#5  Remove them hell,destroy them!
Posted by: raptor || 04/27/2004 8:20 Comments || Top||

#6  yet more benifits from taking out saddam....
Posted by: Dan || 04/27/2004 10:35 Comments || Top||

#7  Removing Saddam had the effect of causing the Libyan Domino to topple. Now it looks like perhaps Sudan is making nice-nice as well and threatening to take Syria down with them.

I do find it interesting that the Islamoids in Africa seem more willing to play-ball than those in Arabia.
Posted by: ruprecht || 04/27/2004 10:40 Comments || Top||

#8  Send them back to Syria. We'll meet them there.
Posted by: eLarson || 04/27/2004 11:28 Comments || Top||

#9  ...Who says they're going back to Syria? We've got all kinds of nice safe places to store them, and highly trained analysts professionals to keep an eye on them.

Mike
Posted by: Mike Kozlowski || 04/27/2004 12:56 Comments || Top||

#10  They just showed up via FedEx at our aspirin factory!
Posted by: Not Mike Moore || 04/27/2004 20:39 Comments || Top||

#11  NMM, I thought Willie destroyed all the aspirin factories in the 3rd world.
Posted by: Super Hose || 04/27/2004 22:48 Comments || Top||


Iraq-Jordan
Zarqawi lashes out at Howard
AL-QAEDA has directly condemned Prime Minister John Howard over his secret trip to Iraq over the Anzac weekend. The Federal Government said today Mr Howard would not be dictated to by terrorists following an overnight statement in which al-Qaeda described the Prime Minister as "wicked". The statement was signed by suspected terrorist Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, and claimed responsibility for a suicide boat attack on Iraq's Basra oil terminal. The statement said the "wicked" Australian Prime Minister rushed to the site of the boat attack, in which three US sailors died, to "see what happened to his troops".

A planned visit by Mr Howard to the Australian frigate HMAS Stuart was cancelled when the ship rushed to rescue Americans wounded in the attack. Mal Brough, Minister Assisting the Minister for Defence, said the Government was aware of the threat of terrorism and the risk involved in Mr Howard travelling to Iraq. He said this was why the trip was kept so secret, but that the Government refused to be dictated to by terrorists. "The most important thing to remember here is that we should never, never, wilt in the face of threats from terrorists," said Mr Brough, who accompanied Mr Howard to Iraq. "It doesn't matter who you are in the world, but particularly when you are a significant leader like the Prime Minister, trying to placate terrorists by doing what they want is certainly no recipe for success. So the Prime Minister was right to go and we do recognise there was a threat. It's also the reason why we maintained secrecy before we went there so as not (to) heighten the risk to our troops or obviously to those personnel that were assisting the Prime Minister and myself on that visit."

Mr Brough condemned Labor's comments that Australia was not providing peacekeepers or protecting the Iraqi people and therefore the troops should come home. "The comments that have been made by the opposition degrading and denigrating the work that's been done by our troops is both ignorant but also very offensive to the families that are back here," Mr Brough said. "They are doing very, very important work in the rebuilding of the security of Iraq." He said Mr Howard had wanted to visit troops in Iraq for some time and felt there was no better day than Anzac Day to do so. "There's is no more significant day in the calendar of this country and particularly the defence forces, than Anzac Day, and I'd say that not only was he so very pleased to see and hear firsthand from them but they in turn were very pleased to see their Prime Minister," he said.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 04/27/2004 12:29:38 AM || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted]
Posted by: Antiwar TROLL || 04/27/2004 9:51 Comments || Top||

#2  I'll do my best, but it's not down to me really...
Posted by: Howard UK || 04/27/2004 9:54 Comments || Top||

#3  Being singled out by Zarqawi for a temper tantrum should be all the proof Australians need: Howard's doing it right. Right enough to scare 'em.

Methinks you're a limp dick, indeed, until AlQ vilifies you. Congrats, John, you rock!
Posted by: .com || 04/27/2004 10:25 Comments || Top||

#4  Yes I have changed my name back (the other was too long).I was hoping Howard would withdraw the Australian Army from Iraq asap. Btw exlib I would like to apologise for saying you should get cancer I was too hard on you.
Posted by: Antiwar || 04/27/2004 9:51 Comments || Top||



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Two weeks of WOT
Tue 2004-04-27
  Marines administer ceasefire thumping in Fallujah
Mon 2004-04-26
  Jihadis tell Italians to protest Iraq war or hostages die
Sun 2004-04-25
  Karzai assassination foiled
Sat 2004-04-24
  3 boat attacks at Basra oil terminal
Fri 2004-04-23
  Finns discover 400 lbs. of explosives at race track
Thu 2004-04-22
  Yasser dumps his house guests
Wed 2004-04-21
  Fallujah Cease-Fire "Over"
Tue 2004-04-20
  Iraq Leaders Create Tribunal for Saddam
Mon 2004-04-19
  Spanish Troops Start Withdrawal Next Week
Sun 2004-04-18
  Toe tag for Abu Walid!
Sat 2004-04-17
  Planned attack in Jordan involved chemical weapons
Fri 2004-04-16
  U.S. troops, militia clash near Kufa
Thu 2004-04-15
  Tater hangs it up?
Wed 2004-04-14
  Philippines May Withdraw Troops From Iraq
Tue 2004-04-13
  Zarqawi in Fallujah?


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