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Home Front: WoT
Johnny Taliban to vacation in Colorado
2007-04-13
FLORENCE, Colo. (AP) -- John Walker Lindh, serving a 20-year sentence after fighting for the Taliban in Afghanistan, has been transferred to Supermax, the federal government's most secure prison, authorities said Thursday.
Bye bye
Lindh was moved to the facility about 90 miles south of Denver in February for security reasons, said Isidro Garcia, a spokesman for the federal Bureau of Prisons. Garcia said he had no other information.
"I can say no more"
Lindh's transfer was first reported on Newsweek.com. He had been held at a medium-security federal penitentiary in Victorville, Calif.

Lindh was captured in November 2001 by American forces sent to topple the Taliban after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks. He was charged with conspiring to kill Americans and support terrorists but pleaded guilty to lesser charges, including carrying explosives for the Taliban government. Lindh has served 4 1/2 years. His attorneys have applied to President Bush to commute his sentence after Australian David Hicks was sentenced to less than a year in prison last month for aiding terrorism.
I guess this means the answer is "No".
Supermax houses some of the nation's most notorious inmates, including Unabomber Theodore Kaczynski, Oklahoma City bombing coconspirator Terry Nichols and Olympic Park bomber Eric Rudolph.
Posted by:Steve

#36  crosspatch, there's more than just punishment going on.

There's also the deterrent angle, as in, "No houris for you, no glory to your family for producing a martyr, you don't even get a comfy cell in a nice climate. Your visitors, if you are allowed any, will slowly diminish over time. You don't get to talk to the outside world, you gradually are forgotten about, and it won't be over any time soon."

Now, to your average sexually frustrated jihadi wannabe, this definitely does not sound like Paradise. We can argue for hours if it works in a deterrent sense. Maybe it does, maybe not. But it sure isn't quite what the local imam promised would be their reward for striking out at the Great Satan.....
Posted by: Swamp Blondie   2007-04-13 23:17  

#35  *ahem* with current DNA technology, more innocent prisoners are freed, and at a faster pace than at any time in human history. I would like to see those proven guilty executed at a similar pace. Is that so wrong? Didn't think so
Posted by: Frank G   2007-04-13 23:09  

#34  If someone is never ever going to be released for any reason, what purpose does keeping them conscious serve?

In most cases, that's why we have the death penalty. As to why we keep people alive, just ask someone who's been released after spending decades in prison on false or trumped-up charges just how glad they are to be alive.

Execution cannot be reversed upon appeal.
Posted by: Zenster   2007-04-13 23:04  

#33  Supermax is not something that would encourage Jihadi, in fact, they die slowly, and in noticeable stages. I would be all for taking Johnny out and stoning him to death today, but I fear in advocating that, I might lose my cable TV simulcast show and radio forum...whoops, mixed threads...kinda
Posted by: Frank G   2007-04-13 23:02  

#32  One final point before I head out for the weekend ... keeping these terrorists alive in prison might eventually cause more terrorism where some group might want to have them freed through taking of hostages or engaging in terrorist actions. If they are never to be released, executing them prevents anyone from ever trying to free them though future terrorist actions, either real or threatened.
Posted by: crosspatch   2007-04-13 22:58  

#31  I would also suggest that life without possibility of parole is not a deterrent to crime either because if a person is alive, there is always hope. They can hope that some time in the next 50 years attitudes change or the jihadis win or something and they might eventually be released.

I would also put forth that life without parole IS execution, albeit very slow. It is "cruel and unusual". It is less humane than the death penalty. Life without parole is also potentially reversible. Death isn't. If there is NO WAY someone is ever going to be released, then there is no point to keeping them alive.
Posted by: crosspatch   2007-04-13 22:28  

#30  I know ... but I meant seriously. If someone is never ever going to be released for any reason, what purpose does keeping them conscious serve? If it is to "punish" then I would submit that in this case "punishment" is more for some mollification of the punisher than to teach any lesson to the punished. A point of punishment is to modify behavior. If a person is never going to be given another chance, then punishment has no point and at that point is only administered to make the community meeting out the punishment feel better. So basically it is torturing someone out of vengeance, it is no longer punishment.

It is more humane to execute the condemned at that point than to give a sentence of "life without possibility of parole" if you keep them awake through the entire process of execution though feeding them to death.
Posted by: crosspatch   2007-04-13 22:20  

#29  Why not just put prisoners like that into an artificial coma with an IV drip and keep them in temperature controlled bins for the rest of their life?

hmmm.....Ima thinkrn of a script, I think I'll call it The Hive, no, wait... The Matrix...yeah... that's the ticket!
Posted by: Frank G   2007-04-13 22:11  

#28  Why not just put prisoners like that into an artificial coma with an IV drip and keep them in temperature controlled bins for the rest of their life? If they aren't awake, they aren't a security risk. If someone has no possibility of parole, what's the point of exercise? Just keep them under until they die from natural causes.

Might be a sick thought, but it is no sicker than boxing someone up for maybe 50 years. Best thing is, should something go wrong and they wake up for some reason, they probably won't be able to walk.
Posted by: crosspatch   2007-04-13 22:09  

#27  Even if released in a few years, what odds he won't then be very useful to anyone for anything?

A punching bag.
Posted by: Zenster   2007-04-13 21:05  

#26  Maybe he was lying through his teeth in order to make everyone think that he wasn't wasting away in prison? Criminals do have this habit of lying, you know. Us monkeys are curious, inquisitive creatures. We don't like being locked up in a small box with nothing to explore and nowhere to go.

Maybe he was lying, but I do not get that impression. Sure, some inmates are going to wither and rot, but some might actually prefer the environment in a Supermax over a regular prison.

Don't take my word though, you can READ about it here. Also, follow RD's link in comment #5 for lots of interesting links.
Posted by: Natural Law   2007-04-13 19:41  

#25  Oh man I like that idea of locking John and John in the same cell, put cameras in there, and seel access on the internet.
Posted by: Cyber Sarge   2007-04-13 17:12  

#24  Yes, and by his own accounting in letters to friends and family, he treasured the silence and isolation. In fact, it seems he thrived. Just sayin'!

Good. I'm for sending them all there. So they can "thrive"...
Posted by: tu3031   2007-04-13 17:06  

#23  Yes, and by his own accounting in letters to friends and family, he treasured the silence and isolation. In fact, it seems he thrived. Just sayin'!

Maybe he was lying through his teeth in order to make everyone think that he wasn't wasting away in prison? Criminals do have this habit of lying, you know. Us monkeys are curious, inquisitive creatures. We don't like being locked up in a small box with nothing to explore and nowhere to go.
Posted by: gromky   2007-04-13 16:54  

#22  Supermax is about five miles south of Florence, CO. I drive by there two or three times a year, on my way to one of my favorite fishing spots. The only windows to the outside are tiny things. Florence is NOT the vacation capital of Colorado, by any means. Johnny boy is really gonna like the summers those two times he'll be able to experience it each year - they'll remind him of Afghanistan.
Posted by: Old Patriot   2007-04-13 16:24  

#21  They exist alone in soundproof cells as small as 7 feet by 12 feet, with a concrete-poured desk, bed and stool, a small shower and sink, and a TV that offers religious and anger-management programs. They are locked down 23 hours a day.

Larry Homenick, a former U.S. marshal who has taken prisoners to Supermax, said that there was a small triangular recreation area, known as "the dog run," where solitary Supermax prisoners could occasionally get a glimpse of sky. He said it was chilling to walk down the cellblocks and glance through the plexiglass "sally port" chambers into the cells and see the faces inside.

Life there is harsh. Food is delivered through a slit in the cell door. Prisoners don't leave their cells to see a lawyer, a doctor or a prison official; those visitors must go to the cell.
Posted by: tu3031   2007-04-13 16:08  

#20  "Warmed the cockles of even my cold heart..."

That brought tears to my eyes too, tu3031; thanks for sharing that.

Posted by: Dave D.   2007-04-13 16:06  

#19   three two hots and a cot for the Taliban life.

IIRC, the furniture is either concrete (bed, seat, toilet) or flat polished steel (mirror on wall). There's absolutely nuthin fun. He deserves it. TaliBitch
Posted by: Frank G   2007-04-13 15:56  

#18  Woody Harrelson's father was there too, but he died of a heart attack last month.

Yes, and by his own accounting in letters to friends and family, he treasured the silence and isolation. In fact, it seems he thrived. Just sayin'!
Posted by: Natural Law   2007-04-13 15:32  

#17  Yeah, Zacky's there. Among Johnny Boy's other new neighbors...

Already there is a veritable "bombers' row" — Ramzi Ahmed Yousef, mastermind of the 1993 World Trade Center blast; Unabomber Theodore Kaczynski; Terry L. Nichols, an accomplice in the Oklahoma City bombing; Richard Reid, the so-called shoe bomber who Moussaoui testified was to join him in another Al Qaeda hijacking; and Eric Rudolph, who bombed abortion clinics and the Atlanta Olympics.

What he's got to look forward to...

Prison expert James E. Aiken looked straight at jurors and told them what Zacarias Moussaoui could expect if they sent him away for the rest of his life. "I have seen them rot," he said. "They rot."

In his trial testimony, Aiken said the whole point of Supermax was not just punishment, but "incapacitation." There is no pretense that the prison is preparing the inmate for a return to society. Like the cellmate of the count of Monte Cristo who died an old, tired convict, Aiken said, "Moussaoui will deteriorate."

The inmate "is constantly monitored 24 hours a day, seven days a week," he said. "He will never get lost in a crowd because he would never be in a crowd."

Christopher Boyce, a convicted spy who was incarcerated at Supermax, left the prison about 100 miles south of Denver with no regret. "You're slowly hung," he once told The Times. "You're ground down. You can barely keep your sanity."

Bernard Kleinman, a New York lawyer who represented Yousef, called it "extraordinarily draconian punishment." Moussaoui might be a household name today, "but 20 years from now, people will forget him," Kleinman said. "He will sit there all alone, and all forgotten."

Warmed the cockles of even my cold heart...

Posted by: tu3031   2007-04-13 14:57  

#16  Woody Harrelson's father was there too, but he died of a heart attack last month.
Posted by: Rambler   2007-04-13 14:52  

#15  I think Moussaoui is there, too.
I think you're right, but the fact they'll never see each other gives a certain satisfaction.
Posted by: eLarson   2007-04-13 14:35  

#14  Being solitary, his soap-dropping days are probably limited, if not over. gee, that's too bad. if Supermax is as bad as alleged, he should go stark raving nuts in a short time.
Posted by: USN, Ret.   2007-04-13 13:40  

#13  Maybe he was moved to the new facility because he complained of being made raw as a consequence of the Pasthun Two Step practiced at the old facility.

LOL.

Hey Johnny: the Aussie Taliban will be out in a matter of months. Bet you wish your family had had the foresight to retain him to represent you, don't you?
Posted by: Mark Z   2007-04-13 11:58  

#12  Hey! Gromky just gave me an idear.....make the two Johnny boys roomies! (Ok. It's probably illegal to do that under some bullshit "international law statute", but admit it....it would make a lot of people happy here on the 'Burg.)
Posted by: Swamp Blondie   2007-04-13 11:50  

#11  I will bet that Jihad Johnny loved to regal the other prisoners of his exploits but found out a little late that even among prisoners there are still patriots. And given that these guys are in medium security they wouldn't kill him just make his life (and probably butt) miserable.
Posted by: Cyber Sarge   2007-04-13 11:30  

#10  Mr. Lindh didn't strike me as terribly strong, mentally. Even if released in a few years, what odds he won't then be very useful to anyone for anything?
Posted by: trailing wife   2007-04-13 11:28  

#9  Ya, the next democrat in the White House will pardon all traitors and jail all loyal americans, just to please our enemies.
Posted by: DarthVader   2007-04-13 09:19  

#8  He'll be pardoned by the next Democrat president we have. It baffles me how people can defend people like him and Johnathan Pollard.
Posted by: gromky   2007-04-13 08:53  

#7  JerseyMike well stated! This schmuck and his hippie leftist 'parents' should hang their heads in shame. Talk about traitors.
Posted by: Mark Espinola   2007-04-13 08:50  

#6  If I was that dumbass, I'd be happy just to be alive. I'd be thanking God America's slipping into nambypamby moral vacuum feelgoodism kept me from dancing at the end of a rope.
He's a douchebag, and that goes for his grubby hippy parents as well.
Posted by: JerseyMike   2007-04-13 08:44  

#5  three two hots and a cot for the Taliban life.
Posted by: RD   2007-04-13 08:39  

#4  I'll bet this'll teach mom and pops to shut the fuck up...
Posted by: tu3031   2007-04-13 08:32  

#3  I think Moussaoui is there, too.
Posted by: Dave D.   2007-04-13 08:31  

#2  Wow. We are going to be neighbors.
Posted by: plainslow   2007-04-13 08:23  

#1  How do you say 'backfire' in Arabic?
Posted by: Raj   2007-04-13 08:17  

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